I have barely seen a more stupid chart in my life

[Srecko Sostar]

On 4/28/2020 at 8:35 PM, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

So, without any duplicity, or being two faced, I agree with the principle for the Governing Body the same as what Jesus said for the scribes and Pharisees, of his day..

(Matthew 23:2, 3) . . .“The scribes and the Pharisees have seated themselves in the seat of Moses. 3 Therefore, all the things they tell you, do and observe, . .

As @JW Insider emphasized about reasonableness, i would look at Jesus words and on practicing his words with little caution. Pharisees commanded  not to work on Sabbath, for example.

.... Well, Jesus done the opposite and he did not participate in do all the things they tell you. 

[Witness]

8 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

In his morning worship talk Mr. Malenfant explained this:

Thank you, Srecko.  I heard this too and really can't get his blasphemy out of my mind. (Rev 13:5)

So, it would be “pointless” to find out just who are Christ’s “ambassadors”, (2 Cor 5:20) since the only names one needs to know (according to Malenfant) are those of the GB.  And, since it is a “very private matter”, what JW would dare talk to one of these other ambassadors? 

Rejecting the ambassadors/members of Christ’s body, is a rejection of Christ.  This is an absolutely stunning statement by Malenfant.  No other members of the Body, are apparently needed.  But, it’s been this way for a long while, since a “wicked slave” and its spiritually “drunk” elder body have worked together to beat down the Body of Christ, while exalting the body of elders.  Everyone, in every congregation knows exactly who the elders are. Matt 24:48-51

The anointed are allowing the GB/elders to cut them off from their Head, Jesus Christ. Their Master, their Head, has become the GB, who defies scripture concerning the anointed Body of Christ.

“They have lost connection with the head, from whom the whole body, supported and held together by its ligaments and sinews, grows as God causes it to grow.”  Col 2:19

 ^“For just as each of us has one body with many members, and these members do not all have the same function, ⁵ so in Christ we, though many, form one body, and each member belongs to all the others.”  Rom 12:4,5

 ^“Now to each one the manifestation of the Spirit is given for the common good.”

“so that there should be no division in the body, but that its parts should have equal concern for each other. “  1 Cor 12:7,25

 

“He will cause deceit to prosper, and he will consider himself superior. When they feel secure, he will destroy many and take his stand against the Prince of princes. Yet he will be destroyed, but not by human power.”  Dan 8:25

 

 

 

 

 

[Srecko Sostar]

4 hours ago, Witness said:

since the only names one needs to know (according to Malenfant) are those of the GB. 

Yes  @Witness , you do preciously*, exactly summarized in a few words main message that this JW elder send to JW people.

No one else of "anointed" around the world is/represents nothing in WTJWorg, but only few of them in GB behaves as head of Organization and elevates themselves above all other anointed in the Body. It seems they acting as Head of Body or at least as the Neck (as in joke, man is head of his wife but she is the neck who rotate head )) 

PS

 * precisely!

[Witness]

10 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

but we are convinced, for example, that the members of the GB have the heavenly calling."

I feel that the majority of the "anointed" leaders of the organization from the beginning, were genuinely anointed to fulfill prophesy.  (Matt 5:14; 2 Pet 3:17; Rev 8:10,11; Matt 24:24)   Yet, I am not thoroughly convinced that all of today's GB members are.  When Malenfant said the above, how can one be totally convinced that each GB member is anointed when (someone correct me if I'm wrong) there is no account of any of their anointing experiences?  And why shouldn't there be? We have an incredible account in the Bible that all in the area witnessed its effect.  (Acts 2:1-3)  JWs are said to be honest in all things.  To say, "we are convinced" with no comment made by these men of their anointing experience is deceptive.  JWs are to take their word for it, but ignore any "word" from a genuine anointed in the organization.  The persuasive argument that Malenfant made is a war of words against the genuine anointed. (Rev 13:7)  In this case, it is one-sided unless a true anointed of God stands up and exposes truth outlined in scripture.  I so wish more would do so.

