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Cos

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Posts posted by Cos

  1. 10 minutes ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

    I do read my Bible, but I use common sense in doing so. 

      The KJV mentions Unicorns 9 times, but does not mention cookie making Keebler Elves, not even once.

    Coincidence?

    Mr. Rook,

     

    I doubt that because your argument coupled with your "common sense” shows that you are ignorant of the Scriptures, and proves that you just follow the false, man made ideas of a magazine, this is brought out by juxtaposing your silly argument on how the KJV translates!

     

    Prove that you read your Bible by providing me with Scriptural evidence for your idea that the Holy Spirit is some sort of power/force, if you can't, then that shows you are NOT reading the Bible but relying on man made teachings. <>< 

  2. 8 minutes ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

    A frog MIGHT avoid bumping his rump, every time he jumps, if he had wings .... but frogs do not have wings ... and neither does your supposition that what is supposed to be a three-in one "Godhead" ... two of them do have personal names, but one does not.

    Even each of my five dogs has a personal name... and they know (in English) what their personal names are.

    If your argument was sound .... and it is NOT, for so MANY reasons .... my dogs have the advantage.

    Mr Rook,

     

    I know that JWs are scripturally naïve, because you follow the false teachings of a magazine and the ideas of men.  I gave you evidence showing how your argument lacks Biblical support. Do yourself a favor…read your Bible! <><

  3. 22 minutes ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

    So ... what is the Holy Spirit's personal name?

    Jehovah God has a name and title .... Jehovah the Almighty God.

    Jesus has a name and title ... Jesus the Christ

    Holy Spirit is a title.

    What is the Holy Spirit's personal name?

    Casper?

     

    Mr Rook,

     

    You don’t know the Scriptures do you, for if you did then you would know how ridiculous your whole argument is!

     

    In Scripture spiritual beings are not always named; some evil spirits are rarely named but are identified by their particular character/title, for example “unclean” and ‘wicked” etc., and yet there is no doubt that they are persons!  

     

    But anyway, to show you further how your argument is completely groundless, you should do yourself a favor and go read in your Bible (that is if you have one?) and take note how the Holy Spirit is identified as YHWH, see Isaiah 6:8-10 and Acts 28:25-29.  

     

    Now, WHERE is your Biblical support for the idea that the Holy Spirit is some sort of power/force? as I have said, I readily await your evidence from the Scriptures to support your claim! <><

  4. Scripture describes the Holy Spirit as a person, not as an impersonal force, when it says that He teaches, guides, comforts and intercedes (John 14:26; Romans 8:14; John 14:26; Romans 8:26).

     

    We are told that He possesses emotions, intellect and will (Ephesians 4:30; 1 Corinthians 2:10–14; 1 Corinthians 12:11).

     

    And one of the most strike irrefutable testimony is that the Holy Spirit spoke to Philip and gave counsel to the church at Jerusalem (Acts 8:29; 15:28). <><

  5. One of the most striking features of the teachings of Jesus is that He was constantly talking about Himself. And to enter into the Kingdom depends on how we respond to Him personally; He even called the Kingdom of God “my Kingdom”.

     

    This self teaching of Jesus is one of the first things that set Jesus apart from the other religious teachers of the world. Jesus points people to Himself saying “I am the truth; follow me” No other founder of the world religions would dare say such a thing and expect to be taken seriously.

     

    The personal pronouns that Jesus uses force us to pay attention.

     

    "I am the bread of life…” (John 6:35)

     

    "I am the light of the world…" (John 8:12)

     

    "I am the resurrection and the life…”  (John 11:25)

     

    The great question on Jesus’ teachings about Himself leads to Him asking, “Who do you say that I am?” (Matt. 16:15).

     

    Jesus had such a strong opinion of Himself, it is not surprise that he should call people to Himself, “Come to me” and “Follow me”.

     

    Jesus offered Himself as someone in whom His contemporaries should put their faith in and to whom they should offer their love to. People are to believe in God – Jesus urged them that to have eternal life people are to believe in Him (John 3:36).

     

    So when we look at the biblical evidence for the true Deity of our Lord Jesus Christ one cannot help noticing Jesus’ own self-consciousness witness of Himself, in other words, His self-understanding…what did Jesus think and believe about Himself?

     

    Let’s have a look at what Jesus says about Himself and whether what He says reflects a consciousness of being Deity?

     

    Keep in mind that what follows is NOT an exhaustive study, but just a brief expose of the topic.

