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TrueTomHarley

Let us Appreciate Brother Lett

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On 8/17/2018 at 12:12 AM, Grey Reformer said:

How do you define Christian Activism, Political Activism, and Civil disobedience

My opinion is not of some importance now. It is more important how WT define it and how some of people who participate in this forum as WT defender, are not  in harmony /unity, obeying) what GB told them, instructing and teaching. Let see what i found in JW publications.

Politicians, activists, and reformers have long struggled to find solutions to divisive issues. Their efforts may be sincere and well-motivated. Yet, Christians recognize that only God’s Kingdom can solve mankind’s problems and guarantee true justice. We must leave the matter in Jehovah’s hands. After all, if each Christian advocated the solution he thought best, would not our congregations soon become divided? - https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/2015527

"From Political Activist to Neutral Christian"                                                                                                                                                                                            THE year was 1953. The place—Liberec, Czechoslovakia (now Czech Republic). I was then a 19-year-old activist who sought political change. We activists propagated our views by distributing leaflets that were critical of the Communist Party, then in power. - https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/102002447

Similarly, true Christians today do not engage in civil disobedience. They await the day and hour when qualified intervention by God will come. Only he has the wisdom and the power to bring lasting solutions to mankind. Through their preaching work, Jehovah’s Witnesses reassure those who are suffering from injustices that such relief is soon to come. - https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/101987647

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1 hour ago, Srecko Sostar said:

My opinion is not of some importance now. It is more important how WT define it and how some of people who participate in this forum as WT defender, are not  in harmony /unity, obeying) what GB told them, instructing and teaching. Let see what i found in JW publications.

Then you will notice, the Watchtower has the same framework as Jesus did, to separate church from state. So, it is not what the GB is saying, it is what scripture is saying. The majority of former witnesses fail to make that distinction.  As for the trolling, from everyone here, that’s to be expected. There’s only one cure. The moral fiber of some is zero.

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4 hours ago, Grey Reformer said:

Then you will notice, the Watchtower has the same framework as Jesus did, to separate church from state. So, it is not what the GB is saying, it is what scripture is saying. The majority of former witnesses fail to make that distinction.  As for the trolling, from everyone here, that’s to be expected. There’s only one cure. The moral fiber of some is zero.

 

I disagree. Jesus "framework" is/are interpreted many times by many people or organizations as how they see how would Jesus do this or that. So when you put quote that sound so final and as definitive diagnosis; " the Watchtower has the same framework as Jesus did", i must be careful, alert :)))) Not forget how same WT using phrases (when they explaining GB doctrines) as "Jesus must be thinking this or that, he obviously mean this or that. So, please do not call for Jesus authority when promote own or GB ideas :))  

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6 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

I disagree. Jesus "framework" is/are interpreted many times by many people or organizations as how they see how would Jesus do this or that.

To sum it up. The one that governs the body of Jehovah’s witnesses is the inspired word of God. The GB doesn’t have anything to do with the framework Christ started, other than obeying God’s and Christ commands. They don’t add on as the general public of former witnesses speculates. If this is too difficult to understand, then the arguments you personally make are simply conjecture.

So, this will conclude our conversation on this matter, and return to the topic at hand.

There is no greater authority than that of God and Christ. That makes even more valuable and has a greater appreciation for the gospel of Christ. 1 Peter 2:21 which the GB intuitively do.

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3 hours ago, Grey Reformer said:

There is no greater authority than that of God and Christ. That makes even more valuable and has a greater appreciation for the gospel of Christ. 1 Peter 2:21 which the GB intuitively do.

More or less, in a manner of speaking, occasionally. sometimes.

Gravity Electricity Wind .mp42 CHAIR pORNEA .mp4JW.ORG on Child Abuse - Claims vs. Reality.mp4

Caleb and Sophia Dolls for Tony .jpg

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On 8/18/2018 at 2:49 PM, Grey Reformer said:

To sum it up. The one that governs the body of Jehovah’s witnesses is the inspired word of God. The GB doesn’t have anything to do with the framework Christ started, other than obeying God’s and Christ commands. They don’t add on as the general public of former witnesses speculates. If this is too difficult to understand, then the arguments you personally make are simply conjecture.

 

So, this will conclude our conversation on this matter, and return to the topic at hand.

