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Lack Of Education Leads To Lost Dreams And Low Income For Many Jehovah's Witnesses


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Zachary Linderer said he wanted to go to college to major in the field of science, but growing up as a Jehovah's Witness, higher education was prohibited by his parents.

Courtesy Luke Vander Ploeg

Growing up on Long Island, Zachary Linderer was obsessed with science.

He grew up a Jehovah's Witness, and like many others in the faith, he was homeschooled his whole life. By the time he got to high school, Linderer knew that he wanted to go to college for something in the sciences: physics, oceanography, something in that realm. But he realized at a young age that wasn't going to be a possibility.

"I knew that it wasn't going to be encouraged that I get an education," Linderer says. "My dad told me that he knew people who were into science, and it dragged them right out of the organization, right out of the truth."

The organization that Linderer is talking about is the Watchtower: the governing organization of Jehovah's Witnesses. The view that higher education is spiritually dangerous is very common among Witnesses, and for Linderer, it meant that his parents wouldn't support him going to college.

Still, he knew that he wanted to study, so he decided to keep his ambitions a secret and figure out a way to attend on his own. Close to high school graduation he let his plans slip to a couple of his Jehovah's Witness friends. Word got back to his family.

"When they found out, my dad and uncles made fun of me," Linderer recalls. "It really squashed my hopes. I knew I wasn't going to get their support, and without their support, it was really obvious to me at the time that I wasn't going to be able to do it on my own."

With only a few credits left before high school graduation, Linderer dropped out. He had no prospects of education beyond high school, so getting the diploma seemed pointless. He struggled to find work after moving out of his parents' home, which eventually led him to get certified as an electrician. Still, that longing to study science haunted him.

"I think I had that feeling at 17 years old or so that that was what I wanted to be, what I needed to be," Linderer says. "There's been this hole ever since then."

From the top down

Linderer's story is a common one for children raised as Jehovah's Witnesses. Pew Research shows that only 9 percent of Witnesses get undergraduate degrees. That's well below the national average of 30.4 percent and the lowest of any faith group. The likely reason for this trend is the religion's official warnings against college.

Witness leadership declined to speak to NPR for this story, but Anthony Morris III, a member of the governing body of Jehovah's Witnesses, outlines the organization's policies clearly in a video on the organization's website. The Watchtower Organization discourages higher education for two basic reasons.

First, higher education is spiritually dangerous. In the video, Morris warns parents that "the most intelligent and eloquent professors will be trying to reshape the thinking of your child, and their influence can be tremendous." He goes on to say that continual association with non-believers in an academic setting can "erode thinking and convictions."

Witness leadership also discourages higher education because they believe it's a waste of time. Jehovah's Witnesses have been predicting the end of the world since the religion's founding at the end of the 19th century. By their rationale, time in college would be better spent out on the streets, converting persons to become Witnesses.

Morris makes it very clear that the Watchtower organization doesn't discourage education, but rather secular education.

"If parents and young ones are motivated to pursue divine education," Morris says, "the quest for higher secular education becomes less and less of an issue."

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Amber McGee (Back) says although she didn't fulfill her dreams to go collage because she grew up as a Jehovah's Witness, she'll pass those dreams on to her children.

Courtesy Luke Vander Ploeg

More material problems

The lack of higher education can translate into more tangible problems for Witnesses. Pew research also shows that Jehovah's Witnesses are among the lowest earners of any religious group.

Amber McGee falls in that category. She grew up a Witness in rural Texas. Like Linderer, she was home-schooled from a young age. Her parents wanted to protect her and her siblings from worldly influences. That decision wasn't easy on her family.

"My mom, who was supposed to be our home school teacher, was not capable of doing it, emotionally mentally," McGee recalls. "She had three young children. She was by herself, very far from family, and even grocery stores and that sort of thing."

McGee's mother never finished high school herself, and the pressure of trying to teach three children was too much for her. She gave up on homeschooling them when McGee and her twin were in third grade. The kids were forced to fend for themselves using workbooks. When she had trouble with a subject, McGee says she'd just pass her work off to her twin, and vice-versa. This left both of them with significant learning disabilities.

