Jump to content

Leaderboard


Popular Content

Showing content with the highest reputation on 05/23/2020 in all areas

  1. 9 points
    I sincerely hope he doesn't change. I've enjoyed his brutal truth throughout the years. Courage is not something that needs changing. I hope you are ok @James Thomas Rook Jr.
  2. 3 points
    I am truly saddened by this....I hope you are okay brother and you have been a great encouragement...because even tho you were obviously hurt with in the truth....you never lost your genuine love for your God Jehovah...and you underestimate your faith...faith is easy when it has not been beaten,,,,but to still have faith when you have been beaten and lay wounded.....that’s real faith...and it would be a honour to have served shoulder to shoulder with you. I don’t know what’s going on..but I sincerely hope you are reasonably well....and a huge thank you from me....for being REAL !!!!!!
  3. 2 points
    Rook has done it before. He's part of the family pretty much.
  4. 2 points
    True. And that Revelation book was written at the same time as the 1989 article when a lot of these "hints" of world disaster from outsiders were highly prized. I think that change you mentioned was made around 2006. But it reminds me that the Society put out a new edition of the "Truth" book in 1981 even though we never did much with it. The time for the original "Truth" book (1968) had already passed, and this update was well nigh ignored compared to the original. And the edits were all focused on getting rid of the quotes from scientists or authors who had directly or indirectly pointed to 1975. (But replacing them with just enough space to replace only those parts so that most of the pages could be reprinted without redoing the pagination of whole book.) So it's a matter of just how many selective quotes were selected from those "some scientists." After a while the purpose of those quotes tells more about the selector than the scientists, especially because we could have found just as many or more who believed that science would resolve life-threatening problems. Back when we believed it was important to remind people that man had been on the earth for 6,000 years, the publications even looked for quotes that dropped that hint, and then italics might even be added to make sure readers noticed the reference to "6,000 years." Here's one from 1975: *** g75 8/22 p. 20 Is the Industrial Way of Life a Failure? *** Psychoanalyst Erich Fromm declares that the current sicknesses of industrial society can be dealt with “only if the whole system as it has existed during the last 6000 years of history can be replaced by a fundamentally different one.” [Italics ours] Fromm saw no particular significance in the number 6,000. But we certainly did. It's a little bit like the way the Watch Tower publications used J.A.Bengel, above, completely out of context on his point about the Hebrews believing a generation was 75 years. First of all the statement was completely false. And his context was only that it fit the time from Jesus' birth to the year 70. If you read the entire reference, you can see that it's just as much about how Jesus' words would fit the period of 40 years from the year 30 to the year 70. And that it would fit the 75 year idea, too. The idea of 75 years, supposedly found in the Seder Olam, was not there in the original Seder Olam (Rabbah) from the year 169 CE. It's not even in the most expanded version of the Seder Olam (Zutta) from 804 CE. (I took the picture from his 1862 version of his work on New Testament words. The 1877 version had changed Hebrews to Jews, but still contained false information about the supposed 75 years: The footnote (2) in the above is not about the 75 years but about how in the 40 years leading up to Jerusalem's destruction in 70, that there were earthquakes and famines and pestilence and war, just as Jesus had predicted. I point this out because it shows how easy it is to start selecting specialists and scholars (even if one needs to go back to 1862) to find a "fact" that isn't even a "fact" to support chronology. It seems important to me, because of the potential for doing this all over again with 2034 or the "devil in the details" behind Splane's chart.
  5. 2 points
    I wrote a post long ago about how they had modified a certain phrase in a Revelation book update: “Some scientists believe that nuclear war might destroy all life on earth within 25 years.” The reason they had done that is because Vic Vomodog had marked off the time on his calendar and he was hoping, praying, pleading that there would be no worldwide nuclear war within 25 years so that he could crow over how they had been wrong again. (after 25 years was okay) I said then I thought taking the quote out was a mistake. Who would be left with egg on their faces if 25 years passed? “Some scientists.” What great debt to we owe to “some scientists” that we should cover for them? They urinate all over Genesis. Why should we bail them out?
  6. 2 points
    I suspect he just took the wrong medication that night. ;-)
  7. 2 points
    I will truly miss you, James. Psalm 26
  8. 1 point
    In good times, and bad times, in times easy and times hard, I have relied on the JW-Archive as a sounding board for many things, and appreciate the forbearance when I have ranted and raved about all sorts of things, even from the Librarian, who often deleted my posts, with cause. I have come to the conclusion that logic and reason is not the end-all that I had aspired to, and that all things being considered, it would have been better for me to be "Brother Watchtower", than the man I have become. I am 73 years old, and I probably do not have time to change .... realistically, but for 14 billion years I did not exist, and I don't remember it bothering me any. My Wife Susan, and my sons and daughter will fulfill whatever unfulfilled dreams I had, as the stars I could reach ... were just starfish on the beach. With whatever time I have left, it is going to be my life's challenge, so I bid each of you so long, and hope you stay closer to Jehovah than I did. ....and like Forest Gump said "... and that's all I am going to say about that." Goodby.
  9. 1 point
    Yes @Space Merchant I do realise that Jesus has all authority and power given to him and that he leads God's people by the use of Holy Spirit. The point i was making was that a person does not need to be guided by the CCJW or Watchtower or their GB. I think in part you would agree with this ? You yourself are not a JW but you feel you have a close relationship with God through Christ. Mr Harley seems to feel that a person has to be a JW and work inline with that organisation to be able to serve God. @TrueTomHarley I've noticed that you have changed your comment.
  10. 1 point
      Hello guest!
    genetic analyses of the virus have not found any substantial changes which would effectively disguise it from the immune system.
