1975 and the Jehovah's Witnesses

[James Thomas Rook Jr.]

AllenSmith:

I followed your link.

If I had not actually been there and seen what happened from Virginia to California, it would ALMOST be believable. The Frenzy was EVERYWHERE. It was consistent on both coasts, at Kingdom Halls and Assemblies, and I made many cartoons making fun of the ludicrousness of the 1975 frenzy. 

Unfortunately, year after year it wore me down and I began to reason "How could I be right, and everybody I know in the Truth be wrong?", and I quit a terrific job in the African Congo to be home in Virginia with my family when the end was to come.

This proves that youth is wasted on the young ... and the fact that I "caved" is an everlasting embarrassment that I have tried never to duplicate, even if it means telling some Brother much more theoretically inclined than I am to "go to hell".

That's where Liberty and Integrity begin.

However noble the goal, or how well intentioned ... It is evil to try and defend Truth ... with lies.

[James Thomas Rook Jr.]

SNL did a skit on JWs and 1975?

That was way back when SNL was actually FUNNY!

Wow... now I gotta find it! (Youtube?)

[Srecko Sostar]

1 hour ago, AllenSmith said:

I also warned people against it,

Hi, 

this job you had done in that period looks like Geoffrey Jackson respond before ARC, how GB expects from all members who read/to read Bible and reject all false, error and wrong instructions, teachings that coming from Organization and to filter all teachings and opinions expressed in publications.

No matter of "side effect". :))

[Evacuated]

 

2 hours ago, AllenSmith said:

Perhaps, in your culture it was different, but in mine, there was no hysteria attached.

Valid observation for me. When first encountering the idea about 1972, I thought it was everyone's understanding as I knew very few Witnesses. But as time went on,  I found it to be a patchy eccentricity rather than hysteria. 

However the fact remains that some of Jehovah's Witnesses DID get seduced by the song of '75 and some of Jehovah's Witnesses DID NOT get seduced by the song of '75.

And yet, we're all still here!  GET OVER IT!

[Israeli Bar Avaddhon]

9 hours ago, JW Insider said:

Credo che sia già stato calcolato, e si riferisce ad un tempo che la Bibbia ha già chiarito. E se sbaglio , che è possibile e probabile - me di essere umano e tutti - allora può fare riferimento a un periodo di tempo che sarà riconosciuto quando succede. Niente da calcolare da essa, e non la cronologia necessario.

Da nessuna parte dice la Bibbia dobbiamo calcolare nulla di tutto questo. Non c'era alcun errore. Infatti, se leggiamo sia Daniele e Apocalisse con attenzione possiamo vedere il motivo per cui non v'è nulla per noi da calcolare. Ma questo, a questo punto, è solo un'interpretazione che non è necessario per difendere qui. Quello che sto affermando è solo un parere. Posso cercare di difendere altrove sotto un argomento su Daniele e Apocalisse.

Dubito che qualsiasi TdG davvero con tutto il cuore credere a quello che è attualmente insegnato circa questi periodi di tempo, altrimenti saremmo interessati a ciò che esattamente è stato detto in quei libri e assiemi. Così com'è, siamo in genere vergogna del contenuto effettivo di quei libri e discorsi di montaggio, e sono costretti a scegliere solo e scegli frasi fuori dal contesto. Se davvero creduto che Gesù Cristo ha visto qualcosa nel contenuto di tali assemblee particolari, saremmo chiedono a gran voce di guardare tutto ciò che Gesù lo guardò per vedere se potevamo comprendere meglio il "pensiero di Cristo". Invece, siamo soddisfatti con l'idea che, anche se la maggior parte di quanto è stato detto nei discorsi chiave di queste assemblee era falsa dottrina, o anche false profezie, Gesù vide ancora la loro condizione di cuore ed era in grado di ignorare le cose specifiche che dicevano e mettere a fuoco il fatto che ci si è fatta promotrice di una serie piuttosto unico di dottrine fondamentali che erano importanti e vero. Non fraintendetemi, apprezzo le dottrine fondamentali che fosse stato vero sia prima che dopo queste assemblee e le pubblicazioni del tempo. Ma le nostre dottrine fondamentali non sono stati rilevanti per le ragioni che abbiamo identificare questi specifici periodi della storia.

Siamo spiacenti di saltare gran parte della vostra presentazione circa la necessità di calcolare altri punti di riferimento. Non vedo la necessità di calcolare uno di questi periodi di tempo in anticipo, o essere eccessivamente preoccupata per quello che avrebbe potuto significare in passato. Continuo commentando il mio punto di vista di questi periodi e poi cancellarlo. Sarò felice di fare questo con un altro argomento, tuttavia.

All right, dear JW Insider, I will be happy to have a constructive conversation, in the light of the Scriptures, on these calculations and points of reference.
I would like to point out a contradiction in your words (if I have understood well from the translation).
If you admit that the 1260, 1290 and 1335 were not about assemblies or resolutions, they obviously concern something else, right?

