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1 hour ago, Srecko Sostar said:

17 Today’s watchman class has likewise had to clarify its views from time to time. Can anyone doubt, though, that Jehovah has blessed the ‘faithful slave’? Besides, viewed in context, are not most of the adjustments that have occurred relatively small? Our basic understanding of the Bible has not changed. Our conviction that we are living in the last days is stronger than ever! -https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1997604

I would like to direct your attention on this paragraph from WT 1997 study edition article. 

On one side you commented how JHVH' and Jesus' instructions are given in different time for different or certain purpose. Can you explain why would be how some "given instruction" in 1st century, be it more appropriate at a certain point of their or our time and some not? I believe how whole set of Jesus' teachings and instructions are good and appropriate for whole and each period of human lifetime. 

But this WT quote give answer why (perhaps you) JW members think differently about this. Because the need to "clarify  own  (watchman class aka GB) views came and coming from the reason they don't teach Jesus' or JHVH' teachings but own human doctrines.  

I guess, we have no need to adjust teachings from Bible, but in WTJWorg example, GB had/have need to adjust own interpretations about own teachings.  

For example, do we need to "adjust" God's teaching (law) about slavery to our time? No, because we don't want slavery today! So, we reject any past law (even if it was divine) that supported slavery. 

We are in position to follow or to not follow teachings and instructions revealed in Bible. 

Quote from WT say: Our basic understanding of the Bible has not changed. Our conviction that we are living in the last days is stronger than ever!

Here we have next thing. Author of article made self conviction how their (and all JW's) "basic understanding" (aka core understanding  /core=basic, central, key, fundamental, elemental, principal/) about something has not changed. And then continue with one basic or core JW teaching -  about "last days".

This Study article put accent on "basic understanding" that JW members strongly believe: Resurrection, Keep on Watch, Everlasting Life, Eternal Future, End is Close at Hand, Put Your Trust in Watchman aka GB.

Also have in mind that this is from the year 1997, that is 83 years after 1914 (Generation Doctrine).

And 13 years after famous WT study article: 1914—The Generation That Will Not Pass Away -https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1984361 

WTJWorg basic doctrine, let say, No 1, according to article: End is Close at Hand, that was based on other basic doctrine, let say, No 2: 1914-The Generation That Will Not Pass Away, ........ are both false, because each supported the other. You are aware of fact how 1914 Generation is replaced with Overlapping Generation. 

According to your understanding what is what in this case?! Milk and solid food or "to call a spade a spade" aka false teachings?

 

Have to get to you in a while, my meeting is about to start.

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5 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

17 Today’s watchman class has likewise had to clarify its views from time to time. Can anyone doubt, though, that Jehovah has blessed the ‘faithful slave’? Besides, viewed in context, are not most of the adjustments that have occurred relatively small? Our basic understanding of the Bible has not changed. Our conviction that we are living in the last days is stronger than ever! -https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1997604

I would like to direct your attention on this paragraph from WT 1997 study edition article. 

On one side you commented how JHVH' and Jesus' instructions are given in different time for different or certain purpose. Can you explain why would be how some "given instruction" in 1st century, be it more appropriate at a certain point of their or our time and some not? I believe how whole set of Jesus' teachings and instructions are good and appropriate for whole and each period of human lifetime. 

But this WT quote give answer why (perhaps you) JW members think differently about this. Because the need to "clarify  own  (watchman class aka GB) views came and coming from the reason they don't teach Jesus' or JHVH' teachings but own human doctrines.  

I guess, we have no need to adjust teachings from Bible, but in WTJWorg example, GB had/have need to adjust own interpretations about own teachings.  

For example, do we need to "adjust" God's teaching (law) about slavery to our time? No, because we don't want slavery today! So, we reject any past law (even if it was divine) that supported slavery. 

We are in position to follow or to not follow teachings and instructions revealed in Bible. 

Quote from WT say: Our basic understanding of the Bible has not changed. Our conviction that we are living in the last days is stronger than ever!

