Jump to content

Jack Ryan

Is it inappropriate for a Christian to participate in Black Friday?

Topic Summary

Created

Last Reply

Replies

Views

Jack Ryan -
Space Merchant -
24
570

Top Posters


Recommended Posts


I get your point.... this video I just saw on FB says something similar...

BUT what can a person do? Stop shopping altogether?

Maybe this is why Jesus said it would be easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.

This topic makes one reconsider MANY things:

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, The Librarian said:

This topic makes one reconsider MANY things:

I think that if we really understand the following point in the "Knowledge" book, true Christians need to treat EVERY DAY AS BLACK FRIDAY!!!

*** kl chap. 13 pp. 126-127 par. 17 Why Living a Godly Life Brings Happiness ***

  • Of course, godly parents do not await a special day to show their children love. A 13-year-old Christian girl remarked: “My family and I have lots of fun. . . . I’m very close to my parents, and when other kids ask why I don’t celebrate holidays, I tell them that I celebrate every day.” Said a Christian youth aged 17: “In our house, gift-giving is all year long.” Greater happiness results when gifts are given spontaneously.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Looks to me like JW's have anti -holidays, so it's just as bad.  I've known JW's that will not eat a roast dinner on 25th December because they are frightened it will look like a Christmas dinner.   

As for pushing for a special effort on a stupid day, well it seems like a way of actually celebrating that day to me. It's like saying they know that day is special to people. 

And the Christmas day door to door witnessing is not a good thing. It's intrusive and rude. It's not wanted by people outside the JW org.  I did it once just to prove that i wasn't scared to do it, but it does not show love to people, it's just being 'pushy' to the extreme. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
40 minutes ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

As for pushing for a special effort on a stupid day, well it seems like a way of actually celebrating that day to me. It's like saying they know that day is special to people. 

Spot on! Bingo! Good point. I've always felt the same way about treating one day as all others vs treating one day as more important than others.

  • (Romans 14:5) . . .One man judges one day as above another; another judges one day the same as all others;. . .
40 minutes ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

And the Christmas day door to door witnessing is not a good thing. It's intrusive and rude.

But not so much worse than the way Black Friday has already intruded on Thanksgiving dinners by starting it at 5:00pm on Thursday and going until 1AM, so that our local "Best Buy" didn't open up again until 8AM on Friday. (Which also reminds me that "Best Buy" was playing Christmas music for persons on hold as early as October 30th this year.)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
34 minutes ago, JW Insider said:

Spot on! Bingo! Good point. I've always felt the same way about treating one day as all others vs treating one day as more important than others.

  • (Romans 14:5) . . .One man judges one day as above another; another judges one day the same as all others;. . .

But not so much worse than the way Black Friday has already intruded on Thanksgiving dinners by starting it at 5:00pm on Thursday and going until 1AM, so that our local "Best Buy" didn't open up again until 8AM on Friday. (Which also reminds me that "Best Buy" was playing Christmas music for persons on hold as early as October 30th this year.)

Oh I'm so glad I'm an Englishman in England. Not proud to be English, just happy to have been born here and live here.  And living in the countryside Black Friday means nothing to me. My wife and i went to view an 'in house' auction yesterday, which we would do any day. It's so nice to have a simple life. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

the Christmas day door to door witnessing is not a good thing. It's intrusive and rude.

Probably in some of the more snooty or nationalistic areas of the UK that is quite right. In fact, many city Brits see it as a way of asserting national identity these days

. Image result for british christmas

Having been inner city most of my ministry time though, the multi-cultural mix makes for a whole different experience. Many don't see Christmas as particularly significant and it is just another day.

Ridley Road Market, a Dalston mainstay off Kingsland Road, now more famous for its trendy bars and clubs.Image result for stamford hill JewishGreen Lanes.jpg

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Outta Here said:

Probably in some of the more snooty or nationalistic areas of the UK that is quite right. In fact, many city Brits see it as a way of asserting national identity these days

. Image result for british christmas

Having been inner city most of my ministry time though, the multi-cultural mix makes for a whole different experience. Many don't see Christmas as particularly significant and it is just another day.

Ridley Road Market, a Dalston mainstay off Kingsland Road, now more famous for its trendy bars and clubs.

    Hello guest!
Green Lanes.jpg

 

I think you have it a bit wrong there. 

British people, the working class ones, have to work almost 24/7 so don't get much rest and don't see their families often. 

The Christmas break is great for many families, as they are not working so can gather together for a big family happy time. 

