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There is Nothing New Under the Sun

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We have wronged no one, we have corrupted no one, we have taken advantage of no one.” (2 Corinthians 7:2)

“Nevertheless, you say, I was “crafty” and I caught you “by trickery.” (2 Corinthians 12:16)

”There is nothing new under the sun” (Ecclesiastes 1:9)

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3 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

We have wronged no one, we have corrupted no one, we have taken advantage of no one.” (2 Corinthians 7:2)

“Nevertheless, you say, I was “crafty” and I caught you “by trickery.” (2 Corinthians 12:16)

”There is nothing new under the sun” (Ecclesiastes 1:9)

So, are you comparing the apostles to the governing body and the organization?  Just asking.

I agree with scripture, there is “nothing new under the sun”, except for its magnitude in the last days.

 

 

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10 minutes ago, Witness said:

So, are you comparing the apostles to the governing body and the organization?  Just asking.

I was comparing them to you and your constant complaining that have shoved you out of the spot where you think you belong. Just answering.

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1 hour ago, TrueTomHarley said:

I was comparing them to you and your constant complaining that have shoved you out of the spot where you think you belong. Just answering.

Maybe you were, maybe you weren't.  Just in case you were...

 What I “preach” about concerns the condition of “craftiness” that you and the anointed ones live under.  Personally, I feel relief knowing that I can now approach God and Jesus without anyone telling me how to do it.  This is what God wants for us, an authentic personal relationship with Him and His Son.  It's called stepping out of the darkness and into the light of Christ.  John 8:12; 1:4,5; 2 Cor 4:6; 1 Pet 2:9

My disfellowshipping was a spiritual “killing” for “apostasy”.  I was told if ever I changed my mind, I would be considered for reinstatement, which is such a laughable proposition.  I would be reinstated into an organization.  I would not be "returning to Jehovah" because God and the organization are two different entities.  Isa 46:5  One, is a practicing lie under the presence of the “man of lawlessness”. Matt 24:15; 2 Thess 2:3,4  It is a "god of fortress" set up by a "king" who rules over spiritual Zion, the true Temple of God.  It is a "god unknown to his ancestors", that "he will honor with gold and silver, with precious stones and costly gifts."  Dan 11:38

The organization is the "different" Beast, that arises to trample the anointed ones. God's chosen people have never had to face anything like it, until now.    Dan 7:7; Rev 13:1,2,7  It holds authority over the "saints"...and you.  

If you would just open your spiritual eyes…

2 Thess 2 Concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered to him, we ask you, brothers and sisters, not to become easily unsettled or alarmed by the teaching allegedly from us(apostles, with whom many JWs compare with the GB) whether by a prophecy or by word of mouth or by letter—asserting that the day of the Lord has already come. (1914) Don’t let anyone deceive you in any way, for that day will not come until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness  is revealed, the man doomed to destruction. He will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God or is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God’s temple, (the anointed ones 1 Cor 3:16,17) proclaiming himself to be God.

God's Temple is not "Jehovah's spiritual temple", otherwise known as the organization - that "different" Beast.  It is in the hearts of the anointed ones.    1 Cor 3:16,17; Eph 2:20-22

Don’t you remember that when I was with you I used to tell you these things? And now you know what is holding him back, so that he may be revealed at the proper timeFor the secret power of lawlessness is already at work; but the one who now holds it back will continue to do so till he is taken out of the way. And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will overthrow with the breath of his mouth and destroy by the splendor of his coming.

 The coming of the lawless one will be in accordance with how Satan works. He will use all sorts of displays of power through signs and wonders that serve the lie,10 and all the ways that wickedness deceives those who are perishing. They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved.11 For this reason God sends them a powerful delusion so that they will believe the lie 12 and so that all will be condemned who have not believed the truth but have delighted in wickedness. 2 Thess 2:1-12

Before God's people have ever suffered destruction, He revealed His message to His servants and sent them to warn His people of their pending doom. 

 “Surely the Lord GOD does nothing, unless He reveals His secret to His servants the prophets”  Amos 3:7

These servants were considered the one's telling the lie by the majority of the people. They were viewed as crazy, with a message of little use.  Think of all the prophets God sent and the people's reactions.  

"They say to the seers, 'See no more visions!' and to the prophets, 'Give us no more visions of what is right! Tell us pleasant things, prophesy illusions.'"  Isa 30:10

Revelation is a book that God reveals to His servants (the anointed ones) who care to heed it's message.  Rev 3:18  It is a warning message concerning the sins of God's holy people, just as He has made known when His people fell into sin throughout the ages.  Rev 1:1 

Your leaders offer you a spiritual paradise of peace and security. This is their "prophetic" message. Jeremiah dealt with this same issue among Israel.

