....and like Forest Gump said "... and that's all I am going to say about that."

[TrueTomHarley]

3 hours ago, Thinking said:

Which also says that the person may be guilty or innocent and being charged means nothing at this point ...Even if he is guilty in the end....shame on all those who threw their hats in the ring...before it  was legally morally and spiritually decided.

Nobody ever thinks about such things on social media. The actual news media has long since set the example of relaying accusation as though it were conviction.

3 hours ago, Thinking said:

Which also says that the person may be guilty or innocent and being charged means nothing at this point ...

Nobody ever thinks of such things. Until it happens to them. Then they think of it.

[Srecko Sostar]

3 hours ago, Thinking said:

like a mob of gossipy old  women...

:))) is this "sexism" ?

[Anna]

2 hours ago, 4Jah2me said:

The child would be 'pushed to one side' for the sake of retaining the Elder in his position.

I don't think it's about retaining the position, but more about fear of slandering the person. When there is notoriety surrounding someone in a responsible position then that position is usually removed. 

 

2 hours ago, 4Jah2me said:

In my opinion, he meant, he would not report it

Yes, that is was what I was trying to imply.

[Anna]

11 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Anna, I found answer on your dilemma

Personally, I did not have a dilemma, I was just showing how there could be a dilemma because  the text is not clear. Of course, as you suggest, you would interpret this as meaning go to the elders. That is how I see it too. But, this could not be proved in court either way (that is what the courts found so frustrating) because the wording is so ambiguous and it could be argued that it means go to secular authorities. Unless you know the "culture" of Jehovah's Witnesses, then you understand it means go to the elders.

It must be stressed though that NOW it is clearly in writing that sins are handled by the congregation, and crimes are to be handled by secular authorities:  https://www.jw.org/en/news/legal/legal-resources/information/packet-jw-scripturally-based-position-child-protection/

[Anna]

1 hour ago, TrueTomHarley said:

The actual news media has long since set the example of relaying accusation as though it were conviction.

Very true. And although I am not news media (😀) I made that classic mistake of NOT reading properly, and assuming! Shame on me.

[Patiently waiting for Truth]

@Anna  Sorry but i have to pick you up on this point >

Quote "It must be stressed though that NOW it is clearly in writing that sins are handled by the congregation,..."

Nothing is handled by the Congregation.  It is all handled by the Elders and Circuit Overseers etc. The congregation are told nothing. Unlike in scripture when it says 'take it to the congregation. 

[Anna]

2 hours ago, 4Jah2me said:

@Anna  Sorry but i have to pick you up on this point >

Quote "It must be stressed though that NOW it is clearly in writing that sins are handled by the congregation,..."

Nothing is handled by the Congregation.  It is all handled by the Elders and Circuit Overseers etc. The congregation are told nothing. Unlike in scripture when it says 'take it to the congregation. 

Ok, if you want to nit-pick. But it is understood that since everyone, including, the elders, are the congregation, then when the Bible says take your grievance to the congregation, it means to those who have shepherding roles, rather than stand on a pedestal and tell the whole assembly of brothers and sisters including children. I can just imagine getting up on the platform and taking the mic and  announcing my accusation against another member. "Hear, hear, I have an announcement to make; br. 4jah did wrong, he did such and such and won't listen to me".  "Booo!" shout some, others say "can't be, surely not 4jah"? Nope, I think you can see that would not be the wisest option.

1Cor 14:40 But let all things take place decently and by arrangement. 

Ephesians 4:11 And he gave some as apostles, some as prophets, some as evangelizers, some as shepherds and teachers..

1 Peter 5:2 Shepherd the flock of God under your care, serving as overseers....

[Thinking]

11 hours ago, Anna said:

You don't know JTR like we do, he would totally understand.

You are right Anna I don’t ...I’m looking at the principle involved...it always boils down to that...

[Witness]

4 hours ago, Anna said:

1Cor 14:40 But let all things take place decently and by arrangement. 

Ephesians 4:11 And he gave some as apostles, some as prophets, some as evangelizers, some as shepherds and teachers..