 

There is no greater authority than that of God and Christ. That makes even more valuable and has a greater appreciation for the gospel of Christ. 1 Peter 2:21 which the GB intuitively do.

 

You can't reason with a man who believes the following and or adheres to:

  • That birds pay for his internet connection.
  • He believes God is not going to be surprised about people changing their sex, even physically by means of drug and or surgically.
  • He makes claim to something he deems as absolute proof when all that is seen is a registry based on a census.
  • He states a woman known as Chloe leads a church and says it is in the Bible, but nothing is found and this woman is only mentioned ONCE in scripture.
  • Thinks writing letters is political, when on the RU side is is not seen as such, nor by anyone who takes into account EU media.
  • So called things addressed, linked, only lead to main page of a website.... That has no mention of what he himself addressed.
  • Thinks that if someone knows the Bible more than him, such one considers others as inferior, when such is not the case.
  • relies on the Admin to save him from his own error(s), but when the topic is focused, stumbles upon himself and likes something that is irrelevant which only worsens for him.
  • Thinks being called "daft" is a major insult, when it also means one who is ignorant.
  • Thinks fighting for Religious Rights is also political when such can be done in a non-political space.
  • Does not know the difference between ECOSOC and SOC; as well as criteria(s) being met or not.
  • He makes a statement about a faith community taking in loads of money from a venue when in reality the information provided says otherwise, thus prompting him to wipe his current message and a message from a year ago.
  • He is not a fan of anything in regards to a man named Abraham, even going as far as to call this man of the Bible, selfish and not caring of anything but himself.
  • He speaks in opinion of money, yet is in agreement with a verse in which a coin came from a fish, and contradicts himself over and over again.
  • Believes a Judge can lead a church when the Old Testament speaks nothing of churches.

 

The list goes on.

That being said, a bit more relaxed that I have I returned from The Motherland.

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On 8/17/2018 at 1:01 PM, TrueTomHarley said:

Weighing in (I think) with @Space Merchant (was it on this thread or another?) here is a psychiatrist declaring that pedophilia is a legitamate sexual orientation, thus arguing for its recognition. This does not appear to be fake news.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/paedophilia-sexual-orientation-straight-gay-criminal-psychologist-child-sex-abuse-a6965956.html

It was on another thread. I was looking into recent information back to 2015, however, the whole sexual orientation thing is indeed something of which can be led into a problem, and cause more issues with institutions of both the educational and religious space should things go to a mission impossible like status.

Yes, some psychiatrist will speak on pedophilia, it is indeed a disorder, however, those who are in agreement with the message thing otherwise. This has also causes a good chuck of people to fight to make pedophilia be recognized as a sexual orientation rather than a disorder. In regards to the LGBT, there is a portion of them who are for this as well, hence the whole business with kids dressing up provocatively, nearly half-naked and running about, dancing and a list of other things. We also see members of this part of the LGBT community who go to the schools and or some facility to teach and read to the children, with the main topic being gender related and so forth. I would put up some information here and or something that is in tired connection to such, but stuff like this is not too friendly on the eyes of the ones who do not suspect such a thing.

For me, my biggest fear is stuff like this taking off, full sail, to the point it cannot be stopped and will eventually tip over and cause some real damage.

That being said, I will be researching on this more, mainly a few years back from 2015, mainly in regards to the EU, for pedophilia is far more greater in such areas compared to the US, for a number of kids are placed into human trafficking and other things in relation, and stuff like this hits home for me because someone, a Democrat, who is friends with Hilary, nearly did the same to my country in regards to taking children into human trafficking and since that day it still bothers me, as well as the assassination of Me. Ebrewein, it was not a suicide as the media claims.

But yeah, in short, it is a major fear, like a virus spreading that cannot be stopped, eventually it will drive you to be highly cautious, perhaps, mad, and a bit overly protective, for in this sense, the schools and the churches are riddled with unsuspecting abusers who take up the disorder to commit ill intent on others.

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On 8/17/2018 at 5:12 PM, Anna said:

I can always tell it's Allen by the questions marks that are put in odd places in a sentence....besides other things...but that's a dead giveaway

I didn't notice that until now.

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13 hours ago, Space Merchant said:

I didn't notice that until now.