"The dress the wound of my people as though it were not serious.  "Peace, peace", they say, when there is no peace".  Jer 8:11

Look around you, can't you see there really  is no peace in the organization?  It cannot save you from the nations as God did for His people when they obeyed His directions.  Isa 48:18   If you had eyes that were open to the sins committed by God's people you would see the lie for what it actually is.  You would understand that you "serve the lie."

Now, brothers and sisters, about times and dates we do not need to write to you, 2 for you know very well that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night. 3 While people are saying, “Peace and safety,” destruction will come on them suddenly, as labor pains on a pregnant woman, and they will not escape.  1 Thess 5:1-3

By the way, God doesn't choose the prominent ones to get His message across.   He chooses the despised ones, those least expected to carry His message.  1 Cor 4:13   But, of course, those who are despised are viewed as the haughty ones, while those who are held in "high esteem", get away with murder.  Gal 2:6; John 16:2-4; Matt 5:11,12; Rev 13: 11,12,15; 11:1-3,7-10

I am not surprised at what you think about me.  I also am not surprised at how you value the GB who have successfully pulled the wool over your eyes.  Matt 23:12

 

 

 

 

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3 hours ago, Witness said:

Maybe you were, maybe you weren't.  Just in case you were...

Sigh.....

I answered a little snarkily because I was trying to avoid what i got anyway—yet another endless tirade that amounts to little more than they, the ‘bad’ anointed are doing it wrong and you, as one of the outmaneuvered ‘good’ anointed, would do it better.

I just can’t take it anymore.

No, I do not think they are the apostles. Nor do they. Yes, they are taking the lead of those who brought an accurate understanding of the Bible to me.

I mean, it’s not as though I heard it from you.

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26 minutes ago, TrueTomHarley said:

I mean, it’s not as though I heard it from you.

If I have an opportunity to share truth, I will.  I know you are not the only fish in the pond who comes here to read.  Matt 13:47-50

Besides, wasn't it you who kept asking me questions and resurrecting a recent thread?  

 

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1 hour ago, Witness said:

Besides, wasn't it you who kept asking me questions and resurrecting a recent thread?  

 

Sigh......

Yes, it is because I am thinking of leaving the faith and I knew that you must have all the answers.

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41 minutes ago, TrueTomHarley said:

Sigh......

Yes, it is because I am thinking of leaving the faith and I knew that you must have all the answers.

Huh.  It would be a miracle if you "left" your faith in the organization.  But, marvelous things do happen.     

I have full confidence in knowing the answer to this question. 

“After this many of his disciples turned back and no longer walked with him. 67 So Jesus said to the twelve, “Do you want to go away as well?”68 Simon Peter answered him, “Lord, to whom shall we go?  John 6:66-68

Sigh... I fear you may not know the right answer, since your leaders always throw you a curve ball. It’s interesting how those who turn to Jesus Christ, once leaving the WT,  speak about Christ, not feeling the need to continually back up his words with “organization” or, “faithful and discreet slave”.   Does God reject them for doing so?  Will they survive WT's rendition of Armageddon?  They are "killed" by your leaders for following Jesus Christ.  Rev 13:15; 11:7

These are the things I know.  

 

 

 

 

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Billy .......

I think the proof that you are delusional rests in the rambling epic tome you just posted, with the expectation that not only anybody would read it in its entirety before falling asleep at the keyboard, or that anyone who did manage to stay awake would facepalm slap their foreheads in realization and exclamation " WOW! He has a POINT!"

It COULD be salvaged, if someone was paying you by the word .... and I am sure they would take your word for how many words you could bill for, rather than be forced to read it.

I would read it through, if you could keep it short.

VRERRY short.

........ like ... one or two paragraphs short.

 

 

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11 minutes ago, BillyTheKid46 said:

Only ignorant fools would make such a claim as James Thomas Rook JR.

But then again, he is the court jester here. Perhaps making such a demand can go even further by applying it to witness, or is there where your obtuse gesture draws the line. 😉

I can see the same example JWinsider applied to John Butler. Can it be? But it does show where the unintelligent Bible goers are in the scheme of not wanting to understand or wish not to understand to obey God and his laws. 😏

 

There ya go Billy!

I KNEW you could do it!

THREE paragraphs ... but all very short!

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O.K. , I will bite ... pray tell what you perceive  Billy OH Billy, as my Bible lawbreaking.