     

    In Mark 2:5-10 we read: “When Jesus saw their faith, he said to the paralytic, ‘Son, your sins are forgiven.’ Now some teachers of the law were sitting there, thinking to themselves, ‘Why does this fellow talk like that? He's blaspheming! Who can forgive sins but God alone?’  Immediately Jesus knew in his spirit that this was what they were thinking in their hearts, and he said to them, ‘Why are you thinking these things?  Which is easier: to say to the paralytic, 'Your sins are forgiven,' or to say, 'Get up, take your mat and walk'?  But that you may know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins....’"

     

    When the paralytic was lowered through the roof by his four friends, Jesus did not respond with a comment about the man’s physical condition or his need of healing. Rather, his initial comment was, “your sins are forgiven”. The reaction of the scribes indicates the meaning they attached to his words: "Why does this fellow talk like that? He's blaspheming! Who can forgive sins but God alone?"

     

    What we have is a strong statement of divine authority, and the context shows that it was a blasphemous assertion IF HE WAS NOT GOD! Notice that He does not answer their charges with a "Hold on now! I am not claiming to be God! I am claiming something less!"--not at all!

     

    The reaction of the Jews shows that they interpreted Jesus’ words that He was exercising the prerogative that belong to God alone (see Isa, 43:25). Here was an excellent opportunity for Jesus to correct the scribes if they had misunderstood the significance of His words. Note that He did not. In fact His response is highly enlightening for He goes on to claims that He has that prerogative of God, notice also how Jesus knew their thoughts; only God can know the thoughts of men (Acts 15:8; 2 Chron. 6:29; 1 Kings 8:38). More can be said but I’ll leave that for another time. <><

     

     

     

     

     

  6. SCRIPTURE shows that the Holy Spirit is a Person, clearly distinct from the Father (not a subspecies of metaphor as has been claimed) and also distinct from Jesus.

     

    John 16:13-14 “…he will guide you into all the truth, for he will not speak of his own initiative, but what he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things to come…he will receive from what is mine and will declare it to you.”

     

    Throughout this passages from John’s Gospel, Jesus ascribes the same or similar personal actions to the Holy Spirit as He does to the disciples and even Himself (e.g., I will go/He will come; I have things to say/He will speak).

     

    It would be very strange to ascribe these personal actions in the same way and in the same statement to real persons and to a thing.

     

    John 12:49 “because I have not spoken out of my own impulse, but the Father himself who sent me has given me a commandment as to what to tell and what to speak." (NWT)

     

    John 16:13 “However, when that one arrives, the spirit of the truth, he will guide you into all the truth, for he will not speak of his OWN IMPULSE, but what things he HEARS he will SPEAK, and he will declare to you the things coming.” (NWT)

     

    In the dialogue in the upstairs room, Jesus compared the Holy Spirit to Himself, the comparison of one person to another. It makes no sense doing so if the Holy Spirit is not a person.

     

    Notice John15:26–27;

     

    “But when the Helper comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, the Spirit of truth, who proceeds from the Father, he will bear witness about me. And you also will bear witness…”

     

    Note how Jesus says the Spirit will “bear witness” just as the disciples will bear witness (“you also…”). Jesus regards the Spirit as being just as much a person as each of the disciples, and speaks of them in the same terms. <><

  7. Matthew 28:19 states that baptism is into the name (eis to onoma) of Father, Son, and Holy Spirit; this was intended as the summary of the first principles of the Christian religion, and of the new covenant. By our being baptized, we solemnly profess, our consent to the scripture-revelation concerning God, the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost.

     

    We are baptized, not into the names, but into the name, of Father, Son, and Spirit, which plainly shows that these three are one, and their name one. The passage is clearly mentioning the three Persons in Trinity. <><

  8. In 1 Cor. 12:11, we read, “But the one and the same Spirit works all these things, distributing separately to each as He wills.”

     

    Here “will” is ascribed to the Spirit and we are taught that the Holy Spirit is NOT a force/power that we are somehow to get hold of and use, but a Person who uses us according to His will. Read it again those of you who don’t “get it”!

     

    The Bible is the only real source of truth, funny how some don’t get that but instead use worldly ideas to try and support their manmade teaching. <><

  9. 1 hour ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

    Your premise is based on a false assumption 

     

    No Mr. Rook, my “premise” is based on the Bible!

     

    On what ‘premise” do base your idea? A worldly one?

     

    1 hour ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

    My theology may be described as a "chainsaw theology".

    It has to make common sense and have real life examples .

     

     

    I don’t care what you call your “theology”, where is your Biblical support?

     

    Anyone can make a doctrine up and twist what you call “real life examples” to try to support that made up doctrines, but without Biblical support it is worthless!

