Jump to content
The World News Media

The Last Days that began in 1914 are now coming to their End...


BroRando
 Share

Recommended Posts

  • Member
On 8/18/2021 at 3:25 PM, Space Merchant said:

Association of Free Bible Students of France

 

On 8/18/2021 at 3:25 PM, Space Merchant said:

The New Covenant Believers (Berean Bible Students Church)

There is a parallel with the Bible Student history chart that is relevant for this discussion that does not align with some opinions here as well.

Two of the listed association renounced it’s fellowship with the Bible Student Association in 1909. The Free Bible Students. That association formed the New Covenant Believers, Christian Millennial fellowship, Free Bible Student Association.

Paul S. L. Johnson was skeptical about Russell’s teaching since 1905 and subsequently lead the Free Bible Students to depart from Russell’s teaching in 1909 as depicted in the chart. This error and lie is not noted in the Bible Student history with that point of departure, since “Henninges” wrote to Russell trying to persuade him to change certain views and when Russell refused, Henninges and the Melbourne congregation left to form their own movement which was called “ the New Covenant Fellowship” in 1909 that is not mentioned in that chart?

That chart doesn’t include how, pilgrim M.L. McPhail and A. E. Williamson from the Chicago Bible Students actually formed the “New Covenant Believers” in 1908 and started their own publication The Kingdom Scribe?

These groups are not mentioned in that chart since it try’s to depict in a simplified manner the major known groups of all the “independent Bible Students. Keep in mind, Russell didn’t agree with many of the understandings independent congregations were offering as insight. Some of that insight included Millerism, which Russell did not accept nor support.

I just thought this correction should be included here. Not everything written in WIKI should be considered factual.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 4 weeks later...

  • Views 692
  • Replies 17
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Posts

Actually it was very similar to the way Miller/Barbour/Russell calculated 1844/1874 and ultimately even 1914. The primary way of calculating 1914 was not the seven times of Leviticus 26 (which later became the 7 times of the Daniel 4 tree dream). That method was considered just a supportive but inferior method by Russell. One of the original "better and clearer" methods made use of that 538 date as seen in the William Miller chart that @Space Merchant showed above. We might be forgiven if w

You know,, that explanation seems a lot simpler than others I have heard …… But I seem to remember the scripture saying it’s a false prophet it will give you a specific date or year. I’ve also heard from possibly the smartest natural man who ever lived, Sir Isaac Newton reportedly calculated the end days to be in 2060, as early as possibly 2032, But I don’t remember how he calculated it. Sure,  Isaac  Newton’s natural intelligence was possibly greater than everybody we’ve ever met put

It's not the same, of course, but there is one surprising group that related themselves in a curious way to the Bible Students/JWs in the 1930s. But they were also very highly divergent in most ways. It was the [mostly African-American] Nation of Islam ("Black Muslim") teachings of Elijah Muhammed. Muhammed recommended to his followers that they listen to Rutherford's radio broadcasts, and he sometimes paraphrased what was in Rutherford's books. Now and then you hear some overlap in his teaching

Posted Images

  • Member
On 8/25/2021 at 8:26 AM, NoisySrecko said:

 

There is a parallel with the Bible Student history chart that is relevant for this discussion that does not align with some opinions here as well.

Two of the listed association renounced it’s fellowship with the Bible Student Association in 1909. The Free Bible Students. That association formed the New Covenant Believers, Christian Millennial fellowship, Free Bible Student Association.

Paul S. L. Johnson was skeptical about Russell’s teaching since 1905 and subsequently lead the Free Bible Students to depart from Russell’s teaching in 1909 as depicted in the chart. This error and lie is not noted in the Bible Student history with that point of departure, since “Henninges” wrote to Russell trying to persuade him to change certain views and when Russell refused, Henninges and the Melbourne congregation left to form their own movement which was called “ the New Covenant Fellowship” in 1909 that is not mentioned in that chart?

That chart doesn’t include how, pilgrim M.L. McPhail and A. E. Williamson from the Chicago Bible Students actually formed the “New Covenant Believers” in 1908 and started their own publication The Kingdom Scribe?