Here we have next thing. Author of article made self conviction how their (and all JW's) "basic understanding" (aka core understanding  /core=basic, central, key, fundamental, elemental, principal/) about something has not changed. And then continue with one basic or core JW teaching -  about "last days".

This Study article put accent on "basic understanding" that JW members strongly believe: Resurrection, Keep on Watch, Everlasting Life, Eternal Future, End is Close at Hand, Put Your Trust in Watchman aka GB.

Also have in mind that this is from the year 1997, that is 83 years after 1914 (Generation Doctrine).

And 13 years after famous WT study article: 1914—The Generation That Will Not Pass Away -https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1984361 

WTJWorg basic doctrine, let say, No 1, according to article: End is Close at Hand, that was based on other basic doctrine, let say, No 2: 1914-The Generation That Will Not Pass Away, ........ are both false, because each supported the other. You are aware of fact how 1914 Generation is replaced with Overlapping Generation. 

According to your understanding what is what in this case?! Milk and solid food or "to call a spade a spade" aka false teachings?

 

Have a read of Acts 18:24-26.  Here was Apollos, a Jew, well-versed in the scriptures and although he was speaking and teaching accurately the things about Jesus, he was acquainted only with the baptism of John, so what did Aquila and Priscilla do?  they took him into their company and explained the way of God more accurately to him.

Milk = what all of us learn at the start, Solid Food = what we come to learn over time.

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1 hour ago, Emma Rose said:

Have a read of Acts 18:24-26.  Here was Apollos, a Jew, well-versed in the scriptures and although he was speaking and teaching accurately the things about Jesus, he was acquainted only with the baptism of John, so what did Aquila and Priscilla do?  they took him into their company and explained the way of God more accurately to him.

Milk = what all of us learn at the start, Solid Food = what we come to learn over time.

 Meanwhile a Jew named Apollos, a native of Alexandria, came to Ephesus. He was a learned man, with a thorough knowledge of the Scriptures.  He had been instructed in the way of the Lord, and he spoke with great fervor and taught about Jesus accurately, though he knew only the baptism of John.  He began to speak boldly in the synagogue. When Priscilla and Aquila heard him, they invited him to their home and explained to him the way of God more adequately. - NIV

Apollos already had accurate teaching/knowledge/faith about Lord. One thing is mentioned here about baptism detail that was different. He was already instructed about Jesus. It would be interesting to see what explanations came from Priscilla and Aquila that are under wording "more adequately".

Again, please consider what WT doing about "the way of God". They intrusively determine what is "the truth" about God and proclaim those who do not accept it with the name “apostates”. Perhaps JW's today need some new Priscilla and Aquila (married couple, aka female and male teachers) in WTJWorg Organization who would be able to explain the way of God, to temporary GB, more adequately/accurately.  

We can speak about two things about wording: 

     adverb: adequately:   A) to a satisfactory or acceptable extent. B) to a sufficient degree or extent
 
     adverb: accurately: A) in a way that is correct, exact, and without any mistakes B) without mistakes or errors
 

A) Was it about Priscilla's/ Aquila's ability as a speakers (educated, substantial vocabulary, etc) who know to adequately and sufficiently explain some more details of the topic to listener who already know core/basic teaching and have accurate information about Jesus?

B) Was it about Priscilla's/ Aquila's call/need to correct some wrong believes, ideas, perspective of listener?

... he knew only the baptism of John.

Issue of baptism is interesting if you have knowledge about changes on baptismal questions through WT history. If Apollos learned from this Christian couple that you need to be baptized in The Name of ..., how it is possible that JW candidate is baptized in The Name of Organization instead of Father, Son and HS? 

Question No 2: Do you understand that your dedication and baptism identify you as one of Jehovah’s Witnesses in association with God’s spirit-directed organization?  ....New: ...identifies you as one of Jehovah's Witnesses in association with Jehovah's organization?

