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JW Core Beliefs .... As Applied

I carefully read Anna's list of JW core beliefs, and responded "Amen", although about some I have been thinking about all the extenuating circumstances that might affect the absoluteness of some of them.

For Example, in U.S. Law there are many things that are felonies, but State Supreme Courts have ruled that although these felonies are lawfully prosecuted, the individual specifics make them AS APPLIED to certain cases make the application of those laws un-Constitutional, either by State, or Federal Constitutions.

In other words, the specific circumstances of the crime determines whether or not those laws can be applied against a specific person, in a specific set of circumstances.

...... Lets suppose a family of five, where all the family members are Jehovah's Witnesses, and the mother has tired of taking care of her three young children, puts them in a car, and deliberately drives that car into a lake, and drowns them. 

It's first-degree premeditated murder.

She is convicted in a court of law, and is sentenced to three life sentences with no possibility of parole.

QUESTION # 1 :     Is the husband, whose three children were murdered by his wife, expected to live his life alone, and never re-marry?

QUESTION #2:      If he does, say after a dozen years, remarry, will he be disfellowshipped?

 

 

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You wouldn’t know a waste of time if one bit you in the rear end. Now here’s a waste of time: ”Good morning, brothers. Our first talk today is on the subject of dress and grooming.”

Okay…I’ll shut up now …😉

To the similar-person who declines to speak with me, saying “No, thanks—I’m CHRISTIAN!” I reply,  “Actually, only a Christian would do what I am doing. Frankly, I’m a little surprised that you are not doing it yourself.”* (Watch that smug smile fade.) *to be used ONLY in cases of blatant smug superiority, (you can smell it) NOT in the case of sincere misunderstanding.

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    Hello guest!
 Now we know that the Law is fine if one applies it properly,
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 recognizing that law is made, not for a righteous man, but for those who are lawless
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and rebellious, ungodly and sinners, disloyal
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and profane, murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, manslayers,
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 sexually immoral people,
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men who practice homosexuality,
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kidnappers, liars, perjurers,
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and everything else that is in opposition to the wholesome
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teaching
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 according to the glorious good news of the happy God, with which I was entrusted. - 1 Timothy 1:8-10

Adding from the secular realm, Goedel's Incompleteness Theorem which says essentially that w/in any given system of axioms there are statements which may be true which one is unable to demonstrate to be true w/o reference to additional axioms outside this system I'd say the legal take on any given specific circumstance can never provide a complete answer w/o reference to other axioms outside the accepted set.

This is not to negate the general principles regarding the sanctity of marriage, nor did Moses who gave an allowance of divorcing on account of "the hardness of the heart" violate said sanctity, but w/in the imperfect realm of humans one could argue on legal grounds that the wilful murder of ones own children would be of sufficient moral reprehensibleness to allow a scriptural divorce on the part of the innocent mate.

I could easily rabbinicize any number of scriptures which would allow for a divorce by following the general principles on which these are based.

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13 hours ago, Pudgy said:

QUESTION # 1 :     Is the husband, whose three children were murdered by his wife, expected to live his life alone, and never re-marry?

QUESTION #2:      If he does, say after a dozen years, remarry, will he be disfellowshipped?

 

Your question reminds me of the pharisees. They came to him and asked him if a women had had 7 husbands which one will she belong to in the resurrection. 

 

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   Acts 15 : 28 & 29 
"For it seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us, to lay upon you no further burden, except these necessary things: to abstain from things sacrificed to idols, and from blood, and from what is strangled, and from sexual immorality. Keeping yourselves from these, you will do well. Farewell."

The rest is up to a person's own conscience, because as you've mentioned the law of the land is different in different countries, and then the law itself is different in different cases.  

But not according to the GB / Watchtower dictators, who love to have control over people. 

(I haven't seen @Anna's list of Core beliefs, shame, but probably because she has blocked me) 

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6 hours ago, Arauna said:
20 hours ago, Pudgy said:

QUESTION # 1 :     Is the husband, whose three children were murdered by his wife, expected to live his life alone, and never re-marry?

QUESTION #2:      If he does, say after a dozen years, remarry, will he be disfellowshipped?

 

Your question reminds me of the pharisees. They came to him and asked him if a women had had 7 husbands which one will she belong to in the resurrection. 

The difference is that my two questions have very real application, and very real consequences right NOW!

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6 hours ago, Patiently waiting for Truth said:

(I haven't seen @Anna's list of Core beliefs, shame, but probably because she has blocked me) 

I haven't blocked you. I posted the core beliefs HERE

But I will list them here too, since this a relevant topic here.

God. We worship the one true and Almighty God, the Creator, whose name is 

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. (
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) He is the God of Abraham, Moses, and Jesus.—
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Bible. We recognize 

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 to humans. (
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) We base our beliefs on all 66 of its books, which include both the “Old Testament” and the “New Testament.” Professor Jason D. BeDuhn aptly described it when he wrote that Jehovah’s Witnesses built “their system of belief and practice from the raw material of the Bible without predetermining what was to be found there.” 
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While we accept the entire Bible, we are 
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. We recognize that parts of the Bible are written in 
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 and are not to be understood literally.—
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Jesus. We follow the teachings and example of Jesus Christ and honor him as our Savior and as the 

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. (
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) Thus, we are 
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) However, we have learned from the Bible that Jesus is not Almighty God and that there is no Scriptural basis for the 
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.—
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The Kingdom of God. This is a real government in heaven, not a condition 

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. It will replace human governments and accomplish 
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) It will take these actions soon, for Bible prophecy indicates that we are living in “
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.”—
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Jesus is the King of 
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 in heaven. He began ruling in 
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.—
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Salvation. Deliverance from sin and death is possible through the 

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. (
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) To benefit from that sacrifice, people must not only exercise faith in Jesus but also change their course of life and get 
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) A person’s works prove that his faith is alive. (
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) However, 
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 cannot be earned—it comes through “the undeserved kindness of God.”—
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Heaven. Jehovah God, Jesus Christ, and the faithful angels reside in the 

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 (
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) A relatively small number of people—144,000—will be resurrected to 
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 to rule with Jesus in the 
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Earth. God created the earth to be mankind’s eternal home. (

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) God will bless obedient people with perfect health and everlasting life in an 
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.—
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Evil and suffering. These began when one of God’s angels rebelled. (

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) This angel, who after his rebellion was called 
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 persuaded the first human couple to join him, and the consequences have been disastrous for their descendants. (
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) In order to settle the moral issues raised by Satan, God has allowed 
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, but He will not permit them to continue forever.

Death. 

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 pass out of existence. (
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) They do not suffer in a 
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 of torment.
God will bring billions back from death by means of 
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) However, those who refuse to learn God’s ways after being raised to life will be destroyed forever with no hope of a resurrection.—
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Family. We adhere to God’s 

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 as the union of one man and one woman, with sexual immorality being the only valid basis for 
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) We are convinced that the wisdom found in 
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 to succeed.—
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Our worship. We do not venerate 

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 or any other 
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) Key aspects of our worship include the following:

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 to God.—
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Reading and 

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.—
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Meditating on what we 

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.—
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 to pray, study the Bible, sing, express our faith, and encourage fellow Witnesses and others.—
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 the “good news of the Kingdom.”—
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.

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.—
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Constructing and maintaining 

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 and other facilities used to further our worldwide Bible educational work.—
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Sharing in 

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.—
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Our organization. We are 

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, each of which is overseen by a body of 
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. However, the elders 
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, and they are unsalaried. (
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) We 
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, and no collections are ever taken at our meetings. (
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) All our activities are supported by 
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.
The 
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, a small group of mature Christians who serve at our world headquarters, provides direction for Jehovah’s Witnesses worldwide.—
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Our unity. We are globally united in our beliefs. (

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) We also work hard to have 
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. (
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) Our unity allows for personal choice, though. Each Witness makes decisions in harmony with his or her own 
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.—
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Our conduct. We strive to 

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 in all our actions. (
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) We 
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, including the misuse of blood by 
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. (
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) We are peaceful and 
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) We respect the government where we live and obey its laws as long as these do not call on us to disobey God’s laws.—
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Our relationships with others. Jesus commanded: “You must love your neighbor as yourself.” He also said that Christians “are no part of the world.” (

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) So we try to “work what is good toward all,” yet 
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 in political affairs and 
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. (
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) However, we respect the choices that others make in such matters.—
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.

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3 hours ago, Anna said:

But I will list them here too, since this a relevant topic here.