McGee says that when she got excited about a subject, her mother would often shut her down. "I told her how much I found history fun," McGee says. "She told me, 'Well, that's not important because it doesn't have any bearing on your future, and it won't be any use in the paradise." This "paradise" refers to the heaven on earth that Witnesses believe is coming after the end of the world.

McGee barely graduated high school. In mathematics, she never made it past the seventh grade level. That's made life difficult for McGee. She's now 34 years old, and the most she's made in a year is about $14,000.

McGee and her family left the Witnesses about a year ago. They're doing better now financially, but it's still far from what McGee had hoped for her life. She had wanted to be nurse growing up, but with no support from her parents and very little education, she didn't feel it was possible. Today, she struggles with that same feeling that Linderer talked about: the feeling of being robbed of something. It's a sentiment shared by most of the more than 100 ex-Jehovah's Witnesses that I heard from while reporting this story.

Still, McGee says she isn't letting that feeling stop her from retaking her life.

"I was taught very, very young to stop dreaming, to not have dreams," McGee says, "that you'll never be a famous person or a doctor or a nurse. It's not possible. So now, as an adult, at 34 years old, I'm learning to start dreaming again."

Even if it's too late for some of her dreams, she definitely hopes to pass them on to her children.

http://www.npr.org/2017/02/19/510585965/poor-education-leads-to-lost-dreams-and-low-income-for-many-jehovahs-witnesses?utm_medium=RSS&utm_campaign=news

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The article that changed everything In my opinion, it was the Watchtower 10/1/2005, “Parents—What Future Do You Want for Your Children?” A close friend of me working in Brooklyn Bethel at those d

These kind of sad tales always bring to mind Paul's words at 1Cor.15:19.

People who are successful in this life made sacrifices to get where they are now, and some continue to make sacrifices. See quote below from a successful writer/journalist, Thuy Yau. “We ha

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People who are successful in this life made sacrifices to get where they are now, and some continue to make sacrifices.

See quote below from a successful writer/journalist, Thuy Yau.

“We have to make the choice between our immediate desires and the needs that will propel our dreams forward.

Fact is, it’s not wrong of us to have these immediate desires, these temptations to choose the ‘easier’ option’. It’s normal to feel that way. However, when we sacrifice what we want right now, we are saving our time and energy for something more important. Something that will bring us one step closer to our real goals. Something we truly want, not just something we want right now.

Maybe we don’t want to sacrifice our time, stability, personal life, sleep, health, stillness and sanity. Maybe it just feels too difficult. But I’ll tell you right now, I’ve sacrificed every one of these things at one point or another. I wouldn’t have gone from writing on a personal blog to working as a freelance writer/journalist, if I had chosen the easier option. I wouldn’t have grown as a person if I hadn’t made those sacrifices either.

If you want to be successful and achieve what you really want in life, you’ll have to make sacrifices. But when you reach the end of that mountain, you’ll be so very glad that you never gave up the journey.”

==

Note the sacrifices it took to arrive at the success she attained as a writer.

If people can make sacrifices to attain transient goals and treasures, what is so wrong for true Christians to choose to make sacrifices and focus on the real life (everlasting life in perfect conditions) which is promised in the scriptures. Paul’s letter to Timothy encourages us to choose the real life and not the illusions of this system of things.

(1 Timothy 6:18, 19) . . .Tell them to work at good, to be rich in fine works, to be generous, ready to share, 19 safely treasuring up for themselves a fine foundation for the future, so that they may get a firm hold on the real life.

 

Jesus Christ said to seek first the Kingdom of God not worldly things.

 (Matthew 6:33) “Keep on, then, seeking first the Kingdom and his righteousness, and all these other things will be added to you.

 

 (1 Corinthians 15:19) If in this life only we have hoped in Christ, we are to be pitied more than anyone.

 

(Hebrews 6:9, 10) 9 But in your case, beloved ones, we are convinced of better things, things related to salvation, even though we are speaking in this way. 10 For God is not unrighteous so as to forget your work and the love you showed for his name by ministering and continuing to minister to the holy ones.

 

We make decisions taking into consideration the real life promised in the Bible.

 

We talking about excellence in everything we do -  we are not talking about sloppiness, carelessness, leaving school without any qualifications or skills. We are talking about not using the world to the full so we may have more time to do God’s will.

