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4Jah2me

BASIC FOUNDATION BELIEFS OF JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES

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I do hear occasionally on this forum, the expression of, (oh dear it's gone now), I'll say Basic beliefs, Foundation beliefs, of Jehovah's Witnesses. 

My point being, when were those basic foundations started ?  Yes we have Russell and Rutherford et al. So who decided what was what and when ? 

We have things like 'hell fire' eternal damnation' ' soul in continual punishment' etc. But who basically found the truth from God's word about 'The dead are conscious of nothing at all' ?

Then we have the 'resurrection of the dead',  those being split into heavenly and earthly. Who decided these things from scriptures ? And when ? 

It would probably take me 10 years, which I probably do not have left, to research all the things I wish to know. 

So here is a question. From 1960, what new serious Bible knowledge do we have from those whom regard themselves as the F&DS or top of the tree ?

What have they given to the congregation that is of extreme importance ?  BUT, more importantly what have they given that they haven't changed since giving it ? 

So we've lost the 7,000 year creative days. We've lost Armageddon in 1975, We've lost no blood / replaced with blood fractions. We've lost the Superior Authorities as God and Christ, and probably lots more. BUT what important beliefs have we gained since 1960 ? What IMPORTANT SCRIPTURAL input have those at the top made since 1960 ? 

 

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4 hours ago, 4Jah2me said:

What IMPORTANT SCRIPTURAL input have those at the top made since 1960 ? 

I think that things LOST are a better topic.  Get rid of all unneccessary baggage so the the truth that we already have becomes brighter and lighter. 

We LOST the habit of smoking for one...... something which is allowed and even promoted by other religions.  Islam allows NO alcohol but members smoke and use drugs.  Many in Sweden smuggle weapons and drugs.........and politics is an integral part of the religion. (I preach to Arab speaking populations and recently moved from Sweden to Rep. Of Georgia.)

The necessity for love is emphasised at meetings and to encourage one another as times become increasingly hard to deal with.  The emphasis of GB is now to assist us to get through the hard times and to maintain ENDURANCE during persecution.  I find this important because my friends and family in South Africa are all enduring a terrible time (dangerous) and do not know how to make a living as the infrastructure of the country is  quickly falling apart.

The need to NOT participate or take sides in politics (not even in your heart) has been emphasized........ In comparison, there is a cold civil war going on in most countries in the West with the " iron and clay"  becoming so extreme -  irreconcileable divided. Satan's propaganda (Rev 16: 14-16)  is leading people to Armageddon and racial and political animosity is growing everywhere! 

The need to NOT choose your own good and bad like Adam and Eve did but remain faithful to Jehovah's moral standards.  This in a world where they are forcing LGBTQ ...... and soon the P on us.  In Scandinavia we received fines for the clip showed at the convention about the pink bow .  Non-muslims go to jail for saying things on Facebook in Scandinavia and UK.

We already have the toolbox and the tools to get us through Armageddon. Now it is just a matter if keeping us clean and functional for Jehovah so we can maintain integrity..

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@Arauna  Quote " I think that things LOST are a better topic " 

But it isn't the topic. You would want it to be because as I've noticed you don't seem to have any things GAINED' 

The GB have lumped great weights onto the shoulders of the congregants and the GB nor Elders lift a finger to help. 

Just as the Pharisees did, adding negativity but nothing positive. 

What I'm showing is that the GB is not motivated by Holy Spirit, and is not moving the CCJW forward. It is stagnant, but wallowing in immorality. 

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3 hours ago, 4Jah2me said:

I've noticed you don't seem to have any things GAINED' 

It is because you are looking for dogma or new rules or something like that.  Not looking for the right stuff....... one can see and still be blind to something in front of you..

Truths are being refined to get us through Armageddon right now.........we are shedding the unnecessary stuff and weight and 'growing' in support and care of each other. As I said...... you are looking for the answers that can suit your agenda.

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It is possible to come up with a list of new things learned that are not merely a matter of losing unnecessary doctrine. Even when doctrines are removed, there is a positive reason for them. For example, when the couple-hundred doctrines that highlighted "class distinctions" by turning every parable and narrative in the Bible into a prophecy about various classes of people, we actually gained the ability to see Bible principles that applied to any and all of us.

But there is still a lot to be said for what Arauna is saying about merely removing the focus on less important things. The theme of Love at the last convention was very simple, but additional ideas for opportunities to show love were gained. Even if they hadn't been, that simple focus motivates each of us to look for new ways to show love for one another.

We SHOULD be in a position now to have plenty to think about, and yet allow our Christianity to help us "keep our eye simple."

*** w11 1/15 p. 25 par. 16 Empowered to Fight Temptation and Cope With Discouragement ***
16 Jehovah’s Word urges us to “make sure of the more important things.” (Phil. 1:10) Likening the Christian life course to a long-distance footrace, under inspiration the apostle Paul recommended: “Let us also put off every weight . . . , and let us run with endurance the race that is set before us.” (Heb. 12:1) His point was that we must avoid needless pursuits, needless weights, that will tire us out.

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25 minutes ago, Arauna said:

It is because you are looking for dogma or new rules or something like that.  Not looking for the right stuff....... one can see and still be blind to something in front of you..

Truths are being refined to get us through Armageddon right now.........we are shedding the unnecessary stuff and weight and 'growing' in support and care of each other. As I said...... you are looking for the answers that can suit your agenda.

No you are wrong. The dogma / rules don't need to be looked for, they are forced on JW's, and constantly mentioned on here. 

But i don't see any replies to my original questions yet. 

 BUT what important beliefs have we gained since 1960 ? What IMPORTANT SCRIPTURAL input have those at the top made since 1960 ? 

And I say the Org is stagnant. Hence it make up rubbish, such as the overlapping generations, as it goes bumbling along.  

Quote @Arauna  " you are looking for the answers that can suit your agenda."  Yes, as my Agenda is searching for TRUTH. 

 

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3 minutes ago, 4Jah2me said:

you are looking for the answers that can suit your agenda."  Yes, as my Agenda is searching for TRUTH. 

The rafter is in your eye........ you have the agenda.  I have none.  I just love jehovah.  Simple.

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3 minutes ago, JW Insider said:

It is possible to come up with a list of new things learned that are not merely a matter of losing unnecessary doctrine. Even when doctrines are removed, there is a positive reason for them. For example, when the couple-hundred doctrines that highlighted "class distinctions" by turning every parable and narrative in the Bible into a prophecy about various classes of people, we actually gained the ability to see Bible principles that applied to any and all of us.

But there is still a lot to be said for what Arauna is saying about merely removing the focus on less important things. The theme of Love at the last convention was very simple, but additional ideas for opportunities to show love were gained. Even if they hadn't been, that simple focus motivates each of us to look for new ways to show love for one another.

We SHOULD be in a position now to have plenty to think about, and yet allow our Christianity to help us "keep our eye simple."

*** w11 1/15 p. 25 par. 16 Empowered to Fight Temptation and Cope With Discouragement ***
16 Jehovah’s Word urges us to “make sure of the more important things.” (Phil. 1:10) Likening the Christian life course to a long-distance footrace, under inspiration the apostle Paul recommended: “Let us also put off every weight . . . , and let us run with endurance the race that is set before us.” (Heb. 12:1) His point was that we must avoid needless pursuits, needless weights, that will tire us out.

They were saying much the same in the 1970's. But you still are not answering my questions. 

I know JW's  are living on a type of 'mana', just like the Israelites were in the wilderness, but the mana is being obscured by the GB adding pollutants 

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It boils down to anyone can cherry pick scriptures from the bible or change words to make it say what ever you want. I say it all started when they came up with their own version of the bible.

Arauna….id love to know which Christian religions promote smoking.

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7 minutes ago, 4Jah2me said:

They were saying much the same in the 1970's. But you still are not answering my questions. 

I think that if there were a lot of new things, many folks would just complain that it represents things we had wrong and had to change. The basic foundational beliefs have been around for quite a while, and we wouldn't expect any big changes in any of these. But we've gained a simpler message even though most of the "deeper" ideas are not discarded.

I think that we can be a bit humbler now because we aren't so often trying to compare our level of scholarship with others. We are not into the scholarship that proves the Trinity wrong, or Christmas wrong, even though we understand that our position on these things is much better than Christendom's.

I think we are wrong on a couple of less important doctrines that should be revisited in a scholarly manner. But if the WTS decided to never revisit some of these things, and could help us completely replace our concern instead with showing love to our fellow believers, and then showing love to our neighbor, and helping us learn patience, humility, peace, joy, love, kindness, moral cleanness, I would not care at all about a couple of mistaken doctrines.

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2 hours ago, JW Insider said:

I think that if there were a lot of new things, many folks would just complain that it represents things we had wrong and had to change. The basic foundational beliefs have been around for quite a while, and we wouldn't expect any big changes in any of these. But we've gained a simpler message even though most of the "deeper" ideas are not discarded.

I think that we can be a bit humbler now because we aren't so often trying to compare our level of scholarship with others. We are not into the scholarship that proves the Trinity wrong, or Christmas wrong, even though we understand that our position on these things is much better than Christendom's.

I think we are wrong on a couple of less important doctrines that should be revisited in a scholarly manner. But if the WTS decided to never revisit some of these things, and could help us completely replace our concern instead with showing love to our fellow believers, and then showing love to our neighbor, and helping us learn patience, humility, peace, joy, love, kindness, moral cleanness, I would not care at all about a couple of mistaken doctrines.

@JW Insider  I think here in the UK we would call that flannel (maybe spelt wrong) but it means using lots of words to say nothing, just to cover over something else. 

As you are one person that always seems to be 'on the button' then I'm presuming NOTHING NEW has been established since 1960. 

I would say even some of the core teachings have gone too. 7,000 year creative days, was a core teaching in the 60's / 70's 

I still don't know the truth about the prediction of 1975 Armageddon, but i do know that JW's sold their houses, left jobs, went full time ministry,  for it.......... So it must have been a pretty serious teaching in it's time. 

God and Jesus Christ being the 'superior authorities' was a core teaching that affected all JWs in WW2.

So, core teachings thrown away, and replaced with nothing, but JWs  still think the GB are anointed and are the F&DS 

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5 hours ago, 4Jah2me said:

As you are one person that always seems to be 'on the button' then I'm presuming NOTHING NEW has been established since 1960. 

Here's just a few off the top of my head, and I could include a dozen more:

We got back to the higher powers (superior authorities) being secular in the very early 60's. Made smoking a DF offense, which has probably improved the health of thousands. We went back to an elder arrangement. We dropped the District Overseer. We reduced the quotas for various pioneer titles. We replaced the separate meeting for the "book study" to be replaced with personal/family study and more focus on field service. Allowed our consciences to accept blood fractions, which has probably improved health or even saved 1,000. We opened up the possibility of the first resurrection from 1918 to a wider range of dates between 1914 and 1935 with the possibility that it could be even as late as the great tribulation. We opened up our understanding of the first resurrection to include the possibility of a "rapture" (as long as we don't use the word). We now see the cleansing of the temple as no longer tied to the situation in the organization in 1918. We now read several prophetic concepts that were once tied to 1914, 1918 and 1919 as no longer fixed to those years, with one now reaching back to the end of the first century, and a couple others now tied to the time surrounding the great tribulation. We got a much more accurate Watchtower history book which helps researchers understand the context of several of the major accomplishments along with several of the mistakes in our history. We now tell parents and guardians that they are free to inform authorities about child sexual abuse without concern for anyone's reputation. We now include elders informing authorities as part of the process wherever it is the law to do so.

5 hours ago, 4Jah2me said:

I would say even some of the core teachings have gone too. 7,000 year creative days, was a core teaching in the 60's / 70's 

It was a core concept with Frederick Franz. Everyone else knew that our chronology doctrines were always the most susceptible to change. Changing, moveable doctrines can hardly be core.

5 hours ago, 4Jah2me said:

I still don't know the truth about the prediction of 1975 Armageddon, but i do know that JW's sold their houses, left jobs, went full time ministry,  for it.......... So it must have been a pretty serious teaching in it's time.

It was serious. But many are too embarrassed to admit it was serious, and are happy to repress their own reactions, or the fact that it came from the WTS, not rank-and-file members of the congregation who were pushing ahead. But you should know that there never was a "prediction of 1975 Armageddon." The prediction was for the 1970's based on 1975 being the end of the 7,000 years since Adam. When that failed, the prediction was for the period up to the year 2000. There never was a specific 1975 prediction.

5 hours ago, 4Jah2me said:

So, core teachings thrown away, and replaced with nothing, but JWs  still think the GB are anointed and are the F&DS 

I see nothing wrong with thinking of the GB as anointed. Saul was anointed. David was anointed. Judas was anointed. Peter was anointed. Thomas was anointed. I'm sure they diligently try to live up to the reputation of a faithful and discreet slave. I think Jesus meant for the phrase to apply to all of us, including them. Most JWs probably know that we all need to be faithful and discreet slaves, but that this is a way of seeing their particular ministry as special.

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7 hours ago, JW Insider said:

years since Adam. When that failed, the prediction was for the period up to the year 2000.

This us not true. I never read any of this in the publications. ...... I have been a JW since 1973.

Any organization which is NOT willing to adjust reminds me of Muslims. Everything set in stone..... no adjustment because word of Allah came down from heaven.  I also recall the church I belonged to before becoming a JW. Doctrine was  set in stone...... trinity, immortality of soul, jesus is God etc. 

Glad to belong to a religion where they are prepared to acknowledge they did not have correct understanding....... or refine teachings.

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5 hours ago, Arauna said:

This us not true. I never read any of this in the publications

I'm sure it's been pointed out under the many prior 1975 topics in this forum.

