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At what moment "The Truth" has ceased to be "The Truth"?


Srecko Sostar

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9 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

Maybe it's not that Jehovah needs me or others to make complaint, BUT maybe Jehovah wants me and others to make complaint. Now that could be a sifting of those that want a clean Org to those that are prepared to remain in a disgusting Org. Jehovah often has heard the voices of His people and then acted on their behalf. 

So in your opinion what does Jehovah think of the way the GB and Elders deal with the important problems within the JW Org ? Because in my opinion Jehovah is withholding His Holy Spirit from the GB and the Org at this time.  

However i do like that bit where you say "i will end this conversation now because it would appear you are hell bent on exposing only the errors  .... " At least you recognise that there are errors, thank you. 

And you would say that Jesus 'had a big mouth' too then ? The way he spoke to the Pharisees many times. Truth hurts, so you can say i have a big mouth and I will understand your pain. 

Is it me that is making the preaching work harder, or the Pedophile elders and others that bring Jehovah's name into disrepute ? Come on, open your eyes, it's earthwide news now. From that viewpoint it doesn't need me to add to it, people out there already know. I don't get involved in the protests but i know there are protests in many countries about the problems within the JW Org. Has Jehovah planned all this ? Is it serving a purpose ? Is it a testing ? But why would anyone want to be part of such an Org that has known about these things for between 20 and 50 years, and not done anything about it apart from keep records ?  

"you have too much bitterness John" Indeed. Have you been a victim of Child Abuse ? If not then you have no idea. 

You have no idea who you are speaking with John..I and my family have been victims of much worse than child abuse ....it is you who have no idea...and it’s is because I have had a spear thru my heart...that I feel I can speak as I do...

there are bad men in positions of authority....wolves In Sheeps clothing..heartless and cruel men who are drunk on their own power over a cong..

having said that ..most are not like that....but why are you expecting g such a clean org now....that is impossible..we won’t be clean and acceptable until after the thousand years...at the moment we are in critical times hard to deal with...he encourages us to keep putting up with each other..because he knew how hard and difficult such things would be..

i am terribly sorry if you had been a victim of abuse...many of us are victims of the most severe abuse...abuse is not always of the sexual kind.......some have not survived.....

there is much wrong amongst his people...but the point is....you didn’t dedicate yourself to an org.....you should have dedicated yourself the the Almighty Creator......

none of us have the answers...you don’t..nor I...only Jehovah will fix this..and thus faith must come Into to play..

now I must take my leave from you....as you are not good for me....you open my wounds and the festering starts all over again...you promote bitterness and restment....and they are my fall down...Ive had to work very hard at understanding why Jehovah allows such horrendous things amongst his people.....the answers are there John...but I know you are past wanting that.......even tho I know it is possible  to heal....and see the big picture...Again I am sincely sorry and anguished at your pain from abuse...

 

 

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I understand your points and you have expressed them very well. I will address each point you raised separately, but first I just want to mention a few general things which have perhaps shaped the per

Hey Brother Billie..your way out on this....it is undeniable if you watched the ARC...we as a people were found to have faulty policies...that’s a fact..we were forced to ammend them. Kids suffer

I think this point showed excellent insight. I wondered if this is what you meant from the start. The very context shows that the type of leadership in this case is more like the local elders rather t

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5 hours ago, Thinking said:

there is much wrong amongst his people...but the point is....you didn’t dedicate yourself to an org.....you should have dedicated yourself the the Almighty Creator......

It just isn't that easy to do in the organization.  According to your leaders, it is necessary to dedicate oneself to the organization.  Otherwise, anyone could get baptized anywhere....like the Ethiopian who was baptized by Philip.  :)  

You bear the identifying “mark” of this “spirit-directed organization”.  Where does this leave God , who demands exclusive devotion?  Can you serve two Masters?  Matt 6:24 ; Deut 6:4-8; Rev 13:1,4,7,11, 15-17

“Have you dedicated your life to Jehovah and symbolized your dedication by water baptism? If so, that is wonderful! Recall that on your baptism day, before eyewitnesses, you were asked whether you had dedicated yourself to Jehovah and understood that “your dedication and baptism identify you as one of Jehovah’s Witnesses in association with God’s spirit-directed organization.” Your affirmative answers served as a public declaration of your unreserved dedication and showed that you were qualified for baptism as an ordained minister of Jehovah. You must have made Jehovah very happy!”  W17/4/ pp. 3-8

It is quite important that JWs keep in mind their promise to serve the organization. The phrase was already italicized; I marked it in bold.  

