SonOfcaleb

Well you clearly didn't know the difference between Prophecy and Prophesy as evidenced by your responses which is why i provided the dictionary definitions for further clarity. If you recall you said; Now I suggest you read your qoutes as CTR never said they were his dates. The qoute says regarding the End of the Gentile Times; Regardless 1914 we believe was the End of the Gentile times as per Daniels prophecy and Jesus was installed as King in the Kingdom. As for your claim about false teachers im going to be blunt, not only are you now moving the goal post as its conducive to our arugment to do so, your claim is simply nonsense. False Teachers merely on the basis of the Bible alone wouldnt garner over 8 million baptized publishers. The Jehovahs Witnesses are the fastest growing religion in the world out pacing Islam and Christendom significantly, the lata whose seen their numbers wane considerably, and all we're armed with is our Bibles. Now if you believe the JWs are false teachers or prophets thats of course our perogative. But dont use spurious sources, along with spurious reasoning to back up what is clearly a disingenous and most of all false pretext, as i've provided you with an abundance of evidence along with FACTS that throughly debunk and disprove your assertion.

I'm not particularly concerned about what you think is true, or what your definition of truth is, as its patently obvious what this thread is about and the discussion you're attempting to goad. My position has been very clear and is based on facts. Yours conversely is based on tendentious reasoning that i've proven to be false, ergo lies. Now these aren't my words as you claim. The Reasoning Book under the aptly titled heading "False Prophets" says the following:- These are the words of the governing body in black and white. As i've repeated numerous times this is a very easy position to understand. As we are not prophets your claim regarding "Watchtower false prophecies" is obviously false. The Reasoning Book continues:- All of this concurs with what i've said already in this thread.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/prophecy Simple Definition of prophecy : a statement that something will happen in the future : the power or ability to know what will happen in the future http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/prophesy Simple Definition of prophesy : to state that something will happen in the future As per the defintion of each word above prophecy is not the result of prophesying. Prophecy comes from divine foreknowledge EG Jehovah God. Prophesy is a merely a describing word indicating a belief of something that will happen in the future. EG Not of divine foreknowledge. I think this a bit of a stretch..Hyperbole if you will. The fundamental tenets of the Jehovahs Witnesses faith EG the principles that we live by which have been established since 1AD have been around for over 2000 years. There is no other Christian religion who adheres as strictly as we do to the teachings of Jesus and the early Christians of 1AD. In that respect we are without paralell among ALL Christian faiths in recorded history. Even the early Christians spent many hours deliberating over doctrinal issues such as circumcision or blood. Some of these proved to be very serious issues that required guidance and further mediation/direction from the governing body in Jerusalem, Ac 15:6-29. Now if men annointed directly by Jesus such as Paul, and early Christians who were priviliged to be Apostles and Disciples of Jesus witnessing Jesus in the flesh along with his ressurection but argued over doctrine how much more so difficult a task is that for the current governing body who are 2000 years removed from those early Christians! Now i'm using this as an illustration to show the inherent fallbility of imperfect men. To expect an infallable understanding of the scriptures and thus all doctrine is unreasonable, as everything can't be known in perfect detail even with regular study. Either way you're only talking about nuanced changes in understanding.The fundamentals of our faith have not changed. In addition im sure you'll struggle to find other Christian faiths who have adjusted their understanding of scripture when most of them have an unwavering, unchallengeable dogma such as the Trinity, worship and veneration of 'Saints' or Papal infallability as examples.

And that time period refers to before Jesus hands over the Kingdom to his father, EG during Judgement Day. Eternal life for those who have been faithful is only granted after Satan and his demons are finally destroyed. Your initial point was when those on Earth would recieve ever lasting life. Therefore my point still stands. You seem to be confusing immortality with ever lasting life. Even after death, hades, and Satan are cast into the Lake of Fire perfect humankind will not be immortal. The destiny for faithful humankind as per Revelation is ever lasting life. Not immortality. Immortality is only given to the 144,000 who will rule in Heaven. As ive already said humans are inherently mortal.

No. Prophecy is not the result of prophesying. Ive aready explained the clear differences between the two. Now as i've already explained that we are not prophets we can move on from that point. We believe the governning body, the Faithful and Discreet slave are annointed men of God, annointed directly by Gods holy spirit much the same way Moses was with Israel, both being commisioned by God to lead Gods sheep. But they are not infallible. You wont find such a teaching from the Society and nor will you find such a notion supported in the Bible. ALL men (apart from Jesus) who have walked this Earth are imperfect and therefore are fallible. In addition if we believed the governing body members were infallable there would be no reason for them to make adjustments to Bible teachings which have been proven to be misunderstandings over the years only to correct said misunderstandings. There is no other religion on this Earth that has corrected or revised its teachings with the level of honesty, obectivity and introspection to the level the society have gone to.