"Go now, write it on a tablet for them,
    inscribe it on a scroll,
that for the days to come
    it may be an everlasting witness.
9 For these are rebellious people, deceitful children,
    children unwilling to listen to the Lord’s instruction.
10 They say to the seers,
    “See no more visions!”
and to the prophets,
    “Give us no more visions of what is right!
Tell us pleasant things,
    prophesy illusions.
11 Leave this way,
    get off this path,
and stop confronting us
    with the Holy One of Israel!”

12 Therefore this is what the Holy One of Israel says:

“Because you have rejected this message,
    relied on oppression
    and depended on deceit,
13 this sin will become for you
    like a high wall, cracked and bulging,
    that collapses suddenly, in an instant.

15 This is what the Sovereign Lord, the Holy One of Israel, says:

“In repentance and rest is your salvation,
    in quietness and trust is your strength,
    but you would have none of it.

18 Yet the Lord longs to be gracious to you;
    therefore he will rise up to show you compassion.
For the Lord is a God of justice.
    Blessed are all who wait for him!

19 People of Zion, who live in Jerusalem, you will weep no more. How gracious he will be when you cry for help! As soon as he hears, he will answer you. 20 Although the Lord gives you the bread of adversity and the water of affliction, your teachers will be hidden no more; with your own eyes you will see them. 21 Whether you turn to the right or to the left, your ears will hear a voice behind you, saying, “This is the way; walk in it.” 22 Then you will desecrate your idols overlaid with silver and your images covered with gold; you will throw them away like a menstrual cloth and say to them, “Away with you!”  (Isa 30)

Every priest under Christ, is to be a "teacher" of God's word, obedient to the teachings of Christ and not to those of men.  

 “For the lips of a priest (1 Pet 2:5,9) ought to preserve knowledge, because he is the messenger of the Lord Almighty and people seek instruction from his mouth."  Mal 2:7

JWs are not allowed to do this, and the anointed are not allowed to act as priests as outlined in scripture.

 

 

[Witness]

Malenfant:

“We don’t need to know the names of all of the anointed on earth today.”

“Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. ¹⁶ You will know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes from thornbushes or figs from thistles? ¹⁷ Even so, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. ¹⁸ A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit. ¹⁹ Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. ²⁰ Therefore by their fruits you will know them.”

The Greek word here interpreted as “know”:

ἐπιγινώσκω epiginṓskō, ep-ig-in-oce'-ko; from G1909 and G1097; to know upon some mark, i.e. recognize; by implication, to become fully acquainted with, to acknowledge:—(ac-, have, take)know(-ledge, well), perceive.

It is imperative for each of us to “know”, during our lifetime, who the anointed are, and what these “trees” teach.  We are to recognize their fruits as either good or bad – good from Jesus Christ; bad from the Father of the lie.  (John 8:44; Luke 6:45)  Thus, we come to “know” that anointed one, and what he or she teaches. ( Mal 2:7) 

 “Anyone who welcomes you welcomes me, and anyone who welcomes me welcomes the one who sent me. ⁴¹ Whoever welcomes a prophet as a prophet will receive a prophet’s reward, and whoever welcomes a righteous person as a righteous person will receive a righteous person’s reward. ⁴² And if anyone gives even a cup of cold water to one of these little ones who is my disciple, truly I tell you, that person will certainly not lose their reward.”   Matt 10:40-42

We cannot “welcome” any anointed disciple of Christ, if we are told to avoid them as an anointed teacher of Christ.  This includes knowing their name and the fruit they are to produce.  

When I was a JW, I thought that by providing, as an example, a place for an anointed one and his family to live in, was giving them a “cup of cold water”.  Jesus is the source of “living water”. (John 7:38) Those who remain “in Christ” will have that same “living water” flowing from their heart. In turn, anyone who “receives” these teachers producing “good fruit”, give back that living water that flows from their own heart as well, from their recognition of teachings produced in harmony with Christ’s truths.

