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JW.org Says Apostates are "Mentally Diseased"

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Should we be concerned that Brothers and Sisters increasing getting heavier and heavier every year is a lack of self control?

They may be depressed, have anxiety, or other emotional disturbances that may play a roll in their increasing obesity.

There is every reason to believe that it is spoons that make us fat..

 

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Thanks @Matthew9969 for using WT magazines. This articles shows how GB want to present us, how mental illness was not started with "apostates" in recent time.

Wording "mental illness" is connect with WT Society context about result, outcome that is seen in JW members who think how they are sort of people who belongs to people known as 144000 class. 

They numbered several reasons why some JW member thinks about self as King and Priest aka part of 144000. They say:

in 1996

-after a while they acknowledged that this was an error

-an emotional response

-perhaps physical or mental strain

in 2011

-past religious beliefs

-mental or emotional imbalance 

in 2016

-mistakenly think that they are anointed

-mental or emotional problems 

It is obvious how WT Society is organization who looks on one part of members as people who have not mental and emotional balance. Perhaps GB say so, because of Jesus words how he is send to ill, sick people, and that also including physical, mental and emotional defects.

But we see how GB put this explanation on exactly one specific class or group of individuals inside organization - "anointed". On all anointed individuals who are outside of GB... or Helpers. Well, here we see how few anointed  individuals who are in position to call themselves as FDS who sharing spiritual food, decided to sending message through publications how only them are mentallyphysically and emotionally in perfect health. All other are in question.  

Well, where insane people living? Inside or outside sanatorium?  

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1 hour ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Thanks @Matthew9969 for using WT magazines. This articles shows how GB want to present us, how mental illness was not started with "apostates" in recent time.

Wording "mental illness" is connect with WT Society context about result, outcome that is seen in JW members who think how they are sort of people who belongs to people known as 144000 class. 

They numbered several reasons why some JW member thinks about self as King and Priest aka part of 144000. They say:

in 1996

-after a while they acknowledged that this was an error

-an emotional response

-perhaps physical or mental strain

in 2011

-past religious beliefs

-mental or emotional imbalance 

in 2016

-mistakenly think that they are anointed

-mental or emotional problems 

It is obvious how WT Society is organization who looks on one part of members as people who have not mental and emotional balance. Perhaps GB say so, because of Jesus words how he is send to ill, sick people, and that also including physical, mental and emotional defects.

But we see how GB put this explanation on exactly one specific class or group of individuals inside organization - "anointed". On all anointed individuals who are outside of GB... or Helpers. Well, here we see how few anointed  individuals who are in position to call themselves as FDS who sharing spiritual food, decided to sending message through publications how only them are mentallyphysically and emotionally in perfect health. All other are in question.  

Well, where insane people living? Inside or outside sanatorium?  

Does this way of thinking actually come from the 'world' ?  It seems to be a away of taking away the credibility of people.

I'm sure it's the type of thing you see in films, when someone wants to make another person feel insecure, or wants to make a person doubt themselves. 

If in fact the Governing Body are NOT inspired, then how would they actually know if someone else was ?  And i do think their attitude is passed down to the elders. 

A bit off topic but I had a funny thought.

Sometimes the Organisation is compared to Noah's Ark. However there were only EIGHT humans in that Ark and the rest were dumb animals that were controlled by those EIGHT humans.

Um how many members of the Governing Body are there ? Oh yes EIGHT.  And who in control of the Org ? Those EIGHT humans. Does make a person wonder exactly what the Governing Body thinks of all the rest in their Ark. 

 

 

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5 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

 

 

There is every reason to believe that it is spoons that make us fat..

 

I'm using a spork from now on.  This gives me half a chance to stay sane and fit.

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1 hour ago, Srecko Sostar said:

JW members who think how they are sort of people who belongs to people known as 144000

Hi, there are only a few JWs who believe so - unlike millions - almost 1 Billion Christian's on earth in various denominations whom ALL think they are going to heaven to be with jesus to rule over whom? 

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On 11/10/2019 at 2:36 AM, Srecko Sostar said:

Srecko: Tom said previously how every person who are not in line with Jesus teachings (JW or not JW) is mentally ill.

I continue to disagree with your word usage. I’m not referring to my comments but how you are handling your own.

The problem, you want to assess the GB are false teachers. That’s a matter of opinion. They conduct their teachings exactly as prescribed by scripture. Therefore, Jesus is the GB's teacher. I seriously doubt Jesus was a false teacher being a perfect man. I can see how some Jews thought he was, but that amounted to a historically bad opinion.

