Nicolas King: JW celebrity and example of hypocrisy

[Jack Ryan 714]

Nicolas King frequently sings with the Watchtower Chorus and had a supporting role in the DVD released at the 2014 convention. (He's on the bottom row, second from the right.)

But he also is a jazz singer, traveling constantly performing at concerts, casinos, charity events, even a brief appearance on The Tonight Show. (Not much time left for service and meetings, now is there?) Besides that, he's hobnobbing with loads of worldly people, showing off on his Facebook page.

 

 

So why is Sergei from the convention video not allowed to play his violin, but Nicolas can pursue his worldly career and get rewarded for it by the organization?

[Jack Ryan 714]

He's wearing a necklace. According to the Beth-hell booklet I read once it says necklaces including ID type do not fit the Bethel standard. Something about homosexuals wear necklaces.

[Jack Ryan 714]

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Wow!

[Antonio Tony 0]

Queria preguntar si esta tal JAY Testigo, es testigo de verdad o que es, porque sus comentarios aveces van dirigidos no ha comentar algo, sino a hacer daño a la Organización, tal como hace en este post, sin saber evidentemente si el hermano del que cita, tiene la autorización para hacer esto o no, sino simplemente lo critica. (solo hay que ver el titulo de su post)

[JW Insider 4,553]

On 10/5/2016 at 0:29 AM, Jay Witness said:

Beth-hell

Really, Jay? Personally, I enjoyed Bethel.

Also, I don't really know who is who in any of these pictures, but there will always be individuals whose lifestyles, professions and employment choices are questioned and judged.

[Anna 1,992]

On 10/5/2016 at 0:28 AM, Jay Witness said:

Nicolas King frequently sings with the Watchtower Chorus and had a supporting role in the DVD released at the 2014 convention. (He's on the bottom row, second from the right.)

But he also is a jazz singer, traveling constantly performing at concerts, casinos, charity events, even a brief appearance on The Tonight Show. (Not much time left for service and meetings, now is there?) Besides that, he's hobnobbing with loads of worldly people, showing off on his Facebook page.

So why is Sergei from the convention video not allowed to play his violin, but Nicolas can pursue his worldly career and get rewarded for it by the organization?

There is a awful lot of assumptions you are making here. The fact is he is a regular pioneer, Ministerial Servant and a Bethel commuter. As long as he is putting Kingdom interests first, living a moral life style, and keeping himself spiritually strong there is nothing wrong with making a living the way he does.

He does not travel constantly either. If he was to put his singing first in his life he would be a lot more famous by now...

You guys just don't get it. Sergei was going to go to the conservatory, which is a full time, dedicated, all consuming study of music. Those who go there, are expected to live it during their study and for the rest of their lives. Sergei's father knew his son would not be able to put Kingdom interests first, or stay loyal to Jehovah, AND THAT WAS THE PROBLEM. He explained that clearly I thought.

Nicolas King was born into a musical family who already had ties with famous musicians and actors. He didn't and doesn't have to do much to making a living. It does not consume his whole life. Pioneering and Christian responsibilities take up the bigger portion.

In any case, you might want to explain what you mean by " get rewarded for it by the organization" I have no idea what you mean by that....

[Outta Here 2,099]

On 10/5/2016 at 05:28, Jay Witness said:

But he also is a jazz singer, traveling constantly performing at concerts, casinos, charity events, even a brief appearance on The Tonight Show. (Not much time left for service and meetings, now is there?) Besides that, he's hobnobbing with loads of worldly people, showing off on his Facebook page.

Jealousy wants what the other person has. Envy wants to deprive the other person of what they have. None of that here is there?

Most people hobnobb in connection with their secular work don't they?

I suppose this is what you call Chit-Chat is it?

 

[Antonio Tony 0]

Jay Witness todavia no me has respondido, eres testigo o eres alguien que se hace pasar por testigo?

[Ann O'Maly 442]

So Nicholas King has the best of both worlds. He has been lucky enough to have been born in a musically well-connected family and he can balance a musical career with theocratic interests.

On the other hand, poor Sergei was presented with an either-or scenario. The conservatoire was blocked off to him, but no other option was offered whereby he could pursue his musical talents and interests to a more professional level other than merely having it as a hobby at home. The boy was visibly crushed (he was a good little actor). As time went on, he lost interest in the violin (remember the video of the old Sergei in hospital and what he said when he saw the old photo of himself as a child with the violin?). That is utterly heartbreaking. No matter what one envisions about living one's dreams in the next world, it's still tragic that his God-given gift is left to wither away in this world.

