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JW Convention 2018 Final Video - English Version

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The governing body has finally realized that FEAR is the only way to keep the JW's in the organization. I mean seriously standing in a field with soldiers heading your way, guns out... wth? This is like the Bunker video, but worse because now there is a song attached to it... this is way too much. I forget what the song was called, but they had everyone sing it at the end. People were crying. I felt so bad knowing how emotional some people got. Makes me so mad.

 @John Houston  See links below for the videos you are looking for.

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Wow that video is so nice, that is how we are living in Nicaragua currently, but in the video the soldiers are still, here they just walk, run against you shooting.... I love the part when King Jesus intervene, "Let your Kingdom come" 

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How is this fear exactly when its encouraging you to find courage in God? Wow some of the things said are truly sad and shows that people don't use their power of reason. Bless all those who speak negatively against Jehovah and his organization. I cried and it was not out of fear, it was out of knowing that I can rely on a higher power for courage in this wicked system. The song was very comforting!

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There are various genres in the film industry. In this video, there are several genres in one. I think, did not watch the whole video, just some parts. As they wait for the "end," these JW people in the video recall some or many moments from their past. In which they have shown their attitude and resisted temptations, remaining faithful to their principle  and so on. Some say that human whole life flashes before the eyes of those who are faced with death. These people in the video are faced with death.

It is funny that hundreds of soldiers surround the twenty civilians in the clearing, on the meadow. Strange military tactics or bad estimates of the commander of the army. Or is it as the WT literature says: "All of us must be ready to obey any instructions we may receive, whether those appear sound from a strategic or human standpoint or not." Seems how similar instructions  existing in army camp too :)))))

The movies exist to make us emotional. And that is ok. It not surprised me how convention people have tears when looks video. All people expecting some spectacular outcome, for movie characters or for those/us who watching. Because  while sitting and looking movie we have projections. We identify with characters, with the main actor, with events. In this video, the director and producer put a couple of comparative main characters. So there is something for everyone. For the old and the young, single and married, for rich and poor ....

We are beings who love fantasy and imagination. Of all kinds. In one moment when i was in prison for neutrality i had imagination too. That wall of jail would broken down as in Jericho and i will walk away :)))) and that was before some 40 years. And walls of that prison still standing and receiving "guests".

It will be nice that God making revolution and "neutralizes" all who are "bad" and those who are not so "bad" (but who are not "good enough"). And new society will growing. And same or similar problem will growing too. Because that is the nature of human, perfect or imperfect not matter. Just opinion :))

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34 minutes ago, Srecko Sostar said:

We identify with characters, with the main actor, with events. In this video, the director and producer put a couple of comparative main characters. So there is something for everyone. For the old and the young, single and married, for rich and poor .... 

One thing the video was conspicuously missing was, looking with big brown eyes at the camera,  a sad, hungry puppy.

 

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6 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

As they wait for the "end," these JW people in the video recall some or many moments from their past. In which they have shown their attitude and resisted temptations, remaining faithful to their principle  and so on. Some say that human whole life flashes before the eyes of those who are faced with death. These people in the video are faced with death. 

I agree with everything you said in your post. I think you understood the film perfectly.

6 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

We identify with characters, with the main actor, with events. In this video, the director and producer put a couple of comparative main characters. So there is something for everyone. For the old and the young, single and married, for rich and poor ....

The film works very well. Some see the theme as fear and some see it as courage. It is mostly about courage, of course, but the backdrop of courage is always fear. That's why the song opens up with the words "Doubt and fear surround me." And the word "fear" is repeated in the song. There is nothing wrong with that in itself, but we have to be careful about the overall impression given when we discuss the context of the great tribulation.

6 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

The WT literature says: "All of us must be ready to obey any instructions we may receive, whether those appear sound from a strategic or human standpoint or not."

This particular film is fine, but we sometimes add the impression that the WTS will still be in full control and have all the right directives that we will need to obey, whether they sound right or not. It dredges up the "Old Testament" context of military authority, and -- just my opinion, of course -- this doesn't seem to be the same context that the Greek Scriptures prepare us for. [It makes the modern-day "ark of salvation" something more physical and material than spiritual.]

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Fear is the compliment of courage.

A person cannot have real courage, without real, palpable fear.

Trying to be courageous is a goal of True Nobility. 

In the face of real danger, a person without fear CANNOT be courageous ... and if without fear, what he does is NOT courage, and he is also a fool.

Courage is not the absence of fear, but rather, deciding that something else is more important than fear.

"A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects."       -       Robert A. Heinlein

There are all kinds of courage.

Doing "The Right Thing" when in the clutch of circumstance and the game is stacked against you requires real courage.

It's called everyday life.

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9 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

It is funny that hundreds of soldiers surround the twenty civilians in the clearing, on the meadow. Strange military tactics or bad estimates of the commander of the army.

My first thought was, with the first shot,  all the surrounded JWs had to do is drop to the ground, and the soldiers would shoot each other!

My second thought was ... why are all the soldiers wearing "masks", if they are going to shoot everyone?

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3 hours ago, JW Insider said:

This particular film is fine, but we sometimes add the impression that the WTS will still be in full control and have all the right directives that we will need to obey, whether they sound right or not. It dredges up the "Old Testament" context of military authority, and -- just my opinion, of course -- this doesn't seem to be the same context that the Greek Scriptures prepare us for. [It makes the modern-day "ark of salvation" something more physical and material than spiritual.] 

In the Old Testament, Jehovah of Armies fought FOR the Jews .... but they ALSO had to fight ... or be prepared and willing to.

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42 minutes ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

but they ALSO had to fight ... or be prepared and willing to.

Christians, too, but without physical weapons:

  • (Ephesians 6:10-13) 10 Finally, go on acquiring power in the Lord and in the mightiness of his strength. 11 Put on the complete suit of armor from God so that you may be able to stand firm against the crafty acts of the Devil; 12 because we have a struggle, not against blood and flesh, but against the governments, against the authorities, against the world rulers of this darkness, against the wicked spirit forces in the heavenly places. 13 For this reason take up the complete suit of armor from God, so that you may be able to resist in the wicked day and, after you have accomplished everything, to stand firm.

And of course, the next verses go on to prove that our weapons and armor, etc., are not physical weapons:

  • 14 Stand firm, therefore, with the belt of truth fastened around your waist, wearing the breastplate of righteousness, 15 and having your feet shod in readiness to declare the good news of peace. 16 Besides all of this, take up the large shield of faith, with which you will be able to extinguish all the wicked one’s burning arrows. 17 Also, accept the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the spirit, that is, God’s word, 18 while with every form of prayer and supplication you carry on prayer on every occasion in spirit.

 

 

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4 hours ago, JW Insider said:

this doesn't seem to be the same context that the Greek Scriptures prepare us for. [It makes the modern-day "ark of salvation" something more physical and material than spiritual.]

Agree. 

“For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war according to the flesh. For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal but mighty in God for pulling down strongholds, casting down arguments and every high thing that exalts itself against the knowledge of God, bringing every thought into captivity to the obedience of Christ.”  2 Cor 10:3-5

The knowledge of God is Truth.  Any argument against truth is a lie; showing that the war at hand and the weapons needed, involve only truth, to battle against lies. 

This is the theme of the Greek scriptures.  Jesus brought truth, battled the lies, and taught his disciples to do the same.  The battle doesn’t take on a physical form with the world’s military armies in the symbolic book of Revelation, but depicts how the rider on the white horse, called “Faithful and True”, defeats the Beast who received “spirit” from the false prophet - all to deceive Christ’s servants…with lies, since that is the weapon false prophets use.  Rev 13:1,5-7,11-17

This is the greatest, destructive “scheme” of Satan and not recognizable by the naked eye. 

