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Showing content with the highest reputation on 11/11/2019 in all areas

  1. 3 points
    .... the problem with that is you have to have them with you. Hmmmmmm.
  2. 3 points
    He (Tom Henry) probably used "some" in his explanation because the scripture says all unrighteousness is sin. The scriptures also show that there is a sin that incurs death and that we would not expect God to cover over. (See Hebrews 10;26) Therefore the apostle John said not to make request about that kind of sin. That is permanent death. (1 John 5:16, 17) 16 If anyone catches sight of his brother committing a sin that does not incur death, he will ask, and God will give life to him, yes, to those not committing sin that incurs death. There is a sin that does incur death. It is concerning that sin that I do not tell him to make request. 17 All unrighteousness is sin, and yet there is a sin that does not incur death. (Hebrews 10:26) For if we practice sin willfully after having received the accurate knowledge of the truth, there is no longer any sacrifice for sins left,... ===== This is what I gather about suicide or self murder from my research in the Bible itself. (Genesis 9:6) 6 Anyone shedding man’s blood, by man will his own blood be shed, for in God’s image He made man. (Proverbs 28:17) 17 A man burdened with bloodguilt for taking someone’s life will keep fleeing until the grave. Let no one support him. Both of these remedies would be difficult to achieve for a man taking his own life. So there is a difference in taking your own life and taking someone else’s life. So it boils down to the same thing - you have to leave it to God. God knows whether it is forgivable or whether it is willful and wanton, disrespecting the Creator and life itself.
  3. 3 points
    I thought your post made a lot of good points. We know about God's mercy but we don't want to purposely take advantage of it for selfish purposes. (Of course, we can never get into the mind of the person committing suicide to know whether they were motivated by selfishness, even if the person leaves a lucid note. We leave it to Jehovah to read hearts.) Also, wanted to point out that Paul never used the word "some" (in case anyone would have read your words to imply that). Either way, though, I think your point is still valid.
  4. 3 points
    Outta Here

    JW OPPOSERS GROUPS

    "Better use of dedicated funds" is a phrase I hear frequently. Isn't that more appropriate? "Saving" money implies hoarding it up somewhere. I think we are more in the business of using resources aren't we?. Compare Matt.25:24-27 😊
  5. 3 points
    Anna

    JW OPPOSERS GROUPS

    All the redrawing and reshuffling of boundaries and the sell off of some Kingdom Halls and the merging of some congregations is probably because a few financial experts were finally allowed to sit down and ascertain the efficiency (or lack of) of the way Kingdom Halls were being used. They called it equalizing. When I hear brothers say that obeying the restructuring, and cooperating with moving to different halls is obeying Jehovah, (was also in a video) I can't help wondering why they don't just say it's because it saves money. Why bring Jehovah into it and make people feel like they're sinning against Him if they don't cooperate.
  6. 3 points
    This viewpoint is personal and not only unreasonable, but unscriptural. In fact, it is also out of line with Jehovah's Witnesses thinking by at least 29 years. As Melinda above said, do your own research in the theocratic literature, and avoid some of the clumsy blundering presented by cleverdicks more interested in their own opinions *** g90 9/8 p. 23 Suicides—A Resurrection? *** Stunned friends of a suicide victim may thus take comfort in knowing that “Jehovah has shown mercy to those fearing him. For he himself well knows the formation of us, remembering that we are dust.” (Psalm 103:10-14) Only God can fully understand the role of mental sickness, extreme stress, even genetic defects, in a “suicidal crisis,” which, the National Observer noted, “is not a lifetime characteristic [but] often a matter only of minutes or of hours.”—See Ecclesiastes 7:7. Granted, one who takes his own life deprives himself of the opportunity to repent of his self-murder. But who can say whether one driven to suicide might have had a change of heart had his fatal attempt failed? Some notorious murderers have, in fact, changed and earned God’s forgiveness during their lifetime.—2 Kings 21:16; 2 Chronicles 33:12, 13. Thus, Jehovah, having paid “a ransom in exchange for many,” is within his right to extend mercy, even to some self-murderers, by resurrecting them and giving them the precious opportunity to “repent and turn to God by doing works that befit repentance.”—Matthew 20:28; Acts 26:20. *** g00 2/22 pp. 6-7 Given a Desire to Live *** Yet, never forget that Jehovah God raises up the dead and that this might well include our loved ones who because of depression, mental illness, or despair took their own lives.—See “The Bible’s Viewpoint: Suicides—A Resurrection?” in Awake! of September 8, 1990, pages 22-3. While suicide cannot be justified, it is comforting to remember that the future prospects of our loved ones rest with a God who fully understands that weaknesses and frailties could push one to such desperate action. The Bible says of Jehovah: “As the heavens are higher than the earth, his loving-kindness is superior toward those fearing him. As far off as the sunrise is from the sunset, so far off from us he has put our transgressions. As a father shows mercy to his sons, Jehovah has shown mercy to those fearing him. For he himself well knows the formation of us, remembering that we are dust.”—Psalm 103:11-14.
  7. 3 points
    Anna