The title of this WT is very telling – “What you Vow, Pay.“  The introductory scripture of the article is Matt 5:33

“Again, you have heard that it was said to the people long ago, ‘Do not break your oath, but fulfill to the Lord the vows you have made.’ 

However, the GB did not provide a way for you to investigate what Jesus said next. 

34 But I tell you, do not swear an oath at all: either by heaven, for it is God’s throne; 35 or by the earth, for it is his footstool; or by Jerusalem, for it is the city of the Great King. 36 And do not swear by your head, for you cannot make even one hair white or black. 37 All you need to say is simply ‘Yes’ or ‘No’; anything beyond this comes from the evil one.

Doesn’t it appear that the organization is going beyond what Jesus words have indicated?  ANYTHING written as a command beyond his words, comes from the evil one.

Jesus’ command:  Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit20 and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.” Matt 28:19,20

Questions for baptism in the organization:

"The first question is:
On the basis of the sacrifice of Jesus Christ, have you repented of your sins and dedicated yourself to Jehovah to do his will? 

 Wt 18/3 pp 3-7 and WT 1985,6/1 p. 30

The second is:
Do you understand that your dedication and baptism identify you as one of Jehovah's Witnesses in association with God's spirit-directed organization? Having answered yes to these questions, candidates are in a right heart condition to undergo Christian baptism." 
WT 18/3 pp. 3-7

They have certainly gone beyond Jesus' words by making a point that you identify yourself with the organization.  Where does it say in the scriptures that the "right heart condition"  depends on a dedication to an earthly organization?  Why don’t they mention one’s dedication to Jesus Christ?  Why would one’s dedication to the organization be more important than serving God AND Christ.  They are one in Spirit.   Why didn't they follow Christ's command?   John 17:22    "anything beyond this comes from the evil one".  

"Here is my servant whom I have chosen, the one I love, in whom I delight; I will put my Spirit on him, and he will proclaim justice to the nations."  Matt 12:18

The Watchtower leaders take more delight in “Jehovah’s organization” than in God’s Son. (they preach a different Jesus 2 Cor 11:4) They take more delight in their self-made commands, than those of Jesus Christ. Are you to tolerate this?  As John brought out, Jesus didn't tolerate the lies of the Pharisees.  In fact, Jesus said,

“Jerusalem, Jerusalem, you who kill the prophets and stone those sent to you, how often I have longed to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were not willing. Look, your house is left to you desolate. I tell you, you will not see me again until you say, ‘Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord.’”    Luke 13:34,35

God doesn't fix lies and sin.  He warns us of the lies that may come against us by wolves in sheep's clothing, and to reject them, not tolerate them.  Jer 5:31; Matt 7:20

I really hope you can see this.

I JEHOVAH your God am a God exacting exclusive devotion.” Thus Jehovah God calls attention to the fact that he tolerates no rivals. Devotees of pagan religions may have a pantheon, but not those worshiping the unique God Jehovah.—Ex. 20:5, NW.   WT 58/1/1 p.30

Indeed, God has a rival.  It is the Watchtower organization.