It is particularly annoying to think that the videos will be used to crush other young ones' aspirations by compelling similar either-or decisions ('theocratic goals' versus 'reaching your potential with your talents'), when JWs like Nicholas King demonstrate that it is possible to have both. 

 

[Outta Here 2,099]

On 12/31/2016 at 4:20 PM, Ann O'Maly said:

It is particularly annoying to think that the videos will be used to crush other young ones' aspirations by compelling similar either-or decisions ('theocratic goals' versus 'reaching your potential with your talents'),

Let's hope that no one is stupid enough to do this (crushing aspirations), but endeavours to aid young ones to 'maximise their talent potential in achieving theocratic goals'

[Ann O'Maly 442]

On 1/28/2017 at 1:27 AM, Eoin Joyce said:

Let's hope that no one is stupid enough to do this (crushing aspirations), but endeavours to aid young ones to 'maximise their talent potential in achieving theocratic goals'

Talents in many of the arts or in, say, natural sciences are not much in demand with regard to the Organization's 'theocratic goals.' So one would hope, from a JW point-of-view, that young ones would be encouraged to 'maximize their talent potential alongside achieving theocratic goals.'

[Outta Here 2,099]

1 hour ago, Ann O'Maly said:

maximize their talent potential alongside achieving theocratic goals

Agree entirely

[Itza Schutzbach 2]

It's good to know that our Judge is above all.

[Melanie Washington 5]

Let's not argue friends....and let's not judge.  Whatever any of us are doing,  if it's not the right thing, Jehovah will take care of it.

I pray the brother King stays protected from Satan while he is pursuing his career, as it I pray for all of Jehovah's people to be protected from Satan. He (Satan) tries to get to us no matter what we're doing. 

[JW Insider 4,553]

And here he is again singing with Franz, Woodworth, Knorr, etc, at WBBR: (second from right, next to Knorr)

 

[Anna 1,992]

On 4/15/2017 at 10:01 PM, Melanie Washington said:

Let's not argue friends.

But we love to argue here!......Hehehe. By the way, last time I spoke with him, which was a few months ago, singing is not a career for him, and he is not pursuing it. It's something he does on the side.

[Melanie Washington 5]

8 hours ago, Anna said:

But we love to argue here!....

I hope that's not the case.  It doesn't seem like that to me anyway, but I honestly seldom read all of the comments. I did for this story, because I was suprised that someone seemed to be criticizing this young men and I was trying to understand why.

 Also, what he does for employment is of no concern to me. I'm sure the brothers would handle it if he wasn't representing  Jehovah well.

[Anna 1,992]

41 minutes ago, Melanie Washington said:

I hope that's not the case.  It doesn't seem like that to me anyway, but I honestly seldom read all of the comments. I did for this story, because I was suprised that someone seemed to be criticizing this young men and I was trying to understand why.

 Also, what he does for employment is of no concern to me. I'm sure the brothers would handle it if he wasn't representing  Jehovah well.

I was just teasing. We dont think we are arguing, but having a discussion. But many people view it as arguing.

I think the criticism came mainly because of the pictures, where he is seen being very buddy buddy with some who look like very worldly people. And I think some were making the point that the Brothers tolerate, what otherwise would be frowned upon, if the person is "famous", in other words there are double standards.

[Melanie Washington 5]

Yes. That's what I summized after reading the comments.  I think people forget that Jehovah gave us free will and we are not zombies. We have to live our lives and we are responsible fto Jehovah for the choices we make.  As long as we are not bringing reproach on Jehovah, the brothers are not going to dictate what we can or can't do. Some people are very critical of others,  whatever they are doing if it doesn't for what they feel is okay. Jehovah is more loving than that.  He gives all of the freedom to grow spiritually at our own pace, and lovingly guides us along the way. I, personally,  am very grateful for that.

[Noble Berean 162]

It's kind of odd to make a post calling out a specific Bethelite brother. Do you know him personally? Because if not, you really don't know if his career affects his Bethel service. Aren't we encouraged not to judge others? What if he Googles his name and your negative post shows up? As far as his FB posts, I don't think a few photos with D-list celebrities means he's clamoring for fame.

However, I do agree with you that there are double standards in the organization. The WT always seems to portray extreme depictions of a Christian lifestyle--to the point that it doesn't feel grounded in reality. For instance, in the recent convention video Remember the Wife of Lot, almost any post-high school education is seen as a pathway to danger. But I know the organization uses (and even pays) college-educated brothers and sisters to create their literature, videos, and music. They also use many JW lawyers. So, the anti-college warnings feel disingenuous and weird. And the reality is not everyone can be a full-time pioneer or live on the brink of poverty, but we all make little sacrifices to be in this faith. I wish we could see a JW video like that. I don't believe JWs should sacrifice their musical interests, but we shouldn't use that talent to pursue an illustrious career or a career that takes our focus away from Jehovah.