The fact that the prediction was for the 1970's, not 1975 is easily seen from the articles called, for example, "What Will the 1970's Bring?" and the Circuit Assembly badges we wore that asked: "Who Will Conquer the World in the 1970's?"

The reason for 1970's instead of 1975 was because of articles and talks that made the following points:

*** Watchtower 1968 August 15 p. 499 par. 30 Why Are You Looking Forward to 1975? ***
30 Are we to assume from this study that the battle of Armageddon will be all over by the autumn of 1975, and the long-looked-for thousand-year reign of Christ will begin by then? Possibly, but we wait to see how closely the seventh thousand-year period of man’s existence coincides with the sabbathlike thousand-year reign of Christ.  . . . It does not necessarily mean that 1975 marks the end of the first 6,000 years of Jehovah’s seventh creative “day.” Why not? Because after his creation Adam lived some time during the “sixth day,” which unknown amount of time would need to be subtracted from Adam’s 930 years, to determine when the sixth seven-thousand-year period or “day” ended, and how long Adam lived into the “seventh day.” And yet the end of that sixth creative “day” could end within the same Gregorian calendar year of Adam’s creation. It may involve only a difference of weeks or months, not years.

If that difference between the end of six thousand years since Adam, and the end of the "sixth day" could not be a matter of years, then this means that it must be less than two years from the autumn of 1975. After the autumn of 1977 it would have become a matter of years, not just months.

Then, especially after the 1970's, the focus of the prediction moved to a time before the year 2000:

The Nations Shall Know That I Am Jehovah p. 216
"Shortly, within our twentieth century, the "battle in the day of Jehovah" will begin against the modern antitype of Jerusalem, Christendom."

Watchtower 1984 Mar 1 pp.18-19
"Some of that "generation" could survive until the end of the century. But there are many indications that "the end" is much closer than that!"

"Let Your Kingdom Come" (1981) p.102
"But now in our 20th century, we have come to the time for harvest  "a conclusion of a system of things, and the reapers are angels"!"

Watchtower 1989 Jan 1 p.12
"He was laying a foundation for a work that would be completed in our 20th century."

 

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12 hours ago, 4Jah2me said:

think here in the UK we would call that flannel (

If teaching a better understanding of "sacrificial love" is flannel...... then your understanding of how society should function is limited....... as most Western societies are now having a problem with the fabric of society.  Religious, racial hate is escalating. People are looking to "social engineering " and post modern philosophy to provide answers.  They are now promoting new minorities such as LGBTQ and protected religions. Soon the UN will bring  in their arbitrary values to create "peace and security"  but will fail at the peace. 

Amidst all this - jehovahs people are United under the moral values taught by christ.  In countries divided by racial hate such as south  africa and  growing racial divide in USA ...... we are United and the  level of support and  care for each other improving. 

The core teachings of truth are there - we just need to improve our social skills with each other to meet the standards of jehovah as taught by jesus and his apostles...... 

16 hours ago, Matthew9969 said:

Arauna….id love to know which Christian religions promote smoking.

I can do better: most allow smoking, pre marital sex, use of predictions, superstition, use of idols, and many are now voting for approval of homosexuality and LGBTQ..... I can go on .... 

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Arauna...you didn't prove what you stated. I have been associated with dozens of Christian religions and have never found one that promotes smoking, pre marital sex, use of predictions, use of idols and voting for approval of homosexuality. So you are lying and spreading falsehood, something that your Jehovah hates. Now you need to come up with something or stop commenting because your making the jw's look even worse.

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10 hours ago, Arauna said:

If teaching a better understanding of "sacrificial love" is flannel...... then your understanding of how society should function is limited....... as most Western societies are now having a problem with the fabric of society.  Religious, racial hate is escalating. People are looking to "social engineering " and post modern philosophy to provide answers.  They are now promoting new minorities such as LGBTQ and protected religions. Soon the UN will bring  in their arbitrary values to create "peace and security"  but will fail at the peace. 

Amidst all this - jehovahs people are United under the moral values taught by christ.  In countries divided by racial hate such as south  africa and  growing racial divide in USA ...... we are United and the  level of support and  care for each other improving. 

The core teachings of truth are there - we just need to improve our social skills with each other to meet the standards of jehovah as taught by jesus and his apostles...... 

I can do better: most allow smoking, pre marital sex, use of predictions, superstition, use of idols, and many are now voting for approval of homosexuality and LGBTQ..... I can go on .... 

@Arauna   I have to say very bluntly that you talk rubbish.  Always going on ( OCD ) about the Devil's world. 

I think your understanding of English English  (as opposed to American English)  is very poor. Not the understanding of the words but  the understanding of the meaning of what I write. I will give you the benefit of the doubt, that you do not understand me, otherwise it is that you deliberately misquote me. 

Oh @JW Insider  what twaddle. Changing man made things / Traditions of men. That is not 'New Light'  That is not God supplying Holy Spirit to reveal important things. That is not a F&DS  supply 'food at the proper time'.  It is showing that so many mistakes were made in the past, that it could not have had God's / Christ's guidance.  

Quote , We got back to the higher powers (superior authorities) being secular in the very early 60's. .......

But this was an ORIGINAL TEACHING of the Bible Students.  Those in power changed it for their own purpose, and it would have caused many deaths or great suffering in WW2 I would presume. 

Quote Made smoking a DF offense, which has probably improved the health of thousands. 

But it was known in the late 1800's by the Bible Students that Smoking was wrong. However, to keep people in the Org, it was allowed until the numbers grew. I'm sure it was mentioned in the purple book. Is it the Kingdom book. 

Just as Christmas was allowed for years, until 1926 ?, even in Bethel   ( I wish I had a better memory) .

Quote. "We dropped the District Overseer. We reduced the quotas for various pioneer titles. We replaced the separate meeting for the "book study" to be replaced with personal/family study and more focus on field service."

Traditions of men. or Man made ideas. NOTHING to do with serving God properly. Not NEW Important teachings.

And then you go on about dates/ years, when the scriptures simply tell us we will not know the day or the hour.  Those dates are once again Man made teachings, and God tells us 'Put not your trust in earthling man'.   Proof positive with all the changes made. 

Quote "We now tell parents and guardians that they are free to inform authorities about child sexual abuse without concern for anyone's reputation. We now include elders informing authorities as part of the process wherever it is the law to do so. "

The GB / Org has been forced to do this due to so many court cases . BUT You must be saying then that the GB / ORG told people they  WERE NOT FREE TO REPORT BEFORE.  

Quote "I see nothing wrong with thinking of the GB as anointed 

If the GB were anointed, would they seriously tell others of the anointed that the others are not the F&DS ?  Just those 8 men

Would an anointed GB tell others of the anointed, not to contact each other or to study God's word together ?

Are they not ALL the BODY OF CHRIST ?  Should they all not be united  as one ? 

10.30 pm UK time. Enough for now. 

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10 hours ago, 4Jah2me said:

have to say very bluntly that you talk rubbish.  Always going on ( OCD ) about the Devil's world. 

I think your understanding of English English  (as opposed to American English)  is very poor. Not the

I understand how a moral society is supposed to function. I BET, you have no clue of social studies 101.   

I also bet - you do not notice the worsening morality in the West because you are not abreast with what is eally going on in the secular world.(misquote from you - I never speak of the Devil's world) .... so yea, it may come across as OCD but it is based on comparisons in the real world out there.

Regarding the English - lol.  My first language is not English and the English we speak has words such as " i am coming now-now" in it........ which means: in a minute.  I used to write in English for newspapers and magazines but that was a long time ago and I had to watch the rules, which I have already forgotten. 

Now- I do not care.  I write as I speak..... no ego to write accurately because I only use it as a tool to communicate.... appearances do not matter to me - only substance. 

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9 hours ago, Arauna said:

I understand how a moral society is supposed to function. I BET, you have no clue of social studies 101.   

I also bet - you do not notice the worsening morality in the West because you are not abreast with what is eally going on in the secular world.(misquote from you - I never speak of the Devil's world) .... so yea, it may come across as OCD but it is based on comparisons in the real world out there.

Regarding the English - lol.  My first language is not English and the English we speak has words such as " i am coming now-now" in it........ which means: in a minute.  I used to write in English for newspapers and magazines but that was a long time ago and I had to watch the rules, which I have already forgotten. 

Now- I do not care.  I write as I speak..... no ego to write accurately because I only use it as a tool to communicate.... appearances do not matter to me - only substance. 

@Arauna  I wish you would bet, as I think you would  owe me money :) 

Of course I have some idea of what goes on in the world. But it is the Devil's world, so should we expect anything different. 

In some ways it is encouraging to see the immorality in that 'world'. It is only proving God's word as correct. Critical times hard to deal with. Having no natural affection. Giving themselves over to lust and homosexuality.  It shows the need for God through Christ to intervene.. 

I only used the OCD as you love to use it so much when talking of others. 

    Hello guest!

 

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1 hour ago, 4Jah2me said:

But it is the Devil's world, so should we expect anything different. 

Oh.... wrote an answer and lost it..... start again....

I totally agree with you.... so you win the bet.  Lol.    When I compare the developments in the world to the core knowledge we have - then my appreciation grows.

Yes, there are renegades among us who bring shame on us with their wickedness.  But were we not warned about the rocks in our love-feasts which we can stumble against?  

My life changed when I did an in-depth study of Islam (read Quran, some hadith and sirah)....... I thought through the social structures of Islam and its promises to rule the world...... and its laws...... It made me analyze society and what the future society under jehovah will look like.... in order to show the differences in Islam and Jehovahs government.  I also compared sharia law and Torah /talmud  with the self-sacrificing love and principles taught by the true messenger from God- jesus.

Atheists also have no moral compass for society to function well.  Good and bad is subjective to them - not objective.  We are all supposed to be equal under God. As society is slowly replacing God with post modern and other human philosophies,  we are seeing a regression of conditions in first world societies...... the incompatibility of the iron and clay..... 

The neo-communistic philosophies that have infiltrated western societies through the Frankfort school of thought (Marxism also wants to rule the world)  and its alliances with Islam in the west - this favours an undercurrent of clashes and in future.  The UN has already brought in strict laws against islamaphobia to maintain "peace and order "  and they will bring in further new society rules to accommodate  new identified minorities. 

So yes,  I do have a different kind of OCD than some of our friends. I revert back to appreciation of the CORE teachings of the bible that is so different to  a fast- regressing secular world.  The first things I learnt from the bible which gave me my first love for God. These radical new and secular developments give me a good sense of where we are in the stream of time. 

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11 minutes ago, Arauna said:

Oh.... wrote an answer and lost it..... start again....

I totally agree with you.... so you win the bet.  Lol.    When I compare the developments in the world to the core knowledge we have - then my appreciation grows.

Yes, there are renegades among us who bring shame on us with their wickedness.  But were we not warned about the rocks in our love-feasts which we can stumble against?  

My life changed when I did an in-depth study of Islam (read Quran, some hadith and sirah)....... I thought through the social structures of Islam and its promises to rule the world...... and its laws...... It made me analyze society and what the future society under jehovah will look like.... in order to show the differences in Islam and Jehovahs government.  I also compared sharia law and Torah /talmud  with the self-sacrificing love and principles taught by the true messenger from God- jesus.

Atheists also have no moral compass for society to function well.  Good and bad is subjective to them - not objective.  We are all supposed to be equal under God. As society is slowly replacing God with post modern and other human philosophies,  we are seeing a regression of conditions in first world societies...... the incompatibility of the iron and clay..... 

The neo-communistic philosophies that have infiltrated western societies through the Frankfort school of thought (Marxism also wants to rule the world)  and its alliances with Islam in the west - this favours an undercurrent of clashes and in future.  The UN has already brought in strict laws against islamaphobia to maintain "peace and order "  and they will bring in further new society rules to accommodate  new identified minorities. 

So yes,  I do have a different kind of OCD than some of our friends. I revert back to appreciation of the CORE teachings of the bible that is so different to  a fast- regressing secular world.  The first things I learnt from the bible which gave me my first love for God. These radical new and secular developments give me a good sense of where we are in the stream of time. 

I'm stunned. We have some sort of agreement here. 

But some of those 'core' teachings I knew when i was around ten years old and had never heard of JW's. 

We used to have a man in a van drive around our council estate. He was from Scripture Union. I would have discussions with him for many hours over the months.  I knew Jesus was not God. I knew the Trinity was rubbish.  I knew there was a hope for the future of a paradise earth. I don't know how I knew those things. 

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14 hours ago, Arauna said:

We are encouraged by GB to think about things (meditate/ analyze) .  Our maturity in spiritual things depend on ourselves - the organization cannot teach us  this. 

@Arauna  I agree with you here, but the problem arises when, on thinking of spiritual things and reading the scriptures privately, we then find ourselves in disagreement with the teachings of the the GB  / JW Org. 

I have always been encouraged to pray for guidance of holy spirit and read the scriptures. But I do find that on reasoning on the scriptures, I have been troubled by the way the GB / JW Org have dealt with and are dealing with things. 

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31 minutes ago, 4Jah2me said:

have always been encouraged to pray for guidance of holy spirit a

I do the same.. You will notice that I do have my own opinions on some things.... which comes from meditation......  .  I  will of course not go and teach this to others.  I teach the basic core teachings to my studies and help them to appreciate that they must do self study for maturity...  I also prepare them for their time as a witness when they will see that everyone is not perfect....... they may even bump their toe on a rock below the surface of the love-feasts..

Most new witnesses face a test with fellow witnesses after baptism -  or a new congregations - it is inevitable..... just depends on how big the test is.  I also help them to get life-skills as a witness.  Some did not learn this while at home or had too many bumps in life.  The qualities to survive and the attitudes that assist in cooperating with others and being kind and fitting in.