They don't want to be talking religion on the door, they want to be having fun with their family. Talking religion is a serious matter, not just a casual natter. But they don't want to be serious at that time they want some fun time.  If you cannot see that then you are not showing love and consideration. And you probably don't understand British people either. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
55 minutes ago, JW Insider said:

I hope you at least have a Thanksgiving celebration and a July 4th fireworks celebration!?!?!?

😉

No, I don't get involved with any traditions of men. :).  And now I'm not a JW anymore i feel great that I do not have to comply with any human ideas of what I should do. I have peace.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

British people, the working class ones,

 You are perfectly right. I know Christmas means a lot to them in these pc days.

Image result for london east end christmas

 

2 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

British people, the working class ones, have to work almost 24/7 so don't get much rest and don't see their families often

Hmm Yes

Image result for London christmas market

 

2 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

And you probably don't understand British people either. 

What? Like these British people??

 Image result for British Cypriots

Caribbean.jpgImage result for British Somalis

    Hello guest!
Indians.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Oh how silly you are. Anyone can grab photos off the internet and pretend that it means something. 

I was once fooled by what i thought was a 'live video' of a terrible massacre, only to find out later it was a re-enactment of how somebody 'thought' it happened.............     I can easily relate that to you. you think you know how British people feel and act. 

It's not 'Christmas' that means a lot, it's the christmas break. The time off work, the rest period. time to relax and have fun with family and friends. And the people want to be left in peace, not talk religion. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

14 Accept the one whose faith is weak, without quarreling over disputable matters. One person’s faith allows them to eat anything, but another, whose faith is weak, eats only vegetables. The one who eats everything must not treat with contempt the one who does not, and the one who does not eat everything must not judge the one who does, for God has accepted them. Who are you to judge someone else’s servant? To their own master, servants stand or fall. And they will stand, for the Lord is able to make them stand.

I personally have never and will never do a black Friday shopping spree. But I don't think it's become a day of worship. Satan wants the world to think that and many of them do. But if a Christian shops on black Friday for the glory of themselves or someone else instead of God, or goes crazy and gets mean and nasty, then that Christian will be accountable to God for their actions and heart condition. But shopping at a store on black Friday doesn't disqualify someone from the love of God or means their impending destruction at Armageddon. If that would be the case I would be in deep doodoo because I shopped on Friday. And I celebrated the 327th day thanking God for all I have with my beautiful girlfriend and her beautiful girls.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Matthew9969 said:

14 Accept the one whose faith is weak, without quarreling over disputable matters. One person’s faith allows them to eat anything, but another, whose faith is weak, eats only vegetables. The one who eats everything must not treat with contempt the one who does not, and the one who does not eat everything must not judge the one who does, for God has accepted them. Who are you to judge someone else’s servant? To their own master, servants stand or fall. And they will stand, for the Lord is able to make them stand.

I personally have never and will never do a black Friday shopping spree. But I don't think it's become a day of worship. Satan wants the world to think that and many of them do. But if a Christian shops on black Friday for the glory of themselves or someone else instead of God, or goes crazy and gets mean and nasty, then that Christian will be accountable to God for their actions and heart condition. But shopping at a store on black Friday doesn't disqualify someone from the love of God or means their impending destruction at Armageddon. If that would be the case I would be in deep doodoo because I shopped on Friday. And I celebrated the 327th day thanking God for all I have with my beautiful girlfriend and her beautiful girls.

Yep it t'ain't what ya does tis it ? Tis the reason why yer does it :) 

Sepptin' some folks worry cus they might be a stumblin' someone.  Tis always sommit to be worryin about. 

Mericans tis strange folks um be, en um ?  And um in lumbrin us British wiv all those 'traditions of men' from Merica. 

Finkin that Halloween started in Merica, and dis Black Friday stuff. What's next ? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Nicole

 

On 11/23/2018 at 3:06 PM, Jack Ryan said:

This is how TRUE Christian JW's celebrate Black Friday -

And what is the religious meaning of Black Friday? 

From where I come from that did not exist until a few years ago. Black Fridays or Black Weekends have spread to many countries where the only meaning is to go to stores to buy things at "lower prices" if you want to go. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

Anyone can grab photos off the internet and pretend that it means something.

Of course they can!

These pictures are all taken in the locality in which I did my ministry. Just to indicate there are many cultures in Britain, particularly inner city where most people are and where real experience is gained. 

7 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

It's not 'Christmas' that means a lot, it's the christmas break. The time off work, the rest period. time to relax and have fun with family and friends. And the people want to be left in peace, not talk religion. 

I'm sure you mean well, but this could be construed as an example of narrow minded inexperience in assuming one view is held by everyone else.