Who today need adequate and accurate explanation? :))

 

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19 minutes ago, Srecko Sostar said:

 Meanwhile a Jew named Apollos, a native of Alexandria, came to Ephesus. He was a learned man, with a thorough knowledge of the Scriptures.  He had been instructed in the way of the Lord, and he spoke with great fervor and taught about Jesus accurately, though he knew only the baptism of John.  He began to speak boldly in the synagogue. When Priscilla and Aquila heard him, they invited him to their home and explained to him the way of God more adequately. - NIV

Apollos already had accurate teaching/knowledge/faith about Lord. One thing is mentioned here about baptism detail that was different. He was already instructed about Jesus. It would be interesting to see what explanations came from Priscilla and Aquila that are under wording "more adequately".

Again, please consider what WT doing about "the way of God". They intrusively determine what is "the truth" about God and proclaim those who do not accept it with the name “apostates”. Perhaps JW's today need some new Priscilla and Aquila (married couple, aka female and male teachers) in WTJWorg Organization who would be able to explain the way of God, to temporary GB, more adequately/accurately.  

We can speak about two things about wording: 

     adverb: adequately:   A) to a satisfactory or acceptable extent. B) to a sufficient degree or extent
 
     adverb: accurately: A) in a way that is correct, exact, and without any mistakes B) without mistakes or errors
 

A) Was it about Priscilla's/ Aquila's ability as a speakers (educated, substantial vocabulary, etc) who know to adequately and sufficiently explain some more details of the topic to listener who already know core/basic teaching and have accurate information about Jesus?

B) Was it about Priscilla's/ Aquila's call/need to correct some wrong believes, ideas, perspective of listener?

... he knew only the baptism of John.

Issue of baptism is interesting if you have knowledge about changes on baptismal questions through WT history. If Apollos learned from this Christian couple that you need to be baptized in The Name of ..., how it is possible that JW candidate is baptized in The Name of Organization instead of Father, Son and HS? 

Question No 2: Do you understand that your dedication and baptism identify you as one of Jehovah’s Witnesses in association with God’s spirit-directed organization?  ....New: ...identifies you as one of Jehovah's Witnesses in association with Jehovah's organization?

Who today need adequate and accurate explanation? :))

 

Apollos needed to adjust what he knew, don't miss the point.  

Ah well, we'll be able to find out what Priscilla and Aquila taught him in the new system.  

Are you considered an apostate?  

I understand that my dedication and baptism identifies me as one of Jehovah's Witnesses in association with God's spirit-directed organization.  A reminder to work with God's spirit-directed organization.  If I call myself one of Jehovah's Witnesses, others will reach the conclusion that I'm associated with Jehovah's organization.

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16 hours ago, Witness said:

By teaching that an organization, filled with corruption, in Satan's world will bring JWs salvation, Jesus as the only Way, Truth, and Life, has become less important. (John 14:6; 4:21-24) God's Temple priesthood has become less important. (Matt 16:18) God's Temple has no meaning, but the organization...JWs cannot live without. 

That's just the beginning of your organization's full rejection of Christ's teachings.  By looking to the brainstorm of men, your leaders have paved the way for going beyond the teachings of Christ.  

"Come to Jehovah's organization for salvation" Watchtower 1981 Nov 15 p.212

"Salvation is to be found through him alone; in all the world there is no one else whom God has given who can save us.”  Acts 4:12

"They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served something created instead of the Creator, who is praised forever. Amen." Rom 1:25

 

 

 

We are fully aware that Jehovah brings salvation and that when that time of judgement arrives, we will all be judged individually.  If there are those that someone here referred to as PIMOs (physically in, mentally out), they will be judged accordingly.  

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16 hours ago, Witness said:

By teaching that an organization, filled with corruption, in Satan's world will bring JWs salvation, Jesus as the only Way, Truth, and Life, has become less important. (John 14:6; 4:21-24) God's Temple priesthood has become less important. (Matt 16:18) God's Temple has no meaning, but the organization...JWs cannot live without. 

That's just the beginning of your organization's full rejection of Christ's teachings.  By looking to the brainstorm of men, your leaders have paved the way for going beyond the teachings of Christ.  