 “Finally, be strong in the Lord and in His mighty power. 11 Put on the full armor of God, so that you can take your stand against the devil’s schemes12 For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms.13 Therefore put on the full armor of God, so that when the day of evil comes, you may be able to stand your ground, and after you have done everything, to stand. 14 Stand firm then, with the belt of truth buckled around your waist, with the breastplate of righteousness in place, 15 and with your feet fitted with the readiness that comes from the gospel of peace. 16 In addition to all this, take up the shield of faith, with which you can extinguish all the flaming arrows of the evil one. 17 Take the helmet of salvation and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God.  Eph 6:10-17

The scripture’s “day of evil” isn’t what the video portrays at all.  Rather, it involves Satan’s deception of lies; and our desire to either battle against it, or stand vulnerable in an open field and allow the enemy, Satan, to overcome us with his “flood” of lies.   Joel 3:14; Rev 16:13-16; 2 Thess 2:9-12;  Rev 12:15,16

“And do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul; rather, be afraid of the one who can destroy both soul and body in Gehenna.”  Matt 10:28

We can’t physically see the light and truth of Christ or the darkness and lies of Satan; yet, we know that both powers exist, and are present for us to decide which will enter our hearts and rule our lives.  2 Cor 11:12-15; John 8:12; Phil 2:14-16; 1 John 1:5,6

Since this is the case, the battle to remain in the light of truth, takes a concerted effort, as “the whole world lies under the sway of the wicked one”. 1 John 5:19

 

 

 

 

 

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On 6/18/2018 at 7:34 PM, Jack Ryan said:

The governing body has finally realized that FEAR is the only way to keep the JW's in the organization. I mean seriously standing in a field with soldiers heading your way, guns out... wth? This is like the Bunker video, but worse because now there is a song attached to it... this is way too much. I forget what the song was called, but they had everyone sing it at the end. People were crying. I felt so bad knowing how emotional some people got. Makes me so mad.

“A horrible and shocking thing
  has happened in the land:
 The prophets prophesy lies,
    the priests rule by their own authority, (GB, elder body)
and my people love it this way.
    But what will you do in the end?  Jer 5:30,31

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2 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

why are all the soldiers wearing "masks"

This soldiers belonging to very very special forces extra trained to deal with pacifists people.... it surprised me that don't see water cannons in action.

....and when filming is over all going to Heineken stored and cooled in last year built basement :)))) 

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1 hour ago, Witness said:

The scripture’s “day of evil” isn’t what the video portrays at all.  Rather, it involves Satan’s deception of lies; and our desire to either battle against it,

like this :))

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3 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

My second thought was ... why are all the soldiers wearing "masks", if they are going to shoot everyone?

They do in Russia.

That was a good Heinlein quote. For a while he and Asimov were all the rage as sci-fi writers. Which did you prefer and why? (Not a trap, honest)

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On 6/18/2018 at 10:34 PM, Jack Ryan said:

The governing body has finally realized that FEAR is the only way to keep the JW's in the organization. I mean seriously standing in a field with soldiers heading your way, guns out... wth?

You completely missed the point of the video.

And those people didn't look afraid at all, and neither did the audience that you said got so emotional.

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38 minutes ago, Anna said:

And those people didn't look afraid at all, and neither did the audience that you said got so emotional.

I suppose we would have to check the screenplay to find out how afraid they were.

As you hold the paper, keep your right or left  thumb on the spot where it is mentioned, so you do not loose your place.

Sarah Conner trying to get away from the Terminator(s), when she was in the nut house ... THAT was some good fear acting!

Sara Conner afraid .mp4

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47 minutes ago, Anna said:

And those people didn't look afraid at all,

Yes, you are absolutely right. I went to see video clip ones again. People faces are not showing fear. I noticed that this little JW group assembled in the field because they obviously received some "instruction" to go there and wait. They were been warned in advance what they can expect and what would be the outcome. Because that they are calm, not panic at all. This scene support WT articles about receiving "instructions" that must be obeyed in Armageddon.     

So, yes, their faces not showing fear as in compare to JW group in basement video from 2016, they show fear to some level. And when male part of group stand before women to protect them, looks like bros are ready to fight against black man uniforms.

NOW:

Group in basement 2016 video was obviously died and resurrected in New World. So, does this mean that this (military) attack on JW people was happened before Armageddon?? No, i don't see that from video. It is Armageddon scene.

Because - This year group was also attacked from same kind of (military) people but not died at all. They were saved, by Christ action. 

Question is:  How is possible that one JW  group died in Armageddon and in the same time other JW group is saved from same "enemy" in same global collapse called Armageddon ? 

 

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6 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Question is:  How is possible that one JW  group died in Armageddon and in the same time other JW group is saved from same "enemy" in same global collapse called Armageddon ? 

The scene appears to be a weak representation of the attack of Gog and Magog on the “holy ones”/”saints”  (anointed).   

From Wt 13/11/15 pp. 16-20
“The prophecy about seven shepherds and eight dukes has its major fulfillment in our day. The citizens of ancient Jerusalem were attacked by the Assyrians. IN THE NEAR FUTURE, Jehovah’s apparently vulnerable people will come under attack from the modern-day “Assyrian,” WHOSE INTENT WILL BE TO WIPE THEM OUT. (caps are mine) The Scriptures refer to that attack as well as the attack of ‘Gog of Magog,’ the attack of “the king of the north,” and the attack of “the kings of the earth.” (Ezek. 38:2, 10-13; Dan. 11:40, 44, 45; Rev. 17:14; 19:19) Do these represent separate attacks? Not necessarily. The Bible could be referring to the same attack under different names.”

It appears Watchtower deliberately left out Rev 20:7-10 in this paragraph concerning this attack of Gog and Magog. 

Here’s why:

Wt 15/5/15 “We are told that AT THE END OF THE 1,000 YEARS, Satan will be released from the abyss, and “he will go out to mislead those nations in the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together for the war.”

"IN THE NEAR FUTURE"

"AT THE END OF THE 1,000 YEARS"

Sounds like deceit in the making. 

Rev 20:7-10 - Now when the thousand years have expired, Satan will be released from his prison and will go out to deceive (with lies) the nations which are in the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle, whose number is as the sand of the sea. They went up on the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city. And fire came down from God out of heaven and devoured them. 10 The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are. And they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.” 

Once Armageddon is finished, Satan is finished. 

Ps 110:1,2 - The Lord said to my Lord,
“Sit at My right hand,
Till I make Your enemies Your footstool.”
The Lord shall send the rod of Your strength out of Zion.
Rule in the midst of Your enemies!

There are no enemies in Watchtower’s peaceful thousand-year kingdom after Armageddon. But there are now. And Gog and Magog certainly cannot make two appearances; one at Armageddon and a thousand years later.   

“ But now Christ is risen from the dead, and has become the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep. 21 For since by man came death, by Man also came the resurrection of the dead. 22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ all shall be made alive. 23 But each one in his own order: Christ the firstfruits, afterward those who are Christ’s at His coming.  Then comes the end, when He delivers the kingdom to God the Father, when He puts an end to all rule and all authority and power. 25 For He must reign till He has put all enemies under His feet26 The last enemy that will be destroyed is death. 27 For “He has put all things under His feet.” But when He says “all things are put under Him,” it is evident that He who put all things under Him is excepted.”  1 Cor 15:20-28

Paul is stating that the active reign of Christ began in the first century, leaving 1914 hanging on nothing.  Watchtower has a way of taking scripture and twisting it as they like, to deceive and surround the "saints" and companions, with lies.  

And He said: “Take heed that you not be deceived. For many will come in My name, saying, ‘I am He,’ and, ‘The time has drawn near.’ Therefore do not go after them."  Luke 21:8

 

 

 

 

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Personally I thought it was a very well made video. It was nice to include Phelicity Sneesby, the young girl from Australia who died shorty after the video "Jehovah is more powerful than my health problem" was shown. She appears in the "courageous" video to the words of "Lasting harm can never hold me—No prison, gate, or grave".

For those who have been following the last few conventions the video will have more meaning because they will recognize the characters from some of the previous stories.