  11. 1 point
    @TrueTomHarley He lost all his kids—none will speak with him. And for what? So as to spread every opposition taunt and insult about the earthly organization that Witness and 4Jah and Srecko and Shiwiiiiiiiiiiiiiii and Matthew4 5784 are perfectly content and capable to spread? That is worth losing your family for? You are a writer, and like many writers you write in riddles. But the gist of the above is that James spread every opposition taunt and insult about the earthly organization that Witness and 4Jah and Srecko and Shiwiiiiiiiiiiiiiii and Matthew4 5784 are perfectly content and capable to spread? James spoke truth. He didn't shy away from it. And if his children turned away from him for his speaking truth, then his children are at fault, not James. And if you are still so spiritually immature that you need to be 'bottle fed' by your GB, and if you are brainwashed into believing that the CCJW have God's approval, then you seriously have a problem for yourself. Its a good job the disciples didn't feel that they still needed to be bottle fed by the Scribes and the Pharisees after Jesus was no longer on Earth. After Jesus had been resurrected to heaven the disciples had no leader on earth. They relied on being guided from above, by Holy Spirit.
  12. 1 point
    admin

    Monk during Coronavirus

  13. 1 point
    He made it all public previously. These are your words, not mine. I am not casting him anywhere. I am very glad to see he re-evaluating some choices he has made so that Nobody Else does. I do. He doesn’t buy into your claptrap that you can remain close to Jehovah while being at serious odds with his earthly organization. Thinking hit the nail on the head—he is REAL. If you are bringing your gift to the altar and you recall that your brother has something against you due to the outrageous things you have said, first make peace with your brother, and then offer up your gift. I imagine that this is what he is doing now.
  14. 1 point
    Quote TTH This is always the case in any paper about anything. Everyone selects point of support. Nobody selects points that undermine their premise. I see no reason to spin it as though it were some sort of conspiracy. There is scarcely anyone who does not do it. BUT the CCJW & W/t, say they are NO PART OF THE WORLD. That is supposed to be the BIG difference. Tom is just showing that they are really no different to any other religion or organisation in this world..
  15. 1 point
    The term generation can also be used as a measure of time with reference to past or future ages. An age which is identified by certain features. That is why I demonstrated the above definition with the pre-flood generation / age and its impact; also the post-flood generation/ age which also consisted of a very long period.. Today they are still commemorating events of WW2 which is an event which is still part of the age starting with WW1 because it is identified by world-wars. However, those people who saw these 'massive signs' and lived in the aftermath of any of these wars may soon start dying. Many are in their sixties or older. I am a post-ww2 baby which understands the impact of the war due to listening to the many stories my grandfather and father told me (both were in the war).. Most of the young generations less than 30 years have no clue. I personally always understand history in the context of the age........ because people are ALWAYS impacted by what happens in their age. Russel was influenced by pyramids because he was living an age that was obsessed with the orient.... because of all the discoveries in the news of artifacts in the middle east. Archeology was a fledgling science and the great mysteries were continuously revealed. It even gave rise to a new religion called Mormonism. So people do get distracted by what is happening in the world and its propaganda. This is why I always caution on this forum that one cannot just Google information about an era and think you understand the mindset and full implications of the era. An era can have many features which define it. Even short periods have many features i.e. the roaring twenties was short-cut by the depression but some of its ideas still lived on in those who were part of it. The generation that was impacted by the first and second world wars are now getting on in life...... we know the stories and the oral traditions...... The millenials, frankly do not care. They are impacted by what happened in the sixties - the loss of morals and experimentation with drugs, and the new philosophies that were brewing in the Frankfort school etc.
  16. 1 point
    I don't recall that particular context. But I didn't include all the quotes from Wohl either. Also, if it were Wohl, he didn't say it until 1980. I noticed that there were several interesting quotes about the "industrial age" and "industrial revolution" that could be implied to fit what you (and Wohl) are saying, but I didn't see the one in the place where you saw it. This reminds me of another thing the Society said about the "generation." It's definitely not the quote you are looking for, but it reminded me about the kind of generation that Arauna mentioned: *** g88 4/8 pp. 13-14 The Last Days—What’s Next? *** How Long Can a Generation Last? The American Legion Magazine pointed out that 4,743,826 U.S. men and women had participated in World War I. But in 1984 only 272,000 remained alive, and they were dying off at an average of nine every hour. Does that mean, then, that the generation of 1914 has already disappeared? The Greek word for generation is geneá, used by Matthew, Mark, and Luke in their accounts of Jesus’ words. It can have different applications according to the context. However, The New International Dictionary of New Testament Theology defines it as: “Those born at the same time . . . Associated with this is the meaning: the body of one’s contemporaries, an age.” A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament states: “The sum total of those born at the same time, expanded to include all those living at a given time generation, contemporaries.” These definitions allow for all those who were born around the time of a historic event and all those who were alive at that time. J. A. Bengel states in his New Testament Word Studies: “The Hebrews . . . reckon seventy-five years as one generation, and the words, shall not pass away, intimate that the greater part of that generation [of Jesus’ day] indeed, but not the whole of it, should have passed away before all should be fulfilled.” This became true by the year 70 C.E. when Jerusalem was destroyed. Likewise today, most of the generation of 1914 has passed away. However, there are still millions on earth who were born in that year or prior to it. And although their numbers are dwindling, Jesus’ words will come true, “this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened.” This is yet another reason for believing that Jehovah’s thieflike day is imminent. So, what events should alert Christians watch for?. . . “Peace and Security” . . . For anyone who wants to do the math puzzle, there must have already been just about no one left from this number of persons still surviving who had participated in WWI. (Assuming there were 272,000 dying at 9 per hour since 1984.) That was near the end of 1984, because although it doesn't say, the American Legion article is from their December 1984 issue. So since there are 24 hours a day for 365.25 days every year, multiplying by 9, and carrying the 1, there would be 78,894 dying every year and, therefore, they would all be gone by April 15, 1988. And this article came out in the April 8, 1988 issue! And it was in March 1988 that the Awake! magazine had just begun adding the following to the inside masthead about "the Creator's promise of a peaceful and secure new world before the generation that saw the events of 1914 passes away." (That statement was in every issue for the next 7 and one-half years.) And, of course, it was just a few months later when the January 1, 1989 Watchtower indicated that Armageddon would be here by the year 2000. Someone caught that mistake in just enough time to remove it from the bound volume and the Watchtower Library CD. Of course, people don't really die off at constant rates like that (9 per hour), but I get the impression that someone was watching those numbers from that American Legion article a little too closely, perhaps from the time it came out. It's like you joked about before, about waiting for the last person to die off. (At least, I hope you were joking!) In fact, in the article above, it was the first time that the number 75 had been used for the "Hebrew" length of a generation, based on something this scholar named Bengel had said. And the scholar was actually referring to the highly discredited Seder Olam. And, of course, the Seder Olam doesn't say anything about a generation being 75 years. In the Seder Olam, except for the longer generations before the Flood, it would have been a closer match to the 490 years as being only 14 generations, per Matthew. That's 490 divided by 14 which is 35 years for each generation. The reason that Bengel wanted it to be 75 was because of his theory that the generation could therefore include not just the 40 years from Jesus' prophecy in 30 CE to 70 CE, but it was a generation that could have started when Jesus was born (which he assumed was about 5 BCE). Also, Bengel was only interested in 70 CE, but the real reason for the 75 years in the Awake! was the point about persons born in 1914 or the year prior, as it says. 1914 + 75, is 1989, and for the year prior 1913 + 75 is 1988. So this was cutting it pretty close. And according to the American Legion magazine, the last surviving soldier from WWI would be dead in just a couple weeks.
