"SPECIAL INVESTIGATION INTO JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES"

[Arauna]

On 6/18/2020 at 7:19 PM, Witness said:

s one thing to be ignorant,

Can you not see that Satan is getting ready to attack all religions on earth?  Have you not noticed how legislation is slowly changing everywhere? … to bring in the new secular world order and the fourth industrial revolution?

Who is spiritually blind?  These news spinners carry on as if all JWs are pedophiles. There are media mob attacks against all Christians at present as well. Less than .0001 percent of JWs are pedophiles and in most of these cases the victims did not have enough proof in front of elders... because it is a hidden crime.  After several years have passed, a mature 'adult' can now no go to court.

While I am definitely for this form of justice I think the courts are shoving all responsibility onto us and all the other organizations working with children. They want these organizations to be responsible when the legal system itself would not have been able to prove it in a court of justice when the victims were too young. The court system did not favor young victims.  Now only did they change the laws to favor the victims at an 'older age' and all hell breaks lose on companies working with children because the legal system is not responsible. At a late stage of pedophile history they held inquiries and changed the laws... to exonerate themselves and keep others responsible. 

This is not about your sense of justice for the victims - that is clear in your replies. It is  just another hate - stick to beat your fellow slaves with..... Have you ever looked at your own spirituality instead of calling us ignorant?

When you know the world is coming to attack you (prophesied) - I would also try to salvage what I can of the funds I have available...…until they come to destroy us.  I have done the same.

I know they are coming for us once they have imposed a new economic world order on us - we will not be able to buy or sell.  No I have not bought gold, silver or bitcoin..... but I have moved the little funds I have to be able to survive until they take me to prison or kill me.   The dollar has already fallen and most people are sitting in front of their mobiles all day.... they do not even know that an economic reset is going on.  So instead of focusing on your hate -  Jehovah is just and he will take these injustices into consideration when His judgment comes, I suggest you stop smirking at JWs and get serious about your humility.  

I think it is right that the Witnesses prefer to react to a Court of Law decision and pay compensation…… not any other kangaroo court in operation.... there will not be justice and it is unbiblical.  A court of law must convict us and if their other organizations sanction us - so be it.... we will suffer the sanction. We obey the legal authority.

[Patiently waiting for Truth]

@Arauna says "Less than .0001 percent of JWs are pedophiles and in most of these cases the victims did not have enough proof in front of elders... because it is a hidden crime. 

BUT,  the organisation insisted on TWO WITNESSES. for what Arauna states is a HIDDEN CRIME 

Thank you Arauna. You admit it is a HIDDEN CRIME and it has been proven by child psychologists that children did not have enough knowledge of the subject to make those things up. BUT still the Org demanded TWO WITNESSES.  

The reason you think the % is so low is that most were never confirmed as paedophiles due to Elders not believing the child victims, or because the paedophile was an Elder being protected by other Elders. 

You seem very worried about money but it is merely a material possession. Jesus and His closest followers had no money, nor even a place to lay their heads. And Jesus told the 'rich man' to get rid of all his possessions to follow Christ. I am willing to walk away from everything that i own, to walk away in just the clothes I am wearing, to follow Christ, to serve God. I have that faith. That is why I am looking for truth. 

The CCJW cannot move forward as it is. It has to be cleansed of all it's immorality. Don't you understand, it has to STAND OUT as being the ONLY PURE WORSHIP....... At the moment it is just one more immoral religion no different to all the rest. 

How will people know if it is 'serving God properly', as it so unclean ?  How will people see the difference ? 

Is there supposed to be a great influx of people before Armageddon ? Does Jesus, as the Good Shepherd, want to save those lost sheep ? Those that have been stumbled by the unjust deeds of the Organisation.

I care not if you call me OCD. Why indeed should I care ? I wonder if the Pharisees would have called Jesus such ? 

I know in my heart that I'm seeking truth, and if the CCJW gains God's approval through Christ, then I will rejoin it, if that is God's will.

[Srecko Sostar]

7 hours ago, Arauna said:

Can you not see that Satan is getting ready to attack all religions on earth? 

According to WTJWorg interpretations of Bible, event you mentioned is future event an fulfillment, hypothesis, of Bible prophecy. It is interestingly that satan who allegedly created "all religions on earth" want to destroy own kingdom ?? I don't understand this logic. I would understand  that he want to destroy JW religion because, hypothesis, JW religion is his enemy, but why would he destroy own lies?? 

7 hours ago, Arauna said:

I think it is right that the Witnesses prefer to react to a Court of Law decision and pay compensation…… not any other kangaroo court in operation.... there will not be justice and it is unbiblical.

 No. That mean you have to pay own lawyers and fight against WTJWorg Australasia in individual court case. And WT Lawyers have more money than individual victims.  

ARC is not "kangaroo court".

ARC established, according to WT Branch Office cca 5000 documents - 1006 perpetrators in WT archive documentation and 1800 victims.

I wonder what sort of "court" is "kangaroo court"?

JW Judicial Committees from 1950 to 2015 or ARC in 2015 ??