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1 hour ago, Anna said:

Personally I thought it was a very well made video. I

I can see how you might say that, but what scriptures are used to back up the scene?  Isn't the whole point to learn what the Bible actually says?  Are they just being dramatic without sound reason for doing so, to touch the hearts of the audience who will walk away with not one shred of biblical evidence to support what they saw? 

 It is all a fabrication.

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10 minutes ago, Witness said:

I can see how you might say that, but what scriptures are used to back up the scene?  Isn't the whole point to learn what the Bible actually says?  Are they just being dramatic without sound reason for doing so, to touch the hearts of the audience who will walk away with not one shred of biblical evidence to support what they saw? 

 It is all a fabrication.

It's no more a fabrication than an artist's impression of paradise. I don't think the point was to depict "exactly" how things will transpire because no one knows for sure. The objective was to inspire courage to stand up for what one believes is right. That's what the audience walked away with I would hope.  It was based on Biblical experiences of God's people in the past such as Joshua, Hezekiah and others where God defeated enemies on their behalf.

For our present day Luke 21:27 is quite applicable: "And then they will see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. But as these things start to occur, stand up straight and lift up your heads, because your deliverance is getting near.” 

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On 8/25/2018 at 12:36 PM, Witness said:

The battle doesn’t take on a physical form with the world’s military armies in the symbolic book of Revelation, but depicts how the rider on the white horse, called “Faithful and True”, defeats the Beast who received “spirit” from the false prophet - all to deceive Christ’s servants…with lies, since that is the weapon false prophets use. 

All spiritual battles must manifest themselves in a physical way eventually.

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16 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

I noticed that this little JW group assembled in the field because they obviously received some "instruction" to go there and wait. They were been warned in advance what they can expect and what would be the outcome. Because that they are calm, not panic at all. This scene support WT articles about receiving "instructions" that must be obeyed in Armageddon.     

Yes. That's the point. Things like this can literally happen, and have literally happened in the past right up to the point of the miraculous divine intervention.

In the past such things have happened even to peaceful secular groups who are perceived as being a threat to totalitarian and imperial states. Even if NOT exactly like what will happen during the great tribulation and Armageddon, it still creates a picture of the divine intervention that can be seen in a symbolic way that all Christians should experience when facing death for a righteous cause. Stephen's faith, for example, may have allowed him to see such a vision of divine intervention just prior to being stoned to death. Long prior to Armageddon, in the first three centuries of Christianity, perhaps hundreds of thousands faced death in such a manner in arenas, by mobs, by trial and execution, on stakes and crosses, by wild beasts, by fire, etc. Those true Christians in the past can still experience what is perhaps similar imagery in their very next conscious moments after their death, at the time of their resurrection. This imagery in the video should help produce a reason to feel the same courage in a potentially near future time when that same imagery may happen literally just prior to divine intervention. 

So all this part of the video, and even the video itself is well done and should have a good effect on our courage.

But you hit upon a major theme of the video, even if it was not very overt. It's also about being obedient to men. This could end up making people associate salvation with obedience to humans. I'm sure that @Witness might have mentioned this before somewhere else, but the very article quoted above by "Witness" about Gog and Magog is the article that you quoted from earlier in this topic:

*** ws13 11/15 p. 20 pars. 16-17 Seven Shepherds, Eight Dukes—What They Mean for Us Today *** [Simplified Watchtower]

  • The Bible says that this army is made up of “seven shepherds” and “eight dukes,” or princes. (Micah 5:5) Who are they? They are the congregation elders. (1 Peter 5:2) Today, Jehovah is using many faithful elders to shepherd and to strengthen his people for the future attack of “the Assyrian.” (See footnote.) . . .  (3) At that time, the direction that you receive from Jehovah’s organization may seem strange or unusual. But all of us must be ready to obey any instructions we may receive, whether we agree with them or not, because obeying these instructions will save our lives.

*** w13 11/15 p. 20 par. 17 Seven Shepherds, Eight Dukes—What They Mean for Us Today ***

  • (3) At that time, the life-saving direction that we receive from Jehovah’s organization may not appear practical from a human standpoint. All of us must be ready to obey any instructions we may receive, whether these appear sound from a strategic or human standpoint or not.

It's just my personal opinion, of course, but this is where I see a danger. We are telling people who expect to be surrounded by doubt and fear [the first words of the song in the video] to remember that for salvation they must be ready to obey instructions they hear through the elders that might sound strange and not make any sense "from a human standpoint." In other words, we are to accept and obey the instructions from humans as if they are from something greater than just a human standpoint.

Notice that the simplified Watchtower version comes out and just plainly states that our salvation depends upon obeying strange and unusual direction from elders through the organization: salvation by obedience to men. Did we forget?

  • (Psalm 146:3)  3 Do not put YOUR trust in nobles, Nor in the son of earthling man, to whom no salvation belongs [who cannot bring salvation, NWT Revised].

Calling them nobles, princes, or dukes, doesn't make a difference;  they are still sons of earthling man, humans. The idea above subverts the scripture.

 

 

 

 

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36 minutes ago, JW Insider said:

Calling them nobles, princes, or dukes, doesn't make a difference;  they are still sons of earthling man, humans. The idea above subverts the scripture.

Yes, it does.

Also it subverts plain old common sense ... which seems to be completely nonexistent.

It could only be worse if all those Brothers and Sisters in the video were ordered out into the middle of an open field by the GB or Elders, to be murdered by the mysterious  black suited boogymen, had been told to take shovels with them, and dig their own graves, prior to being attacked.

Jehovah and his armies are seen preparing to slaughter those about to slaughter the Brothers and Sisters, but there is NO evidence that during the years of terror in Germany and Nazi occupied lands, that Jehovah saved a single person, or interfered with any side of the conflict, and approximately 10,000 Brothers and Sisters were murdered by the Nazis.

There is NO evidence that God is in any way interfering with what is going on in the Russian Federation, today.

Not individually.

Not as a group.

Please correct me if I have missed a material fact.

Remember facts?

 

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39 minutes ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

approximately 10,000 Brothers and Sisters were murdered by the Nazis.

We stopped using that number in the 1970s. The jw.org site has a better approximation now:

    Hello guest!

  • About 1,500 of Jehovah’s Witnesses died during the time of the Holocaust, out of some 35,000 Witnesses living in Germany and Nazi-occupied countries. The cause of death is not known in all cases. Since research is ongoing, figures and other details may be updated in time.
  • Executions: Close to 400 Witnesses were executed in Germany and in Nazi-occupied countries. Most victims were tried in court, sentenced to death, and beheaded. Others were shot or hanged without a formal court hearing.
  • Severe detention conditions: More than 1,000 Witnesses died in Nazi concentration camps and prisons. They were worked to death or died as a result of torture, starvation, exposure to cold, illness, or poor medical care. As a result of the brutal treatment, others died shortly after their liberation at the end of World War II.
  • Other causes: Some Witnesses were killed in gas chambers, subjected to deadly medical experiments, or given lethal injections.

The last group under "other causes" could have been as many as 100 Witnesses. Further study on this shows that many of those deaths we might still be counting as "Jehovah's Witnesses" were actually "Bible Students" who were either still one of the other factions of "Russellites" or who had returned to "Bible Students" associations after certain issues they had with J.Rutherford especially after 1927 and after 1933.

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1 hour ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

Thank you for correcting me,. where I was wrong about the 10,000.

I sincerely wish someone COULD correct me about the rest of my post.

That is three posts in a row, and as usual, you are evading the issue, an issue that you brought up in the first place.

How did it turn out with Sarah and the Terminator?

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1 hour ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

I sincerely wish someone COULD correct me about the rest of my post.

Ok, here goes:  there may be evidence that we don't know of. We don't know everything. So the correct thing to say would be YOU haven't seen any evidence. There are brothers or sisters who believe they have seen evidence of Jehovah's interference during Nazi occupation. Of course which of it was actually interference from Jehovah we just don't know.....In any case, Jehovah is and has always been concerned more for our spiritual safety, rather than physical safety. If our physical life is in jeopardy and we die, well he can make us live again. However if we are in jeopardy spiritually and it leads to our spiritual death....well...that's different story...

