Jump to content
The World News Media

The Sacred Field Ministry Stopped by a Bad Flu?


Jack Ryan

Recommended Posts

  • Member
1 hour ago, Witness said:

SM, you bring to the table, phrases and philosophies outside of the Wt. That's fine, but if I choose to call the GB "prosperity preachers", it is because they are.

On the contrary Witness, these aren't philosophies, they're historical accounts concerning Christianity, mainly when it comes to origin. A Philosophy is the study of general and fundamental things, about existence, reason, knowledge, values, mind, and language, majority of which does not correlate with Christian Christology. Such questions are often posed as problems to be studied or resolved. Now, Christian philosophy differs greatly and most of the time, it is against what is in the core teachings, to some degree, the Scriptures alludes this when it came to anything that is accursed.  Christian philosophy is the set of philosophical ideas initiated in 2nd century to the present day, and it continues to now, I even refuted some of it here. Christian philosophy emerged with the aim of reconcile science and faith, starting from natural rational explanations, some of which generated over the centuries with its independent scientific and philosophical theories,  which even correlates with the idea of coexistence. It is also the direct result of paganism from some, like the Greeks.

Sure you can choose, as you stated, but isn't that in of itself spreading a lie to inform everyone that Restorationist are what they were against even prior to the 19th century Great Awakening? Remember, you spoke heavily about slander and lies, even that of misinformation, but clearly, you, misinforming people the difference between a Restorationist, be it a Jehovah's Witnesses, even you, also a Restorationist to that of anyone of the Prosperity Theology, derived from New Thought. Even when the facts are presented, you purposely refuse, which is telling because you were always open to facts when it fits your favor, although in some cases an err.

This is evidently the simplest of a historical accounts in Christian history, anyone can read.

That being said, if they are considered such by you, can you explain why they adhere to Commission and not believe Jesus to be God when 100% of Anti-Trinitarians do not believe Jesus is God? I mean, you were pretty clear on John 1:1, were you not?

1 hour ago, Witness said:

They may not fit your definition according to your restricted terms,

These aren't my terms, they are straight from historical accounts and facts. It is evident you have Gnosiophobia in this regard. The irony here myself, Srecko and Evo essentially cited all historical sources, and said information was presented many times. I see this as a sad remark on your part because you just the following of mixing New Thought with Restorationism.

That said, it isn't my definition, if I recall, I was not born in the days Restorationism came out of it's predecessor - not of us were, at is. And God knows what you'd say if we bring up Subordinationism, which is essentially what birthed Restorationism.

1 hour ago, Witness said:

I choose to call the GB "prosperity preachers", it is because they are. 

This is willful slander regardless of disagreement with JWs. In this regard you only prove JWs to be right concerning misinformation. Although you can give point as to why GB is wrong, but to commit to a lie to even push your resolve is bad, mainly in the face of those who dealt with New Thought Christians. This is why people like Francis Chan always wins, and more and more people are swept by Babylon, from misinformation such as this.

1 hour ago, Witness said:

but their actions show them up to be men who revel in fleshly desires and dominance over others. 

So if they're Prosperity Preachers as you said, what is the reason for Jehovah's Witnesses to be preachers let alone adhere to Commission and why they do not believe in the Trinity?  Prosperity Preachers do not have preachers besides them and their circle and they hold the Trinity to an extremely HIGH regard. They are among the worse to deal with because of Interfaith involvement.

1 hour ago, Witness said:

That is only possible by promoting the need for money.

So this should be answered then - If they're Prosperity Preachers as you said, what is the reason for Jehovah's Witnesses to be preachers let alone adhere to Commission and why they do not believe in the Trinity? 

1 hour ago, Witness said:

Lumping the Wt into your worldly definitions may work for you, but it doesn't work with me. 

It isn't a worldly term, it is direct notation the Apostolic Age whereas Subordinationism existed. After the councils and everything that transpired, such ones came back as Restorationist in an attempt to not just restore the church, but the Scriptures. This is the reason why you have the notation of the 2 camps concerning God and Christ, with the latter believing Jesus is the Son of the Living God, Matthew 16:16.