These groups are not mentioned in that chart since it try’s to depict in a simplified manner the major known groups of all the “independent Bible Students. Keep in mind, Russell didn’t agree with many of the understandings independent congregations were offering as insight. Some of that insight included Millerism, which Russell did not accept nor support.

I just thought this correction should be included here. Not everything written in WIKI should be considered factual.

The source was not from a wiki, it was from CSE - 

    Hello guest!

That being said, Wiki has not been factual unless it suits them. In the paradigm, they had recently changed information to misinform people, i.e. 9/11, Kabul, etc.

 

Also, this is the first time I have ever seen you make a response. I always see you in the reactions.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Member
On 8/18/2021 at 5:25 PM, Space Merchant said:

Are you aware that some other groups who believed in 1914 of Christ becoming King? I remember on CSE, someone posted possible groups other than Bible Students

Remember, though, that most of the Bible Student groups broke off long before even the Bible Students under Russell and Rutherford believed that Christ became King in 1914. Russell believed that Jesus Christ became King in 1878, and he believed this right up until he died. Rutherford believed that Jesus became King in 1878, well into the 1920's. (Remember the famous "Advertise, Advertise, Advertise" speech at Cedar Point, Ohio in 1922?) It wasn't until Rutherford died in 1942, that Fred Franz could officially change Christ's presence from 1874 until 1914. This happened in the books "The Truth Shall Make You Free" (1943) and "The Kingdom Is At Hand" (1944). As jw.org says:

*** jv chap. 28 p. 632 Testing and Sifting From Within ***
Based on the premise that events of the first century might find parallels in related events later, they also concluded that if Jesus’ baptism and anointing in the autumn of 29 C.E. paralleled the beginning of an invisible presence in 1874, then his riding into Jerusalem as King in the spring of 33 C.E. would point to the spring of 1878 as the time when he would assume his power as heavenly King.

*** jv chap. 28 p. 632 Testing and Sifting From Within ***
That 1878 was a year of significance seemed to be fortified by reference to Jeremiah 16:18 (‘Jacob’s double,’ KJ) along with calculations indicating that 1,845 years had apparently elapsed from Jacob’s death down till 33 C.E., when natural Israel was cast off, and that the double, or duplicate, of this would extend from 33 C.E. down to 1878.
Extending the parallels further, it was stated that the desolation of Jerusalem in 70 C.E. (37 years after Jesus was hailed as king by his disciples when he rode into Jerusalem) might point to 1915 (37 years after 1878) for a culmination of anarchistic upheaval that they thought God would permit as a means for bringing existing institutions of the world to their end. This date appeared in reprints of Studies in the Scriptures.

*** ka chap. 11 pp. 209-210 par. 55 “Here Is the Bridegroom!” ***
In the year 1943 the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society published the book “The Truth Shall Make You Free.” In its chapter 11, entitled “The Count of Time,” it did away with the insertion of 100 years into the period of the Judges and went according to the oldest and most authentic reading of Acts 13:20, and accepted the spelled-out numbers of the Hebrew Scriptures. This moved forward the end of six thousand years of man’s existence into the decade of the 1970’s. Naturally this did away with the year 1874 C.E. as the date of return of the Lord Jesus Christ and the beginning of his invisible presence or parousia. The millennium that was to be marked by the detaining of Satan the Devil enchained in the abyss and by the reign of the 144,000 joint heirs with Christ in heavenly glory was therefore yet in the future. What, then, about the parousia (presence) of Christ? Page 324 of the above book positively says: “The King’s presence or parousia began in 1914.” Also, in the Watchtower issue of July 15, 1949 (page 215, paragraph 22), the statement is made: “ . . . Messiah, the Son of man, came into Kingdom power A.D. 1914 and . . . this constitutes his second coming and the beginning of his second parousía or presence.”

Over the years Rutherford had made a few sometimes vague comments that the "kingdom" chronology was being adjusted, but he relied on it thoroughly for his 1925 predictions. Also, there were some more specific comments in a 1924 booklet written by Van Amburgh (not written by Rutherford) and in the Golden Age (edited by Woodworth) that made it pretty clear that this change from 1878 to 1914 was in the works. 