Another area is the phrase “mentally ill” versus “mentally diseased”. One projects and aligns with what scripture states as false teachers. Those of us that are, willing to subvert scripture by our own understanding, while the other phrase is indicating a state of mind. I believe that difference has already been answered by others.

The Watchtower is not suggesting people are crazy for being false teachers. If that is the impression you are getting, it is a false one.

Under the opinion given by you, there are 9.2 billion people on earth right now that can be considered, false teachers except you. I would dispute that.

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5 hours ago, 4Jah2me said:

there were only EIGHT humans in that Ark and the rest were dumb animals that were controlled by those EIGHT humans. Um how many members of the Governing Body are there ? Oh yes EIGHT.  And who in control of the Org ? Those EIGHT humans. 

You call yourself astute?

If you would use the head God gave you and focus, you would note that one GB member is eating a lot to be big as an elephant, one is stretching his neck like a giraffe, another growing stripes like a zebra, yet another shrieks like a macaw, and so forth. 

Look, everyone knows this. Why do you come to the table so ill-equipped in knowledge?

”My, what wolflike teeth you have, grandma”

”All the better to control you with, my dear.”

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On 11/10/2019 at 7:21 AM, Tom Henry said:

same way there are witnesses that condemn the way the Watchtower is running

Agreed. It is easy to critisize, hard to build up. Many condemned Moses for the way he was doing things. Later God took some of his Spirit from  Moses and gave to others to help him.  So Moses had a lot of Spirit and approval from Jehovah. But,  it was in this time there was rebellions and murmurings against him and the people had expectations for someone better, more to their liking. 

If the GB inspired fear and things were less transparent you would be more in awe of them but because they project themselves unhypocritically (what you see is what you get) - people endow themselves with the right to criticize just about everything about them, going as far as saying that they are not the nation jehovah is using to spearhead the preaching work.   Show me another people who has the infrastructure to fulfill jehovah's will regarding preaching in most countries and I may believe your pitiful criticisms.  These are ordinary men running an operation for their food and keep.  They feel priviledged by jehovah to do this assignment. 

I have worked in corporations where CEOs get bonuses that are in the millions.  They make terrible mistakes and mess up the corporation ......and just before it collapses get even a higher CEO job at another BIGger corporation with more pay. Arrogant and stupid and very capable to make the same mistake over and over.  One of them had a driver and a big limo with so much airs very few people felt worthy to speak to him. The old corporation he worked for gets a new name, new ownership and a new CEO who brings in different measures to curb spending, diversify business etc.  YET people expect the GB to get it right the first time such as when the TV Broadcasts started etc. 

Israel, as a nation was soooooo imperfect and jehovah used them. What I see here on this forum with certain individuals is a tremendous arrogance - their right to critisize.  Well, Satan gave himself the right to critisize the way jehovah chose to use his sovreignty. JAH was so gentle, that arrogant Satan used the gap to downsize Jah himself!.  

The governing body knows that each individual has the right to personal opinion. They tolerate a lot of personal criticism.  People expect them to be an example in every respect - something which even Jesus could not do due to the wickedness of the religious leader's hearts. Jesus shone his light but it was not good enough for the religious leaders.  (We have some people here who feel they are "leaders" because they forget from which organization they learnt the truth of the kingdom in the first place). They were priviledged to see the inside workings  where imperfect GB are and now feel they saw it ALL so they know it ALL.  Familiarity does breed contempt - Jesus's own brothers did not accept him before his death.

It is when our personal opinion is no longer in line with scriptures that we ourselves go beyond that which is written. Who will stop the arrogance - you yourself must do this. If your self-control is not sufficient you can become like Cain who had no self-control and caused the death of his own kin. Spiritual death and stumbling blocks are more serious.  People are only shunned in the congregation when they become rebellious in their sin.

I have a lot of personal opinions - much too opinionated  - and I know it. I have never been spoken to about it and I am aware that as a woman I cannot stand out too much.  I am happy about it because my main focus is to preach.  If I am ever spoken to, I will definitely tone my opinions down.  I am fun.  The young women love to work with me because we always have fun. I am upbuilding, I am a confidante, I  bring my share and I have ample room to move in Jehovahs organization....... I even feel important and blessed.  But not in the way others want to feel important. 

If one meditates about Jehovahs word and read a lot  - you are bound to come up with thoughts that are not found in the Insight Book.... or have not found it yet.  I have a good understanding of the truth and will never attend "clubs" for witnesses.  This is the only forum I share my thoughts.  I do not pretend to be a scholar because to me it is too "churchy-institutionalized". 