The Jehovah's Witnesses are still considered Restorationist due to their history, even as Bible Students, and those who predate them - the facts were brought up.

Granted you like Bible Gateway, here you go concerning The Age of the Apostles - https://www.biblegateway.com/resources/encyclopedia-of-the-bible/Apostolic-Age

1 hour ago, Witness said:

but it doesn't work with me. 

You were adamant of history before, so why the change?

1 hour ago, Witness said:

I don't need to dig into New Thought Theology or New Ageism

It isn't much of a dig up when you can simply look at the history of Christianity. You also just confused New Thought with literally Anti-Trinitarianism. If I may add, as I recall you briefly attested to New Ageism from your source in the past and you never corrected your statement, you were checked on that and informed on what New Ageism actually is. Again, even an err and not knowing can reap problems.

1 hour ago, Witness said:

to understand that the scriptures relate to "my people"

If that was the case, then you would not have been called out on this in the past, even now concerning Christian history.

1 hour ago, Witness said:

he "saints"/priesthood in the organization. (Rev 18:4-8) 

Then Kosnen would not have checked you also for he speaks of himself as chosen. In his defense, he knows Christian history, and would not reduce himself to ignorant slander, which in turn, can cause people to be misinformed.

That being said, I suggest you learn the history because you showed yourself to be very brittle in this regard.

And thanks to you, you just have legitimately gave Prosperity Preachers some canon fodder granted all of this is public.

No Anti-Trinitarian would make such confusion, even if you are not for JWs.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


  • Views 10.7k
  • Replies 196
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Posts

Did it ever occur to you that the early scribes may be have been at fault for leaving out this passage, and that God made sure it was replaced, especially for our sake in the last days?  Read it, and

Can someone explain to me, to whom would it have been advantageous to insert that piece of writing ? 'Religions' have always been about control. That piece of writing was concerning forgiveness.

Not a misstep, they actually tried to change Gods “times and laws”. It finishes in Acts 1:7 when “He said to them: “It is not for you to know the times or dates the Father has set by his own

Posted Images

  • Member

@Srecko Sostar It isn't of interpterion. It is based on history. Even if we go back further, we can see the division between both parties concerning the Christ. Although Restorationism is a root, it's parent is practically Suborinationism, which was driven out by those who professed the teaching that later became known as The Trinity Doctrine. We also have the historical events of Bible Translation, which was brutal for some. This also connects to how paganism entered Christianity. Trinitarians, and those of the Prosperity Theology, are against Anti-Trinitarians whole heartedly, likewise, Anti-Trinitarians do not like their counterparts, and it has been this way for the longest time, so much so, as pointed out, Islam got involved too, which should tell you something.

That being said, when people do not know a bit of their history, they'll end up making wild assumptions.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Member

Well it seems the GB / Watchtower / JW Org are going to be going in for video broadcasting in a big way because that is what the building at Ramapo is all about. And in the assembly / convention talks they were giving instructions as to how donations should be made. I think @Srecko Sostar jokingly called in Video-vangalising or similar.  

Of course the Covid virus has stopped many things so it's easy to understand that JWs stopped the door to door work. However time will tell if this door to door work restarts and if the Kingdom Halls get reopened. Right now the KH are closed here in UK... That's why I try to be balanced on some points, because there are some things that are obviously done for good reason. JWs here in UK have been sensible regarding the Covid virus.. 