  17. 1 point
    Yes, and that is real danger. Because we can never be sure about ...
  18. 1 point
    "Generation" is cluster (of people) around major historical events. "Historical generation" are people who have an experience or a series of experience. In both examples we see how center of attention, limelight are not people but events or in Bible terminology "signs". But, are they, "signs" in the eyes of the beholder trustful, reliable measure for conclusions? And as you mentioned before, what "signs" and events truly speaking? Are they beginning of start point or beginning of end point? Or, are they a means for help, for understanding that it will become more difficult for each generation in each subsequent period marked by new and uncertain things, events, circumstances? Things can going from bad to worst, and they going in that direction for centuries. But also, we see how some things went from bad to better. It depends, all is in the eyes of beholder.
  19. 1 point
    Space Merchant

    Joseph the Dreamer

    Yes. But reading it daily is like training the muscle. Day and night we must - Joshua 1:8. If we can eat everyday, we can read everyday, that is how I see it.
  20. 1 point
    Exactly, Christians today are not inspired, they cannot profess fulfillment, they cannot do the things that Jonah, Agabus, and the others can do. Hence the following: A normal, Spirit led Prophet who is clearly not inspired and not infallible have the gifts of the spirit regarding prophesying. It is regarded as dominant, the ability for one to profess in spreading the good news gospel of the Kingdom and the Messianic Age of the coming Christ, such of which gives evidence of the holy spirit's role as seen in Scripture, Matthew 24:14, Luke 4:18, Acts 2:18, 19 and Romans 12:6-8. Such ones with spiritual gifts have that is of what is cultivated, or cultivated gifts as some would say. Christians, what do they do exactly? They... Preach the Good New Gospel and of God's Kingdom are Spirit Led, Spirit Led as is wanting to receive and or is given the Holy Spirit. They also preach the coming of the Christ (Messianic Age), with Scriptural evidence as noted above, therefore, your last statement is in err, 4Jah2me. Which by a legitimate definition means: In Abrahamic religions, the Messianic Age is the future period of time on Earth in which the messiah will reign and bring universal peace and brotherhood, without any evil. Many believe that there will be such an age; some refer to it as the consummate "kingdom of God" or the "world to come". No Anti-Trinitarian/Non-Trinitarian has ever, called claim to being inspired. That is both undeniable and an absolute fact. The only people who are to make such a claim are among the mainstream Christians, that make absurd claims of being able to see God and or Satan, as well as the dead, let alone being able to speak to spirits, hence my previous remark to Witness about New Age practices. Granted it was stated that such abilities of prophets of old can do, an Inspired Prophet, it has died off with the apostle, hence no one, not even the students, onward to this day can do this, and or make claim to being an inspired prophet. The latter as been debunked a couple times, even by former members, as well as current Bible Students, as is with a couple sources that studied all about the pastor for 55+ years. It was also mentioned that other than the Bible Students, there were other groups that also came to that conclusion and also believed in the second coming of the Christ whereas the Christ was to be made a King. The calculations in question revolves around the very thing, at the time, many Christian deemed popular, the study of pyramid (Pyramidology) Note: It is said that many intelligent, as well as knowledgeable people around the world were convinced that the Great Pyramid had been divinely constructed to reveal Biblical truths. The focus was that of the Great Pyramid of Giza. That said, the pastor was professing this based on a Biblical interpretation, which is in connection to the Gentile Times, and even prior there was a few statements by said pastor, according to those that had studied him, such information can be searched on this forum, for it was disccused. That being said, during that year, there has been other things going on other than a dreadful war, the spiked corruption, etc. One of the reasons why the other groups, existing and no longer existing sided with the notion of the Gentile Times. As for the last bit, you left out the schism, which resulted in what was stated in the book being taken out of context and the number of groups that came about that day, moreover, if you continue to read pass that point, you can see as to where the point is coming from, and it is more in connection with the conveying of Ezekiel as is the Book of Revelations, hence why, by some, it is an important book, but to others, they take a small sample and take said sample out of context. There is no question, that Babylon the Great will be destroyed. That being said, even prior to the study of Pyramids, no claim of inspiration was ever made, if I am not mistaken, among the people who studied the pastor, R. Lite (from what I can dig up granted his sources are very old and being inactive), stated the same thing. R. Lite is also a Bible Student, however, at times he seems to be a bit radical, most likely eldery state is getting to him. Granted this was talked about people, to which I even made a point, there is no statement on this pastor's part and or the group, even after the aftermath, mentioned that God's Day would arrive on 1925, however, if one does the research accordingly, we see the notion of the Jubilee cycle, not bringing this forward results in confusion, which is understandable, but looking into it you can see this. Granted with what was taking place during that time, this pastor vs. others who were unseating, it is no surprise people would come to said conclusion. As for the property itself, if I am not mistaken I remember this was mentioned before. A San Diego man who was unable to leave the state or something of the sort built the house, and said house was allegedly supposed to be used for Christian activities. Other than that, something as uninformed doesn't negate a belief and or faith, as which was mentioned before. No different from the other things uninformed. That being said, this one, as is with the last