 I thank jehovah every day for his blessings and the insight I get from Him because I do not think that scholars have ever got it right.  The scholars in Jesus's day, in all the theological institutions in our day, do not even have a clue what the "sacret secret" is. Their guest is knowledge, not love. Their guest is ego, not love, their guest is to dominate other peoples minds with their own ideas - not love.  Yes, there were those among us who are like "rocks" in our love-feasts- and jehovah is busy with a cleansing work - cleaning out those who cause stumbling.  Did he not say he will start with his own people?

 

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2 hours ago, Arauna said:

The governing body knows that each individual has the right to personal opinion. They tolerate a lot of personal criticism.  People expect them to be an example in every respect - something which even Jesus could not do due to the wickedness of the religious leader's hearts. Jesus shone his light but it was not good enough for the religious leaders.  (We have some people here who feel they are "leaders" because they forget from which organization they learnt the truth of the kingdom in the first place). They were priviledged to see the inside workings  where imperfect GB are and now feel they saw it ALL so they know it ALL.  Familiarity does breed contempt - Jesus's own brothers did not accept him before his death.

It appears you have drawn your own conclusion with my comment. It appears everyone here is willing to set a dangerous precedence when they don’t get the full context of someone else comments. Be that as it may, you had plenty of bottled up emotion. It’s good to release it. How about doing that with everyone you think has an unsubstantiated grievance, and not limit it to just one or two.

The inference you promote is fundamental human rights. Do you believe, God’s word was written to expand on human rights?

What about the spiritual right that Jesus gave his life for? What about the right of our creator? I doubt God would condemn and punish the organization as he did with the Israelite's every time they criticized his messenger and had someone within act upon their own greed, yet the whole nation was punished for it, God wouldn't use the same criteria in modern times. Joshua 7:1-2, Ezekiel 35:5, Isaiah 24:1-2

I wouldn’t expect a witness to argue fundamental human rights, but the rights of our heavenly father. I will agree, no one should be silenced especially when someone criticizes a critic. That also sets a dangerous precedence when someone gives more power to those that oppose and reject an organization just for following in the footsteps of Christ and obeying God’s commands.

Too much emphasis is placed on 8 men rather than the worldwide brotherhood that is affected by such criticism in real time.

1 Peter 2:14-16

14or to governors as those sent by him to punish those who do wrong and to praise those who do right. 15For it is God’s will that by doing good you should silence the ignorance of foolish men. 16Live in freedom, but do not use your freedom as a cover-up for evil; live as servants of God.

Psalm 31:18

18May lying lips be silenced, which speak with arrogance against the righteous, full of pride and contempt.

This should give you pause to reflect and set aside what your conclusion was and give it a more realistic view, the comment was not intended or directed to you personally. Especially when it comes to how God communicates and how things are done. I don’t believe we have a full account on the daily lives of all the prophets, Jesus and the apostles. The accounts we do have, are of historical spiritual value. That means we don’t know everything that went on back then, and we are not deprived on anything now. Should people expect to know more just because it’s the Org by opposers?

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11 hours ago, Arauna said:

Hi, there are only a few JWs who believe so - unlike millions - almost 1 Billion Christian's on earth in various denominations whom ALL think they are going to heaven to be with jesus to rule over whom? 

Hi. No problems with numbers :))) 

When you mentioned numbers, some would say how 144000 can be a symbolic number too, not literal. Because Lamb is also symbolic expression, and not literal creature. :))

11 hours ago, Arauna said:

Billion Christian's on earth in various denominations whom ALL think they are going to heaven to be with jesus to rule over whom?

I am not sure do they want to "Rule"...... or just to be in Paradise with him. :))

8 hours ago, Tom Henry said:

I continue to disagree with your word usage.

No problem Tom. That will not make me "mentally ill" :)).

8 hours ago, Tom Henry said:

Another area is the phrase “mentally ill” versus “mentally diseased”.

Thesaurus. com

diseased

[ dih-zeezd ]SEE DEFINITION OF diseased
3 hours ago, Arauna said:

The governing body knows that each individual has the right to personal opinion. They tolerate a lot of personal criticism.