I think anyone can go off on hysteria? However, does anyone know what dot, dot, dash, dash, mean? Between friends, it can mean many things. There is a superficial need to know the identity of those who reject the arguments made here. What a crowd. LOL!!

 

the word assume makes it very clear!!!

The topic posted:

Let us Appreciate Brother Lett

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News  Philadelphia Media Network, PBC

She says she was 5 when another Jehovah's Witness raped her. The religion's leaders call such accounts 'false stories'

"For much of the last two decades, Lett has been a member of the small governing body that runs Jehovah’s Witnesses and sets the course for the denomination’s followers at more than a dozen congregations in the Philadelphia area, and thousands more around the world. Lett and the seven other men on this committee maintain quiet profiles, their voices usually absent from media coverage about the Witnesses’ widespread child sex-abuse problems.

But in the spring of 2015, Lett unexpectedly starred in a 10-minute video that was posted on the Witnesses’ website, an appearance that coincided with a spate of stories about abuse allegations and cover-ups published by Reveal, from the Center for Investigative Reporting.

Dressed in a dark suit, he grew animated as he urged followers to stay united by “rejecting false stories.”"

.......read more at http://www.philly.com/philly/news/jehovahs-witnesses-child-sex-abuse-stephen-lett-chessa-manion-20180620.html

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44 minutes ago, Srecko Sostar said:

.......read more

I'll take a chance here. Srecko posts a Philly article damning to Jehovah's Witnesses. (though it has nothing to do with the thread - my thread)

I wrote a reply to that article and sent it to the newspaper, cc to the reporter and an editor or two. I said they owed it to their readers to publish it or its equivalent as prominently as they had published theirs maligning a group of decent people. The letter of reply was not acknowledged in any way. 

Let's see if the reply can remain here. Srecko's incendiary link has stayed. Let's see if the response is permitted to stay as well. It is directly relevent and does not veer off in any other direction.

http://www.tomsheepandgoats.com/2018/07/an-open-letter-to-the-philadelphia-inquirer-because-they-did-not-acknowlege-much-less-print-the-sent.html

The Philly paper went on to write two follow-up articles, the reporter checking back to Reddit. I replied to each of them, and then wrote a fourth piece summarizing them all: "Three Incendiary Articles from the Philadelphia Inquirer."
 

She says she was 5 when another Jehovah's Witness raped her. The religion's leaders call such accounts 'false stories'

They do not. It is the spin put on them that he calls 'false stories.'

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2 minutes ago, TrueTomHarley said:

(though it has nothing to do with the thread - my thread)

Stephen Lett  is mentioned as important figure in this situation. That was the reason why  i putted. :)) 

 

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1 hour ago, TrueTomHarley said:

I'll take a chance here. Srecko posts a Philly article damning to Jehovah's Witnesses. (though it has nothing to do with the thread - my thread)

I would say, dig deeper into the news source. Now, I’m not suggesting to have cryptic messages within your fellow writers, since there is no critique in grammar for other participants in this forum. Just saying.

https://www.cjr.org/united_states_project/inquirer-daily-news-paywall-philly.php

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philadelphia_Media_Network

With the old owner, sensationalism without verification was the norm.

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13 hours ago, Grey Reformer said:

With the old owner, sensationalism without verification was the norm.

No, not really. Under the former owner, through 2016, the Philadelphia Inquirer and Philly.com still had journalistic integrity. (200-plus journalists are expensive, though.) They were known to emphasize "bad news," but they were never known for sensationalism without verification. You describe it the way people describe the National Enquirer (which is often confused with the Philadelphia Inquirer).

You seem to have implied that those provided links to Columbia Journalism Review (CJR) and Wikipedia would have supported your claim but they didn't. CJR did discuss the faults and business mistakes of the previous ownership and the typical lurid links of their online outlet, Philly.com. Still nothing about sensationalism without verification, however.

Of course, the writer of the CJR article admits that he is a friend of the current managing editor for digital content at Philadelphia Media Network (PMN), so this whole article reads like a cautious advertisement for his friend, but nevertheless quotes someone there about their current situation, since 2017:

  • “Our job is to make sure that the best journalism gets as many eyes as possible … It’s really easy to throw up links all day long, but we’re starting to think about making sure that we’re sharing our best journalism at the best times with the best people in a more focused way.”