one, never claimed to be inspired and or is spoken of as being inspired. That has also been debunked and proven otherwise - misinformation. The 1975 year as been used time and time again to prompt a claim of inspiration, however, by doing the research, one can see the truth of the matter. That being said, there was no strong expectation of God's Day being that year, moreover, core of it was focused on Thousand Year Reign of Christ and the following after of 6,000 years of human history. So in short, speculative articles, however, no definite Statement of the sort. The truth of the matter, to be brief, that people mistook the statement, not understanding it properly, hence, it result in people among the faith community drawing their own conclusions. The statement in blue is misleading, because if one were to lookup the article in question, it's focus was in living out your days in the wicked world in peace. To be more specific, no command was given, it simply stated that people had sold their homes to live simpler lives and profess the remaining days of their lives preaching. What is contradicting is, if they sold their homes because of God's Day, who the mention of preaching, if prior to God's Day all good gospel preaching must cease? To add on to that, said article mentioned a very specific verse - 1 John 2:17, and it continues to give points on said "simple life" and "preaching". Actually, the second part is also a bit misleading. Granted no statement was ever given, the latter was coming with their own conclusions and assumptions, and in turn, spread said information among it's community. Now, the statement wasn't based on 1975, for it was more based on people coming to their own conclusions of something, hence the question mentioned prior in said statement even says "If a person has regulated his life with the view that the end would come on a certain date, what should he now do?" Moreover, that book goes into further detail in the next few paragraphs. The book in question is A Solid Basis for Confidence. That is for the last bit, again, due to what is heard, people came to their own conclusions, and assumed, for if the end was to occur, they would not be preaching at all prior. If they ask for God's Spirit. Regardless, someone who HAS the Holy Spirit is still NOT INSPIRED, hence biblical evidence to such point out in my refute quotation to Witness a while back. Therefore, if there was never a claim of being an inspired prophet, the previous remark isn't in your favor. Later followers of the Christ were not inspired, but if given and or asked for the spirit, they do the work, do they not? Likewise, everyone here, including me, we are not inspired prophets, but, because of the spirit, it allows us to preach the gospel truths, granted I never seen some of you do it, granted you only have one focus. So what point are you attempting with this verse? Also just putting this below regarding a prophet inspried, so you betetr understand the differences: An inspired prophet's message is inspired, like that of a breathe of God himself, therefore infallible. God is the primary source of the message and the author of the message granted the Word came from him. The written work itself in it's original form is both sacred and inspired. As the verses, 2 Timothy 3:16 - All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness, For prophets inspired by God have verbal communication through even that of angels, visions that puts forth God's message to those who hear it, they have dreams or night visions that is seen by them even in their sleep, and can convey a message even by means of a trance, other times through songs of praise that contribute to a prophet receiving communication that is divine (Exodus 9:1; Amos 3:3-8; Jonah 3:1, 2) Which goes back the last question, which I've stated: If they ask for God's Spirit. Regardless, someone who HAS the Holy Spirit is still NOT INSPIRED, That being said, both you and I are not even inspired, yet the both of use quote Scripture and explain it, do we not? Therefore, my statement on the matter is factual and true with biblical support to back it up, therefore, when I ask you to prove otherwise, you said nothing, moreover, you did not even look into the verses and passages, found in Scripture, the supports my point. The thing is, do you understand what a false prophet is? It takes discernment to understand what a false prophet is. Hence that is the notion of a prophet who is not inspired, but is indeed a modern day Christian. Christians can be at fault, and can make mistakes, to quickly brand someone as false without proper discernment shows err. As for the other bit, if you carefully do the research, you would come to the conclusion that most people who is not a hardcore Trinitarian, would come to. Even as much, even on Muslims, can even point this out, as seen in some debates, especially concerning the history of the Bible. The thing is, coming to an understanding of things, not coming to conclusions, and be quick to point fingers. How so if the invitation is of God? Only God can choose an individual, to be among the fold with his Son, those of Zion. Again, this is some dark water territory, regarding ANY chosen by God, from ANYWHERE, Christians are to be very, very careful, hence my past statement of judgement in front of the white throne. This is why one must be incredibly neutral, if someone is deemed chosen, for one might end up paying for it in the end. That being said, as I stated before, the late Solider of God was among the chosen, despite who he is and what he does, he has done good things, he has done mistakes, but to belittle him of this type of position and or otherwise, as a man, is a mistake. Hid dealing are with the one who has chosen him, therefore, his dealings is not with us men. Likewise, this goes for ALL chosen ones. That being said, you are a bit confused on what sinning against the spirit actually entails, I suggest you read into what that means. But most of the things you linked do HAVE sources, and said information was talked about time and time again on this forum for years now. Also your claims from before, you can at least attempt to prove them instead of shying away from them, I see you laughed, but cannot bite, as usual. EDIT: Well that escalated quickly, you HELPED me, your sources had links to a number of Articles - thank you for helping me point it out for you.