     

    The personhood of the Holy Spirit is affirmed by Scripture, but because you base your idea of the Holy Spirit on the teaching of men, your use of worldly examples fall flat when put up against the truth of Scripture.

     

    For example, you claim that the passages that show that the Holy Spirit is a Person are “figures of speech”. So when you read (and I’m assuming that you do read a Bible);

     

    “And while they were serving the Lord and fasting, the Holy Spirit said, "Set apart now for me Barnabas and Saul (Paul) for the work to which I have called them.” (Acts13:2).

     

    Why would Luke employ a synecdoche in this passage (and elsewhere)? 

     

    Further your claims about the created universe just goes to show how you want to make God fit your artificial (non-biblical) idea. <><

  10. 3 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

     

     the Holy Spirit is not a person.

     

     

    But where is your Biblical proof that this is the case when referring to the Holy Spirit? Have you any? If you have none then you are just sprouting the ideas of men and nothing else. <><

  11. Further to the Biblical verification that the Holy Spirit is a Person, the Scriptures show that He has the ability to think, to will and to feel.

     

    The Holy Spirit is not an impersonal force as false religion teach.

     

    In his epistles, Paul uses several verbs for the Spirit’s activity that only make sense if the subject of the verb is a Person.

     

    Paul writes of the Spirit searching and knowing (1 Cor. 2:11), teaching (1 Cor. 2:13), and crying out (Gal. 4:6), just to name a few.

     

    Paul tells the Ephesian church not to grieve the Holy Spirit (Eph. 4:30). One cannot grieve a force, but can certainly grieve a person who has a will and emotions. <><

  12. Christian baptism as designated in Matthew 28:19 is an act of religious worship, in which the person being baptized is obligated to believe in, worship, and serve the only true God. The apostles of Christ had been taught that there was but one God; and yet they were commanded to baptize into the name of three distinct persons—the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. Mark the fact: Christ did not say "the names," but "the name." 

     

    A few brief remarks here, the Biblical Trinity is not three separate Gods, but a unity of three distinct persons in one God.

     

    In the form of administering baptism the doctrine of the Trinity is unequivocally taught. No superiority or difference in rank is mentioned as appertaining to either of the Three; but all of them are spoken of in parallel terms.

     

    It is therefore impossible to suppose that, while the Father is self-existent, eternal, and omnipotent, the Son should be a mere creature, subject to all of the limitations of a finite being; or, that the Holy Spirit should be a mere power or force, without any personal existence.

     

    The very form, indeed, running in the name—not names—of the Three, shows that the authority of all three is the same, their power equal, and their glory One.

     

    Christians have understood their baptism as obligating them to worship the Son and the Holy Spirit, as well as the Father.

     

    The disciples of Christ have a mandate which is to baptize into the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit, teaching those to observe all that He commands until the end of the age; and thus by Jesus’ own words this fully proves the co-equality of each of the Three Persons. <><

  13.  “May the Lord direct your hearts to God’s love and Christ’s endurance” (2 Thess. 3:5)

     

    In this verse we have the Father and Christ named alongside the One to whom this request for blessing is made. The verse clearly has three Persons in view.

     

    Jesus Himself says in Matt. 9:37-38, “the harvest is plentiful but the workers are few. Ask the Lord of the harvest therefore to send out workers into the harvest field”

     

    Who is “the Lord of the harvest”? It is the one who sends forth persons to reap in the fields of the world, and when we look to the book of Acts, we see that it is the Holy Spirit who sent forth Barnabas and Paul on their missionary journey:

     

    “And while they were serving the Lord and fasting, the Holy Spirit said, "Set apart now for me Barnabas and Saul (Paul) for the work to which I have called them.” (Acts13:2).

     

    And it is the Holy Spirit who appoints elders to look after the church:

     

    “Pay attention to yourselves and to the entire flock over which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers to be shepherds of God's church, which he acquired with his own blood.” (Acts 20:28). 

     

    The Holy Spirit is indeed a Person. The Scriptural testimony to the personality of the Holy Spirit is far more abundant in Scripture then the weird and whacky idea of an “active force” which has no biblical support. <><

  14. The Doctrine of the Trinity arises because of everything that the Bible, especially in the New Testament, says about the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

     

    We see this not just in various passages that talk about the Deity of Christ or the Person of the Holy Spirit, but in a pervasive pattern throughout the New Testament in which the three Persons are presented alongside one another in an equal and obvious parallel. There are too many examples to list them all, here are a few examples.