    Suicide. God's view. Organisation's view

    No new light, just the elder's opinion, and not a very good one at that. It still stands that Jehovah will be the judge as he knows the reasons and circumstance.
  8. 2 points
    Thanks @Matthew9969 for using WT magazines. This articles shows how GB want to present us, how mental illness was not started with "apostates" in recent time. Wording "mental illness" is connect with WT Society context about result, outcome that is seen in JW members who think how they are sort of people who belongs to people known as 144000 class. They numbered several reasons why some JW member thinks about self as King and Priest aka part of 144000. They say: in 1996 -after a while they acknowledged that this was an error -an emotional response -perhaps physical or mental strain in 2011 -past religious beliefs -mental or emotional imbalance in 2016 -mistakenly think that they are anointed -mental or emotional problems It is obvious how WT Society is organization who looks on one part of members as people who have not mental and emotional balance. Perhaps GB say so, because of Jesus words how he is send to ill, sick people, and that also including physical, mental and emotional defects. But we see how GB put this explanation on exactly one specific class or group of individuals inside organization - "anointed". On all anointed individuals who are outside of GB... or Helpers. Well, here we see how few anointed individuals who are in position to call themselves as FDS who sharing spiritual food, decided to sending message through publications how only them are mentally, physically and emotionally in perfect health. All other are in question. Well, where insane people living? Inside or outside sanatorium?
  9. 2 points
    Outta Here

    JW OPPOSERS GROUPS

    Or technology per se? The scripture spoke of a time when men who were delegated to care for mundane tasks required spiritual and secular qualifications in view of the context of their work. This required appropriate selection. Similarly today, secular background is required to implement technical solutions for spiritual tasks effectively. The acquisition of secular skills is sometimes erroneously viewed as antithetical to spiritual endeavour. Therefore an important and enlightened balance needs to be achieved and maintained to avoid waste. This of course will have to incorporate the principles of Ex.35:30-35. Quite a challenge, but apparently met is my observation.
  10. 1 point
    TrueTomHarley

    JW OPPOSERS GROUPS

    There should be Kingdom Halls on every street corner, like gas stations, only more so.
  11. 1 point
    Hi, there are only a few JWs who believe so - unlike millions - almost 1 Billion Christian's on earth in various denominations whom ALL think they are going to heaven to be with jesus to rule over whom?
  12. 1 point
    I'm using a spork from now on. This gives me half a chance to stay sane and fit.
  13. 1 point
    Does this way of thinking actually come from the 'world' ? It seems to be a away of taking away the credibility of people. I'm sure it's the type of thing you see in films, when someone wants to make another person feel insecure, or wants to make a person doubt themselves. If in fact the Governing Body are NOT inspired, then how would they actually know if someone else was ? And i do think their attitude is passed down to the elders. A bit off topic but I had a funny thought. Sometimes the Organisation is compared to Noah's Ark. However there were only EIGHT humans in that Ark and the rest were dumb animals that were controlled by those EIGHT humans. Um how many members of the Governing Body are there ? Oh yes EIGHT. And who in control of the Org ? Those EIGHT humans. Does make a person wonder exactly what the Governing Body thinks of all the rest in their Ark.
  14. 1 point
    The main thing, God will know the reason why. The biggest factor to consider is Exodus 20:13, Deuteronomy 5:17 Didn’t Jesus himself quote from the Old Testament? Matthew 19:17-18 What is anger and reconciliation in Matthew 5:21 all of which apostle Paul well understood as “some” that committed an act against God’s creation would be considered for judgment as did Christ. With sociology, we need to understand when the word “suicide” was invented. Self-murder can be more appropriate to align our knowledge with scripture with a greater degree in understanding. https://academic.oup.com/jsh/article-abstract/46/3/620/908916?redirectedFrom=PDF https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/philosophy/article/suicide-and-selfmurder/2C862F7D9DC18AC9BEE68DA5E3334814 https://www.jstor.org/stable/1109529?seq=1#metadata_info_tab_contents
  15. 1 point
    Perhaps he was just tired of having her incessant screaming, smearing poop on the walls, chasing him arount' the house with a machete, poisoning his food, and microwaving the cat.
  16. 1 point
  17. 1 point
    James Thomas Rook Jr.