The realit y is: we are social animals and want to fit in , be successful in the group and it is hard on some people- especially if one has some weird personality quirks..... Navigating life - no matter where you go - is hard.  For us the workplace can be a specially hard because people expect us to be "better" than others...... when we are just ordinary people like everyone else..... The only difference is that we try to be faithful to god........ to the best of our very imperfect ability. Sometimes we must face ridicule for that...so as ordinary people we have to build up courage and work on our social skills to navigate out of difficult situations.

I have a very friendly personality and stand out easily..... as a woman this is not always a good thing.  So I have learnt to be smart and gauge the right time to say what I think.  Last year I went to see two Arabic brothers and spoke to them about their attitudes towards women..... because Arabs have an inbred attitude which the truth does not completely correct.... years and years of training in a certain way is not just going to disappear.  I waited for the right time and managed to do it successfully....   did they take my concerns to heart?   I do not know....  but I seemed to do OK afterward.  As I grew older I learnt to not keep quiet about my concerns....... but wait for a long time until the time is right and then talk.  Every time I was successful, I grew in maturity.  Now I help the young sisters to also grow strong and become pillars in the congregation. 

 

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JW organization consider self to be Christians. I would suggest, if you don't mind, to reconsider what is or should be basic in Jesus'teachings. I guess how main foundation of Christianity and therefore for JW's, can be found in two famous verses as Jesus' respond or answer on question: Which is greatest command? 

Love should be main teaching, main doctrine of religion that want prove self as to be "only true". Why? Because "knowledge" as product of Bible interpretations that makes distinctions between various religions, and constant tries to prove how member of another church is wrong about some issue, will not help no one.

Religious "knowledge" brings people to problems. "True knowledge" or "Error knowledge" or "Brighter knowledge" or "Clarified knowledge" and so on .... But knowledge puffs up while love builds up. - 1 Cor 8

 

34 “A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. 35 By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another.” - John 13

All our talking and litanies and outwitting (outsmarting) is vain work. What will count is how we treat each other, and not how smart we can be to win in discussion.  :)))

 

One of main positive way how to love people around you is not going to war for reasons because of many wars are started, for sure, but it is also  crucial to defend people who are under attack. How to accomplish these two?

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32 minutes ago, Srecko Sostar said:

One of main positive way how to love people around you is not going to war for reasons because of many wars are started, for sure, but it is also  crucial to defend people who are under attack. How to accomplish these two?

Witnesses have never actually taught pacifism. So using violence in our own self-defense or in the defense of our loved ones is not forbidden. But taking sides in a nationalistic war is surely being a part of the world, and its desires. Christianity is based on the premise that very few will actually try to be true to all the loving principles highlighted in the Bible. Christianity finally fulfills the most important parts of the Law, including "you must not kill." But since true Christians are in a minority, there will always be plenty of less faithful Christians (and others) to fight these wars.

Let's say that India wants to go to war with Australia. True Christians, I expect, would hardly be a factor. India's military would lose no more than 1 percent of their potential defense to true Christians, and Australia would lose no more than 1 percent. This is absolutely no factor at all in the outcome of the war. (Which would no doubt become a proxy war for the largest superpowers who will ally themselves with each side anyway.)

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10 hours ago, JW Insider said:

Witnesses have never actually taught pacifism.

There is often a difference between what is believed, and what is taught.

My was a Navy nurse during WWII, and working in Philadelphia hospitals, seeing men come back mangled and torn apart, and forever ruined, and dying, made her become a pacifist.  She finished her enlistment, however.  Years later, she saw a "Let God Be True" book on a neighbor's end table, and to my blessing and hers, she asked her neighbor if she could read it.

I was taught the Truth from an early age from my pacifist Mother who was in addition to being a devout Witness, a devout pacifist.

So ... "Stuff Happens" like that all the time, and later, when I went to the U.S. Selective Service Draft Board, I was still confused about what my role should be  ... but I knew that the issue was NEUTRALITY, NOT pacifism, because by them, I had learned that pacifism was a bogus philosophy for cartoons, much like our cartoons of all animals in the New System frolicking and eating straw.

More later ....

 

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1 hour ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

There is often a difference between what is believed, and what is taught.

The focus on only supporting future wars to be led by Christ Jesus directly, has promoted the idea that we really are expected to be pacifists. Also the idea that we focus ONLY on spiritual warfare leads to the same conclusion. As late as 2003, a convention talk mentioned this:

*** w03 1/15 p. 26 “Zealous Kingdom Proclaimers” Joyfully Assemble ***
The second speaker in this symposium addressed questions relating to neutrality. Early Christians were not pacifists, but they recognized that their prime allegiance was to God. Likewise today, Jehovah’s Witnesses hold firmly to the principle: “You are no part of the world.” (John 15:19) Since tests of our neutrality can arise quickly, families ought to make time to review the Bible’s guidelines on this subject.

Generally, however, the impression is given that we are very much like pacifists but don't want the label because it's often associated with protestors and radicals. However, the farther back one searches in the publications, the more we see that the discussion could include acceptable self-defense.

*** w64 8/15 p. 484 Those Who Pursue Peace ***
Actually, Jehovah’s witnesses are not in “rebellion” against the activities of any government, but they do maintain uncompromising neutrality as to the world’s political and military affairs, as they follow the Scriptural injunction to ‘seek peace and pursue it.’ They are not pacifists. They do not oppose any government’s program of military conscription or demonstrate against it, but they submit themselves to God’s arrangement of things.

*** w55 8/1 p. 478 Questions From Readers ***
However, this refusal to pay back insult for insult does not mean Christians are to be pacifists or that they must never resort to self-defense.

 

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33 minutes ago, JW Insider said:

Christ Jesus directly, has promoted the idea that we really are expected to be pacifists.

Don't agree.  We are ambassadors or emissaries for the  kingdom of Jehovah under Jesus.

What does an emissary do?  He is 'Actively' promoting his own government and loyal to his own government while remaining  neutral in the affairs of the foreign government.

We are active, very active doing ambassadorial work - not passive.

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29 minutes ago, JW Insider said:

*** w55 8/1 p. 478 Questions From Readers ***
However, this refusal to pay back insult for insult does not mean Christians are to be pacifists or that they must never resort to self-defense.

 

That is why we can see how JW security guards (ms and elders) was used as peacekeepers and/or bouncers in some videos.

If some hooligans or organized mob go to attack KH and people in it, would fighting back be in harmony to Bible principles and self-defense interpretations?

If some soldiers go to attack your village or town, would fighting back be according to Bible principles and self-defense interpretations? 

Self-defense in WT magazine didn't explain much. Because what is self-defense?  Yelling and waving with hands? If someone want to use self-defense he/she have to know how to do it!  Looking videos on that subject, going to courses and lot of practice, than you can do it properly to defend self or other who need help. Otherwise ....do not go in conflict with one who is prepared for conflict.

50 minutes ago, JW Insider said:

The focus on only supporting future wars to be led by Christ Jesus directly, has promoted the idea that we really are expected to be pacifists

@Arauna I think how you didn't read carefully what was written. JW Insider didn't said how Jesus promoted idea, BUT HOW FOCUS on only supporting future wars to be led by Christ Jesus directly, has promoted the idea. WHO making this sort of FOCUS? WT publications making focus on preaching service and to stay still (be neutral) in human wars.

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13 minutes ago, Srecko Sostar said:

think how you didn't read carefully 

Apologies dear - no prob.  I just butted in that we are not pacifist..... lol.   Did not mean to mess up thread.

5 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

JW organization consider self to be Christians.

To understand the randsom sacrifice is crucial - that jesus gave his soul in death for 3 days.  Not love but self-sacrificing love as set in the example of jesus. 

If I love you more than myself (prepared to give my life) and you live me more than yourself (prepared to give your life) the world will be a different place. Alas !  We will all show this kind of love completely  under futurekingdom of Christ.

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5 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

 If some hooligans or organized mob go to attack KH and people in it, would fighting back be in harmony to Bible principles and self-defense interpretations?

If some soldiers go to attack your village or town, would fighting back be according to Bible principles and self-defense interpretations? 

I see no problem in the two instances you mention responding with lethal force, in the defense of ANY "innocent" people.

Plus, realizing that an incompetent defense is no defense at all, being a professional victim is something I try to avoid.

Just a a carpenter has to be skilled in his craft, sometimes taking many years to learn, piece by piece, and trial-and-error ... and have the proper tools, and be able to use them.

Luke 22:36

The Apostles, as all Galilean men, customarily carried swords, and at least TWO of the Apostles at the "Last Supper", and first Memorial, were armed WITH THEIR OWN PERSONAL SWORDS ... which they had in the room with them already, having taken them off to sit down and have dinner, and enjoy their Meeting, as was the custom at the dinner table back then.

We all die.

Cowards die a thousand deaths ... the valiant ...  only once.

 

 

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      You may of course comment as to what you feel would make for good spiritual progress within the JW Org too. 
    • By 4Jah2me
      Point 1. I really do laugh at this term "Only game in town"   As I've said before the JEWISH RELIGIOUS LEADERS would have said that serving God by obeying THEM and the Mosaic Law, was the only game in town. Jesus however proved those Religious leaders to be wrong. Jesus and his disciples carried over the good points of the Mosaic Law and discarded the bits no longer needed. (Such as animal sacrifices, circumcision etc). 
      Russell & Co came out of former religions. I presume they must have carried over some good points from those former religions, then made adjustments or changed doctrines.
      So why would it not be possible for people that have left the JW Org to form a new religion ?  Carrying over the good and disposing of the bad, of which there seems to be plenty....
      I'm not saying it will happen but it does dispose of this idea of 'the only game in town' brainwashing. JW's seem to be taught that there cannot be anything else ever. What if Russell had believed that, the Bible Students would have never been formed. 
      Point 2.  The 'Truth' / JW Org.
      As I read more and more on here I am finding out that the Governing Body / Writing Dept'  / Legal Dept' et al,  have deliberately told many lies.
      The latest I'm reading (on a new topic on here) but the info stems back a while, seems to contain information whereby the 'Org' / those in charge at the time, implied, that children cannot get baptised, and that blood transfusions were acceptable to the Organisation. It seems that this was written in order to get favours from a certain government. 
      Both of those things are lies but seem to be deliberately used for some form of dishonest gain.
      Then of course we have lawyers telling lies in court about shunning. 
      And C.S.A court cases have proved that elders and others have deliberately lied. And the American 'section' of the JW Org deliberately withholding information regarding such matters.
      Link this to misuse of scriptures, such as, Superior Authorities, which deliberately took away people's conscience / freedom of choice, in WW2.
      And I'm sure people here can come up with lots more examples of lies, deliberate wrongdoing, mistakes, misinterpretations, 'new light' corrections et al.
      Why am i writing all this ?  Well I am proving two points. 
      1. If it's your 'only game in town' then it's not a good one. 
      2. That calling it 'The Truth' is totally deceptive.
      I do not think you would like it if I gave you a meal that was three quarters yummy, but a quarter poison. The poison might well contaminate the good food !
      So, saying that the Org / GB are three quarters right does not help. 
       
       
       
       
    • By JayDubya
      They are digging their own grave.  This is not spiritual warfare.  This is a lie.  
    • By JOHN BUTLER
      I do find it kinda' funny that JW's love to talk about billions of people being removed / destroyed / killed / murdered at Armageddon. Billions of people.
      And for what ? Well JW's say it's for not serving God. But they will also say it's for not being a baptised JW. 
      Well we do know for sure that God either deliberately had, or deliberately allowed, the destruction of Jerusalem in circa 70 C E, and for what ? 
      Well the Bible shows us it was for not serving God properly, and for killing God's son. 
      BUT when I suggest that the Governing Body should be removed or destroyed, oh dear, the JW's they get really upset ya know. 
      Governing Body = 8 men.   Jerusalem = how many, men, women and children, thousands of them. 
      But oh dear, now it would be murder. So what was it back then ?  Your see JW's live in a dream world, wrapped up in cotton wool, they just cannot face the real world.
      The Governing Body do not serve God properly. That is clearly visible to anyone that honestly wants to see it. 
      The Governing Body are destroying JW Org, and if JW Org is God's true Organisation then the GB are deliberately working against God and against God's intentions. 
      Humans that deliberately work against God and cause problems for God do not last long on this Earth. 
      The Bible shows much proof of this, such as those that opposed Moses. 
      I am expecting the GB to be removed, one way or another. But only if God really wants to use the JW Org / Watchtower soc for His own purposes. 
      If God does not want to use those Orgs then it would seem sensible for God to set up a new Org for His purposes. 
      The only problem with the GB being 'removed' is that JW's will call it a 'sign of the times' and 'persecution', but if God causes the removal then I'm sure He will put them straight. 
      Those people that say that the GB cannot be removed / destroyed, are those people that worship the GB. And those people that worship the GB may probably need removing too. 
      The world is wicked, it belongs to Satan. The Earth is wonderful and it belongs to Almighty God.
      For God to save this Earth and for Him to save a few humans too, drastic things have to take place. Drastic things have to take place.
       