     

    After his resurrection, Jesus commissioned his disciples to take the gospel to all nations, telling them to baptize people “into the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit” (Matt. 28:19).

     

    Some sadly are under the impression that this statement means that people are to be baptized in the name of Jehovah the Almighty, his first created angelic son, and his invisible force/power.

     

    But the text makes much more sense as meaning that new disciples are to be baptized in the name of three co-equal Persons identified as the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Some just don’t like this fact and try to make out that the passage is a late insertion…it’s not.

     

    Two passages from Paul’s writings, out of the many that could be highlighted, are noteworthy:

     

    “Now there are varieties of gifts, but the same Spirit.
    And there are varieties of ministries, and
    the same Lord.
    There are varieties of activities, but
    the same God who works all things in all.”
    (1 Cor. 12:4-6)

     

    “The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ,
    and the love of
    God,
    and the fellowship of
    the Holy Spirit, be with you all.”
    (2 Cor. 13:14)

     

    In both of these passages, divine blessings are said to come from God (the Father), the Lord (Jesus Christ), and the (Holy) Spirit.

     

    The order in which the three are presented doesn’t even seem particularly important.

     

    The apostle Peter in his first epistle invokes all three Persons in his salutation:

     

    “…elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father,
    in the sanctification
    of the Spirit,
    for obedience and sprinkling of the blood
    of Jesus Christ:
    Grace to you and peace be multiplied.”
    (1 Peter 1:2)

     

    These are just a handful of the many passages of this three co-equal pattern where God—Christ—Spirit or Father—Son—Holy Spirit appear. <><

  15. On ‎2‎/‎20‎/‎2018 at 11:51 PM, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

    I have already stated the reasons I do not view Holy Spirit as a Holy Ghost ....

    And, you may want to substitute "Birth Certificate", for "Drivers License".

    Mr. Rook,

     

    I want to know what Biblical support you have for the your idea that the Holy Spirit is a power/force... do you have any? I think not.

     

    Also, I don’t need to substitute anything. Like it or not, you brought up the silly example of drivers’ license to try to support your manmade idea, I just showed how unsubstantiated it was. <><

  16. On ?2?/?18?/?2018 at 11:34 AM, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

    Cos:

    If you check 200 MILLION driver's licenses, you will NOT find a single one that says the licensee's name is "human being".

    God has a Name ... in English, it is commonly and by custom since the 1600's  in English .... Jehovah.

    The Son of God has a name ... In English, it is Jesus.

    The Archangel was referred to, again in English ... as Michael.

    The Slanderer and Resister Angel turned demon is named, again in English ... Satan.

    All five of my dogs have individual, specific personal names, as did every dog I have owned before them.

    (... pauses for a swig of Cranberry Juice ...)

    Even the juice I drink had a name ... Cranberry.

    SOOOooo....

    What is the Holy Spirit's personal name?

    Descriptions and Titles do not count ... I have a comforter on my bed ... and as I have learned recently ... the Advocate is not a personal name... its the name of a "Gay Rights" magazine, or a Baton Rouge, Louisiana Newspaper. If they were Greek publications, they would be TITLED "Paraklete", identifiers to be sure ... but not being PERSONS , DNA or Spirit based .. that would not be PERSONAL names.

    You must be thinking of CASPER, the FRIENDLY Ghost, of yesteryear's comic book fame.

    What is the Holy Ghost's personal name?

     

     

    Casperwatchingsleep-1050x579.jpg

     

    CASPER?

     

     

    Mr. Rook,

     

    We have gone over this already. Your argument is not a sound one, just because you think the Holy Spirit does not have a personal name, is not a good recourse to assume that the Holy Spirit is not a real Person. If this were a valid argument, then, following your line of reasoning, a newborn child is not a person until he/she is named (or is of age to get a driver's license).

     

    In Scripture spiritual beings are not always named; some evil spirits are rarely named but are identified by their particular character/title, for example “unclean” and ‘wicked” etc., and yet there is no doubt that they are persons!

     

    But anyway, your argument is groundless, go read in your Bible and take note how the Holy Spirit is identified as YHWH, see Isaiah 6:8-10 and Acts 28:25-29.

     

    Now, WHERE is your Biblical support for the idea that the Holy Spirit is some sort of power/force? I readily await your evidence from the Scriptures to support your claim! <><

  17. In an initial post we are given a Unitarian view point which seeked to explain away the implications of the passage of Matthew 28:19, to the tone that verse 18 gives the meaning of verse 19. That in verse 19, “the singular name is pertaining to is the one authority of God the Father (Yahweh/Jehovah) through God's Son (Yeshua/Jesus) in God's Holy Spirit … The disciples are to do these things in the name of the authority of the Father, given to the Son, by the Holy Spirit…”

     

    That was how the Unitarian explanation was given in spite of the clear meaning of the passage.