Not that it should matter too much to anyone here, but just to get a discussion started, I will happily state that I am in 100% agreement with all the scriptures in this list. And am in 100% agreement with at least 990 of the 997 words (counted by copying the content portion of this to 

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).

I found only 3 things I'd take a small issue with:

  1. "Professor Jason D. BeDuhn aptly described it when he wrote that" I agree with this point, but I'm embarrassed that such an important list (for our purposes) has the name and opinion of a "secular" professor in it. Jason DeBuhn's name has been on this list since at least 2015 and has never been removed. It's inconsistent with the rest of the list, which otherwise only highlights a simple Bible basis, not some scholar.
  2. "A person’s works prove that his faith is alive." This isn't necessarily true. A person can have works that look like they are motivated by faith, but are motivated by self-righteousness, a competitive spirit, a desire to earn salvation and be rewarded accordingly, blindly following men, etc., just to mention some common examples.   (Matthew 7:22) . . .Many will say to me in that day: ‘Lord, Lord, did we not . . . perform many powerful works in your name?’
  3. "He began ruling in 
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    ." Hmmm. I've probably said before that I can't find this one in the Bible. (And it's just about the only sentence that has no scripture to back it up.)  I wish it had said: "We believe Jesus is now ruling invisibly from heaven." Or, "We believe that we now live in a time when Jesus, from his heavenly throne, is giving special attention to matters of the Kingdom on earth."

In addition to those, there are a couple of other things, much less important to me, that I could see changing in the future, and the change wouldn't cause a problem or inconsistency either way. For example, I could see the possibility that the "144,000" is a symbolic number, and might even represent the full number of natural Jewish Christians as easily as it could represent the full number of spiritual Jews. But the list explicitly allows for some expressions to be interpreted symbolically, anyway, so it wouldn't bother me either way to use the expression, "The 144,000 will rule in heaven."  ["We recognize that parts of the Bible are written in 

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 and are not to be understood literally.—
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.
"]

It's also possible that "blood" in Acts 15 is a symbol for "bloodguilt," such as murder, manslaughter, war, etc., just as "idols" can include things like "gluttony" (Phil 3:19) "greediness" (Col 3:5) and even "pleasing men" (Eph 6:6,7; Gal 1:10)  Personally, for my own conscience, I'm fine with the idea that abstaining from blood transfusions is one way that we abstain from blood. But there's a chance that we as individuals and as an organization should not be imposing this as a rule on the Bible-trained consciences of others.

That idea might already be covered, even if unintentionally, by the very nice idea expressed here: "Our unity allows for personal choice, though. Each Witness makes decisions in harmony with his or her own 

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."

Outside of those few comments, I would be willing to die for the other 990 words out of the 997.

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1 hour ago, JW Insider said:

Professor Jason D. BeDuhn aptly described it when he wrote that" I agree with this point, but I'm embarrassed that such an important list (for our purposes) has the name and opinion of a "secular"

Whoa! I almost said something so dumb that PSomH could call ME a dodo and I would have little defense. 

My quick impression was that if was Jason who agreed, but was embarrassed, etc, leading me to almost ask: I never thought he was a Witness—is he? But after reading the remark 200 time, I see it is you who agree but is embarrassed. 

I dunno. Yeah, I see your point, it is a little odd there, but it is just an appeal to testimonial. After all, if they quoted Bro Splane, people would say, “Well, of course, he would say that.

There is a Russian professor they could have used to, Gordienko? I think, who says: When the authorities make accusations against the Witnesses, the do not realize they are making accusations against the Bible itself.’ He has the advantage of being dead, so the Russian authorities cannot arrest him.

 

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4 hours ago, JW Insider said:

but just to get a discussion started

Speaking of names and opinions, perhaps the authors of this text should list the accompanying comments of each of the GB members, in the list of "core beliefs / doctrines". Why? Because their names and accompanying comments would give “credibility” to every essential point of belief. After all, they are the “guardians of the doctrine,” as Mr. Jackson told the ARC. “Guardians of doctrines” have “power,” since 1919, to shape doctrines and modify them as needed. And that is their practice to this day. Which will continue in the future, as you noticed very well.

Such an even clearer role (more clearly visible to the ordinary believer) for the FDS aka GB as the Main Ecclesiastical Governing Body*, among other things, would have the effect of minimizing the role of the individual who, due to his "immature" biblical conscience and "weak" theocratic knowledge, could put in question his own future and exercise bad influence on the “spirituality” of other members.

“Guardians of doctrine” have in the past, for example, celebrated Christ’s birthday. Then they decided it was a pagan custom. How could this become a pagan custom, when the angels in heaven sang and rejoiced at the moment of Jesus ’birth? Yes, no child born into JW families will become a future “king”. But JW parents can celebrate a child’s birth with faith and hope that it is their child who will become a good human (or at least a future member of the JW church - a little irony).

The "guardians of the doctrine" support the division into clergy and laity. They have confirmed this with statements before the courts, and they confirm this with the practice in assemblies around the world. They are declaratively against it and this teaching is not on the list of "core doctrines", but it is widely used in the daily practice of religion. It is indeed manipulative of GB to oppose the clergy-laity relationship and this they support by biblical passages and quotations and interpretations of those same passages. On the other hand, they makes abundant use of the same form/model that they names and declares unbiblical.

I think many of you will agree that the List of “core doctrines” that is offered is neither accurate nor complete.

*Cobb v. Brede (California Superior Court, San Mateo County February 22, 2012) ("I am general counsel for the National Organization of Jehovah's Witnesses out of Brooklyn, New York. ... We are a hierarchical religion structured just like the Catholic Church").

California’s appeals court provides a generally accurate description of the Jehovah’s Witnesses hierarchy. The relevant upshot is that, “[e]lders are the highest authority at the congregational level,” and, thus, are the Jehovah’s Witnesses equivalent of Roman Catholic priests.5 In order to be appointed an elder, a person must first be a ministerial servant in IAN S. MILLICAN 3 ESTABLISHING DUTY IN CHILD SEX ABUSE CASES AGAINST THE JEHOVAH’S WITNESSES BY IAN S. MILLICAN 2. ESTABLISHING DUTY IN CHILD SEX ABUSE CASES AGAINST THE JEHOVAH’S WITNESSES 4. GOING REMOTE: 2021 EMERGING TRENDS FOR MEDICAL MALPRACTICE LITIGATION 5. ROBINS KAPLAN FILES INJECTAFER CASE 6. NEWS 7. RECOGNITION AND CASE RESULTS good standing.6 Top-down, the Jehovah’s Witnesses, or, “Watchtower,” as the parent-organization is known, is controlled by the Governing Body of eight elders, essentially the board of directors for Watchtower.7 - 

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Here, Petitioner Watchtower sought to protect confidential, intra-faith communications among clergy (elders) regarding Bible-based religious appointment processes, some of which included congregants’ penitential confessions and all of which impacted privacy rights of non-parties..............

...........J.W. asserted she requested Watchtower produce various documents, and Watchtower refused citing the clergy-penitent privilege.

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      Jesus said to him: “Why do you call Me good? Nobody is good except one, God.” (
      Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. ) "Father, if you want to, remove this cup from me. Nevertheless, let, not my will, but yours take place." (Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. )

      Question: He said to them: “You, though, who do you say I am?” (Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. )

      What was Peter's Answer? “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.” (Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. ) Peter identifies Jesus as “the Christ” (Greek, ho Khri·stosʹ), a title equivalent to “the Messiah” (from Hebrew ma·shiʹach), both meaning “Anointed One.” Here “Christ” is preceded by the Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content.  in Greek, evidently as a way of emphasizing Jesus’ office as the Messiah.—See Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. .

      The Apostle Paul also gives witness about the Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content.  . "For there stood by me this night the angel of God, whose I am, and whom I serve," (Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. )

      "Praised be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ" (Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. ) Why not study the following Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. ? Once the Son of Man set's you free, you really are Free! (Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. )

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    • By BroRando
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      Beautiful isn't it? How do you react when seeing 
      Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content.  Are you overcome with a wondrous and overwhelming awe? If you were to enter into a Personal Relationship with someone whom you deemed special or important, what is the first thing you would want to know about that Person? Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content.

      "The name of Jehovah is a strong tower. Into it the righteous one runs and receives protection." (Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. ) "At that time those who fear Jehovah spoke with one another, each one with his companion, and Jehovah kept paying attention and listening. And a book of remembrance was written before him for those fearing Jehovah and for those meditating on his name." (Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content.

