SELF-APPOINTED PROGNOSTICATORS

[Witness]

"JEHOVAH GOD is the Grand Identifier of his true messengers. He identifies them by making the messages he delivers through them come true. Jehovah is also the Great Exposer of false messengers. How does he expose them? He frustrates their signs and predictions. In this way he shows that they are self-appointed prognosticators, whose messages really spring from their own false reasoning—yes, their foolish, fleshly thinking!"w97 5/1 p. 8

I found this wt. quote after answering a JW on reddit with this comment.  For any JW passing through here...

Do you remember the cover of the 5/15/1984 Awake magazine? If not, you can look up its image on Google. Do you think that God knew that this was a lie before time showed that your leaders failed in their prediction? The world calls people that do this, false "prognosticators”. I think even your writers have used this term in references to false prophets.

Yes, God was aware it would fail. In light of all the dates set by your organization for Armageddon, did God know each one would fail? Yes, of course. Did He say, “well even though these leaders have misled thousands with their promises that didn’t hold true, and even though they took their message of error to people’s homes world-wide, misleading them with a teaching that will certainly prove to be false, I will bless them with abundance of spiritual food!”

Really? Show me where in the scriptures God approves of falsehoods – false teachings. These are only the blatant untruths, made by your leadership. The list is very long.

God is looking for people to come out of your organization where darkness and rotten fruit is found. (Matt 7:15-20; John 3:19,20) He wouldn't demand that people remain where He knew Christ's teachings were abandoned for men's doctrine. You've got it all wrong, sir.

“I will use my power against the prophets who see false visions and predict things that don’t come true. They will not help my people make decisions or be recorded in the records of the nation of Israel. They won’t even enter Israel. Then you will know that I am the Lord.” Ezek 13:9 (GW)

Then the Lord told me, “These are the lies that the prophets are telling in my name: They claim that I sent them, commanded them, and spoke to them. They dreamed up the visions they tell you. Their predictions are worthless. They are the products of their own imagination.” Jer 14:14

This is what the Lord of Armies says:

“Don’t listen to what the prophets are saying to you.

They fill you with false hope. (like the people had, on the cover of the Awake)

They speak about visions that they dreamed up.

These visions are not from the Lord.” Jer 23:16

“A time will come when people will not listen to accurate teachings. Instead, they will follow their own desires and surround themselves with teachers who tell them what they want to hear. People will refuse to listen to the truth and turn to myths.” 1 Tim 4:3,4

 

So tell me, where is it said that God has turned a blind eye to false, failed teachings by your GB, and expects you to do the same? (Rev 18:4-8)

 

 

 How to Identify True Prophets

 

 

 

 

[Srecko Sostar]

2 hours ago, Witness said:

Did He say, “well even though these leaders have misled thousands with their promises that didn’t hold true, and even though they took their message of error to people’s homes world-wide, misleading them with a teaching that will certainly prove to be false, I will bless them with abundance of spiritual food!”

This question that you asked, hit the core. WTJWorg with GB leadership has been supporting its own chronology of past and future events for decades. Certainly, most of the effort was invested in proving that "Armageddon is at the very door" and that it will happen in a certain period of time. Sometimes this included a precisely expressed year, sometimes a short period bounded by the lifespan of a “generation” or the end of a century (e.g., the 20th century).
Indeed, should one have faith and confidence in the “spiritual food” that comes from GB forecasters?

[Patiently waiting for Truth]

It proves that the Watchtower / JW Org needs to provide a 'carrot', a bribe, a false promise.

So the next question needs to be. What will God or Christ replace this with ? 

[Pudgy]

Somewhere around 50 years ago there was a television program on called “Slattery’s People”, starring Richard Crenna as a congressman who went around helping his constituents.

As the program opened the camera zoomed in on the two keyed desk receptacles a congressman uses to vote with, while a very distinguished voice intoned  “Democracy is a very bad form of government …… But all the others are so much worse.“

I think one of the reasons that I remember that so emphatically is that is the way I view Jehovah’s Witnesses in modern times, merely because we govern with heavily flawed human beings.

You are never going to get justice. You are never going to get equity. You’re never going to get fairness. You are never going to get reasonableness.

You are never going to get justice. You are never going to get equity. You’re never going to get fairness. You are never going to get reasonableness.

Until Christ’s Kingdom Is fully in place and is being administered by perfect people, angels or whatever they’re going to use.

I suspect that 700 years into the thousand year reign of Christ there will still be people in authority that have many of the failings and foibles that plague us today, and the survivors will still be bitching and moaning that life is just not fair.….. And they will be correct.

 ……. and they will be correct.

Get used to it.

Basically we are just big ugly bags of mostly water, trying to be something we’re not, and failing in some way, or most ways.

With all the colossal persistent and never ending screw-ups, arrogances and missteps that the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society engages in daily remember this, in reality, and for now…… And I cringe as I write this…… they are the best bet the human race has.

……. as the people of Poland discovered when invaded by the Nazis, you don’t fight a war with the army you want…… You fight a war with the army you have.