     

    Yet after stating the assumed meaning of how the passage goes, then followed another post which basically is an account of someone else’s claims and which at the end states basically the same idea as the first post; but this second post does more, it implies that the passage of Matthew 28:19 is a later insertion to support the Trinity.

     

    How can the passage of Matthew 28:19 mean what is claimed in the first post (and at the end of the second post) and also be a later insertion?

     

    That is just typical of the contradictive nonsense some propagate. The reason for this I believe is because this simple passage speaks volume and some just don’t like the implications of what that means.

     

    Let’s note, without getting into a long expose, that in the baptismal passage of Matthew 28:29, Jesus marks, as parallel, the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit, this is particularly interesting when you consider the fact that in the Bible nothing can be equivalent with God in anyway.

     

    Yet here Jesus deliberately expresses the co-equality of the three. Some clearly don’t like this and will even try to cast doubt on the genuineness of the passage.

     

    Now it is a growing position from some groups such as Muslins, Modalists, Arian/Unitarians and some Jews, that the passage of Matthew 28:19 is not genuine. Even some liberal academics have fallen for this ruse.

     

    The passage is textually authentic being found in all Greek manuscripts and ancient version, see for example the UBS Greek Text critical edition on the New Testament or Bruce Metzger’s Textual Commentary on the Greek New Testament.

     

    These groups, who cast doubt on Matthew 28:19, all refer to the fourth century Historian, Eusebius to try to validate their claims.

     

    What these group fail to see (or maybe they are just fixated on trying to make it seem that the passage is not genuine) is that Eusebius has a tendency to paraphrase.

     

    To demonstrate, in Demonstratio Evangelica, one of the places which the author in the second post cites, and where Eusebius is supposed to be quoting the short version of Matthew 28:19, notice that Eusebius also "quotes" Philippians 2:9. However, the statement is certainly not a quotation:

     

    Eusebius writes :

     

    For he did not enjoin them “to make disciples of all the nations” simply and without qualification, but with the essential addition “in his name”. For so great was the virtue attaching to his appellation that the Apostle says, "God bestowed on him the name above every name, that in the name of Jesus every knee shall bow of things in heaven and on earth and under the earth." It was right therefore that he should emphasize the virtue of the power residing in his name but hidden from the many, and therefore say to his Apostles, "Go ye, and make disciples of all the nations in my name.’ (Demonstatio Evangelica, col. 240, p. 136)

     

    But, Philippians 2:9 in full is:

     

    “Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name: That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth”

     

    Eusebius of Caesarea, when discussing the history of the gospel going forth to the world would paraphrase passages from Scripture, keeping the focus on the command to preach to all nations.

     

    However, when discussing matters of theology, he quotes the passage of Matthew 28:19 more fully:

     

    "We believe in One God, the Father Almighty, the Maker of all things visible and invisible. And in One Lord Jesus Christ, the Word of God, God from God, Light from Light, Life from Life, Son Only-begotten, first-born of every creature, before all the ages, begotten from the Father, by whom also all things were made; who for our salvation was made flesh, and lived among men, and suffered, and rose again the third day, and ascended to the Father, and will come again in glory to judge quick and dead. And we believe also in One Holy Ghost; believing each of These to be and to exist, the Father truly Father, and the Son truly Son, and the Holy Ghost truly Holy Ghost, as also our Lord, sending forth His disciples for the preaching, said, 'Go, teach all nations, baptizing them in the Name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost,'" (Eusebius' Letter to the Church in Caesarea).

     

    So even Eusebius knew of and used the full form of the text we have today, he simply felt free to paraphrase it at times when his purpose did not require a full citation.

     

    In the passages in the Book of Acts, such as Acts 2:38, 8:16, 10:48 etc, when looked at in context the phrase “in the name of” is not a formula as that of Matthew 28:19, but a reference to authority. It is similar to hearing someone say, "Stop in the name of the Law!" We understand that the "name of the Law" means by the authority of the Law.   It is the same with baptism "in Jesus' name."  To baptize in Jesus' name is to baptize in the authority of Jesus.  Consider the following from Acts:

     

    "And when they had placed them in the center, they began to inquire, "By what power, or in what name, have you done this?" Then Peter, filled with the Holy Spirit, said to them, "Rulers and elders of the people, if we are on trial today for a benefit done to a sick man, as to how this man has been made well, let it be known to all of you, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ the Nazarene, whom you crucified, whom God raised from the dead--by this name this man stands here before you in good health" (Acts 4:7-10).