Have you already got an idea of what these days could be?
is it something past or future?
If it were something future, it is obvious that "from a certain point" we need to start calculating, is not it?
If, instead, it is something past, we should be able to understand what the prophecy referred to (you yourself said that "we will understand it later").

However now I am coming out of the original article (which is dedicated to 1975). So I leave you with these questions.
I wish you the best

[TrueTomHarley]

8 hours ago, JW Insider said:

• The initial idea is floated, often with a bit of caution.
• Then someone is sure enough to begin championing the prediction and begins to stake their reputation on it.
• Then as confidence builds, those statements become more and more direct and less careful.
• Then as the time approaches and the kinds of surrounding expectations that might have validated the prediction aren't there yet, real caution kicks in, and if necessary, some backtracking begins.
• After the failure is obvious, we can expect blame and finger-pointing.

This is not unlike the 'Six Stages of a Project' that used to be cynically posted at the workplace:

1) Enthusiasm

2) Disillusionment

3) Panic

4) Hunt for the Guilty

5) Punishment of the Innocent

6) Praise and Honors for the Nonparticipants.

[Srecko Sostar]

2 hours ago, AllenSmith25 said:

Yet, the only ones digging the past and bring up *incorrect* information are ex-witnesses.

Sorry if i am bored, but "1975 events", as unpleasant and inseparable part of WT JWorg history, was portion of official convention spiritual food program this year. GB digging their own and yours (members) past. Perhaps GB looking to much apostate channels about 1975 and been provoked to put this same subject as "proper food in proper time" (with late of few decades :)))))))) almost half century.   

[Srecko Sostar]

2 minutes ago, AllenSmith25 said:

literature, omitting certain things, and adding

of course, it is possible. But as it was showed in some examples from WT publications in this Forum, WT using such tactics of omitting and skips commas, words, quotation, verses with purpose to misrepresent  other people thoughts and words. Perhaps some bad ex-JW imitate former religion leaders. :))) but we have many ex-JW who are honest and truthful in stating things. If you want you will accept that fact :))    

[Srecko Sostar]

38 minutes ago, AllenSmith25 said:

They knew I was an active witness, and they held no animosity toward me. We got along just fine.

hehe, you know what people said: do not talk about religion, politics and sport... and you will drink your coffee with person, of opposite stand, in peace :))))))) 

[Evacuated]

2 hours ago, AllenSmith25 said:

Personally, I knew a few [ex-witnesses]  that I worked with. I had no problems with them. They knew I was an active witness, and they held no animosity toward me. We got along just fine.

Now this raises an interesting angle. Why is that some ex-witnesses can live with their choices and those who remain as witnesses, and others go all nasty and vindictive? Probably for a separate discussion? I might just post it if any think it is worth a look?

[Anna]

1 hour ago, Gone Fishing said:

Now this raises an interesting angle. Why is that some ex-witnesses can live with their choices and those who remain as witnesses, and others go all nasty and vindictive? Probably for a separate discussion? I might just post it if any think it is worth a look?

I think, in my opinion, those who are nasty and vindictive are those who feel they have been wronged (injustice and all that) and are shunned by their families. Remove the shunning, and I think that would take the wind out of their sails.  Then there are others who just have the need to insist on everyone seeing things their way, and get very upset if you don't agree with them, regardless whether they are shunned or not. 

Perhaps it's not a good idea to take a look. It might bring some rather controversial topics to light...

P.S. Unless you mean discussing the psychological aspect of it rather than any specific reasons...

Just looked at your post again...maybe I misunderstood your question, are you talking about vindictive and nasty Witnesses?

 

[Noble Berean]

18 minutes ago, Anna said:

I think, in my opinion, those who are nasty and vindictive are those who feel they have been wronged (injustice and all that) and are shunned by their families. Remove the shunning, and I think that would take the wind out of their sails.  Then there are others who just have the need to insist on everyone seeing things their way, and get very upset if you don't agree with them, regardless whether they are shunned or not. 

Perhaps it's not a good idea to take a look. It might bring some rather controversial topics to light...

P.S. Unless you mean discussing the psychological aspect of it rather than any specific reasons...

 

Really good point. Do our extreme shunning policies give exJWs a justification for leaving the religion and staying away?

I think of 1 Corinthians 10:31-33: "Therefore, whether you are eating or drinking or doing anything else, do all things for God’s glory. Keep from becoming causes for stumbling to Jews as well as Greeks and to the congregation of God, just as I am trying to please all people in all things, not seeking my own advantage, but that of the many, so that they may be saved."

Our org always focuses on stumbling fellow JWs, but the scripture indicates we are not supposed to stumble anyone...Jew, Greek, or Christian. When I reflect on the disfellowshipping video at the convention, doesn't our extreme stance cause great stumbling? JW parents aren't even supposed to pick up the phone when their daughter calls? Imagine if that daughter was terminally ill or had suffered a personal tragedy. Or maybe she just needed some support at a dark time? That would make most bitter. It seems our love extends only to some.

And when the prodigal son returned to his father, he didn't wait around for some committee to approve fellowship. He embraced him immediately.