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A CIRCUIT OVERSEER STATES, "YOUR FAITH IS GARBAGE AND NEEDS TO BE TORN DOWN"

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1 hour ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

Spoken like a true arrogant WT lawyer .... or Gerritt Losch.

The bottom line is, you said NO, to my challenge.

James Thomas Rook Jr

By not answering, you are declining my offer, in essence saying you won't accept my challenge, so what’s the difference in that puzzled mind of yours. However, I didn’t say no, I declined your offer under the terms you gave. Why flush good money down the toilet. Knows that’s the difference in arrogance.

Do you have a humorless cartoon to go along with your evasiveness?

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1 hour ago, Outta Here said:

That seems to be the trouble with those who apostatize in this manner. They were idolators themselves, but having realised it, they just can't come clean and admit it, they have to accuse everyone else in the organisation they have now renounced of the very practice they themselves engaged in.

They turn themselves into "once-duped" but now "enlightened"victims to gain sympathy and acclaim from their newfound peers. Their self-appointed crusade might provide some temporary relief for the resentment and embarrassment they feel, but needs constant repetition.  

The sad thing is that they think they left the organisation they now oppose. But, actually, they were rejected. :(

1John 2:19: "They went out from us, but they were not of our sort; for if they had been of our sort, they would have remained with us. But they went out so that it might be shown that not all are of our sort."

Well if you put it like that @Outta Here I suppose I went out from JW Org because I'm not a Pedophilie and I don't condone Pedophilia, so I proved that I an not of that 'sort'.  Your quote of scripture not mine. 

As for me being an 'idolator' and then realising it, you are right. Exactly right. I did serve the JW Org as I thought it had 'truth'. But now having studied the bible myself without the misguidance of the JW Org, I see through the veneer of the GB domination. @JW Insider has just confirmed much of what I believe about the GB and it's Org. @James Thomas Rook Jr. says he has proof of same, if he is being serious. 

Actually i have 'come clean' about it many times on this forum. Maybe you don't read many of my posts.

However, I always think of Saul that thought he was doing right until Jesus showed him what was really right.  Saul would never have become Paul without guidance from Jesus Christ.  Maybe, just maybe, Jesus sees those in JW Org that think they are doing right but are doing wrong,  then maybe Jesus shows them the right way. Maybe Jesus will help people to leave the JW Org and to find the right way to serve God. I haven't given up hope In God through Christ. 

Quoter "some temporary relief for the resentment and embarrassment they feel,"   Do you really think the Apostle Paul felt that ? Look how off track Paul was, but Jesus guided him in the right direction. Do you think Paul was embarrassed ? I think Paul was too busy doing God's will to be concerned for his own embarrassment.  I'm also too busy to be embarrassed. 

Oh by the way the scripture you have used doesn't match the purpose you had for it. 

: "They went out from us ... But they went out  ...   Does not  = But, actually, they were rejected 

To leave of one's own accord is not being discarded or rejected, it is LEAVING OF ONE'S OWN ACCORD. :) :) 

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5 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

Look how off track Paul was, but Jesus guided him in the right direction.

 You surely don't compare your situation with that of Paul's conversion to Christianity do you? Is that the result of your "having studied the bible" yourself? The only similarity apparent is what Jesus said at Acts 26:14.

I think you will find that those who "go out" from the Christian congregation due to being of the "wrong sort" actualy fit the description of those in Jesus' illustration of the dragnet as "unsuitable fish" (wrong sort). They are thrown out by the angels, regardless of any illusion they might have of leaving of their own volition.

But then of course, as to an individual judgement of such ones, jthe final estimation  of their actual worth lies with Jehovah and the man he has appointed. With the right heart, they can still return if they become the right sort. (Of course, even that is by Jehovah's permission as it is he that "draws" men to Christ).

However you want to view it, you are not of our sort at present, and the generally patronising tone and insulting content of these postings you make suggest a heart that is abundant in rather unpleasant things at the moment. You and your former congregation are better off the way things are currently. Likely. the same applies to the video makers in the original posting.

