Evacuated
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Posts posted by Evacuated
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2 hours ago, The Librarian said:
Your subsequent questions are SO far off topic... please create new questions when you head down various paths and just paste a link to discuss them there.
Fine and agreed.
I will leave to @Ann O'Maly to create new questions if wished as this line starts with the post at 17:00 on 30/04/2016.
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2 hours ago, Ann O'Maly said:
You are playing with words
Just your opinion, to which you are of course entitled.
2 hours ago, Ann O'Maly said:Rubber-stamp
Definition:
2. A person or organization that gives automatic approval or authorization to the decisions of others, without proper consideration:
Not a Jehovahs's Witness view of baptism
2 hours ago, Ann O'Maly said:w79 10/1 p. 27 par. 20 ...... show their commitment by .......dedicating...... (extract)
Not a Jehovahs's Witness view of dedication
We've moved on since 1979, e.g WT 1/15/2010 p.4 par.4: "Christian dedication is a serious matter. It is more than a mere commitment"
As I said, Witnesses do not view: baptism as a "rubber-stamp"; dedication as a "commitment"
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23 hours ago, Ann O'Maly said:
Bible interpretation kills faith?
For these, apparently so:
2Pet.3:15-16. "our beloved brother Paul also wrote you according to the wisdom given him, speaking about these things as he does in all his letters. However, some things in them are hard to understand, and these things the ignorant and unstable are twisting, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction"
1 hour ago, Ann O'Maly said:If Bible truth does not depend on the corroboration of decaying artifacts, why do the Org. and other Bible believers go to great pains to provide historical evidence for biblical accounts and characters?
Why not? It's of more interest than watching soap operas right?
As for the necessity for human detritus to corroborate God's word of truth .....not required.
Compare 2Thess. 2:13 "..when you received God’s word, which you heard from us, you accepted it not as the word of men but, just as it truthfully is, as the word of God.."
1 hour ago, Ann O'Maly said:If the Bible is not true, faith in it will not lead to everlasting life either.
So, are you saying that without artifacts to corroborate, the Bible is not true?
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Ecclesiastes 12:13 - The conclusion of the matter, everything having been heard, is: Fear the true God and keep his commandments, for this is the whole obligation of man.
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On 2/7/2016 at 10:56, Ann O'Maly said:
Some of the UK ones have been found to be operating below expected standards.
This home has been inspected again by the Care Quality Commission recently. Improvement has been noted with some further work required.
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14 minutes ago, Shiwiii said:
they could not kill Jesus on false testimony or false witnesses, it had to be true.
Is this discussion saying that Jesus was convicted for breaking the Mosaic Law on blasphemy by telling the truth about himself?
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5 hours ago, Ann O'Maly said:
Stop playing.
You know full well the answer to that question.
I'm not playing Ann O'Maly. Your meaning is not clear and my response depends on which is true.
5 hours ago, Ann O'Maly said:How so?
The context includes "Any reasoning based on this view would not reflect matters as Jehovah's Witnesses see things. It may, however, reflect matters as non-Witnesses or ex-Witnesses would see things."
e.g. Witnesses do not view: baptism as a "rubber-stamp"; dedication as a "commitment" Those who are not dedicated Jehovah's Witnesses often use these descriptions.
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8 hours ago, Ann O'Maly said:
Surely, without artifacts to corroborate Bible history, you might as well have faith in Aesop's Fables, right?
Wrong!
Bible truth does not depend on the corroboration of decaying artifacts. Faith in Aesop's Fables will not lead to everlasting life.
9 hours ago, Ann O'Maly said:Bible interpretation kills faith? Is that what you're saying?
Not me!
2Pet.3:15-16. "our beloved brother Paul also wrote you according to the wisdom given him, speaking about these things as he does in all his letters. However, some things in them are hard to understand, and these things the ignorant and unstable are twisting, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction"
So there's fallacy in them there arguments!