    • By Witness
      Not long ago, Gerrit Losch asked, “So, whom do you trust?  You fully trust Jehovah, Jesus and the faithful slave.”  “Do you trust me?  I hope so.”  He quoted, Prov 14:15:
      “The naive person believes every word.  But the shrewd one ponders each step.” 
      The leaders of the organization teach that it is God’s organization. This would mean all instructions, all teachings, would come from God. So, we could surmise that all teachings are trustworthy, that JWs could thoroughly expect their leaders in charge, to tell them the truth as Losch expressed above - truth spoken at all times.  
      JWs, you are told that you hear God’s promises when you listen to what the organization teaches you. You are told you love the organization because it teaches you “wonderful truths”. You are admonished to do what the organization wants you to do, because it is God’s proactive organization, always guiding you for your benefit, with your best interests at heart. Isa 48:17,18
      However, since your anointed leaders claim not to be inspired by Holy Spirit, how can you trust their teachings as beneficial and coming from God? (1 John 2:27; Rom 5:5) (1 Cor 12:4,7; Heb 2:4)
      We’re talking about a multi-million-dollar organization in the earthly spiritual realm that promises to guide you to salvation. (Phil 3:19; Rom 1:25) That’s a big deal! Millions of people depend on it, to lead them in truth; since without truth, we cannot be saved. John 8:32;14:6
      Ask yourself, how can it be done without its leaders’ inspiration from Holy Spirit? On a wing and a prayer, as the saying goes? What leads them, what motivates them, if their hearts are not inspired with truth from Christ? (John 16:13; 2 Pet 3:18) (1 John 4:1; 2 Pet 2:1; Rev 8:11;13:15; 16:13,14)
      I have heard 1 Cor 13:8 used by one of the GB members, as the reason for lack of inspiration among the organization’s leaders:
      “Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will be done away with. Where there are various languages, they will cease. Where there is knowledge, it will be done away with.”
      Has knowledge vanished away during these last days? No. Then, why would prophesy cease? Dan 12:4; Rev 11:1-3
      Consider verse 9,10: 9 "For we know in part, and we prophesy in part; 10 but when that which is complete has come, then that which is partial will be done away with. "
      “That which is complete” has not arrived; thus, prophesy as well as knowledge, has not ceased. John 16:13
      (Consider “Has Prophesy Ceased?”  4womaninthewilderness, Pearl Doxsey) 
      What if, you found a teaching in the history files (there are several, and easy to find) that wasn’t trustworthy; that is, it couldn’t be applied today since it was replaced with another teaching? And, this teaching affected the promise of salvation for thousands of people? Many may have died under that false teaching, going to their grave believing simply, a lie. Would this be any different than a Catholic going to his grave believing in the trinity? A lie is a lie. God or Jesus would not be responsible for the organization giving you faulty instructions, that later had to be scrapped. It falls on the shoulders of men. Isa 2:22 We must admit that it is an abnormal relationship of a spirit inspired organization (“spirit-directed”), to be led by uninspired leaders. John 3:21; 1 John 1:6; Rev 13:11,12,15
      I think you’ll agree that we would never receive bad advice or direction from the Father, because He truly has our best interests at heart. Jer 29:11 So much so, that we received warning from Jesus of false “christs”, false prophets who would come on the scene in the last days to deceive “even the elect”. Matt 24:22-25 Now, the “elect” are the anointed ones, where the majority are gathered presently in the organization. Rev 20:7-9 Would they, as a group, be deceived by false prophets in “Christendom” if they are baptized JWs? Would they, as a group, be 'conquered' spiritually by any false prophets in the world when they are already JWs? Rev 13:7; 9:1-4
      The Bible speaks of an anointed “remnant” coming out of “Babylon”. Zech 2:6,7; Matt 24:15,16; Rev 18:4; 12:14,6 If that remnant is the anointed in the organization that have escaped Babylon, as your leaders teach you, this would indicate there are numerous anointed ones in Christendom who never entered the organization. Do you believe this, JWs?
      The anointed are a remnant, the last group of the “woman’s seed” to face Satan’s final test before the Kingdom arrives. Rev 12:4,15,17 This test is called the “Great Tribulation”. Jer 30:5-7; Matt 24:21,22; Rev 3:10 Deceit is at its helm, since it is Satan’s greatest, most powerful tool to use against God’s people. 2 Thess 2:3,4,9-12
      The Great Tribulation is a spiritual assault by Satan upon the remnant (Rev 12:17; 20:8-10; 16:13-16; 1 Tim 4:1; Luke 21:20-22)
      through the greatest Army that has ever existed [Rev 13:1,4; 11:2; 9:7,10; Luke 22:31; 21:20-22,24; Mark 13:14 – (Num 18:7); Matt 24:15,16]
      It has a deceptive priestly - princely veneer (Jer 7:4,8; Ezek 44:6-9; Rev 9:7; Nahum 3:17) of divine inspiration*** and approval, through endorsement by the false prophet's lying spirit, not by God's spirit! (Rev 13:14,15; 19:20) (Rev 2:2; 2 Cor 11:13-15; 2 Tim 3:5,13; Matt 7:15; 1 Tim 4:1; Rev 16:14,13,15; 19:20; Matt 24:24,25; Rev 13:15--***"breath" -John 2:22).  Pearl Doxsey, “The Great Tribulation, What and Why?” 
       
      DECEIT. How do we conquer deceit? By examining each teaching offered by an anointed one, and comparing it to God’s standards through Jesus Christ - to determine if it is true. Matt 7:20; John 15:5 As humans adjusting our spiritual beliefs, we may easily settle for what feels good, but not always for what is right. This last test is one that should purge our minds and hearts of falsehoods, but not all will submit to God’s pure standards of truth. Dan 12:10; Ps 66:10-12; Mal 3:2-4   Not all will be among the “remnant” to “come out of her, my people”. Rev 18:4-8
      Will you?  Or, are you the naive one who believes every word that comes from leaders who are not "inspired" by the truth of Christ?
       
      Praise Yah!
      I will extol YHVH with all my heart
      in the council of the upright and in the assembly.
      2 Great are the works of YHVH;
      they are pondered by all who delight in them.
      3 Glorious and majestic are His deeds,
      and His righteousness endures forever.
      4 He has caused His wonders to be remembered;
      YHVH is gracious and compassionate.
      5 He provides food for those who fear Him;
      He remembers His covenant forever.
      6 He has shown his people the power of His works,
      giving them the lands of other nations.
      7 The works of His hands are faithful and just;
      all His precepts are trustworthy.
      8 They are established for ever and ever,
      enacted in faithfulness and uprightness.
      9 He provided redemption for His people;
      he ordained His covenant forever—
      holy and awesome is His name.
      10 The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom;
      all who follow His precepts have good understanding.
      To Him belongs eternal praise.
      Psalm 111
       

    • By JOHN BUTLER
      I find it interesting when so much is compared between the Jews and the JW's.
      But in my opinion, one big difference between being a Jew before and in the time of Jesus, and being a JW, is choice. 
      If a person was born into the Nation of Israel, they were born under Law and ruled over by the Religious leaders (and the Romans) at that time. There was no choice of being a Jew or not being a Jew. They were born into it. So of course many of them, probably all of them, committed 'sin' and had to make sin offerings. God had chosen that Nation, those people had responsibility but not of their choice. 
      Now, people that enter the JW religion do so voluntarily.  ( Unfortunately for those born into it, they have to go through the motions of serving the JW Org until they are of an age whereby they can leave home. Then, when of age they too can volunteer to be a JW or chose to leave the Org.). 
      There is a big difference from being born into a Nation which you may not like, than voluntarily joining a religion which you do like.
      So the big question is, if 'millions' of people voluntarily join this JW Org, why do so many commit child abuse, adultery and many other sins ? 
      If this is supposed to be 'THE true religion', why are the people not guided by God through Jesus  Christ ?  Just reading comments on here from so called JW's makes me laugh. There is no love, no mercy, no understanding, no respect even. 
      Being an ex JW and seeing things from both sides i have found more genuine love, kindness, friendship, respect, warmth, understanding etc outside of the Org than inside. Inside the Org people have to be told to 'love one another', outside the Org people do it anyway. 
      It has amazed me how JW's can really believe that God is with them when they are so cold and selfish.
      With the Jews that were born into that Nation, they had no choice about their way of life. It was basically a dictatorship by God. The Laws were from 'above'. Obviously for the right reason, to bring forth Jesus Christ who in turn would 'rescue' the human race from complete destruction. But it was a totally different situation to the JW Org today.
      So now all you 'JWs', think on it. Do you truly believe you are in this' special environment' within the Org ? Do you really think that your Org has God's approval ? 
      Think deeply about all the problems within JW Org. All the disgusting things being done voluntarily by all the volunteer JW's. 
      Now ask yourself, are you really a volunteer JW or are you trapped in the Org for fear of losing all those 'so called friends' ? 
      You know that you can only have your family and 'friends' as long as you are a JW.   Do you feel like the Jews must have felt, trapped in that Nation ? 
      As we know many of the Jews left the Jewish religion and way of life to follow Christ, but it was difficult for them. However, they did have God's approval and God, through Christ made this known clearly. And it seems that many are leaving the JW Org to seek God's approval too. 
      But remember that all JW's are volunteers, or should be, so why oh why is there so much trouble in that Org ? 
       
    • By JOHN BUTLER
      Having read lots of comments on this forum it is very easy to see that all that Jehovah's Witnesses have is their belief in their Governing Body and it's Writing Department. 
      If they believe, as a certain cowboy would have it, that a person can gain no true knowledge from the bible itself, then how else does a person gain true knowledge ? 
      It would seem that Jehovah's Witnesses rely totally on their GB 'boses' and on the Writing Department of same, to tell all JW's what to believe and when to believe it. 
      Why do i say 'and when to believe it' ?  Well you have to keep up you know . What is said to be 'truth' by the GB and co one day,  will be said to be totally untrue the next day or week.
      JW's have nothing, no proof of any 'enlightenment' from above. They talk proudly about having 8.5 million members earthwide, but how many Muslims are there earthwide ? How many Catholics earthwide ?  Numbers prove nothing as it can be clearly seen. 
      Yes I was once fooled by all the 'niceness' of a few brothers and sisters. But once I got to know those people properly I soon found out that they are no better than people in the world. 
      The JW Org is no better than any other organisation that pretends to serve God, but the JW Org is in some ways more dangerous.  It wraps itself around people's lives and restricts people's freedom of thinking. It pretends to have 'special knowledge' from God that no other organisation has.
      But then if one looks closely one can see it is all just a smoke screen. The JW Org only has 8 men in America dominating it, and 8.5 million people worshiping those 8 men. 
      I do feel a bit foolish having wasted years of my life believing all of it's lies and deceit, but I congratulate myself for not being frightened to ask questions and do research for myself. 
      No matter what any Jehovah's Witness tells you, the truth is, all they have is a belief in their GB, and they follow their GB's orders via all the others in charge including the puppet men Elders. 
      At meetings, conventions, assemblies, on the ministry et al, all they do is use the literature provided for them by the GB and the Writing dept. Without question they pump this 'information' into other people. When conducting a supposed 'bible study' it is actually a book study, studying the words of the GB / writing dept, not studying God's written word properly. They spend more time reading the paragraphs and answering those questions than they do reading scriptures and focusing on God's words.
      It is a horrid way of brainwashing people, washing out the common sense and replacing it with lies from the GB / writing dept. Dictating, giving orders and pretending it is God's will. 
      Removing the love that people have for one another and replacing it with discrimination. Shunning family members, turning their back on anyone that is not a JW by saying all other people are just 'part of the world' and therefore wicked. 
      Frightening people with threats of 'armageddon' killing them. 
      And now it seems that they are almost begging for contributions as they seem to be getting short of money. Well paying off millions in compensation for the Child Abuse / Pedophilea of course. Selling off Kingdom Halls too as funds run low. 
      Oh how low that religion has sunken. Are they really stupid enough to believe that God is with them ?  
       
    • Guest Nicole
      By Guest Nicole
      What is one way that true Christians are different from members of false religions? We “speak the truth.” (Read Zechariah 8:16, 17.) Paul said: “We recommend ourselves as God’s ministers, . . . by truthful speech.” (2 Corinthians 6:4, 7) And Jesus said that people speak “out of the heart’s abundance.” (Luke 6:45) This means that an honest person will tell the truth. He will tell the truth to strangers, coworkers, friends, and loved ones. Let us discuss some examples of how we can show that we are trying to be honest in all things.
       If you are a young person, you may want your peers to accept you. Yet because of this desire, some young people are living a double life. They pretend to be morally clean when they are with their family and the congregation but are completely different when they are on social media or with people who do not serve Jehovah. They may use bad language, wear immodest clothes, listen to music with unclean lyrics, get drunk, use drugs, date secretly, or do other bad things. They are lying to their parents, to their brothers and sisters, and to Jehovah. (Psalm 26:4, 5) But Jehovah knows when we claim to honor him and then do things he hates. (Mark 7:6) It is so much better to do what the proverb says: “Let your heart not envy sinners, but be in the fear of Jehovah all day long.”—Proverbs 23:17.

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    • By Bible Speaks
      How did you learn the Truth? 
      I was raised in the Truth. ?

    • By Jesus.defender
      Did Jesus really say He was God?
      That’s exactly how Jesus’ original audience seemed to take it when He said, “I and the Father are one.” In fact, the Jews were ready to kill Him right there! Why? “Because you,” they said, “a mere man, claim to be God” (John 10:33).
      On another occasion, He used the personal name of Israel’s God–the name revealed to Moses (Exodus 3:14)–to refer to Himself. And He even used the Torah for context, so no one would misunderstand Him: “Before Abraham was, I AM” (John 8:58). This would be about wild as telling a Muslim, “I am your God, Allah.” Don’t try that in Saudi Arabia! It’s no wonder the Jews tried to stone Him to death. That was the exact penalty for blasphemy under the Jewish legal system. It was pretty clear to everyone there  that He was saying, “I am Israel’s God.”