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18 hours ago, JW Insider said:

They feel that intensive Bible study, organizational experience, faith in Jehovah, meditation and prayer will all combine in some spiritual way to guide them.

This is very good sentence, from which i read next: 

All and every moment of efforts numbered here (intensive Bible study, organizational experience, faith in Jehovah, meditation and prayer) reveals one side - human efforts, to gain, what? ....these things are combination of preconditions, causes that will, supposedly,  result in spiritual guidance (from above). 

What i see here is, only/solely working (almost fleshly) efforts of particular human who strive to get, to receive something divinely, spiritually from God, by deeds, by work (aka intensive bible study, more preaching, more meetings etc).

What is omitted in this sentence (not by purpose and not from you personally) but by common/general view in WT organization is the role of Second Part in this "equation". Influence and power that depend of that very Person who is The Source of spiritual guidance.   

Pushing made by/from WTJWORG  how person must and have to do this and that and to do it more and more, is something that can be obstacle, dam, close door for Divine Power. Yes, Divine Power destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah or Jericho Walls, BUT it can be very "Powerless" to change human minds and hearts. Because in case of Sodom and Jericho we talking about Naked Power. But when people are involved, this Spirit Force is on Next Level, in my opinion, on level of soft, gently, unobtrusively, discretely actions and effects...... After all, JHVH ask, plead for love by your free will.

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15 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

I had a Brother call me up at 7:30 in the morning, many years ago, asking in desperate need if I had any money I could lend him.  I checked my resources, and told him I had $4.00, which I was planning to use for lunch money that day, but he was welcome to that.

...... and he hung up on me.

That hamburger at lunch was especially delicious !

This is wide problem, lending/borrow money to brotherhood.

I know at least three cases how JW people not return money to those JW who borrow them money.

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7 hours ago, BillyTheKid46 said:

James Thomas Rook Jr

By not answering, you are declining my offer, in essence saying you won't accept my challenge, so what’s the difference in that puzzled mind of yours. However, I didn’t say no, I declined your offer under the terms you gave. Why flush good money down the toilet. Knows that’s the difference in arrogance.

Do you have a humorless cartoon to go along with your evasiveness?

You crack me up Billy. The level in which you interact with others is very telling. 

 

Also, it doesn't hurt my feelings if you down vote my posts. It actually makes me smile..........because you read it. 

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7 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

@JW Insider has just confirmed much of what I believe about the GB and it's Org. @James Thomas Rook Jr. says he has proof of same, if he is being serious. 

Who are these people but a bunch of flakes like you? So what have they actually confirmed in your puzzled mind? They don't speak for the Watchtower. In their hearts, they are not affiliated to the Watchtower. They speak in the same respect as apostates. Therefore, what possible thing can they prove aside to confirm how inadequate you are in understanding scripture with their understanding? The GB didn't teach you to apply scripture by their standards. They taught you through others to apply scripture by Christ standards,

Therefore, what have you taught yourself by learning scripture on your own? To be foolish and an apostate? You really taught yourself something. How embarrassing it will be when someone wants to use somebody like you in a court of law as a witness. It is going to be very easy to prove your personal bias and mental state.

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3 minutes ago, Shiwiii said:

Also, it doesn't hurt my feelings if you down vote my posts. It actually makes me smile..........because you read it

Glade to accommodate. You should be laughing your head off right now. Let me know how else I can make you feel better as a clueless proponent of scripture. I laugh my head off by people like you, John, Screcko, witness, James, JWinsider that have the same mindset as you.

However, since you comment on my post. What are you doing, think about it, what did you write? "Because you read it" Its time people start using what is meant with the word intelligence.

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1 minute ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

... since you were not willing to "put your money where your mouth is", Billy, you will NEVER KNOW!

Anytime you are brave enough to go to court with your allegations and proof, let me know. So, the day you don’t feel like a coward and actually commit, keep blowing hot air.

