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BillyTheKid46

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  1. Downvote
    BillyTheKid46 reacted to Anna in Let us Appreciate Brother Lett   
    I lived through that time too, but I did not pay a lot of attention to it as I was too young.  However, a friend helped me to dig up a WT from 1975 that seems to make a distinction between an oath binding one to a person, and an oath to a country.
    Here are a few excerpts:
    ......."Thoughtful Christians weigh the matter in the light of Bible principles before taking any sworn oath. In doing so, they find that some oaths are Scripturally unacceptable. For example, in the days of the Third Reich, every German soldier was required to take this oath: “I swear by God this holy oath that I shall render unconditional obedience to the Führer of the German Reich and people, Adolf Hitler, the Supreme Commander of the Armed Forces, and that as a brave soldier I shall be prepared at all times to risk my life for this oath.” A person dedicated to Almighty God cannot bind himself unconditionally to a sinful human, for Jehovah exacts “exclusive devotion.”...........Hence, despite severe persecution, faithful Christian witnesses of Jehovah in Germany would take no oaths binding them to Adolf Hitler......
    ..........A true Christian, then, would not take an oath that would involve him in the controversies of the world or that would subject him unquestioningly to the will of another human. But what if a nation required that such an oath be taken by those desiring to become citizens? Could a person dedicated to God take an oath of that kind with mental reservations, reasoning that sex, age or other factors would make it unlikely that what had been sworn would ever be required? The individual must decide, but it would not be Christian to make a false oath of any kind, even if refusal to do so resulted in being denied the rights of citizenship.........
    ........A citizen of the United States of America who desires to travel abroad will find the following oath on a passport application: “I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservations, or purpose of evasion: So help me God.” If an applicant finds this objectionable, he is permitted to strike this oath from the passport application, and he will not be denied the document on that basis"...........
    Awake 1975/7/22 page 27-28
    Interestingly this was written during the presidency of Nathan Knorr. 
    edit:
    In addition this is what the proclaimers book  ch 29, page 674 had to say:
    In Malawi, there is only one political party, and possession of a party card indicates membership. Although the Witnesses are exemplary in paying their taxes, in harmony with their religious beliefs, they decline to buy political party cards. To do so would be a denial of their faith in GodÂ’s Kingdom. Because of this, late in 1967, with the encouragement of government officials, gangs of youths throughout Malawi launched an all-out attack on JehovahÂ’s Witnesses that was unprecedented in its obscenity and sadistic cruelty. Over a thousand devout Christian women were raped. Some were stripped naked before large mobs, beaten with sticks and fists, and then sexually assaulted by one person after another. Nails were driven through the feet of the men and bicycle spokes through their legs, and then they were ordered to run. Throughout the country their homes, furniture, clothing, and food supplies were destroyed.
    Bellow are the translated contents of the card. I cannot verify the correctness of the translation as I do not speak Chichewa

     

     

  2. Downvote
    BillyTheKid46 reacted to James Thomas Rook Jr. in Let us Appreciate Brother Lett   
    I was there, and paying attention.
    I know better.
  3. Like
    BillyTheKid46 reacted to Grey Reformer in Let us Appreciate Brother Lett   
    How do you define Christian Activism, Political Activism, and Civil disobedience?

    What you're implying is what? That, Jehovah’s Witnesses send their letters to the Orthodox Church? At some point, making sense reflects upon the one making the argument.

    Just like in 1975. It was a self-inflicted incident perpetrated by overzealous individuals that misunderstood the Watchtower message. Therefore, there was NO! Test of faith within the organization. However, there are still confused individuals that continue to mislead the public just as any former witness does to continue a known conspiracy theory. So, there is no need to defend the Watchtower with occurrences that were out of their control.