      Why Jesus is God? The Apostle Thomas called Jesus God.John 20:27-29: 2. The Apostle Peter called Jesus God.2 Peter 1:1: 3.The Apostle John called Jesus God.John 1:1-3, 4.God the Father called Jesus God.Hebrews 1:8: 5. God the Father called Jesus God. 6.Isaiah the Prophet said the Messiah would be God.Isaiah 9:67. The Jews who crucified Jesus understood Him to be saying that He was equal with God.John 5:18: 8.Jesus called Himself "I AM", the Old Testament name for God (Exodus 3:14).John 8:58-59. 9.Jesus calls Himself "the Alpha and Omega," the title of Almighty God.Revelation 22:12-13. 10. Like God (Gen. 1:1) Jesus created.Colossians 1:16-1711. Like God, Jesus forgives sin.Mark 2:5-7, 10-11:12. Like God, Jesus gives eternal life.John 10:27-28: 13. Like God, Jesus received, receives and will receive worship.Matthew 14:32-33. 14. Jesus said that only God was good; and Jesus was good. John 10:11: "I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd gives His life for the sheep."John 10:11: "I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd gives His life for the sheep."Jesus was as good as they come. He was "sinless," "holy," "righteous," "innocent," "undefiled," and "separate from sinners." (Hebrews 7:26) That's pretty good! 15. Like God, Jesus can be present in more than one place at the same time.Matthew 18:20: 16. One of Jesus' titles is "God with us."Matthew 1:23. 17. Jesus' blood is called God's blood.Acts 20:28: 18. Jesus has the same nature as God.Hebrews 1:3a: 19. Jesus spoke as God.Jesus did not speak as one of God's prophets: "thus says the Lord," but as God: "I say to you."Matthew 5:27-29. 20. Like God (Psalm 136:3), Jesus is called the Lord of Lords and King of kings.Revelation 17:14. And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for his only son, and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn. ( WHEN WAS GOD PIERCED? ). And he shall pass through Judah; he shall overflow and go over, he shall reach even to the neck; and the stretching out of his wings shall fill the breadth of thy land, O Immanuel (means God Among Us). 
      John 1:1, "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."
      John 1:14, "And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father, full of grace and truth."
      John 8:58 "Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am." Crossreference with Exodus 3:14 "And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you."
      John 10:33 "The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God."
      John 20:28 "And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God."
      Collossians 2:9 "For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily."
      Hebrews 1:8 "But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: "
      Matthew 4:10 "Then saith Jesus unto him, Get thee hence, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve." Crossreference with Matthew 2:2, Matthew 2:11, Matthew 28:9.
      Isaiah 44:6 "Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God." Crossreference with Revelation 1:17 "And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last: I am he." and Revelation 1:8 "I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty."
      2Peter. Jehovah The Father appears.
      John 1. Jehovah the son.
      John 8:58 Jesus identifies Himself as Jehovah "I Am"
      Acts 5. Jehovah the Holy Spirit identified.
    • By Jesus.defender
      BOTH the FATHER and the SON HAVE the SAME 119 ATTRIBUTES, CLAIMS and MAJESTY.
      ‘I am Jehovah - that is my name: and my glory will I not give to another.’ (Isaiah 62:8).
      The glory of these 119 attributes are jointly owned by the Father and the Son, and nobody else.
      Jesus Christ is Jehovah God, equally with the Father, because both the Father and Son alone
      have the following attributes:
      1. both are to be honoured equally (John 5:23)
      2. both are the I AM (Exodus 3:14-15; John 8:24,58)
      3. both are the Mighty God (Isaiah 10:20,21; Jer 32:18; Psalm 50:1; Isaiah 9:6; Gen 49:24)
      4. both own the same throne (Psalm 45:6,7; Hebrews 1:8; Revelation 22:1,3)
      5. both accept worship (Exodus 34:14; I Chronicles 16:29; Hebrews 1:6; Matthew 28:9)
      6. both laid the foundation of the earth (Psalm 102:24-27; Isaiah 48:13; Hebrews 1:10-12)
      7. One God has created mankind (Mal. 2:10; Prov. 16:4; Isaiah 44:24; Col 1:16; John 1:3)
      8. both are the Shepherd (Psalm 80;1; Gen 49:24; John 10:11; Hebrews 13:20; I Peter 5:4)
      9. both are from Everlasting (Psalm 90:2; Habakkuk 1:12; Micah 5:2; Hebrews 7:3).
      10. both are the First and Last (Isaiah 44:6; Revelation 1:17,18; Rev. 2:8; See p.54).)
      11. both are the Alpha and Omega (Revelation 1:8; 21:5-7; 22:13-16; See p.54)
      12. both come and Reward (Isaiah 40:10; 62:11; Revelation 22:12)
      13. both are unchangeable (Malachi 3:6: Hebrews 13:8)
      14. both have unsearchable riches (Romans 11:33; Ephesians 3:8)
      15. both are the Holy One (Isaiah 43:15; Acts 3:14)
      16. both are omnipresent and fill all things (Psalm 139:7; Jer. 23:24; Eph. 4:10; John 3:13)
      17. both are omniscient (Psalm 147:5; Prov. 14:3; John 21:17; John 16:30; Colossians 2:3)
      18. both are omnipotent (Genesis 17:1; Matthew 28:18; Hebrews 1:3)
      19. both are eternal (Deuteronomy 33:27; Hebrews 7:3; Micah 5:2)
      20. both own the everlasting Kingdom (Psalm 145:13; Daniel 7:14; II Peter 1:11)
      21. both are Lord of all (Psalm 103:19; Matthew 11:25; Acts 10:36)
      22. both are the only Saviour (Isaiah 43:11; Titus 1:3,4; Philippians 3:20; II Peter 1:1; 3:18; Luke 2:11; Hebrews 5:9; Acts 4:12)
      23. both are the Truth (Deuteronomy 32:4; John 14:6)
      24. both are sinless (Deuteronomy 32:4; Hebrews 4:15)
      25. both are in the beginning (Genesis 1:1; John 1:1)
      26. both God and the Son are the Judge (Psalm 82:8; John 5:22), but the Father is not the Judge (John 5:22 ‘The Father judgeth no man’).
      27. both are our Hope (Psalm 39:7; I Timothy 1:1)
      28. both shelter believers under their wings (Psalm 91:2,4; Matthew 23:37)
      29. both are our Redeemer (Psalm 130:7,8; Isaiah 44:6; Galatians 3:13; Titus 2:14)
      30. the glory of both was seen by Isaiah (Isaiah 6:3,5; John 12:41)
      31. both are the Rock (Deuteronomy 32:3,4,18; Psalm 18:31; I Corinthians 10:4)
      32. both are to be looked to for salvation (Isaiah 45:22; John 1:29; John 6:40)
      33. to both shall every knee bow and every tongue confess (Isaiah 45:23; Philippians 2:10; Romans 14:10,11)
      34. the enemies of both shall perish (Psalm 92:9; Philippians 3:18,19)
      35. both send the Holy Spirit (Joel 2:28; John 16:7)
      36. to both shall all men come (Psalm 65:2; Isaiah 45:24; John 12:32)
      37. both forgive sins (Exodus 34:7; Mark 2:5,7; Colossians 3:13)
      38. both blot out sin (Isaiah 43:25; Hebrews 1:3; I John 1:7)
      39. both still storms (Psalm 107:29; Matthew 8:26)
      40. both own the Holy Spirit (Matthew 10:20; Romans 8:9)
      41. both seek the lost (Ezekiel 34:16; Luke 19:10)
      42. to both are applied 10 aspects of the Lord’s Prayer (Matthew 6:9-13; see page 954)
      43. both receive believers to glory (Psalm 73:24; John 14:3)
      44. both are our One Master (Malachi 1:6; Matthew 23:8,10)
      45. both are served by believers (Deuteronomy 10:20; Colossians 3:24)
      46. both lead believers to living waters (Psalm 23:2; Revelation 7:17)
      47. both correct believers (Proverbs 3:12; Revelation 3:19)
      48. both prepare a place for believers in heaven (Hebrews 11:16; John 14:2)
      49. both are all in all (I Corinthians 15:28; Colossians 3:11)
      50. both are known by believers (Galatians 4:9; Philippians 3:10; John 17:3)
      51. both are cleaved to by believers (Deuteronomy 10:20; John 15:4)
      52. both are the light of the world (Psalm 27:1; John 8:12)
      53. both are the Light of the New Jerusalem (Isaiah 60:19,20; Revelation 21:23)
      54. both give eternal life (Psalm 36:9; John 10:28)
      55. both are called ‘My Lord and my God’ (Psalm 35:22,23; John 20:28)
      56. both are our Righteousness (Isaiah 45:24; I Corinthians 1:30; Jeremiah 23:5,6)
      57. both have the same voice as of many waters (Ezekiel 43:2; Revelation 1:15)
      58. both are witnessed to by believers (Isaiah 43:10; Acts 1:8)
      59. both own the peace given to believers (Philippians 4:7; John 14:27)
      60. both own the gospel (I Thessalonians 2:2; Romans 1:16)
      61. both give saving grace (Titus 2:11; Acts 15:11)
      62. both are our peace (Judges 6:24; Ephesians 2:14)
      63. both are pierced and looked upon (Zechariah 12:10; John 19:37)
      64. both sanctify believers (Exodus 31:13; I Corinthians 6:11)
      65. both give victory to believers (Psalm 98:1; I Corinthians 15:57)
      66. both heal people (Exodus 15:26; Matthew 9:35)
      67. both equally own the churches (I Corinthians 15:9; Romans 16:16; I and II Thess. 1:1)
      68. both own the Kingdom (Matthew 6:33; Rev. 11:15).
      69. both are glorified by the Gentiles (Isaiah 24:15; II Thessalonians 1:12; Matthew 12:21)
      70. both own the Day of the Lord (Isaiah 13:6; Philippians 1:6; II Thessalonians 2:2)
      71. both give grace to believers (Romans 5:15; Colossians 1:6; II Cor. 8:9; Galatians 6:18)
      72. both own the same glory (Romans 5:2; II Corinthians 8:23)
      73. both own the same love (John 5:42; II Corinthians 5:14)
      74. both own the same Word (Psalm 119:11; I Thessalonians 2:13; Colossians 3:16)
      75. both own salvation (Luke 3:6; Jonah 2:9; Acts 4:12; II Timothy 2:10)
      76. both were served equally by Paul (Titus 1:1; Romans 1:1);and by James (James 1:1)
      77. both own the commandments (I John 5:3; John 14:15)
      78. both had their way prepared by John the Baptist (Isaiah 40;3; Mark 1:1-3)
      79. both search all hearts (Psalm 139:1; Revelation 2:23)
      80. both own the same flock (I Peter 5:2; John 21:15,16)
      81. both ascend on high, lead captivity captive, and give gifts to men (Psalm 68:17,18; Ephesians 4:7-10)
      82. both are like a Bridegroom (Isaiah 62:5; Mark 2:19,20)
      83. both receive the glory of God alone forever and ever (Isaiah 42:8; Galatians 1:4,5; I Peter 5:10,11; II Peter 3:18; Hebrews 13:21; I Peter 4:11; Revelation 1:5,6)
      84. both are the source of fruit (Hosea 14:8; John 15:5)
      85. both are our source of strength (Psalm 119:28; Philippians 4:13)
      86. both give rest for our souls (Jeremiah 6:16; Matthew 11:29)
      87. both shall appear at Christ’s return (Psalm 102:16; Zechariah 14:3,4,5; Titus 2:13)
      88. both will come to earth (Isaiah 40:10; Revelation 22:7,12,20)
      89. both are to be trusted in (Jeremiah 17:7; Ephesians 1:12; John 14:1)
      90. both are our King (Isaiah 6:5; 33:22; Revelation 17:14; 19:16; I Timothy 6:14,15)
      91. both will wound their enemies’ heads (Psalm 68:21; 110:6)
      92. both take vengeance (Romans 12:19; II Thessalonians 1:7,8)
      93. both will be opposed by the Antichrist’s armies (Isaiah 34:22; Revelation 19:19)
      94. both will fight against the Antichrist’s armies at Armageddon (Zechariah 14:3; Revelation 19:11,13,21)
      95. both will destroy death (Isaiah 25:8; II Timothy 1:10).
      96. both receive the faith of believers (I Thessalonians 1:8; Galatians 3:26)
      97. both are our life (Deuteronomy 30:20; Colossians 3:4)
      98. both are to be prayed to (Matthew 6:9; Acts 7:59)
      99. both raised up Christ (Acts 2:32; John 2:19,21)
      100.both own all of the other (John 16:15)
      101.both enter the east gate of Jerusalem (Ezekiel 44:1,2; Luke 19:37-45)
      102.the man on the throne in Ezekiel 1:26 is identified as the God of Israel in Ezek 10:20
      103.both names are placed on the same level in the baptism formula (Matthew 28:19)
      104.both fellowship equally with believers (I John 1:3).
      105.both comfort believers (Isaiah 66:13; Philippians 2:1).
      106.both receive doxologies of worship in heaven (Revelation 5:8-10; 5:11,12; 5:13,14).
      107.both jointly send grace and peace to the churches (Romans 1:7).
      108.both the love of the Father and love of the Son are an equal privilege given to us.(John 14:21)
      109.both jointly declare themselves to be Jehovah, “I am the first,& I am the last”(Isaiah 44:6)
      110.both come to his temple, ‘the Lord shall suddenly come to his temple.’(Malachi 3:1; Mat 21:13)
      111.both are the King of Israel (Isaiah 44:6; John 1:49).
      112. both can be blasphemed (God-Rom.2:24; HS-Luke 12:10; Christ-Luke 22:65; Acts 13:45; 18:5,6; 26:9,11)
      113.both are always with all believers (Matthew 28:20; 2 Corinthians 13:14).
      114.both are the one lawgiver (God-Rom.7:22; Christ-Gal.6:2; HS-Rom.8:2; James 4:12).
      115.both have the same face (Revelation 22:3,4)
      116.both have the same Name (Revelation 22:3,4)
      117.both own the same servants (Revelation 22:3)
      118.both are the Temple of the New Jerusalem (Revelation 21:22)
      119.Heavens are the work of thy hands (Psalm 102:24-27; Hebrews 1:10-12)