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36 minutes ago, BillyTheKid46 said:

Who are these people but a bunch of flakes like you? So what have they actually confirmed in your puzzled mind? They don't speak for the Watchtower. In their hearts, they are not affiliated to the Watchtower. They speak in the same respect as apostates. Therefore, what possible thing can they prove aside to confirm how inadequate you are in understanding scripture? The GB didn't teach you to apply scripture by their standards. They taught you through others to apply scripture by Christ standards,

 

Therefore, what have you taught yourself by learning scripture on your own? To be foolish and an apostate? You really taught yourself something. How embarrassing it will be when someone wants to use somebody like you in a court of law as a witness. It is going to be very easy to prove your personal bias and mental state.

 

Is this really the best you can come up with child ? Oh it's kid isn't it, well same thing. 

The GB wouldn't know Christ's standards if he punched them on the nose.  Once again you worship your GB. 

What have i taught myself ? Well I've taught myself that honesty is important to God even though your GB don't think it is. 

I've taught myself that just as Christ values people's lives and cares about them, then so should I, even if your GB doesn't care about people but only cares about themselves and the business / JW Org. 

I've taught myself not to fear men, even though the Elders of JW  congregations try to 'lord it over them' and to bully the congregants.

I've taught myself to think for myself instead of just being a puppet to the GB and it's Org like you are. 

But you are a blind worshipper of the GB, so there is no point talking sense to you as you cannot understand it. 

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26 minutes ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

If you actually do decide to laugh you head off, please have someone video it and put it on YouTube.

Way over the top there, James, don't you think?

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10 hours ago, Outta Here said:

The sad thing is that they think they left the organisation they now oppose. But, actually, they were rejected. :(

 

Those who leave the organization to follow only the Father and Christ, are then labeled as rejected.  They found the “fruit”/teachings to be rotten.  The leaving happens before the rejection, which Jesus stated would occur to those who turned to him.  Matt 7:15-20; John 15:20; Matt 5:11,12

John 16:2 – “They will put you out of the synagogue; in fact, the time is coming when anyone who kills you will think they are offering a service to God.”

“out of the synagogues” – “excluded from sacred assemblies of Israelites, excommunicated”

Matt 10:18 – “You will be brought before governors (GB) and kings (elders) for My sake, as a testimony to them and to the Gentiles.”

10 hours ago, Outta Here said:

1John 2:19: "They went out from us, but they were not of our sort; for if they had been of our sort, they would have remained with us. But they went out so that it might be shown that not all are of our sort."

So, who “went out” from among who, to being with?  John is speaking of the presence of the “antichrist”.  He leads off by saying,

 “Little children, it is the last hour; and as you have heard that theAntichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come, by which we know that it is the last hour.” 1 John 2:18

The first “antichrist” in the Jewish system was the rule of the Pharisees.  They rejected Christ and had him killed by Gentiles.  We have another prophetic “Jewish” system intact right now – the organization, led by those who reject Christ.  How do we know they reject him although they speak about him?  One way of knowing, is simply because the organization “excommunicates” those anointed in Christ and all believers of Christ, which gives proof of the presence of another antichrist.  They realize that an “organization” steeped in the traditions of men is not SALVATION.  They realize that there is “no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved.”  Acts 4:12

The other validation of the organization as the antichrist, which is “lawlessness” against the law of God fulfilled in Christ, is the given power of the elders over the “saints”/anointed priesthood, who are the Temple of God. Matt 24:48-51; Ezek 44:6-9;2 Thess 2:3,4; Rev 11:1,2; 1 Pet 2:5,9; 1 Cor 3:16,17; Eph 2:19-22

The Pharisees rejected the new “Temple” God was building. John 2:19-22  The GB rejects the “living stones” of that Temple built on Christ, because the GB has established their own “temple”, which is the organization.  The rejection of the priesthood is not only inside but outside the organization.    The Pharisees held on to the old structure of worship, and it was destroyed.  The organization demands obedience to its fabricated structure of worship, and according to Revelation, it too, will be destroyed. Rev 13:4,5-8; Rev 19:20

The scriptures are like a puzzle that when joined together, give us evidence of this happening as John said, at the last hour. 