'Christmas' means a lot to some people; many do not have time off work; many have no family and few friends; many DO want to talk about all sorts of serious matters, including religion, anytime. (We are not looking for those who do not by the way.) 

PS. reply if you like but pardon my non-response here as I have gone off topic now.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, Matthew9969 said:

But if a Christian shops on black Friday for the glory of themselves or someone else instead of God, or goes crazy and gets mean and nasty...

It was definitely for the glory of God and not self when I elbowed the jerk trying to lay his fat hands on the wide-screen TV I wanted.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The Electronic Zombie Apocalypse has yet to subside. So far the storm has yet to be calmed.

Around this time it is rare for one of this crazies to buy food from the store or hear anything regarding God.

That being said, The Super Wal-Mart in my area was a cross between Saving Private Ryan and World War Z utter chaos. There were some people hopping over and jumping over cars.

 

So far what has gone by this week

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Similar Content

    • By Tianna Mercier
      I am hoping that Single and Available as a sub group doesn't mean you have to be that, to post in Socialize!!  I am traveling across the country with my husband and was hoping to find some friends from Lancaster, PA congregations that would like to go out in service and then Quilt shopping afterward. I will be in the area around Sunday 5/22 to Monday 5/23.  Let me know! Thanks!!
      Tianna Mercier
      gotomgo.org
      facebook.com/benefitforabike
    • Guest Nicole
      By Guest Nicole
      What should I gift a new born of Jehovah's Witnesses?
    • By Bible Speaks
      Giving Thanks? - Thanksgiving and Black Friday? - A Contradiction? ???
      Chuckle ???

    • By Jack Ryan
      Another view on the 'thanksgiving' threads being posted here today....
      Unthanksgiving Day
      The National Day of Mourning
      A Thanksgiving bonfire at dawn: celebrating Native American resistance on Alcatraz
    • Guest Nicole
      By Guest Nicole
      "Throughout the world harvest has always been the occasion for many queer customs which all have their origin in the animistic belief in the corn [grain]-spirit or corn [grain]-mother. This personification of the crops has left its impress upon the harvest customs of modern Europe. .... Throughout the world, as Sir J. G. Frazer shows, the semi-worship of the last sheaf is or has been the great feature of the harvest-home. Among harvest customs none is more interesting than harvest cries; the Devonshire reapers go through a ceremony which in its main features is a counterpart of pagan worship." - pp. 231-232, Encyclopedia Britannica, volume 11, 14th edition.

      Note what the publication Holidays Around the World, by Joseph Gaer says about Thanksgiving:

      "Thanksgiving for the annual harvest is one of the oldest holidays known to mankind ... 'The Romans celebrated their Thanksgiving early in October. The holiday was dedicated to the goddess of harvest, Ceres, and the holiday was called Cerelia. 'The Christians took over the Roman holiday and it became well established in England, where some of the Roman customs and rituals for this day were observed ... "

      "The Pilgrims, who in 1621 observed our initial Thanksgiving holiday, were not a people especially enthusiastic about the celebration of festivals. In fact these austere and religious settlers of America would have been dismayed had they known of the long and popular history of harvest festivals, of which their Thanksgiving was only the latest. .... The harvest festival, with its attendant rites, seems to have spread out from ... Egypt and Syria and Mesopotamia. The first or the last sheaf of wheat was offered to the `Great Mother' ... Astarte [equivalent to Ishtar and Eastre] was the Earth Mother of the ancient Semites; to the Phrygians she was Semele; under the name of Demeter she was worshiped by the Greeks at the famous Eleusinian Mysteries..." - pp. 271-272, Celebrations - The Complete Book of American Holidays, Robert J. Myers, Doubleday & Co., 1972

      God has always demanded that our worship to him, no matter how small, must be pure and untainted. God Himself said:

      "And God proceeded to speak all these words, saying...You must not have any other gods against my face. Because I Jehovah your God am a God exacting EXCLUSIVE DEVOTION." (Ex. 20:1-5)
    • By The Librarian
      Dear Librarian,
      Are Jehovah’s Witnesses allowed to celebrate Thanksgiving?
      - Julie, Boston, Massachusetts, USA
      ———

      See also:
       
    • Guest
      By Guest
      “Black Friday: because only in America people trample each other for sales exactly one day after being thankful for what they already have.”
       
    • By James Thomas Rook Jr.
      Today is November 18, 2017.
      In about five days or so many in the United States will celebrate a National Day of Thanksgiving, and many of Jehovah's Witnesses will not.
      WHY?
      Below is the complete text of U.S. President Abraham Lincoln's Thanksgiving day proclamation.
      Please read it carefully, and tell me ... What's wrong with THIS?
      ......................................................................................
       
