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Why John Butler Left Jehovah's Witnesses

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32 minutes ago, Judith Sweeney said:

 Who cares what "john butler" does or says?  I cannot stand a cry baby.   All of his beesmerching of people who really Try to live according to the Bible and do the right thing, just insults the Faithful.  This especially insults the faithful who have been imprisoned and faced yes, even death to adhere to their faith.  

Judith, I think John is just plain loony in his single-minded obsession over one and only one thing. But I want also want to be fair to him. He was assigned the title of this thread. He did not choose it himself, and he has griped about it. It often happens that a thread starts to go in multiple directions, and then an administrator will break it up into separate threads, choosing what he thinks is the most appropriate title, oblivious to how the title subject himself may not like it. 

 It has happened to others. After slamming some ‘apostates’ I found myself heading a thread entitled ‘TrueTom vs the Apostates’. I protested. I don’t go out of my way to pick fights with these guys. I weigh in only like Elihu, when I spot three of them beating up on my friend Job.

My protest fell upon deaf ears. I was stuck with the role. So I warmed to the task and went after them with such ferocity that the same @admin that put me on the thread pulled me off it, slapped me with an A for abuse, and removed the entire thread, something I don’t think has happened before or since!

Should he criticize me for ‘attacking apostates’, I say, as did the Joker to Bstman: ‘I made you? YOU MADE ME!!!’ My, what a freak I have become.

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51 minutes ago, Judith Sweeney said:

 This especially insults the faithful who have been imprisoned and faced yes, even death to adhere to their faith.  

This is a very good point. Recently I read a report of women who had been kidnapped by ISIS. They had been exhibited in cages, driven about in the back of trucks, raped any number of times at will by multiple men , burned with cigarette butts when they resisted. THESE are the people John’s lying new friends try to equate Witnesses with? C’mon! Even @admin will cease to think this an unseamly squabble between co-religionists and recognize it for what it is: Decent people that may not be his cup of tea, though decent nonetheless, under attack from the despicable.

John does have one genuine circumstance that, in some measure, excuses his unhinged hatred. He has written, here or on another thread, of a truly horrific childhood involving sexual abuse. It had nothing to do with Jehovah’s Witnesses, a faith he discovered much later. But it appears to have seared him permanently. To that extent, I can sympathize with him.

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Never did I dream that I would one day tussle with @admin. And now I see that I have erred in attributing to him what in actuality originated with the Librarian (the old hen).

I don't revel in the role. I am very grateful to both for providing a forum in which I could hone my writing skills. I have tried to repay both. Even though I put my stuff on my blog, some of the hottest items I also reproduce here. Even should there be a link within to my blog, I entertain no comments there, thus going there may even help the folks here, since if you want to beef about anything, you must do it here. I simply want to keep all my writing under one roof. I don't care if it also appears elsewhere. I make no money on it, and even the third ebook I wrote, ‘Dear Mr. Putin- JehovahÂ’s Witnesses Write Russia, with chapter 12 entitled ‘Pedophiles,Â’ is free. Should anyone want to ‘pay me,Â’ buy the other two. To date, the overall project is a money-loser, but that is not my chief concern.

I will further repay by raising a new topic that I have not raised before: "Is it Time for Jehovah's Witnesses to Apologize?" It will appear here very soon.

[Edit: Okay, here it is: 

 ]

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8 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

..very funny but a little silly to ask such.  If John Butler in his trying to imitate Jesus sometimes compare own acts with that of Jesus, what is bad in that? Many christian people doing the same, even JW members doing the same on global scale

You must be confused Srecko. My opinion is in reference to someone stating their grievance as Dr. Ford did without proof. People want to be believed. Christ story was not just told but witnessed. That is the substance behind my comment. If it becomes confusing to you again, please fill free to ask.

What I have seen. Not everyone gets a fair shake when it comes to being offensive here. I will do my best to avoid that. That's why TTH comment was confusing, to say the least.

There is no need to get cynical and aggressive as some seem fit to do here. How people define religion in their personal life is to seek the approval of God, not man.

Each religion has a way of introducing people to that prospect. Whatever, personal grievances you think you have, as the owner said, move on. You do yourself a disservice to think, something can be solved in a discussion board.

There are no answers to serious questions that society itself has generated. This is where faith comes in. To subvert faith for personal reasons is meandering and unacceptable to god.

Even when it placed in a humorous way. Gods guidance doesn’t sustain the majority of arguments here if understood through scripture.

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2 hours ago, Paul Dedee said:

What I have seen. Not everyone gets a fair shake when it comes to being offensive here. I will do my best to avoid that. That's why TTH comment was confusing, to say the least.

