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Governing Body: Does it show loyalty or disloyalty to question the GB?


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 On 8/25/2017 at 6:03 PM, JW Insider said:

It's easy to understand that sentiment. What's hard to understand is why you claim that you will always prefer the teachings of Jehovah's Witnesses even if you are aware that the Bible teaches something different. I'm really surprised that any Witness would admit that. Seriously!

You have admitted your thinking about Jehovah's Witnesses. Now its on record for all to see.

So you feel , after your edit, that its ok to pick and choose what to believe from Jehovah's Organization.

[edited to add the words in brackets] by "insider":

 "What's hard to understand is why you claim that you will always prefer the [certain, specific] teachings of Jehovah's Witnesses even if you are aware that the Bible teaches something different [about those certain, specific teachings]"

You even went so far as to say on 8/27 : "You obviously don't know that that my experience at Bethel makes me believe that I have "power" and "authority" to question the dispensation of spiritual food by God." Need I say more O.o You have more authority because you spent a few years at Bethel 40 years ago. LOL right. No wonder you believe you have as you say"special interpretation". O.o Rather haughty - no wonder you call yourself an "insider". Satan was an "insider" also, so I woundn't brag about it.

No reason to say further. Promoting the teachings of Christendom is wrong. Jesus said "by their fruits " you would recognize true from false religion.

The Bible teaches whatever our HEAD tells us we do = JESUS. NOT you and Christendom. LOL seriously O.o

This is a shipwreck in progress. All I have to say now is:

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Then why did the Watchtower ever change anything if everything was directly from scripture? Obviously you are saying that this might not have been true last year, because some things have already changed since then, but it must be true this year. But if it's true this year, then you are claiming that any changes made for next year are no longer directly from Scripture, unless of course you are arguing that the Scriptures contradict themselves. You are using cult-speak even though the Watchtower

Knowing the role of the Governing Body should help us to understand how to treat them. This was brought up in another thread, but it seems relevant here. In the first century, the order of authority was apostles then prophets (1 Cor 12:28).  It seems to me that the prophets and apostles checked each other so that no one group became too powerful in the first century. They both had different but equally important roles to fulfill: the apostles took the lead over the congregation and the prop

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2 minutes ago, bruceq said:

So you feel , after your edit, that its ok to pick and choose what to believe from Jehovah's Organization.

Yes. Of course. It's our obligation and our responsibility. See the list of scriptures that are currently in the very first post under this topic/thread. And there are at least a dozen more such scriptures that I didn't include. We should always pick and choose right from wrong. It's the very reason for having and training our conscience.

Otherwise, you could be led astray by various doctrines. Imagine if no one had questioned it when Russell said that the Great Pyramid was, "Jehovah's witness" as he called it, or "the Bible in stone." How long would Rutherford have gone on bragging about how when he changed the correct belief about Romans 13 to the incorrect belief that this was direct proof that prophecy was being fulfilled through the Watchtower Society?

11 minutes ago, bruceq said:

You even went so far as to say on 8/27 : "You obviously don't know that that .my experience at Bethel makes me believe that I have "power" and "authority" to question the dispensation of spiritual food by God." Need I say more O.o 

Yes, indeed. You need to say more. How about including the very next sentence in the context. AllenSmith had just said he "KNOWS" that this claim makes me believe this particular lie. So I answered:

10 hours ago, JW Insider said:

You obviously don't know that that my experience at Bethel makes me believe that I have "power" and "authority" to question the dispensation of spiritual food by God. If you "knew" of course, your guess could not have been so wrong.

I know that @Anna wanted me to give you the benefit of the doubt, that you weren't actually scouring my words to find some way to dishonestly twist them. I wonder what she or other readers of your words think now? And I'm back to wondering if you really have no concern to represent Jehovah's Witnesses as honest and studious. You could end up giving the impression that . . . well, I'm sure you already know what impression this gives. But I would ask you to remember that Jesus said "By their fruits you will recognize them."

  • (Matthew 7:20) 20 Really, then, by their fruits you will recognize those men.
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15 minutes ago, JW Insider said:

Yes. Of course. It's our obligation and our responsibility. See the list of scriptures that are currently in the very first post under this topic/thread. And there are at least a dozen more such scriptures that I didn't include. We should always pick and choose right from wrong. It's the very reason for having and training our conscience.

 

So you DO believe in the authority of the Governing Body to interpret "Presence, Sign, Gentile Times..." Or in YOUR authority to interpret these things to us?