      Washington, D.C.
      October 3, 1863
      By the President of the United States of America.
      A Proclamation.
      The year that is drawing towards its close, has been filled with the blessings of fruitful fields and healthful skies. To these bounties, which are so constantly enjoyed that we are prone to forget the source from which they come, others have been added, which are of so extraordinary a nature, that they cannot fail to penetrate and soften even the heart which is habitually insensible to the ever watchful providence of Almighty God. In the midst of a civil war of unequalled magnitude and severity, which has sometimes seemed to foreign States to invite and to provoke their aggression, peace has been preserved with all nations, order has been maintained, the laws have been respected and obeyed, and harmony has prevailed everywhere except in the theatre of military conflict; while that theatre has been greatly contracted by the advancing armies and navies of the Union. Needful diversions of wealth and of strength from the fields of peaceful industry to the national defence, have not arrested the plough, the shuttle or the ship; the axe has enlarged the borders of our settlements, and the mines, as well of iron and coal as of the precious metals, have yielded even more abundantly than heretofore. Population has steadily increased, notwithstanding the waste that has been made in the camp, the siege and the battle-field; and the country, rejoicing in the consciousness of augmented strength and vigor, is permitted to expect continuance of years with large increase of freedom. No human counsel hath devised nor hath any mortal hand worked out these great things. They are the gracious gifts of the Most High God, who, while dealing with us in anger for our sins, hath nevertheless remembered mercy. It has seemed to me fit and proper that they should be solemnly, reverently and gratefully acknowledged as with one heart and one voice by the whole American People. I do therefore invite my fellow citizens in every part of the United States, and also those who are at sea and those who are sojourning in foreign lands, to set apart and observe the last Thursday of November next, as a day of Thanksgiving and Praise to our beneficent Father who dwelleth in the Heavens. And I recommend to them that while offering up the ascriptions justly due to Him for such singular deliverances and blessings, they do also, with humble penitence for our national perverseness and disobedience, commend to His tender care all those who have become widows, orphans, mourners or sufferers in the lamentable civil strife in which we are unavoidably engaged, and fervently implore the interposition of the Almighty Hand to heal the wounds of the nation and to restore it as soon as may be consistent with the Divine purposes to the full enjoyment of peace, harmony, tranquillity and Union.
      In testimony whereof, I have hereunto set my hand and caused the Seal of the United States to be affixed.
      Done at the City of Washington, this Third day of October, in the year of our Lord one thousand eight hundred and sixty-three, and of the Independence of the United States the Eighty-eighth.
      By the President: Abraham Lincoln
      William H. Seward,
      Secretary of State
      .......................................................
      I cannot find anything wrong with this ... nothing at all.
      Do you see something that a sane, rational person should be seeing that I do NOT see?
      .
       
