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At what moment "The Truth" has ceased to be "The Truth"?


Srecko Sostar

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I understand your points and you have expressed them very well. I will address each point you raised separately, but first I just want to mention a few general things which have perhaps shaped the per

Hey Brother Billie..your way out on this....it is undeniable if you watched the ARC...we as a people were found to have faulty policies...that’s a fact..we were forced to ammend them. Kids suffer

I think this point showed excellent insight. I wondered if this is what you meant from the start. The very context shows that the type of leadership in this case is more like the local elders rather t

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On 11/1/2018 at 4:48 PM, Srecko Sostar said:

1) study it

many JW study Bible, but how it is possible that also many of them not saw "errors" in doctrines for all this decades. How is possible that many JW accepted so many teaching and instructions that was later been abandoned? Well it seems how something is/was lacking in our personal Bible study for all these years "in the truth".

2) accept the logic as facts  

as we all are witnesses to that too, wrong logic can deceive us.

3) holy spirit opens our minds and hearts wide to understand 

do you talking, in this statement, about "to be inspired" by God? If you are, than this is contrariwise, in opposition to GB claim how them, as anointed ones, are not inspired by holy spirit. If anointed are not inspired, how non-anointed can be inspired? To confuse and make foggy on all this, that same GB teaching how, despite the fact they are "not inspired by spirit", they are "guided by spirit". :)) 

4) unique above all, is how the Bible's teachings are accepted by millions of people in just the same way

It is "unique" too, how people in some periods of time accepted also some teachings and was been deceived. Modern examples are; Nazi ideology and era when millions of German people followed Fuhrer, or Communism ideology in east Europe or more better example is China people or North Korea. Millions of people accepted teachings in same way. Capitalism is also unique ideology for millions worldwide.   

 

On 11/1/2018 at 4:48 PM, Srecko Sostar said:

1) study it

many JW study Bible, but how it is possible that also many of them not saw "errors" in doctrines for all this decades. How is possible that many JW accepted so many teaching and instructions that was later been abandoned? Well it seems how something is/was lacking in our personal Bible study for all these years "in the truth".

2) accept the logic as facts  

as we all are witnesses to that too, wrong logic can deceive us.

3) holy spirit opens our minds and hearts wide to understand 

do you talking, in this statement, about "to be inspired" by God? If you are, than this is contrariwise, in opposition to GB claim how them, as anointed ones, are not inspired by holy spirit. If anointed are not inspired, how non-anointed can be inspired? To confuse and make foggy on all this, that same GB teaching how, despite the fact they are "not inspired by spirit", they are "guided by spirit". :)) 

4) unique above all, is how the Bible's teachings are accepted by millions of people in just the same way

It is "unique" too, how people in some periods of time accepted also some teachings and was been deceived. Modern examples are; Nazi ideology and era when millions of German people followed Fuhrer, or Communism ideology in east Europe or more better example is China people or North Korea. Millions of people accepted teachings in same way. Capitalism is also unique ideology for millions worldwide.   

The apostles also believed errors....in thinking Jesus Kingdom was coming there and then ...and he would be a king amongst them.....and the thing is....Jesus ALLOWED that error to be believed by them....he knew exactly what they were hoping in and believing.....yet he deliberately chose for them to go on believing that lie or mistaken belief ...

im sure there was more to that than I can work out..but I can see it was a testing and a threshing of their faith....they had made their own assumptions...and leant on their own understandings.....much like we as a people have...at times....and he has allowed it once again...and for more good and spiritual  reasons that I can work out.....but I have worked a bit out...and it is a time of confusion and threshing and sifting....

we are very much like the Christians of Jesus times....nothing seems to be working out like we thought...we have assumed wrong things...taught wrong things...some really major stuff ups actually ...

without  doubt....each and every one of Jehovah’s people are being sifted...our errors are being allowed....

Your missing the big picture Srecho.....since when has his people ever been with out errror...it’s a pattern we have down thru the ages....the Israelites...the Jewish System....and he warmed us about wolves in sheeps clothing infiltrating the congs and misleading many....the Jambares and jannis type of men...

You have put too much faith in Men my brother...and you have allowed them to stumble you.....look beyond them...and to Jehovah....he will correct the errors as he always has done with his people....

i know it’s very hard and painful ...at times agonizing...but being threshed and winnowed is just that....