      "Symʹe·on has related thoroughly how God for the first time turned his attention to the nations to take out of them a people for his name." (Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. ) "I am the One who declared and saved and made known When there was no foreign god among you. So you are my witnesses, declares Jehovah, and I am God." (Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. )

      "During his life on earth, Christ offered up supplications and also petitions, with strong outcries and tears, to the One who was able to save him out of death, and he was favorably heard for his godly fear." (Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. )

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    • By Witness
      How do we define the common phrase, “power trip”?
      “A sustained and often aggressive exercise of power over others in order to boost one's stature or feeling of self-worth”
      I want to share the following perspective of privileges and entitlement in the organization, made by an exjw on reddit. He described the progressive reality of power and authority, harboring in the hearts of the governing leaders. (Prov 25:6; Rom 2:8; Gal 6:3) 
      These leaders presently ‘exercise all authority’ over the organization’s operations, yet the elder body is also given great authority over the anointed, replacing God’s chosen priests as the organization’s counterfeit priesthood. (Rev 13:1,2,5-7,11,12,15-17) (Matt 24:15,16; Mark 13:14; 2 Thess 2:3,4; Dan 11:36) (1 Pet 2:5,9; 1 Cor 3:16,17; Ezek 44:6-9)
      This person relates the pervasive drive for men especially, to "reach out", be recognized and respected on all levels of the organization. The demands and expectations for select JWs to succeed in supporting the organization, are sourced with the men at the top. Although this progressive learning tool of control is exercised upon all JWs, it is an especially blasphemous act against God’s holy anointed priesthood. (Matt 24:24,25; 48-51; Rev 13:5-7; 11:1,2) 
      “The devil led him up to a high place and showed him in an instant all the kingdoms of the world. 6 And he said to him, “I will give you all their authority and splendor; it has been given to me, and I can give it to anyone I want to. 7 If you worship me, it will all be yours.” Luke 4:5,6
      _____________
      Did you ever “serve” as an attendant at conventions? What about working the parking lot at assemblies or memorial? Did you or your dad routinely travel to other halls to give a Sunday talks? Did you ever work safety at quickbuilds? Did you ever have a part on the stage at an assembly or convention? Were you ever in a drama? Did you ever get to pass the emblems (or even partake)? If you got baptized, do you remember sitting in the special section that morning? Did you ever get announced as an MS, elder or pioneer?
      If you can answer yes to any of the above questions, you may recall the sense of pride you felt. Even if you’re a lowly teenager running mics or controlling the sound, any position of responsibility comes with a small (but noteworthy) power trip. Imagine, for a brief moment, an elder, the COBE, the circuit overseer or even a visiting bethelite pulls into the parking lot at memorial or circuit assembly and for one small moment, it is you who has all the power and control. You have the orange vest, the orange cone, the straw hat and the honorable Attendant badge. They must drive and park where you tell them to. They will obey your command. For a small snapshot in time, even they must follow your leadership and direction—even tho they represent god on earth. But for that moment, they heed your direction when parking a car. They need your microphone to share their wisdom. The anointed cannot partake unless you hand them the emblems. They cannot speak while you’re on the platform, even if you’re simply reading the WT. YOU have all the power and control. YOU command everyone’s attention. The day you got baptized, it was YOU everyone looked at in the special section. It was you they sang and applauded for. When you (or your dad) visited another hall to deliver a Sunday talk, you already felt special. They lined up to meet you. You met new friends. You were automatically trusted as “exemplary” and even given “hospitality.”
      And even tho you may have only been a teenager at the time, or if you were an adult MS or elder, you were likely nothing special outside of the empowering moments those titles brought with them—but for those brief moments, even YOU, an uneducated window washer, enjoyed the taste of control and power. The highest ranking JW had to park where you told them. They couldn’t enter a quickbuild without safety gear and you had the power to stop them. They couldn’t interrupt your talk or take your spotlight the moment your appointment was announced. Yet, outside those windowless walls, you were nobody.
      IMAGINE the sense of power and control the GB feels all the time, everywhere they go. They brag about their humble lifestyles (and it’s true, their lodgings at HQ are ok at best—nothing spectacular, in fact most of our homes are probably nicer than their rooms are), but they never lose that feeling of ultimate authority. Everywhere they go, they’re met with reverence. Everything they say is spoken as god’s mouthpiece. Every visit they make, every broadcast they host, they are revered.
      What’s their motivation, you ask? Just try to remember those brief moments when you had title, rank and authority over others and ask yourself what you’d do if that was the way you lived 24/7.
       
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      “Should We Obey Men?”  
      Why Jesus came to earth / Last World Power over the Chosen Ones / "Iron" and "Clay"  
      “Who Really is?” 
       
       
       

    • By BroRando
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      Jehovah's Day is a 'timed event' that will soon bring an end to all wickedness. (
      Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. ) The fulfillment of this prophecy was unknown to the angels and even Jesus Christ himself was not privy to the timing of this Great Day. (Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. )

      Jehovah's Day is well prophesied in the Bible throughout the scriptures. It is linked to the Conclusion of Satan's Wicked and Violent World during the Last Days. Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content.  is a transition period that brings an End to the Last Days and ushers in Christ's Millennial Reign as Christ's Political Enemies are brought to nothing under his feet.

      Can we expect Jehovah's Day to begin after the sealing process ends? Yes, we can. Matter of fact, the scriptures counsel us to Keep in Expectation of it! We read: “The vision is yet for the appointed time, and it keeps panting on to the end, and it will not tell a lie. Even if it should delay, keep in expectation of it; for it will without fail come true. It will not be late.” (Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. ) What does this tell us? Jehovah's Day will not be late, we may not recognize it at first. After all, the flesh melting off the bones and eyeballs dropping out of the eye sockets is figurative speech as to what happens to someone who has been pitched into Gehenna or the fiery furnace. They die the second death without knowing it, an everlasting death of destruction. Oh... they will become hostile and vindictive, for Jesus states, Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content.

      The wicked simply die off, the scriptures go on and tell us, "All the peoples of the earth will have to see that Jehovah’s name has been called upon you, and they will be afraid of you." (Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. ) We have no need to worry about a date, nor do we need to worry about losing our Kingdom Halls. We worship Jehovah with spirit and truth. (Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. )

      Nevertheless, the hour is coming, and it is now, when the true worshippers will worship the Father with spirit and truth, for indeed, the Father is looking for ones like these to worship him." (Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. ) Serve Jehovah faithfully to your end and you won't have an end. Keep walking and remember Lot's wife.... Ready or Not, Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content.  is coming...

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    • Guest Nicole
      By Guest Nicole
      ¡Despertad! 8 de Octubre de 1982.pdf

    • By Witness
      A comment from another forum:
      ("pimi" - physically in, mentally in...the organization)
      "My pimi aunt, also elder’s wife, is a good person and cares for people. Some of her kids have left the Borg and she treats them all equally and kindly. She hasn’t shunned members of the family who did get dfd. So at one convention when a sister we all knew was being interviewed on stage about her association with her own disfellowshipped son the sister said: “to me, he’s dead”. Enter major applause from the audience (nuts!!!) and one absolutely horrified and appalled elders-wife auntie. She called me after and told me about it and was just shocked someone could say that about their own kids. I was pimi at the time myself and we both HATED it and Thought it was crazy and what made her equally mad was the mega applause. Sickening! I had to share this story of these brainwashed cult people because any normal person with a heart sees how wrong this is. What was the scripture again about how people won’t have natural affection in the time of the end again? 🤔"
       Who is benefitting from this “loving provision” of treating someone as dead?  I suppose only those who are in "good standing" in the organization.  The disfellowshipped one certainly cannot be the recipient of love, if no one acknowledges his or her existence.   
      What a wicked twist the "spirit-breathed" Wt. has put on the meaning of Christ’s love.   (Matt 7:1; Rev 13:15)
       
       
      At dawn he appeared again in the temple courts, where all the people gathered around him, and he sat down to teach them. 3 The teachers of the law and the Pharisees brought in a woman caught in adultery. They made her stand before the group 4 and said to Jesus, “Teacher, this woman was caught in the act of adultery. 5 In the Law Moses commanded us to stone such women. Now what do you say?” 6 They were using this question as a trap, in order to have a basis for accusing him.
      But Jesus bent down and started to write on the ground with his finger. 7 When they kept on questioning him, he straightened up and said to them, “Let any one of you who is without sin be the first to throw a stone at her.” 8 Again he stooped down and wrote on the ground.
      9 At this, those who heard began to go away one at a time, the older ones first, until only Jesus was left, with the woman still standing there. 10 Jesus straightened up and asked her, “Woman, where are they? Has no one condemned you?”
      11 “No one, sir,” she said.
      “Then neither do I condemn you,” Jesus declared. “Go now and leave your life of sin.”  John 8:2-11
       