 

I am not entirely sure of the meaning here, but it seems more and more likely that @admin had specific persons in mind when he blew his top at everyone, and that I was the one to sass him back, though I was the least of all targets. I do use humor a lot, sometimes to deflate those I think are whiners or windbags, (always on the other side of course, but this almost need not be said; none of my people would ever carry on this way) and humor often does not translate well. 

Ah well, if it is, it is. I’m not going to apologize to him again; I already did. I don’t necessarily read all comments closely, or even at all, before commenting. You cannot deduce everything through forensic methods. I miss some things. The threads drive me nuts, too, some of it. Admin and I may have more in common than he thinks.

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6 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

A little ‘gem’ from this week’s Bible reading:

John 11:21 “Martha then said to Jesus: “Lord, if you had been here, my brother would not have died. Yet even now I know that whatever you ask God for, God will give you.”

Jesus had had two days advance notice, yet he just sat there. (vs 6) Martha did not have to respond as she did. Could she not have ‘gone apostate’ and yelled: ‘What in the world is wrong with you?! You might as well have killed him yourself!’

Oh dear here you go comparing your Governing Body with Jesus Christ. So you think your GB can resurrect people from the dead do you ?

Martha knew exactly who Jesus was. That scripture proves that fact. 

Your GB say that they are important, exalting themselves, and we know what Luke 14 v 11 says about those that exalt themselves don't we ? 

It does however show how far off line you are when you compare the GB to Jesus. 

Jesus proved many times that he had his Father's approval. I doubt the GB of JW Org having such, not the way that are acting. 

just another thought, I pray to God through Jesus Christ, do you pray through your GB ? 

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5 hours ago, Judith Sweeney said:

 Who cares what "john butler" does or says?  I cannot stand a cry baby.   All of his beesmerching of people who really Try to live according to the Bible and do the right thing, just insults the Faithful.  This especially insults the faithful who have been imprisoned and faced yes, even death to adhere to their faith.  

You are entitled to your opinion and thank you for adding it. 

I suppose all the Victims of Child Abuse in the JW Org are cry babies to you also. 

If all JW's 'tried to live according to the bible' then there would not be over twenty years worth of CHILD ABUSE  within the Org. 

I see you are using the devil's tactics, working on emotions. 

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4 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

This is a very good point. Recently I read a report of women who had been kidnapped by ISIS. They had been exhibited in cages, driven about in the back of trucks, raped any number of times at will by multiple men , burned with cigarette butts when they resisted. THESE are the people John’s lying new friends try to equate Witnesses with? C’mon! Even @admin will cease to think this an unseamly squabble between co-religionists and recognize it for what it is: Decent people that may not be his cup of tea, though decent nonetheless, under attack from the despicable.

John does have one genuine circumstance that, in some measure, excuses his unhinged hatred. He has written, here or on another thread, of a truly horrific childhood involving sexual abuse. It had nothing to do with Jehovah’s Witnesses, a faith he discovered much later. But it appears to have seared him permanently. To that extent, I can sympathize with him.

Wow Tom I get a 'bashing' and almost a' praising' from you. Thanks for being my judge and jury, I presume God gave you that job did he ?

Lets see now. You say I'm plain loony. Then you say i have some lying new friends. Anything else about me that i don't know ? 

You did note however that i have reason for my strong feelings in one regard. And you also noted that i did not start this topic. Thankyou. 

"... in his single-minded obsession over one and only one thing". Are,here is where you are wrong. BUT we are not supposed to mix issues on a topic. And it would mean starting so many topics for each subject, I honestly don't have the time. 

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4 hours ago, admin said:

@JOHN BUTLER anytime you want me to lock and bury this topic feel free to ask. 

@The Librarian does sometimes create separate threads when he feels another has been hijacked. 

All is ok. Debate is good. Thankyou. 

The responses I get help me to evaluate myself and others. 

If however you think the topic has run its course and is getting stale, then close it if you wish. 

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3 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

Never did I dream that I would one day tussle with @admin. And now I see that I have erred in attributing to him what in actuality originated with the Librarian (the old hen).

I don't revel in the role. I am very grateful to both for providing a forum in which I could hone my writing skills. I have tried to repay both. Even though I put my stuff on my blog, some of the hottest items I also reproduce here. Even should there be a link within to my blog, I entertain no comments there, thus going there may even help the folks here, since if you want to beef about anything, you must do it here. I simply want to keep all my writing under one roof. I don't care if it also appears elsewhere. I make no money on it, and even the third ebook I wrote, ‘Dear Mr. Putin- JehovahÂ’s Witnesses Write Russia, with chapter 12 entitled ‘Pedophiles,Â’ is free. Should anyone want to ‘pay me,Â’ buy the other two. To date, the overall project is a money-loser, but that is not my chief concern.

I will further repay by raising a new topic that I have not raised before: "Is it Time for Jehovah's Witnesses to Apologize?" It will appear here very soon.