[James Thomas Rook Jr. 3,569]

I think the thing that is being overlooked here, is the unwritten rule that pervades the entire Society, from top to bottom

... EVERYTHING NOT SPECIFICALLY PERMITTED .. IS FORBIDDEN!

Unless of course, like Michael Jackson, and recently the entertainer known as Prince, you give $30,000 a month to the Society, and in Prince's case stood to leave 183 MILLION DOLLARS to the Society.

Then, the "rules" are bent into a pretzel .... without breaking them.

This has not changed since ancient times when tribal witch doctors were the local governing bodies.

[Anna 1,992]

45 minutes ago, Noble Berean said:

It's kind of odd to make a post calling out a specific Bethelite brother. Do you know him personally? Because if not, you really don't know if his career affects his Bethel service. Aren't we encouraged not to judge others? What if he Googles his name and your negative post shows up? As far as his FB posts, I don't think a few photos with D-list celebrities means he's clamoring for fame.

However, I do agree with you that there are double standards in the organization. The WT always seems to portray extreme depictions of a Christian lifestyle--to the point that it doesn't feel grounded in reality. For instance, in the recent convention video Remember the Wife of Lot, almost any post-high school education is seen as a pathway to danger. But I know the organization uses (and even pays) college-educated brothers and sisters to create their literature, videos, and music. They also use many JW lawyers. So, the anti-college warnings feel disingenuous and weird. And the reality is not everyone can be a full-time pioneer or live on the brink of poverty, but we all make little sacrifices to be in this faith. I wish we could see a JW video like that. I don't believe JWs should sacrifice their musical interests, but we shouldn't use that talent to pursue an illustrious career or a career that takes our focus away from Jehovah.

It stands to reason that professionals are needed. They will be needed come the new system too. If you are able to acquire a profession without it encroaching on, or taking you away from, Jehovah's service then NO one will bat an eyelid. If one doesn't understand what the WT is saying regarding education, then perhaps they need to make the truth their own first,  and then they will be able to make a wise decision.

[TrueTomHarley 3,343]

On 10/5/2016 at 0:28 AM, Jay Witness said:

But he also is a jazz singer, traveling constantly performing at concerts, casinos, charity events, even a brief appearance on The Tonight Show. (Not much time left for service and meetings, now is there?) Besides that, he's hobnobbing with loads of worldly people, showing off on his Facebook page.

What's it to you?

 

On 4/15/2017 at 10:01 PM, Melanie Washington said:

Let's not argue friends

You should not think all are friends here.

On 2/5/2017 at 8:51 AM, Ann O'Maly said:

Talents in many of the arts or in, say, natural sciences are not much in demand with regard to the Organization's 'theocratic goals.' So one would hope, from a JW point-of-view, that young ones would be encouraged to 'maximize their talent potential alongside achieving theocratic goals.'

Just think. If he only pursued the priorities you seem to advocate - why, he could be another Chester Bennington! Or Michael George! Or Kurt Cobain! And a ...who's the other one who just hung himself a few weeks ago? Or, by ignoring spiritual things, he could live 80 years and then die!!!

3 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

This has not changed since ancient times when tribal witch doctors were the local governing bodies.

...sigh...

[b4ucuhear 256]

16 hours ago, Noble Berean said:

 For instance, in the recent convention video Remember the Wife of Lot, almost any post-high school education is seen as a pathway to danger. But I know the organization uses (and even pays) college-educated brothers and sisters to create their literature, videos, and music. They also use many JW lawyers. So, the anti-college warnings feel disingenuous and weird.

The anti college/university warnings may seem a bit weird but the warnings are there for a reason. Some have fallen away from the faith because of closer association and involvement with the world. That being said, I do understand your point about double standards. When the society needs lawyers, doctors, engineers...it's all good - they just won't pay for it now for the most part. However, if parents and the brother feels he needs to go to university (apparently college is OK) then that is more than a warning/discouraged (can't speak for how this is being applied elsewhere). The most recent direction we have from the society is that if a son chooses to go to university, the Father's elder qualifications are required to be put into question or they may not be even recommended at all. But that removal/not being recommended review is being taken by both elders and Circuit Overseers as a law - even though there is a series of questions elders should go through to determine if a brother should be removed/recommended if his son goes to university. At the same time that a brother has not been recommended in our congregation because his son is going to university (he is exemplary in every way, including his family and the said son that is attending university), there is a visiting brother who did go to university who has privileges but is "being used by Bethel." It is very disappointing because the brother and his family is one of the most exemplary in the congregation AND, the vast majority of elders favour recommending him. (The Kibosh on the recommendation comes from higher up). So these types of double standards and  "going beyond the things written" in creating new defacto laws to control or penalize personal decision is what makes us appear to be cultish both from outside and within the organization.