     

    "But in order that it may not spread any further among the people, let us warn them to speak no more to any man in this name. And when they had summoned them, they commanded them not to speak or teach at all in the name of Jesus" (Acts 4:17-18).

     

    "We gave you strict orders not to continue teaching in this name, and behold, you have filled Jerusalem with your teaching, and intend to bring this man’s blood upon us" (Acts 5:28).

     

    "And they took his advice; and after calling the apostles in, they flogged them and ordered them to speak no more in the name of Jesus, and then released them" (Acts 5:40).

     

    "But when they believed Philip preaching the good news about the kingdom of God and the name of Jesus Christ, they were being baptized, men and women alike" (Acts 8:12)

     

    "But Barnabas took hold of him and brought him to the apostles and described to them how he had seen the Lord on the road, and that He had talked to him, and how at Damascus he had spoken out boldly in the name of Jesus. And he was with them moving about freely in Jerusalem, speaking out boldly in the name of the Lord" (Acts 9:27-28)

     

    "And this did she many days. But Paul, being grieved, turned and said to the spirit, I command thee in the name of Jesus Christ to come out of her. And he came out the same hour" (Acts 16:18)

     

    As can be seen, the expression in the book of Acts is one of authority. So also when people were being baptized, they did it calling on Jesus' name (Acts 22:16); that is, they were calling upon Jesus who has all authority in heaven and earth. The faithful are supposed to "call upon the name of the Lord Jesus" (1 Cor. 1:2) because it is by His authority that we Christians have the hope and right for the forgiveness of sins.

     

    After Jesus’ resurrection He told His followers to go and make disciples of all nations baptizing them in the one singular name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, ONE God, three persons. He told them to teach these new disciples from the nations all that He had commanded, and He promised to be with them always.

     

    The Bible powerfully preserved, throughout the ages and through numerous streams of evidence the words of Matthew 28:19. If your beliefs cannot reconcile with these words, it is your beliefs that are in error, not the words. <><

  18. We read in Romans 15:30,

     

    “I appeal to you, brothers, by our Lord Jesus Christ and by the love of the Spirit, to strive together with me in your prayers to God on my behalf”

     

    Here "love" is ascribed to the Holy Spirit.

     

    The Holy Spirit is not a mere blind, unfeeling “power” as some like to claim, with no Biblical backing. The Holy Spirit is a Person who loves us tenderly and He extends that love through our hearts, love comes from love. Love is the evidence of true religion, and this love is of the Holy Spirit and His love for us.

     

    The Holy Spirit loves all the chosen people of God. His love runs in the same channel as the love of the Father and the Son — and has the same objects, and aims at the same end. <><

  19. In another discussion on how arianism, and it’s later off-shots, began in the fourth century, I read many works from the early church, pre fourth century.  

     

    It is well documented how the Watchtower Society lied in some of its publications about what the early church taught and believed in an effort to further deceive its adherents (and other naive individuals) into believing its false teachings.

     

    So I thought, before I provide more evidence from the Scriptures that the Holy Spirit is a Person that it would be interesting to see what the early church taught and believed on this matter.

     

    Now the following is presented only to shows what the early Christians believed on this matter, and also to further demonstrate how the claims made by the Watchtower about the early church are not only unreliable but are as false as their teachings.

     

    The First Epistle of Clement to the Corinthians was written just before the end of the first century, in this epistle Clement claims that it was the Holy Spirit who said “Let not the wise man glory in his wisdom, neither let the mighty man glory in his might, neither let the rich man Story in his riches; but let him that glorieth glory in the Lord, in diligently seeking Him, and doing judgment and righteousness” (First Epistle of Clement to the Corinthians, Chapter 13).

     

    Ignatius (35-107AD), who was a disciple of the apostle John, he writes “But the Holy Spirit does not speak his own things, but those of Christ, and that not from himself, but from the Lord; even as the Lord also announced to us the things that he received from the Father.? (The Epistle of Ignatius to the Ephesians, Chapter 9).

     

    Justin Martyr (100-165AD) writes, “...use with simplicity the words and expressions which offer themselves, and declare to you whatever the Holy Ghost, WHO descended upon them, chose to teach through them to those who are desirous to learn the true religion.” (Justin’s Hortatory Address to the Greeks, Chapter 35).