O.o

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12 minutes ago, bruceq said:

So you DO believe in the authority of the Governing Body to interpret "Presence, Sign, Gentile Times..." Or in YOUR authority to interpret these things to us?

Thanks again for the direct question. I absolutely do believe in the authority of the Governing Body to interpret "Presence, Sign, Gentile Times, etc." And I also believe it is your responsibility, bruceq, to question it, the same way that the Galatians were expected to question the teachings about circumcision and law that were being promoted by James, Peter and John and others.

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On 8/27/2017 at 0:12 PM, JW Insider said:

Thanks again for the direct question. I absolutely do believe in the authority of the Governing Body to interpret "Presence, Sign, Gentile Times, etc." And I also believe it is your responsibility, bruceq, to question it, the same way that the Galatians were expected to question the teachings about circumcision and law that were being promoted by James, Peter and John and others.

So you believe it is proper to question Jehovah and His Organization. O.o

I can see it now...you approach Jehovah and say: I have the authority to question what the Governing Body is teaching us even though YOU appointed them with the authority to interpret things to us because I spent a few years at Bethel. O.o

Once again here is insiders path of interpretation away from Jehovah's Organization. With your teachings you may attract some undesirables {even opposers}  as they see disunity by not following the teachings of Jehovah's Organization. 1 Cor. 1:10, Mt. 24:45.  -  And now I see it has happened!!!

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52 minutes ago, AllenSmith said:

Prove, the governing body has changed Jesus doctrine which is God's Doctrine.

Sure. From 1919 to 1927 the Governing Body promoted the doctrine that the Great Pyramid was as Russell called it: "Jehovah's witness" and "the Bible in stone." The books stating this doctrine were promoted until about 1933. After Rutherford changed the doctrine, he even called the Great Pyramid, "Satan's Bible." (1928)  So if you believe that what was taught from 1919 to 1927 was "God's doctrine" then the Governing Body under Rutherford changed it.

Of course, in 1925 Rutherford also used the term "Satan" to refer to the larger part of the Governing Body at that time and he finally got rid of the entire Editorial Committee, which he had previously referred to as "Satan," in 1931.

The Watchtower also claims that Rutherford changed Russell's "correct view" of Romans 13 to an incorrect view, and says that it stayed that way in the 1930's until the 1960's. If you believe the current doctrine is "God's doctrine" and that the Watchtower is correct when it says that this doctrine was "correct" under Russell, then you should accept the Watchtower's view that Rutherford changed what you now call "God's doctrine."

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33 minutes ago, AllenSmith said:

Don't you feel better, rather than being hypocritical for almost two years? Remember, back then before I was deleted so you could look good to others here. I asked you to be HONEST!! I "respect" honesty. What I don't respect is dancing around honesty. I'm glad you finally got it out of your chest. That's good. You've unburdened yourself. And others can finally deal with realism, to know if you think that "truth" is insulting, then you obviously despise the Watchtower.

Oh boy!! :) I think that first question was supposed to be rhetorical, right? Clearly you are mistaken in thinking that this is the first time I've pointed out that the answers to such ridiculous questions are sometimes so obvious. The reason I have said the exact same thing on several previous occasions in the last couple years is that it highlights the contradiction you create when you call doctrines from any particular "current" time "God's doctrines." I have to say that it seems so demeaning to an all-powerful God to sully his name by saying that certain false doctrines had to be considered "God's doctrines" just because at the current time, back then, they were being promoted by the Governing Body.

Paul actually cursed at the Galatians for putting up with this kind of thinking: that just because the persons who are promoting a teaching are well-respected persons such as Peter, James and John, that they should just go along with it:

  • (Galatians 1:7-9) . . .; but there are certain ones who are causing you trouble and wanting to distort the good news about the Christ. 8 However, even if we or an angel out of heaven were to declare to you as good news something beyond the good news we declared to you, let him be accursed. 9 As we have said before, I now say again, Whoever is declaring to you as good news something beyond what you accepted, let him be accursed.

Yet it was the same people Paul named here that we have called the "Governing Body" in Jerusalem: Peter, James and John, for example. So you can't argue that when Paul says, "beyond the good news that was declared to you" that he was referring to the Governing Body. He was referring to the doctrines of Christ Jesus and Jehovah God as now found in the Bible.

  • (Galatians 3:1-3) 3 O senseless Ga·la?tians! Who has brought you under this evil influence, you who had Jesus Christ openly portrayed before you as nailed to the stake? 2 This one thing I want to ask you: Did you receive the spirit through works of law or because of faith in what you heard? 3 Are you so senseless? After starting on a spiritual course, are you finishing on a fleshly course?