  21. 1 point
  22. 1 point
    I quote you @Space Merchant " Christians today, who are prophets, of any kind are not inspired and are not infallible and such makes up the majority of Non-Trinitarians today, even to our counterparts who are the Jehovah's Witnesses. Us Christians are Spirit led prophets, the ability to spread the gospel truth and the truth about the Messianic Age, for this is something of which he both have in common. " Well here are the 'uninspired prophets' of the Bible Students and Jehovah's Witnesses :- Jehovah's Witnesses[edit] Main article: Unfulfilled Watch Tower Society predictions Charles Taze Russell, the first president of the Watch Tower Society, calculated 1874 as the year of Christ's Second Coming, and taught that Christ was invisibly present and ruling from the heavens since that year.[13][14][15][16] Russell proclaimed Christ's invisible return in 1874,[17] the resurrection of the saints in 1875,[18] and predicted the end of the "harvest" and the Rapture of the saints to heaven for 1878,[19] and the final end of "the day of wrath" in 1914.[20] 1874 was considered the end of 6,000 years of human history and the beginning of judgment by Christ.[21] A 1917 Watch Tower Society publication predicted that in 1918, God would begin to destroy churches and millions of their members.[22] J.F. Rutherford, who succeeded Russell as president of the Watch Tower Society, predicted that the Millennium would begin in 1925, and that biblical figures such as Abraham, Isaac, Jacob and David would be resurrected as "princes". The Watch Tower Society bought property and built a house, Beth Sarim, in California for their return.[23] From 1966, statements in Jehovah's Witness publications raised strong expectations that Armageddon could arrive in 1975. In 1974 Witnesses were commended for selling their homes and property to "finish out the rest of their days in this old system" in full-time preaching.[24] In 1976 The Watchtower advised those who had been "disappointed" by unfulfilled expectations for 1975 to adjust their viewpoint because that understanding was "based on wrong premises".[25] Four years later, the Watch Tower Society admitted its responsibility in building up hope regarding 1975.[26] Do you think they were guided by God's Holy Spirit ? Deuteronomy 18 v 20 through 22. 20 “‘If any prophet presumptuously speaks a word in my name that I did not command him to speak or speaks in the name of other gods, that prophet must die.a 21 However, you may say in your heart: “How will we know that Jehovah has not spoken the word?” 22 When the prophet speaks in the name of Jehovah and the word is not fulfilled or does not come true, then Jehovah did not speak that word. The prophet spoke it presumptuously. You should not fear him.’ And do you think the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses are now guided by God's Holy Spirit ? Matthew 24 v 24 For false Christs and false prophetsa will arise and will perform great signs and wonders so as to mislead,b if possible, even the chosen ones Anyone that understands God's written word can preach the 'Good news of God's Kingdom' but to put a date or time on it is 'going beyond the things written'. And if a person should be of the Anointed heavenly calling then i would think by doing so they would be sinning against the spirit.
  23. 1 point
    James Thomas Rook Jr.

    Joseph the Dreamer

    I realize all to well that I should NEVER be granted immortality, as one of the Anointed of God, and my chief value as a human is to set a bad example that should NOT be emulated. Perhaps that is why all three of my children turned out so well ....they had my example of what they did not want to turn out like. I do like to discuss philosophy, common sense, practical efficiencies, but consider myself a "theologian" ... nah. The "dark side of the Force, Luke ..." is unfortunately, very strong within me. If I had not been associated with Jehovah's Witnesses my whole adult life, I probably would have been rightfully executed many, many years ago, and Civilization would have been a lot safer.
  24. 1 point
    As far as I know (I do not know the exact history and origin of such a calculation) a period of one year or 12 months is the framework for measuring the term - generation. So, all persons born within those 12 months of a given year can be considered to be one (1) generation. Every person born after December 31st in a given year, becomes part of some other generation from the following year with the date of January 1. This is a normal and common understanding of the term generation. And it works still today between people with normal, common sense. :))) Everything else one wants to add as an explanation for the purpose of defending the idea of GB about the "overlapping generation" is nothing but religious entanglements that should support a failed organized-religious concept of a failed ideology that is still alive in WTJWorg. Most here have finished high school. When you graduated, what generation of graduates were you? What generation of graduates do you still belong to today? To my generation, was born in 1961? Or my father generation who was born in 1923? ............. Or you belong to both (triple) generations of graduates in the same time because you were born in 1949?
  25. 1 point
    I keep seeing "Witness" pop up in your recent posts. You missed me, didn't you! Either that, or I am still an irritating burr in your saddle.