     

    “Our teacher of these things is Jesus Christ, who also was born for this purpose, and was crucified under Pontius Pilate, procurator of Judaea, in the times of Tiberius Caesar…and holding him in the second place, and the prophetic spirit in the third… for they do not discern the mystery that is herein, to which, as we make it plain to you, we pray you to give heed.” (First Apology, chapter 14)

      

    Irenaeus (120-202AD) writes;

     

    "For I have shown from the scriptures, that no one of the sons of Adam is as to everything, and absolutely, called God, or named Lord. But that He is Himself in His own right, beyond all men who ever lived, God, and Lord, and King Eternal, and the Incarnate Word, proclaimed by all the prophets, the apostles, and by the Spirit Himself, may be seen by all who have attained to even a small portion of the truth. Now, the scriptures would not have testified these things of Him, if, like others, He had been a mere man.” (Against Heresies, book 3, chapter 19)

     

    “the Son and the Holy Spirit, the Word and Wisdom; whom all the angels serve, and to whom they are subject.” (Against Heresies, book 4, chapter 7)

     

    “For with Him (the Father) were always present the Word and Wisdom, the Son and the Spirit…”(Against Heresies, book 4, chapter 20)

     

    Tertullian (155-220) writes;

     

    "Thus the connection of the Father in the Son, and of the Son in the Paraclete, produces three coherent Persons, who are yet distinct One from Another. These Three are, one essence, not one Person” (Against Praxeas, chapter 25)

     

    Tertullian was clearly believed in and taught of the uncreated Deity of Christ along with the personality of the Holy Spirit. Let’s have a brief look at more evidence from “Against Praxeas” which speak volumes.

     

    “Scriptures attest the clear existence of, and distinction in the Trinity, and indeed furnish us with our Rule of faith…the distinction of persons in the Trinity is clearly set forth” (Against Praxeas, chapter 11 emphasis mine)

     

    “If the number of the Trinity also offends you…With these did He then speak, in the Unity of the Trinity… the following text also He distinguishes among the Persons… I must everywhere hold one only substance in THREE COHERENT AND INSEPARABLE PERSONS” (Against Praxeas, chapter 12 emphasis mine)

     

    “That there are, however, two Gods or two Lords, is a statement which at no time proceeds out of our mouth: not as if it were untrue that the Father is God, and the Son is God, and the Holy Ghost is God, and each is God” (Against Praxeas, chapter 13)

     

    “Then there is the Paraclete…Thus the connection of the Father in the Son, and of the Son in the Paraclete, produces THREE COHERENT PERSONS, who are yet distinct One from Another. THESE THREE ARE, ONE ESSENCE, not one Person…”(Against Praxeas,  chapter 25 emphasis mine)

     

    Hippolytus  (170-235) writes;

     

    “A man, therefore, even though he will it not, is compelled to acknowledge God the Father Almighty, and Christ Jesus the Son of God, who, being God, became man, to whom also the Father made all things subject, Himself excepted, and the Holy Spirit; and that these, therefore, are three.” (Against The Heresy Of One Noetus, section 8)

     

    Athenagoras (133-190AD) writes;

     

    “The Holy Spirit HIMSELF also, which operates in the prophets... Who, then, would not be astonished to hear men who speak of God the Father, and of God the son, and of the Holy Spirit, and who declare both their power in union and their distinction...” (Defense for the Christians, Chap. 10)

     

    The above is not an exhaustive list there are many more examples. These quotes from the early Christians are from different parts of the then Roman world and span hundreds of years and all before the fourth century.

     

    Now as I said the preceding quotes are presented only to shows what the early Christians believed on this matter, and also to demonstrate how the claims made by the Watchtower about the early church are not only unreliable but are as false as their teachings. <><

  20. 4 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

    Check out a Greek Interlinear Translation.

     

    The quotes I gave are a Literal Translation and are from my Interlinear Bible by Jay P. Green Sr. You might also want to look up Young’s Literal Translation.

     

    The rest of what you say is a complete and utter load of bias rubbish oozing from you distorted mind. You have no idea whatsoever on any of the things you say, none. It is no wonder you agree with that dishonest Space merchant…birds of a feather…<><

  21. 42 minutes ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

    The "Godhead" is a completely made up FANTASY... It does not exist, and has never existed. 

    Mr. Rook,

     

    Please note the following Scriptures.

     

    “For the unseen things of Him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things made, both His eternal power and Godhead, for them to be without excuse.” (Romans 1:20)

     

    “For in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily” (Col 2:9). <><

  22. The Bible provides many ways to help us understand that the Holy Spirit is truly a Person rather than impersonal thing.