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1 hour ago, Anna said:

Ok, here goes:  there may be evidence that we don't know of. We don't know everything. So the correct thing to say would be YOU haven't seen any evidence. There are brothers or sisters who believe they have seen evidence of Jehovah's interference during Nazi occupation. Of course which of it was actually interference from Jehovah we just don't know.....In any case, Jehovah is and has always been concerned more for our spiritual safety, rather than physical safety. If our physical life is in jeopardy and we die, well he can make us live again. However if we are in jeopardy spiritually and it leads to our spiritual death....well...that's different story...

1 hour ago, TrueTomHarley said:

How did it turn out with Sarah and the Terminator?

Anna:

Everything you say is true, but that does not change the facts that there is no evidence you could present.

Coincidence is NOT the same as causality.  Not the same at all. 

Wishful thinking even less so.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

TTH:

For about $12 a month, you can have Netflix deliver to your door the entire Terminator Series, The Notebook, Hacksaw Ridge, and other answers .  These things are part of contemporary culture, like Star Trek, James Bond, Jack Reacher, Asimov, Heinlein, and  more.

During WWII, the common culture was represented by Baseball .... today it is general knowledge of movies.

You need to catch up, even if only to understand contemporary references and sub-references in context.

And as for me evading an issue multiple times ... that is a laugh (hoohahoohaaa). I was just bypassing your request for the outcome of a movie .... hardly "an issue".

 

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4 hours ago, JW Insider said:

But all of us must be ready to obey any instructions we may receive, whether we agree with them or not, because obeying these instructions will save our lives.  - ws13 11/15 p. 20 pars. 16-17 Seven Shepherds, Eight Dukes—What They Mean for Us Today *** [Simplified Watchtower]

This has been discussed before somewhere and you know what my feelings are on this and I've probably mentioned this already but this is a good post to mention it again; the argument seems to be that this reasoning would be following the pattern of the past, where God's people always had to follow some kind of instruction, whether splashing blood on the doorposts, or go somewhere etc. However, the very same people who present this argument say that other things are going to mean our deliverance. Actually just this last midweek meeting the workbook mentions we must prepare spiritually to be saved and we do that by

  • By developing TRUST IN JEHOVAH,

  • which gives us COURAGE,

  • which leads us to a POSITIVE ATTITUDE,

  • which coupled with BROTHERLY LOVE

  • enables us to ENCOURAGE fellow believers

  There is no mention of listening to any instructions. In any case the Bible might give examples of instructions in the past, but it never mentions anything like that in reference to "judgement day" /Armageddon. On the contrary, we are clearly told that those believing in Jesus will be saved. No verbal instructions which might seem illogical from a human standpoint there. Then there is the scripture in Matthew 24:40 " Then two men will be in the field; one will be taken along and the other abandoned. 41  Two women will be grinding at the hand mill; one will be taken along and the other abandoned" indicating that this can happen without any special instructions.

I wanted to check how the WT interpreted this scripture so I looked it up. There only seem to be three references to it (there might be newer ones that I don't know of) One is from WT 1975: "Weeks earlier Jesus had made a similar statement, prompting the disciples’ question, “Where, Lord?” He answered, “Where the body is, there also the eagles will be gathered together.” (

    Hello guest!
) The ones “taken along” are spiritually sharp-sighted, like eagles, who gather to the one whom they discern to be the Messiah, for the spiritual feast that Jehovah provides within his place of safety. They will gather together with God’s congregations on earth, under his true Messiah. Those “abandoned” will be those who do not keep spiritually awake and who consequently get swallowed up in a selfish way of life, as did the people in Noah’s day. Such are “abandoned” to destruction along with the world system of things in which they are involved".  Then God's kingdom of a thousand years book has a similar explanation also referring to Luke 17:37, and then the last reference was from WT 54 and in my mind seems the better explanation: "The word used here in the Greek for the expression “taken along” is also used when Joseph is said to have taken his wife home. It is also as when Jesus is said to have taken Peter, James and John along with him into the mount of transfiguration. Jesus used the word when he said: “I am coming again and will receive you home to myself, that where I am you also may be.” (
    Hello guest!
    Hello guest!
    Hello guest!
    Hello guest!
, NW) Thus, those “taken along” receive a favorable standing with the Lord and are brought into a way of salvation. This corresponds to Noah’s being taken into the ark the day of the flood and to Lot’s being taken by the hand and led out of the city and therefore precedes the execution of judgment."

In context, the question "Where Lord" in Luke 17:37 surely seems to be asking where will the man in the field, and the woman grinding at the mill be taken. And Jesus' answer surely indicates heaven, primarily, and salvation for those not of the heavenly class. But I still don't see any instructions.....because to be taken by the hand (as in Lot and Noah) and led somewhere, are not instructions

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57 minutes ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

Coincidence is NOT the same as causality.

Of course. I wasn't talking about coincidence though.

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1 hour ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

These things are part of contemporary culture, like Star Trek, James Bond, Jack Reacher, Asimov, Heinlein,...today it is general knowledge of moviesYou need to catch up, even if only to understand contemporary references and sub-references in context.

I have read more books than you, if only because while you are watching movies you cannot read books.

To the extent that Paul is correct when he counts 'contemporary culture' a lot of refuse, hopefully I can be forgiven for having missed a few fliks.

And I did see some of the Terminator series, like that one where the modern alien takes the cop's body and can reform itself from just a puddle of molten metal, and the 'cop' therefore becomes the bad guy, while Arnold as a biker is the good guy. That's why I thought he may have taken on the attendants, because he was certainly the kid's protector, and I think his mama's as well.

Nobody can do everything. I have to write about God and keep my promise before the moon and stars and JWI that I will be nicer to you, and even now i can feel the devil on my left shoulder making faces at the angel on my right.

Now, once and for all, what happened with Sarah and the Terminator? A man can only stand so much religion. What about Sarah? You brought her up.

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5 hours ago, JW Insider said:

(Psalm 146:3)  3 Do not put YOUR trust in nobles, Nor in the son of earthling man, to whom no salvation belongs [who cannot bring salvation, NWT Revised].

So what was your opinion on Br. Losh's opening talk on trust in the March 2018 broadcast?

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11 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

For about $12 a month, you can have Netflix deliver to your door the entire Terminator Series, The Notebook, Hacksaw Ridge, and other answers .  These things are part of contemporary culture, like Star Trek, James Bond, Jack Reacher, Asimov, Heinlein, and  more.

 

Still holding out, huh? This is becoming an obsession for me. I wish you had never brought it up. What happened to Sarah and the Terminator?

Look, I cannot see all those macho movies. I want to, desperately, and I do feel a responsibilty to illuminate my writing with the wisdom of contemporary culture, but my wife does not enjoy those movies, so if I am going to watch them, I must watch them myself. 

Now, I am already in hot water with my wife due to my time spent in writing, another solo sport. She accuses me sometimes of not turning around from my bad habits, like that of "not listening," which is exacerbated at such times. She misunderstands completely. The problem is that I turn around so instantaneously  that I cannot stop my rotation and I do another 180, but just try telling her that. 

We do jointly fulfill our obligation to keep abreast of contemporary culture in that we have fallen into the habit of one TV show per night, at present alternating between episodes of Monk and Psych. shows I never heard of all during their run but was alerted to afterwards by my 9-year-old nephew who has seen them all. I tried to tell the kid that he should watch the Terminator movies so as to pull his weight in society but his mother intervened. I like these two shows submitted by a nine-year-old. In last night's Psych, for example, Juliet was outraged that the circus weight guesser guessed her weight wrong and she obsessed about it during the remainder of the show. Now, I think it is very important not to obsess over things, but she says later on: "Shawn, I've got it!" and Shawn thinks she has uncovered a break in the case, but she goes on to explain that her particular pants are not 'slimming.' At shows end, when the circus guesser is revealed as a villain and is about to shoot the good guys, robbing them of any further contribution to contemporary culture, she decks him from behind with a single blow of unusual force, that she accentuates by saying "145 pounds, my ass!"