      Since both Jesus and the Father have these same attributes, both are Jehovah God.
      There are not 2 Gods, but One God in 3 persons. One who has these attributes must be God.
      The Lord’s Prayer is devoted to worshipping the Father. Jesus conceals His personal glory
      in this prayer as seen by other Scriptures which are just as true of Christ as the Lord’s Prayer
      is of the Father.
    • By JOHN BUTLER
      "All Scripture is inspired of God and beneficial for teaching, for reproving, for setting things straight, for disciplining in righteousness,"
      2 Timothy 3 v 16
      Was this in it's way a small prophecy ?                 
      The 2nd book of Timothy was written 65 C.E.  However 1,2,3, John and Revelation were written much later.
      So we have two points, 1. The writings were not complete when Paul wrote that information. 2, The Bible had not been constructed so no idea would have been formed as to what the Bible would contain. 
      Were there other writings ? Would they be considered as Scripture? 
      It seems that Paul was inspired to write that "All scripture is inspired.... " 
       
    • By Jesus.defender
      The Trinity and Bible Proofs that Jesus Christ is God
      1. Matthew 28:17-20 “they worshipped him”, “All power is given to me”, “I am with you always” and “baptizing them in the name (one God) of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost” = Trinity.
      2. In Matthew 3:1-3, Jesus Christ fulfils Isaiah 40:3 to ‘Prepare the way of Jehovah’ and our God.
      3. John 1:1 “the word was God” (KJV, NIV), not ‘a god’ (NWT). a) Isaiah 44:8 ‘Is there a God beside me?’ b) The absence of the article before “theos” (God) identifies “word” as the subject (Colwell’s rule)Ans855
      ‘The subject is identified by the article (ho logos) and the predicate (theos) without it.’ AT Robertson 5,4.
      John did not use the word for “Godlike or a lesser god” (theios) to describe Jesus, but used “theos” (God).
      All early writers disagree with JWs. (Irenaeus,Theophilus, Clement,Tertullian, Origen, Cyprian, Tatian).
      All modern Greek experts disagree with JWs. (Zodhiates, AT Robertson, Wuest, Vine, Vincent, Mantey)
      4. John 1:3 “All things were made by him” Malachi 2:10 “Hath not one God created us?” Jesus is Creator.
      5. John 3:13 “Son of man which is in heaven.” Jesus is omnipresent (on earth and in heaven at same time)
      6. John 4:42 “Christ, the Saviour of the world.” Isaiah 43:11 “Jehovah; beside me there is no saviour.”
      7. John 5:18 “said God was his Father, making himself equal with God”. John believed it and quoted it.
      8. John 5:23 “all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father” Do you honour the Son as God?
      9. John 6:46 “Not that any man hath seen the Father.” Who did OT saints see who they said was God?Is6:5
      10. John 8:24 “If ye believe not that I am, ye shall die in your sins.” Jehovah is “I am” in Exodus 3:1-14.
      11. John 8:58,59 “Before Abraham was, I am. They took up stones to cast at him.” Jesus said He is God.
      12. John 10:30 “I and my Father are One. They took up stones to stone him.” No stoning if agree with God.
      13. John 10:33 “thou being a man, makest thyself God. They sought again to take him (39)”. Why?
      14. John 16:15 “All things that the Father hath are mine:” All the Father’s attributes as God are Christ’s.
      15. John 17:5 “the glory which I had with thee before the world was.” Isaiah 42:8 “I am Jehovah: my glory will I not give to another.” Jesus is Jehovah because he alone shares Jehovah’s exclusive glory.
      16. John 20:28 “Thomas said unto him (Jesus), My Lord and my God.” No rebuke for blasphemy or error.
      17. Acts 20:28 “Feed the church of God, which he (God) hath purchased with his own blood.” Jesus =God
      18. I Cor. 1:2 “all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ.” Prayer to Jesus makes him God.
      19. I Corinthians 15:47 ‘the second man is the Lord from heaven’ This is Jesus. No man is from heaven.
      20. II Corinthians 13:14 is the Apostolic Benediction:“The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the communion of the Holy Ghost, be with you all. Amen.” (II Corinthians 13:14).
      Why is there a change in the order of the persons of the Trinity, compared to Matthew 28:19, if not to show that in this Trinity none is before or after the other, and none is better than another?
      21. Philippians 2:6 “Who being in the form of God (in His pre-incarnate state Christ had the form of God) thought it not robbery to be equal with God.” (a prize to be held on to, not a prize to be won. AT Robertson).
      22. Colossians 2:9 “In him (Christ) dwells all the fullness (exhausts the limits) of the Godhead bodily.”
      23. I Thes 4:14 “them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.” Jesus returns as God at rapture.
      24. I Timothy 3:16 “God was manifest in the flesh.” Jesus is God the Son conceived in Mary.
      25. Titus 2:13 “the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ.” Granville-Sharp rule: Jesus is God and Saviour.
      26. Hebrews 1:6 “Let all the angels of God worship him.” Only worship God. Matt 4:10, Ps97:7 Son is God
      27. Hebrews 1:8 “To the Son he saith, ‘Thy throne, O God, is forever and ever’” Psalm 45:6,7. Son is God.
      28. Hebrew 1:10 “And (to the Son he saith), Thou, Lord, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands:.thou art the same.” Son is unchangeable creator. Ps102:24
      29. Hebrews 1:13 To which of the angels said he, Sit on my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool? 35
      30. I John 5:7 “There are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.” 
      The heavenly and earthly witnesses in v.7,8 are confirmed in v.9 by God and men.
      The masculine article (oi) for “that” in v.7 is derived from the masculine nouns “Father and Word” in v.7.
      31. Revelation 1:17,18 “I am the first and the last: I am he that liveth and was dead;” Jesus = first and last.
      Revelation 1:11 “I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last:” Jesus = first and last = Alpha and Omega.
      Revelation 22:12,13 “I come quickly; I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last.” Jesus=Alpha & Omega.
      Revelation 1:8 “I am Alpha and Omega, the Almighty.” Jesus = first & last = Alpha & Omega =Almighty
      32. Revelation 22:3 “the throne of God and of the Lamb.” Both God and the Lamb equally own the throne.
      Revelation 22:3 “his servants shall serve him:” Both God and the Lamb equally own the same servants.
      Revelation 22:4 “they shall see his face.” Both God and the Lamb have the same face.
      Revelation 22:4 “his name shall be in their foreheads.” Both God and the Lamb have the same name.
      Revelation 20:6 “they shall be priests (of God and of Christ), and shall reign with HIM a thousand years” Revelation 21:22 “for (the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb) are the temple of it.” Both are temple of NJ Revelation 21:23 “for (the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light) thereof.” Both light of NJ
      33. God identifies Himself as “us” (a Trinity) in:‘God said “let us make man in our image”’ Genesis 1:26 ‘Jehovah God said, “Behold the man is become as one of us . . .’ Genesis 3:22. ‘Jehovah came down … the Lord said, let us go down.’ Genesis 11:5,7 ‘who will go for us?’ Isaiah 6:8. 34. Exodus 3:14 “I AM hath sent me unto you.” ‘I AM’ is the name of the angel of Jehovah, Jehovah, God (2,4,6) & Jesus in John 8:58 “Before Abraham was, I AM” & John 8:24 “If ye believe not that I AM”
      35. Psalm 110:1. God told David that David’s son would be David’s God. ‘The LORD (Jehovah) said unto my Lord (Adonai), Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool.’ Jesus applied this to Himself in Matthew 22:41-45 as a question: ‘If David then call him Lord, how is he his son?’ This shows that Jesus Christ would be both a man descended from David and David’s God.
      36. Isaiah 6:1-8,5. “Mine eyes have seen the King, Jehovah of hosts” on the throne in heaven. God asked Isaiah “who will go for us?” (‘us’ = trinity). In John 12:37-41, John said, “These things said Esaias when he saw his (Jesus) glory, and spake of him (Jesus).” Jesus was the King, Jehovah of hosts that Isaiah saw.
      37. Isaiah 9:6 ‘Unto us a child is born (human Jesus),unto us a son is given (God the Son): his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The Mighty God.” Jehovah is Mighty God in Isaiah 10:21;Jer32:18; Ps 50:1
      38. Isaiah 44:6 ‘Thus saith Jehovah the King of Israel (Father) and his redeemer Jehovah of hosts (Son)”
      39. Isaiah 48:12,13,16 “Hearken unto me…Mine hand also has laid the foundation of the earth, and my right hand has spanned the heavens:…Come ye near unto me,..the Lord GOD, and his Spirit has sent me.”
      Me, mine, my and me is God the Son describing his two works of creation and of incarnation to save man.
      40. Ezekiel 44:1,2 “This gate shall be shut…because Jehovah, the God of Israel has entered in by it.”
      In Luke 19:45-47 Jesus, who is Jehovah, fulfilled this prophecy, entering the east gate on a colt in 33AD.
      41. Hosea 4:1 and 5:15. Jehovah will return to ‘my place’ (heaven), till the Jews admit their offence of killing Jesus. “Hear the word of the LORD (Jehovah) (4:1),.I will go and return to my place (heaven), till they (Jews) acknowledge their offence (of killing Jesus), and seek my face: in their affliction (7 year tribulation) they (Jews) will seek me early.” Jehovah the Son came from heaven to be born of Mary as a man, he was rejected and crucified by the Jews. The resurrected Lord Jesus returned to heaven. Jesus will return when the Jews acknowledge their offence of killing Jesus. This occurs after the 7 year tribulation.
      42. Zechariah 11:4,12,13. “Thus saith the LORD (Jehovah) my God; (v.4). If ye think good, give me my price; So they weighed for my price thirty pieces of silver (v.12)….I took the thirty pieces of silver, and cast them to the potter in the house of the LORD’ (Zechariah 11:4,12,13). (silver, temple floor, potter field) These three prophecies were fulfilled in Judas betraying Jesus Christ in Matthew 26:14-16 and 27:3-10.
      43. Zechariah 12:9-10. When Jesus Christ returns to earth, He is identified as Jehovah God whom Israel pierced on the cross. “I (Jehovah) will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem (v.9). They (Israel) shall look upon me (Jehovah) whom they have pierced.” Jesus fulfilled this in John 19:37.
      44. Zechariah 14:3,4,5,9. When Jesus Christ returns to earth on the Mount of Olives, He is identified as Jehovah God (Zechariah 14:3,4). ‘Then shall the LORD (Jehovah) go forth and fight against those nations, And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives (v.3-4)....the LORD (Jehovah) my God shall come, and all the saints with thee (v.5)….the LORD (Jehovah) shall be king over all the earth.’ When Jesus ascended to heaven from the Mount of Olives, two angels told those witnesses present that “this same Jesus shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.” (Acts 1:10-12).
      45. In Zechariah 2:8-11, Jehovah the Son states twice that Jehovah the Father has sent Him to Israel. This proves that there are at least two persons in the Godhead, both called Jehovah.
      “For thus saith Jehovah of hosts (the Son).. (v.8) Ye shall know that Jehovah of hosts (the Father) hath sent me (v.9). ‘I (Jehovah the Son) will dwell in the midst of thee, and thou shalt know that Jehovah of hosts (Father) hath sent me unto thee.” (v.11).
      Lesson: Jehovah (the Father) sends Jehovah (the Son). Two persons here are named Jehovah. This clearly proves that Jesus Christ in His pre-incarnate state is fully Jehovah God.
      46. In Zechariah 3:2 “Jehovah said unto Satan, Jehovah rebuke thee, O Satan”.
      One person in the Jehovah Godhead speaks about another person in the Jehovah Godhead. See Isaiah 48:16 Rules of Grammar dictate that: “Jehovah (the first person = person speaking) said unto Satan (the second person = person spoken to), Jehovah (the third person = person spoken about) rebuke thee.”
    • By Bible Speaks
      “Send out your light and your truth. May these themselves lead me.” Psalm 43:3.  JEHOVAH is very considerate in the way he makes his purposes known to his servants. Instead of revealing the truth all at once in one blinding flash of light, he enlightens us progressively. Our trek along life’s pathway might be compared to a walk that a hiker takes down a long trail. He starts out early in the morning and sees little. As the sun begins to rise slowly over the horizon, the hiker is able to distinguish a few features of his surroundings. The rest he sees in hazy outline. But as the sun continues its ascent, he can see farther and farther into the distance. So it is with the spiritual light that God provides. He allows us to discern a few things at a time. God’s Son, Jesus Christ, provided spiritual enlightenment in a similar manner. Let us learn how Jehovah enlightened his people in ancient times and how he does so today.

    • By Srecko Sostar
      "clear, pure water of truth" ?? ...and famous question that can be hear from platform and in witnessing "Would you drink water from a glass with just one drop of poison in it?"
       
      Water That Leads to Life
      ..."Jehovah’s Witnesses invite you to taste the pure waters of truth." .....
      [Picture on page 9]
      "You can find the ‘waters of truth’ at your local Kingdom Hall"
       
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    • By Jack Ryan
      In paragraph 9 of this weeks Watchtower it was talking about how children’s comments at the meetings can prompt newly interested ones to recognise the ring of truth.
      I donÂ’t recall ever hearing it referred to as the ring of truth before. Is this a new phrase theyÂ’re going to try and get everybody using along the lines of, the truth, the brotherhood, this wicked system of things, etc etc.
       
