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Leah Remini Tackles Jehovah's Witnesses for 'Scientology and the Aftermath'

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We finally got a chance to catch up with Lloyd Evans to ask him about his appearance on Leah Remini’s special Aftermath episode about Jehovah’s Witnesses.

Lloyd was understandably grateful for the opportunity to appear with several other ex-JW activists in a 2-hour show in an Emmy-winning series. But we had to ask, how significant was this program in the history of the subject?

Lloyd: I think many ex-JWs are still trying to process this, but I think the Aftermath Special is the most significant piece of TV journalism ever done on Jehovah’s Witnesses. We’re just not used to this level of exposure in the movement. Every now and then there will be a news program (like NBC Dateline and BBC Panorama in 2002) but this is the biggest and most comprehensive exposure there has been so far. And thanks to A&E’s reach it’s being shown in multiple countries. I’ve even seen a version of our show dubbed into Italian, which is surreal! Leah and Mike have really done us a huge favor. I’m still getting messages about the impact it’s having.

The Bunker: What else would you have liked to see in the show? Some people were telling us it only scratched the surface, but it sure seemed pretty packed.

Lloyd: We hit all the main issues. Child abuse, shunning, blood transfusions, domestic violence, treatment of women, doomsday fear-mongering. But there is so much more to go into in each of those subjects and the impact the policies are having. There’s enough material, not just victim’s stories but actual policy documentation, court cases and Watchtower propaganda video footage, to sustain an episode on each of those subjects.

The Bunker: We went to the JW Broadcasting website and watched some video — wow, JW is grim. At least Scientology has some wackiness and craziness. These JW guys are so monotone and one-note.

Lloyd: Yes, Scientology is super cheesy and quite duplicitous. What you see and the reality of Scientology are so different that it’s almost comical. You do get a bit of deception in JW propaganda but mostly they’re very up front about how manipulative they are and how much they expect from followers. They’re so deluded that it all makes total sense to them.

The Bunker: When it comes to Christian preaching, we’re used to the charismatic preachers, so the JW stuff was just so determinedly dull. Keep calm while you wait for the world to end.

Lloyd: Yes. Interestingly these people were raised in what was called the “Theocratic Ministry School,” which was supposed to hone their skills as teachers and communicators. But frequently we’re finding through the propaganda videos (which are a relatively new thing, mostly since 2014) that the men who rose to the top are terrible speakers and orators. I can only imagine that they’ve succeeded due to being yes men.

    Hello guest!

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14 hours ago, Indiana said:

We finally got a chance to catch up with Lloyd 

This fellow invited/cajoled/taunted/practically begged for me to appear on his podcast, then turned hostile when it became clear that I would not. (The pen is mightier than the podcast)

I did “appear”, with some tenacity, albeit always respect, on his website. He didn’t endure it long. I am banned there.

(Though maybe it is like when the Librarian (that old hen) slapped some demerits on me for some wrong that she imagined I had committed. They were said to be permanent, but they soon vanished. I haven’t checked with Lloyd.)

He likes easy softballs that he can swat out of the park.

 

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Seems a bit one sided. Would it not make sense to speak to both sides? Those that see this are now saying that she would not try this with anyone else. People should be able to speak their peace.

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14 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

The "homeowner" sets the rules about what speech is permitted

That’s why I didn’t appear on his ‘podcast.’

I have no problem with someone controlling his own site. I do mine as well, far more tightly than he. 

The difference is that he constantly remarks on how few Witnesses show up to engage with him. Should some do that, however, and actually succeed in making a few points, he tosses them out.

14 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

It is also true with The Librarian

the old hen

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You come to their playground that they own, you are bounded to their rules. They can warn you, remind you, but should you go out of line, you will be exiled, excommunicato'd, banished, kick-out, of the playground.

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On 3/10/2019 at 6:44 AM, Space Merchant said:

You come to their playground that they own, you are bounded to their rules. They can warn you, remind you, but should you go out of line, you will be exiled, excommunicato'd, banished, kick-out, of the playground.

sounds exactly like being a jw in a kh. 

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31 minutes ago, Shiwiii said:
On 3/10/2019 at 9:44 AM, Space Merchant said:

You come to their playground that they own, you are bounded to their rules. They can warn you, remind you, but should you go out of line, you will be exiled, excommunicato'd, banished, kick-out, of the playground.

sounds exactly like being a jw in a kh. 

If you misbehave in my house, you may be shot dead.

.... you do not "take a dump" in someone else's environment.

That's why gentlemen go out in the street to fight .... or in a public forum where the rules are somewhat more lax.

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8 minutes ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

If you misbehave in my house, you may be shot dead.

.... you do not "take a dump" in someone else's environment.

That's why gentlemen go out in the street to fight .... or in a public forum where the rules are somewhat more lax.

rightly so and I agree. The difference being is that  I do not proclaim to accept any joe public person into my "house" without establishing the boundaries before hand if we are on different playing fields. 

"House rules" are everywhere, its up to each of us to either accept them or not enter. That makes it kind of hard for those dragged in without a choice. 

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10 hours ago, Shiwiii said:

sounds exactly like being a jw in a kh. 

Sounds exactly like mainstream Christendom and soco films who, inasmuch butcher the gospels knowingly.

9 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

If you misbehave in my house, you may be shot dead.

.... you do not "take a dump" in someone else's environment.