Prior to this, my wife and watched episodes of Chuck, suggested by my kids. Prior to that, some time ago, it was episodes of Office, also suggested by my kids. In fact, I used the Office show as a template to straighten out an atheist's love-life, taking a pesky detour from my work of writing about God, a detour that I didn't want to take but you know how some people just cannot turn down a privilege, in a post entitled 'Jim and Pam and Ray Goth' which I would love to link to but I don't dare because the Librarian will get mad, though she should'nt because I have disabled my comment section so as to leave no doubt that I do not wish to compete with her. 

So don't chide me for failings in keeping abreast of contemporary culture. I feel that I am pulling my weight, and I am keeping my marriage with the lovely Mrs Harley in good shape as well. Make no mistake, the woman is a looker. You do not want to mess with something so good. 

Now, for the umpteenth time, what happened to Sarah and the Terminator? Look, if James is reverting to orneryness, becoming stubborn just for the sake of becoming stubborn, one of you other participants tell me. This is not like confession, that only the priest can answer. Unless you do not want to embarrass yourself by admitting to the secret sin of not having watched it yourself.

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23 hours ago, Anna said:

Why do you say that?

I get that impression. In basement video and paradise video i noticed some same faces. I do not know what was intention of film maker, and do not know what their "artistic freedom of expression" want to tell to audience. But suppose that one of intention is that public and every person in public or every who will looking to video, connect some dots and fulfill some space that came while and after somebody watched the video. So, my perception said me that after brutal intrusion of soldiers happened something terrible. Or you think that nothing bad happened to this JW group?  Next video in serial was paradise video. And i saw few actors from  previous video. That gave me perspective how those persons died of violent death in old system and been resurrected in NW.

Just my freedom on how i am experienced the scenes of the film. 

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20 hours ago, Anna said:

For our present day Luke 21:27 is quite applicable: "And then they will see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. But as these things start to occur, stand up straight and lift up your heads, because your deliverance is getting near.” 

Please remind me WHO will see Jesus in the cloud? And HOW they will see Him in the cloud?

 

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20 hours ago, Anna said:

All spiritual battles must manifest themselves in a physical way eventually.

I can agree whit this. For example; my spiritual battle/s which intensified in the period between 2013 and 2015  have experienced their literal, physical, material finals in a way that I literally came out of the organization. 

Few connections with some of JW who are glad to see me and have some conversation and with few of you on this Forum while we are exchanging comments are the remnants of that past connection.

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I am looking forward to viewing those snippets you sent me, @James Thomas Rook Jr. re Sarah and the Terminator, but I have to wait until my wife leaves the house, maybe to go shopping. "Honey, we have no wine!" perhaps I will holler, and she will rush off to find some. 

Seriously, those really are way cool movies, and I have seen only one complete one and snippets of others. For reasons I don't recall, I think Sarah came to ally herself with the Terminator, who she at one time had valid reason to fear.

Though it was overall a terrible movie, parts of The Last Action Hero were very appealing, because Schwartzenegger was not afraid to poke (abundant) fun at himself. 

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2 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:
23 hours ago, Anna said:

For our present day Luke 21:27 is quite applicable: "And then they will see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. But as these things start to occur, stand up straight and lift up your heads, because your deliverance is getting near.” 

Please remind me WHO will see Jesus in the cloud? And HOW they will see Him in the cloud?

I quoted this scripture because that was clearly the application of it in the video. I quoted it because another poster asked what scripture the scene was based on. You saw Jesus coming in the clouds, and aiming his arrow at the enemies. Of course this was a "depiction" as in seeing with the eyes of faith, as the song says "give me eyes of faith and help me always see, there are more with us than against us". They, the faithful, "saw" Jesus and his vast army, more of them than those who were on the ground.  So although the people in the video were literally seeing Jesus, it won't be literal in reality, because although Jesus is mighty, he cannot be in several places at the same time. So it was their eyes of faith that saw their deliverance coming.  I hope it answers your question.

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3 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Just my freedom on how i am experienced the scenes of the film. 

Yes, of course, but you seemed certain. In any case, I think your question was related to wondering why some didn't survive Armageddon and others did. Actually to be precise, the scenes are showing the great tribulation which precedes Armageddon. If anyone dies at Armageddon it's because they have been executed by Jesus. But there is possibility that some faithful Christians may die during the great tribulation at the hands of God's enemies.

The end of the basement video was inconclusive on purpose I guess. Some friends suggested that the soldiers didn't "see" the brothers. Others thought that an angel of Jehovah stepped in. In any case, the depiction of paradise showed other characters from preceding videos (which also appeared in the 2018 video), so I don't think seeing those who were in the basement necessarily meant they had died and were resurrected, it could have meant they survived....

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5 minutes ago, JW Insider said:
18 hours ago, Anna said:

So what was your opinion on Br. Losh's opening talk on trust in the March 2018 broadcast?

My opinion? I believe that Proverbs 14:15 is an excellent scripture. ?

Good answer! Typically JW Insider :)

 

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1 hour ago, Anna said:

Good answer! Typically JW Insider :)

In case that sounded too flippant, I wanted to add that I have full confidence in the insight and guidance that the slave displayed when Losch put that scripture (Proverbs 14:15) in the center of his speech.

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On 8/26/2018 at 3:34 PM, Anna said:

It was based on Biblical experiences of God's people in the past such as Joshua, Hezekiah and others where God defeated enemies on their behalf.

For our present day Luke 21:27 is quite applicable: "And then they will see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. But as these things start to occur, stand up straight and lift up your heads, because your deliverance is getting near.” 

In Jesus’ day, his enemies manifested themselves as the Scribes and Pharisees; leaders of his own people.  They battled against Jesus’ words of truth and set out to kill him.   Spiritually, they had as their Father, Satan.

In our day, the battle is fought against a composite false prophet, and a Beast/organization, that the false prophet supports. (Revelation chapter 13) The false prophet “breathes” spirit into the image of the Beast.  They are also, Gog and Magog as both have the same plan in mind; to come against the “saints” and companions with deceit.  Rev 20:7-9

Where are the “saints” and their companions?  The saints are the anointed ones.  You should be able to perceive how the symbolic characters of Revelation manifest themselves.  And as what happened in Jesus' day, those who stand for truth are  "killed", but symbolically as Revelation 13:15-17 expresses.  John 16:2; Luke 12:11,12

Those that surround the “saints” in Revelation don’t carry rifles or wear masks.  How would that play out as a deceptive ploy?  Obviously, the people in the field in the video were well aware the enemy was coming, which is not how the Bible tells it.  Rev 16:13-16  As has always happened with God’s people, the majority don’t heed the warnings.    Satan uses deceit, just as he did with Eve.  Not many wake up to this fact. Rev 6:15-17; 8:10,11  Only remnants of God’s people survived destruction that came upon them in the past, it is the same during the end times.  Amos 7:1-9

A movie about the life of Joshua is much different than Wt’s video on Armageddon.  Children’s movies are made on the lives of individuals in the Bible.   Wt’s version of Revelation is based on a physical battle, which if it were to occur, would be a Satanic diversion of the true spiritual battle that we are warned of throughout the Greek scriptures.  Obviously, Wt. doesn’t interpret Revelation consistently as the example I earlier stated, gives proof of.     So, who is it that is deceiving you and the rest of JWs?

 

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14 hours ago, Anna said:

Luke 21:27

25 “There will be signs in the sun, moon and stars. On the earth, nations will be in anguish and perplexity at the roaring and tossing of the sea. 26 People will faint from terror, apprehensive of what is coming on the world, for the heavenly bodies will be shaken. 27 At that time they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. 28 When these things begin to take place, stand up and lift up your heads, because your redemption is drawing near.”