[Witness]

7 hours ago, Arauna said:

Can you not see that Satan is getting ready to attack all religions on earth?  Have you not noticed how legislation is slowly changing everywhere? … to bring in the new secular world order and the fourth industrial revolution?

Who is spiritually blind? 

JWs are spiritually blind.  Satan may be getting ready to do just as you say.  But, what should be your concern?  What's happening on the outside of your organization, or where spiritual "Israel" resides...in sin?  Can there be a difference to the same sin according to who commits it?  Does it take on a better, acceptable hue within the organization, than outside of it?

Who are "my people" in Rev 18:4-8?  

 

[JW Insider]

7 hours ago, Arauna said:

Less than .0001 percent of JWs are pedophiles and in most of these cases the victims did not have enough proof in front of elders... because it is a hidden crime.

I know this is just your opinion, but the numbers don't bear this out. In mathematical terms 1 percent is 1 out of 100, so that .0001 percent, literally means that only one out every million JWs are pedophiles. In other words, there are only 8 pedophiles in the entire world who are JWs.

Since 1950, there have been on the order of 100,000 JWs in Australia (there are over 60,000 today). During that time, there were over 1,000 perpetrators who were considered by the congregations to be pedophiles, persons who had committed sex crimes against children. 1,000 out of 100,000 (1 out of 100).

That's actually 1 percent, not .0001 percent. And since most cases are never caught and most pedophiles attack more than one child, the effect of the crimes probably affect an even higher percentage of Witness children.

Even back in the early 1990's a brother in Writing who had worked in the Service Department for several years estimated (to me) that every congregation of 100 people has had at least one. (That's also 1%.)

[TrueTomHarley]

49 minutes ago, JW Insider said:

Even back in the early 1990's a brother in Writing who had worked in the Service Department for several years estimated (to me) that every congregation of 100 people has had at least one. (That's also 1%.)

A pretty good guess, I would imagine. I like to think that is still quite low, in view of Invisiblechild.org  reporting that 1 out of every 5 children in the US will be suffer molestation before age 18. But such will never be known for sure because practically nobody other than JWs made note of abuse cases within the membership; Witnesses did so in the spirit of Romans 2:22– to ensure that they ‘practice what you preach.’ In doing so, they produce a ‘paper trail,’ the 1000 ARC cases that nobody else produces because everybody else was content to not look.

Their vigilance is readily used against them. It is the classic example of the cynical phrase, ‘No good deed goes unpunished.’ Had they stuck their heads in the sand, as was the pattern elsewhere, and cried like Sergeant Shultz: “I know nothing!!” they would have fared better.

 

[Patiently waiting for Truth]

@JW Insider Wow, 1 in 100.  so that database that the GB / Lawyers are withholding is going to be massive. no wonder they are keeping it secret.  Is there any update on this yet ? 

Fast Facts—United States of America   https://www.jw.org/en/jehovahs-witnesses/worldwide/US/

• 1,237,054—Ministers who teach the Bible
• 12,594—Congregations
• 1 to 273—Ratio of Jehovah’s Witnesses to population
• My estimate Roughly 100 per congregation  because some won't actually be preaching / reporting. 

So that brother in 'Writing / Service Department' had inside information. and he said EVERY congregation of 100 people has had at least one paedophile. So that gives us 12,594 Paedophiles in USA alone. And each paedophile abuses more than on child usually. 

Um, have the GB destroyed that Database ? And if Australia had records going back 50 years then USA would also have records going back 50 years. 

And Arauna wonders why people are concerned. And TTH just keeps cracking silly jokes and being sarcastic.  Because to them it is just Collateral Damage. 

[TrueTomHarley]

31 minutes ago, 4Jah2me said:

So that brother in 'Writing / Service Department' had inside information. and he said EVERY congregation of 100 people has had at least one paedophile.

You moron, nothing was said of “inside information” and he didn’t “say” anything—he “estimated”—there is a difference. Moreover, you ignore the overall inference of the above remark that everyone else likely has significantly more CSA than within JW.

I’m not sure that you care about children at all. If you do, that concern is far overshadowed by your mission to run down the Witness organization. What a hateful loon!

[Witness]

32 minutes ago, TrueTomHarley said:

A pretty good guess, I would imagine. I like to think that is still quite low, in view of Invisiblechild.org  reporting that 1 out of every 5 children in the US will be suffer molestation before age 18. But such will never be known for sure because practically nobody other than JWs made note of abuse cases within the membership; Witnesses did so in the spirit of Romans 2:22– to ensure that they ‘practice what you preach.’ In doing so, they produce a ‘paper trail,’ the 1000 ARC cases that nobody else produces because everybody else was content to not look.

Their vigilance is readily used against them. It is the classic example of the cynical phrase, ‘No good deed goes unpunished.’ Had they stuck their heads in the sand, as was the pattern elsewhere, and cried like Sergeant Shultz: “I know nothing!!” they would have fared better.

 

And now the elders “good deeds” are to destroy the paper trail.  How does that fit in with practicing what they preach?  

To add to your selective statistics, “A typical pedophile will commit 117 sexual crimes in a lifetime”.  This of course, would include crimes committed to more than one child, over and over again. 