"Come to Jehovah's organization for salvation" Watchtower 1981 Nov 15 p.212

"Salvation is to be found through him alone; in all the world there is no one else whom God has given who can save us.”  Acts 4:12

"They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served something created instead of the Creator, who is praised forever. Amen." Rom 1:25

 

 

 

Are you considered an apostate?

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8 hours ago, Emma Rose said:

The book is absolutely right, they do not beg for money.

Maybe some brothers and sisters might come by some kind of windfall and choose to donate, that is their choice and nothing to do with you or me.  I've been a JW for .....years, certainly long enough to know what goes on and I've never been begged for what belongs to Jehovah to begin with.  

What's your story?

Still waiting for your proof concerning riches.

"Is it lawful for us to pay taxes to Caesar or not?”

23 But detecting their craftiness, He said to them, 24 “Show Me a denarius. Whose image and inscription does it have?”

“Caesar’s,” they said.

25 “Well then,” He told them, “give back to Caesar the things that are Caesar’s and to God the things that are God’s.”   Luke 20:22-25

 

Did Jesus say, take half of that coin and give it to God? No. It had Caesar’s name on it, not God’s.   Shouldn’t this tell us that money is not needed to worship God “in spirit and truth”? (John 4:23,24)  Any money that Jesus and the disciples had, was given to those in need – the poor.  Can your organization let go of all of its riches and give them to the poor? (Matt 19:21; Luke 12:33)  After Jesus left the earth, the congregations shared everything, they supported one another.  This is our template to go by.  If you had read the post link, you may have understood.  

 We convince ourselves that we need money for religious purposes, when we are told and believe leaders of a religious organization cannot feed us spiritual food without it. They cannot spread their version of “truth”.  (Matt 23:15)  “There is more money going out, than coming in”, GB Stephen Lett stated. This is manipulation, and we know it worked. People were changing their meager budgets to give to men who were already money-rich. All involved at the top, have this insatiable drive to build and expand on, their fleshly desires. (Matt 19:21-24)   They are now selling kingdom halls to free up money for larger projects.  The development of the organization is the same development as all other religious organizations. So, what sets your religions apart?  Nothing, really; expect the anointed trapped within. (Rev 20:7-9)  It tell lies also, just as other religious do.  Money is required to keep religious leadership’s power and authority stable over the “flock”; no matter if it is the Catholic church, or the Mormon church, or the Wt. organization.  The end result, is power to manipulate another person’s spiritual well-being.  The organization has always thrown up the example of the Catholic church in the faces of its members, expounding on its riches.  Well, when it comes to its own riches, they are dead quiet about it.  There is no transparency at the top.

What is the distinction between pure worship and false worship?  Pure worship does not require money. The Temple of God, the dwelling of His Spirit, does not need riches to promote “spirit and truth”.  (1 Cor 3:16,17; Eph 2:20-22)  It does not need a physical, literal mountain to worship at.  That was Jesus’ point when talking to woman at the well.  A literal mountain is seen from a distance.  Wt has built many of them, for the world to see, with riches procured from those who have fallen for their deception. (Matt 24:24; 2 Pet 1:16; 2:2) And the organization glorifies its works that they have ‘collected’ in these endeavors. (Luke 4:5-7)  Wouldn’t you agree that other religions have been successful at that also?   Jesus was saying that building organized mountains, are not the way to worship God

 Truth in Christ is light, that radiates outwardly from within. (Luke 6:45)  He told those whom HE would send, that they would be a lamp shining in a dark place, just as he was the light of the world. (Matt 5:14-16; John 1:4,5; 13:20) As the source of living water, his words were enough for us to recognize truth and he did not charge money to receive it.  He didn’t ask for donations. If your leaders were truly part of the vine of Christ, they would not expect you to give money for it either.   (John 15:1-6; 7:38)  Riches are not necessary to produce his truth.   

 Can your organization sell all of its riches and give them to the poor? (Matt 19:21)   It has become “treasure” for all who are part of it.  It is their desire of the eyes, so much so, that thousands travel many miles to flock to its ornate buildings.