14 hours ago, Anna said:

So although the people in the video were literally seeing Jesus, it won't be literal in reality, because although Jesus is mighty, he cannot be in several places at the same time. So it was their eyes of faith that saw their deliverance coming.  I hope it answers your question.

From verses in Luke, those who will see Jesus in the clouds are named by noun "people". And people that are described in Luke are people who "will faint from terror, apprehensive of what is coming on the world". Well this is something different then you explained and applied this on symbolic sight of people who have faith in deliverance (as JW group in video showed faith). I think that this two can not be in harmony. Maybe you would like to find some other verses for video or find some other explanation on Luke 21:27.  

Other problem is what sort of "sight" (see) we can talk about - literally, allegorical  or some other intellectual perception and understanding on circumstances in the World. Verse said that people will "see" Him. Because "signs" of all kind ,about Luke was talking, are visible in all accepts of human perception, we can say how "signs" are literal, material, emotional, in connection with body and soul of all people and by that visible, people can "see" it/that. In that way Luke are not spoke in allegorical way. In that way context of Luke chapter 21 are very literal.   

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14 hours ago, Anna said:

Yes, of course, but you seemed certain. In any case, I think your question was related to wondering why some didn't survive Armageddon and others did. Actually to be precise, the scenes are showing the great tribulation which precedes Armageddon. If anyone dies at Armageddon it's because they have been executed by Jesus. But there is possibility that some faithful Christians may die during the great tribulation at the hands of God's enemies.

The end of the basement video was inconclusive on purpose I guess. Some friends suggested that the soldiers didn't "see" the brothers. Others thought that an angel of Jehovah stepped in. In any case, the depiction of paradise showed other characters from preceding videos (which also appeared in the 2018 video), so I don't think seeing those who were in the basement necessarily meant they had died and were resurrected, it could have meant they survived....

yes Anna, as i said all is about "artistic freedom of expression" and about "perceive/observation/sense of spectator" :))

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7 hours ago, Witness said:

Wt’s version of Revelation is based on a physical battle, which if it were to occur, would be a Satanic diversion of the true spiritual battle that we are warned of throughout the Greek scriptures.

interesting thought!

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As much as I disagree with almost everything @Srecko Sostar says, and admittedly do not usually read all of his comments end-to-end, I will concede that he has markedly improved his presence. I once wrote that he "deliberatedly chooses to represent himself on this forum as a moron," due to his incessant: "hehehe )))))))))"

He doesn't do that anymore. English is obviously not his primary language, yet he has succeeded in employing it with more power.

None of this is personal. It is a fight over ideas, and only to a lesser extent over those who embrace them.

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@TrueTomHarley He, Mr. Sostar (not to be confused with the Japanese character by a similar name) is heavily misguided to the point he will use vague and or his own opinions and interpretations to make a point, some of which he has no proof of and or valid information, and at times even the Bible itself defeats his own words, and to this day his December 2017 claim will forever be immortalized on this forum prior to him sweeping his claims under the rug or him trying to use a Registry and Census as proof of owning a business, the irony here it is nothing to do with information from sources that is murky, the information he posed was of his own design. Other than that he reminds me of the Cheshire Cat from Alice in Wonderland, but far more cryptic, flawed and giggles spontaneously. One thing for certain, when proven wrong, the giggles stop in a following response, therefore, he is running on E when it comes to giggles at that point.

That being said, it is the time of year again, and we know how these things are. If I am not mistaken this group has reached a high number before for these assemblies, this includes all languages, for even their other services they hit the 20,175,477 mark.

The only concern is Gangstalking being a possibility, who target people of race, sex, nationality, color, religion, faith, background or even perhaps the state they live in, or perhaps the color of their eyes even or the way they dress/groom, etc. so it would not be a surprise if such ones somehow enter into or end up near these assemblies this faith group, so vigilance is key in such situations as well as awareness.

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16 minutes ago, Space Merchant said:

@TrueTomHarley He, Mr. Sostar (not to be confused with the Japanese character by a similar name) is heavily misguided to the point he will use vague and or his own opinions and interpretations to make a point, some of which he has no proof of and or valid information, and at times even the Bible itself defeats his own words, and to this day his December 2017 claim will forever be immortalized on this forum prior to him sweeping his claims under the rug or him trying to use a Registry and Census as proof of owning a business, the irony here it is nothing to do with information from sources that is murky, the information he posed was of his own design. Other than that he reminds me of the Cheshire Cat from Alice in Wonderland, but far more cryptic, flawed and giggles spontaneously. One thing for certain, when proven wrong, the giggles stop in a following response, therefore, he is running on E when it comes to giggles at that point.

That being said, it is the time of year again, and we know how these things are. If I am not mistaken this group has reached a high number before for these assemblies, this includes all languages, for even their other services they hit the 20,175,477 mark.

The only concern is Gangstalking being a possibility, who target people of race, sex, nationality, color, religion, faith, background or even perhaps the state they live in, or perhaps the color of their eyes even or the way they dress/groom, etc. so it would not be a surprise if such ones somehow enter into or end up near these assemblies this faith group, so vigilance is key in such situations as well as awareness.

Thank you for this. I am somewhat protected by my opening motto, which I think should be the motto of every brother who uses the internet: "Everyone online is a liar."

Of course, they are not. But if you open with that assumption, and never entirely discard it for anyone you do not know personally, you are golden.

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1 hour ago, TrueTomHarley said:

Of course, they are not. But if you open with that assumption, and never entirely discard it for anyone you do not know personally, you are golden.

Unfortunately, that's pretty much one of three opening assumptions that I keep in mind too, even outside the Internet, even when I know someone personally, too. That's why I'm also doubtful of claims from anyone that someone's claims had to be swept under the rug, as it were.

2 hours ago, Space Merchant said:

and to this day his December 2017 claim will forever be immortalized on this forum prior to him sweeping his claims under the rug or him trying to use a Registry and Census as proof of owning a business, the irony here it is nothing to do with information from sources that is murky, the information he posed was of his own design.

So, @Space Merchant, what was that about? Can you point me to the post you are talking about?

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26 minutes ago, JW Insider said:

Unfortunately, that's pretty much one of three opening assumptions that I keep in mind too, even outside the Internet, even when I know someone personally, too. That's why I'm also doubtful of claims from anyone that someone's claims had to be swept under the rug, as it were.

As they say, there really are only two decent people in the world - me and you. And sometimes I have my doubts about you.

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49 minutes ago, JW Insider said:
2 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

Of course, they are not. But if you open with that assumption, and never entirely discard it for anyone you do not know personally, you are golden.

Unfortunately, that's pretty much one of three opening assumptions that I keep in mind too,

Hmmmm....I personally think TTH, JTR, Strecko, Space Merchant, and even Witness are genuine in what they say. Includes you of course.

Does that make me naive?

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7 minutes ago, Anna said:

Does that make me naive?

Not, of course, if you came to that conclusion after multiple interactions among several different types of personalities under several different types of circumstances.

We are naive if we jump to such conclusions prior to seeing good evidence about someone, or at least the personalit(ies) they represent. On social media, people are apt to represent only specific sides of their personality, or specific (or special) aspects of their life and lifestyle. It's very difficult to get a well-rounded view of a person on such a limited basis, no matter how much they write.

That said, I agree that we can all get a good sense of the personality of all the people you mentioned, among many others (yourself included). But I was rather surprised to see that picture of you with the King of Siam when I looked you up on the Internet. 

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not know personally

even when I know someone personally

everyone online is a liar

open with that assumption

sometimes I have my doubts about you

.... or similar quotes, no matter who said it, it is in general use, and not originated by Mr TTH.

Yes, we are living in such atmosphere of human interactions where  suspicion, mistrust, and the possibility of being deceived is the reality of every society on Earth. This is/was present in every particle of time to this day.  