     

    Matthew 28:19 teaches us to baptize in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. This is a collective reference to one Triune God.

     

    Also, we are not to grieve the Holy Spirit  (Eph. 4:30). The Spirit can be sinned against (Isa. 63:10). And most important of all we are to obey Him (Acts 10:19-21).

    “And as Peter pondered concerning the vision, the Spirit said to him, ‘Behold, three men are seeking you. But rising up, go down and go with them, not discriminating, because I have sent them.’ And going down to the men, the ones sent from Cornelius to him, Peter said, ‘Behold, I am the one whom you seek. What is the cause for which you are here?’” (Acts 10:19-21) <><

  23. 12 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

     

    REVELATION 1:1-2

    The revelation from Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show his servants what must soon take place. He made it known by sending his angel to his servant John, who testifies to everything he saw—that is, the word of God and the testimony of Jesus Christ. "

    GOD GAVE  ------>> TO JESUS

    ...

    get it?

    Mr. Rook

     

    It amazes me how many times you get so many things wrong.

     

    You imply that Revelation 1:1-2 should be enough to prove that Jesus is not God, because as you reason, Jesus is given the Revelation from God.

     

    But you forget that Jesus is the mediator between the Godhead and mankind, in His mediatorial role He is given the Revelation to pass on to man.

     

    The fact is, Jesus has been resurrected as man and His role as mediator and revealer is not over. The fact is Jesus has a great more to say to His true followers (compare John 16:12).

     

    But you JWs won’t understand this as Jesus is not directly your mediator as such because the Watchtower falsely teaches that He is only the mediator for the 144,000.

     

    Let me make this point plain, Jesus, in His role as mediator represents the matters of God to man, and as mediator He is revealing to man the revelation of the Godhead, the verse speaks of Him in His meditorial role, to claim as you do that this proves He is not God is quite ridiculous, and ignores what Scriptures says elsewhere.

     

    The Revelation comes from the Godhead, and it is given to Jesus as mediator to pass on to man. And Jesus is qualified to perform the role of mediator because He is both God and man, do you get it…probably not! <><

  24. Space merchant,

     

    I read through your response and I am astounded by the amount of your contradictions, not only that but you even deliberately alter my statement to try to cover up for something you said.

     

    I said on January 20;

     

    On ‎1‎/‎20‎/‎2018 at 8:06 PM, Cos said:

    Irenaeus marks the identification of the Holy Spirit as a person just as the Son is a person when he writes;  “the Son and the Holy Spirit, the Word and Wisdom; whom all the angels serve, and to whom they are subject.” (Against Heresies, book 4, chapter 7)

     

    Note carefully that my above statement does NOT contain the word “eternal”!

     

    You responded on January 24 with this comment;

     

    On ‎1‎/‎24‎/‎2018 at 8:59 PM, Space Merchant said:

    We see here again in Chapter 4, of which you only pulled a portion of said paragraph, not realizing, once again, what Irenaeus was talking about, allow me to post that paragraph so you can see for yourself. Also with all due respect, Irenaeus indeed identified the Holy Spirit as a Person (said spirit has no personality whatsoever), however, never once did he claim that it was God, or that it, the Son and the Father are “selfsame” (remember this word for what you will see later) in this specific paragraph, as you claim:

     

    I replied on January 28

    On ‎1‎/‎28‎/‎2018 at 9:43 AM, Cos said:

    You claim that I just “pull portions” from what Irenaeus writes as if doing so were wrong in some way, even thought you recognize that what I said is correct for you acknowledge that “Irenaeus indeed identified the Holy Spirit as a Person”, but it is you who doesn’t agree with Irenaeus on this… so how can you attribute Unitarianism to Irenaeus?

     

     

    Now here comes your contradiction and deliberate altering of what I said;

     

    On ‎2‎/‎3‎/‎2018 at 3:51 AM, Space Merchant said:

    That being said, on to your next claim, my response was regarding you previous claim, which you said:

    Irenaeus establishes the Holy Spirit as a distinct, eternal person alongside the Father and the Logos. “For with Him (the Father) were always present the Word and Wisdom, the Son and the Spirit…” (Against Heresies, book 4, chapter 20).

    I never made such a claim, for I have stated that Irenaeus never stated that the Holy Spirit was or is an “Eternal Person, as you said, not Irenaeus.

     

     

    You added the word ‘eternal’ to my statement and then made up the excuse that that was what you were responding to.

     

    This shows me your true character (John 8:44) and to which I will not waste anymore of my time addressing your dishonest claims any further! <><

     

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