Those who remain loyal to Jehovah’s organization take the view the apostles did when many of Jesus’ disciples stopped following him. Peter expressed their feelings by saying: “Lord, whom shall we go away to? You have sayings of everlasting life.” (John 6:68) The loyal “sheep” see that the way to life is with Jehovah’s faithful organization.  w62 12/15 pp. 758-763

Oh my.  Since when did the way to life divert from Christ, and point to“Jehovah’s organization”? Since a mere hundred years ago or so.   WT 62 12/15 pp. 758-763  

You sound so troubled, somewhat of a misfit JW.  Matt 11:28   There is more peace of mind on the other side of the wall of lies, than within such darkness.  Ezek 13:10-16

Simon Peter answered him, “Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life.  We have come to believe and to know that you are the Holy One of God.”  John 6:68,69

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Lol...well I probably am a misfit...I smiled at that..but I think I will still follow Joshua’s and Kalebs example....they would have hated to see what Aaron was doing with the Golden calf...I’m sure they would have stood apart mentally and spiritually  from that...but they didn’t leave the camp....they showed great faith that Moses would come back...and I’m sure many were very confused at that time....I too will wait for Jesus to come down from the mountain....and correct his people...

I remember a number of personal accounts of sisters and brothers being put into German  concentration camps...they would often get taunted by their captors because those in leadership at that time...COs and Elders and even those in authority of the branch office betrayed them.....and those little sisters of no account and probably viewed as insignificant in the cong ...said.....”they may do as they wish..but for me...I will remain loyal to my God”

So this little old misfit will do the same....:).....along with many many others who will stand firm and loyal to their God and Christ....You have underestimated so many of us...

.

 

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14 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:
  • @Space Merchant Quote  "Indeed we do, but one of us is able to see what is going on with today's society while the other does not allow himself to see what is going on in the world."  How strange you should think that way . 
  •  
  • .Just as Noah and his God-fearing family were preserved in the ark, survival of individuals today depends on their faith and their loyal association with the earthly part of Jehovah's universal organization." Watchtower 2006 May 15 p.22"                                                                                                                                                                                                 They must appreciate that identifying themselves with Jehovah's organization is essential to their salvation." Kingdom Ministry 1990 Nov p.1

I cannot be bothered to look for more but these two prove the point. 

They preach the 'Good News of God's Kingdom' to bring more people into the JW Org, because they believe it is only when a person is in that Org that people can be saved. 

Sorry SM I do realise it is a waste of my time trying to converse with you. Have a good day. 

Already several steps ahead of you, some bits of it came not just from the article but information from a non-disgruntled one also, in addition to how Restorationist Christians operate.

Enjoy

 

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59 minutes ago, Space Merchant said:

Already several steps ahead of you, some bits of it came not just from the article but information from a non-disgruntled one

Just in case anyone might misunderstand, I would like to make it clear that I am neither disgruntled,  or non-disgruntled, but am merely moderately well gruntled.

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9 hours ago, Anna said:

What interests me John, what things will need to be cleaned out? You must have specific things in mind.

Anna you are not blind to all the problems in the Org are you ? 

The way Child Abuse is dealt with, needs sorting out. NOT just on paper, anyone can write a list of what procedure should be, and then secretly do it a different way. You yourself have given me instances of this...... 

The GB stating that they themselves (only those 8 men) are the faithful and discreet slave. When Jesus said to his apostles that one should not put himself above another. Yet the GB do put themselves above the others of the Anointed. 

The false teachings, which they pretend are mistakes. The changing of meaning of scriptures, by the GB, to suit their own needs or wants.  Surely everyone knows about Page 9 in the Revelation book, where the GB / writers say " It is not claimed that the explanations in this publication are infallible." Huh ? On the one hand they say they are the Faithful slave of God, giving the right food at the right time. Then on the other hand they say 'But we could be wrong'  Why would they be wrong if they claim that the information comes from God ?  Of course they have been proved wrong, so I think it proves my point, they are not receiving the info' from God.

So, the GB need to be cleaned out, removed by God or Jesus Christ. As Jesus said, the wicked slave would be thrown out in the streets. 

Information from God's Kingdom Rules book :-

The Bible students in 1883 knew Christmas was wrong but they continued to celebrate Christmas until 1926, so deliberate sin was committed against God.

In 1895 Bro Russell commented that smoking was wrong, using scripture to back up what he said. But smoking was allowed to continue within the JW Org until 1973. Over 75 years of deliberate sin by those 'in charge' of the Bible Students/JW Org. 

And they seem to boast about it in that book as if making the changes was so good. Yes good, but much too late, as it should have been done as soon as they realised.