  26. 1 point
    You've done it before, so it is no surprise you have done it again, the first time you made an accusation, granted you did not mention me, hence I only found out when you stated "The Merchant". You also took said accusation and made it as a truth and I challenged you to prove said accusation and you vanished. So speak your peace because the source I am using says otherwise, and I purposely left some things out just to convey them from your response. I am not superior, but if you want to alluded to your past assumption, I invite you to try. I care about facts and the only thing that irks me more is conveying information in a way to spin the narrative. The last time you attempted this, it backfired, likewise with Mr.C. You only say this now granted of what has been presented, hence the interaction prior. But you have adhered to a collective in the past, even though so and so have been wrong or misused information. On the other side of the spectrum, when another person says something that is right, you deem it as something wrong, as is with said collective without coming to an understanding as to what was said, what is the conclusion and so forth. Yes, this is indeed true, even in Bible times this was the case, especially in regard to Apostle Paul, of whom even some Christians seem to have a strong hatred for. A body within any entity will formulate some information in order to maintain some balance. In regards to Christianity, such leaders do so by means application of Bible principles. I'll give you an example, people living together prior to marriage. Clearly, granted we get an example from the Bible, Christians can make the application of how this can be a potential danger, especially when it is known that the flesh is weak and imperfect, coupled with how the world views sex. Because of that, in order to prevent anything bad from happening, a body of Christian bodies and or heads discuss these things, and come to a conclusion on prevention, in doing so, the chosen ruling is then presented to the other body, Church Congregants in form of a sermon and or message, even by means of alternatives regarding newcomers. That said, they're not yes men, they are not "yes men". These are both separate political entities, hence, has no correlation of what is presented. Those opposition parties are not too far from the left and the right, as is with the Republican and Democratic parties in the US, and or the oppositions in various countries, and clearly they are not a united source in decision making, hence, opposition. Although you are not into politics, granted, I am sure all of us here are neutral, it would be wise to know the basics. That being said, voting is a far different story in regard to the focus. They are merely religious heads/leaders, as is the case with all faiths. in Christianity, some ruling is based on Bible Principles, as is how things are within the vicinity of individuals and or groups, and how are things ran in said lands. You do realize how some ruling are made, correct? There is no debate, but there is discussion, as is the case, with ALL faiths. In these discussions, regarding on the situation, some ruling by means of the area, and or Bible Principles are addressed and how it can be put into effect. Some discussions cannot be removed, which is correct, however, things can be tweaked and or added, especially when there is some sort of change, for instance, the Coronavirus, clearly in this regard, there were things being talked about, which later on, is presented to congregants and or the public, and such discussions is to enable how the people can protect themselves and their families under this pandemic. Clearly such people did not just see COVID-19 and through ideas on the wall and hope it sticks, they discussion first. I purposely left out another bit of my quotation just to throw that on to you. The term, “faithful and discreet slave”, is used by them to describe the group's body of religious leaders in its role professing teachings. The term also refers to “faithful and wise servant”, by others, individualized and or by other groups, even by modern day Bible Students, as for Unitarian denominations, we use the other rendering. Now a faithful servant, they profess said teachings of pertaining to articles of faith. This term heavily correlated with the interpretation this Parable – “The Faithful Servant” found in the following verses (Matthew 24:45–47, Mark 13:34-37 and Luke 12:35-48) and it is said the fulfilled began on Pentecost 33 C.E. (Acts 2). This role, for pretty much most Christian groups, especially if organized, act as the example found in said Parable, as a faithful servant (or slave), when it comes to arriving at decisions on regarding teachings and or other things, this information, once finalized, is presented. Again, I bring up Apostle Paul regarding Dietary Laws and Circumcision. The faithful and wise servant is in connection with a small and or little flock of servants who are faithfully carrying out vows within the body of Christ, moreover, the whole body individually and or collectively, giving the food (Spiritual Food/Milk of which the Bible speaks heavily about) by a due season to the household of faith, which are the believers, Christians, who are given said food. A faithful servant, when it comes to teachings, application and discussions being made, under both God and Christ, are deemed responsible whereas the master of these slaves is the Christ, Jesus, hence The Parable. Despite all this, regardless of faith, no man is inspired, well, you have some Trinitarian scholars and Christians out there who claimed this, i.e. stating they can speak to the dead or see them, or entered briefly some form of afterlife (which all connects to Spiritism and not Christianity). As I had told both Srecko and Witness (who I see here once again), who they themselves claimed that these religious leaders claimed to be “inspired”, as is, on Witness’ part, even ignored a snippet from what she had posted to state said truth, they were in the wrong, granted no claim of being inspired, the irony was I believe that part was purposely cut out, on her part. This is but one of said claims, even outside of anything pertaining to JWs, some claims were based on either the sheer misguidance and or feelings vs. Scripture based mentality, more so, even some chosen ones, refuted them. To add on to that, there was another, who claimed this, but it was more on a Trinitarian vs. Non-Trinitarian turf, something I am heavily in. All this, was before your time, and I can freely quote said discussion here if need be. Actually, granted we are all sinners, and are imperfect, any man, woman, or child is capable of sinning, as is with repentance, hence, prisoners, some of I, a few others, young and old, partook in writing to, who they themselves wish to seek God. Now, in regard to Excommunication, even they can succumb to such, should they commit a sin. When it comes to religious leaders, even those of whom are a body, they rarely commit to grave sin, so in this sense, even with them, they can sin and be excommunicated from their religious community. Another notion of which you presented, "They cannot be Disfellowshipped by other JWs" how are you so sure when Excommunication in regards to sin can easily be applied should any of them commit grave sin? So far, I haven't seen anything from them, nor, others. I recall Srecko posted something a while back, claiming it to be a truth, but after some research was done, it was not merely just a lie, but someone out there throwing conspiracy. Clearly you are not getting what I am conveying, which is evident. But the boat of your exegesis without conclusion will not sail as far. I study Christology, so I already know what Jehovah's Witnesses are about, as is with what they derive from. I am not referring to the Bible Student Movement or the Great Awakenings. If you disagree, point out what you disagree with, just stating this only shows you really have nothing to say. You said the same thing in another discussion I am having with someone regarding Titus 2:13. The Parable, in this sense, is correct and the actions of the slave in said parable on conjunction with the master, The Christ. Even today, everyone is able to recognize that. As for the topic at hand, any group, entity, and or institution, is capable of taking such an action if it violates what they have. More so, even an individual as that right to take such an action, if it is something that does not sit well with them. Now ANYONE is capable of going about this sort of action, so I suggest you read the 2 examples below carefully:
      Hello guest!
      Hello guest!
    I also advise learning about copyright and all things pertaining to it: You may not even know your own UK political system, but you should be able to know the rights of your people, if I know this, it is surprising that you do not know this, granted, by mere assumption of our last interaction, you are the older one. In addition to that, there are those in the UK whom I know, some even more up there when it comes to Bible reading and history, will tell you the same thing. That being said, a collective who makes decisions for the betterment of something or someone, even a group vs. a collective that consist of yes men and women are VASTLY different. EDIT: Alas, the individual who barks cannot bite - as expected.
  27. 1 point
    He tries to come across as a reasonable person.... which you definitely are not. 1 4Jah2me reacted to this I see these OCD reactions all the time from you and view them as a medal...... I even started to react this way as well and realized that mental derangement can be contagious in some ways. ..... LOL
  28. 1 point
    Maybe someone smarter than me could put together a power point presentation on how this topic evolved from a discussion about a ludicrus power point presentation on a attempt to disprove God, evolving to a discussion about the insane theory of the overlapping generations, to the validity of the governing bodies words, value and worth..