Concerning field ministry though, I tried to give warning to some JWs because I honestly thought that JWs would be in danger of physical harm due to the information concerning CSA which was and still is freely available to the public. I also wanted to make some other information known to my local congregation but, of course, they all stopped talking to me when i left, so it was impossible for me to show concern for them. I am still concerned about the elderly ones that have little knowledge about CSA or other problems in the JW Org. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Member

@Patiently waiting for Truth Kathgar is a British-Arabic Jehovah's Witness, last I seen him he said CSA is low due to most institutions being closed, but he did say in areas such as London, CSA is at it's worse, even after the Justice system debacle. Granted of how long he has been pushing on misconceptions and educating people on the matter, there should be more aware of CSA, mainly in the past 4 years now. JWs won't be preaching any time soon because of what the, in this case, The United Kingdom, will end up doing very soon. London is somewhat open, which explains why preachers congregant in Hyde Park.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Member
16 minutes ago, Srecko Sostar said:

What do those who know, who are well learned about history, say on question: Does the devil believe in the Trinity?

Anything pertaining to lying about God, yes. People in the past were suppressed, even killed over it; mainly those forced to accept the Creeds of the Triune God.

It opened doors to the teaching that their is life after death, having visions even though the apostles have all died out, and the list continues, but at the center of it all, is Jesus Christ.

The history is important because of how close early Christian teachings were eradicated and overwhelmed by the new teaching, one of the reasons you have old Bishops who kept calling our heresies, one in question was Irenaeus of Lyons.

This goes for Bible Translations too, for that history was wild on it's own. This led to many believing verses and passages that are either not true or do not line up with Strong's.

So in short, the core battleground for Anti-Trinitarians and Trinitarians is concerning Jesus and the Bible. If the history of Christianity or the Bible isn't even concerned, it would be problematic. We are lucky this history isn't lost. You do not have to know everything, but at least the basics, with just basic understanding, it becomes a benefit.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Member
7 hours ago, Space Merchant said:

Sure you can choose, as you stated, but isn't that in of itself spreading a lie to inform everyone that Restorationist are what they were against even prior to the 19th century Great Awakening? Remember, you spoke heavily about slander and lies, even that of misinformation, but clearly, you, misinforming people the difference between a Restorationist, be it a Jehovah's Witnesses, even you, also a Restorationist to that of anyone of the Prosperity Theology, derived from New Thought.

For you, it is all about restorationism.  For the general JW it is not about being part of restorationism, or being a Restorationist.  Why you can't see that I just don't know.

7 hours ago, Space Merchant said:
9 hours ago, Witness said:

I choose to call the GB "prosperity preachers", it is because they are. 

This is willful slander regardless of disagreement with JWs.

If the shoe fits...notice I didn't capitalize "prosperity preachers".  Another "shoe" would be calling them, "fortune seeker preachers/teachers".  I am not concerned with those you call officially, Prosperity Preachers, thus I haven't slandered them.  

7 hours ago, Space Merchant said:

That being said, I suggest you learn the history because you showed yourself to be very brittle in this regard.

This is just a suggestion, (but I would rather you not do so  please) - become a JW for about 20 years at least, then get back to me.  We'll talk about the organization's "history" of false teachings.

Wait a minute, who am I slandering, Prosperity Preachers or the GB?  The GB willingly slander any who reject their falsehoods, just want to make this clear.

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Member
7 hours ago, Space Merchant said:

So this should be answered then - If they're Prosperity Preachers as you said, what is the reason for Jehovah's Witnesses to be preachers let alone adhere to Commission and why they do not believe in the Trinity? 

As GB Splane said, false teachers introduce ‘a few grains of truth mixed in with falsehoods, and inspired by the demons’. (1 Tim 4:1,2; Rev 16:13-16)  

He knows what he's doing.  The only commission they are adhering to, is their own.  Many times the subject of "core teachings" has come here.  Yes, JWs hold onto a few grains of truth, and turn a deaf ear to all the lies.  (2 Cor 11:3,4,14,15)  Matt 24:24,25

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Member
8 hours ago, Space Merchant said:

You do not have to know everything, but at least the basics, with just basic understanding, it becomes a benefit.

Basic knowledge about WTJWorg tell me they are in error in things in which they teach and act erroneously. I am :) with that cognition. If you and others think otherwise, it is yours and their right to dissent.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Member
13 hours ago, Witness said:

For you, it is all about restorationism.  For the general JW it is not about being part of restorationism, or being a Restorationist. 