  4. Downvote
    BillyTheKid46 reacted to Srecko Sostar in Let us Appreciate Brother Lett   
    so called "SIFTING", very popular terminology in one period of organization used to explain described phenomenon and some other situation when Company caused mass (in greater or less numerous scale) disapproval of some parts of members.
    excellent observation!
    ohh yes, in fact so many informative ideas and interpretations and double, triple time/way of fulfillment. So complicated to understand what in fact author want to teach. Pictures, parables, yesterday, today, tomorrow,  transmitted meaning and true meaning ....In fact not understandable, only way is to learn by memorization and repeat the text ... and play that you understand :)))))))
    It is also written in some apocrypha :)))))))  
    A generation of JW and those who will be JW goes and next  generation of JW and those who will be JW comes,       But the earth remains forever.
  5. Haha
    BillyTheKid46 reacted to Evacuated in Let us Appreciate Brother Lett   
    Definitely bad, oppressive, a tool of the insecure. There is a tendency for some to try to lever on this basis. Seems to be a kind of convoluted version of what Peter said at Matthew 26:33.
    However, I do not think Paul and Barnabas were fear-mongering when they said “We must enter into the Kingdom of God through many tribulations." Acts 14:22, or Paul when he said to the Hebrews, "In your struggle against that sin, you have never yet resisted to the point of having your blood shed." Heb.12:4.
    Certainly, Peter counseled vigorously against abject "obedience to men" at Acts 5:29: “We must obey God as ruler rather than men.", all the more notable as coming from one who displayed the opposite behaviour at times.
    However there is a balance in this matter too, as the same Scriptures counsel children to be "obedient to your parents" (Eph.6:1), slaves to "be obedient in everything to those who are your human masters" (Col.3:22) all faithful Christians to mark those who are "not obedient to our word through this letter" (2Thess.3:14), "to be obedient to governments and authorities" (Titus 3:1); and, finally, to "be obedient to those taking the lead among you" (Heb.13:17).
    So when a b(B)rother says obeying instructions in what is of little consequence now is good practice for obeying instructions regarding what might be big consequences later, I don't feel blackmailed by some sort of bogey-man tactic really. I just feel that this is someone giving me a bit of good advice on how to turn a bumpy ride into something a little smoother. But then, that's just me. Everybody has their own way of dealing with and reacting to these things it seems. 
    I agree entirely with avoiding the creation of a fear-mongered, man-pleasing attitude.
    I endorse fully the need to engage in reflecting Jesus' manner in refreshing our fellow worshippers, working to lighten their "burdens" wherever we can.
    But at the same time we need to balance the fact that it was Jesus who instructed a heightened level of alertness in "keeping on  the watch", an avoidance of everyday distractions in maintaining a personally calibrated "whole soul" level of activity, and a full appreciation of the "torture stake" element involved in our acceptance of discipleship. ?
  6. Downvote
    BillyTheKid46 reacted to JW Insider in Let us Appreciate Brother Lett   
    I never said it was for a misguided purpose. I can't say I really agree with the purpose, but that was not a concern of mine at the time. My question was more about whether the book would be re-set (in new molten lead linotype) or whether it would be redone for offset printing, and perhaps even an upgrade to the artwork. Also, we had a set of proofreading changes that were not exactly the kind that that the proofreading department could just fix without permission. (And this has an expensive trickle-down effect on the other language editions.) They would be tied in with editorial decisions.
    A few month later, for the updated "Truth" book (1968 edition vs the new 1981 edition), several references to 1975 and the probable imminent end in the 1970's, had to be removed and replaced with new content, but this was a more obvious editorial decision, not a proofreading decision.)
  7. Haha
    BillyTheKid46 reacted to TrueTomHarley in Let us Appreciate Brother Lett   
    "This next lesson is mighty important."
    "Bullwinkle is a dope."
    "NOT that lesson. This lesson:" (Rocky and Bullwinkle)
    Still, if studying the 1000 years book twice was for misguided purpose, for what reason was it directed that we study the Greatest Man book four times? (and again, in its new version)
     
