HollyW

The numbers just never add up because the idea that there were less than 144,000 Christians from the first century until 1935 is countered by what the WTS has published in their own literature. They published an article about the ten persecutions than took place from the first century to somewhere around 303 A.C. and the number of Christian martyrs just in the last one by Diocletian was over 850,000. These Christian martyrs were held up as examples for modern day JWs to imitate. But they must have realized their goof, or someone actually did write in about it, because a few months later there was one of the QFR that explained that the majority of those Christian martyrs they had praised so highly were actually just "professed" Christians, i.e. not true Christians at all. [wt 9/1/1951 Hated For His Name, p.516-519] Diocletian assumed the crown A.D. 284. At first he seemed friendly to the Christians, but in the year 303 he gave in to persuasion and opened the tenth persecution, probably the most ferocious of all. Suffocation by smoke, forcible drinking of melted lead, mass drownings and burnings, breaking on the rack of men and women alike ran the empire with blood. In a single month 17,000 were slain. In the province of Egypt alone, 144,000 such professed Christians died by violence in the course of this persecution, in addition to another 700,000 who died as a result of fatigues encountered in banishment or under enforced public works. But someone noticed something about the numbers: [wt 1/15/1952 QFR] Questions From Readers ● According to the article “Hated for His Name” in the September 1, 1951, Watchtower, hundreds of thousands of Christians died in the “ten persecutions” starting in Nero’s time, 144,000 dying in Egypt alone during one of the persecutions. How can this be harmonized with the Scriptural limitation of 144,000 placed on the number being in Christ’s body, andwhich position was the only one open to Christians during those centuries?—J.A., Dominican Republic. The article did not class with any finality the individuals that died during these persecutions, but spoke of the results in a general way. Note that a key qualification was made in the case referred to in the question: “In the province of Egypt alone, 144,000 such professed Christians died by violence in the course of this persecution, in addition to another 700,000 who died as a result of fatigues encountered in banishment or under enforced public works.” The victims are identified as “professed Christians”, not Christians in fact. Many of those persons might have been caught in the wave of persecution, but may never have actually preached the truth or followed in Jesus’ footsteps, being only professed Christians. They knew the world they lived in was rotten and they were listening to the message of the Christians and willing to die for it even though not in line for the high calling in Christ Jesus. Many professed Christians today might be willing to die for their faith, but still not be Jesus’ footstep followers and meeting the Scriptural requirements for such.

Thanks for your answer, Melinda. I find it at odds with the Bible though: Revelation 21:4 and he shall wipe away every tear from their eyes; and death shall be no more; neither shall there be mourning, nor crying, nor pain, any more: the first things are passed away. It says "death shall be no more". There's also these scriptures: Isaiah 25:8 He will swallow up death forever, And the Sovereign Lord Jehovah will wipe away the tears from all faces. The reproach of his people he will take away from all the earth, For Jehovah himself has spoken it. 1 Corinthians 15:26 And the last enemy, death, is to be brought to nothing. But thanks for your reply anyway. Holly

Hi John, Are you saying the resurrection during "his presence" is the same one that takes place during the 1,000 year reign?

Melinda, you say that the ones in the first resurrection won't be subject to death. What about those in the resurrection when the 1,000 years have ended? After the final test at the end of the Millennium, will it be possible for those folks to sin and die?

Hi Melinda, So, when Abraham is resurrected during the 1,000 years, will he be considered righteous, or will he be considered dead until the end of the 1,000 years?

Hi Glenn, I'm glad you posted the passage there in Revelation 20 because it shows the two occurrences of "come/came to life", one following the other in adjacent posts. (I hope there's spell check here. Why is the second "come to life" called a resurrection? Do you view those on earth as being dead until the end of the 1,000 years?

Hi Ann, Good point and good question. I always wondered why "come to life" was interpreted so differently by the WTS in this passage.. As you pointed out, in one instance they say "come to life" means one thing, and in the very next sentence "come to life" means something else. And actually in the second instance they have it not meaning "resurrected" at all, but more like "self-improvement" (i.e. improving oneself thru study of WT publications until able to meet God's standards mentally, morally, physically, and spiritually---and can thereafter stand before God and continue to live based on ones own merit......continuing to live for as long as they don't sin and get annihilated in the lake of fire.)