Whether PMN got the article right about the Witnesses or not is another question, but trying to tarnish the credibility of a paper because it had a prior history of mistakes is like those people who point out historical mistakes of the WTS in order to tarnish its current credibility.

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1 hour ago, JW Insider said:

You seem to have implied that those provided links to Columbia Journalism Review (CJR) and Wikipedia would have supported your claim but they didn't. CJR did discuss the faults and business mistakes of the previous ownership and the typical lurid links of their online outlet, Philly.com. Still nothing about sensationalism without verification, however.

Your comment only proves there can be a difference of opinion. Just like there were some critics of the newspaper before it went online.

Sensationalism and propaganda sell. It should be obvious as to the usage here. How did Trump win the presidency if not through lies as he has done with all his business endeavors?

By the way, thanks for that tip about TOR browser. I started using it. I didn’t know there were unethical spies in our organization.

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1 hour ago, Grey Reformer said:

By the way, thanks for that tip about TOR browser. I started using it. I didn’t know there were unethical spies in our organization.

That wasn't me. It was someone else who gave the tip about the TOR browser. Also, it's much better to just recognize that there is no such thing as perfect anonymity. The TOR browser, for all we know, is promoted surreptitiously by government agencies because of their own ability to exploit weaknesses in it while tempting people to use it for dishonest and nefarious purposes. Better to just be honest and know that all things hidden can easily come to light.

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When I heard that the Philly reporter hangs out at the Reddit site, and then I later saw him there myself, as though reporting back to the 'faithful' and promising them further salvos, I thought maybe other reporters might do that too.

So I have posted there several times, as JTR immediately detected at his Apostate Control Center. In any community where ones do nothing but repeat and reinforce, in time the subject becomes skewed and misrepresented. 'They need some education over there,' I said, not regarding the chief priests, but the third parties that may pop in or even take their main nourishment from that source. I don't expect to turn anyone around. I hope only to present another side so that should a reporter broadside us, he at least has a better feel for who and what he is broadsiding. On posts that are lengthy, which is most of them, I usually post just a few paragraphs, and link to the remainder on my own blog, where I can keep track of it and it is not quickly buried. Do you know,  Ms @The Librarian, that I have never once been called for 'spamming' on the 'apostate' site?

In writing specific replies to each Philly article, then an overreaching one incorporating all three, I begin to imagine, I hope not too immodestly, that I become a 'news source' in my own right. What I write I have seen no one else write in a comprehensive fashion. This is also true of my 'review' of the Apostasy movie and an upcoming post or two about the BITE model that everyone is swooning over.

Though some get all bent up that specific replies are not forthcoming from the theocratic organization on whatever dirt opposers think they have dug up on us, and fume that responses cannot be found on the official website, I think they cannot be expected to appear there or anywhere else. To do so would require our brothers go the 'low road,' from the Bible standpoint. Jesus said (Matthew 11) that they will bellyache no matter what you do, so shrug it off and go full speed ahead. David said 'all day long they muttered at him, and he responded by keeping mum.' The plowman that keeps looking behind 'is not well-suited for the kingdom of God,' so they tend not to do that. (Luke 9:62)

It will be for others to defend them, and they may not even appreciate it. And they may not even appreciate it because it is not a good idea. Who can say? I just find that, having taken the time to get my head around things, I cannot let one-sided articles go by without posting a reply as complete as I know how to make it.

Another reason, maybe the more important reason, for the organization's not jumping into the fray, is the principle of separateness. The fray is populated by those yet in the 'low sink' of 1 Peter 4:4. 'Water's just fine here in the low sink!' they cry. 'What are you, nuts, for staying out?' It is just as Peter says, that they are puzzled about it for a time, but quickly figure out that the 'correct' response is to 'speak abusively' of those keeping separate. And few people are as quick to embrace values of the sink than media people - it is they who discuss the merits of "theybees," for example, while people of common sense dismiss it as stupidity on steriods. And don't get me going about people who were out of the low sink but dive back in. "Water is not so bad here, after all," they say, as they slap lipstick on a pig like varnishing a barn.