So there's nothing new here in spite of you rhetoric. You have always known that there have been false teachings that were considered "God's teachings" at the time. But this very idea brings reproach on the truth. The entire meaning of the word truth is turned upside down if you are required to say that falsehood is also truth and that a person can even be disciplined for believing truth when he is still required to accept falsehood as "God's doctrines."

Instead, we can be appreciative of the progress that has always been made. We can cheer on the Governing Body for the wonderful tools they have provided, and the set of core doctrines that we appreciate. We can thank Jehovah that they have been so successful under His guidance, as someone here just said. But calling what is good, bad, and what is bad, good is not what Jehovah wants from us. 

  • (Isaiah 5:20) 20 Woe to those who say that good is bad and bad is good, Those who substitute darkness for light and light for darkness, Those who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter!

 

 

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Knowing the role of the Governing Body should help us to understand how to treat them. This was brought up in another thread, but it seems relevant here. In the first century, the order of authority was apostles then prophets (1 Cor 12:28). 

It seems to me that the prophets and apostles checked each other so that no one group became too powerful in the first century. They both had different but equally important roles to fulfill: the apostles took the lead over the congregation and the prophets were spiritual guides. 

The prophets were necessary to "fill in the gaps" of an incomplete Bible, but today we have a complete Bible. So, prophets are unnecessary. However, the GB asserts that Bible discernment is unsuccessful without their interpretations of it. In other words, the Bible alone is insufficient--we need the GB to "fill in the gaps." So, the GB acts likes the apostles by taking the lead and prophets by being exclusive interpreters of the Bible.

This premise seems flawed to me. The Bible should stand alone as a separate entity. It shouldn't be intertwined with the GB, because the Bible should act as an external auditor for the GB's actions. At present, by being "guardians of doctrine" the GB can make the Bible fit their method of operation. The Bible is not a rigid thing and this can be taken advantage of.

So while I respect the Governing Body for taking the lead, I feel that they have too much unchecked authority, and this could set a bad precedent for the future. The GB should be actively checked by the Bible and any student of the Bible.  
 
 

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"Governing Body: Does it show loyalty or disloyalty to question the GB?"

Firstly, I ask, loyalty to what?  The organization or to God?

I think the better question is, do we show loyalty to God and Christ when tolerating wayward teachings by the GB?  If these men were faithful servants, they would welcome questions and suggestions from fellow anointed servants and adjust their own thinking by reasoning on the scriptures. This is the role of a steward; to gather from all sources. 

  Although they truly would love to called so, and hint at it frequently, they are not Moses. Instead of pointing to themselves as the source of the final word, they should be pointing to God. Acts 14:15; Luke 4:8; Rev 19:10 There is not just one rotten and discarded teaching from the mouths of the GB, there is a bushel of them.  Matt 12:33; Col 2:8

Are they above law of loving one’s neighbor as one’s self?  They certainly show it in the same way as the Pharisees. Matt 5:20; Mark 10:42-45; Phil 2:3; Rom 12:10; Eph 5:21

Even Jesus did not expect glory for himself. John 7:16,18; 17:4

We are judged on our love for purity in truth, not for following men.

 