The fruit they produce, signifies their “daily/regular sacrifices”/”constant feature” offered before God.  1 Pet 2:5; Heb 13:15; Rom 12:1; Rev 7:15

With smooth, seemingly “righteous” words, Malenfant aids in the “trampling” of the anointed priests/Temple “stones” in the organization. His words support the termination of each anointed one's sacrifices to be made before God.  Ezek 44:6-9; 2 Chron 13:9; Dan 12:11; 2 Thess 2:4

"His forces will rise up and desecrate the temple fortress. They will abolish the regular sacrifice and set up the abomination of desolation.”  Dan 11:31

 

 

 

 

[Srecko Sostar]

3 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Yes  @Witness , you do preciously,

I mean - precisely!

Please accept my apologize for grammar error  

[Srecko Sostar]

2 hours ago, Witness said:

 To say, "we are convinced" with no comment made by these men of their anointing experience is deceptive.  JWs are to take their word for it, but ignore any "word" from a genuine anointed in the organization. 

Malenfant: ".....after all JHVH has blessed them, they fulfill Bible prophecy about FDS. There are certain things that we acquire knowledge about and were convinced of. We see JHVH favor on them, we have no doubt that JHVH blessing is upon their effort to take of the domestic and provide spiritual food all of us. But there's something we don't know. We have nothing to do with the final sealing. That is a personal thing that take place between individual and JHVH god and ..... that's what we're told and that's what we understand ..."  

Listen what words he used to prove the subject: after all, they fulfill prophecy, were convinced of, we have no doubt that JHVH is upon their effort, that's what we're told and that's what we understand.

Empty proves for spiritual blind mind to be convinced into deception, again.

[Anna]

13 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

and i might also add at this point. Even though we don't know about that personal relationship that comes about, we don't experience it ourselves, but we are convinced, for example, that the members of the GB have the heavenly calling." 

Mr Malenfant is person who can control his curiosity about things no one knows, not even he, but it seems how he knows all about that personal relationship and very private matter  that supposedly exist between GB members and JHVH.

:)))  and he try to manipulate audience with this "confidential information".

I think you may have misunderstood what Malefant was saying. I don't think he was saying that he knows of some confidential information or details about the personal relationship of the GB with Jehovah, and the anointing, as opposed to any other anointed. I think what he was saying is that we cannot be sure if someone has been called to heaven, we have to take their word for it, and that might be a little difficult if for example someone who has obvious mental problems claims to be anointed. However, it should be a lot easier if that person is of sound mind. And then he quoted the example of the GB, we can see they are of sound mind, therefore there is no reason to doubt their anointing. 

[Srecko Sostar]

50 minutes ago, Anna said:

I think you may have misunderstood what Malefant was saying. I don't think he was saying that he knows of some confidential information or details about the personal relationship of the GB with Jehovah, and the anointing, as opposed to any other anointed. I think what he was saying is that we cannot be sure if someone has been called to heaven, we have to take their word for it, and that might be a little difficult if for example someone who has obvious mental problems claims to be anointed. However, it should be a lot easier if that person is of sound mind. And then he quoted the example of the GB, we can see they are of sound mind, therefore there is no reason to doubt their anointing. 

Thanks for respond.

I can't take this explanation to be useful in defending Malenfant reasoning. After he told how no one  in congregations knows who of anointed really received heavenly calling (congregants can only assume, guess and speculate, with visual observation, with the help of literal sight, how individuals who partaking symbols possibly have heavenly calling, as he explained) he went beyond own reasoning and conclusion and presentation about issue, and made second guess, thesis about same subject.