    JW OPPOSERS GROUPS

    You cannot economically justify having a baby ... but willy-nilly ... people DO have babies. Some things are more important than economic justification.
  18. 1 point
    If you do commit suicide, make sure you have 2 witnesses, then maybe you'll be resurrected.
  19. 1 point
    When it comes to analyzing the nature of a person’s true intent under God’s law about suicide, witnesses need to be careful when an error in personal judgment can distract others from the truth. Yes, the Watchtower has printed several articles about suicide, and God’s mercy. However, at what point can God’s mercy not be a factor for redemption. I find many witnesses are conflicted when it comes to hope. Especially if it’s personal. Meaning close to one's heart, a friend or relative. Several things need to be considered, before we can be complicit with our answers. The inability to have control due to mental illness. A person without having control of their action “might” be a good reason to apply mercy. However, what of those that take their lives due to passion, anger, or selfish emotion. A man or woman takes their lives because of conflict with a personal relationship.(i.e. murder/suicide) How about a rich person that takes his/her life because they lost it all. They couldn’t stand the idea of being poor after experiencing riches and had a commanding life to be served by others. The early church fathers were conflicted as well. They labeled suicide a sin. However, what kind of sin. Since no one can get into the minds of those inflicted to know, we cannot say for sure who God will hold accountable for their personal actions. *** g90 9/8 p. 22 Suicides—A Resurrection? *** The Bible’s Viewpoint Suicides—A Resurrection? THE tragic news of a suicide does not close a chapter in the lives of relatives and friends; it opens one—a chapter of mixed feelings of pity and anger, sorrow and guilt. And it raises the question: May we entertain any hope for our friend who took his or her life? Although self-inflicted death is never justified, never righteous, the apostle Paul did hold out a beautiful hope for even some unrighteous ones. As he told a Roman court of law: “I have hope toward God . . . that there is going to be a resurrection of both the righteous and the unrighteous.”—Acts 24:15. Even the apostle Paul understood his limitation to know who God would judge. The keyword here is highlighted. Why would the word “some” be important. Following scripture in 1 Corinthians 3:16, Romans 6:16 1 Corinthians 6:19 19Do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own; 20you were bought at a price. Back then, if someone was a slave, was that life their own? It will all depend on if someone has missing faculties or the action is a selfish one. If someone comments, whatever you do just don’t commit suicide, perhaps that person feels a person’s thought is a selfish reason behind it, and that Elder would be motived by concern, to correct a misguided emotion. What Witnesses should “never” do is be absolute when stating “all” suicides will not be judged and will receive mercy. While scripture doesn’t specifically state the word “suicide” it is necessary to understand the correct way how the Watchtower articles are presented to the public, and not go beyond its true intent. 1 Corinthians 3:17 17 If anyone destroys God’s temple, God will destroy him; for God’s temple is holy, and you are that temple.
  20. 1 point
  21. 1 point
    ... this is why an ice skater pulls her arms in closer to her body ..so that she will spin faster.
  22. 1 point
    I felt I needed to catch the speaker's words; they were, “apostates do not drift away from the truth”. In my household, there are four individuals who use to live the life of a JW; me, a widely known disfellowshipped “apostate”, my husband who is not disfellowshipped but never hesitated to reveal the organization’s hypocrisy to the elders while still “in”, my son and daughter-in-law who eventually quit going to the meetings, and are not disfellowshipped but shunned by all JWs they may happen to see. My daughter-in-law’s parents refuse to visit their daughter and grandchildren. Out of the four of us, I am the only disfellowshipped vocal one, the other three just walked away, yet all of us are treated the same. Because of the act of shunning, wouldn’t you say that all four in our house are considered, “apostates”?
  23. 1 point
    I will guess how many ex Bethel workers who lost their jobs after WT Society accepted a new economic and financial audit of operations within the corporation, ask for and received Letters of Recommendations. No matter of jobs they had in Bethel, from cleaning and washing to IT skills, those letters possibly helped some of them when looking for secular jobs. I know one Bethel elder who left Bethel and because he has fine knowledge about computers, he open private business and now living from that. His wife also found secular job. One sister who left Bethel as cleaner, have not easy time to found and keep cleaning work at secular job market. Some other Bethel people lost place in Home, and went to pioneer service or looking for jobs. I do not know what official credentials, diploma they have. But that depend on what secular school education they have had accomplished before Bethel. Only, as i learned by @JW Insider respond, Gilead School students received formal piece of paper as proof of finished education inside WT Society. All other, Bethel workers, can get Recommendation Letter. But I am not sure for what secular jobs, Gilead School students, can/would candidate for in real word. Funny thing i see in Recommendation Letter and Gilead Diploma. According to Bible verses in 2 Cor 3, JW rejecting such Letters and Diplomas as proof for their qualification about service, ministry (in teaching others about Gospel, using Bible as whole for teaching others) This including two things: 1) "spiritual" qualification for teaching , and 2) "spiritual" qualification for position in hierarchy (clergy style). On other side it is good if you have some paper as proof of your qualification .... for something. Or as proof how you have skills and experience in cleaning floors. Little irony, you won't mind me .:)) I am working in one High School. For several years we have White Boards and board markers in almost all classes. Few smart boards, too. Only in one room, teacher (older generation) want to stay on white chalk and green board. Ministry of education, working on school reform (new curriculum) and equip schools with technological equipment. In the same time teachers and professors in Grammar (children from 7-15 of age) and High school (from 15 - 18 of age) system, are in strike for better material position, salary. It is hard to find professor for IT subject to teach children, because they can find jobs with much better salary than in school.
  24. 1 point
    I have heavily invested in a lesser precious metal... lead. Oh wait ... I prepared for the Zombie Apocalypse..
  25. 1 point
    I do not consider myself a god, or a sheep. I consider myself a "Sheepdog", whose NATURAL instincts and "function in life" is to protect women, and children, and my family, and all innocent people, and if necessary, to engage in mortal combat with others who try to harm them. ...this even makes the sheep VERY nervous, but the reason many of them are sheep is not a desire to be peaceable with all men, as far as it depends upon them ... but because they are naturally stupid, and or cowards. Andre: I have no idea what your last two posts mean in the real world. Fine ideas from Scripture, but irrelevant to this post. If I have missed something, please explain it to me in short words, short sentences, and short paragraphs, .... in your own words. Otherwise, it is just "white noise". ... like a fan running while one is sleeping.
  26. 1 point
    Arauna