What do you think? Did Jesus  have similar/same thoughts and feelings about 12, and even Judas till the his final betrayal, in that short period of "privately knowing each other"?  And what Jesus decided to make it, to do about it? What are His (public or private or tacit) comments about them? Bible is very, very short about that. Wonder why? Perhaps He was so above  of commenting other this way? Oh, how i I want to be like him! But always miss the goal, intent. Some good thoughts from books of E.M Remarque comes to my mind now.  

It doesn't matter what name some of us put in such context. 

But to continue to be "moron" for some of my readers, this time i will put my signature on letter (as Paul has his) 

hehehe:))))) 

 

2 Thessalonians 3:17 New International Version (NIV)

17 I, Paul, write this greeting in my own hand, which is the distinguishing mark in all my letters. This is how I write.

 

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27 minutes ago, Srecko Sostar said:

not know personally

even when I know someone personally

everyone online is a liar

open with that assumption

sometimes I have my doubts about you

.... or similar quotes, no matter who said it, it is in general use, and not originated by Mr TTH.

These are ordinary enough expressions that it is hardly to be expected that they are original. Still, the only one not (to me) when I posted it was: sometimes I have my doubts about you.

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4 hours ago, Space Merchant said:

The only concern is Gangstalking being a possibility, who target people of race, sex, nationality, color, religion, faith,...so it would not be a surprise if such ones somehow enter into or end up near these assemblies this faith group, so vigilance is key in such situations as well as awareness.

The enemies of Jehovah’s Witnesses have succeeded in doing what they could never have done alone, putting the Cause before the world. Russia persecution triggers international sympathy. Shunning and child abuse cover-up allegations trigger international frowning. All three are diluted by the fact that there are endless atrocities today to compete for people’s limited attention.

Cover-up allegations and shunning complaints are bad. Invariably they are exaggerated, such as people are wont to do, but they are seldom manufactured. Countering the bad press will be the good things that Jehovah’s Witnesses have to offer, never mentioned by opposers.

A recent development of the Witness organization is self-guided, online Bible study lessons at their website, addressing such age-old questions as ‘Why does God permit suffering?’ ‘What happens when we die?’ and ‘Is there realistic hope for the future?’ Is it only opponents that can use the web? People want such answers. Someone says (pityingly) in a video that Witnesses ‘crave certainty.’ Isn’t that a big ‘Duh’? Anyone here enjoy playing Russian Roulette with their finances or health? The more certainty we can lay hold of the better.

Bible answers are Jehovah’s Witnesses’ strong suit. Christians are directed in the Bible to stay separate from the greater world, as they offer it a helping hand. Anything with an upside will have a downside. The downside zeroed in on exclusively in some venues is real, but it does not negate the upside. Therefore it depends upon where is your focus. ‘Bible education’ is the overall goal of the Witness organization, ‘preaching the good news,’ As the online study sessions demonstrate, with only some exaggeration, if push comes to shove, the essential components of the Witnesses’ work can be run out a server in someone’s dorm room.

Meanwhile, going atheist holds some attraction, mostly escaping anyone who would tell you what to do, as though one does not simply put themselves under the ‘control’ of other deep-pocketed parties telling you what to do, be it Trump, Soros, the Russians, Big Defense, Big Pharma, pro or anti climate change with the enormous economic and lifestyle consequences both bring. Atheism will appeal to some, but never all. The yeartext presumably atheists agree upon is: “Sh*t happens. Get used to it. Maybe we can elect the right politicians to fix it.” How’s that project going, anyway?

No, that yeartext will just not cut it for everyone. Better to run something like "Be Courageous"

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2 hours ago, JW Insider said:

But I was rather surprised to see that picture of you with the King of Siam when I looked you up on the Internet. 

I won't say what I found when I looked you up

The truth is some on here know me better than others and vice versa, right @TrueTomHarley ? Hehee heee :))))

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@JW Insider It was regarding his Glasgow comment from a while back of which he put forth before, only after doing some research I see the errors and made the response, even not yielding upon assumption. He quickly deleted both comments from Dec. 2017 and Jul. 2018, in the same thread he used a registry and or census via link to make proof of an owned business, location being Australia if I remember correctly, when actually seeing the link itself we do not see any proof of an owned business or corporation, just a listed non-profit and nothing more, granted such websites that have a registry of this kind have a list of institutions and other things. Not sure but you had a bit of a presence on this thread too from a while back. The deleted item linked was done immediately on Sostar's part when the research have been made, for if it was not for the research my response would have been different. As for the video that came from the now deleted 2017 post by him, it can still be found on YouTube of which it paints the faith as being part of the world and or sponsoring a sporting event or banking on it for that matter, when in reality, they simply rented out the Hydro venue weeks after the sporting event.

Some of us may be quick to assume things and or say something and later do the research if need be, but it was and never is the case with this man, as to wherever and anywhere he is seen.

@TrueTomHarley The thing is we have a big enemy, an enemy people are not paying attention to, and it is only drawing in more converts, all one can do is avoid such, be vigilant and be aware, and be very very careful. There are some things I have to further do research on to find more information, some of which even overwrites what I already know, but the more you go deeper into these things, the more you want to seek. Another problem for me, as do some, most sources I rely on have gotten axe'd since the whole Alex Jones thing and it is not that easy as it use to be to seek out clear information as of late.

That being said, I had been recommend a small source of which I am getting use to for some days now regarding things in the EU, especially Russia.

Other than that, after what went down for my people, I, as do others, tend to be a bit paranoid at times.

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On 8/29/2018 at 6:41 PM, JW Insider said:

what was that about?

  On 7/18/2018 at 8:33 PM, Space Merchant said:

Can you prove it instead of making claim? Literally we are part of the world, but when it comes to the world, but Spiritually, should you accept, we are not part of the world at all.

Mr JW  Insider this down is my comment in full version as respond to Space Merchant. Judge by yourself what is it. All of us as private or legal persons/entities have NUMBER. And that is what i try to show  to SM. Who gave us number? For what purpose? For what sort of work?

About Glasgow video. Yes that was my mistake. I was relied to much on those who put that video, not in full length. Second problem is my English and to not listen more carefully. Mea culpa with smile! :)) Would somebody stoned me because it? People on responsible positions in WT making many and much more worst  errors on global level for at least 8 000 000 people. How many looked my deleted post? And with what response, with what consequences for their life? Thanks for reading this! 

 

So you are JW who spiritually is not part of this world? That is nice.

I will provide links from Australian government site about Australian Branch. Only to illustrate, the same is around the world. Watchtower have Identity number and in this case it is Charity ABN 42002861225 (ABN is Australian Business Number), and they have additional business name - "Watchtower Travel".  Travel Company? :)))))

 

    Hello guest!

    Hello guest!

    Hello guest!

 

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7 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Mr JW  Insider this down is my comment in full version as respond to Space Merchant. Judge by yourself what is it. All of us as private or legal persons/entities have NUMBER. And that is what i try to show  to SM. Who gave us number? For what purpose? For what sort of work?

As in who gave us the number, the website of which you listed states it very clearly, the links for your website states the following (I'll link you the glossary on the final part):

Quote

Business name(s)

The national business names registration service has replaced state and territory services, meaning you only need to register your business name once with a single national register.

The new service commenced on 28 May 2012 and is managed and administered by the Australian Securities & Investments Commission (ASIC).

If your business does not operate under your own entity name (e.g. GLM Pty Limited or Jane Smith), you will need a registered business name.

To apply for a registered business name you will need to have (or be in the process of applying for) an Australian business number (ABN). This is to assist with the identification of the entity behind a business name.

If you have registered a new business name with ASIC after 28 May 2012, ASIC will automatically update the ABR and ABN Lookup with this information.

To register for, update or cancel a business name, you will need to go to the 

    Hello guest!
.

 

7 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

About Glasgow video. Yes that was my mistake. I was relied to much on those who put that video, not in full length. Second problem is my English and to not listen more carefully. Mea culpa with smile! :)) Would somebody stoned me because it?