 

(1 Cor 7: 29-35) 29 Moreover, this I say, brothers, the time left is reduced. From now on, let those who have wives be as though they had none, 30 and those who weep as those who do not weep, and those who rejoice as those who do not rejoice, and those who buy as those who do not possess, 31 and those making use of the world as those not using it to the full; for the scene of this world is changing. 32 Indeed, I want you to be free from anxiety. The unmarried man is anxious for the things of the Lord, how he may gain the Lord’s approval. 33 But the married man is anxious for the things of the world, how he may gain the approval of his wife, 34 and he is divided. Further, the unmarried woman, as well as the virgin, is anxious for the things of the Lord, that she may be holy both in her body and in her spirit. However, the married woman is anxious for the things of the world, how she may gain the approval of her husband. 35 But I am saying this for your personal advantage, not to restrict you, but to move you to what is appropriate and to constant devotion to the Lord without distraction.

 

People are not coerced to apply these scriptures.  Jehovah God has confidence that persons who understood the scriptures and the urgency to get on the side of His approval would do this willingly. He said prophetically on his Son’s coming to power as the King of God’s kingdom, people would offer themselves to do the King’s bidding.

 

 (Psalm 110:3) “Your people will offer themselves willingly on the day of your military force. In splendid holiness, from the womb of the dawn, You have your company of young men just like dewdrops.”

 

The important work that they would buy out time for is the preaching of the good news of his Kingdom which would solve all the problems now plaguing the world. People need to hear the real solution. (See Matthew 24:14 and Matthew 28:19,20.)

 

Paul further showed that we should buy out time for this.

 

(Ephesians 5:15, 16) 15 So keep strict watch that how YOU walk is not as unwise but as wise [persons], 16 buying out the opportune time for yourselves, because the days are wicked.

 

He warned also about materialism.  The more “successful” you are the more gadgets to care for, and service; more travelling, more appointments, parties, etc.  If you simplify your life there will be more time to get down to doing God’s business.

 

(1 Timothy 6:9, 10) But those who are determined to be rich fall into temptation and a snare and many senseless and harmful desires that plunge men into destruction and ruin. 10 For the love of money is a root of all sorts of injurious things, and by reaching out for this love some have been led astray from the faith and have stabbed themselves all over with many pains.

 

It was true in the first century too that some had left the faith because of reaching out for things that the love of money brings. The precursor to getting more money is usually higher education.

 

People who discern what God’s will is will cut down on or avoid things that would prevent them from living a simple life where they will have time for God and his purposes.

 

The apostle John also encourages us not to love the world and the things in it.

 

(1 John 2:15-17) Do not love either the world or the things in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him; 16 because everything in the world—the desire of the flesh and the desire of the eyes and the showy display of one’s means of life—does not originate with the Father, but originates with the world. 17 Furthermore, the world is passing away and so is its desire, but the one who does the will of God remains forever.

 

True Christians want to do God’s will and remain forever after the disobedient world passes away. (Rev 7: 14). Those who fall asleep in death look forward to a resurrection to life in heaven or on a paradise earth. (John 10:16; Luke 12:32; Ps 37:10,.11)

 

So some persons make sacrifices to obtain more money and prominence in this life, whereas true Christians make sacrifices in this life to attain the real life, everlasting life.

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.

This advice came out in the May 9, 1989 Awake ... and it is up to EVERY INDIVIDUAL Brother and Sister to review in their own mind how COMPETENT this advice was .... because it has not changed ...

Taking sound, reality based advice will, barring chance and unforeseen circumstances, make your life better, happier, EASIER, and more fulfilling. Most of the REAL PROBLEMS I have had in my life have been caused by being poor, and constantly STRUGGLING to keep gainfully employed.

Gainfully employed in THIS day and age is not the same as in the time of John the Baptist, where you could dress in rags, live in a hole in the ground, and eat locusts (YUM!), and die of exhaustion, deprivation, starvation ( No, I'm FASTING! ...uh... yeah... uh... that's it .. uh "fasting!") .and disease, and a LONG life for the average genetically disposed person was around age 34 and you were full of infection of every sort, and your teeth had rotted out of you head.  You walked everywhere, and died on the side of the road from exposure.