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2 hours ago, Ann O'Maly said:
Really? Doesn't baptism rubber stamp a vow with God to do His will and work along with the JW organization for life?
The life of the JW organisation or the life of the witness?
2 hours ago, Ann O'Maly said: I see my point hit home.
Yes, I see it clearly. Its not right for a family to avoid their daughter because she doesn't shop in Walmart. Mind you, I don't shop in Walmart either, but that's by choice. Where do I stand with that family?
I see you quoted me out of context on the subject of baptism. May I ask are you speaking as an ex-Witness or a non-Witness?
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2 hours ago, Ann O'Maly said:
Particularly in the JW faith, a baptism is a lifelong contract - not only with God, but with a religious organization.
This is not an assessment that one of Jehovah's Witnesses would make. Any reasoning based on this view would not reflect matters as Jehovah's Witnesses see things. It may, however, reflect matters as non-Witnesses or ex-Witnesses would see things.
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2 hours ago, Ann O'Maly said:
To illustrate:
2 hours ago, Ann O'Maly said:Have Sophia's family and friends acted reasonably?
No. Of course they haven't.
BUT the scenario you paint is too trivial to illustrate the point you are hoping to make.
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33 minutes ago, Ann O'Maly said:
1. If there were no artifacts to corroborate Bible history, on what would your faith be based?
Heb.11:1 "Faith is the assured expectation of what is hoped for, the evident demonstration of realities that are not seen."
Heb.6:18 "two unchangeable things in which it is impossible for God to lie,"
What do you base yours on?
39 minutes ago, Ann O'Maly said:2. Biblical interpretation is the scaffold upon which faith hangs, is it not?
More like the gallows.
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Prophecies
in Topics
7 hours ago, Jesus.defender said:Funny how you ignore the examples of false prophecies from the watchtower
Jonah did not make a false prophecy
You are just making presumptuous and unfounded statements as you do not know what I choose to ignore or take note of.
Why not stick to facts, such as the interesting list of WT quotes you provided? I gather it is not your own research, but nevertheless it is useful.
Unfortunately (for me that is), the filtered and irrelevant jibes and accusations you also include in your posts make the extraction of useful information a rather tedious exercise.
A forum such as this of course allows for freedom of expression, but why not take a leaf from @Jay Witness? The posts there, while challenging, are heavy on fact, economical on personal opinion.
Better still, why not use more closely the methods of the one your name tag would seek to defend?
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On 4/3/2016 at 19:45, Jay Witness said:
What about the part where if you don't distribute the bread or if you don't report enough time spent distributing bread the boss will end your life.
Wow!!!!! Where do you live????? Luke 21:1-4
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17 hours ago, The Librarian said:
Have a link? I do not see it on either platform.
https://tv.jw.org/#en/video/VODProgramsEvents/pub-jwbam_201410_1_VIDEO
Its about 2 hours 8 mins in.
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3 hours ago, Shiwiii said:
But that does not address the equality of the honor given in the verse. It's not a matter of why, but rather what.
In the verse at John 5:23, in responding to the Jews at that time (v19), Jesus showed that the honor which the Jews were accustomed to give to Jehovah as their Judge, they would now have to give equally to Jesus as well. This was because Jehovah would be transferring the executive role of Judge to His Son, Jesus. (Acts 17:31).
Of course, in delegating authority for judging to Jesus, Jehovah in no way relinquishes His position as Supreme Lawgiver and Judge. He is that eternally by His very nature as Creator and God. That is why those Jews would need to continue honoring the Father and would now additionally have to honor the Son as they had formerly honored the Father alone.
As Jehovah has "set a day to judge the entire inhabited earth", this requirement for honor to be given to both Jehovah and Jesus is incumbent on all of mankind who wish to gain a favourable judgement in line with the principle stated at 1Sam 2:30: "those honoring me I will honor". Honoring Jehovah necessitates the honoring of His Son and vice versa.
John 5:23.