Well, than it seems, how elders going above given power and position, because they, elders in congregations suppressing not only criticism but also critical thinking :)) 

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      https://www.metro.se/artikel/efter-metros-avslöjande-om-jehovas-vittnen-polisen-inleder-förundersökning-om-hets-mot-folkgrupp
    • By Jack Ryan
      bh chap. 11 pp. 110-112 pars. 12-15 - Imagine that a teacher is telling his students how to solve a difficult problem. A clever....student claims that the teacher’s way of solving the problem is wrong. What should the teacher do?....suppose that the teacher allows the rebel to show the class how he would solve the problem...he knows that allowing them the opportunity to try to prove their point will benefit the whole class. When the rebels fail, all honest students will see that the teacher is the only one qualified to lead the class....consider two things that the teacher in our illustration would not do............he would not stop the rebel student from presenting his case.
    • By Jack Ryan
      POLK COUNTY, Fla. (WFLA) – A Polk County mother is outraged after she claims a school bus driver used her son to spread hate. Natalie Encarnacion told News Channel 8 that the bus driver, now identified as Violeta Jacobo, told her seven-year-old son he would go to hell for supporting his mom’s same-sex relationship. One afternoon, in the beginning of February, her son had missed his bus from Alta Vista Elementary School, so a different bus driver took him home. “He mentioned [to the bus driver] he was hoping his two mom’s wouldn’t be upset that he was home so late,” Encarnacion said. “She said ‘whoa God doesn’t like that,’ then she went on and on telling him how he wouldn’t make it into heaven and there is a such thing as hell.” She claims the bus driver even sent him home with a Jehovah’s Witnesses card, and hate in his heart. “Later that night, he explained why we should not be together anymore,” Encarnacion said. “He is absolutely questioning this now, something we have so smoothly transitioned into and never had any issues with.” Encarnacion said she contacted the school board and never heard back. She also contacted DCF. She told News Channel 8 the agency looked into the incident, but closed the case when they did not find any neglect. According to Polk County School Board Spokesperson Jason Geary, they are still reviewing the matter. However, they have spoken to the bus driver and instructed her that she must follow the code of ethical conduct. According to Geary, Violeta Jacobo is an active bus driver, employed since August 31, 2012. There is no past disciplinary action in her personnel file. “It’s shocking and it’s infuriating to know that nobody is doing anything about it. Just the thought that she could do this to other kids.” Encarnacion said she hopes something is done so she can’t do this to another family. “I am extremely devastated. My home life and everything is being affected by this. My son is rebelling against our relationship and it’s just putting everything into question. It’s really upsetting and I hope nobody ever has to go through this,” she said. “This has put hate in his heart.”