Using the figure of one pedophile per a congregation of one hundred JWs, among just one thousand JWs, 117,000 crimes against children could be committed by JW pedophiles. 

Not such a rosy picture to look at, is it. 

[JW Insider]

40 minutes ago, 4Jah2me said:

So that brother in 'Writing / Service Department' had inside information. and he said EVERY congregation of 100 people has had at least one paedophile. So that gives us 12,594 Paedophiles in USA alone. And each paedophile abuses more than on child usually. 

So much can go wrong with trying to read too much into the numbers. Even if there is a database of 12,000 or more pedophiles, this does not mean that all of them were found to be actively committing crimes in the congregation. A big reason for such a database is clearly to keep a lookout for danger even if the person had been convicted or suspected long before becoming a Witness. Some were probably cases of incest, and crimes of opportunity, where the children are no longer in direct danger after they leave the household. (And this is another reason why the WTS would want to protect the privacy of such a database.) Many of the persons involved are likely dead by now. Remember that the brother who estimated this percentage was giving a rough estimate, not of how many are currently in the congregations, but the number that a typical congregation might "have had." If it was 1% over a period of a couple decades, then I would suspect it's more reasonable to conclude that there was another 1% or so who got away with it. But even here, we are talking about a period of decades, not a current number.

Recently, closer attention to the subject has helped to drive down the opportunities. It has helped parents stay more alert and better equipped to protect their children. I think you remember that years ago, on this forum, I complained that the WTS had not yet done nearly enough to change the process and the basic direction of the way such crimes were treated. In the last year, I have explained that I agree with the current direction. I have seen important changes to these processes, and important changes to the basic direction of the judicial focus. (There is no longer an implied element of protecting the reputation of the congregation, and the focus has shifted almost completely to the protection of children, and recognizing that the shame is on the perpetrator and no one else.) I am satisfied that the WTS did about as much as it was possible to do for now, and that most of the current issues are carry-overs from prior to these last changes.

[Patiently waiting for Truth]

@JW Insider Sorry i totally disagree with your viewpoint. 

Quote :  Some were probably cases of incest, and crimes of opportunity, where the children are no longer in danger after they leave the household. (And this is another reason why the WTS would want to protect the privacy of such a database.)

The Earthwide Organisation isn't very consistent then is it ? Australia handed over the 50 years worth of information, it seems.

The UK, after a court case I believe, handed over the information. BUT HQ America, the GB and their Lawyers, refuse to hand over the Database. They also refuse to apologise to those victims in Australia and to join the redress scheme. 

And I repeat that if Australia had 50 years of info', then America must also have 50 years of info'. Not just a pretend 20 year database. And if the info goes back that far (50 years) then GB members and Writing Department members could be on it. And maybe that is the reason the GB / Lawyers are hiding it all. 

And do you really think Almighty God gives Holy Spirit to those 8 men that are so mean and selfish. Hiding all that perverted information about thousands of paedophiles. 

And once again the physical man has to insult me. Quote "You moron, ................ What a hateful loon!"  Mr Harley is obviously deeply hurt, and i forgive him his insults to me. 

Quote JWI "Even back in the early 1990's a brother in Writing who had worked in the Service Department for several years estimated (to me) that every congregation of 100 people has had at least one. (That's also 1%.)"

A brother of that standing would not make a wild guess off the top of his head. He would have some knowledge to base it on. I would call that inside information. 

And TTH's idea that just because other religions, clubs etc, have a greater number of paedophiles, it is all ok for the CCJW to have thousands. What i cannot understand though is, if as TTH says, no one else kept any records, then how does anyone know exactly how many  paedophiles / victims those other organisations had. How to you compare JW records with no records at all ? 

•  

[Srecko Sostar]

2 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

But such will never be known for sure because practically nobody other than JWs made note of abuse cases within the membership; Witnesses did so in the spirit of Romans 2:22– to ensure that they ‘practice what you preach.’ In doing so, they produce a ‘paper trail,’ the 1000 ARC cases that nobody else produces because everybody else was content to not look.

Their vigilance is readily used against them. It is the classic example of the cynical phrase, ‘No good deed goes unpunished.’ Had they stuck their heads in the sand, as was the pattern elsewhere, and cried like Sergeant Shultz: “I know nothing!!” they would have fared better.

Apologize for my harsh words, but i don't understated is this comment produced by your motives (emotions) only or by your mental, mind conclusion about same information we all have possibility to read.   

How can you say, or better to say, how you can prove, supposed fact, how only JW "made note of abuse cases within membership" ? Many institutions collects documentation about own daily work. And many have to stay for shorter or longer time and some of them have to stay forever, according to archival regulations.

Did Australasia WT showed vigilance? Why they decide to produce papers to ARC, and their friends in NY WT doing opposite. WT in US refused to produce documents about CSA inside JW church to "secular authorities". What they are? Vigilant too? 

Documents can be used ONLY against those who committed crime. Perpetrators or individuals, or organized group of individuals or perhaps top management of institutions who hiding facts, are those who committed crime.

Documents about pedophile cases are not against rank and file JW members who living in "spiritual paradise" of ignorance about this bad things.

You are writer of books, you reading a lot, so you know this.