It is up to EVERY INDIVIDUAL Brother and Sister to review in their own mind how COMPETENT this advice was .... because it has not changed

.

 

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It's a Trap.jpg

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To be fair, someone should report satisfaction statistics for those who have gone to (recent) college, for it is not free, and job openings do not necessarily greet graduates. Moreover, if you flame out today, you find yourself working at McDonald's trying to pay off the astronomical bills you have so far run up.

 

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On 2/23/2017 at 7:34 PM, Melinda Mills said:

People who are successful in this life made sacrifices to get where they are now, and some continue to make sacrifices.

See quote below from a successful writer/journalist, Thuy Yau.

“We have to make the choice between our immediate desires and the needs that will propel our dreams forward.

Fact is, it’s not wrong of us to have these immediate desires, these temptations to choose the ‘easier’ option’. It’s normal to feel that way. However, when we sacrifice what we want right now, we are saving our time and energy for something more important. Something that will bring us one step closer to our real goals. Something we truly want, not just something we want right now.

Maybe we don’t want to sacrifice our time, stability, personal life, sleep, health, stillness and sanity. Maybe it just feels too difficult. But I’ll tell you right now, I’ve sacrificed every one of these things at one point or another. I wouldn’t have gone from writing on a personal blog to working as a freelance writer/journalist, if I had chosen the easier option. I wouldn’t have grown as a person if I hadn’t made those sacrifices either.

If you want to be successful and achieve what you really want in life, you’ll have to make sacrifices. But when you reach the end of that mountain, you’ll be so very glad that you never gave up the journey.”

==

Note the sacrifices it took to arrive at the success she attained as a writer.

If people can make sacrifices to attain transient goals and treasures, what is so wrong for true Christians to choose to make sacrifices and focus on the real life (everlasting life in perfect conditions) which is promised in the scriptures. Paul’s letter to Timothy encourages us to choose the real life and not the illusions of this system of things.

(1 Timothy 6:18, 19) . . .Tell them to work at good, to be rich in fine works, to be generous, ready to share, 19 safely treasuring up for themselves a fine foundation for the future, so that they may get a firm hold on the real life.

 

Jesus Christ said to seek first the Kingdom of God not worldly things.

 (Matthew 6:33) “Keep on, then, seeking first the Kingdom and his righteousness, and all these other things will be added to you.

 

 (1 Corinthians 15:19) If in this life only we have hoped in Christ, we are to be pitied more than anyone.

 

(Hebrews 6:9, 10) 9 But in your case, beloved ones, we are convinced of better things, things related to salvation, even though we are speaking in this way. 10 For God is not unrighteous so as to forget your work and the love you showed for his name by ministering and continuing to minister to the holy ones.

 

We make decisions taking into consideration the real life promised in the Bible.

 

We talking about excellence in everything we do -  we are not talking about sloppiness, carelessness, leaving school without any qualifications or skills. We are talking about not using the world to the full so we may have more time to do God’s will.

 

(1 Cor 7: 29-35) 29 Moreover, this I say, brothers, the time left is reduced. From now on, let those who have wives be as though they had none, 30 and those who weep as those who do not weep, and those who rejoice as those who do not rejoice, and those who buy as those who do not possess, 31 and those making use of the world as those not using it to the full; for the scene of this world is changing. 32 Indeed, I want you to be free from anxiety. The unmarried man is anxious for the things of the Lord, how he may gain the Lord’s approval. 33 But the married man is anxious for the things of the world, how he may gain the approval of his wife, 34 and he is divided. Further, the unmarried woman, as well as the virgin, is anxious for the things of the Lord, that she may be holy both in her body and in her spirit. However, the married woman is anxious for the things of the world, how she may gain the approval of her husband. 35 But I am saying this for your personal advantage, not to restrict you, but to move you to what is appropriate and to constant devotion to the Lord without distraction.

 

People are not coerced to apply these scriptures.  Jehovah God has confidence that persons who understood the scriptures and the urgency to get on the side of His approval would do this willingly. He said prophetically on his Son’s coming to power as the King of God’s kingdom, people would offer themselves to do the King’s bidding.