 “For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrinebut according to their own desires, because they have itching ears, they will heap up for themselves teachers; and they will turn their ears away from the truth, and be turned aside to fables. 2 Tim 4:3,4

Those who “went out from us” are those from the anointed Body of Christ who “maligned the way of  truth”.  As all anointed are, they were tested by Satan and took up his offer to dominate their brothers in Christ.  Luke 22:31; 4:5-7; Mat 24:48-51   They fell from God’s favor and pursued the riches of this world.  Rev 8:10,11; Heb 12:14-17  Satan, now has his out to build his deception which captured all anointed with bits of truth.  2 Thess 2:9-12

“But there were also false prophets among the people, even as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Lord who bought them, and bring on themselves swift destruction. And many will follow their destructive ways, because of whom the way of truth will be blasphemed. By covetousness they will exploit you with deceptive words; for a long time their judgment has not been idle, and their destruction [

    Hello guest!
]does not slumber.”  2 Pet 2:1-3

In verse 3 - Through, “greedy desire to have more, covetousness, avarice”, “shall they with “fictitious” words make merchandise of you: whose judgment now of a long time lingereth not, and their damnation slumbereth not.”

Paul tells the anointed ones:

“Beware lest anyone cheat you ("exploits" you, "make merchandise of you") through philosophy and empty deceit, according to the tradition of men, according to the basic principles of the world, and not according to ChristFor in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily; 10 and you are complete in Him, who is the head of all principality and power.”  Col 2:8

This is what Revelation reveals, the true identity of the “antichrist”/”man of lawlessness” which is the elder body of the organization, “exalting itself” over the Temple, and “sitting”/ruling/judging the anointed priests.  This is presently directed by the “false prophet”. 2 Thess 2:3,4; Rev 13:1,11,13-17

“The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, 10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this reason God will send (“to bid a thing to be carried to one”)  them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness."  2 Thess 2:9-12

We “fall” into this deceptive rule by men, by the “edge of the sword” – God’s word of truth ,used as bait.  Heb 4:12   As true to prophesy, the anointed are now “captive” among the nations of people from all over the world. This "camp of saints" is surrounded, captive to Watchtower's "empty philosophy".   Rev 16:13-16; 20:9 On the other hand,  they are also dispersed, not allowed to be unified under their one Head, Jesus Christ. Joel 3:2 This captivity to “empty philosophy”, affects all JWs.  The anointed are now “trampled” by uncircumcised “Gentiles”/elders who rule over them.  It is this “man of lawlessness” that rejects them, by spiritually “killing” them.  Rev 13:15

Those who are rejected/excommunicated from the "synagogues" by the "man of lawlessness" are not the ones who speak against Christ, but on behalf of him.

 24 "And they will fall by the edge of the sword, and be led away captive into all nations. And Jerusalem will be trampled by Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled.”  Luke 21:24

It is the divisive sword that discerns each heart’s love, for either truth or lies.  Rev 13:10  Truth is not found in half-truths spoken by men.  It is found “outside” the camp where those who follow Christ suffer “disgrace” put upon them by their own people.  They “seek the city to come”, not putting their faith in  “Jehovah’s organization” – a “continuing city”  that is full of blasphemy in every definition of the word, just as the early Jewish system had become in Jesus’ day.  Heb 13:12-14

 I wish JWs would reject living in blasphemy.  To make this “tribulating” decision of either keeping the life one loves under false circumstances, or being rejecting and finding peace and truth from Christ, is the essence the great tribulation/Armageddon.  Matt 16:25

 

“Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’  Matt 7:21-23

 

 

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@JW Insider

Even though Billy the Kid was killed by Pat Garret, not have his head cut off, I didn't mind the humorless depiction. This is a good example of how stupid people make any attempts to justify their actions. I don't mind it, other than to show how biased JWinsider is to initially rebuke harshly John’s comment and is sensitive to James horrid demonstration of making a mockery of human existence.