  29. 0 points
    @Space Merchant i.e. said claim of yours stated that they said Armageddon would happen on 1975, but there was no claim made by them to suggest such, anywhere. could see was a short time ahead in which to finish the work assigned to them." Watchtower 1968 Aug 15 p.494 Why Are You Looking Forward to 1975?
  30. 0 points
    The irony of it all, it was your sources that let me to the articles. If you haven't noticed, anything related to Wikipedia, at the very bottom there are citations and notes, when you search for said citations, it takes you to a number of books and or articles. Therefore, I was agreeing with the cited sources of which you proved, it was not by my own hand. If it was not for your Wikipedia quotes, I may not have been able to find more information, such as The Jubilee Year. I don't appear to be superior, not at all. That is why it can be said, when I told you to prove it, you failed a number of times. Someone doing research and finding the truth of the matter does not mean they are superior, it means they put in the time to do the work. This was discussed at least 4-5 times on prior, with JWInsider, Anna, and a number of others, including me weighing in on this. All of us, have pointed out what the Jehovah's Witnesses stated, moreover, what the meaning of Salvation is. Therefore, all that would need to be done is link the thread in question to prove said point. No. If I recall, I haven't uttered salvation at all on this thread in particular. I have elsewhere, and also stressed elsewhere that Salvation can be lost and or gained (regained). Clearly, you do not understand what was conveyed. Of course, Non-Trinitarians understand what it means to gain/lose salvation, you are responding to one - @Space Merchant. Other denominations, however, who most are not Anti-Trinitarian, state otherwise, for if one is saved, they can never lose salvation, which, if we go to the Bible, does not make sense, not to mention the verse we see in Jude. How so? Made made claims which you cannot be proven, I even invited you to prove them, which you had failed. Regarding a Prophet Inspired and Not Inspired, the Bible itself offers more proven than you assuming. You even alluded to my point, which thus makes it correct. If you go back to your comment, you made 2 claims regarding me, not the JWs. I told you to prove it, you haven't, this was the same end result as our first discussion. If the Bible speaks truth on what an inspired/no inspired prophet is, why do you say it is wrong? If I agree with the Bible, and you disagree, where does that leave you? I agree with the following verses, therefore, because of this, and your claim, it shows you are in error [Matthew 24:14, Luke 4:18, Acts 2:18, 19 and Romans 12:6-8] - you have a Bible, do you not? Read these verses, or simply read my refute response to Witness, of which I quoted a few comments up. Do you even understand the Parable of the Faithful Servant? As anyone can see, you've added your own assertions, every notion I pointed out in regards to this Parable is correct, especially when it comes to the flock and spiritual food. It is not that I agree with you, it is the fact you are going upon your own understanding, and not actually looking into Scripture to convey the truth of the matter. If I had not mentioned the Parable, you'd include something vastly different regarding what A Faithful Servant is. I suggest you re-read the below. The Bible holds more truth vs. mere assumption and or understanding. Again, MAN cannot assume such. When it comes to Chosen Ones, those that are chosen is between God and that individual. To make such a statement there is hell to pay in regards to the White Throne. Reasons why a majority of us Christians are neutral when it comes to this is for not wanting to beget a costly mistake. That being said, be it that they are or not, if I recall, among their community, it is said they have a number of chosen ones among them, it is not soley 8 religous leaders. Because I do research it irks you this much? If you did not know something and I pointed it out, you consider this being all knowing and superior? A mere rendering buttered your biscuit in this regard and if I point that out being knowledgeable is deemed a threat to you? You are beginning to remind me of Srecko now with the Donkey, Abraham and Glasgow discussions of the past (and it is for good reason I bring up reminders of old discussions, should specific points be made again). Also, if I recall, you were the one who brought all this put, as I tell many here, a do a response to a response, nothing more. That being said, you ignore what is true to fit the information you wish to convey, likewise with the Bible, you have little to no understanding of what a prophet inspired is and or not inspired, thinking that someone who is not inspired cannot grasp the holy spirit, when the Bible says otherwise. You cannot fool anyone, and it is no surprise you walked right into it by making these claims, not to mention you were the one to link the Wikipedia, somehow you do not agree with the very source which you linked. Perhaps next time remember this: If you are going to use a wiki, make sure the citations are NOT against your claims, otherwise, it can only prove to engineer your own err at the end of the day, i.e. said claim of yours stated that they said Armageddon would happen on 1975, but there was no claim made by them to suggest such, anywhere. Other than that, regardless, as for the topic at hand, although there is some level ground, however when this go beyong that, it is their information, they can do as they please with said information, for it originated from them and is provided by them, produced by them and shared by them, in terms of law and the like, it is for them, even outside of that, this goes for ALL entities, institutions, and the like.
  31. 0 points
    Tu nous manqueras, mon ami. We have a saying, "Pa bliye yon bon moun" meaning an individual whom you know and speak to, in this case, comment to, to and fro won't be forgotten.
  32. 0 points
    and hope you stay closer to Jehovah than I did. Your closeness to God does not depend on your closeness to the CCJW. Your love of God, Christ and truth is what matters.
  33. 0 points
    Am I on Candid Camera? Of course you do. Patch up with those kids first. Send them your above post as a letter of introduction, if you must. If you have all your children serving Jehovah, you have a better track record than me. You likened yourself to Mickey once. Based on my limited knowledge of both, I can easily see a likeness. “We made Miller Lite the #2 selling brand in the country, and everyone said ‘Nobody will drink that stuff.” Sometimes an actor switches roles.
  34. -1 points
    I would be stunned if the WTB&TS, et al, was successful in their lawsuits, as in the United States the concept of "whistleblowers" is held in very high regard, and the "Fair Use Doctrine" of U.S. copyright law is interpreted very liberally. There is a lot to be said and considered on this matter, and an excellent source is WIKIPEDIA. .... want to be smarter and well informed on this specific issue? Read THIS:
      Hello guest!