Can you not see the pattern ? The GB / Org 'bosses' know about things much sooner than they let the congregants know.  Not giving the right food at the proper time... Could it be that they were /are frightened of losing so many people from the Org if they do things properly. 

Carry that through to the Child Abuse / Pedophilea problem and once again it can clearly be seen that the GB and HQ's in every country knew about the serious problem of Child Abuse in many many congregations, but deliberately held back on taking positive action. Most active JW's never knew for years about it, and many still don't know. Once again deliberate sinning was / is taking place.

Shunning. This one is a mixed bag of course. But if it leads to people being left completely alone and depressed then i would think it was not God's or Jesus Christ's intentions. It should be made clear when a person is 'no longer one of Jehovah's Witnesses', whether they were disfellowshipped or 'resigned', and whether the person sinned against God or not. No personal details need to be given but the congregation should know if they are allowed to talk to the person or not. Many congregants unfortunately will not think for themselves, they need guidance or 'approval' from the elders.

Quite funny that the Org prints this magazine 'Return to Jehovah', but no one is supposed to even talk to ex JW's. 

When the bible reminds us 'not to forsake the gathering of ourselves together' I don't think it mean in such a 'military way'. 

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20 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

but i am talking about JW, Bible and issue

but i am talking about JW, Bible and issue

perhaps bigger font and color will help :=)

If that was the case then why in God's name would you quote what I said earlier? Hypocritical, don't you think?

On 11/5/2018 at 10:33 AM, Space Merchant said:

One cannot clean out a problem that is spread out throughout the world like a plague. You can prevent small instances - yes, but as to he problem itself - no. There are also better ways of doing things, better solutions, but people do not want to take advantage of such, one of these solutions is to educate our children on this matter, for if we can teach a child about Strangers, we can do the same for Child Abuse, for this is recommended by Child Abuse and Neglect Services to teach young ones about this, to see the signs.

You pulled one of these solutions is to educate our children on this matter, when I am speaking about the solutions provided by Child Abuse and Neglect Prevention services themselves.

So Srecko, where is it in my own response [above] I am equating Bible Principles? Show me.

Another thing I stated the following, directly to you: Well the thing is Srecko, I am not talking about JWs, I am talking to you, directly,

I said this because if you are unaware of such services actually exist, you show yourself not to be someone who is doing things the better way of putting into application, teaching our young ones about the problem so they themselves can teach others to lessen cases of abuse, be it sexual or violence and or other. Therefore, when I said you've been under a rock, it shows you do not take into account of the problem at all and solely dig your head into a single faith group. And I am glad Mr. Butler agrees with you because I told him the same thing months ago to which he agrees just for some reason this time it is different, and now it shows his view has changed. I am probably sure he agrees with your other views that is against anything Scriptural as well if it was obvious against what is true to what the Word says.

For a guy who wants to have a say in child abuse, you tend to ignore anything pertaining to child abuse prevention in terms of educating the youth, as you have done before and as you have done now, Srecko.

Now Srecko, you ask for Bible Principles, you shall have it. As with ANY Christian the safety of our children is of very high concern, to wherever our children are and whom they are in contact with and or communication with, be it young persons or grown people.

The Bible speaks of all forms of Brazen Conduct which correlates with sexual immorality/fornication otherwise known as or in the same category as pornography. For, the Bible itself condemns such loose and unclean conduct as Galatians 5:19-21 and Ephesians 4:19 states. Granted Mr. Butler assumes I "pretend" which cannot proven by his own word, twice, perhaps a third, I will show you as to how these verses point this out regarding the principles you seek and yet you yourself do not apply, after all you want to focus on the Bible as you claim

  • Galatians 5:19-21 - [19] Now the works of the flesh are evident: sexual immorality, impurity, sensuality, [20] idolatry, sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, fits of anger, rivalries, dissensions, divisions, [21] envy, drunkenness, orgies, and things like these. I warn you, as I warned you before, that those who do such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.
  • Ephesians 4:19 - They have become callous and have given themselves up to sensuality, greedy to practice every kind of impurity.