    • By sami
      ONE OR THREE?
      In his book TWO BABYLONS, Alexander Hislop traces the various mythologies back to a common heritage. Hislop pointed out the antiquity of the theological concept of the Trinity by giving examples of pagan trinities in Siberia, Japan, and India. He noted that the recognition of the Trinity was “universal in all the ancient nations of the world”. He went so far as to say that “the supreme divinity in almost all heathen nations was triune”.
      Historian Arthur Wainwright can find no doctrine remotely resembling the doctrine of the Trinity taught in Judaism until the time of Philo in the first century AD. And we know that Philo, even though he was a Jewish priest, was heavily influenced by Greek pagan thought.
      The idea of a “plural” God was far from the Hebrew mind.
      The pagan idea of a triad is very old. Sumerians, according to Morris Jastrow, paid homage to a triad of El-lil, “god or lord of the storm”, Ea, “water deity” of Eridu on the Persian Gulf, and Anu, sun god of Ur-uk.
      El-lil, was called “the father of Sumer” (“Shinar”), and “chief of gods”, “creator and sustainer of life”. The universe was apparently up among these three “pre-eminent” deities.
      Later, Marduk, the “firstborn” of Ea, and the patron deity of Babylon, is made “god of the earth”,
      and his symbol, oddly enough, is the dragon. He was called “Bel” or “Baal” (lord).
      Ashur, the god of the Assyrian capital was a “sun god”, and his consort or wife was Ishtar, the “great mother” goddess of Nineveh, a city founded by Ninus or Nimrod.
      Ishtar, known as Ashtoreth to the Phoenicians, and Astarte to the Greeks, was often portrayed riding on a lion. She was called the daughter of the moon, and identified in astrology as the Roman Venus (“goddess of love”). She was also known as Nana or Madonna (Lady). From whence comes the title and worship of Mary as the Madonna and queen of heaven.
      Ishtar has a bloody history as a goddess. She was reputedly the murderer of her consort Tammuz (variously known as Baal, Adonis, the Egyptian Osiris, the Greek Bacchus, or simply Nimrod). Queen Semiramis later brought forth an illegitimate son, which she claimed was Nimrod resurrected. He was called El-Bar, or “God the Son”, and “the Branch of Cush”. Thus was formulated one of the ancient triadic patterns of “father, mother, son”
      Franz Cumont tells us that triads were very common in the religion of the Chaldeans. The Babylonian triad became the Syrian triad of Hadad, Atargatis, and Simios. In Rome, this triad was Jupiter, Venus, and Mercury. Not only did the triadic pattern of deity spread throughout the world, but Cumont remarks on the continuing influence of the Babylonian priesthood after the fall of Babylon from political leadership.
      The ancient Greeks impressed with the wisdom of the Babylonians. Franz Cumont said, “Philosophy claimed more and more to derive its inspiration from the fabulous wisdom of Chaldea (Babylon) and Egypt”.
      According to Cumont, the “entire neo-platonic school is heavily indebted to the Chaldeans (Babylonians)”. It was the neo-platonic school of philosophy which influenced the Catholic fathers, Justin Martyr, Clement of Alexandria, and Origen.
      Porphyry reveals that the neo-platonists had incorporated Babylonian and Persian demonology into their philosophical system.
      The Greek philosopher Plato, greatly influenced the Catholic fathers. He was acquainted with Babylonian wisdom, and had traveled to Babylonia, Israel, and Egypt.
      Philo Judaeus (20 BC-50 AD) of Alexandria was the man who attempted to fuse the strict monotheistic theology of the Hebrew religion with the transcendental theology and philosophy of the Greek platonists.
      He, Philo, had a profound influence upon the Catholic fathers, and therefore upon the development of the Catholic Trinity.
      For one looking into Philo’s work will see that his conception of the Logos, with some modifications, is very similar to later trinitarian teaching on the Catholic Logos.
      Charles Semisch has stated, “The early (Catholic) Fathers only poured the contents of the scriptures into a Philonian vessel: they view the biblical passages through a Philonian medium”.
      I thought that the quote by historian Will Durant is quite appropriate: “Christianity did not destroy paganism; it adopted it.
      . . . From Egypt came the ideas of a divine trinity.” In the book Egyptian Religion, where Siegfried Morenz says: “The trinity was a major preoccupation of Egyptian theologians . . . Three gods are combined and treated as a single being, addressed in the singular. In this way the spiritual force of Egyptian religion shows a direct link with Christian theology.”
      Morenz goes on to say “Alexandrian theology as the intermediary between the Egyptian religious heritage and Christianity.”
      Edward Gibbon’s History of Christianity said : “If Paganism was conquered by Christianity, it is equally true that Christianity was corrupted by Paganism. The pure Deism of the first Christians . . . was changed, by the Church of Rome, into the incomprehensible dogma of the trinity. Many of the pagan tenets, invented by the Egyptians and idealized by Plato, were retained as being worthy of belief.”
      Dictionary of Religious Knowledge says that the Trinity “is a corruption borrowed from the heathen religions, and ingrafted on the Christian faith.”
      The book…. The Paganism in Our Christianity said this of the trinity doctrine: “The origin of the [Trinity] is entirely pagan.”
    • By Jesus.defender
      THE TRINITY
      Watchtower Teaching: JW arguments against the Trinity are:
      i) If Jesus is God, who ran the universe during the three days that Jesus was dead in the grave? Satan had a great chance to take control.
      Answer: Jesus’ body died, not His soul or spirit. He along with the Father and the Holy Spirit still ran the universe.
      ii) If Jesus is the immortal God, He could not have died.
      Answer: The immortal God, by taking on a mortal body, had His mortal body die.
      iii) Since God is not a God of confusion (I Corinthians 14:33), it is impossible that the Bible would talk of a God who could not be understood by human reason. JWs claim that the Trinity is incomprehensible and unreasonable. ‘We worship what we know’ (John 4:22).
      Answer: Man’s lack of understanding has never stopped new discoveries. What percent of the total knowledge of the universe do you possess? (about zero percent).
      Ask: Could there be something about God that you don’t comprehend?(eg: His Trinity?).
      iv) The word ‘Trinity’ is not in the Bible.
      Answer: Neither is ‘Bible’, ‘organisation’, Kingdom Hall’, chocolate, motor car, etc.
      Say to the JW: ‘By this logic you would agree that Kingdom Halls don’t exist either?’
      This is shallow reasoning designed to throw the Christian off guard. If it can be proved that the Bible teaches a certain truth, then naming that truth does not make it unbiblical. We should ask: ‘Is the particular teaching in the Bible?’
      v) The Watchtower has misrepresented the Trinity doctrine in order to make its denial more plausible. 
      They erect a straw man that is easily knocked down.
      They call the Trinity a ‘freakish looking, three headed God’ (Let God be True, p 102)
      ‘This doctrine of three Gods in one God . . .’ (Studies in Scripture, 1899, Vol 5, p 60,61)
      Note: Trinitarians do not believe in ‘three Gods in one God’.
      They believe in one God, with three co-equal persons in the one Godhead.

      1. Refuting the Watchtower’s FALSE Quotes of Early Church Writers
      The Watchtower is quite happy to tell lies by inventing statements allegedly made by six Ante-Nicene Church writers who lived before 325 AD. Page 7 of their publication ‘Should you believe in the Trinity?’ Shows the Watchtower’s claims that these ancient writers taught that Jesus Christ was not God. These quotes are FALSE and INVENTED by the Watchtower. They are easily refuted by the photocopied excerpts of the 10 volume set of genuine Ante-Nicene church fathers quotes that prove these early writers strong belief in and defence of the Trinity.
      In the Watchtower’s false quotes we notice that:
      1) None of these references are given a source, making them nearly impossible to check. It is almost certain that the Watchtower has invented these quotes.
      2) Notice the lie of the central bold quote on page 7: ‘There is no evidence that any sacred writer even suspected the existence of a [Trinity] within the Godhead’.
      We refute this Watchtower lie, and prove beyond doubt that both the Trinity and the full deity of Christ were well known and firmly believed as early as 110 AD as seen from the quotes by the Ante-Nicene (before 325 AD) church fathers which follow the Watchtower quote.
      The following quotes are from the 10 Volume set of The Ante-Nicene Fathers, translations of The Writings of the Fathers down to A.D. 325, by editors Alexander Roberts and James Donaldson, American Reprint of the Edinburgh edition, revised and arranged by A C Coxe, published by W.B.Eerdmans, Grand Rapids, Michigan, reprinted in May 1987.
      The Watchtower’s claim that Constantine and the Council of Nicea introduced the deity of Christ and Trinity doctrines in 325 AD is proven false by these pre-325 AD quotes to the contrary:
      i) Justin Martyr (110-165 AD),Volume I, page 263: ‘His Son, being God’ Volume I, page 219 Justin Martyr says:: ‘Christ existed as God before the ages’ Volume I, page 264). Justin Martyr says that ‘Christ is Lord and God’.
      ii) Irenaeus (120-202 AD) Volume I, page 328 not only shows the NWT to be wrong on John 1:1
      but also calls Christ ‘God’
      iii) Clement of Alexandria (153-217 AD) In Volume 2, p 468, written in 193 AD, Clement clearly quotes the Holy Trinity as Father, Son & Holy Spirit. page 173
      iv) Tertullian (200-250 AD) Volume 3, page 598 page 598 Tertullian against Praxeas, Volume 3, p.606 Tertullian correctly quotes John 1:1, saying that Christ is God. (Volume 3, p. 607) Tertullian again quotes the
      Trinity on a fourth occasion. (Vol 4, page 99)
      v) Hippolytus (170-236 AD) Volume 5, page 228 mentions the Trinity and quotes John 1:1 correctly.
      vi) Origen (185-254 AD) Volume 4, page 255. Twice he quotes the word ‘Trinity’, as Father, Son and Holy Spirit. Also on page 258 he quotes the Trinity in ‘Origen de Principiis’, written in 230 AD.
      vii) Thaumaturgus (205-265 AD) Volume 6, pages 42, 45
      2. Is the Trinity a Pagan Concept? No! Because:
      i) The Babylonians and Assyrians believed in triads of gods, which were three separate gods (polytheism) governing other gods. This is totally different from the Trinity of only one God (monotheism) with three persons within the one Godhead.
      ii) Triads of gods pre-date Christianity by about 700 years and were far removed from Israel..
      iii) Some pagan ideas have some truth in them, such as the pagan Flood legends. Just because pagans spoke of a concept that remotely resembles a biblical concept, does not mean that Christians stole it from the pagans.
      iv) JWs quote Hislop’s The Two Babylons to support their case, yet they don’t tell us that Hislop believes in the Trinity, as seen from Hislop’s quote:
      ‘They all admitted a Trinity, but did they worship the Triune Jehovah?’ (p. 90)
      - About 80% of the sources that the WT quotes are from Trinitarians. This begs the question: ‘How can the WT disprove the Trinity by quoting sources who believe the Trinity?
      - 15% of their sources are secular works like Encyclopaedia Britannica.
      - 5% of WT sources are invalid sources of Biblical truth, eg: sceptics, spiritists, Unitarians.
      - The WT always finds some unknown, obscure person to agree with them. They do not examine the credibility of such sources. Most WT sources have no credibility & no authority.
      - The WT rarely gives page numbers of its quotes to allow check the source and context.
      v) JWs claim they represent the ‘faith once delivered to the saints’. They claim that the Trinity idea was introduced in 325 AD. What they don’t say is that current WT teachings have no precedent in history. They do not say who were the JWs of the first three centuries or later. No early church ‘father’ represented their beliefs. The WT is historically bankrupt.
      vi) The WT, by showing a three-headed god, use the ‘straw-man effect’, where they misrepresent what Christians believe, and then proceed to ‘shoot down’ this ‘straw man’.
      This is seen in five pictures of three-headed gods which are supposed to represent the God of Christendom. (‘Should you believe in the Trinity’ p 10).
      vii) The WT is happy to misquote sources to prove their point.
      Consider page 6 ‘Should you believe in the Trinity’, where they misquote the New Encyclopaedia Brittanica by failing to give the full relevant quote. They stop the quote at the asterisk *
      ‘The Encyclopaedia Britannica (1976 Edition) correctly states:
      “Neither the word Trinity, nor the explicit doctrine as such, appears in the New Testament”,’
      [*They stop the quote here, ignoring the rest of the article which endorses the Trinity:]
      ‘nor did Jesus and his followers intend to contradict the Shema in the Old Testament: ‘Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God is one Lord’ (Deuteronomy 6:4). The earliest Christians, however, had to cope with the implications of the coming of Jesus Christ and of the presence and power of God among them - ie, the Holy Spirit, whose coming we connected with the celebration of Pentecost.
      The Father, Son, and Holy Spirit were associated in such New Testament passages as the Great Commission: ‘Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit’ (Matthew 28:19); and in the apostolic benediction:
      ‘The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ and the love of God and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you all’ (2 Cor. 13:14). Thus, the New Testament established the basis for the doctrine of the Trinity.The doctrine developed gradually over several centuries and through many controversies.
      Any early church council disputes were over fine points of Trinity clarification, such as the substance, nature and omnipotence of Father, Son and Holy Spirit, never over whether the Trinity was right or wrong. The truth of the Trinity was always accepted.
      3. Refuting Watchtowers’ wrong application of I Corinthians 14:33
      ‘for God is not the author of confusion, but of peace . . .’
      Watchtower Teaching: JWs say that because God is not the author of confusion, the Trinity doctrine cannot be true because it is so unreasonable. How can the Father, Son and Holy Spirit each be God, and yet there be only one God? It doesn’t make sense to them.
      Bible Teaching: Just because one is unable to fully understand something, doesn’t mean that it is false.
      i) Finite humans cannot possibly understand everything about the infinite God.
      ‘How unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out.’ (Romans 11:33)
      ‘For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the Lord.
      As the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts’. (Isaiah 55:8,9)
      ii) Can you fully understand how light can be both a particle of matter and a wave form?
      iii) Can you fully understand how God did not have a beginning? (No) Do you reject the idea?
      Ask: Should we reject the Trinity doctrine because we don’t fully understand it, when we accept other things about God and the universe which we don’t fully understand.
      I Corinthians 14:33 means that a church should avoid disharmony in its services by only
      having two or three prophets speak in a service, and only one at a time.
      ‘Confusion’ means ‘parts of a whole which are at strife with one another’.
      ‘Peace’ means ‘parts of a whole acting in harmony’.
      5. Refuting WT’s misunderstanding of Deuteronomy 6:4 and Mark 12:29
      ‘Hear,O Israel, the Lord (YHWH) our God (Elohim) is one Lord (YHWH).’ (Deut 6:4)
      Watchtower teaching: JWs say that, since God is one, He cannot be Triune at the same time. Why would God speak as one person if He were composed of three persons?
      Bible teaching: The ordinary name of God (Elohim) is in the plural form ‘Hear, O, Israel, Jehovah our Elohim, one Jehovah.’ Deut.6:4
      If God had intended to assert a solitary, exclusive type of unity, the expression would have been ‘Eloah’, not the plural ‘Elohim’.
      It does not say: ‘Hear, O Israel, Jehovah, our Elohim, one Eloah.’
      The use of Elohim (a uniplural noun) means: ‘there is a real plurality, yet Jehovah is one.’
      Ask: Who is Jehovah? Is it the Father alone? Is Jesus Jehovah? Is the Holy Spirit Jehovah?
      If we can find verses teaching that Jesus is Jehovah (or God) and the Holy Spirit is Jehovah,
      then we have proved the Trinity.
      i) The Holy Spirit is called Jehovah:‘Now Jehovah is the Spirit’.(II Corinthians 3:17 NWT)
      ii) Jesus Christ is called God, as follows:
      (1) ‘Our Lord Jesus Christ who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords; who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto’(I Tim 6:14-16)
      (2) ‘The Word was God.’ (John 1:1)
      (3) ‘of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ’ (Titus 2:13)
      (4) ‘the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ’. (II Peter 1:1)
      (5) ‘if ye believe not that I am, ye shall die in your sins.’ (John 8:24)
      (6) ‘Before Abraham was, I am.’ (John 8:58)
      (7) ‘God was manifest in the flesh’. (I Timothy 3:16)
      (8) ‘Thomas said unto him, My Lord and My God’. (John 20:28)
      (9) ‘in him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily.’ (Colossians 2:9)
      (10) ‘unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God is forever.’ (Hebrews 1:8)
      (11) ‘If you publicly declare . . . that Jesus is Lord.’ (KIT: ‘ha Adon’ in Hebrew footnote of Romans 10:9. In the 1961 edition of NWT, p.1453, ‘ha Adon’ = Jehovah).
      (12) ‘that he (Christ) might be Lord both of the dead and the living’. (Romans 14:9).
      In verses 6-11 of NWT ‘??????’(Lord) is translated 7 times as Jehovah, except in v.9. Why?
      (13) ‘in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.’ (I John 5:20)
      (14) ‘feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.’ (Acts 20:28)
      6. Notice how God reveals Himself in stages to man:
      (1) God revealed His Unity as the one and only true God, to refute the nations’ many gods.
      (2) God revealed the Trinity (Jehovah=Father+Son+HS) in the Old Testament in:
      ‘Jehovah your God is God of gods (the Father), and Lord of lords (the Son)’. (Deut.10:17).
      ‘Thus saith Jehovah the King of Israel (the Father),and his redeemer Jehovah of hosts (the Son).Is44:6
      ‘God said “let us make man in our image . . .”.’ Genesis 1:26
      ‘Jehovah God said, “Behold the man is become as one of us . . .’ Genesis 3:22
      ‘Jehovah came down . . . the Lord said, let us go down . . .’ Genesis 11:5,7
      ‘the Lord saying . . . who will go for us?’ Isaiah 6:8
      ‘What is his name....and what is his Son’s name.’ Proverbs 30:4
      ‘the Lord God (the Father), and his Spirit (HS), hath sent me (Jehovah the Son).’ Isaiah 48:16.
      (3) God revealed the fullness of the Trinity doctrine in the New Testament:
      Matthew 28:19 ‘baptizing them in the name (singular name, not plural) of the Father, and of
      the Son, and of the Holy Spirit.’
      I John 5:7 ‘There are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.’
      Revelation 22:1,3,4 ‘the throne (of God and of the Lamb) shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him; they shall see his face, and his name shall be in their foreheads.’
      Key:God and the Lamb have one throne, one name, one face and one ownership of servants.
      II Corinthians 13:14 ‘The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, the love of God, and the communion of the Holy Ghost’. There is one God, but three persons within the Godhead.
      (4) Early Christians with a strong Jewish background, who knew Deuteronomy 6:4, continually refer to Jesus as ‘Lord’ and ‘God’ (Romans 10:13, I Thess 5:2, I Peter 2:3, 3:15.) They often apply to Jesus many Old Testament texts which refer to Jehovah, such as:
      a) Jesus Christ in Matthew 3:1-3 fulfils Isaiah 40:3 to‘Prepare the way of Jehovah’ and Elohim.
      b) Jesus Christ’s glory in John 12:41 is Jehovah’s glory in Isaiah 6:1-5.
      c) Jesus Christ’s voice as the sound of many waters in Revelation 1:15 is identical to Jehovah’s voice as the sound of many waters in Ezekiel 43:2.
      d) Jesus Christ being pierced in Rev 1:7 is the same one as Jehovah being pierced in Zech
      12:10.
      e) Jesus Christ being called on for salvation in Romans 10:13, is the same as Jehovah being called on for salvation in Joel 2:32
      f) Jesus Christ, the Lamb, is the everlasting light in Revelation 21:23, just as Jehovah ‘shall be . . . an everlasting light’ in Isaiah 60:19,20.
      Ask:Do you agree that Trinitarians believe Deuteronomy 6:4 that there is only one true God?
      Ask: Do you understand that Trinitarians don’t teach that there are three gods in the Trinity, but that there is only one God with three persons within the one Godhead?
      Ask: How do you explain that the early Jewish Christians who believed Deuteronomy 6:4, applied to Jesus many Old Testament texts that were originally written of Jehovah?
       