Jehovah forgave Aaron his betrayal...he forgave Peter his betrayals.....also stop and think about this....the Jewish System was so bad...so self righteous and pious.(those in positions of authority )..yet Jehovah still allowed that people..his people....to birth the messiah....incredible really isn’t it....he put his son right in the midst of them...

what you wrote above is all true...logical.....I get what your saying  and why you say it....but I’m sorry but I still feel you are missing the big picture....but hey...I miss a lot of fine details.....actually I often wonder why he bothers with any of us...:)

 

 

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29 minutes ago, Thinking said:

The apostles also believed errors.

 

29 minutes ago, Thinking said:

Jesus ALLOWED that error to be believed

 

29 minutes ago, Thinking said:

yet he deliberately chose for them to go on believing that lie or mistaken belief

 

30 minutes ago, Thinking said:

we have assumed wrong things...taught wrong things...some really major stuff ups actually ...

 

31 minutes ago, Thinking said:

since when has his people ever been with out errror.

 

31 minutes ago, Thinking said:

it’s a pattern we have

 

35 minutes ago, Thinking said:

You have put too much faith in Men my brother.

 

 

Dear Thinking and final words of Yours is: 

 

32 minutes ago, Thinking said:

what you wrote above is all true...logical

Thanks!

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2 hours ago, Thinking said:

 

The apostles also believed errors....in thinking Jesus Kingdom was coming there and then ...and he would be a king amongst them.....and the thing is....Jesus ALLOWED that error to be believed by them....he knew exactly what they were hoping in and believing.....yet he deliberately chose for them to go on believing that lie or mistaken belief ...

im sure there was more to that than I can work out..but I can see it was a testing and a threshing of their faith....they had made their own assumptions...and leant on their own understandings.....much like we as a people have...at times....and he has allowed it once again...and for more good and spiritual  reasons that I can work out.....but I have worked a bit out...and it is a time of confusion and threshing and sifting....

we are very much like the Christians of Jesus times....nothing seems to be working out like we thought...we have assumed wrong things...taught wrong things...some really major stuff ups actually ...

without  doubt....each and every one of Jehovah’s people are being sifted...our errors are being allowed....

Your missing the big picture Srecho.....since when has his people ever been with out errror...it’s a pattern we have down thru the ages....the Israelites...the Jewish System....and he warmed us about wolves in sheeps clothing infiltrating the congs and misleading many....the Jambares and jannis type of men...

You have put too much faith in Men my brother...and you have allowed them to stumble you.....look beyond them...and to Jehovah....he will correct the errors as he always has done with his people....

i know it’s very hard and painful ...at times agonizing...but being threshed and winnowed is just that....

Jehovah forgave Aaron his betrayal...he forgave Peter his betrayals.....also stop and think about this....the Jewish System was so bad...so self righteous and pious.(those in positions of authority )..yet Jehovah still allowed that people..his people....to birth the messiah....incredible really isn’t it....he put his son right in the midst of them...

what you wrote above is all true...logical.....I get what your saying  and why you say it....but I’m sorry but I still feel you are missing the big picture....but hey...I miss a lot of fine details.....actually I often wonder why he bothers with any of us...:)

 

 

Luke 17 v 1&2.  Then he said to his disciples: “It is unavoidable that causes for stumbling should come. Nevertheless, woe to the one through whom they come!  It would be more advantageous for him if a millstone were hung from his neck and he were thrown into the sea than for him to stumble one of these little ones. 

The GB should take not. 

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@JOHN BUTLER If they never claimed to be inspired, it should be obvious that they are taking notes. The Bible verses you posted cites what context of it reads, the nwt Bible shows this too.

Us men are imperfect, and even prophets, priests and the anointed fits this description, for in present day, we still never heard them, orally say they are, not even in the past and there is evidence.

causes for stumbling: Or “stumbling blocks.” The original meaning of the Greek word skanʹda·lon is thought to have referred to a trap; some suggest that it was the stick in the trap to which bait was attached. By extension, the word came to refer to any impediment that would cause one to stumble or fall. In a figurative sense, it refers to an action or a circumstance that leads a person to follow an improper course, to stumble or fall morally, or to fall into sin. At Luke 17:2, the related verb skan·da·liʹzo, translated “stumble,” could also be rendered “become a snare to; cause to sin.”

