Exploitation of Forgiveness

[Equivocation]

What do you guys think? The forms of exploitation people do about God's forgiveness and why Christians forgive.

After Shophmore year and coming back from vacation, I have some time to reflect until the next war - junior year lol.

I make thread on this because of a school experience, social media and what was shown recently from this month's broadcasting about being lured into sin.

[JOHN BUTLER]

10 minutes ago, Equivocation said:

What do you guys think? The forms of exploitation people do about God's forgiveness and why Christians forgive.

After Shophmore year and coming back from vacation, I have some time to reflect until the next war - junior year lol.

I make thread on this because of a school experience, social media and what was shown recently from this month's broadcasting about being lured into sin.

People on this blog seem to have different ideas about God's forgiveness. I've been condemned to death by at least one member (BTK). The thinking on 'sinning against the holy spirit' seems to mean different things to different people. From my viewpoint only the Anointed can 'sin against the spirit' because only they have been anointed with that holy spirit. 

As for Christians forgiving, Jesus said to the disciples to forgive 77 times, or ongoing. But he was talking to the disciples / apostles, and it would seem to refer to forgiving those who were actually trying their best to serve God properly. 

As for forgiving people in the 'world' that deliberately sin or commit crime against you, that may be a totally different thing. 

Also there are probably sins that should not be easily forgiven of those that call themselves Christians. Victims of Child Sex Abuse or Adultery may find it hard to forgive those that have committed these sins against them.  

I think you have to make your own peace with God through Jesus Christ on these matters. On here you may probably get a dozen different answers. And each sin or crime against you needs individual attention and prayer. Don't make a hasty decision and try not to hate anyone. 

[Equivocation]

@JOHN BUTLER Those who are Anointed are imperfect like us, mainly when it comes to sinning against the spirit.

About forgiveness, the Bible tells us what it means and how that is practiced by us to apply what Jehovah's word and what his son Jesus taught us, mainly when face to face with people who does sin but doesn't repent for his or her sins.

But my focus is those who exploit God's forgiveness. I told Billy of a school experience regarding a girl who was known cause people to sin, sexual sin and does so by seducing people, she tried this with me. Her idea of forgiveness is that no matter how many times she sins and causes others to sin, she think she will be forgiven when she knows what she is doing. 

I'm not trying to hate anyone, but I am uneasy with you after what you did last time, even then, I still forgive you but you said something along the lines that my forgiveness was fake. Normally a negative first impression with someone leaves a bad taste.

Also people exploit the forgiveness of Christians, we cannot forget about that either. Like if they sin they will exploit a Christian's ability to forgive and pretend to repent, in order to stay in the community, but that person knows in their heart they'll do it again, self harm and or harm to others. Some negative actions can be very damaging leaving a scar on those effected. 

[James Thomas Rook Jr.]

I have a tendency to forgive those who have sinned against me . especially if they live more than a thousand miles away.

The rest is prorated, by distance.

If they get close enough, I keep "one in the chamber".

[Space Merchant]

Yes. Christians can easily be exploited. For if a man sins against himself and or someone, he can fake repentance, play his card as an actor, to be reinstated and back into the fold only to commit the same acts again.

Others will continue on sinning, and think that God will simply for give them, i.e. a man who commits sexual immorality with multiple women, and after each ill action, he prays, repents, only to willfully do the same thing over and over again. It is one thing if someone is addicted, but someone who generally loves his or her sins and does so, will are the false ones. They pretend to be Christian by means of immoral parties on a Saturday night and suddenly on Sunday they are a Saint.

Reasons why people do not take the Bible or God's word seriously.

Then you have those who incite infighting within Christendom, and those who take the flaws of someone and or a group and attack them for it when said flaws are not even in the realm of heresy. 

Aside from that, the fake repenter is usually brought back into the fold because Christians practice forgiveness, which is understandable, but they fall to being gullible as if all things will be happy and dandy afterwards, and such sin can stem from sexual immorality, violence, willful drug use without an addiction, and even child abuse be it violent, mental, sexual, etc. as well as Gang Stalkers, and those who wish to spread doubt and false doctrines within the community.

I have more to say, but I do such at a later time.

@James Thomas Rook Jr. But that would negate what must be applied if you are down this route. Repentance does not require ammunition. We should be taking in a lesson of what the Bible says about forgiveness and repentance. We should also be aware of those who exploit this in the Bible in order to commits more acts of sin, even to others.