    • By Jesus.defender
      BIBLE PROOFS OF THE TRINITY

      Key: The Father, Son and Holy Spirit are so clearly and consistently linked in Scripture that, assuming that God is not three persons, makes it impossible to understand some passages.
      Though JWs exalt human reasoning against the Trinity doctrine, saying it is unreasonable,those who submit to God’s Word must conclude that it is unreasonable to doubt the Trinity.
      Consider these scriptures proving the Trinity:
      1. Matthew 28:19 The ‘Name’ of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit.

      Watchtower teaching: JWs ask, ‘Does this verse prove the Father, Son and Holy Spirit are equal in substance, power and eternity?’ They say, ‘No, no more than listing three people
      Tom, Dick and Harry mean that they are three in one.’ They say that the Trinity doctrine is imposed on the text, not derived from it.

      Bible Teaching: The key point is that the word ‘name’ is singular in the Greek NT, thus proving that there is one God, but three distinct persons within the Godhead.
      This proves the Trinity because Jesus did not say:
      i) ‘into the names (plural) of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.’
      ii) ‘into the name of the Father, and into the name of the Son, and into the name of the Holy Spirit’, as if we had three separate beings.
      iii) ‘into the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit’ omitting the three articles (the), as if the Father, Son and Holy Spirit might be three designations of a single person.
      What He does say is: ‘into the name (singular) of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit’.
      Jesus first teaches the unity of the three by combining them all within a single name.
      He then teaches that each is a different person by introducing each of them in turn with the
      article (tou):
      Question: Can you see that rules of grammar dictate plurality (the, the, the) within unity (the name), because the word ‘name’ is singular and definite articles (Greek: tou) are placed in front of Father, Son and Holy Spirit?
      Other verses showing ‘three-in-oneness’ of the Godhead are:
      i) At the creation of man, ‘God said, let us make man in our image, after our likeness . .’ (Genesis 1:26). ‘Our image’ in v. 26 is explained as God’s image in v. 27.
      The one true God consists of three persons who are able to confer with one another and carry out their plans together, while still being one God.
      ii) After the Fall, ‘the Lord (Jehovah) God (Elohim) said, Behold, the man is become as one of us . ’ (Genesis 3:22)
      ‘Us’ refers back to LORD (Jehovah), showing plurality within the Jehovah Godhead.

      iii) At the Tower of Babel, ‘the LORD (Jehovah), said . . let us go down’ (Genesis 11:6,7).
      iv) Isaiah ‘saw the Lord (Adonai) sitting upon a throne (v.1) mine eyes have seen the King, the LORD (Jehovah) of hosts (v.5). I heard the voice of the Lord (Adonai) saying: ‘Whom shall I send, and who will go for us?’’ (Isaiah 6:1,5,8) Here Isaiah sees ‘Adonai’ on the throne, then Isaiah calls Him ‘Jehovah of hosts’ (v.5).

      Then Adonai asks,‘Who will go for us?’The ‘us’ shows plurality in the Jehovah Godhead. This equivalence of Adonai and Jehovah (both called ‘us’) proves the Trinity Godhead.
      2. Genesis 18 and 19. Three men each called Jehovah.
      JWs believe that it is impossible for Jehovah God to exist as three persons: Father, Son and Holy Spirit. Yet Genesis 18 and 19 shows Jehovah appearing to Abraham as three men. This
      shows that even the impossible from a human viewpoint is possible with God. Notice that:

      i) Abraham addresses the three as ‘Jehovah’ (v.3 NWT);
      ii) When two of the three men depart to visit Lot in Sodom, Abraham continues to address the remaining one as ‘Jehovah’ (Genesis 18:22,26,27,30,31,32,33).
      iii) Lot addressed the other two as ‘Jehovah’ (Genesis 19:1,18 NWT). ‘Then Lot said to them: “Not that please, Jehovah”.’ (19:18 NWT)
      iv) ‘Then Jehovah made it rain sulphur and fire from Jehovah, from the heavens upon Sodom and Gomorra.’ (Genesis 19:24)
      Notice the mention here of two Jehovahs, one in heaven who sends judgment on Sodom and Gomorra, at the bidding of the other Jehovah on earth.
      This gives strong evidence for more than one person in the Godhead. The Jehovah upon earth was one of three persons to visit Abraham, one of whom stays behind to speak further to Abraham and is called Jehovah. (Genesis 21:1 ‘Jehovah turned his attention to Sarah’).
      Hence this shows that it is possible for Jehovah to manifest Himself as three-in-one.
       
      3. II Corinthians 3:17 - ‘Jehovah is the Spirit’ (NWT).
       
      JWs challenge Christians to prove the Trinity in the Bible. This can be done if we find verses teaching that the Holy Spirit is Jehovah God, and the Son is Jehovah God.
      II Corinthians 3:17 teaches this by saying: ‘Now Jehovah is the Spirit.’

      How much clearer can it be than this, which states that the Holy Spirit is (=) Jehovah God? This proves the Deity of the Holy Spirit, and the existence of 2 persons in the Godhead.
      4. I John 5:7,8 The Johannine Comma, the famous Trinitarian proof text (3 Heavenly witnesses)
      Watchtower teaching: JWs claim that this passage ought not to be in the Bible, because it is not in most Greek manuscripts. It is omitted by most modern Bible versions. ’
      Bible Teaching: Erasmus omitted it from his first edition of the printed Greek NT (1516), because it occurred in the Latin Vulgate and not in any Greek manuscript. To quieten the
      outcry that followed, he agreed to restore it if it could be found in one Greek manuscript.
      Two Greek manuscripts, Codex 61 and 629 were found, so Erasmus included it in his 1522 edition. Since these manuscripts are late (14th and 15th Century), some think the readings are
      corrupt. What do we answer? (See page 805-806).

      5. In II Corinthians 13:14, (the Apostolic Benediction) why is there a change in the order of the persons of the Trinity, compared to Matthew 28:19, if not to show that ‘in this Trinity
      none is before or after the other, and none is greater or less than another’?

      ‘The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the communion of the Holy Ghost, be with you all. Amen.’ (II Corinthians 13:14)
      ‘Baptising them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost.’ Matt. 28:19
    • By Queen Esther
      THE  TRUTH  ABOUT  CHRISTMAS......
      The year was 1928, when Jehovah's people came to understand the God-dishonoring roots of Christmas. Since then, the pagan roots of Christmas customs have become general public knowledge..... but few people have made changes in their way of life as a result. But, Jehovah's Witnesses are always willing to make the needed changes in order to become more acceptable as servants of Jehovah God.
      When shown that celebrating the birth of Jesus had actually become of greater interest to people than the ransom provided by his death; that the revelry of the holiday and the spirit in which many gifts were given did not honor God;  that the magi whose gift-giving was being imitated were actually demon-inspired astrologers;  that parents set an example for their children in lying by what they told them about Santa Claus;  that  "St. Nicholas"
      (Santa Claus) was admittedly another name for Satan the Devil himself;  and that such festivals were, as acknowledged  by Cardinal Newman in his "Essay on the development of Christian Doctrine" were "the very instruments and appendages of demon-worship"  the church had adopted....  When made aware of these things, Jehovah's Witnesses promptly and permanently ceased having any part in  Christmas  celebrations.
      Jehovah's Witnesses do have good times with their family and friends. But, they do not participate in holidays and celebrations that are linked with pagan gods (as is true of such holidays as Easter, New Year's Day,  May Day and Mother's day).  Read, 2.Cor. 6:14-17.  Like the early Christians,  Jehovah's Witnesses do not even celebrate birthdays. They also respectfully refrain from sharing in national holidays, that memorialize political or military events and also refrain from giving worshipful honor to national heroes.
      WHY ?
      BECAUSE  JEHOVAH'S  WITNESSES  ARE  NO  PART  OF  THE  WORLD !
      Reference, Proclaims Book,  pages  198-200....
      ( by  Brother  Roger B. Elder )     Thank  you  Brother  Elder !




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