 

 (Psalm 110:3) “Your people will offer themselves willingly on the day of your military force. In splendid holiness, from the womb of the dawn, You have your company of young men just like dewdrops.”

 

The important work that they would buy out time for is the preaching of the good news of his Kingdom which would solve all the problems now plaguing the world. People need to hear the real solution. (See Matthew 24:14 and Matthew 28:19,20.)

 

Paul further showed that we should buy out time for this.

 

(Ephesians 5:15, 16) 15 So keep strict watch that how YOU walk is not as unwise but as wise [persons], 16 buying out the opportune time for yourselves, because the days are wicked.

 

He warned also about materialism.  The more “successful” you are the more gadgets to care for, and service; more travelling, more appointments, parties, etc.  If you simplify your life there will be more time to get down to doing God’s business.

 

(1 Timothy 6:9, 10) But those who are determined to be rich fall into temptation and a snare and many senseless and harmful desires that plunge men into destruction and ruin. 10 For the love of money is a root of all sorts of injurious things, and by reaching out for this love some have been led astray from the faith and have stabbed themselves all over with many pains.

 

It was true in the first century too that some had left the faith because of reaching out for things that the love of money brings. The precursor to getting more money is usually higher education.

 

People who discern what God’s will is will cut down on or avoid things that would prevent them from living a simple life where they will have time for God and his purposes.

 

The apostle John also encourages us not to love the world and the things in it.

 

(1 John 2:15-17) Do not love either the world or the things in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him; 16 because everything in the world—the desire of the flesh and the desire of the eyes and the showy display of one’s means of life—does not originate with the Father, but originates with the world. 17 Furthermore, the world is passing away and so is its desire, but the one who does the will of God remains forever.

 

True Christians want to do God’s will and remain forever after the disobedient world passes away. (Rev 7: 14). Those who fall asleep in death look forward to a resurrection to life in heaven or on a paradise earth. (John 10:16; Luke 12:32; Ps 37:10,.11)

 

So some persons make sacrifices to obtain more money and prominence in this life, whereas true Christians make sacrifices in this life to attain the real life, everlasting life.

Some good reasoning there Melinda. In a nutshell, the worldly way is all about ME. The Christian way is about others, and putting Kingdom interests first.

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On 2/25/2017 at 7:15 AM, Anna said:

Some good reasoning there Melinda. In a nutshell, the worldly way is all about ME. The Christian way is about others, and putting Kingdom interests first.

The article that changed everything

In my opinion, it was the Watchtower 10/1/2005, “Parents—What Future Do You Want for Your Children?” A close friend of me working in Brooklyn Bethel at those days mention that the brother (I think he was from the GB) presiding the Monday Family Worship said regarding the article under study: “well, this is the same point of view as always”, but not everyone nodded. Let’s review why.

Summarizing the advises from 1990-2005, this quote could be a typical example:

  • ·        *** g94 8/22 p. 5 Additional Schooling or not? *** Supplementary Education. The Watchtower of November 1, 1992, noted concerning Jehovah’s Witnesses and the full-time ministry: “The general trend in many lands is that the level of schooling required to earn decent wages is now higher than it was a few years ago. . . . It is difficult to find jobs with decent wages after completing simply the minimum schooling required by law . . .  “What is meant by ‘decent wages’? . . . Their wages might be termed ‘adequate,’ or ‘satisfactory,’ if what they earn allows them to live decently while leaving them sufficient time and strength to accomplish their Christian ministry.”   So The Watchtower said: “No hard-and-fast rules should be made either for or against extra education.

In spite of the above reference, in general, advanced education was always presented in a way not recommended, for its dangers, as immorality, materialism, proud and so.

But, when this 2005 article was studied in the congregation, we couldn’t find any possibility do chose going to University and to be an exemplar brother. And this position was forced in several schools of elders and additional instructions regarding choosing speakers for assemblies and other exemplar Christians.