In his next demonstration about same class, 144000 kings and priests who are all equal in this position before god, he put his personal (or small group) opinion above general, official doctrine presented few seconds before. It is known how WTJWorg published how some anointed are emotionally and mentally imbalanced, ill and partaking in symbols. And by that concluding how god will not choose such individual. But Malenfant stated how this relationship is of personal relationship and very private matter. Well, who we are to interfere if god want few "crazy" people to go to heaven??!! 

On other hand, when you said:... and that might be a little difficult if for example someone who has obvious mental problems claims to be anointed. However, it should be a lot easier if that person is of sound mind.

If we are able to detect who is with mental problems and who have sound mind, it can be useful. But, what sort of mind (person) would/will devil use more for his purpose to deceive humankind with false doctrines? "Sound mind" or "mentally and emotionally disturbed mind"?? 

I am pretty sure in your answer :))

[Witness]

2 hours ago, Anna said:

I think what he was saying is that we cannot be sure if someone has been called to heaven, we have to take their word for it, and that might be a little difficult if for example someone who has obvious mental problems claims to be anointed. However, it should be a lot easier if that person is of sound mind. And then he quoted the example of the GB, we can see they are of sound mind, therefore there is no reason to doubt their anointing. 

From a "human standpoint", which is what I imagine you are referring to, would you say that the GB member, David Splane had a "sound mind" when concocting the latest chart of "this generation"? 

Does it appear that A. Morris had a "sound mind" when visiting the liquor store? Or, when he spoke of people like charred hot dogs, in reference to the upcoming carnage at Armageddon?

Did Stephen Lett have a sound mind when he stated that it was all apostate lies that the organization had a child abuse problem?  Or, that there was "more money going out than coming in" which was followed with great plans to build media centers?

Did S. Herd have a sound mind when comparing the size of a woman's brain to that of a man as so much smaller, and how that limits her abilities?  

Just some reminders.   

 

 

 

[Witness]

2 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Listen what words he used to prove the subject: after all, they fulfill prophecy, were convinced of, we have no doubt that JHVH is upon their effort, that's what we're told and that's what we understand.

Well, I have no doubt....I am fully convinced...that they fulfill prophesy...as the wicked slave.  Jesus never told us that there was only one possibility, that being only a "faithful slave" as the GB suggests; if so, why would he have mentioned a wicked one. 

 

[Anna]

On 5/14/2020 at 3:53 PM, Srecko Sostar said:

But Malenfant stated how this relationship is of personal relationship and very private matter. Well, who we are to interfere if god want few "crazy" people to go to heaven??!! 

You obviously mean that he could chose them while they are crazy on earth, but they would get cured and not be crazy in heaven. This could be the case, but it is difficult to imagine why Jehovah would pick someone who is crazy.

Mental illness takes many shapes and forms there is, just to mention a few:

• Bipolar disorder. ...
• Persistent depressive disorder. ...
• Generalized anxiety disorder. ...
• Major depressive disorder. ...
• Obsessive-compulsive disorder. ...
• Post-traumatic stress disorder ...
• Schizophrenia. ...
• Aspergers

With those disorders people act in a way that is not normal and one cannot rely on them to make sound decisions or act in a reliable way. And yes, it is true that it is Jehovah that picks the people, and since it is a private matter we cannot know. BUT logic AND the Bible tells me that that a Christian who is taking the lead must posses certain qualifications, and one of those is being sound in mind.

Titus 2:2 : Let the older men be moderate in habits, serious, sound in mind, healthy in faith, in love, in endurance. 

Titus 2:6-9 Likewise, keep on urging the younger men to be sound in mind, showing yourself to be an example of fine works in every way. Teach what is pure* with all seriousness, using wholesome* speech that cannot be criticized.

So in view of that, I am sure you would agree that many who have mental issues would have a problem with being sound in mind. We would expect elders, such as the GB to be sound in mind. We also expect the faithful slave to be of the anointed. So put those two together and we could understand why Malefant concluded that we can trust that the GB are of the anointed.