Granted that the primary responsibility for protecting a child and or children against abuse belongs to parents and or guardians, it is an obligation for us as both a guardian and or parent to educate ourselves on this matter first before educating such things to a child or children.

Those who have or care for children need to understand that, there are things we can do regarding child abuse and things we cannot do, although we cannot stop it 100% as Mr. Butler claims in regarding a cleansing of a faith community which is neigh impossible. If we are to be honest, truly honest with ourselves, a simple, reasonable man would be wise enough to understand that if  we can't even stop wars, famine, sickness and death 100% by our OWN hands, how can one think, even assumes that man who cannot govern or keep themselves in check can somehow cease anything in the category of abuse, which is also including of child abuse?  Last I check the bible makes it clear only God's Kingdom can clear all that, cleanse the badness of this world as with men who governs their own into Hades - by their hands (Daniel 2:44-45).

The truth of the matter is, due to the price of our imperfections, such a thing exist and will only be done away with by God himself, not you, not me, not Butler, not even the Jehovah's Witnesses, not anyone, expect God and what his Purpose and Will (And his Order [whereas biblical fact was proven true in contrast to the errors professed by both you and Witness], of which you were in denial of before) entails in regards to the removal of ALL forms of wickedness, in conjunction with ALL things that brings us pain and sadness, one of the many things, that being Child Abuse. I believe in God strongly and what He will do, but if you yourself and perhaps Mr.Butler do not believe then there is a problem. Both of you read the Bible as you made it clear, this should come as obvious for you and as can be seen one cannot simply cleanse something totally because if it takes place in the world and trhives of of imperfection and sin and death,  it will come back again and again and again like a recurring super villain from a Saturday morning cartoon that just doesn't seem to quit i.e. you can remove a pedophile abusing teacher from a school, but eventually there will be another and another, in the US, most of them being commonly Caucasian women, and the cycle repeats itself over and over again. You have to be living in a dreamworld if something can be eradicated totally from an institution and or anywhere in the world.

The Bible even tells us that 

  • Proverbs 25:28 - A man without self-control is like a city broken into and left without walls.

But it does not hinder our ability to do something - better solutions in terms of minimizing instance of abuse and having our young ones being aware of the signs of abuse and those who have been abused to increases positive outcomes in not just helping survivors, but preventing another victim, moreover, as some claim, another statistic - of which no one wants to be in any regard in such things.

We have to treat potential and or suspected abusers who molest children in the same category as strangers, or those who commit sexual assault and or harassment, for these individuals come in many forms, a teacher, a neighbor, a priest, a steward, a club organizer, a business associate,a politician, and the list goes on and they are in all institutions, even among Jehovah's Witnesses and the like all institutions those who seek to commit harm to a person and or child, according to Child Abuse and Neglect Services, they seek friendship with the child and or if the child is of the household, they focus on said child, in turn a victim and or victims, other times it can be a person from in or out of town who is seeking to kidnap and rape a child, as well as possibly force them into child prostitution rings for slavery and abuse, which was the case with a real life historical example known as The Boys Town, which started out as a peaceful organization until the passing of the founder, and later on how child abusers infiltrated the organization (which is no different from Luciferians infiltration into Christendom), granted everyone knows it was beyond their power to stop this spreading of abusers and such information came to light of how it began. Another big help, an effective solution, is we have to talk to our children about what is sex, for this is another solution and a good one because for most child abusers who prey on children often find themselves victims who have no idea what sex is, thus handing them over to the abuser, you make it an easy win for them and a loss for the victim, therefore, another thing to be taught to our children increases the chance of awareness, for we have had many, many examples in our day whereas some children are able, willing and capable of evading the advances of an abuser, even some capable of seeking multiple adults who can help them (as the motto goes if one adult is of little to no help, seek ANOTHER) be it someone they know or a stranger, or some lone wolf who is seeking to kidnap a child to perform such acts, moreover, such ones who are educated in this sense can even evade and avoid other children and or teenagers who they themselves CAN be the child abuser in this case, hence the child on child abuse crimes, which can also be prevented. Therefore the Bible is correct when it comes to wisdom, in this sense, as The Bible says in Proverbs 2:10-12, it reads:

[10] for wisdom will come into your heart, and knowledge will be pleasant to your soul; [11] discretion will watch over you, understanding will guard you, [12] delivering you from the way of evil, from men of perverted speech,

Which brings forth question to which both you and Mr. Butler can answer - are you for or against teaching, educating children in this sense if the concern for Child Abuse is of high concern, not just among the Jehovah's Witnesses, but all children everywhere in and or out of all institutions? If anyone who adheres to Child Sex Abuse and Neglect Services, just as one adheres to the command of the Christ, the answer should be an obvious one. As I had told the both of you, someone who had spoken to young children, teens alike, even adults who are unaware of such education, there are better solutions at combating the problem, and you are looking at one. My advise to the both of you, actually pay attention to what those who make the PSA and other material in terms of training is actually saying. If the majority can, so can you, for if you can follow what the Bible says, when it comes to being morally upright and the like, you can apply in what it says about teaching wisdom, and in this case, teaching wisdom to our children.

That being said, the subject of sex is awkward to discuss with children, just as it is when the child reaches a grade in elementary whereas family living is taught regarding the subject and they come to you with concerns and questions on the other side of the spectrum, a child may find the subject even more awkward, and he is not likely to bring it up with you, perhaps later on. Now to be honest to myself, I can tell you both my mother and father taught found it was the right time to talk to be about the matter before I was 12, which is the case with a majority of children in the US, for some, even younger, others, who find themselves dealing with pornography be it knowing about what sex is or not, are often educated far later on when they want to come clean about their problem and or found out to be viewing of such material. And when this is discussed with out children, we ourselves cannot be shy about what words we use and how we say it, we have to be upfront and honest about every word and every answer to a question that is posed, for we should not be ashamed of anything said.

Now, These people are similar to false teachers of which the Bible deems a wolf in sheep's clothing as read in Matthew 7:15, 24:11 2 Peter 2:1, and 1 John 4:1 for such ones who are practically sociopolitical (a sociopath), they can and will do whatever it their ill goal entices them to do so when it comes to seeking younger ones who cannot defend themselves and or unaware of what will happen. Moreover, pedophilia in of itself is a disorder and those who have it can and will act out by means of said disorder and seek opportunity, on the other side of the spectrum, there are those, even in politics that seek to make this a sexual orientation, hence why if you do not seek better solutions, people like this will win and be far worse for all institutions. In many, many, if not, the majority of cases of sexual abuse of children, the abuser, who is the perpetrator is someone the child already knows and trusts - 100% fact and true and this information is the same as what these services makes us, and everyone else aware of.

That being said, I encourage you both to actually open your eyes for once because as can be seen you keep them shut, and unlike the both of you, I am far more serious about the issue and I have the mental capacity to understand and see this "earthwide" problem as Mr.Butler profess is indeed a great one, but to focus solely on a group when the problem is everywhere also is sheer ignorance, just as ignorant as the one-sided claims in the US in this regard, especially when it comes to child abuse and race, which can be on the line of true an not true.

That being said, if a Father, any Father in this case, can teach his son to paint, to build something, to fight, to drive and or other, it does not shy away from a Father teaching his son about child abuse, about the signs of an abuser and the sign of someone who is being or has been abused, he teaches him about sex and any body member associated in this regard, he teaches his son, his child about strangers so nothing can befall of his own son - vice versa for daughters and the mothers who teach their children. In this day and age, a child can be swayed by an abuser from a game such as Minecraft (it extends to even social media, something of which I will post very very soon putting forth the facts), but any educated parent, especially one who has played games themselves, teach their children about being safe online, as is in the schools and the churches. Therefore, we should spare time to TEACH our children so they can equip themselves with wisdom in this regard, even Biblically , since you want an answer, so they can be aware of any brazen conduct that can potentially make them a would be victim and or a statistic of the worse kind.

The next problem you face is that the very people you tend to seek for help regarding child abuse are the same ones who tend to free abusers on the whim, to Butler, the grooming Gangs in the UK s with human sex trafficking coupled with the Black Market, to anyone in the US, the fallen politicians, who got out scott-free when he should be serving his sentence.