But there was this small sentence in the article:

  • ·        *** w05 10/1 p. 30 par. 13 Parents—What Future Do You Want for Your Children? *** “Of course, immorality, bad behavior, and pressures are by no means limited to the college or university campus

Of course! Every JW is well aware of this reality. A young Christian of 16 years must face also to temptations and pressures in his secular job, if he chooses leave studies and start to work. And, this is the reality in my country, the immorality in Professional Schools (not sure the translation in English, I mean places where you learn some skill), are WORST, and the atmosphere is WORST than in Universities. Why? Because in my country, in general only good students go to University, and most of them concentrate on studying. On the other hand, a lot of unmotivated youth assist to these other schools only to passing the time.

To whom correspond the decision? All those involved, not the elders, not the congregation. When should react the congregation? (Gal 6:1) “Brothers, even if a man takes a false step before he is aware of it, you who have spiritual qualifications try to readjust such a man in a spirit of mildness” In other words, if we see the brother takes a dangerous path, the loving way is to advise him. For example:

  • ·        The young must leave the home and go to another city, staying with worldly people
  • ·        The debts are so high that will force to the Christian to spend all his time work hard to cancel

Love and spiritual motivates us to give advice. Perhaps the lack of judgment could lead to losing the privileges. But not (is my opinion) as a general rule. But let’s consider next situations:

  • ·        What (as in my city) there are several universities, avoiding the necessity to leave home?
  • ·        What if my son eats at home, sleeps at home?
  • ·        What if, for these reasons, I have the opportunity to talk with my son every day, and see the different situations he’s coping in his daily life?
  • ·        What if the workload in his studies are quite similar to those that would have working?
  • ·        What if I can move to the city where the University is located, to oversee my son?
  • ·        What if I can delay the finalization of the career, in the interest that my son would have less workload, and, in this way, more freedom for his spiritual activities?
  • ·        What if I can take over the debts
  • ·        What if…?

The 2005 article did not consider these possibilities at all. Simply, if you go to University, you’ll face all these dangers.

What has happened since then?

I have a good friend. He’s a very known elder. His three sons have gone to University (living at home). The outcome:

  • ·        The three are -at this time- in full time ministry. One of them was several years in Bethel.
  • ·        One of them is a very humble and nice elder (because before he went to University he already was so)
  • ·        Two of them are not so humble (because before they went to University they already were this way)

I’ve seen a lot of other youth not going to University. The outcome

  • ·        The humble ones, still are.
  • ·        The proud ones, still are.

Yes, I’ve heard a lot of times the experience of someone going to University and leaving the truth, or becoming more proud, or more materialist. But I’ve seen the same in many brothers without superior studies. For me, the relevant factor is:

Has contributed the superior studies to this spiritual outcome?

My personal experience.

I learnt the truth in the 1975 generation. Imagine. I start as pioneer the same day when I was baptized, when I was 16. In spite my parents pressure (I’m alone as JW) and my love for Science and Chemistry, I started the regular at 17 accepting any kind o partial time job, and when I was 18 was sent as special pioneer to another region. Later, I got married and about 30 had to leave full time service.

My situation was anything but easy. My only skill with 30 years was to preach. I struggled a lot studying for myself computer sciences after exhausting workdays. As I gained skills I could get better jobs. Over time I founded my own company related with software development. All my employees have University degree but, invariably, I had to teach them a lot of skills.

Do I think I lost my time when I was pioneer? I’m about 60, Do I think I could have attended University and, later, start as pioneer? What if, instead of doing well things, economically, at this moment I had a poor paid job, with no good holidays, no good car, do I still think it was a bad decision, not going to Chemistry University?

I would never exchange those wonderful years serving as pioneer and helping humble people to learn the truth, helping to establish new congregations, depending of God’s hand… No car, no big house, no holidays is better than serving in this special way.

So, what I think about these persons that now realized they wasted part of their life not attending superior studies?

As several of you have mention, if we hold the kingdom first, no sacrifice we could have done is perceived as such. But this does not mean that our position regarding superior studies are, at some degree, an imposition, not a personal decision.