As pointed out, it is not of my saying, it is the history itself, you are just as much of a Restorationist, as is, the majority of Anti-Trinitarians out there, be it a group or not, mainly in this modern age. What Subordinationism Christianity has birthed, Restorationism, has not changed. There is a deviation of Restorationism, should those accept the creeds instead of speaking out against it.

You're confusing beings with roots. There is a reason why I mentioned roots, as is what it means, something that is an origin or source (as of a condition or quality).

14 hours ago, Witness said:

If the shoe fits...notice I didn't capitalize "prosperity preachers".  Another "shoe" would be calling them, "fortune seeker preachers/teachers".  I am not concerned with those you call officially, Prosperity Preachers, thus I haven't slandered them.  

You're deviating from your lie now. Again, you were adamant about those speaking a lie, but to lie about a legitimate rival to Anti-Trinitarian, Jw or not, was willful on your part. I do hope you realize people can see that, especially a multitude of Anti-Trinitarians, for, to this day still battles with those in the prosperity camp, especially in regards to what they did some years ago that resulted in the interfaith nonsense.

Witness, it is slander to call Anti-Trinitarians prosperity preachers, you should have stuck with your false prophet notation instead of equating anything with Anti-Trinitarianism with a slanderous rival of which they dealt with for many, many years. The irony in this you speak of Babylon the Great alone, not realizing a potential threat. Therefore, Kosenen was right about you.

Learn the difference between the two.

14 hours ago, Witness said:

This is just a suggestion, (but I would rather you not do so  please) - become a JW for about 20 years at least, then get back to me.  We'll talk about the organization's "history" of false teachings.

You say this every time you evade addressing questions. But if we are to take it there, somehow a former JW adhere to a bit of New Ageism, and deconstruction of God's Order. Or cannot hold their own without the slight mention of a former faith.

So, as to my question, address it - If they're Prosperity Preachers as you said, what is the reason for Jehovah's Witnesses to be preachers let alone adhere to Commission and why they do not believe in the Trinity? 

You are a former JW, are you not? the answer should not be this difficult.

That being said, I find it quite ironic that for your 20 years, yet you proclaimed adhere to a guy, even defended without fact, who said your former faith hid literal poison in the basement of the churches, or perhaps believed in an untruth believing it to be truth, thus professing it yourself. The Biblical Facts thread comes to mind.

14 hours ago, Witness said:

Wait a minute, who am I slandering, Prosperity Preachers or the GB?  The GB willingly slander any who reject their falsehoods, just want to make this clear.

You referred to JWs as prosperity preachers, let alone Anti-Trinitarianism. That in of itself is slander.

GB you can speak of, I care not, but it is the obvious accusation of New Thought theology, which in of itself, does not make any sense.

13 hours ago, Witness said:

As GB Splane said, false teachers introduce ‘a few grains of truth mixed in with falsehoods, and inspired by the demons’. (1 Tim 4:1,2; Rev 16:13-16)  

This ahs noting to do with the question addressed to you. The prosperity theology or it's root, New Thought, has nothing truthful about it, which is evident from their inception and what transpired, and their role in Babylon.

13 hours ago, Witness said:

He knows what he's doing. 

What does this have to do with the question addressed to you concerning the commission and the Trinity?

13 hours ago, Witness said:

The only commission they are adhering to, is their own.

Everyone who came out of the Great Commission, be it they hold on to their Restorationist roots or not, adheres to it. The Commission itself is rooted in Matthew 28:16-20 and to the gospel being taught to the Nations, hence Matthew 24:14; Mark 13:13. The Commission is the instruction of the resurrected Jesus Christ to his disciples to spread the gospel to all the nations of the world, and as we see in Scripture, it was later entrusted to the church to continue this command. In regards to majority of Anti-Trinitarians, even that of the JWs, to them, although the general public agree/disagree with some of their notations, they recognize them for adhering to the Great Commission, such, even pointed out by the non-religious.