You had a source of spiritual riches when knowing the two anointed ones you spoke about.  Sadly, they most likely didn’t understand the light of truth was in themselves, since they bought their spiritual provision from a false prophet. (Matt 25:1-13;;Rev 13:11,12,15-17)  They were captivated by “empty philosophy” just as you are.  (Col 2:8; 1 Tim 4:1; Rev 13:10; 16:13-16)  God’s Spirit dwelled within their heart – the spirit of truth, and His laws were written within it.  (Rom 5:5; 1 John 2:27; Heb 10:16)  Instead, they submitted to the corrupt rulership of an organization built with literal riches.  In your organization, the “living stones” of the Temple are not allowed to shed their “light” God gave them in Spirit, since it would conflict with the false light from your evil slave. (Rev 8:10,11)  Each anointed one, is a “teacher” of the law fulfilled in Christ.  Yet, those who are subservient to an evil slave are restricted from teaching Christ’s truths.  (Mal 2:7; 1 Pet 2:5,9)

 “Don’t collect for yourselves treasures (“or valuables”) on earth, where moth and rust destroy and where thieves break in and steal. 20 But collect for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust destroys, and where thieves don’t break in and steal. 21 For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.”  Matt 6:19-21

Does your organization adhere to this teaching of Jesus? Or, does it tell only its members not to do this?

8 hours ago, Emma Rose said:

Ah I see, your emphasis is on Christ alone with Jehovah in the background?

We live by Christ's teachings, that is what it means to be a Christian.

I speak of both the Father and the Son.  I listen to the words of Christ, as the Father told us to. (Matt 17:5)

Jesus answered, “If you knew the gift of God, and who is saying to you, ‘Give me a drink,’ you would ask him, and he would give you living water.”  John 4:10

John 7:37,38 - On the last and most important day of the festival, Jesus stood up and cried out, “If anyone is thirsty, he should come to me and drink! 38 The one who believes in me, as the Scripture has said, will have streams of living water flow from deep within him.” 

“Come, everyone who is thirsty,
come to the waters;
and you without money,
come, buy, and eat!
Come, buy wine and milk
without money and without cost!
Why do you spend money on what is not food,
and your wages on what does not satisfy?
Listen carefully to Me, and eat what is good,
and you will enjoy the choicest of foods.
Pay attention and come to Me;
listen, so that you will live.
I will make an everlasting covenant with you,
the promises assured to David.
Since I have made him a witness to the peoples,
a leader and commander for the peoples,
so you will summon a nation you do not know,
and nations who do not know you will run to you.
For the Lord your God,
even the Holy One of Israel,
has glorified you.”  Isa 55:1-5

 

 

 

 

 

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26 minutes ago, Emma Rose said:

I understand that my dedication and baptism identifies me as one of Jehovah's Witnesses in association with God's spirit-directed organization.  A reminder to work with God's spirit-directed organization.  If I call myself one of Jehovah's Witnesses, others will reach the conclusion that I'm associated with Jehovah's organization.

What Is Baptism?

The meaning of baptism

The Bible compares baptism to burial. (Romans 6:4; Colossians 2:12) Water baptism symbolizes a person’s dying to his past course of life and beginning a new one as a Christian dedicated to God. Baptism and the steps that lead up to it are God’s arrangement for a person to gain a clean conscience based on his faith in the sacrifice of Jesus Christ. (1 Peter 3:21) Thus, Jesus taught that his disciples must get baptized.—Matthew 28:19, 20. - https://www.jw.org/en/bible-teachings/questions/what-is-baptism/

Even WTJWorg publication explained what is purpose of baptism and in the same time contradict to themselves. Purpose of baptism for individual is not to show others to what sort of organized religion she/he belongs. Baptism not exist for purpose of registration to particular organization. Baptismal question No. 2 in WTJWorg is not in harmony with own published explanation and not in harmony with Jesus' teachings. 

Question No. 1 Have you repented of your sins, dedicated yourself to Jehovah, and accepted his way of salvation through Jesus Christ? contains elements that can be found in the Bible.

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