But the publications quoted on jw.org showed that the old 1874/1878 chronology was not completely removed until 1943. During those 60-some years from 1878 to 1943, all the Bible Student spin-offs and break-aways had already left. In fact most of them had left between 1917 and 1929, when apparently less than a quarter of the original Russellite Bible Students were still associated with the Watch Tower Society. Note these (generally factual) ideas from the resources quoted in the Wikipedia footnotes:

The Bible Student movement is a

    Hello guest!
    Hello guest!
    Hello guest!
    Hello guest!
movement that emerged from the teachings and ministry of
    Hello guest!
, also known as Pastor Russell. Members of the movement have variously referred to themselves as Bible Students, International Bible Students, Associated Bible Students, or Independent Bible Students. The origins of the movement are associated with . . .Russell's teachings.

A number of schisms developed within the congregations of Bible Students associated with the Watch Tower Society between 1909 and 1932.

    Hello guest!
    Hello guest!
The most significant split began in 1917 following the election of
    Hello guest!
. . .

Thousands of members left congregations of Bible Students associated with the Watch Tower Society throughout the 1920s . . . . William Schnell, author and former Jehovah's Witness, claims that three quarters of the original Bible Students who had been associating with the Watch Tower Society in 1919 had left by 1931.

    Hello guest!
    Hello guest!
    Hello guest!
In 1930 Rutherford stated that "the total number of those who have withdrawn from the Society... is comparatively large."
    Hello guest!

Between 1918 and 1929, several factions formed their own independent fellowships, including the Stand Fast Movement, the

    Hello guest!
, the
    Hello guest!
founded by
    Hello guest!
, and the
    Hello guest!
. These groups range from conservative, claiming to be Russell's true followers, to more liberal, claiming that Russell's role is not as important as once believed.
    Hello guest!
Rutherford's faction of the movement retained control of the Watch Tower Society
    Hello guest!
and adopted the name
    Hello guest!
in July 1931.
    Hello guest!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Member

I think the real question is, if a person of good heart decided he wanted to become one of Jehovah’s Witness, do you have to really believe all these superfluous things that are of no consequence in order to be baptized as one of Jehovah’s Witnesses?

Would you have to give lip service to these things which are in retrospect blatantly wrong?

Would you get a pass from the elders for things which in good conscious to you seem silly and stupid, if you firmly believed in all the core beliefs and wanted to dedicate your life to Jehovah God, through Christ?

……. what I am afraid of is that the travesty is, that we already know the answers to the above questions.

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Member
2 hours ago, Space Merchant said:

The source was not from a wiki, it was from CSE - 

    Hello guest!

CSE is well-indexed by Google, but the closest comment I could find in this regard was the following on CSE:

Baptist William Miller came up with calculations pointing to 1844 as the second coming of Christ Jesus. Seventh Day Adventists, along with members of the Bahai’ Faith, also point to October 1844 as being highly significant with regard to end-time prophecy. As far as I am aware, the only other group apart from Jehovah’s Witnesses who still cling to 1914 are the survivors of the original Bible Students who voted with their feet and left the organisation after the second President, Rutherford, introduced the name Jehovah’s Witnesses.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Member
16 hours ago, Pudgy said:

I think the real question is, if a person of good heart decided he wanted to become one of Jehovah’s Witness, do you have to really believe all these superfluous things that are of no consequence in order to be baptized as one of Jehovah’s Witnesses?

The truth is you have to kiss the butt of the Elders to be able to get baptised. The Elders rule over the congregations.

The congregation i was in when I wanted to get baptised, was ruled over by two Elders, a father and son.  The son decided that I wasn't ready, so his father agreed. They STOPPED me getting baptised. But I was humble then, I just said ok. Later when the son wanted me to get baptised i actually didn't want to. But once again I was humble, and I did as I was told, and got baptised. 

So I know first hand (from more than one experience) that the Elders have complete control over the congregants, and they love every minute of it. But of course they will be judged for it. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 Share





×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

Terms of Service Confirmation Terms of Use Privacy Policy Guidelines We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.