    I personally think we should be proud of every thing we say and do, and not object if someone else shouts it from the housetops. If we SHOULD be ashamed of anything we have published, and the "Pillowgate" videos immediately come to mind, it is ONLY by public disclosure that whatever it is, that it will ever change. Sometime around the 1960's, at Assemblies, we used to have a Public Relations Department set up, but they changed the name to News Service, because PR was asking for something, and NS was giving away something for free. Their lawsuit will generate more publicity by a factor of at least X 100, than ever existed before ... and when all is said and done, and if the WTB&TS wins the lawsuits ( improbable at best ..) it will NOT stop Brothers from leaking these videos to others, or them publishing them, actually IN the public interest, to anybody who has a computer and a piece of free software, such as "Freemake Video Downloader:. That genie left the bottle a long time ago.
  35. -1 points
    @Space Merchant I am not frightened to mention you by name, why should I be ? It was more the use of sarcasm not to mention your name, and look it got a reaction . I tend to disagree with most things you say, but I laugh too, because you try so hard to come across as someone who is superior. I know for myself that i am an individual. It matter not to me if you and others feel the need to add me to some 'make believe' 'collective'. I did quite like this bit though :- A more in-depth definition is: A governing body is a group of people that has the authority to exercise governance over an organization or political entity. The most formal is a government, a body whose sole responsibility and authority is to make binding decisions in a given geopolitical system (such as a state) by establishing laws. Now here in the UK the ruling Government has an opposition party. I know very little about politics but I do know there are two 'houses', the House of Lords and the House of Commons. So there is debate and questioning. Also the people of the UK can vote for a different government every 5 years. And, parliament can be dissolved in some cases. However the Governing Body of CCJW rules over millions of people without debate and questioning. Those 8 men that has the authority to exercise governance, and are a body whose sole responsibility and authority is to make binding decisions, cannot be removed, according to some JWs on this forum. They have given themselves the title 'Faithful and Discreet Slave', and they cannot be disfellowshipped by other JWs. But you seem to think that is ok, however you do not want to become a JW . I totally disagree with most of what you say SM, but. Have a good day.
  36. -1 points
    @Space Merchant You write a lot and basically say nothing. So many people on here do that. As for copyright laws, they do not interest me because my point wasn't, do they have the legal right, my point was that Jesus said, recorded at Matthew 5 V 39 However, I say to you: Do not resist the one who is wicked, but whoever slaps you on your right cheek, turn the other also to him. Basically Jesus said 'Just let it go by'. However, the GB and their Lawyers are just looking to create diversion, to take people's eyes away from all the Child Sexual Abuse accusations and court cases. And regarding the GB calling themselves the 'Faithful and Discreet Slave', you do know that in the past ALL the remaining ones of the Anointed were known as the 'Faithful and Discreet Slave'. So who gave the GB the right to change it ? Remember that the GB admit to NOT being inspired by God's Holy Spirit. But some how they WERE 'inspired' to exalt themselves above their Fellow Slaves. Hence showing themselves to be the wicked slave. But of course you will not agree with me.
  37. -1 points
    @Space Merchant Like I've said before you will always disagree with me just for the sake of trying to look superior. I hope it brings you joy. It certainly gives me something to laugh at. And if I write that the CCJW / GB say that a person 'must be a baptised Jehovah's Witness to gain salvation', will you disagree with this too ? And are you saying that any Non Trinitarian Christian can gain salvation no matter what religion they are, or even if they have no denomination ? Now that would be in disagreement with the JW GB. Quote "Also your claims from before, you can at least attempt to prove them instead of shying away from them, I see you laughed, but cannot bite, as usual " When I show you truth you are too blind to see it so there is no point. You only believe what you want to believe, and you THINK you know better than me or others. I was right about the Governing Body exalting themselves above their 'Fellow Slaves' as in the parable. But you won't agree with me. For that GB to suddenly decide only they, those 8 men, are the Faithful slave and for them to assume the others of the Anointed are NOT the Faithful Salve, shows the GB up to be the wicked slave. However like I say, you wish to convey yourself as knowing more than others, so there is little point in talking directly to you. In fact I tend now to use my comments to communicate with others even if I do link your name to them.
  38. -1 points
    @4Jah2me And So I saith to thee, Give me a direct """"quote""""" of them stating Armageddon will happen in 1975? Example: Frosted Flakes, random I know, but proving a point. The slogan of this cereal brand is "They're Great!" and their mascot is an anthropomorphic humanoid tiger named Tony. Who said the quote directly as stated? Tony the Tiger. Now, all you did was post a picture of an article (haven't you read it), of which was posted several times over on this forum, and debunked. For further detail, to make a claim that they said 1975 was indeed God's Day was to occur, I do not see what is stopping you from quoting said claim, in this case, the name of the person who said it and where it took place. I got another example for you "Beauty is in the Eyes of the Beholder" who said it? Margaret Wolfe Hungerford. Other than that, the way I see it, a strong sermon often tends to make people speculate, and jump to conclusions, as noted last time. I think someone stated something before as projected, but the claims out there that say otherwise does not hold enough water. I will note your response because I do not want another Glasgow (Srecko knows, and he was sorry for it) to happen: That being said, relating to the topic at hand, as we speak, if something of someone is in use, especially without permission and or improperly, they have the right to take action. EDIT: Thank you for proving me point, again. Now - Your claim would be a strong one, if they had indeed made the claim. The only thing in that article of yours that I am somewhat not easy with is the King James Version of the Bible, nothing more. As I pointed out, before your arrival, we had spoken about this before, that is why I mentioned Rook, JWInsider and the others, regarding the subject, this is one of several threads for 1975.




×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

Terms of Service Confirmation Terms of Use Privacy Policy Guidelines We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.