 

 

 

 

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When you are caring for your father with dementia and you must blow off a stick of dynamite under him to get him to shower or acquiesce to be cleaned up in any other way, and when you tell him for the 500th time where this one or that one member of the family is, and you have even moved in with him because his house is bigger than yours and in your smaller house he would drive you absolutely crazy with his constant requests for information you gave him 5 seconds ago and besides, he is just about blind, but in his own house it doesn't matter because he knows where everyone is, and in spite of all the upheaval in your life you are still grateful life worked out that way so that you could care for him....

it occurs to you that life would be less likely to have worked that way had you immersed yourself in the type of career that is generally only possible with a fine university education as its underlying base, for with a simple life, you can maneuver it, but with a complicated life, it maneuvers you, and you say 'it's the nursing home for you Pop!' where he will die very quickly disoriented and demoralized, and perhaps even as a pin cushion for whatever Pharma wants to send his way to make him more pliable.

Please don't give me the 'buts' or the 'what ifs,' for I will immediately acknowledge there are a ton of them. Nor is this to lay any guilt upon anyone who has placed parents in the nursing home, for sometimes it must be done. Nor is it any reason in itself to not choose university. It is, though, a reminder that the university course can 'trap' you into doing things or not doing things that you may regret deeply afterwards, since 'this life' today is not the real life, but failing to take care of your parents to the fullest degree you can perhaps is.

(Pop is in the second book. He doesn't know it, but then, he doesn't know anything. He was, however, once a vigorous man who did many things for his children, some of which they appreciated at the time and some of which they appreciated only later)

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3 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

it occurs to you that life would be less likely to have worked that way had you immersed yourself in the type of career that is generally only possible with a fine university education as its underlying base

I didn't quite catch the connection between the choice a university-educated person might make with respect to caring for an aging parent.

3 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

It is, though, a reminder that the university course can 'trap' you into doing things or not doing things that you may regret deeply afterwards, since 'this life' today is not the real life, but failing to take care of your parents to the fullest degree you can perhaps is.

I'm guessing that some kind of professional career like being a lawyer, doctor, engineer, nurse, or teacher makes you more likely fail to take care of your parents to the fullest degree. I'm sure there are tens of thousands of professionals who get caught up in the importance of their career and don't do all they can for their aging parents. But I'm wondering if there may not be elevens of thousands of non-university-educated who end up doing or not doing things they deeply regret afterward, and fail to take care of their parents to the fullest degree. My anecdotal experiences tell me that you could easily have this one backwards.

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Well, it's all anecdotal and I don't pretend to be dropping the 11th Commandment. But IF you have been trained by Bible education, which can be found you know where, and IF your life has not been made so important so that your present demanding career makes it unthinkable to interrupt it for such a duty, you are more likely to provide personal care for your aging parents.

Look, don't argue with me on this one because I will give up - you'll never see a white flag go up so fast. But I had some fonts lying around the house and I had to use them before they went bad so I used them here. Besides, as far as I'm concerned, if you want to go to college, go to college. If you get some peer-pressure heat because of it, just accept it as a price that must be paid. That's how it is with any human organization. Not everything goes your way. But you accept it because you know that the Lord's will can be magnified here on earth if his servants are organized, as opposed to as if each person is his own wandering planet.

Nor should you be too quick to blow off the circuit overseer who said of his former fancy pants circuit that there were 100 that went to college and only 3 who remained in the truth. Atheistic, humanistic professors, sexually avant-garde students and faculty alike,  see your naive offspring coming along with stars in his/her eyes and say 'It's Game On!' just like I do with the Librarian whom I fear.

And don't miss the organization's counsel, which arguably could be given more strongly, that it's not just what you should not do, but what you should. Prepare your youngster well ahead of time to choose from career paths available to him and learn what options are available and at what cost. If you are all thumbs yourself, make sure he knows that one can't make a living in all-thumbs. Or maybe it is given. Despite their counsel to familiarize yourself with whatever comes down the pipe, I am drawn to what primarily concerns me.

I like CMP's point, too, that where he comes from, the ones who get to university are serious minded but the ones who take the easy stuff are riff-raff, generally speaking. It's not that way here. Here they just party and malign Trump and take absurd curriculum that has no practical application anywhere. But it is different where he is, apparently.

Bernard Strawman pointed out that Tom Irregardless wouldn't use his word so much if he had some education. But Tom has focused on education that trains morally, the kind of education God's organization specializes in. You can always hire out for smarts when you need them.

 

 

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