The important point to remember here is the Tree's in the Garden were literal. Their meanings of course just like the Tree's in Revelation that you've qouted were/are symbolic. Your original question was:- As i said already there is no literal Tree that the 144,000 have to partake of to recieve immortality bearing in mind the 144,000s destiny is as spirit creatures in Heaven, EG Angels. It would be unreasonable to think these annointed ones by God personally would have to partake of the fruit of a literal tree in order to recieve immortality. In fact theres no scripture in the Bible that supports such a notion. Revelation 20:14 says "And death and the Grave were hurled into the lake of fire. This means the second death, the lake of fire." Jesus was very clear here to John that death and the grave would perish forever in the symbolic Lake of Fire of which there is no return and no ressurection. Therefore there will be no Adamic death anymore as a result of Adamic sin. In addition all those alive after Satan is finally destroyed will have their names symbolically etched in the Book of Life and will recieve ever lasting life. Unlike Adam who choose death these ones would have faithfully passed the test and proven their commitment to Jehovah and his Kingdom. Therefore this isn't continued life, its true ever lasting life which was once also Adams destiny if he'd have been obedient. as he too would have been able to eat from the Tree of Life and live forever. In the extremely unlikely event that some were to rebel there would be no ransom sacrifice for them. In addition the example for what happens with rebels or resistors would have been already proven. Thus their fate would be death. But which 'perfect' sensible human being after all that Mankind has gone through would choose death over life in a Paradise Earth....

That passage doesnt support your point. In fact it supports and confirms mine. Prophecy (Noun) and Prophesy (Verb) are two different words with subtle differences in meaning. One is a noun the other is a verb and used in the descriptive sense. The society have used the word prophesy in the correct context in the passage from the Watchtower supporting what i already said in that we are not prophets which you've already acknowledged. Therefore the heading of this thread is incorrect as none of the passages the OP has qouted are prophecies. Rather they are statements, and descriptions of prophesies based on our religious instruction and study from the Bible of events we believe will happen in the future. So to summarize and to your point and mine we are not 'inspired' prophets. We do not speak for God as the prophets of old did who were sent on their commision directly from God. And we have never made any prophecys at all on future world events with any divine foreknowledge. http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/english/prophesy?q=+prophesy Usage The words prophesy and prophecy are often confused. Prophesy is the spelling that should be used for the verb ( he was prophesying a bumper harvest), whereas prophecy is the correct spelling for the noun ( a bleak prophecy of war and ruin). The differentiation between the spellings of the noun and verb was not established until after 1700 and has no etymological basis, prophesy being at first a spelling variant of both the noun and the verb.

Nothing wrong with my reading ability mon frere. I read your post and its quite transparent the 'debate' you're attempting to stir. You made the fallacious claim regarding these alledged Jehovahs Witnesses prophecies. So putting your hubris to one side and dealing with the facts il repeat what i said again as you didnt seem to understand it the first time. We are not prophets and have never made any prophecies. I think thats quite an easy sentence for most cognitive adults to understand. And not only that its fully supported by Gods own word in the Bible. You know of any prophets foretold or otherwise after Jesus time circa 1AD that were sent specifcally to the Nation of Israel. Nah me neither.....

Very flexible use of the English Language here....Its a Logo. Not a symbol. It doesnt represent a concept. Its not a visual image. It doesnt suggest an idea. Its a logo. Many institutions the world over use logos to represent themselves. Correlating the JW logo with the Cross of Christendom is disingenous hyperbole at best.

The last prophet Jehovah sent was his son Jesus Christ. No prophets have existed on Earth since Jesus acension to Heaven. I'm sure i could find the source of the content that you've copy/pasted but i think that would be a waste of my time as Jehovahs Witnesses have never prophesied anything. We are not prophets. So you probably want to change your subject heading....

The Tree of Life in Eden as you know was symbolic. The Tree didn't possess anything intrinsic within it that could provide ever lasting life as Adam and Eve were created perfect and thus had the abiity to live forever. Eating of the Tree of Life was a priviliege that they would have been able to partake of if they'd been obedient and not eaten from Tree of Knowledge. As we know they choose to eat from the ToK and were ousted from Eden as a result of their sinful disobedience. Now the ToL did not bestow immortality on anyone eating from that tree. The Tree symbolically only provided ever lasting life. Also human beings are not and cannot be immortal, and that includes perfect human beings. Immortality is a direct 'gift' from God that was given to Jesus when he returned to Heaven, along with the 144,000 who also recieve the gift of immortality from Jehovahs Holy Spirit which is attested to by the Apostle Paul. Only spirit beings can be immortal and thus recieve immortality. In the 'New System of Things' there will not be a 'Tree' to partake of. During Judgement Day those Jesus & the 144,000 deem to be 'righteous' will recieve ever lasting life on the basis of their faith and works.