The Holy Spirit

[Cos]

I find it strange how JWs will sometimes regard the Holy Spirit as an attribute of God; and at other times resolve the passages in which He is spoken of into a roundabout way, or indirect way for God Himself; or, to express both as a figure of speech; to me this shows that JW have no real idea, but will say anything except the obvious.

 

In establishing the fact that the Holy Spirit is a Person, note when you read Scripture how frequent the Holy Spirit is associated (and distinguished) with two other Persons in equal degree! <><

[The Librarian]

Jehovah's Witnesses view the Holy Spirit, not as an actual person separate from Jehovah, but as His "energy" or "active force", that he uses to accomplish his will in creation and redemption

 

[Cos]

On 9/2/2017 at 9:34 PM, The Librarian said:

Jehovah's Witnesses view the Holy Spirit, not as an actual person separate from Jehovah, but as His "energy" or "active force", that he uses to accomplish his will in creation and redemption

 

Yes generally JW's regard the Holy Spirit as an attribute of God, but sadly this is just another error. <><

[James Thomas Rook Jr.]

6 minutes ago, Cos said:

Yes generally JW's regard the Holy Spirit as an attribute of God, but sadly this is just another error. <><

It is ?

In this forum the burden of proof is on you.

You have already proved by your own words in the Archive Topic "Demonism and the Watchtower", that you are completely clueless as to what constitutes proof, or reason, or logic, but I am willing to give you another chance at redemption from conviction by your own hand.

PROVE IT!

[Cos]

19 minutes ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

It is ?

In this forum the burden of proof is on you.

You have already proved by your own words in the Archive Topic "Demonism and the Watchtower", that you are completely clueless as to what constitutes proof, or reason, or logic, but I am willing to give you another chance at redemption from conviction by your own hand.

PROVE IT!

Mr. Rook,
 

I did give you proof, you just don't like it!
 

If the Holy Spirit were not a person but a designation for some sort of attribute of God then we would not find passages where both the Spirit and an influence are co-ordinately named.

 

For example the words in Acts 10:38 "anointed with the Holy Spirit and with power" makes the idea that the Holy Spirit is a mere "force" or "attribute" as redundant,  "anointing with power and power"(?)

 

That the Spirit of God is distinct from God the Father (just as the Son is) is seen from passages were you can try to substitute the term "God" or "Father" in place of where the Holy Spirit is present, here is an example;

 

Eph. 2:18 "For through Him we both have access to the Father by one Spirit" ["access to the Father by one Father.?!]

 

More examples can be cited to show the error JW have, but you will more likely dismiss them as you have just done with the above. <><

[Evacuated]

7 hours ago, Cos said:

For example the words in Acts 10:38 "anointed with the Holy Spirit and with power" makes the idea that the Holy Spirit is a mere "force" or "attribute" as redundant,  "anointing with power and power"(?)

I don't see Jehovah's Witnesses or the Bible teaching that "Holy Spirit" and "power" are literally synonymous. Do you?

[The Librarian]

@Gone Fishing I agree that "power" is oversimplified. 

Too often in our explanations or illustrations of Holy Spirit we have used electricity as an analogy which is an oversimplification.

 

[James Thomas Rook Jr.]

Cos:

What you have stated is OPINION.  You have proved NOTHING, except that you can type.

Both God and Christ have a personal name ... what is the Holy Spirit's name .... Casper?

If so, it must be a FRIENDLY spirit.

YEAH, that's the ticket!

( ... for those in Rio Linda that was intended to be biting sarcasm .... because the Holy Spirit does NOT have a personal name ... and God and Christ do! )

note:  ... descriptions do not count as personal names, no more than a warm blanket does... um .... not being a person...

.

.

Even my seven dogs have personal names ...... in human English .....  I don't know if that is true in Arf.

.

 

[Evacuated]

2 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

that was intended to be biting sarcasm

Despite the acerbic nature of your comment (hardly "seasoned with salt") I'm giving you a upvote because you are absolutely right! (Even though you couldn't care less what I think).

[Cos]

22 hours ago, Gone Fishing said:

I don't see Jehovah's Witnesses or the Bible teaching that "Holy Spirit" and "power" are literally synonymous. Do you?

Gone Fishing,

 

I have had JW’s describe the Holy Spirit to me as God’s “power”.

 

Obvious some do think this while you imply you don’t.

 

I’m curious to know, how you describe your idea of the Holy Spirit?

 

I believe that the Watchtower identifies the Holy Spirit as “God’s POWER in action” on their web page. Maybe they mean “power” in another sense, you tell me.

 

“In the Bible, God’s holy spirit is identified as God’s power in action.” https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/102006245

 

Does that surprise you? <><

[Cos]

19 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

Cos:

What you have stated is OPINION.  You have proved NOTHING, except that you can type.

Both God and Christ have a personal name ... what is the Holy Spirit's name .... Casper?

If so, it must be a FRIENDLY spirit.

YEAH, that's the ticket!

( ... for those in Rio Linda that was intended to be biting sarcasm .... because the Holy Spirit does NOT have a personal name ... and God and Christ do! )

note:  ... descriptions do not count as personal names, no more than a warm blanket does... um .... not being a person...

.

.

Even my seven dogs have personal names ...... in human English .....  I don't know if that is true in Arf.

.

 

Mr. Rook,

 

Your argument is not a sound one, just because you think the Holy Spirit does not have a personal name like Christ does, is not recourse to assume that this mean the Holy Spirit is not a real person. If this were a valid argument, then, following your line of reasoning, a newborn child is not a person until he/she is named.

 

In Scripture Spiritual beings are not always named; some evil spirits are rarely named but are identified by their particular character, for example “unclean” and ‘wicked” etc.

 

The Holy Spirit is identified by His character, which is holiness. The designation “Holy Spirit” is clearly intended as a description of character.

 

Also, it is interesting to note that the Holy Spirit is identified as YHWH, see Isaiah 6:8-10 and Acts 28:25-29. <><

[James Thomas Rook Jr.]

Cos:

Even though we don't know what those names are, Jehovah has even named the stars of the heavens, and knows them all by a personalized, (which really means individual),  name  ....he did NOT give personalized individual  names to  the radiations they emit ...gamma radiation,  x-rays, ultra violet, radio waves, infrared, etc. .... for electricity, Reddy Kilowatt comes to mind as a personalized name that power companies gave to Electricity as an advertising ploy.    before they realized you do not have to advertise electricity.

PEOPLE are silly that way, but we enjoy being amused.

I am going to keep this short, as today I have to work outside all day installing bundles of electrical wiring for my yard underground wiring system , and I don't want to get a sunburn from Fred ultraviolet light, or have a heat stroke from Wanda infrared light, and is rumored that If I am not careful, Reddy Kilowatt will try to kill me.

I am silly THAT way.

Forgive me ... it's silly to name FORCES with personal names as I have just done ( and the electrical companies did)...... that is why Jehovah does not do it.

That is why the HOLY SPIRIT does NOT have a personal name  , it,  like a star, is a FORCE that emanates from God to affect things at the other end ... to accomplish his will at his direction.

It is a DIRECTED force, not light sunlight that illuminates the solar system, and beyond.

So ...ponder this ... why do trillions upon trillions of stars have a personalzed name ...  and the HOLY SPIRIT does not ... only descriptions of WHAT IT DOES!

Answer: (For those in Rio Linda...) IT'S A FORCE.

Of course Casper the friendly farce may condemn me to hell for saying so ... but that would be...... "unfriendly"

MAY THE FORCE BE WITH YOU, COS.