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    • By Witness
      They state they were appointed as the “faithful and discreet slave”.
      A question frequently asked, since they are not inspired, how did they receive this message from God, to know they should appoint themselves in this position?  Use some logical reasoning; they compare themselves to not only the apostles but even Moses – all inspired men, prophets and teachers chosen personally by God and Jesus Christ.  It takes total arrogance to make the assumption that God chose them to lead 8 million people, without inspiration from the Holy Spirit.  It takes total blindness for these people to believe that He has!  (Exod 3:10-12; John 15:16; Acts 9:15) (Mark 4:12; 1 Cor 2:14)
      Since they are not inspired, they lean on their “Helpers” to share the workload of putting food on the spiritual table. (Ezek 44:6-9)  Are the Helpers inspired?  Someone has to be, in order to live up to their proclamation that God directs the organization. 
      What about the anointed ones in the congregations? (Male or female – God is not partial, Gal 3:28; Rom 2:29)  Could they have some “inspiration” to share?  Do they know truth?  (1 John 2:27)
      If they did act on the spirit given them through an anointing, what happens if their heart tells them that the GB are wrong in their teachings? (2 Cor 1:21,22) What happens if they choose to speak up, to defend truth?  To defend Jesus Christ as their Head? (Eph 4:25; 1 Tim 2:5-7)  They are ignored, silenced, and very possibly, disfellowshipped. (Ray Franz, as an example – one of probably thousands over the last century)  (John 16:2; Rev 13:15)  There is a huge army in place to take care of these matters - men, not appointed by God although JWs in general believe that once again, God even directs their appointment. (Dan 7:25; 8:24; Rev 9:4;13:7)  Can’t you see? The appointments by men are preferred over the authentic anointed appointments by God.
      Let me tell you why God has nothing to do with appointing elders. When my husband was approached to be an elder, the body wrote the Society of their consideration; but also to let them know he wore a beard for medical reasons. (These men were desperate for help) The letter they received back said it was up to the body of elders to appoint him, and to be aware of possible consequences for their choice.  There was no Holy Spirit involved, no prayer uttered; only the opinion of men from the top, down to the congregation level just like it happens in any other organization.  Up to that point I had believed that the GB actually prayed over each elder appointment, and received the answer from God. In fact, an elder told me this.  Don’t be fooled, JWs.  God would not choose men to serve Him, when His priests were anointed specifically to fill the role as shepherds. (Mal 2:7; John 21:17; Matt 28:16-20; John 15:8; 1 Pet 2:5,9; Rom 12:1; Gal 6:9)  
       “But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to what we have preached to you, a curse be on him!  As we have said before, I now say again: If anyone is preaching to you a gospel contrary to what you received, a curse be on him!”  Gal 1:8,9
       
      If the GB was directed by Christ’s Holy Spirit, the Spirit would aid in leading the anointed members together, to teach truth.  Jesus performed miracles while on the earth, couldn’t he do the same from heaven?  The GB cannot claim to be a “faithful slave” of Christ, yet also reject their own brotherhood.  (1 Cor 12; 1 John 3:10-12; Matt 24:48-51)
      “Be of the same mind toward one another. Do not set your mind on high things, but associate with the humble. Do not be wise in your own opinion.”  Rom 12:16
      “God resists the proud,
      But gives grace to the humble.”
      6 Therefore humble yourselves under the mighty hand of God, that He may exalt you in due time” 1 Pet 5b,6
       Or, are some of these men total imposters in more ways than one.  If anointed, they have become “Israel’s” harlots by transgressing their covenant of life in Christ. (Rev 17:1-6)  Yet, perhaps some are total “Gentile” imposters, never to have been anointed to begin with – never appointed as a priest of God. (1 Pet 2:5,9)
      And no -  if they reject their anointed brotherhood, refusing to acknowledge each member as necessary; refusing to acknowledge that this anointed body when working together would soar in speaking God’s truths, they are no longer under the covenant of life.  They have disconnected from the Head and become the “head” of the body they have chosen, the “Gentile” elders.  (Rev 11:1,2)
      “ Let no one cheat you of your reward, taking delight in false humility and worship of angels, intruding into those things which he has not seen, vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind, 19 and not holding fast to the Head, from whom all the body, nourished and knit together by joints and ligaments, grows with the increase that is from God.”  Col 2:16-19
      Wake up, JWs.   These men have shoved the anointed in Christ, into a back corner. (Isa 51:23)  Selfish power, not love, is their driving force in this organization.  Power over you, and especially over “Israel”. (Ezek 21:21,22,24,25) Deceit, not truth, is the driving spirit behind this organization and its leadership. (Matt 24:24) It is established on the ground, and in the realm where politics, riches, power and authority has become the bedrock of the GB’s “inspiration”. What spiritual entity offers these things? (Luke 4:5-7; Rev 9:1; 13:11) What spiritual entity would just as soon destroy Christ, and those part of his Body? (Rev 12:3,4,7) Can’t you see that this signifies a spiritual war based on deceit? (Eph 6:12;Rev 13:5-7; 16:13-16)  The holy priesthood has been absorbed into a nation and has lost its identity.  It appears that they would rather remain captive to falsehoods, than to open the door for Christ. ( Matt 25:6;Rev 3:18-20) Oh, how I wish all of you would leave darkness behind; and simply, turn to the light and truth of Jesus Christ.  (John 14:6)
      The opposition that I usually receive to comments such as this, is in defense of the GB and the organization; whereas the Temple priesthood means little to nothing. (1 Cor 3:16,17; Eph 2:20-22) There is no defense given for Jesus Christ. (Dan 8:25) What sort of heavy spiritual blindness are JWs under that would cause them to exalt a man-made corporation, over a heavenly Temple/House built by God? (Rev 13:1,2,4; 16:13-16) The pride that JWs carry in their heart, in believing that doctrine of men and proven falsehoods can be called truth…believing that God has blessed their efforts through manpower (no inspiration by God remember? Zech 4:6)...while His house/dwelling/Temple of “living stones” lies in ruins, will ultimately bring them to their knees.  (Ezek 21:6,7; Luke 19:41-44; 2 Thess 2:9-12; Rev 18:4-8)
      You reside in the “home” of the man of lawlessness – the disgusting thing that “sits” in the Temple of God and “tramples”/rules over the anointed priesthood. How I wish you could perceive this danger.  (Matt 24:15,16; 2 Thess 2:3,4)
      “But we have renounced the hidden things of shame, not walking in craftiness nor handling the word of God deceitfully, but by manifestation of the truth commending ourselves to every man’s conscience in the sight of God. 3 But even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing, 4 whose minds the god of this age has blinded, who do not believe, lest the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine on them. 5 For we do not preach ourselves, but Christ Jesus the Lord, and ourselves your bondservants for Jesus’ sake. 6 For it is the God who commanded light to shine out of darkness, who has shone in our hearts to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.” 2 Cor 4:2-6
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    • By Witness
      "This is my first video. I'm not sure how many videos I will do. I hope to reach out to Jehovah's Witnesses and former JW's in the Missouri area. My reason to do these videos is not to hurt anyone but to bring awareness to the issues that face JW's that are in a high control group."
      Please, hear his words.  Elders are realizing that as "shepherds", compassion must be regulated according to men, and not according to the Bible.  
       
       
       
    • By Witness
      "Will there be a disfellowshipping? Bethelites are facing a crisis of conscience with the revelation that one of their prominent Governing Body members will no longer be associated with their organization."
      Premiers at 4:00 EST
       
       
       
       
    • By Srecko Sostar
      Part 1.  In this part we will meet few quotes in article from one WT magazine which describes administrative functions in WTJWorg past. Many of them stayed till today. 
      Please be free to comment. 
       