  8. Downvote
    BillyTheKid46 reacted to JW Insider in Let us Appreciate Brother Lett   
    Many sincere brothers now are quick to defend the mistakes of the past by saying that the number of little ones who were stumbled was actually a good thing. We've seem multiple comments on this forum that make that claim. As the misguided logic goes, with 1975, for example, it was a kind of test that only stumbled those who were serving Jehovah with a date in mind.
    To be fair, I think all this talk about the importance of obedience to men is a mistake. It is not hooked to anything so tangible as a calendar date so fewer people will be stumbled outright. But more people will be disheartened over time without being able to put their finger on exactly why. In my opinion it will be because they probably anticipated that association with fellow Witnesses would continue to enhance their love for Jehovah God and Jesus Christ in an overwhelmingly positive, uplifting, encouraging and heartwarming way.
    In this case, perhaps the brothers in the lead feel that they need to cover all the bases, and prepare us for unknown possibilities. The problem, in my opinion, is that this emphasis on the importance of obedience to men has now been associated (e.g., summer conventions) with a kind of future "fear-mongering" about the conditions we can expect during the great tribulation. It creates an even heavier load by making us overly concerned about the next day, when we would prefer to think that seeking first the Kingdom would have freed us from such anxiety, throwing our burden upon Jehovah, knowing that Christ's load is light, and his yoke is kind.
    (Matthew 6:33, 34) 33 “Keep on, then, seeking first the Kingdom and his righteousness, and all these other things will be added to you. 34 So never be anxious about the next day, for the next day will have its own anxieties. Each day has enough of its own troubles. But this makes it appear to serve the exact same purpose as 1975. This time, by associating these unspecified ways in which we will need to show obedience to men with a certain level of fear-mongering about the great tribulation, we will pay more than the usual attention to men. It should have the effect of ratcheting up the activity and anticipation by making the end seem even more imminent.
    It reminds me of an experience at Bethel when I once had an opportunity to question Brother Franz about his plan to have us study a 1973 book a second time in 1981.
    *** km 11/80 pp. 1-3 par. 5 Part I—Congregation Meetings ***
    CONGREGATION BOOK STUDY: In January we will start studying the book God’s Kingdom of a Thousand Years Has Approached. This 416-page book, published in 1973, contains vital information that is even more apropos now than when it was first released. Think of the hundreds of thousands of new ones who have been baptized since it was first published. My question was about whether we needed a new edition to change some inaccuracies, or whether it would go into print using the old press plates. His response was basically that we needed no update to it because "this is what the publishers need right now." [The book was basically a history of the Watchtower Society wedged into what are now half-obsolete explanations of Matthew 25.] But his idea was that it would somehow make people appreciate the Society, its place in our time, and therefore raise the level of activity.
    So ultimately I think that the pendulum will swing the other way again, and there will be a kind of retraction of this method of making the end seem so imminent as a way to raise activity levels. The Bible indicates that this method can backfire.
    (Proverbs 13:12) 12 Expectation postponed makes the heart sick,. . . Langston Hughes agreed:
    *** g94 5/22 p. 27 Put Humor Into Your Life ***
    Poet Langston Hughes once wrote: “Like a welcome summer rain, humor may suddenly cleanse and cool the earth, the air, and you.” Oh wait, not that one, but his famous one: "What happens to a dream deferred?"
    Of course, those who become disheartened (over the current emphasis) will likely be "chalked up to" the fact that this served as a test to get rid of those who were not worthy. For most, including myself, the overall context of these "changes" is not as bad as I just represented it, since the overall point is not to fear men, but to expect Jehovah to come to our aid when the trouble seems completely overwhelming. But unfortunately, I fear that even the perceived combination of emphasis on "obedience to men" and "fear-mongering" will combine to create a new kind of burden that will not appear to reflect the true spirit of Christianity. 
  9. Like
    BillyTheKid46 reacted to Space Merchant in Let us Appreciate Brother Lett   
    @Srecko Sostar And yet you do realize as to what caused the ban to begin with and what prompted such to take place, for if they were indeed in politics they would not have been suppressed months prior, granted if you are well aware of Alexander Dvorkin and everyone in connection to him. Letter writing isn't political just as people who come to defend a memorial area such as a cemetery from those who seek to change it.
    Now, you listed the following:
    As well as:
    Would it make more sense to address 3a first and then 5a? Indeed we are humans living on earth, all of us who roam the earth and those of us who use to, thus being buried in Sheol.
    As for point 3a, as the following reads:
    And as to what political affairs? Asking someone to not cease one's primary source of worship is not political, let alone religious rights. What is deemed political if if the faith was in affiliation with groups similar to the other churches in Russia, mainly the Non-Orthodoxy ones. For if we have to speak of this as a political issue then it can be said Apostle Paul's dealing with Artemis followers is seen as political or Christians to Niro, when the reality is, it is not. The only thing political that was taking place during the time of religious distress was in regards to the Anti-Corruption Heroes who are in direct and indirect confrontation with The Kremlin, as well as the RoC Church, due to a number of reasons, for more than 1,000 arrests have been made and a sheer twist of using Yarovaya Law (Закон Яровой) against anyone they choose. On the other side of the spectrum, there has been a non-political/violent movement to save Soviet Era homes only for the State Duma to deal with them, physically, but unfortunately, they too lost to the Kremlin.
    There was also no form of competition, if you know the motto of the Russian Orthodox Church (RoC) they consider others as competition and will do what is necessary to deal with them, be it other faiths, or anyone playing Pokemon in or near a church, to even some child quoting Shakespeare, for anything inciting of hatred tends to trigger the church greatly. That being said, the other factor is Bible bans, that effects all persons and subject them as suspect, we know this because of the tracker site formed by the FSB, so far one has been recovered, but the reason, mainly targeting religion, has been hidden and or changed on Russia's side, only after the State Duma made made new laws about a year ago.
    Again if you REALLY understand Apostle Paul's writing, which seems to be an issue already, you'd realize the Civil Disobedience of Spiritual Warfare, for we can see that a faith's action for worship and or anything connecting to God is being suppressed., cut of, if you will.
    Other then that, go to Russian side of things to actually understand the situation.
    At the end of the day, what these people have been doing and or doing is wanting to continue their faith, nothing more, no leadership or competition and or political interest, simply trying to keep their faith community going for what they see fit is in connection to worshiping El Shaddai.
    Also it should also be point to claim that one shouldn't be ignoring of what was informed to such one before.
  10. Downvote
    BillyTheKid46 reacted to James Thomas Rook Jr. in Let us Appreciate Brother Lett   
    I think several postings above this one Sreko Sostar did provide standard definitions.
    The problem with people making their OWN definitions ... is that people make their OWN agenda driven definitions, to fit their distorted world view, and call good, evil ... and call evil, good.
  11. Downvote
    BillyTheKid46 reacted to James Thomas Rook Jr. in Let us Appreciate Brother Lett   
    No ... not really ... petitions to God prayer is trying to influence God.... NOT politicians.
     