That’s entertainment. But at least, I got everyone here back on track. Concentrate on the truth rather than each other pretending to speak the truth. I like it so much better when you concentrate on 1 and not snipe at each other.

Tom, needs all the intelligent opinions from factless people for his next book.

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I am a self-proclaimed Barbarian, as I have stated many dozens of times here on the Archive, and in every day life.

12 minutes ago, BillyTheKid46 said:

What does that picture say about James? Where’s that witted sarcasm of your, for James Thomas Rook Jr.

It would not bother me in the least to put someone's head on a pole if I found them mistreating puppies.

The ONLY thing that keeps me in check is being one of Jehovah's Witnesses.

... this is where you look behind you and laugh, nervously.

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      Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. "But we have renounced the shameful, underhanded things, not walking with cunning or adulterating the word of God; but by making the truth manifest, we recommend ourselves to every human conscience in the sight of God."
      (2 Cor. 4:2)

    • By Bible Speaks
      Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. O Jehovah, who may
             be a guest in your tent?
      Who may reside in your holy mountain?
        Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. The one who is walking faultlessly,
      Practicing what is right
      And speaking the truth in his heart."
                 (Psalm 15:1,2)       Do not let your mouth say       what your heart doesn't feel. 
    • By Bible Speaks
      What Does the Bible Say About Christmas? ???????
      The Bible’s answer
      The Bible does not give the date of Jesus’ birth, nor does it say that we should celebrate his birthday. As McClintock and Strong’s Cyclopedia states: “The observance of Christmas is not of divine appointment, nor is it of NT [New Testament] origin.” Instead, an examination of the history of Christmas exposes its roots in pagan religious rites. The Bible shows that we offend God if we try to worship him in a way that he does not approve of.—Exodus 32:5-7.  History of Christmas customs
      Celebrating Jesus’ birthday: “The early Christians did not celebrate [Jesus’] birth because they considered the celebration of anyone’s birth to be a pagan custom.”—The World Book Encyclopedia.
      •December 25: There is no proof that Jesus was born on that date. Church leaders likely chose this date to coincide with pagan festivals held on or around the winter solstice.
      •Gift-giving, feasting, partying: The Encyclopedia Americana says: “Saturnalia, a Roman feast celebrated in mid-December, provided the model for many of the merry-making customs of Christmas. From this celebration, for example, were derived the elaborate feasting, the giving of gifts, and the burning of candles.” The Encyclopædia Britannica notes that “all work and business were suspended” during Saturnalia.
      •Christmas lights: According to The Encyclopedia of Religion, Europeans decorated their homes “with lights and evergreens of all kinds” to celebrate the winter solstice and to combat evil spirits.
      •Mistletoe, holly: “The Druids ascribed magical properties to the mistletoe in particular. The evergreen holly was worshiped as a promise of the sun’s return.”—The Encyclopedia Americana.
      •Christmas tree: “Tree worship, common among the pagan Europeans, survived after their conversion to Christianity.” One of the ways in which tree worship survived is in the custom of “placing a Yule tree at an entrance or inside the house in the midwinter holidays.”—Encyclopædia Britannica.
      Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content.
    • By Bible Speaks
      @caribbeangiirll shares with us: “My sister and I are out in service working the territory in Curacao, Netherlands Antilles. It was our first time doing territory work here since both of us were living in Canada and took the truth there. We had so much fun sharing the good news here.”
    • By Bible Speaks
      @almaguers123 from Corpus Christi,Texas, USA shares with us: “Our first part as a family!!! My husband finally made the truth his own and was baptized this year. So happy we almost couldn’t contain ourselves. Thanks to Jehovah’s undeserved kindness we are enjoying many blessings together.” Baptisms Corpus Christi Texas USA
    • By Bible Speaks
      "Ride in the cause of truth and humility."—Ps. 45:4.
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