[Noble Berean 162]

6 hours ago, b4ucuhear said:

The anti college/university warnings may seem a bit weird but the warnings are there for a reason. Some have fallen away from the faith because of closer association and involvement with the world.

I understand being vigilant to the world's influence, but aren't JWs exposed to the world in any job or K12 school? Why is there such a strong emphasis on college in particular? At some point, we all have to encounter and work with worldly people in our day-to-day lives. I hate to use the phrase "thought control" but that's the only conclusion I can make from this anti-college sentiment. Tony Morris even said in a broadcast that colleges expose young ones to dangerous worldly philosophies. It's like they don't want young JWs to become too smart or they'll "wise up."

6 hours ago, b4ucuhear said:

The most recent direction we have from the society is that if a son chooses to go to university, the Father's elder qualifications are required to be put into question or they may not be even recommended at all.

That is very interesting. Is this from a leaked doc or word of mouth?

[b4ucuhear 256]

"Paul wrote the Corinthians a second letter. He told them: “Not that we are the masters over your faith, but we are fellow workers for your joy, for it is by your faith that you are standing.” (2 Cor. 1:24) What did Paul mean by that? And how should those words affect Christian elders today?
OUR FAITH AND OUR JOY
3 Paul mentioned two vital aspects of our worship—faith and joy. Recall that regarding faith, he wrote: “Not that we are the masters over your faith, . . . for it is by your faith that you are standing.” With these words, Paul acknowledged that the brothers in Corinth stood firm, not because of him or any other human, but because of their own faith in God. Hence, Paul saw no need to control the faith of his brothers, and he had no desire to do so. He was confident that they were faithful Christians who wanted to do what was right. (2 Cor. 2:3) Today, elders follow Paul’s example by expressing confidence in their brothers’ faith and motives for serving God. (2 Thess. 3:4) Rather than making rigid rules for the congregation, elders rely on Scriptural principles and direction from Jehovah’s organization. After all, present-day elders are not the masters over their brothers’ faith.—1 Pet. 5:2, 3." WT 2013

I am in full agreement with that the direction we receive in that article. One of the ongoing problems I see at times is that many/some brothers take suggestions/principles...and make them into their own hard and narrow personal rules. Or that some are so dominated by authority that they are afraid to make any decision that isn't "safe" - even if it is legitimate within the framework and direction we receive and may even impinge on the faith of others.  I also worry when the direction we receive (and I respect) starts sounding like our personal choices are being overruled/dictated to us by imperfect men - especially when it is well beyond the boundaries of doctrinal matters.  I recognize the value of the counsel (ie higher learning) and the potential dangers associated with it. But I am uncomfortable when parent's decisions (not involving doctrinal matters) is in effect taken away from them and assumed by someone else, or face the threat of penalty.

[TrueTomHarley 3,343]

1 hour ago, Noble Berean said:

I hate to use the phrase "thought control" but that's the only conclusion I can make from this anti-college sentiment.

The most basic and essential technique of successful thought control is to first separate a subject from all that is familiar. Jehovah's Witnesses are often accused of thought control, yet a prospective witness spends only about 5% of his time in unfamiliar surroundings - all else is as it has always been.

the typical university student, however, is separated almost 100% from all that is familiar - housed and fed and taught on campus that has almost zero regard for Christian beliefs.

[James Thomas Rook Jr. 3,569]

Dueling banjos.

Is it better to sit up on the porch, pickin 'n a grinnin' .... or take the canoe downriver through the rapids?

[TrueTomHarley 3,343]

I hope someone tells this Nicholas King fellow that he is having his 15 minutes of fame.

[Melanie Washington 5]

Anyone judging a matter before knowing ALL the facts is foolish. Proverbs 18:13

Who are you to jugde? James 4:12

Only Jesus can judge. John 1:22, 27

STOP judging! Matthew 7:1, 2

[James Thomas Rook Jr. 3,569]

Good advice for the ELDERS!, Melanie.

Under the Early Christian Congregation judging was limited to what we today call "marking", and people made INDIVIDUAL DECISIONS based on  a Bible Trained Conscience .... disfellowshipping was NOT institutionalized, as it is today, and certainly not with the rampant and brazen CRUELTY of destroying whole families or the sins of ONE PERSON.

If the Elders are going to make the decisions FOR US ... why have a Bible trained conscience AT ALL?

.