  12. Downvote
    BillyTheKid46 reacted to Srecko Sostar in Let us Appreciate Brother Lett   
    Definition of politics https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/politics
    1a : the art or science of government b : the art or science concerned with guiding or influencing governmental policy c : the art or science concerned with winning and holding control over a government 2: political actions, practices, or policies 3a : political affairs or business; especially : competition between competing interest groups or individuals for power and leadership (as in a government) b : political life especially as a principal activity or profession c : political activities characterized by artful and often dishonest practices 4: the political opinions or sympathies of a person 5a : the total complex of relations between people living in society b : relations or conduct in a particular area of experience especially as seen or dealt with from a political point of view     By point 5a in explanation we are all involved in this process, as human living on Earth. By point 3a in particular group (WT JWorg) exist also political activities that is focused on events within society (members) and on other side how this religious group have to deal whit person outside of WT society (WT as Company and JW as religious body of members) In general use inside JW members, word "politics" are clearly viewed, i believe, as activity that is specific mainly or most for politicians and government that lead some country. JW members, in general, don't see how would even word "politic" be something that can be used in vocabulary of WTBT Society or JW congregations for internal affairs. This word sounds to much worldly to JW members, like sort of blasphemy. Even among  ordinary people in society (non JW) word "politics" have mainly negative connotations, especially when they looking how politicians acting.   
  13. Downvote
    BillyTheKid46 reacted to Srecko Sostar in Let us Appreciate Brother Lett   
    Heh, JW letters was addressed to Russian Government, Mr Putin, Medvedev and all other political characters that are in "position to changed" Court decisions. So, how can you considered that as Neutral colored letters? When involved at least two parts of governing,  political and judicial power. 
    What JW consider as it is more powerful?   8 000 000 x i do not how many prayers in the day to JHVH ... or 8 000 000 letters of pray to Putin and Medvedev who "serve to Gods enemy, devil"? :))))
  14. Haha
    BillyTheKid46 reacted to Evacuated in Let us Appreciate Brother Lett   
    How can there be an argument about this? Isn't it one of the functions of prayer?
    Me too.
    I wish someone who actually through those times as a participant rather than a bystander could give us a comment.
     