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      References
      The Watchtower, March 15, 2002 pp. 13-14 paragraph 4 Watchtower August 1, 2001 p. 14 paragraph 8, "A mature Christian ... does not advocate or insist on personal opinions or harbor private ideas when it comes to Bible understanding. Rather, he has complete confidence in the truth as it is revealed by Jehovah God through his Son, Jesus Christ, and 'the faithful and discreet slave.'" "Jehovah, the God of Progressive Revelation", Watchtower, June 15, 1964, page 365, "The abundance of spiritual food and the amazing details of Jehovah's purposes that have been revealed to Jehovah's anointed witnesses are clear evidence that they are the ones mentioned by Jesus when he foretold a 'faithful and discreet slave' class that would be used to dispense God's progressive revelations in these last days ... How thankful we should be for the provision God has made of this slave class, the modern spiritual remnant, as they faithfully dispense the revealed truths of Jehovah! ... Jehovah's faithful witnesses have been progressively brought to an understanding of Jehovah's purposes, which are clearer now than ever before in history." Penton, M. James (1997). Apocalypse Delayed. University of Toronto Press. p. 160. ISBN 0-8020-7973-3. Penton, M. James (1997). Apocalypse Delayed. University of Toronto Press. p. 33. ISBN 0-8020-7973-3. The Watchtower, February 15, 1927, page 55, paragraph 38. Watch Tower, 1927, as referenced by Jehovah's Witnesses - Proclaimers of God's Kingdom, Watchtower Society, 1993, page 626. Report of Annual Meeting, Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society of Pennsylvania, October 6, 2012. Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content.  (1963), The Four Major Cults, Grand Rapids, Michigan: William B. Eerdmans, pp. 246–247, ISBN 0-8028-3117-6 Organized to Do Jehovah's Will, Watch Tower Society, 2005, p. 16. The Watchtower April 1, 1972, p. 197. The Watchtower August 1, 2002, p. 13 paragraph 17. "Do You Discern the Evidence of God's Guidance?", The Watchtower, April 15, 2011, pages 3-5. "Do You Discern the Evidence of God’s Guidance?", The Watchtower, April 15, 2011, "Jesus Christ is the assigned Leader of the congregation. He has delegated some authority to a faithful slave class, made up of faithful spirit-anointed Christians. That slave class, in turn, appoints overseers in the Christian congregation." "Do You Take the Lead in Showing Honor?", The Watchtower, October 15, 2008, page 23, "It is Scriptural for “the faithful and discreet slave” through its Governing Body to appoint men to positions of responsibility, and some men are appointed to exercise authority over other appointed men." Overseers and Ministerial Servants Theocratically Appointed", The Watchtower, January 15, 2001, page 15, "The Governing Body appoints qualified brothers at the branches to represent it in making appointments of elders and ministerial servants. Care is taken that those acting representatively on behalf of the Governing Body clearly understand and follow the Scriptural guidelines for making such appointments. Hence, it is under the direction of the Governing Body that qualified men are appointed to serve in the congregations of Jehovah’s Witnesses worldwide." Organized To Do God's Will, Watch Tower Bible & Tract Society, 2005, page 16. Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content.  (1963), The Four Major Cults, Grand Rapids, Michigan: William B. Eerdmans, pp. 300–301, ISBN 0-8028-3117-6 Beckford, James A. (1975), The Trumpet of Prophecy: A Sociological Study of Jehovah's Witnesses, Oxford: Basil Blackwell, p. 109, ISBN 0-631-16310-7 One Lord, One Faith, One Baptism”, The Watchtower, September 15, 1983, page 19, paragraph 19. Jehovah's Witnesses in the Divine Purpose, Watch Tower Bible & Tract Society, 1959, page 22, "... in many ways the evidence was beginning to accumulate that, of all the early voices heard, Jehovah had chosen the publication we now call The Watchtower to be used as