[Edit: Okay, here it is: 

 ]

I remember a song by a group name Plan B. 

It was entitled "Too late to Apologize"  Quite fitting i think. 

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 I know "attention seeking" when I see it.     I do not care that you "left"...>>>keep going.  Jesus Christ did not shove the message on anyone.   Geesh, how can you get any work done when you are on here all the time?   You are just trying to spread Venom.   Perhaps your seditionist attitude is Not the one that God Almighty Jehovah WANTS in His New System.  Hmmm?  

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41 minutes ago, JOHN BUTLER said:
hours ago, Judith Sweeney said:

 Who cares what "john butler" does or says?  I cannot stand a cry baby.

It is possible to understand your position. You are person who cannot stand some situations and emotions in other people life. Perhaps you think how they alone are "guilty" for theirs problems. It can be and it does not have to be so.  

Please explain how do you "survive" Mr. Lett and some other JWTV presenter who "crying" for money on behalf of WT Corporation? :)))

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 All dedicated servants of God know that Jehovah's Eyes are Everywhere.  The GB is just doing the best they can.  Really...they are Not immune to the ills of this wicked system, especially as it is escalating in badness.   Why not Pray for mere humans who are TRYING to determine Gods will.   

     Money is needed.   Money talks...other "stuff...er, "walks".    

       As this earth is growing more and more angry as the Mother is injured.  Natural Disasters are pandemic, and the Governing Body, as is fashioned after the First Century Model....is keeping ME....(just speaking for myself now)  in good viewing, and dramas and encouragement and literature, and lights on at the meetings and ect.ect. and it takes Money to function at all in this society.   I do not mind forking over some dough.   It is Worth it~

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4 minutes ago, Judith Sweeney said:

 I know "attention seeking" when I see it.     I do not care that you "left"...>>>keep going.  Jesus Christ did not shove the message on anyone.   Geesh, how can you get any work done when you are on here all the time?   You are just trying to spread Venom.   Perhaps your seditionist attitude is Not the one that God Almighty Jehovah WANTS in His New System.  Hmmm?  

Oh dear Judith, throwing your rattles out of the pram .  As you should know i didn't start this topic. BUT I'm not going to run away from it. 

I should of course simply reply that i don't care what you think of feel. But hey that is not my nature. 

If you do not understand me fine, go and talk to other people that you find more agreeable.

To let this forum get you so uptight is such a shame. 

As for attention, I wish to draw attention, in a positive way,  to the Victims of Child Abuse and to the cause of that abuse in the JW Org. 

I wish to show up the GB for what they really are, the wicked slave class. 

And as for getting any work done.  My wife and i have been at a semi derelict mansion house (which i have the keys for)  most of the day dealing with an auctioneer that is to take the contents to auction for us. So I get plenty of work done. Another auction to lay out and lot up on Friday, Autojumble this time. Life is hectic Judith. This forum takes very little of my time. 

 

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14 minutes ago, Judith Sweeney said:

All dedicated servants of God know that Jehovah's Eyes are Everywhere. 

members of other religions have same or similar beliefs 

14 minutes ago, Judith Sweeney said:

Why not Pray for mere humans who are TRYING to determine Gods will.   

also Holy book said to pray for Secular kings and rulers who not trying

Well, it will be good  not to be "strict" to much about many things mentioned here :))  

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43 minutes ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

Lets see now. You say I'm plain loony. 

I did NOT say you are loony. (Or did I?) What I said was that you so closely resemble loony that I cannot tell the difference. See? I am willing to put the onus on myself.

Imagine. Here I propose what has never been proposed before, at least by me, making a magnificent concession, and the big baby just keeps saying hateful things about the Christian organization. 

 

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Tom said  "Judith, I think John is just plain loony in his single-minded obsession over one and only one thing. "

Am i just loony for this one issue :) ? 

 and the big baby just keeps saying hateful things about the Christian organization. ? Are you referring to me here Tom ? 

Since when has telling the truth been the same as 'saying hateful things' ? 

And the insult 'big baby' is so so Christian attitude isn't it ? 

Wake up and smell the coffee Tom, your JW Org is under deep scrutiny by God and by the people on this Earth. 

Remember God has very often used people of the world, to bring punishment on his own people. 

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2 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

I am not entirely sure of the meaning here, but it seems more and more likely that @admin had specific persons in mind when he blew his top at everyone, and that I was the one to sass him back, though I was the least of all targets.

My opinion is based on observation through time. It seems some posters and comments have been removed for no better reason than to decide who can or can’t post here, that’s all. My observation shouldn’t be offensive to anyone as a discussion board should have a platform to refute certain claims. But, I’m a newcomer here, so I will tread as though I’m walking on eggshells, as not to anger the owner.

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