      Following Faithful Shepherds with Life in View - 
      Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. This means we must prove our faith by our course of action, by the things we do. It means that righteous requirements of the King Jesus Christ must be met.......Therefore, in submitting to Jehovah’s visible theocratic organization, we must be in full and complete agreement with every feature of its apostolic procedure and requirements.
      UNITY MAINTAINED BY SUBMISSION
      ...In this way today too the governing body of the Christian congregation serves the entire organization. Solutions to problems arising in one locality are widely circulated so that the unity and oneness of the entire organization might be maintained...In submitting yourself to Jehovah’s visible organization as administered by such servants, you are still not required or expected to follow men..... It is the faith of these men that is to be imitated and their course of conduct that is to be observed....These men too, though occupying responsible positions of oversight themselves, recognize and submit to the superior appointment of the “faithful and discreet slave.”....The account says: “In those days there was no king in Israel.” (Judg. 21:25) So it was in the earlier days of the modern theocratic organization. Jehovah’s administration of righteousness took a pronounced forward step with the return of the Christian congregation to apostolic teachings. But before the King, Jesus Christ, was enthroned in 1914 C.E. the organization was loosely administered. Each “ecclesia” or congregation was self-governed by elected “elders” and “deacons.” But in 1914 Jehovah enthroned his King Jesus Christ, and from 1919 onward the time became due for Jeremiah’s prophecy to be fulfilled: “‘And I myself shall collect together the remnant of my sheep out of all the lands to which I had dispersed them, and I will bring them back to their pasture ground, and they will certainly be fruitful and become many. And I will raise up over them shepherds who will actually shepherd them; and they will be afraid no more, neither will they be struck with any terror, and none will be missing,’ is the utterance of Jehovah.”—Jer. 23:3, 4.
      12 This benefit of theocratic administration did not come all at once. In 1932 the “elective elders” were replaced in the congregation by an appointed “service director,” who was assisted by a group of mature members of the congregation democratically elected to their positions. But not until 1938 did the final change to strictly theocratic order take place. In that year, through the columns of The Watchtower, it was revealed from the Scriptures that the power of appointment of servants in congregations rightfully rests with the governing body of the “faithful and discreet slave” as directed by Jesus Christ from Jehovah’s temple.Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content.  This important step in the restoration of theocratic order assured Jehovah’s “sheep” that they would not again be separated into independent “flocks” by unscrupulous “shepherds.” The shepherds that Jehovah promised through Jeremiah would be those fully in agreement with Jesus’ words that “they will become one flock, one shepherd.”—Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. .
      14 In 1942 the change came. In the throes of World War II, with the change in administrations of the second and third presidents of the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society,...The years since 1942 have told their tale regarding the exploits of the anointed Elisha class, accompanied by an ever-increasing number of the “great crowd.”—Rev. 7:9-17.
      On February 1, 1943, the Watchtower Bible School of Gilead was set up for training missionaries and special representatives of the Watch Tower Society to serve in all parts of the earth. That same year, 1943, a new training program, the Theocratic Ministry School, began in the congregations of Jehovah’s witnesses. At first only male students were enrolled in these schools, but in 1958 provision was made for the women of the congregations to enroll and participate.
      20 Such a theocratic view of matters will enable you always to keep pace with the organization, neither running ahead nor lagging dangerously behind. You will encounter trying circumstances. Do not be overcome by them. Wait on Jehovah and put your hope in him. (Ps. 37:34; 27:14) It might even be that reproof will be necessary on occasion. Do not become offended. If you do, you are undoubtedly taking yourself too seriously, failing to see the point of the reproof. Nor should you persuade yourself that you are of no use to the organization and quit simply because some mistake may be drawn to your attention. Rather, “my son, do not belittle the discipline from Jehovah, neither give out when you are corrected by him; for whom Jehovah loves he disciplines; in fact, he scourges every one whom he receives as a son.”—Heb. 12:5, 6.
      21 On the other hand, it may be that your advancement will be rapid. Guard against an attitude of super-faithfulness. It might ensnare you. Do not feel that others in the congregation are slow and backward. You might even become impatient with the organization. Consider instead the example of Moses, who pleaded with Jehovah to spare his typical theocratic nation when some faithless ones in the organization sinned against Jehovah and brought his anger down upon the entire congregation. (Ex. 32:1-14) Neither should you wait constantly to be directed as to the theocratic activity assigned. Eagerly assume individual responsibility and seek ways of advancing the Kingdom interests in harmony with the program currently outlined by the “faithful and discreet slave.”
      22. Why, then, should we stick loyally to Jehovah’s visible organization?
      22 The Bible sets forth every inducement and encouragement to place the theocratic organization ahead of oneself, to accept it in all its features and stick to it loyally. The theocratic pace of activity is still increasing. What Jehovah will yet require of his faithful servants on earth before Armageddon he will reveal in due time. Staying close to his visible theocratic organization is the only way to find out. Having identified that organization and God’s righteous requirements expressed through his channel, never let it go. Follow Jehovah’s faithful shepherds so that, “just as sin ruled as king with death, likewise also undeserved kindness might rule as king through righteousness with everlasting life in view through Jesus Christ our Lord.”—Rom. 5:21.
    • By Witness
      It’s 2 minutes long.  I suggest listening to it twice.  Notice the undertones of ridicule directed against the “auTHORity” of Jesus Christ.   See if you detect the exemplified authority of the GB, placed on the same level as God’s word.  And how Jesus was aware of his “limitations”, not having authority “to teach others things that originated in his own mind”.  But this man? He displays no humble attitude before God’s Son.   Even though the GB persists in fabricating deception originating from THEIR minds, you are made aware that they are above and beyond such limitations! 
      Honestly, JWs.  This is a man who told lies about the organization’s problem with child abuse. Now, he is blatantly exalting himself above Christ and his authority.  If any of you believe you will receive eternal life by “sticking close” to this false christ/prophet, and not Jesus Christ, I fear for your lives.  Will you continue to look the other way and excuse his and all of the GB’s actions, thinking that God will correct them?  God looks at us individually and views OUR choice to serve Him and His Son, or to serve men who expect obedience to them.  (Joel 3:14)
      “Beware of the teachers of the law. They like to walk around in flowing robes and love to be greeted with respect in the marketplaces and have the most important seats in the synagogues and the places of honor at banquets. 47 They devour widows’ houses and for a show make lengthy prayers. These men will be punished most severely.”  Luke 20:46,47
      “Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves.” Matt 7:15 
      “Beware lest anyone cheat you through philosophy and empty deceit, according to the tradition of men, according to the basic principles of the world, and not according to Christ.”  Col 2:8
      “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’  Matt 7:21-23
       
      Then the Lord said to me, “The prophets are prophesying lies in my name. I have not sent them or appointed them or spoken to them. They are prophesying to you false visions, divinations, idolatries and the delusions of their own minds.  Jer 14:14
       
       
       
    • By Patiently waiting for Truth
      Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. I don't watch television and I'm quite choosy as to films that I will watch, but when it comes to the 'Life of Christ Jesus' I am quite keen to watch films and programmes of interest. 
      I have just finished watching Series One of ' The Chosen'. It is about the Life of Jesus from before He made Himself know to the 'public at large'. 
      Of course it uses a lot of 'artistic licence' and lots of things in it are not facts, but I find it helpful to see the type of lifestyle the Jews lived and to see Jesus and His followers as real people. 
      I don't know if your 'Leaders' will tell you not to watch it, but i found it relaxing and a pleasure to watch. I particularly liked Nicodemus and his meeting with Jesus, the questions asked and answered. 
      I don't think any of you would find it offensive but of course you will note many faults in it, as i did. However, in my opinion it is far better to watch this than watch most other films of our time. 
       
    • By Patiently waiting for Truth
      Copied as found. Don't know how true this is. 
       