Hmmmmmm?

Many dozens of times I have admitted on this forum of being a Barbarian, but that is more of a cultural thing ... so you probably have quite a list that would justify such serious and profound accusations.

Please be specific.

And to show you are NOT delusional, please prove it, and provide scriptural backup.

I await your scathing specific condemnations.

2019-05-21_014906.jpg

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I keep no secrets, Billy ... everything I do is open and "in your face", as I care nothing about any consequences ... mainly because I do not actually stick burglars' heads on a pole in my front yard, even though the idea does appeal to me.I

I asked you to specifically to enumerate the horrors you accuse me of, and you choked, and replied with irrelevant gibberish.

I was giving you an opportunity to PROVE you are not a slanderer, are not a liar, and not delusional.

You failed to do any of those things.

You stand convicted by your very own slanders and lies against me as a bitter, irrelevant agenda driven Watchtower policy wonk, as well.

Exactly what I would expect from a Greek speaking Watchtower Lawyer, or lawyer wannabe.

You know why Watchtower Lawyers can swim in the Atlantic Ocean without any fear of being eaten by Sharks?

.... Professional Courtesy.

 

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4 hours ago, BillyTheKid46 said:

Being anonymous gives everyone certain anonymity to biblical judgment. But don’t feel bad, you’re NOT alone in this, here.

You are AGAIN guilty as homemade sin of what you accuse ME of ... the irony is so thick you could cut it with a knife.

My name here is EXACTLY as shown on my birth certificate, my home mortgage, my Publisher's Record Card, how I am known in the Congregation ( ..actually, casually it is Tom Rook ...), my driver's license and my US Passport..

Again you have condemned yourself with your own words .... unless you really ARE BillyThe Kid46, and that's what is shown on your birth certificate, how you are known in your Congregation. and that is what is shown on your Driver's License, etc.

 

Every posting you make you shoot yourself in the foot ... AGAIN.

Part of my being a Barbarian is that I find it all very, very funny.  Like watching a Daffy Duck Cartoon where it is Duck Season and he gets his face rearranged continually from being shot.

Or as Daffy might say .... "He's Dispichible!"

 

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BillyTheKid46:

There is something despicable about a man who weaponizes Scripture to try and intimidate others, for his own aggrandizement.

That is who you are, Billy, clear to the bone.

Your logic and reasoning is SO FLAWED, you think you can compile ONE of anything, in a nebulous foggy cloud of thought, and make assumptions about everything else.

Just FYI, I have had sustained discussions about my philosophy with an Elder Body in the past, in fact, several Elder Bodies in different congregations all over the country, over the years ... but my being a Barbarian means that I ignore  uninspired, and error ridden  Organizational pontification..

Been there ..... done that. 

I make them mad, and they make me sad. 

We're even.

If I am wrong about any subject ... I of course have to pay the price for being wrong

If THEY are wrong, I STILL pay the price, in full,  for taking their bad advice,  and they pay no price whatsoever.

... and so far, my track record is light years better than theirs about being right on matters the Bible does not speak about, and about 50/50 in things it does speak about.

... and as far as confessions go ...... as far as I know, the Watchtower has only apologized ONCE since 1870 ... for screwing up peoples' lives.

2019-05-21_215527.jpg

When the Body of Elders assembled to interrogate me asked me specifically what my views of the Governing Body was, about a year and a half ago, I replied:

"I will have to agree with what they published in the February, 2017 Watchtower ... that they are neither inspired, or infallible" .

The Coordinator said "Oh yeah, I remember reading that ... "  The other two Elders looked at him in astonishment, as  they had not, or did not remember it.

They could not release me from "ROOM 101" fast enough.

Several years before that I had a body of elders surround me in an aisle way at the Kingdom Hall, after the Watchtower Study,  and I could no escape them without pushing one or more aside, and one asked me without any preamble whatsoever, what I thought of the Governing Body.  My reply was spontaneous and instantaneous:

"I do not think of them at all!"

They left me alone after that. .... until "next time".

 

 

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5 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

My name here is EXACTLY as shown on my birth certificate, my home mortgage, my Publisher's Record Card, how I am known in the Congregation 

I do respect that for the sake of showing guts. I really do.

 

5 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

actually, casually it is Tom Rook

I would appreciate it if you would go by James. Or, just tell me if you insist upon Tom and I will go to James.

I am really curious. Can it really be, with you being so open and all, that you have triggered no sanctions in the congregation? You never let on that you have, one time relating a current field service experience when you were packing a gun and the sisters  commented how they should fell safe.