The brothers cannot win by jumping into the fray. Pope Francis apologiizes in the wake of the Pennsylvanian report, and it is "too little, too late," to the Church's opponents. And no, JTR, it is not even remotely similar to the JW situation - please do not embarrass yourself still further by going there. It will always be 'too little too late' to those whose primary goal is to discredit what they don't like. Even were the brothers to decide that they have something that merits a public apology, the instant retort would be: "Well, what are you going to do about it?" Unless the answer is exactly the course that opposers want, the 'apology' will be dismissed as but empty words. We should not be naive.

How do you face a squad that would convict you for not 'going beyond the law' in reporting? What sort of an invitation to Monday-morning quarterbacking is that? If it is so crucial to go beyond the law, then MAKE that the law. What is so hard about that? Jehovah's organization can make a new policy and spread it throughout every congregation in the world in no time at all. The overall world is, as usual, incompetent, and tries to foist the consequences of its incompetence on others - in this case the one branch of Christianity that knows that if you preach moral values, you had better take some measures to determine that your own people are doing them.

How do you face a squad that says the standard of justice integral to Western law should be abandoned because bad guys escape through the net that way? Each time DNA evidence releases someone convicted on less strenuous proof from prison, we see the value of actually making sure of your facts. Doesn't matter to the zealots. Not long ago the British cops descended with huge fanfare - helocopters, I think, to bust some well-known person for pedophilia, with media giving the raid the greatest coverage. It turned out that when it was found that there was nothing to it, the man sued media and won a large award. It did not make a dent in their zeal. 'Alright, alright, so we destroyed someone,' they muttered. 'It is worth it in our quest to 'protect children.' In searching, I didn't remember enough to bring up the story, but I came up with this from the Michael Jackson trial  (one of the most shameful travesties of 'journalism' says the HuffPost) which is almost better. Meanwhile, at Apostate Control, JTR does not miss an opportunity to malign Michael Jackson, as he does Prince, because he thinks he can hurt the Watchtower that way.

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/charles-thomson/one-of-the-most-shameful_b_610258.html

Nonetheless, do what Jackson pleaded for before the ARC and the problem is solved. Both parties, congregation and government, can pursue their goals without interfering with the other.

No, I think the organization will never go there, in answering charges specifically. It will focus on what it does best, make 'reforms' that it deems necessary, and press forward. It will take up the words of Russell about not kicking at every one that barks, because you don't get very far that way.

Meanwhile, the Librarian, fine lady that she is, and who can blame her for blowing a gasket when I try to link to my blog three times a day? took a look at my blog, said it had an 'old look,' and made some suggestions. I had to admit that it did, so I went to Typepad and said 'what were they going to do about it?' It turns out they can make things more modern, even get it so that it flows into whatever device summons it. I will not get to it immediately, because it is a pain in the neck, but I wlll get to it. Thank you, Ms Librarian. (you old hen) My blog will not compete with yours. It is only a collection of writings I deem loyal. At most, I get one or two attaboys from allies, and seldom even that. "I don't want more,'" said the fox to the sour grapes. And what! You think I am going to let JTR go there without a leash? No. I want to write, not moderate comments.

It is as you say: FB and the huge social media sites are squeezing out the bacon of everyone else. I took a four year hiatus from blogging to attend to some pressing matters. When I returned, it took awhile to restore former traffic. That has been done. Yet the commenting never reappeared. Come, we are allies in a battle that is not unimportant. I don't mean to take from here; I think it almost an impossible goal due to presentation and commenting differences, and if I link to myself, will only do so if it is directly relevent, and not just tooting my own horn for the sake of tooting it. Especially if Srecko links to an entire article, where a hit man writer luxuriates in slowing building his point, I ought to be able to counter with a post progressively building a reply.

 

 

 

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43 minutes ago, JW Insider said:

That wasn't me. It was someone else who gave the tip about the TOR browser. Also, it's much better to just recognize that there is no such thing as perfect anonymity. The TOR browser, for all we know, is promoted surreptitiously by government agencies because of their own ability to exploit weaknesses in it while tempting people to use it for dishonest and nefarious purposes. Better to just be honest and know that all things hidden can easily come to light.

I thought you are the one that wrote it. Is there another JWinsider?

Au contraire Mon frère. Anyone really wanting anonymity can achieve it. That’s why hackers seldom get caught. But, those trying not to hide, are easily detected. Just like, from Virginia to Seattle Washington Amazon to Virginia, and Florida. There must be a lot of doubt and speculation in your life.

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