@Equivocation Because young so called Christians in high/middle/elementary school, even in my day, do not know what a Christian is and how to be one. They would say it and say Jesus saves and that's that, and they do not know Yahweh. Also some would consider your forgiveness as fake because you are a JW, as is with love as some had said, which they'll say is fake, and such ones will be quick to judge and assume when they do not know you as a person.

@JOHN BUTLER And yet that would take away from pass sayings and discussions; a contradiction at best concerning some. Forgiveness is as simple to understand as is with Repentance. There are those in today's world who has no idea who God is and even some, their apology are genuine, for not all people are bad persons, just in a wrong place and or misguided, hence, i.e. homeless persons, troubled teens and or children, a mental torn person, on the other side of the spectrum you have those who are so deep down in sin, they think no one can forgive them, even God and such ones often cause injury to themselves and or others, i.e. lashing out, suicide, which seems to be recent as is the experienced I had spoken of some time ago. For such ones are far different than those who fake repentance and or forgiveness, as is with those who do so to pretend to repent and seek forgiveness only to commit more sin, such as violence, immorality, etc.

 

 

 

[JOHN BUTLER]

There seems to be a cross over here between asking forgiveness from a person, and / or, repenting to God through Christ.

Who of us is really capable of judging others ? God has judged. Jesus Christ can judge. But us humans are all sinners so do we have the right to judge if a person is repentant to God ?

It would seem that in the JW Org, men, Elders, are given the right to judge others. But what exactly are those Elders judging ? They cannot judge whether God or Christ has forgiven a person's sins. Elders can only judge if a person has basically apologised to the JW Org. Repentance attaining to forgiveness from God through Christ is of no one else's business really. In my opinion (which most on here seem to disagree with  ) a person has to make their own peace with God. 

My point here about judging others, is not about judging who one should mix with etc. Because we all need to judge in that way. Most people judge who they will trust, or who they will spend time with, maybe even to the point of who's vehicle they will travel in for safety. But surely it is not our place to judge on God's behalf.  For instance Billy the Kid has judged that i will not receive forgiveness from God or Christ. In my opinion that is going beyond the things written. 

[Space Merchant]

1 minute ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

There seems to be a cross over here between asking forgiveness from a person, and / or, repenting to God through Christ.

It is a mix of both granted of what was seen in the other thread.

2 minutes ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

Who of us is really capable of judging others ? God has judged. Jesus Christ can judge. But us humans are all sinners so do we have the right to judge if a person is repentant to God ?

None of us, but depending on what the person has done, decisions can be made to take action, as is with Jesus' church in the past.

3 minutes ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

It would seem that in the JW Org, men, Elders, are given the right to judge others. But what exactly are those Elders judging ? They cannot judge whether God or Christ has forgiven a person's sins. Elders can only judge if a person has basically apologised to the JW Org. Repentance attaining to forgiveness from God through Christ is of no one else's business really. In my opinion (which most on here seem to disagree with  ) a person has to make their own peace with God. 

But you must take into account what Jesus himself has commanded and entrusted his church, especially concerning wrongdoers, either in the ignorant sense and or those who do sin willfully. If someone wants to enter back into the church of the Christ, the community must be informed and those who are in religious office should make the decision of whether this person can enter back into the fold when it was known he or she had been excommunicated.

Actually it is, when actions can and or has effected the community as a whole.

5 minutes ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

My point here about judging others, is not about judging who one should mix with etc.

But you do this freely and when this was brought up there is an excuse, at this you should be honest to yourself in this regard.

6 minutes ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

Because we all need to judge in that way.

How so?

7 minutes ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

Most people judge who they will trust, or who they will spend time with,

Not necessarily. If a person is trusted, why must one judge them?

8 minutes ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

maybe even to the point of who's vehicle they will travel in for safety.

That is within the reaming of loyalty, responsibility and trust.

8 minutes ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

But surely it is not our place to judge on God's behalf. 

Exactly, but the thing is in older discussions you yourself have judged.

9 minutes ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

For instance Billy the Kid has judged that i will not receive forgiveness from God or Christ.

Can you give an example? For he must have said this because you can say this, but the discussion between the two of you may be entirely different.

10 minutes ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

In my opinion that is going beyond the things written. 

Not really because there are those who misguide others, who will not enter God's Kingdom, especially when not putting into application what it means to be Christ like and to apply the fruits of which is vital for Christians to apply.

That being said, op's directive is regarding those who exploit forgiveness and repentance, as in, a man can sin willfully, repent in the face of the faith community, only to enter back into the fold to sin again, as is that is what can be drawn from his response to billy in the other thread.