As deliberately as offensive, accusatory, and outrageous as you are—have you truly never heard about it?

As an experiment, I am going to quote a Bible passage that was recently cited on our weekly program. See if you can spot the words I have cleverly substituted (look very hard).

Looking intently at the Sanʹhe·drin Paul said: “Men, brothers, I have behaved before God with a perfectly clear conscience down to this day.”  

At this the high priest An·a·niʹas ordered those standing by him to strike him on the mouth.  

Then Paul said to him: “God is going to strike you, you whitewashed wall. Do you at one and the same time sit to judge me in accord with the Law and, transgressing the Law, command me to be struck?”  

Those standing by said: “Are you reviling the high priest of God?”  

And Paul said: “You lying son of a b***h! I’ll revile you if I want, you odious fool! Your mother’s midwife probably slapped her instead of you!!!”

There. Did you catch it? Honestly, why don’t you be more like Paul actually was?

 

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On 5/22/2019 at 11:41 PM, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

Many dozens of times I have admitted on this forum of being a Barbarian, but that is more of a cultural thing ... so you probably have quite a list that would justify such serious and profound accusations.

Please be specific.

And to show you are NOT delusional, please prove it, and provide scriptural backup.

I await your scathing specific condemnations.

 

From your nebulous general response, it seems clear that you think the word "Specific" refers to the Ocean West of California.

 

12 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

I asked you to specifically to enumerate the horrors you accuse me of, and you choked, and replied with irrelevant gibberish.

I was giving you an opportunity to PROVE you are not a slanderer, are not a liar, and not delusional.

You failed to do any of those things.

 

Well, BillyTheKid46, (who is NOT really who you are) ... I suppose we will just have to "agree to disagree".

I do try to be a good Jehovah's Witness ... but nobody that has ever met me has yet accused me of being "Brother Watchtower".

For me, that is a badge of honor.

.... but then again ... I am a Barbarian.

The major "take away" point is this:

I DO NOT WANT TO BE, AND DO NOT TRY TO BE.

( For the logical, reasonable, and rational reasons I stated on this thread, several posts before this posting, which I am re-posting below, as I know you will misconstrue the points, anyway .)

 

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8 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

If I am wrong about any subject ... I of course have to pay the price for being wrong

If THEY are wrong, I STILL pay the price, in full,  for taking their bad advice,  and they pay no price whatsoever.

... and so far, my track record is light years better than theirs about being right on matters the Bible does not speak about, and about 50/50 in things it does speak about.

 

This quoting of myself is the basis of why I rationally and deliberately choose to be who I am ... the fact that it drives you absolutely insane is merely an added bonus.

Meanwhile, you are hiding behind your fake desperado cowboy uniform.

Billy_the_Kid_corrected.thumb.jpg.2a564d5b205f658ce190f110366a95dc.jpg

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5 hours ago, BillyTheKid46 said:

On the rest of your rant, Grow up James, you and Butler need stronger meds. Maybe that will prevent you with a rationalization to be talking to yourself, and pretending to be the third person within yourself. You’re no God. That might give “witness” an impression of, Trinity.

What you get from other peoples' input is not only astounding, ... it's truly stunning.

I am stunned that you are giving advice that I am no God, and that I am trying to give the impression of  a Trinity.

How you get these ideas may be of serious concern.   THAT one was a certified Doozie.

That was as strange as your accusing me of hiding behind an avatar, when it is you that are doing that.

..... I think I have you figured out, Billy.

You are projecting who you are, which you view with revulsion and contempt ....  onto everyone else.

 

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6 hours ago, BillyTheKid46 said:

Do you wonder why the Librarian sanctioned this by NOT admonishing you, as he did with me and Butler, even though I have never threatened to harm anyone like Bulter? How strange

Well Billy, I am actually glad you asked that specific question:

(Remember "Specific", the Ocean West of California ...)

The answer is .....

No ... the reason is very clear to EVERYBODY ... except you.

You are a chronic, and continuous slanderer and liar, with delusions of scriptural grandeur, who continually attacks others without provocation .... so when they RESPOND with pointing out you goofy logic, virulent hatred, and insults ... it is ONLY self defense on their part.

You are chastised and threatened with banishment because you are a colossal pain in the butt.

Others are not chastised as they are merely defending themselves FROM you, by pointing it out .... which everybody realizes .... except you.

All that being said, you may in fact be a much better JW than most here, including myself .... who makes no claim whatsoever of being a "good" one.

You are still my Brother, but you scare the hell out of me ... in a nice, long distance way,  of course ... bless your pea-pickin' heart.

 

 

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