1 Peter 5:2 Shepherd the flock of God under your care, serving as overseers....

All of these scriptures refer to the anointed Body of Christ, not a false priesthood - "Gentiles who "sit" in God's Temple. (2 Thess 2:3,4; Rev 11:1,2)    Nothing in the organization takes place "decently and by [God's] arrangement" in Christ.  It takes place indecently by man's arrangement.  The "gifts" are given to "Israel" for a purpose, which are not used under the GB/wicked slave.  The anointed priests (1 Pet 2:5,9) are the shepherds that God has assigned, yet are ignored in your organization.    

Are the elders, "saints"?  

Eph 4:11,12 - "And he himself gave some as apostles and some as prophets and some as evangelists and some as pastors and teachers  for the equipping of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for building up the body of Christ"

 

 

[Thinking]

10 hours ago, Anna said:

Very true. And although I am not news media (😀) I made that classic mistake of NOT reading properly, and assuming! Shame on me.

It’s okay Anna ...I’m not slamming you..we all make mistakes and Ive done some beauties.......can you remember many years ago...actually decades ..the case of Lindy Chamberlain and the child that was taken by a dingo...the cry ...A Dingos got my Baby....went around the world.

Just about everyone had an opinion on her...before and after her trials ...even in the Cong...they had her as guilty..even today I have heard brothers joke...about ..A Dingo taking a baby...or such things... Cartoons  were prolific Over here and world wide...

That destroyed that family and the children...she did many years in jail..and after many legal battles was declared innocent and given a pardon.......She was religious which is an oddity in itself in Australia and added fuel to the fire...
I’ve  seen a young brother accused of what Rook has been...he was nearly lynched by his town....later the police admitted they got it wrong...he was destroyed...He has major hang ups to this day...too scared to go IN to school to pick his kids and Later his grandkids up...just in case.....he suffers anxiety and depression and contemplated suicide.....and will until Jehovah’s day starts..and the former things not remembered..People say he’s hermit ...he’s a loner....and he is one of the Most honourable brothers I Know.
we cannot play with peoples lives...and often we don’t even mean to...but it happens...

The person who started this should hang their head in shame....but then again you would have to have a conscience to do that...it’s okay Anna...you didn’t start this...hey a wise persons learns by others mistakes...unfortunately that’s not me...I seem to have to make the mistake ...then I learn..so I’ve got nothing to brag about Sis....

 

[Thinking]

13 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

It wasn’t exactly a lover of Jehovah who did this, and for better or for worse, the mission statement of this website is (apologies to the Washington Post) “Theocracy Dies in Darkness.”

Point well made. 

Who Did This???? No trial for him then hey
Well I cannot read his heart so I wouldn’t know if he was a lover of Jehovah or not...you must have super powers Tom......also the point about this statement of this website is Theocracy Dies in Darkness....errr ummmm ...not if your one of Jehovah’s Witnesses it  doesn’t...or it shouldn’t !😉...or should I say not if your a true lover of Jehovah...aaaaaah..I’m getting as sarcastic as you my brother....not a good trait to have actually 🥴

[Anna]

2 hours ago, Thinking said:

the case of Lindy Chamberlain and the child that was taken by a dingo...the cry ...A Dingos got my Baby....went around the world.

Yes (I remember the  movie, Lindy Chamberlain being excellently portrayed by Meryl Streep). It showed perfectly how people can be whipped up into mass hysteria over something that they have no idea about.....merely assumptions and  prejudice (in this case her religion) this experience and the one you mention of the poor brother, show what a daunting task the elders have in having to  be careful not to wrongly accuse someone. Because as you say, it can destroy lives when the person is actually innocent. It is as if we let out all the feathers in a pillow, and then try to put them back in. 

As for the situation with JTR, nobody that I am aware of passed any judgement on him, not even me, considering I (wrongly) thought he had been convicted.

2 hours ago, Thinking said:

The person who started this should hang their head in shame...

I know you mean well, but I am not sure what you mean by "started this"? You mean that somebody posted a link* to a probable explanation to his sudden departure from the forum? That’s all I can think of, because nobody expressed any negative or judgemental comments to do with JTR on this thread. On the contrary....

*the information in the link is accessible to the public, anyone can see it.