 

 

 

 

[Patiently waiting for Truth]

19 hours ago, Pudgy said:

With all the colossal persistent and never ending screw-ups, arrogances and missteps that the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society engages in daily remember this, in reality, and for now…… And I cringe as I write this…… they are the best bet the human race has.

and that, in your eyes, gives them reasons to act like dishonest dictators. Well if you are happy with that, I'm not.

NOR will I go preaching LIES just because you say it's the best we've got.  

Nor would i invite families into that immoral spider's web. you are welcome to it if it makes you happy.

[Pudgy]

Ok …. What specifically WOULD YOU DO?

…… remember, on the plus side they teach core Bible truths, including the BIGGIE ……

….. Globally, they teach people to war, no more.

 

[Patiently waiting for Truth]

13 hours ago, Pudgy said:

Ok …. What specifically WOULD YOU DO?

I've made my viewpoint very clear before.  I am 'Patiently waiting for Truth'.  Tom finds this very funny.

Yes I could easily still be a JW. I could have just lingered in the background. I could have pretended that CSA was a lie.

I could have pretended that all the false predictons didn't happen.  In other words i could have been a coward. 

Why would I want to support / contribute to / preach on behalf of, an immoral, dishonest, self-centered group of 8 men, who pretend to be the F&DS' ?

I am waiting for God, through Christ, to 'awaken' spiritually, the true Anointed remnant. When that happens, I don't know if it will be by cleaning out the W/t - JW Org, or, by forming a new association. I believe that there are true Anointed ones in many countries around the Earth.  I think that a 'new association' guided by 'Anointed Servants' could be organised globally. It does not need all of them in one place. 

I did have a thought that just as John the Baptiser made the way clear before Jesus came, then maybe JW Org has made the way clear before the True Anointed appear. 

Remember too that the Watchtower was around before the JW Org was formed, and most of those 

13 hours ago, Pudgy said:

core Bible truths

were known long before the JW Org was formed.  Although Russell wasn't a JW, he did most of the ground work. 

But I haven't stopped having Bible discussions and will talk to anyone that will discuss it sensibly.  I also try my best to encourage my family to think about 'spiritual things'.  In online discussions about world events I will try to introduce Bible prophecy. What i don't do is pretend i know the when and how of God's plans. 

So back to your question as to, What would i do ?

I would and do accept that I am NOT Anointed, therefore I do not expect God or Christ to work through me. 

Therefore I pray, read my BSB Bible, and i wait to find out who the 'Spiritual JEW'  are.  

Sometimes we just have to have patience and wait on God through Christ. 

The alternative of course is to try to 'run on ahead' without spiritual guidance, and we have seen the bad results clearly in the Watchtower / JW Org. 

[Pudgy]

…. Get more than 200 people together, in ANY religious group, and watch “the way things SHOULD be” go to hell in a hand basket.

…… it’s the nature of imperfect humanity.

….. sometimes also attributed to “bad luck”.

[Patiently waiting for Truth]

On 8/25/2021 at 7:42 AM, Pudgy said:

Get more than 200 people together, in ANY religious group, and watch “the way things SHOULD be” go to hell in a hand basket.

Ye of little faith.

You miss the whole point of HOLY SPIRIT being poured out onto the TRUE ANOINTED ones. 

You, and others, seem to think that God and Christ do not realise the seriousness of the 'times' or that they don't care. You and others only seem to think in a 'physical' way. 

Your comment in fact, says, God cannot be served properly. Or is it that you cannot serve God properly ? 

It would seem sensible to me that God, through Christ, would prove in some way, who is the Spiritual JEW that us 'little dogs' should 'go with'.  

The GB / Watchtower / JW org has proven that they cannot be trusted in many ways. Do you honestly think God and Christ will allow that to continue. To allow millions of people to be stumbled at this time when we are moving closer to the Judgement Day.  

When Christ uses his authority to change things here on Earth, those in the Org will be in for a very big shock. 

[Pudgy]

…… if you cut them, and they bleed red blood, I trust them not.

The ones I trust the most is based on actual, put it in a spreadsheet and analyze it observed, definable, quantifiable and historical credibility.

Your assumptions about what God SHOULD DO is as bad as anyone else’s, including myself. 
 

I think everybody is in for a big shock.

[Pudgy]

….. because we are, each and every living soul, mortal …… soon enough  ….. perhaps too soon …. We will all get a test of our theological ideas. 

[Patiently waiting for Truth]

On 8/26/2021 at 1:42 AM, Pudgy said:

Your assumptions about what God SHOULD DO is as bad as anyone else’s, including myself. 
 

But it is based on scripture.

1.  'Ten men clinging to the robe of a JEW'  and

 

2.   Acts 2:17
New International Version
17 “‘In the last days, God says,
    I will pour out my Spirit on all people.
Your sons and daughters will prophesy,
    your young men will see visions,
    your old men will dream dreams.

Sorry did this in a hurry as I''m off out. Bye.