     
     
  15. Downvote
    BillyTheKid46 reacted to James Thomas Rook Jr. in Let us Appreciate Brother Lett   
    That is just plain SILLY!
    It's "Aluminum Foil Hat" silly!
    That is correct ... and that is Reality, as it exists on the ground ... where the "rubber meets the road".
    64 MILLION LETTERS TO TRY AND GET A GOVERNMENT TO CHANGE ITS POLICIES ... IS POLITICAL ACTIVISM.
    YOU are the one playing with words ... to take what is actually the case, and pretend that it does not apply in THIS case ... and it DOES.
    The FACTS are either one of two things ... and cannot be a third thing.
    The past Presidents of the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society, Russell, Rutherford, and Knoor (whom I have seen in person) did in actual fact swear allegiance to the Constitution of the United States, and swore to defend it, in their heart of hearts, without reservation, or mental evasion .... OR ... to get a Passport, they Swore under Oath before God... and LIED .... lying under oath before man and God to the United States State Department, and each of their Passport applications were fraudulent ... AND they lied SPECIFICALLY before God by their signing that crystal clear and unambiguous oath.
    There is no third choice, unless you are agenda driven irrational, and borderline (?) insane.
    MEANWHILE ... the Brothers and Sisters in Malawi were being tortured and killed because Bro. Knoor, who signed an oath of allegiance to the United States Constitution, before God and man, refused,  when there  was only ONE political party in Malawi at the time, to  let them buy a 25 cent National ID card. (foreigners were exempt from that requirement).
    I lived through those times, when it was all going on, as contemporary news !
    I REMEMBER IT !
     
     
  16. Upvote
    BillyTheKid46 reacted to Grey Reformer in Let us Appreciate Brother Lett   
    This would depend on how you are willing to interpret scripture.

    NWT (1 Peter 2:17) 17 Honor men of all sorts, have love for the whole association of brothers, be in fear of God, honor the king.


     
    1 Peter 2:17 NIV

    17 Show proper respect to everyone, love the family of believers, fear God, honor the emperor.

  17. Downvote
    BillyTheKid46 reacted to James Thomas Rook Jr. in Let us Appreciate Brother Lett   
    Sure ... I do the same thing, completely of my own initiative ...Any JW I refer to as Brother  or Sister. I also capitalize the first letter of "holy words", such as Justice, and similar words.   It also helps to differentiate between a family brother or sister.
    I break the "rules of grammer", according to the amount of honor I attribute to something.
    That being said, I do maintain, entirely due to the book "1984" by George Orwell, the capitalization of "Big Brother", which I see as a VERY important philosophical concept to "Grok" ... which is another capitalized philosophical concept, of major importance.
  18. Like
    BillyTheKid46 reacted to Space Merchant in Let us Appreciate Brother Lett   
    @Grey Reformer Well it is said by a majority of Russians I have seen and what is seen in the discussion with those shut out by the duma, Russian Church does not like competition. They will go after you for anything, they went for a Librarian and a Pokemon player, they went for many others and it will not stop as long as the triads of power remain. Outside of religion, people also fought for their homes and other things in Russia.
    The Russian Church had gotten stronger since the day the Pope met Cyrill.
  19. Downvote
    BillyTheKid46 reacted to Srecko Sostar in Let us Appreciate Brother Lett   
    "Having Brothers Lett and Sanderson in Ukraine and Russia on the same weekend underscored the unity of God’s people and showed the brothers how much Jehovah and Jesus care about them......the Russia branch office to write: “The brothers and sisters were deeply touched that the Governing Body is so interested in this part of the world field. All of us felt as though we were given a big hug by the Governing Body.” https://www.jw.org/en/jehovahs-witnesses/activities/events/governing-body-encourages-witnesses/
    Can somebody explain me why is big B need to be in word Brothers Lett and Sanderson? 
    according to this - "Sister and Brother are capitalized in the same way as Doctor -- when used as honorifics or titles. These particular titles, along with "Mother" and "Father", are commonly used by religious orders." - it looks strange that brothers in Russia branch put accent on religious status of their brethren/brothers in Lord Jesus in another branch even if that is headquarter office.  
    Is that sort of men worshiping? Idolatry? I can understand if we honoring our friend, brother, wife in front of strangers or in some sort of official business, in public, on street, in work place or similar situation. But this is in article for JW members ,in first place, for worldwide brotherhood. Or nevertheless we should put Brotherhood  with BIG B, for rank and file members? :)) for purpose of honoring them, because many inside rank and file are in some sort of religious orders to some level (publishers and pioneers of all kind,  missionaries, elders of all sorts, Betel workers, lawyers ...) or if we want tell the truth, all JW members are part of religious order/orders but in some kind scale of hierarchy. :))
  20. Thanks
    BillyTheKid46 reacted to Grey Reformer in Let us Appreciate Brother Lett   
    Indeed. But, an easy way for the orthodox church to influence the Kremlin to remove an opposing church that doesn’t advocate the killing of another human being through a political process. (I.e. a political pawn) Which governments are at play?