      APRIL 10, 2020   On Wednesday, the U.S. Food and Drug Administration 
      Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content.  regarding an experimental treatment for COVID-19. It involved “convalescent plasma” collected from people who have recovered from the disease. The FDA said that, while the treatment had not been approved (since experimental data was virtually non-existent), there were a few places where scientists or doctors could use it, including in patients with “serious or immediately life-threatening COVID-19 infections.” The thinking is that there are antibodies present in the plasma of recovered patients that could help current patients fight the virus. Okay. Fine.
      The problem is that the Jehovah’s Witnesses are reacting to this statement by saying it would 
      Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content.  to accept this treatment. JWs have famously refused blood transfusions 
      Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content.  even when they’re needed to save their own lives. The religion’s leaders are now saying plasma is included in that ban. The watchdog site JWsurvey obtained a “leaked memo from a Jehovah’s Witness Circuit Overseer” sent to local leaders:
      Do you think ALMIGHTY GOD really means this ? 
    • By Patiently waiting for Truth
      Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. How Is Jesus’ Sacrifice “a Ransom for Many”?
      Payment. The Bible says that Christians were “bought with a price.” (
      Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. ) That price is the blood of Jesus, with which he “bought people for God out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation.”—Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. .  Can we please take a look at this little quote from a JW Org page. Link is above for reference. 
      It looks all good doesn't it ? But is it in fact deceiving ? It's the bit that I've highlighted in RED. 
      It's a part quote from a scripture, AND, it is where I say that JW Org misuses scripture. 
      Lets look at the Revelation scripture Ch 5 v 8, 9  BUT also include verse 10. 
      When he took the scroll, the four living creatures and the 24 elders
      Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content.  fell down before the Lamb, and each one had a harp and golden bowls that were full of incense. (The incense means the prayers of the holy ones.)Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content.  And they sing a new song, saying: “You are worthy to take the scroll and open its seals, for you were slaughtered and with your blood you bought people for God out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation, 10  and you made them to be a kingdomHello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content.  and priests to our God,Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content.  and they are to rule as kings over the earth.” In the top sentence ( marked as 1. Payment ) the GB / Writing department of CCJW / Watchtower make it look as if the Revelation scripture referenced is talking about ALL Christians. BUT, if we look at verse 10, we can see that it is talking only about the Anointed. How ? Because it says those ones are to rule as kings over the earth.” 
      So, Jesus was slaughtered and with his blood he bought Anointed Ones from every tribe and tongue and people and nation,
      Do people fully understand this ?
      These ones eat the flesh and drink the blood of Christ.  John 6 v 53 - 56.
       So Jesus said to them: “Most truly I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of man and drink his blood, you have no life in yourselves. 54  Whoever feeds on my flesh and drinks my blood has everlasting life, and I will resurrect him on the last day; 55  for my flesh is true food and my blood is true drink. 56  Whoever feeds on my flesh and drinks my blood remains in union with me, and I in union with him.
      When Anointed ones are resurrected to heavenly life they have no further testing, because they have eaten the flesh and drank the blood of Christ and they are in union with Him. 
      Whereas, the Earthly class do not eat and drink those things, so the ransom has not yet paid the price for them. Therefore the Earthly Class will get a testing at the end of the Thousand Years. Only on passing that test will the ransom of Christ pay the price for them and then they will 'come to life'. 
      I feel these are not my words, but God's. I have never thought of myself as inspired but if i can be of use to God through Christ, then may that take place according to God's will. 
       
    • By Patiently waiting for Truth
      If the CCJW is going to be God's / Christ's chosen Organisation to bring humans through 
      Armageddon / Judgement Day
      What serious changes need to take place in it first ?
      As you know my feelings are that neither God nor Christ can use the CCJW as it is. But I am seriously trying to think on a more spiritual level so I'm trying not to be biased. By reading many comments on this forum I've noticed that even those JWs that resolve to stay firmly in the 'Org', still have some feelings of discontent. 
      So the question I'm asking is more to those JWs who are remaining 'faithful' to the CCJW and it's GB. 
      Do you see the need for big changes in the way the CCJW is run ?
      Do you really believe that God & Christ are happy with the CCJW as it is ?
      I am not deviating from my belief of a 'true Anointed' being 'raised up' in these 'last day', but as I've said before that 'true anointed' could well be within the CCJW.
      I'm keeping my mind 'open' to all manner of thoughts, whilst trying to, hopefully with God's guidance, find truth. 
      However, I am of the opinion that 'new light' via the GB, will not provide the answers or right direction that is needed. But that is just my personal opinion, and I may be proven wrong................
    • By James Thomas Rook Jr.
      If a JW votes in a national election ... will there be congregational sanctions against him?
      The last thing I heard was in 1999 in the Watchtower that it had changed that we were now allowed to follow our consciences, in voting quoted here:
      " Questions From Readers
      How do Jehovah’s Witnesses view voting?
      There are clear principles set out in the Bible that enable servants of God to take a proper view of this matter. However, there appears to be no principle against the practice of voting itself. For example, there is no reason why a board of directors should not take a vote in order to arrive at decisions affecting their corporation. Congregations of Jehovah’s Witnesses often make decisions about meeting times and the use of congregation funds by voting with a show of hands.
      What, though, of voting in political elections? Of course, in some democratic lands, as many as 50 percent of the population do not turn out to vote on election day. As for Jehovah’s Witnesses, they do not interfere with the right of others to vote; neither do they in any way campaign against political elections. They respect and cooperate with the authorities who are duly elected in such elections. (Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. ) As to whether they will personally vote for someone running in an election, each one of Jehovah’s Witnesses makes a decision based on his Bible-trained conscience and an understanding of his responsibility to God and to the State. (Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. ) In making this personal decision, the Witnesses consider a number of factors.
      First, Jesus Christ said of his followers: “They are no part of the world, just as I am no part of the world.” (Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. ) Jehovah’s Witnesses take this principle seriously. Being “no part of the world,” they are neutral in the political affairs of the world.—Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. .
      Second, the apostle Paul referred to himself as an “ambassador” representing Christ to the people of his day. (Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. ) Jehovah’s Witnesses believe that Christ Jesus is now the enthroned King of God’s heavenly Kingdom, and they, like ambassadors, must announce this to the nations. (Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. ) Ambassadors are expected to be neutral and not to interfere in the internal affairs of the countries to which they are sent. As representatives of God’s heavenly Kingdom, Jehovah’s Witnesses feel a similar obligation not to interfere in the politics of the countries where they reside.
      A third factor to consider is that those who have a part in voting a person into office may become responsible for what he does. (Compare Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. , The New English Bible.) Christians have to consider carefully whether they want to shoulder that responsibility.
      Fourth, Jehovah’s Witnesses greatly value their Christian unity. (Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. ) When religions get involved in politics, the result is often division among their members. In imitation of Jesus Christ, Jehovah’s Witnesses avoid becoming involved in politics and thus maintain their Christian unity.—Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. .
      Fifth and finally, their keeping out of politics gives Jehovah’s Witnesses freeness of speech to approach people of all political persuasions with the important message of the Kingdom.—Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. .
      In view of the Scriptural principles outlined above, in many lands Jehovah’s Witnesses make a personal decision not to vote in political elections, and their freedom to make that decision is supported by the law of the land. What, though, if the law requires citizens to vote? In such a case, each Witness is responsible to make a conscientious, Bible-based decision about how to handle the situation. If someone decides to go to the polling booth, that is his decision. What he does in the polling booth is between him and his Creator.
      The Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. , said: “Where Caesar makes it compulsory for citizens to vote . . . [Witnesses] can go to the polls and enter the voting booths. It is here that they are called upon to mark the ballot or write in what they stand for. The voters do what they will with their ballots. So here in the presence of God is where his witnesses must act in harmony with his commandments and in accordance with their faith. It is not our responsibility to instruct them what to do with the ballot.”
      What if a Christian woman’s unbelieving husband insists that she present herself to vote? Well, she is subject to her husband, just as Christians are subject to the superior authorities. (Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. ) If she obeys her husband and goes to the polling booth, that is her personal decision. No one should criticize her.—Compare Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. .
      What of a country where voting is not mandated by law but feelings run high against those who do not go to the voting booth—perhaps they are exposed to physical danger? Or what if individuals, while not legally obliged to vote, are severely penalized in some way if they do not go to the polling booth? In these and similar situations, a Christian has to make his own decision. “Each one will carry his own load.”—Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. .
      There may be people who are stumbled when they observe that during an election in their country, some Witnesses of Jehovah go to the polling booth and others do not. They may say, ‘Jehovah’s Witnesses are not consistent.’ People should recognize, though, that in matters of individual conscience such as this, each Christian has to make his own decision before Jehovah God.—Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. .
      Whatever personal decisions Jehovah’s Witnesses make in the face of different situations, they take care to preserve their Christian neutrality and freeness of speech. In all things, they rely on Jehovah God to strengthen them, give them wisdom, and help them avoid compromising their faith in any way. Thus they show confidence in the words of the psalmist: “You are my crag and my stronghold; and for the sake of your name you will lead me and conduct me.”—Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. ."
      Now, all this is well and good .... but if a Brother's conscience will allow him to vote in national elections ... will he be chastised, sanctioned, or punished for the free exercise OF his conscience, by the CCJW ?
       