Going back to the first century, the Commission was held strongly, since Pentecost 33AD and onward, even in the face of Bishops. Restorationists, those that maintain said roots, do not have their own Commission. In fact, the Great Commission sits on the basis of Matthew 24:14 alone; even then, Restorationist of the 19th century didn't know everything, but they sought to learn despite their counterparts moving into the direction of Creeds.

That being said,  the Commission was addressed many times and what it signifies, even to you, at one point you even ignorantly brushed it off as a Unification Church.

14 hours ago, Witness said:

Many times the subject of "core teachings" has come here. 

Not really. Majority of threads speaks of JWs alone, rarely is there any topic of "core teachings" on the forums concerning who God is, and or of Scripture. The only one ever brought forth, you turned it into a JW thread when the focus should've been Scripture and what is conveyed.

Plus, history is rarely spoken of in terms of Christology alone.

14 hours ago, Witness said:

Yes, JWs hold onto a few grains of truth, and turn a deaf ear to all the lies.  (2 Cor 11:3,4,14,15)  Matt 24:24,25

This has nothing to do with the question addressed to you concerning their roots vs. the claim.

The question remains below:

If they're Prosperity Preachers as you said, what is the reason for Jehovah's Witnesses to be preachers let alone adhere to Commission and why they do not believe in the Trinity? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Member
10 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Basic knowledge about WTJWorg tell me they are in error in things in which they teach and act erroneously. I am :) with that cognition. If you and others think otherwise, it is yours and their right to dissent.

It still does not excuse the New Thought slander. I mean, you did cite Restorationism yourself.

That being said, Basic knowledge in regards to the Bible and the history of Christianity, we can stick with that, especially concerning JWs - we can go with the Bible first. And the fact you bring this up, reminds me of what you stated a while back regarding the Jehovah's Witnesses version of the Bible concerning error - I guess we can start with that, with just 2 questions.

My response to you:

NOTE: Jehovah's Witnesses were spoken of as committing various errors because of their New World Translation (NWT) of the Bible, and they teach that their action on this was because the errors were considered not inspired, hence 2 Timothy 3:16 (All scripture is given by inspiration of God). Not only they were spoken of as removing part of verses, but in their translation, removing a verse/passage entirely.

Concerning errors -  [1] can you explain to me why the Jehovah's Witnesses removed Gospel of John 7:53–8:11 from their translation of the Bible and some have not? Let alone change parts (Partial Verses Omitted) of a verse?

That passage isn't the only example, but we have a few others, as seen below:

image.png

image.png

 

 

Also they were spoken of as in error for verses like Acts 7:59, 60 and the verses in Matthew, it was even addressed here - 

https://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/161040/acts-7-59

[2] Why did the Jehovah's Witnesses make this change to the 2 verses?

 

image.png

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Member

New World Translation, online on JW Org. 

Luke 17 : 35  There will be two women grinding at the same mill; the one will be taken along, but the other will be abandoned.” 36  ——

Matthew 24 40  Then two men will be in the field; one will be taken along and the other abandoned. 41  Two women will be grinding at the hand mill; one will be taken along and the other abandoned.

Strange that the verse should be left out of Luke, but used in Matthew. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites





  • Recently Browsing

    • No registered users viewing this page.
  • Popular Contributors

  • Topics

  • Posts

    • It appears to me that this is a key aspect of the 2030 initiative ideology. While the Rothschilds were indeed influential individuals who were able to sway governments, much like present-day billionaires, the true impetus for change stems from the omnipotent forces (Satan) shaping our world. In this case, there is a false God of this world. However, what drives action within a political framework? Power! What is unfolding before our eyes in today's world? The relentless struggle for power. The overwhelming tide of people rising. We cannot underestimate the direct and sinister influence of Satan in all of this. However, it is up to individuals to decide how they choose to worship God. Satanism, as a form of religion, cannot be regarded as a true religion. Consequently, just as ancient practices of child sacrifice had a place in God's world, such sacrifices would never be accepted by the True God of our universe. Despite the promising 2030 initiative for those involved, it is unfortunately disintegrating due to the actions of certain individuals in positions of authority. A recent incident serves as a glaring example, involving a conflict between peaceful Muslims and a Jewish representative that unfolded just this week. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/mar/11/us-delegation-saudi-arabia-kippah?ref=upstract.com Saudi Arabia was among the countries that agreed to the initiative signed by approximately 179 nations in or around 1994. However, this initiative is now being undermined by the devil himself, who is sowing discord among the delegates due to the ongoing Jewish-Hamas (Palestine) conflict. Fostering antisemitism. What kind of sacrifice does Satan accept with the death of babies and children in places like Gaza, Ukraine, and other conflicts around the world, whether in the past or present, that God wouldn't? Whatever personal experiences we may have had with well-known individuals, true Christians understand that current events were foretold long ago, and nothing can prevent them from unfolding. What we are witnessing is the result of Satan's wrath upon humanity, as was predicted. A true religion will not involve itself in the politics of this world, as it is aware of the many detrimental factors associated with such engagement. It understands the true intentions of Satan for this world and wisely chooses to stay unaffected by them.
    • This idea that Satan can put Jews in power implies that God doesn't want Jews in power. But that would also imply that God only wants "Christians" including Hitler, Biden, Pol Pot, Chiang Kai-Shek, etc. 
    • @Mic Drop, I don't buy it. I watched the movie. It has all the hallmarks of the anti-semitic tropes that began to rise precipitously on social media during the last few years - pre-current-Gaza-war. And it has similarities to the same anti-semitic tropes that began to rise in Europe in the 900's to 1100's. It was back in the 500s AD/CE that many Khazars failed to take or keep land they fought for around what's now Ukraine and southern Russia. Khazars with a view to regaining power were still being driven out into the 900's. And therefore they migrated to what's now called Eastern Europe. It's also true that many of their groups converted to Judaism after settling in Eastern Europe. It's possibly also true that they could be hired as mercenaries even after their own designs on empire had dwindled.  But I think the film takes advantage of the fact that so few historical records have ever been considered reliable by the West when it comes to these regions. So it's easy to fill the vacuum with some very old antisemitic claims, fables, rumors, etc..  The mention of Eisenhower in the movie was kind of a giveaway, too. It's like, Oh NO! The United States had a Jew in power once. How on earth could THAT have happened? Could it be . . . SATAN??" Trying to tie a connection back to Babylonian Child Sacrifice Black Magick, Secret Satanism, and Baal worship has long been a trope for those who need to think that no Jews like the Rothschilds and Eisenhowers (????) etc would not have been able to get into power in otherwise "Christian" nations without help from Satan.    Does child sacrifice actually work to gain power?? Does drinking blood? Does pedophilia??? (also mentioned in the movie) Yes, it's an evil world and many people have evil ideologies based on greed and lust and ego. But how exactly does child sacrifice or pedophilia or drinking blood produce a more powerful nation or cabal of some kind? To me that's a giveaway that the authors know that the appeal will be to people who don't really care about actual historical evidence. Also, the author(s) of the video proved that they have not done much homework, but are just trying to fill that supposed knowledge gap by grasping at old paranoid and prejudicial premises. (BTW, my mother and grandmother, in 1941 and 1942, sat next to Dwight Eisenhower's mother at an assembly of Jehovah's Witnesses. The Eisenhower family had been involved in a couple of "Christian" religions and a couple of them associated with IBSA and JWs for many years.)
  • Members

    • chan

      chan 0

      Member
      Joined:
      Last active:
    • BTK59

      BTK59 139

      Member
      Joined:
      Last active:
  • Recent Status Updates

  • Forum Statistics

    • Total Topics
      65.4k
    • Total Posts
      158.9k
  • Member Statistics

    • Total Members
      17,670
    • Most Online
      1,592

    Newest Member
    Apolos2000
    Joined
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

Terms of Service Confirmation Terms of Use Privacy Policy Guidelines We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.