    JW OPPOSERS GROUPS

    Thanks for that personal experience and viewpoint. I have seen (especially in computer field) many brilliant kids. One of my nephews also played music while teaching himself programming. He is a firewall programmer (or something very saught after in protection field) without a degree. I marvel sometimes at kids who turn out technical machines in poor countries (especially central Africa) where the intellectual and technical landscape is barren. They somehow find books and teach themselves. My best friend in Africa has a son who manufactures feeding machines for factories (including car factories). He designs and makes them. I knew him as a boy. She raised him and his 2 sisters alone and did not have money for secondary education. I wish all stories turn out like this but unfortunately we do know reality - not all people are innovative. Some have to go to vocational school to learn how to do a job in order to become employable. To be an entrepeneur one needs a skill (self-taught or acquired during secondary education) to provide something of value one can sell.
  27. 1 point
    JW Insider

    JW OPPOSERS GROUPS

    Definitely not dropouts...... one can keep learning without going to university. One can get very talented people who have NO degree.......in science or art but still attain an extremely high level of competency. Did I mention that my youngest son was accepted to each and every Ivy League university in the United States? Just wanted the excuse to mention that again if I didn't state it before. 😊 His final choices were between MIT, CalTech, Harvard, and he chose Harvard because he also writes/performs music and studies history. He graduated with his degree in theoretical/engineering physics (with a minor in music) and was almost immediately contacted by another Ivy League university graduate who has worked at each Bethel site in upstate NY. Through this particular circumstance I have come to learn of several more university graduates working at NY Bethels. The engineers and environmental specialists, even IT specialists at various Bethels, have become more and more "infested" with Ivy League graduates. These are not always full-time positions, but are persons added to the team. At one time they were given only a consultant role, or advisory role, and often ignored, but the Society has learned through very expensive mistakes, to give them leadership roles in these teams. When I was at Bethel in Brooklyn many years ago, a flailing Computer/IT department was just starting up and a lot of expensive mistakes were being made when a couple of brothers with a lot of "spiritual" seniority were chosen to lead the new department. After about a half-million dollars worth of mistakes, they started to ditch the "decision by seniority" paradigm and gave more decisions to a brother who had a high position at IBM, but who was also arrogant to a fault. And they brought in a new bunch of fresh college graduated kids from around the country. One was a sister that my brother knew from Missouri, and one was a brother I had known from Missouri. (A brother who had not pioneered or even been very active.) We had a four person room at Bethel and he became one of the four roommates. My roommate would commiserate with the sister and another member of the Computer department about the ridiculous arguments and decisions of the day. As it turned out, Arauna, you were right. A lot more practical progress was being made from a small team of computer hobbyists from up at the Wallkill Watchtower Farm in upstate NY. My roommate and the sister thought this was hilarious because there was a lot of prejudice against the "farm boys" even though the difference between who got assigned to the farm and who got assigned to Brooklyn was often just as random as a name in a hat. The "untrained" farm boys actually finished a home-made computer that started to computerize typesetting flawlessly through the APS5. This was a huge breakthrough project that Brooklyn had already wasted half-a-million on.




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