a channel through which to bring to the world of mankind a revelation of the divine will and, through the words revealed in its columns, to begin a division of the world's population into those who would do the divine will and those who would not. For this reason 1879 was a turning point in the work. This little group, headed by C.T. Russell, had now been tested and had been found fit to undertake the great preliminary campaign leading up to the climax expected in Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. ." "Willingly Expand Your Ministry", The Watchtower, June 1, 1963, page 338. Zion's Watch Tower and Herald of Christ's Presence, October/November 1881. Proclaimers of God's Kingdom, Watch Tower Bible & Tract Society, 1993, page 142. Watch Tower, July 15, 1906, Watch Tower Reprints, page 3811, As Retrieved 2009-09-23, page 215. Penton, M. James (1997). Apocalypse Delayed. University of Toronto Press. pp. 33–37. ISBN 0-8020-7973-3. The Battle of Armageddon (Part IV, "Studies in the Scriptures") by C. T. Russell, Watch Tower Bible & Tract Society, 1897, page 613. Watch Tower, October 1, 1909, Watch Tower Reprints, page 4482, As Retrieved 2009-09-23, page 292 "Testing and Sifting From Within", Jehovah's Witnesses - Proclaimers of God's Kingdom, Watchtower Society, 1993, page 626, "According to Brother Russell, his wife, who later left him, was the first one to apply Matthew 24:45-47 to him. See the Watch Tower issues of July 15, 1906, page 215; March 1, 1896, page 47; and June 15, 1896, pages 139-40." Watch Tower, December 1, 1916, Watch Tower Reprints, page 5998, As Retrieved 2009-09-23, page 357 "Testing and Sifting From Within", Jehovah's Witnesses - Proclaimers of God's Kingdom, page 626, "Many ... clung to the view that a single individual, Charles Taze Russell, was the "faithful and wise servant" ... Particularly following his death, The Watch Tower itself set forth this view for a number of years. In view of the prominent role that Brother Russell had played, it appeared to the Bible Students of that time that this was the case. He did not personally promote the idea, but he did acknowledge the apparent reasonableness of the arguments of those who favored it." Publisher's Preface, Studies in the Scriptures, Series VII: The Finished Mystery, Peoples Pulpit Association, Brooklyn, NY, 1917. Watch Tower, March 1, 1923, pages 68 and 71, as cited by Raymond Franz, Crisis of Conscience, Commentary Press, 2007, page 63. Watch Tower, 1927, as referenced by Jehovah's Witnesses - Proclaimers of God's Kingdom, Watchtower Society, 1993, page 626. The Watchtower, September 15, 1950 p. 326|"The Father is the great Provider of spiritual food, and he delegates to his organization the duty of preparing and serving this life-sustaining 'meat in due season'. The table is the Lord’s, he sits at the head, and the children seated at the table are waited on and served and helped by the mother organization." "Release Under Way to the Ends of the Earth", The Watchtower December 15, 1951, page 749, paragraph 4|"Christ Jesus approved of his remnant as a 'faithful and discreet slave' and set this "slave" class over all his earthly belongings. Then by the theocratic organization Jehovah led them from one truth to another, opening the eyes of their hearts and the ears of their understanding to see and hear these truths." The Watchtower, May 15, 2008, page 29 "Seek God's guidance in all things", The Watchtower, April 15, 2008, page 11. "How Are Christians Spiritually Fed?", The Watchtower, January 15, 1975. "Do You Appreciate the “Faithful and Discreet Slave”?", The Watchtower, March 1, 1981, page 24. Theocratic Aid to Kingdom Publishers, Watch Tower Bible & Tract Society, 1945, page 307. Franz, Raymond (2007). In Search of Christian Freedom. Commentary Press. pp. 128, 129. ISBN 0-914675-17-6. Penton, M. James (1997). Apocalypse Delayed. University of Toronto Press. pp. 179–183. ISBN 0-8020-7973-3. Insight In The Scriptures volume 1, Watch Tower Bible & Tract Society, 1988, p. 805-806. See also:
       