    • By James Thomas Rook Jr.
      WHY .... doesn't Jehovah God consider warfare ... murder?
      It seems clear to me that Jehovah allows civil governments to run their own affairs as they see fit, and even has no objection to them judging and executing wrongdoers ... and even commands us to be in subjection to these governments, as even the very worst of them are better than anarchy.
      People generally misinterpret the scripture that say " Thou shalt not kill." where the scripture more actually says "Thou shalt not murder".
      There is a very real difference.  A sovereign government, executing a wrongdoer is implementing the political will of that government ... whether it be a government the size of a continent .. or an extended family sized tribe of Jewish sheepherders living way out in the middle of nowhere, living in tents, governed by a patriarch.
      I have not been able to find in the Bible where actual warfare, committed by any sovereign group, is considered to be murder ... either by the perpetrators of the war, or the defenders of the war against them, except in the case of "war crimes" against non combatants and other cases.
      Did you know it is legal to drop napalm on civilians in war, from an aircraft ... but not from a flame thrower from a soldier on the ground?
      ....but I digress.
      Even people that warred against the Jews  were not considered murderers..... they were considered warriors.
      I am working on getting this all straight in my mind now ... as there seems to be a profound truth buried in this stream of thought, somewhere, but I cannot get it to crystallize, or perhaps it is approaching 3AM, and I am too tired to think about it.
      But whatever it is that is ... what profound basic principle that I am missing ...is based on having a correct answer  as to WHY ... WHY does God NOT consider warfare to be murder.
      I suspect when I figure it out, it will be like driving down a road in a southerly direction, thinking you are going North ... and then you see that landmark or sign that indicates you are really going South ... and that feeling you get when your whole frame of reference rotates in your head, like the world just rotated 180 degrees.
      It's like deja vu, and geography, combined.
      Perhaps my premise is faulty, but I don't think so.
      Please feel free to destroy my premise, or my stream of thought, or my conclusions.
      I try to be "loyal" to whatever is true, and not an agenda of defending an agenda.
      Knowing "WHY?" things are the way they are, is the key to good philosophy.
      Bad philosophy will waste our lives, which are pitifully short.
       
       
       
       

    • By James Thomas Rook Jr.
      WHY .... doesn't Jehovah God consider warfare ... murder?
      It seems clear to me that Jehovah allows civil governments to run their own affairs as they see fit, and even has no objection to them judging and executing wrongdoers ... and even commands us to be in subjection to these governments, as even the very worst of them are better than anarchy.
      People generally misinterpret the scripture that say " Thou shalt not kill." where the scripture more actually says "Thou shalt not murder".
      There is a very real difference.  A sovereign government, executing a wrongdoer is implementing the political will of that government ... whether it be a government the size of a continent .. or an extended family sized tribe of Jewish sheepherders living way out in the middle of nowhere, living in tents, governed by a patriarch.
      I have not been able to find in the Bible where actual warfare, committed by any sovereign group, is considered to be murder ... either by the perpetrators of the war, or the defenders of the war against them, except in the case of "war crimes" against non combatants and other cases.
      Did you know it is legal to drop napalm on civilians in war, from an aircraft ... but not from a flame thrower from a soldier on the ground?
      ....but I digress.
      Even people that warred against the Jews  were not considered murderers..... they were considered warriors.
      I am working on getting this all straight in my mind now ... as there seems to be a profound truth buried in this stream of thought, somewhere, but I cannot get it to crystallize, or perhaps it is approaching 3AM, and I am too tired to think about it.
      But whatever it is that is ... what profound basic principle that I am missing ...is based on having a correct answer  as to WHY ... WHY does God NOT consider warfare to be murder.
      I suspect when I figure it out, it will be like driving down a road in a southerly direction, thinking you are going North ... and then you see that landmark or sign that indicates you are really going South ... and that feeling you get when your whole frame of reference rotates in your head, like the world just rotated 180 degrees.
      It's like deja vu, and geography, combined.
      Perhaps my premise is faulty, but I don't think so.
      Please feel free to destroy my premise, or my stream of thought, or my conclusions.
      I try to be "loyal" to whatever is true, and not an agenda of defending an agenda.
      Knowing "WHY?" things are the way they are, is the key to good philosophy.
      Bad philosophy will waste our lives, which are pitifully short.
       
       
       
       
    • By The Librarian
      Jehovah in the Bible, the God of Israel who 
      Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. , a spirit realm outside the physical heavens and is not omnipresent or "residing" in a human's heart.
      "Jehovah" at Exodus 6:3(1611 King James Version)
      Jehovah /dʒɨˈhoʊvə/ is a Latinization of the Hebrew יְהֹוָה, a vocalization of the Tetragrammaton יהוה (YHWH), the proper name of the God of Israel in the Hebrew Bible, which has also been transcribed as "Yehowah" or "Yahweh". יְהֹוָה appears 6,518 times in the traditional Masoretic Text, in addition to 305 instances of יֱהֹוִה (Jehovih).The earliest available Latin text to use a vocalization similar to Jehovah dates from the 13th century. 
      Relationship of Jehovah with the rest of the Universe
      Think of Jehovah as the Architect of the Universe and Jesus Christ as his "Master Builder" (Proverbs chapter 😎 through whom everything else was created. His first Creation was Jesus Christ himself Billions of years ago before the physical universe ever existed.

      Michael the Archangel (later called Jesus Christ) used God's Holy Spirit in order to create our Universe and later perform miracles related in the Gospels. All energy in the Universe sources with Jehovah God's Holy Spirit and later the exalted and enthroned Jesus Christ enthroned as King would be given "Life within himself" thereby also being given immortality and having his own spirit. (source needed) See also
      Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. Jehovah's Witnesses Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content.  / Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content.
      Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content.  
       
    • By James Thomas Rook Jr.
      TTH:
      Just wait until YOU get to be 73, and find battle scars galore.
      A lot of mature restraint is really just being too TIRED.
      Ya wanna FIGHT!?
      ..... yeah, yeah, yeah ....... start without me.
      I need to take a nap.
      ==============================================================
       
      ... except for the Governing Body.  
      When THEY make mistakes, they pay no price whatsoever.
      WE DO.
      They .... never miss a meal.
    • By Patiently waiting for Truth
      So lets try to be a bit positive.  A question.  How is the GB and the JW Org moving forward SPIRITUALLY ?
      What progress has it made in the last fifty years ?   I'm not talking about physical things, not buildings, not books, not meeting times........ 
      I'm talking about purely spiritual matters.  Spiritual guidance, true spiritual love from the top of the Org down, mercy, understanding of people, serving the congregants as a way of serving God Himself (as Jesus did), showing patience without having weakness, making true adjustments according to true scripture not according to man's guesses. 
      You may of course comment as to what you feel would make for good spiritual progress within the JW Org too. 
    • By James Thomas Rook Jr.
      Norway is the great catalyst that will force the GB to start thinking about basic human rights, as currently there is a lot of discussion in the Norwegian Government about " ... Why are we giving the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society Norwegian dollars (Kroners) every year from Tax money for their charities ... for EACH and every of the approximately 112,000 JWs in Norway (paraphrased), when they prohibit their members to vote"... which THEY consider to be an inalienable, and non-negotiable human right of all peoples, everywhere.
      The WTB&TS is currently being governed by the Lawyers, Accountants, and the Finances department, with the GB not admitting being personally responsible for ANYTHING.
      What we consider "reasonable", they consider EXTREMIST, and many European nations give tax money to ALL legitimate churches, without restriction on how they spend it.
      By violating what these governments' and peoples' basic understanding on what constitutes extremism, soon, if not already, it is going to affect the flow of cash into the Society's Treasury.
      One of several major concerns of the Governing Body is to not hemorrhage money, as it has been doing for years in the constant Child Sexual Abuse court cases.
      THIS is what will drive any change .... not love ... not justice ...not fairness .... MONEY!
      -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
      By the way .... has the Society recently decided that voting is a matter of personal conscience?
      What I have read is so "weasel worded", I cannot tell.

    • By James Thomas Rook Jr.
      Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content.
      Posted by Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. on November 9, 2019 at 4:20 am  
      The Supreme Court of Canada heard arguments Thursday in a lawsuit against a religious congregation’s “shunning” practice, but the congregation and several other groups contend the justices had no right to even take part in the case.
      Randy Wall, a real estate agent, filed the suit against the Highwood congregation of the Jehovah’s Witnesses organization in Calgary, Alberta.
      Wall was expelled from the congregation for getting drunk and not be properly repentant, court records said. He pursued an appeals process through the Jehovah’s Witnesses then went to court because he said the Witnesses’ “shunning” — the practice of not associating with him in any way — hurt his business.
      He explained his two occasions of drunkenness related to “the previous expulsion by the congregation of his 15-year-old daughter.”
      A lower court opinion said: “Even though the daughter was a dependent child living at home, it was a mandatory church edict that the entire family shun aspects of their relationship with her. The respondent said the edicts of the church pressured the family to evict their daughter from the family home. This led to … much distress in the family.”
      The “distress” eventually resulted in his drunkenness, Wall said.
       