    So, there is no hatred from the Watchtower toward the Russian Federation, other than having to put up with the mandates of earthly governments as they come to change. If you study history? You will find the same prospects in Jesus time.

    Although, the topic of conversation is “appreciation” to a certain person. I have no stomach to poke fun at a person due to his outer appearance or the way he conducts himself in public with mannerisms. That is more telling of others than “Lett” himself. A given fault of humanity, especially those that don’t study scripture as they should. 1 Samuel 16:7

  21. Downvote
    BillyTheKid46 reacted to James Thomas Rook Jr. in Let us Appreciate Brother Lett   
    That is just plain SILLY!
    It's "Aluminum Foil Hat" silly!
     
  22. Downvote
    BillyTheKid46 reacted to Srecko Sostar in Let us Appreciate Brother Lett   
    Funny conclusion, in my opinion!
    "It's politically correct to hate on Russia these days."
    But many US companies making big money in Russia. Watchtower is also US Company.
    Maybe WT is just first on Russian list of US companies that have to be stopped to operate in Russia. :))))) Have to wait to see.
    https://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrapoza/2016/08/03/headline-halah-t/#40025a795f99
    https://www.amcham.ru/eng
  23. Thanks
    BillyTheKid46 reacted to Grey Reformer in Let us Appreciate Brother Lett   
    Of course, letter writing has nothing to do with a political agenda. That irrational idea is a knee-jerk reaction to cover a false statement and it has sinister implications written all over it.

    Just as Russia used the Watchtower as an excuse to actually retaliate itself against the United States because of its sanctions. The Watchtower became a pawn in a governmental chess game.

  24. Like
    BillyTheKid46 reacted to Space Merchant in Let us Appreciate Brother Lett   
    @Srecko Sostar 
    This has already been discussed, you were even in the discussion in regards to OSCE:
    Learn what it is if it didn't get through the first time:
    Mind you, you agreed with everything said in the end, but here we see that is the complete opposite and the clear expectation that no one would realize it til now.
  25. Downvote
    BillyTheKid46 reacted to James Thomas Rook Jr. in Let us Appreciate Brother Lett   
    If you read carefully hidden in Sunday's WT lesson for last week .. the emphasis was on OVERTHROWING governments, or regime change.
    Be a sport ... read the WT study article once again, with that kept in your mind.
    It appears that the only way many of us develop reading comprehension is after reading something incorrectly, recovering from figurative "bullet wounds".
    The Society is VERY careful nowadays NOT to directly speak against voting.
    Probably learned from recovering from too many continuous governmental sanction "bullet wounds".
    The legal staff and accountants and the "Helpers" are now running the show.
    I have carefully watched this transition and power shift over 50 years and more.
    It has been funny, and terribly, terribly sad, at the same time.
     
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