For if you Butler cannot recognize how pedophiles, some of them far worse than others, how they take up authority in any institution of their living, as of now even Restaurants, then clearly you both have a lot to learn, as I told Mr. Butler time an time again, and I will say it, so my words stick this time, there are better solutions in regards to the matter of child abuse, clearly if you are not getting thing your way, you are going about things the wrong way and make the incorrect chose of focusing on a single group and or party when you are surrounded by others who have the same issue. Yes, JW children are of high concern granted that anyone can be Evangelized and or convert to become one of Jehovah's Witnesses, for as the saying goes for all in Christendom, we do not know who comes to the church or their intent be it good or bad, however, ALL children should be of a concern and we should not have to single out a faith, or someone of a race in order to go about the issue, in doing so, as my source pointed out, Solider of God, we only create a bigger problem when we give power to those who commit the acts, for it is reasoning like this that allow people like Nathan Larson to have people on his side, it is reasoning like this that support such behavior and thinking it is okay, it is reasoning like this why those for pornography are allowed to have a portrayal of children and cratering to their demographic, it is reasoning like this not educating our children as well as older folk that will lead to issues like this, having the mentally of not having to worry about something that is happening to others and a list of other things.

I suggest you take read of this, the both of you: 

Because it would seem the one cannot open his eyes properly and the other who perhaps had an even bigger rock on top of him that is perhaps bigger than the ones used for tombs in ancient times.

You have to focus on the problem, not masses of persons who have no connection to the problem, the same ones who can be effected too. And like you I said earlier

 one of these solutions is to educate our children on this matter

I made this one bigger for you so that YOU can understand what I have been saying here for months now.

And as far as Evo's consider, the one who stopped the protest (ironically joined by a gay man and artist who did speak up), the one who is friends with John Cedars stated the exact same thing only to be attacked by the very people you support clearly and obviously, Srecko. You cannot play on two tables, Srecko, you can only play on one and quite frankly you do even know which table you should be sitting at, but this is not of your concern because you have proven yourself to believe in the undeath teaching, which is not a Christian practice. And clearly if you believe God is okay with the sexual changes done by a man and or woman to their own body, be it due to what they see themselves mentally and physical, how are you in a position to even teach when you believe this? I suggest you ponder on that very notion you profess, I will not do you the favor or linking your own words in an attempt to remove it as you had done last time regarding another discussion that has, gone awry, on your part.

Then again any Biblical Fact and or actual source of something goes in one of your ears and out the other and attempting to keep hidden my full response by taking a snippet to tag anything JW related to it was a fail on your part, perhaps this time you read, observe and understand what I convey or go back to the rock that is your dwelling place.

The truth has been spoken, do with it as you will to your own liking and take into account these solutions provided by those who deal with Child Abuse and the examples they give, as is with Bible Principles of which you, and I will say, that you asked for.

 

The question you see but try to ignore still stands

What is the most important sign that one has to look out for regarding a potential abuser [school setting - church setting - business setting - public space]? 

The answer itself can be found in the response, Srecko - should you prove yourself to actually have a concern rather than be part of the problem.

 

That being said you take these solutions and go about the problems that right and positive way, but the other stuff, this warpath-sque based mind attitude isn't the way to do it, and even the non-religious can see that too.

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29 minutes ago, Thinking said:

Probably the same reason David got so much wrong and Peter, Samson,Moses..oh and Jonah 

This is because people do not take into account the actions of those in the Bible, mainly those mentioned in the Old Testament, especially Moses, of whom there is a passage that prompts people to deny him and say they do not follow Moses, for they say this because they do not taken into context his actions, which was similar to that of King Saul.

For those who claim to read the Bible ignore these facts that is as clear as day, placed before them like the sun in the sky, for it is that obvious.

That being said, no Restorationist Christian in history, or ANY non-trinitarian, claim to be inspired, those who nullify by being spirit direct and or the holy spirit into the mix clearly have no idea of what the notion actually is - inspired and or not inspired prophets and or teachers.

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