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Truth from Jehovah always will be. Our imperfect brains cannot always understand it when it first shines. (Prov.3:5, 6) When Jesus spoke about people eating his flesh and drinking his blood, the faithful apostle Peter, not comprehending what Jesus meant, was asked by Him: "You do not want to go also, do you?" Simon Peter answered him: " Lord,whom shall we go away to? You have sayings of everlasting life. We have believed and come to know that you are the Holy One of God. "  Peter didn't quite get what he'd just learned. Did that mean Jesus wasn't the "Anointed One" ? Peter knew from whom he had learned the truth. Paul pointed the same out to Timothy and what he should do. (2Tim. 3:14, 15) What organization brought the Truth to us? Jehovah's Witnesses made plain the importance of the Bible in learning about God and His purposes. Foremost of these surrounds His glorious Name. Where else do we find a people for His Name? (Matt.6:9, 10; Acts 15:14) So, what we don't yet understand, we humbly wait for from Jehovah in His time. We also don't stir up controversy, arguing about words. (Psa. 62:1-8; 2 Tim. 2:14, 15) Clearly, Jesus appointed our Governing Body. (Matt. 24:45-47) Careful, personal study, along with heartfelt prayer, use of publications they've provided us will be helpful. Humbly, peacefully ask your congregation overseers also to help. May Jehovah's holy spirit bring peace to us all.

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2 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

Luke 17 v 1&2.  Then he said to his disciples: “It is unavoidable that causes for stumbling should come. Nevertheless, woe to the one through whom they come!  It would be more advantageous for him if a millstone were hung from his neck and he were thrown into the sea than for him to stumble one of these little ones. 

The GB should take not. 

So should you and I John....

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20 minutes ago, Martha Braun Amistadi said:

Truth from Jehovah always will be. Our imperfect brains cannot always understand it when it first shines. (Prov.3:5, 6) When Jesus spoke about people eating his flesh and drinking his blood, the faithful apostle Peter, not comprehending what Jesus meant, was asked by Him: "You do not want to go also, do you?" Simon Peter answered him: " Lord,whom shall we go away to? You have sayings of everlasting life. We have believed and come to know that you are the Holy One of God. "  Peter didn't quite get what he'd just learned. Did that mean Jesus wasn't the "Anointed One" ? Peter knew from whom he had learned the truth. Paul pointed the same out to Timothy and what he should do. (2Tim. 3:14, 15) What organization brought the Truth to us? Jehovah's Witnesses made plain the importance of the Bible in learning about God and His purposes. Foremost of these surrounds His glorious Name. Where else do we find a people for His Name? (Matt.6:9, 10; Acts 15:14) So, what we don't yet understand, we humbly wait for from Jehovah in His time. We also don't stir up controversy, arguing about words. (Psa. 62:1-8; 2 Tim. 2:14, 15) Clearly, Jesus appointed our Governing Body. (Matt. 24:45-47) Careful, personal study, along with heartfelt prayer, use of publications they've provided us will be helpful. Humbly, peacefully ask your congregation overseers also to help. May Jehovah's holy spirit bring peace to us all.

You say many things that you have no proof of. You seem to be just another puppet JW. 

The name Jehovah was in use for a very long time before the JW's started using it. A Catholic monk maybe, started using the name ?

As for comparing your GB with Jesus that is totally wrong. Jesus PROVED who he was, even resurrecting people in God's name. What have your GB done ? Nothing but make a name for themselves in the wrong way. 

You say, What organization brought the Truth to us? i say not the GB of the JW Org.  Because they tell so many lies, or mistakes as they would call it. And even in the Revelation book they had to say on page nine, "It is not claimed that the explanations in this publication are infallible." Wow, really had faith in God then didn't they ?  They have known all along that what they say is pure guesswork. 

You think Jesus appointed your GB ? Dream on. 

Martha, I kind of feel sorry for you. I'm not anti-JW Org completely, but I really cannot understand how anyone could swallow it all hook, line and sinker. Without any questions, not even about the Child Abuse, the Shunning, oh dear..... 

 

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5 minutes ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

Explain please.

I don't pretend to be of the Anointed. I am not a puppet Elder.  I am open about the fact that I don't understand many things in God's word. 

I'm not asking anyone to follow me. 

We ALL have the power to stumble another....no matter who we Are...

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