    • By Anna
      I have posted this issue before, but it was during the time of the hot topic of the persecution in Russia and maybe got overshadowed by it. A poster brought it up again in one of the threads so I thought I will try again to post it as a topic. My goal is not to sow doubts, nor to promote some false ideas, but rather to get to the bottom of this as I feel it is a valid question. The summary of the problem can be seen in the quotes below:
      Referring to people leaving their religion to join Jehovah's Witnesses:
      "No one should be forced to worship in a way that he finds unacceptable or be made to choose between his beliefs and his family".  Awake 7/09 page 29
      AND
      Regarding those disfellowshipped from Jehovah's Witnesses:
      "Really, what your beloved family member needs to see is your resolute stance to put Jehovah above anything else - including the family bond.....Do not look for excuses to associate with a disfellowshipped family member, for example, through email" p.16, paragraph 19, Study WT Jan / 2013
      In the above situation we are assuming that the reason for disfellowshipping was because of changing one's religion and/or apostasy (not because of immorality etc.)
       
       
       
       
    • By James Thomas Rook Jr.
      Have any past Presidents of the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society
      ever had armed bodyguards .. and does the GB now have them?
    • By JW Insider
      Usually when we refer to the "faithful and discreet slave" parable, we refer to the parable of 'the faithful and the unfaithful slave' found in Matthew 24:45-51. But the parable of the "faithful and discreet slave" is also found in Luke, where the expression is changed a bit to "the faithful steward, the discreet one . . . that slave."
      (Luke 12:42-48) 42 And the Lord said: “Who really is the faithful steward, the discreet one, whom his master will appoint over his body of attendants to keep giving them their measure of food supplies at the proper time? 43 Happy is that slave if his master on coming finds him doing so! 44 I tell you truthfully, he will appoint him over all his belongings. 45 But if ever that slave should say in his heart, ‘My master delays coming,’ and starts to beat the male and female servants and to eat and drink and get drunk, 46 the master of that slave will come on a day that he is not expecting him and at an hour that he does not know, and he will punish him with the greatest severity and assign him a part with the unfaithful ones. 47 Then that slave who understood the will of his master but did not get ready or do what he asked will be beaten with many strokes. 48 But the one who did not understand and yet did things deserving of strokes will be beaten with few. Indeed, everyone to whom much was given, much will be demanded of him, and the one who was put in charge of much will have more than usual demanded of him.
      "That slave" is given an assignment to feed the master's "body of attendants." If he obeys, he gets a promotion, and if he disobeys he is punished. This is the exact same idea as in Matthew 24, except that there are only about 15 words referring what happens if this slave obeys and 150 words in the section about what happens if the slave disobeys. That's about 10 times as much space given to the idea of disobedience versus obedience. In Matthew it's only about 3 times as much space given to the idea of disobedience.
      That might explain why the verses in Matthew are referenced so much more often in Watch Tower publications and speech. The Watchtower has, of course, minimized the idea of any potential disobedience:
      *** w13 7/15 p. 24 “Who Really Is the Faithful and Discreet Slave?” ***
      Was Jesus foretelling that there would be an evil slave class in the last days? No. Granted, some individuals have manifested a spirit similar to that of the evil slave described by Jesus. We would call them apostates, whether they were of the anointed or of the “great crowd.” (Rev. 7:9) But such ones do not make up an evil slave class. Jesus did not say that he would appoint an evil slave. His words here are actually a warning directed to the faithful and discreet slave.
        Notice that Jesus introduces the warning with the words “if ever.” One scholar says that in the Greek text, this passage “for all practical purposes is a hypothetical condition.”
      This is an adjustment to the doctrine held just up until the change in 2013. Prior to the quote above (originally presented at the Annual Meeting in 2012) the idea about the evil slave was just the opposite: that the "evil slave" came directly from the ranks of the "faithful slave."
      *** w04 3/1 p. 13 pars. 2-4 ‘The Faithful Slave’ Passes the Test! ***
      The expression “that evil slave” draws our attention to Jesus’ preceding words about the faithful and discreet slave. Yes, the “evil slave” came from the ranks of the faithful slave. How?
      3 Before 1914, many members of the faithful slave class had high hopes of meeting with the Bridegroom in heaven that year, but their hopes were not fulfilled. As a result of this and other developments, many were disappointed and a few became embittered. Some of these turned to ‘beating’ their former brothers verbally and consorting with “confirmed drunkards,” religious groups of Christendom.—Isaiah 28:1-3; 32:6.
      4 These former Christians came to be identified as the “evil slave,” and Jesus punished them with “the greatest severity.” How? He rejected them, and they lost out on their heavenly hope. They were not, however, immediately destroyed. They first had to endure a period of weeping and gnashing of teeth in “the darkness outside” the Christian congregation. (Matthew 8:12) Since those early days, a few other anointed individuals have shown a similar bad spirit, identifying themselves with the “evil slave.” Some of the “other sheep” have imitated their unfaithfulness. (John 10:16)
      Now, of course, the "faithful slave" is made to be the equivalent of the Governing Body since 1919. (The Governing Body has only existed in its current form since the early to mid-1970's.) For this reason, evidently, it would no longer be appropriate to consider or expect that the evil slave might come from the ranks of the Governing Body. Continuing this teaching would likely create a measure of suspicion and questioning of the Governing Body themselves.
    • By Diakonos
      I really didn't know whether to laugh, cry or throw my hands up in despair when we discussed this at last night's meeting. The answers that were given during these paragraphs and the response of the study conductor really showed to me how, as a general rule, we are such a non-thinking and illogical group of people.
       
      5 As we saw in Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. of this book, the Bible Students spent decades pointing out that the year 1914 would be significant in fulfilling Bible prophecy. However, at that time they believed that Christ’s presence had begun in 1874, that he had begun to rule in heaven in 1878, and that the Kingdom would not be fully set up until October 1914. The harvest would extend from 1874 to 1914 and would culminate in the gathering of the anointed to heaven. Do mistaken ideas such as these cast doubt on whether Jesus was guiding those faithful ones by means of holy spirit?
      6 Not at all! Think again of our opening illustration. Would the premature ideas and eager questions of the tourists cast doubt on the reliability of their guide? Hardly! Similarly, although God’s people sometimes try to work out details of Jehovah’s purpose before it is time for the holy spirit to guide them to such truths, it is clear that Jesus is leading them. Thus, faithful ones prove willing to be corrected and humbly adjust their views.
       
      It is also upsetting that the governing body, in instances like this, always speak in the third person. How much more humble would it be for them to say ;
       
      "Similarly, although we, the faithful and discreet slave sometimes try to work out details of Jehovah’s purpose before it is time for the holy spirit to guide us to such truths..."
       
      Any comments ?
       




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