      http://wfla.com/2017/03/07/polk-woman-claims-school-bus-driver-told-7-year-old-son-he-would-go-to-hell-for-moms-same-sex-relationship/
    • By Michelle
      How ridiculous. Anyone asking such questions is not reading the material nor either listening to or attending meetings. Uniforms? Smacks of apostate individuals spreading falsehoods. 
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    • The point was that Jehovah is organized, the evidence is all around us. This leads us to believe that His visible favored people would be organized in doing His will. Moving forward we can consider WHO HE is about to sanction based on Matthew 13:36-43, John 4:23,24,Revelation 18:4 and a few more.......
    • Just as the WT knows how to work the global market by investing their money in hedge funds, they know how to manipulate a developing mind with persuasion techniques.  I perceive the downplay of higher education as a safeguard from losing members.  While the organization warns these young ones of Satan’s worldly traps when pursuing higher education, in reality it appears to me that it’s all about keeping JWs captive to the organization’s “empty philosophy”.  Col 2:8  Knowing how the young mind develops sheds light on the org's use of persistent warnings not to pursue higher education.  “Developmental Tasks and Attributes of Late Adolescence/Young Adulthood (Ages 18-24 years) http://www.amchp.org/programsandtopics/AdolescentHealth/projects/Documents/SAHRC AYADevelopment LateAdolescentYoungAdulthood.pdf This is a time of life when very little is normative. It is a period of frequent change and exploration that covers many aspects of their life: home, family, work, school, resources, and role. Develop and apply abstract thinking skills Adolescents experience significant changes in their capacity to think. In changing from concrete to abstract thought they are increasingly able to understand and grapple with abstract ideas, think about possibilities, think ahead, think about thinking, and “put themselves in another person’s shoes.” In general, this changes their ability to think about themselves, others and the world around them. This is a gradual process that spans adolescence and young adulthood. For example, early in the process youth are limited in their ability to hold more than one point of view – understanding something from one perspective but not another. ·        Capacity for abstract thought becomes established; can think abstractly and hypothetically; can discern the underlying principles and apply them to new situations; and can think about the future, considering many possibilities and logical outcomes of possible events. ·       Able to hold and manipulate clusters of abstract ideas and create systems for organizing abstract thoughts. ·       Greater ability to consider different points of view at the same time can result in increased empathy and concern for others, and new interest in societal issues for many. It also allows youth to better value the diversity of people (and their perspectives) and appreciate that there may be many right answers to a problem. Adopt A Personal Value System Adolescents develop a more complex understanding of moral behavior and underlying principles of justice. They question and assess beliefs from childhood and restructure these beliefs into a personal ideology (e.g. more personally meaningful values, religious views, and belief systems to guide decisions and behavior). ·        Decisions and values are less influenced by peers. ·       Able to see multiple viewpoints, value the diversity of people and perspectives and appreciate that there can be many right answers to a problem. ·        Identify values and viewpoints that work for oneself while respecting viewpoints/values of others I would imagine there is a high risk of young JWs entering a college or university after high school, with the same age group, and going through the same mental development stages ...leaving the Watchtower altogether.  
    • John 17:14-16 The comments in the study Bible on John 17:15 say: "Jehovah...could even separate his people physically from the rest of the world and place them in a a safe and peaceful environment. However, regarding his disciples, Jesus prayed to his heavenly Father: "I request you, not to take them out of the world, but to watch over them because of the wicked one." Jehovah has chosen not to take us "out of the world." Rather, it is his will that we live among the general population of this world in order to proclaim his message of hope and comfort to others. (Rom. 10:13-15) But, as Jesus implied in his prayer, by living in this world, we are exposed to "the wicked one." Disobedient mankind and wicked spirit forces cause much pain and anguish, and Christians are not immune to distress." 1 Peter 5:9 So while we recognize we have to live in a world under Satan's control, it doesn't mean we should go out of our way to expose ourselves to potentially dangerous influences and bad association. There are of course necessary things we must do to survive and provide for our families - such as employment, which as you correctly pointed out, can mean rubbing shoulders with worldly people and attitudes whatever level of education we choose. But even on that, we are selective so as to minimize our exposure to potentially harmful influences. It may include being selective as to what type of work we are willing to accept, or whom we work with/for. Many caring parents know they can't completely eliminate bad influences at school for instance (since kids have to have some type of schooling and it is beneficial), but they may choose to be selective as to whom they allow their kids to spend their extra time with. So living in the world, we recognize there are certain things we must do whether we like it or not. But that doesn't mean we shouldn't exercise caution and be selective as to what we choose to involve ourselves in. I could rationalize that I need a job to support myself and my family - a legitimate and necessary need,  but would I choose to work for the mafia to do so? No, I would be selective and cautious.  I agree with you. I often have the same problem on both phone and tablet. Fortunately I've recently discovered that we can edit and make corrections. I wish I had known that earlier before "auto-correct" ran roughshod over my posts.  As for my level of education, I provide as little information as possible to identify me. As a "whistleblower" on some things, there would be an opportunity for "blowback" from men in authority who have something to hide. I don't even post what country I'm from. So when I have written that at times there are men in authority who act as wickedly as people in the world and hide behind their authority, I know exactly what I'm talking about. That's why I don't buy into the "Jesus is in full control of everything..." stuff, because I know some of the stuff that goes on is about as unChristlike as you can get. He doesn't cause/control it just because he allows it for a time. I also question some of the decisions men (not Jesus) have made when I am in possession of all the facts - especially when removal or disfellowshipping has as it's objective to silence whistleblowers who expose their corruption. I have never been DF'd, but I know if they thought I was spilling the beens on them, that's exactly what would happen. So I don't mention any names either that would tip them off. Just letting people know that you can still maintain your faith and relationship with God despite the evil that (some) men do - and get away with for now.  Sorry if this rant is off topic.
    • Perhaps it can be as you said. And perhaps this can be true with many other similar "stories".   What I see as important in this "story", is fine moral message and inspirational, motivating injection that in this materialistic and superficial everyday life offers a spiritual upgrade.... said with different order of words. 
    • Some do. Like the Rainbow Mountains, and some of the Caucasus (Svaneti) look more like rocky Alps. I'd love to see those mountains, and I planned to visit Georgia within two or three years if possible. I've never been to Georgia, the closest so far has been to northern Turkey (Ankara, Zonguldak, Samsun). If Jehovah did not intervene, and nature was left to itself, moving the tectonic plates would have caused thousands of violent aftershocks and tsunamis for quite some time after the floodwaters settled. Even on water, during the Flood, the Ark would have to be given divine protection. Settling on a high mountain might protect from tsunamis but not the quakes. I'd like to look up some info on these. Where should I start?
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