      Wall submitted to the court arguments that about half his client base, members of various Jehovah’s Witnesses congregations, then refused to conduct business with him. He alleged the “disfellowship had an economic impact on the respondent.”
      During high court arguments Thursday, the congregation asked the justices to rule that religious congregations are immune to such claims in the judicial system.
      The lower courts had ruled that the courts could play a role in determining whether or not such circumstances rise to the level of violating civil rights or injuring a “disfellowshipped” party.
      The rulings from the Court of Queen’s Bench and the Alberta Court of Appeals said Wall’s case was subject to secular court jurisdiction.
      A multitude of religious and political organizations joined with the congregation in arguing that Canada’s courts should not be involved.
      The Justice Center for Constitutional Freedoms said in a filing: “The wish or desire of one person to associate with an unwilling person (or an unwilling group) is not a legal right of any kind. For a court, or the government, to support such a ‘right’ violates the right of self-determination of the unwilling parties.”
      Previous case law has confirmed the right of religious or private voluntary groups to govern themselves and dictate who can be a member.
      But previously rulings also reveal there is room for the court system to intervene when the question centers on property or civil rights.
      The Association for Reformed Political Action described the case as having “profound implications for the separation of church and state.”
      It contends the court should keep its hands off the argument.
      “Secular judges have no authority and no expertise to review a church membership decision,” said a statement from Andre Schutten, a spokesman for the group. “Church discipline is a spiritual matter falling within spiritual jurisdiction, not a legal matter falling within the courts’ civil jurisdiction. The courts should not interfere.”
      John Sikkema, staff lawyer for ARPA, said: “The issue in this appeal is jurisdiction. A state actor, including a court, must never go beyond its jurisdiction. The Supreme Court must consider what kind of authority the courts can or cannot legitimately claim. We argue that the civil government and churches each have limited and distinct spheres of authority. This basic distinction between civil and spiritual jurisdiction is a source of freedom and religious pluralism and a guard against civic totalism.”
      He continued: “Should the judiciary have the authority to decide who gets to become or remain a church member? Does the judiciary have the authority to decide who does or does not get to participate in the sacraments? Church discipline is a spiritual matter falling within spiritual jurisdiction, not a legal matter falling within the courts’ civil jurisdiction. The courts should not interfere. Here we need separation of church and state.”
      The Alberta Court of Appeal, however, suggested the case was about more than ecclesiastical rules.
      “Because Jehovah’s Witnesses shun disfellowshipped members, his wife, other children and other Jehovah’s Witnesses were compelled to shun him,” that lower court decision said. “The respondent asked the appeal committee to consider the mental and emotional distress he and his family were under as a result of his duaghter’s disfellowship.”
      The church committee concluded he was “not sufficiently repentant.”
      The ruling said “the only basis for establishing jurisdiction over a decision of the church is when the complaint involves property and civil rights,” and that is what Wall alleged.
      “Accordingly, a court has jurisdiction to review the decision of a religious organization when a breach of the rules of natural justice is alleged.”
       
                     
    • Guest Indiana
      By Guest Indiana
      Who does adultery effect? First and foremost, it effects God. He sees all that we do. So when a husband or wife cheats on their mate, not only does he see the steps that lead to the adultery, but he sees the act itself. Next, the innocent mate is effected once they are told or find out about the actions of their unfaithful mate. If the couple has children, then they will be effected by this as well. 
      Both the families of the guilty mate and the innocent mate will no doubt be hurt. The congregation may become aware of what happened, and this can be damaging. Especially is this the case if the ones involved were viewed as exemplary in the congregation. Finally, in some instances (see WT 1991 11/15 p.22 par 15), even Non-Witnesses in the community may find out. This reflects poorly on the very first person who was effected by all of this...Jehovah. 
      So before committing any sin, it is vital to think about the ripple effect our actions will have on those around us. (Based on a recent C.O. talk) -Proverbs 22:3



       




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    • Esther  »  Eric Ouellet

      Bonjour Éric
      Je recherche un discours pour une étudiante. Le thème c'était "Dieu approuve-t-il une religion en particulier ? " 
      Si tu l'as en audio ou écrit, c'est assez urgent car je la vois cet après-midi. 
      Merci beaucoup mon frère
      Esther😉
      · 0 replies
    • folens  »  Esther

      Bonsoir Esther et-ce celui-ci?

      Dieu accepte-_t-_il toutes les religions.docx
      · 1 reply
    • Esther  »  jpl

      Bonsoir Jpl
      Je recherche un discours qui avait pour thème " Dieu approuve t'il toutes les religions ? " C'est pour mon etudiante de la Bible. Si tu l'as écrit ou oral, peu importe, c'est pour qu'elle puisse l'écouter
      Merci beaucoup ! 
      Ta soeur dans la foi
      Esther
      · 3 replies
    • Esther  »  folens

      Bonsoir
      Je recherche un discours qui avait pour thème " Dieu approuve t'il toutes les religions ? " C'est pour mon etudiante de la Bible. Si tu l'as écrit ou oral, peu importe, c'est pour qu'elle puisse l'écouter
      Merci beaucoup ! 
      Ta soeur dans la foi
      Esther
      · 0 replies
    • the Sower of Seed

      Daniel 12:6 Jehovah sends an angel to ask another angel: “How long will it be to the end of these marvelous things?” The other angel "the man clothed in linen" is inspired by Jehovah, raises both hands to Heaven and answers twice! One at verse 7, then verses 11 & 12. Just as the angel raises both hands to Heaven, there are 2 fulfillments, there are 2 beasts, the first dies, but rises again with greater power today. This who Jesus spoke about at Matthew 24: 15 “Therefore, when you catch sight of the disgusting thing that causes desolation, as spoken about by Daniel the prophet, standing in a holy place (let the reader use discernment). 
      Today we can use discernment as we see the dashing to pieces of the “power” of the holy ones in the hindrance of the “public” ministry caused by Covid19. We will see a greater attack on that ministry of Spiritual Israel under the rule of the King of the South as the world turns on religion. 
      Jesus stated that no man knows the day or hour, that was true then, because only Jehovah knew how long He gave Satan to prove his point. Only Jehovah could look into the last days and see when the constant feature would stop, the days are counted from then until the first day people will enjoy true happiness. This is the most important day to live for.
      John 4:23 states "Nevertheless, the hour is coming, and it is now, when the true worshippers will worship the Father with spirit and truth, for indeed, the Father is looking for ones like these to worship him." Why is God having to search for "True Worshippers"? Because the world is almost all "False Worshippers", denied understanding as stated at Daniel 12:10.  It's amazing how He has hidden the truth from minds, religions formed before the last days were formed without all the facts, even though they could read it over and over, because of their heart’s inclination, He has hidden the facts from them. How the primary resurrection will occur on Earth, that the land would be apportioned out to those choosing to live as a subject of the sovereignty of the Almighty God Jehovah. 
      Jehovah longs to talk with His friends of old like Noah, Abraham, David as well as Daniel. Daniel has seen Michael/Jesus stand up and the start of the resurrection which will benefit him, how he will stand up for his lot. verse 13. God has promised them the "Promised Land", a greater land then the small area of Israel, the whole planet will become a blessed restoration of the Edenic starting place. Matthew 19:28 Jesus said to them: “Truly I say to you, in the re-creation, when the Son of man sits down on his glorious throne, you who have followed me will sit on 12 thrones, judging the 12 tribes of Israel. Consider too Acts 3:21 "Heaven must hold this one within itself until the times of restoration of all things of which God spoke through the mouth of his holy prophets of old." The true reward that so many have hoped for now has a starting date!    
      If you have given your life to Jehovah and enjoy a relationship with Him, Read and Meditate on Daniel 12, pray for insight and understanding, for knowledge, wisdom, for faith and integrity for the days ahead!  For whether we live or die, we belong to Jehovah and will enjoy our lot just like Daniel.

      · 1 reply
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