       
    • By Bible Speaks
      King Solomon and the Queen of Sheba - Amazed at His Wisdom. Knowledge and Wisdom! - A Gift from Jehovah! ~ 
      (Sol′o·mon) [from a root meaning “peace”]
      (1 Kings 10:1-25) . . .Now the queen of She′ba was hearing the report about Sol′o·mon in connection with the name of Jehovah. So she came to test him with perplexing questions. 2 Finally she arrived at Jerusalem with a very impressive train, camels carrying balsam oil and very much gold and precious stones; and she came on in to Sol′o·mon and began to speak to him all that happened to be close to her heart. 
      3 Sol′o·mon, in turn, went on to tell her all her matters. There proved to be no matter hidden from the king that he did not tell her. 4 When the queen of She′ba got to see all the wisdom of Sol′o·mon and the house that he had built, 5 and the food of his table and the sitting of his servants and the table service of his waiters and their attire and his drinks and his burnt sacrifices that he regularly offered up at the house of Jehovah, then there proved to be no more spirit in her. 6 So she said to the king: “True has the word proved to be that I heard in my own land about your matters and about your wisdom. 
      7 And I did not put faith in the words until I had come that my own eyes might see; and, look! I had not been told the half. You have surpassed in wisdom and prosperity the things heard to which I listened. 8 Happy are your men; happy are these servants of yours who are standing before you constantly, listening to your wisdom! 9 May Jehovah your God come to be blessed, who has taken delight in you by putting you upon the throne of Israel; because Jehovah loves Israel to time indefinite, so that he appointed you as king to render judicial decision and righteousness.” 10 Then she gave the king a hundred and twenty talents of gold and a very great deal of balsam oil and precious stones. There never came anymore the like of that balsam oil for quantity such as the queen of She′ba gave to King Sol′o·mon.
      11 And Hi′ram’s fleet of ships that carried gold from O′phir also brought from O′phir timbers of algum trees in very great amount and precious stones. 12 And the king proceeded to make out of the timbers of the algum trees supports for the house of Jehovah and for the house of the king, and also harps and stringed instruments for the singers. Timbers of algum trees like this have not come in nor have they been seen down to this day. 13 And King Sol′o·mon himself gave the queen of She′ba all her delight for which she asked, apart from what he gave her according to the openhandedness of King Sol′o·mon. After that she turned about and went to her own land, she together with her servants. 
      14 And the weight of the gold that came to Sol′o·mon in one year amounted up to six hundred and sixty-six talents of gold, 15 apart from the men of travel and the profit from the traders and all the kings of the Arabs and the governors of the land. 16 And King Sol′o·mon went on to make two hundred large shields of alloyed gold (six hundred [shekels] of gold he proceeded to lay upon each large shield), 17 and three hundred bucklers of alloyed gold (three mi′nas of gold he proceeded to lay upon each buckler). Then the king put them in the House of the Forest of Leb′a·non. 18 Further, the king made a great ivory throne and overlaid it with refined gold. 
      19 There were six steps to the throne, and the throne had a round canopy behind it, and there were armrests on this side and on that side by the place of sitting, and two lions were standing beside the armrests. 20 And there were twelve lions standing there upon the six steps, on this side and on that side. No other kingdom had any made just like it. 21 And all the drinking vessels of King Sol′o·mon were of gold, and all the vessels of the House of the Forest of Leb′a·non were of pure gold. There was nothing of silver; it was considered in the days of Sol′o·mon as nothing at all. 
      22 For the king had a fleet of ships of Tar′shish on the sea along with Hi′ram’s fleet of ships. Once every three years the fleet of ships of Tar′shish would come carrying gold and silver, ivory, and apes and peacocks. 23 So King Sol′o·mon was greater in riches and wisdom than all the other kings of the earth. 24 And all the people of the earth were seeking the face of Sol′o·mon to hear his wisdom that God had put in his heart. 25 And they were bringing each his gift, articles of silver and articles of gold and garments and armor and balsam oil, horses and mules, as a yearly matter of course."
      wol.jw.org

    • Guest Nicole
      By Guest Nicole
      I make a lot of the gifts I give, and often they’re small.  So when I found this punch board that lets you make scrapbook paper DIY gift boxes, I knew I would use it a lot!  Not only does it work great for small gifts, it’s also perfect for making up favor boxes for your party or DIY wedding.  I’m going to show you today how quickly you can punch and fold a gift box, and give you an idea for how to dress it up to make it wedding-worthy, or to make that gift to your friend extra-special.

      Supplies needed to make your own rustic DIY gift boxes:
      We R Memory Keepers Gift Box Punch Board
      2.5 inch Wide Burlap Ribbon (About 12 inches)
      Hemp or Jute Twine (About 30 inches)
      Scrapbook Paper – one sheet for each box (I used white 8×8 sheets for this project, but you can use any size between 6×6 and 12×12)
      Floral Accents (Optional. I used Petaloo Chantilly adhesive blossoms, but you can use anything to match your color theme!)

      The supplies for these DIY gift boxes go a long way, which makes them a great choice for making up several for your wedding or party.  The box size I made is 3.25 inches x 3.25 inches x 1.75 inches, but the punch gives instructions for making short, tall, or square boxes using any size paper 6×6 inches to 12×12 inches.  Choosing a different size will mean you need more or less burlap and twine, but you can plan on these supplies making about 30 boxes – and less than 40 cents each, before you add the embellishment that matches your theme.  The idea I’ll be showing you today comes out to $1 each.

      The great part, too, is how quickly they make up.  Especially if you get a few friends together, punching and assembling, you can make up these DIY gift boxes in just a couple of minutes!  In fact – I’m sharing a video how the punch board works, so that you can see how quickly they come together.
      You can see how in just a few minutes, you can make up something shabby chic, elegant, or colorful – and customize them any way that suits your party theme!

      http://blog.consumercrafts.com/paper-crafts/rustic-diy-gift-boxes/
    • By Bible Speaks
      “Look! Sons are an inheritance from Jehovah; the fruitage 
      of the belly is a reward.” (Psalm 127:3.)
    • By The Librarian
      JW Gifts for a Pioneer School
      Anyone know what the typical Pioneer School Gifts were back in 1960? Just curious.




×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

Terms of Service Confirmation Terms of Use Privacy Policy Guidelines We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.