You didn't rely on the video because the video in question even tells you of who will come to Glasgow and the venues of which they will reside in, the video's title, of which you relied on states the following:

The December 2017 (December 9, 2017) comment made by you was of your own design, not of anyone else, for their concern is being part of the world or not, you took it a step further by stating the following: JWorg attracted thousands of people and millions of pounds to Scotland on XX Commonwealth Games, Glasgow 2014.

When this thread existed, it only pointed back to one source when goggle searched: Srecko Sostar.

You also went on to say the following: 

video reveal JWorg in sport and business events, Glasgow 2014. OR UK TV news  REPORTERS WERE LIE? Among some Scottish Products :))) is JWorg. How many JW rank and files surfed on you-tube, in 2014 and after, to find out what was been actual in 2014, and be in time with activities of their religion? ~ Sostar

If anyone looks at that video, they themselves can clearly see this was not the case, not even outlandish sources would make that remark either and this was pointed out by you and only you when the video gave a clue of something entirely different. Mind you, as I said before, everyone else' concern was those being part of the world or not, hence why some of the comments were deleted by the poster, but no one made claim to what you have stated, not even part of it alludes to such of what you stated.

The other thread you deleted, in connection to this in discussion, you even stated that the JWs were running a business this way, this was prior to when you deleted everything as of July 18th, 2018.

Indeed this was a mistake, but what was added into the mix was of your design, no one else, be it members of the faith, disgruntled ones, and or other.

I mean everyone makes error, even me, but going this far is silly.

7 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

?People on responsible positions in WT making many and much more worst  errors on global level for at least 8 000 000 people. How many looked my deleted post? And with what response, with what consequences for their life? Thanks for reading this! 

You'd be surprised when your information was passed on. Let's just say an Arab had a few words to say on this matter, and people do read into things, and also tend to connect it with something and or someone.

Everyone is aware, regardless of their faith and or background, that the venue was of used 2 weeks after the sporting event, I mean, the Hydro SSE is quite the spectacular venue, who could miss that when it is the talk of the ton to some?

Everyone makes errors, even JWs, for a I told you before, we are all imperfect and it is the price of which we pay, for there is good and there is bad, something of which you took issue with before also.

7 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

So you are JW who spiritually is not part of this world? That is nice.

I will provide links from Australian government site about Australian Branch. Only to illustrate, the same is around the world. Watchtower have Identity number and in this case it is Charity ABN 42002861225 (ABN is Australian Business Number), and they have additional business name - "Watchtower Travel".  Travel Company? :)))))

 

    Hello guest!

    Hello guest!

    Hello guest!

Here is the Link of which I had mentioned, therefore, understanding is of importance: 

    Hello guest!

 

If the Awesome Church is registered as a Business Name/Number, it does not make them a legitimate business (and lord and behold, it can be looked up and found, even though I do not take kindly to Trinitarians, their ABN can be found and is in connection with a legitimate source), just another religious institution, the same case can be made of any of whom is of religious position and or non-profit.

No one is asking to stone you, they are merely asking you to read into things, for yes we do make errors, but to continue to make error upon error upon error and using said error only shows you, be it corrected or not, do not take the time to read into things. I myself tend to jump to conclusion on things, mainly when someone says something that does not bode well with me or something else, but at least, later on I try to learn something. You must do the same also otherwise one can accept what Gone Away have stated of your words, flawed.

That being said, that is all that will be said of you and the other things speak for itself, like you having yet to show me the truth of Chloe elsewhere. But will leave it at that because  because you expect so-and-so to save you for a second time, it won't happen here, nor ever again, hence why I am more aware of how you tend to do things.

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To both @Srecko Sostar and @Space Merchant

Thanks for the clarification, both of you, and I didn't mean to get you to rehash this same conversation. I remember this particular one, although I didn't take so much of an interest in it because it seemed that Srecko Sostar had made some gullibility mistakes and Space Merchant had correctly pointed that out. I thought that might be the thread you were speaking about. But when you, Space Merchant, had worded what you said about a certain one of his December 2017 claims being forever immortalized, I thought I had missed a followup thread or some of the posts from that thread that had perhaps been deleted, as you said. I was interested because you made it sound as if it were much more sinister of a problem than I had recalled. I remember the excellent research you put into that rebuttal for both Witness and Srecko. But I understand where you are coming from, and I understand that Srecko has learned something from you. I had never looked into some of the information you provided there, Space Merchant, and I appreciated it, too. I personally had looked at "Six Screens of the Watchtower" a couple times, a couple years ago, and thought it was one of the worst of the anti-JW sites for its lack of accuracy. What a waste of time.

Just an aside, but when a person sees he has made a mistake, no longer believes fully in a specific point he has made, and he or she removes the mistaken, confusing post for that reason, I think this can be the right course of action.

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@JW Insider No worries and thanks. I said what I said because I know if I had never saved that information, not knowing he will delete his current and a year old post on Glasgow, he would say something entirely different, for I had only saved it to make note of what to research on, only to find out Sostar deleted both post at the same time.

But this is common on some forums, for someone will say something, then deleted it afterwards when people see it, and when it is brought up again, the original poster will speak negatively and act as if his own words do not belong to him, but when one have a snippet of what is deleted and or in full, the tables turn quickly and what is said remains on whatever forum in question for as long as the forum exist, which is the case here. So if anyone, even guests, who want to see the whole Glasgow thing, they see it there, should anyone opposite to them take what Sostar had said with seriousness, the actual information is there that says otherwise.

But yes, everyone makes mistaken, even me, for I tend to dwell on things with minor paranoia, other times, when dealing with oneness and Trinity believers I tend to get irritated and often go overboard only to correct myself after, mainly when I do not have my research notes with me, when I forget something that becomes an issue. But in Sostar's case, he is just a different case entirety.

But yes, some people learn things, some people have a hard time learning, while others do not learn at all.

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    • By Jack Ryan
      I am starting to get requests for these items posted previously. Enjoy!
       
    • By Bible Speaks
      Many brothers have written to us asking if it is an error or it was intentional that in the program of the REGIONAL ASSEMBLY 2018, the last Sunday farewell song and prayer, their number did not appear.
      We can confirm, because it is already public domain in the US, that a new song will be released WORLDWIDE a new song that day and at that time, right at the end.
      Those of us who have heard it have been electrified and in due course we will share it privately with the interested parties, ALWAYS THE ASSEMBLIES HAVE STARTED in a few days.
      The lyrics of the song are just what is needed TODAY.
      Translated Google 

    • By T.B. (Twyla)
      Here is a notebook for the 2018 “BE COURAGEOUS”! Regional Convention that I did.  TB
      2018 “BE COURAGEOUS”! Regional Convention notebook.pdf
    • By Jack Ryan
      The video starts in a board room meeting where a group of men are brainstorming experiences which they can share – and one of the pinpoints “Sally”. ?
      The clip then cuts to a young woman walking around what appears to be a market.
      She seeÂ’s women wearing rainbow bracelets, with rainbow posters showing two stick-figure women holding hands.
      When she goes to the till she’s asked if she would like to “make a donation to the marathon”, to which Sally says “no, thank you”.
      She then walks to a separate store and purchases a blanket.
      While waiting she sees a number of women wearing the bracelet.
      The woman who serves her asks Sally if she would like her rainbow bracelet in the bag or if she would like to wear it now.
      “No thank you,” Sally repeats again.
      “What’s wrong honey?” A third woman then questions her. “You got something against them?” 
      “Well no I don’t have anything against them personally,” she begins to reply, but she is then cut off.
      “So what’s the problem?”
      “I respect that they have a right to choose their lifestyle but as a Bible reader,” Sally begins to try and explain.
      “Excuse me I’m a bible reader too I go to church and our church is one of the biggest supporters for this marathon,” the woman replies.
       
      “Displaying courage now will help me display courage in the future,” a voice tells her.
      “Well I’m one of Jehovah’s Witnesses and we believe the bible teaches sex is for a man and a woman who are married,” Sally says.