That's why gentlemen go out in the street to fight .... or in a public forum where the rules are somewhat more lax.

There is always rules to a forum. We are lucky to have such a less strict admin unlike other places.

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16 hours ago, Space Merchant said:

Sounds exactly like mainstream Christendom and soco films who, inasmuch butcher the gospels knowingly.

you're funny. I mean, you already know that what I said is true. It DOES sound like the wt, because they do exactly that. 

Your statement here is silly. Why? because your feelings are hurt and want to lash out. No one agrees that mainstream Christianity disfellowships or excommunicates or shuns.  You are just hurt, and that's ok. It'll get better. 

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On 3/12/2019 at 11:54 AM, Shiwiii said:

you're funny. I mean, you already know that what I said is true. It DOES sound like the wt, because they do exactly that. 

Your statement here is silly. Why? because your feelings are hurt and want to lash out. No one agrees that mainstream Christianity disfellowships or excommunicates or shuns.  You are just hurt, and that's ok. It'll get better. 

You assume way too much my friend. I don't hurt easily, I speak of what is true. It is not unknown to anyone the JW community and their churches profess excommunication, and it is not a shock to anyone who understand where excommunication originated from and how it was practiced. The church of the Christ does expel persons and such a practice is committed by those who applies it. Those of the mainstream practice 2 ill forms of excommunication, something I brought up before, and it waters down and or damages what Jesus entrusted the disciples in this current day and age.

You are confusing Restorationist with mainstream Christendom. For last I checked, they, among a handful of others are not interfaith, nor do they integrate things of this world into their churches.

That being said, you humor me, I invite you to profess how am I hurt and or sad when I shed nothing of the sort in this sense here?

But I do saith, when it comes to forums and communities as such, even for here, regardless of who you are, the rules are sent by the admin here, and we are to abide by them, as with every forum or social space. Going beyond that will result in termination and or being kicked out, thus even goes for educational institutions, governmental, business, religious, etc. Such ones have the ability to bind and loosen said community, just as Jesus commanded his disciples, to bind and loosen, after all, yous aid it best yourself, shouldn't we be following Jesus command?

You are not the first to try me, nor are you the last, but you are free to try.

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On 3/11/2019 at 10:06 PM, TrueTomHarley said:

Not to mention a wonderful Librarian.

Yes. Not every form is blessed with good folk. For Christian admins at CSE, if you do not have facts to make up your information, you will lose rep and your response removed. If anything you will get a comment follow up that says "lacking in evidence and or information" something of that sort.

So what is said, must be detailed and backed up with clear information. Well here, some of us still cling to the original state of this section, i.e. controversial posts.

But hey, anything goes from time to time on a forum.

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15 hours ago, Space Merchant said:

You are confusing Restorationist with mainstream Christendom.

you keep bringing this up, but you know what? No one has mentioned it but you. Seems like you want a discussion on the topic. Do it. 

 

15 hours ago, Space Merchant said:

But I do saith, when it comes to forums and communities as such, even for here, regardless of who you are, the rules are sent by the admin here, and we are to abide by them, as with every forum or social space. Going beyond that will result in termination and or being kicked out, thus even goes for educational institutions, governmental, business, religious, etc. Such ones have the ability to bind and loosen said community, just as Jesus commanded his disciples, to bind and loosen, after all, yous aid it best yourself, shouldn't we be following Jesus command?

This is straight up comedy.   Since you failed at expanding on the "mainstream Christianity" thing, you've had to resort to fourms and private clubs. Keep going sm, tell us about the knitting circle that won't allow cross stitch and how that ties back to your statement that Christians shun. 

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7 hours ago, Shiwiii said:

you keep bringing this up, but you know what? No one has mentioned it but you. Seems like you want a discussion on the topic. Do it. 

Is that a problem? I brought it up because that information is true, something factual. When you study religious theology, things like this is known. And Restorationist are among the fold who are not part of the mainstream, hence why there is always a conflict between they and them.

7 hours ago, Shiwiii said:

This is straight up comedy.   Since you failed at expanding on the "mainstream Christianity" thing, you've had to resort to fourms and private clubs.

I have spoken of mainstream Christendom many, many times. It pertains to the threads I've started here on how they twist Scripture into some other form of doctrine, one of which you were in said discussion briefly. And no, I have been preaching and teachings not to the people I help, homeless, youth, what have you, but to those that speak of doctrines that is not of the church. I have even stated I do this publicly in person, etc. Hence why I, as well as many from cse, are often on conversation and or debate when we are met with falsehood.

If I had to resort to forums only, why would I have preached the messages of the gospel to those in Thailand? Africa? Recently the countries of my parents? There are times whereas I am absent, if not work, if not helping young ones or the homeless, I am preaching the gospel to those who want to have a head start in learning the Bible.

7 hours ago, Shiwiii said:

Keep going sm, tell us about the knitting circle that won't allow cross stitch and how that ties back to your statement that Christians shun. 

cross stitch? You do realize I am Unitarian, right? If I am not mistaken, you brought this up, and it is not the first time I've explained excommunication and 3 forms practiced by Christians today whereas only one form out of the 3 is correct. If I mention it now, you'd simply equate your comment about a separate discussion.

That being said, I still don't understand your claim of me being hurt. Seems to be the other way around if one such as yourself is irked that easily to even make the first response that brought us to this point. But hey, it is evident when I see people watering down Scripture.

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