"so that all may honor the Son just as they honor the Father. Whoever does not honor the Son does not honor the Father who sent him"
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On 4/26/2016 at 11:37, Shiwiii said:
I noticed you included the words "including His Son Jesus Christ", why have you included this if you do not believe they should be honored the exact same way?
I included these words because recognizing Jehovah's work in creating His only-begotten son is included in the reasons for assigning Him honor.
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5 hours ago, Eoin Joyce said:
I think I'm dealing with an Internet bot,
5 hours ago, Shiwiii said:Why thank you for the complement.
@Shiwiii
Apologies for this comment. For some reason, I was getting multiple copies of 3 of your comments every time I posted to this thread. I have traced this to a browser issue which I have corrected now. So I am not subject to what appeared to be an automated response.
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On 4/26/2016 at 11:37, Shiwiii said:
I'm not following your references, are you meaning Philippians 1:6? and Job 8:49? there is no Job or Joshua 8:49
Sorry about that (late night typos) Pihillipians 2:6; John 8:49
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6 minutes ago, Shiwiii said:
Lol, and that is the sole reason why I can not understand jehovahs witnesses. They are not free to have an opinion other than the wt, lest they be cast out of the club.
No...I think I'm dealing with an Internet bot, also known as web robot, WWW robot or simply bot, is a software application that runs automated tasks (scripts) over the Internet. Typically, bots perform tasks that are both simple and structurally repetitive, at a much higher rate than would be possible for a human alone.
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Prophecies
in Topics
1 hour ago, Jesus.defender said:Yes, amazing how you can put total commitment into an organisation that has proven itself to be so wrong.
I like Jonah too.
Jonah 3:4.
"Then Jonah entered the city, and walking a day's journey, he was proclaiming, "In just 40 days more , Nineveh will be overthrown."
Sorry about "the satanic NWT", but I think the others say similar.
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Prophecies
in Topics
I like Jonah too.
Jonah 3:4.
"Then Jonah entered the city, and walking a day's journey, he was proclaiming, "In just 40 days more , Nineveh will be overthrown."
Sorry about "the satanic NWT", but I think the others say similar.
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1 hour ago, Jesus.defender said:
You need to get rid of your satanic NWT
Right away Sir!
Matt 28:18 (Jesus)
Job 34:13 (Jehovah)
New International Version
Then Jesus came to them and said, "All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me.
Who appointed him over the earth? Who put him in charge of the whole world?
New Living Translation
Jesus came and told his disciples, "I have been given all authority in heaven and on earth.
Who put him in charge of the earth? Who appointed him to be over the whole world?
English Standard Version
And Jesus came and said to them, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me.
Who gave him charge over the earth, and who laid on him the whole world?
New American Standard Bible
And Jesus came up and spoke to them, saying, "All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth.
"Who gave Him authority over the earth? And who has laid on Him the whole world?
King James Bible
And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.
Who hath given him a charge over the earth? or who hath disposed the whole world?
Holman Christian Standard Bible
Then Jesus came near and said to them, "All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth.
Who gave Him authority over the earth? Who put Him in charge of the entire world?
International Standard Version
Then Jesus approached them and told them, "All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me.
Who entrusted the earth to him? Who made him responsible for the entire inhabited world?
NET Bible
Then Jesus came up and said to them, "All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me.
Who entrusted to him the earth? And who put him over the whole world?
New American Standard 1977
And Jesus came up and spoke to them, saying, “All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth.
“Who gave Him authority over the earth?
And who has laid on Him the whole world?
King James 2000 Bible
And Jesus came and spoke unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.
Who has given him charge over the earth? or who has laid on him the whole world?
American King James Version
And Jesus came and spoke to them, saying, All power is given to me in heaven and in earth.
Who has given him a charge over the earth? or who has disposed the whole world?
American Standard Version
And Jesus came to them and spake unto them, saying, All authority hath been given unto me in heaven and on earth.
Who gave him a charge over the earth? Or who hath disposed the whole world?
Douay-Rheims Bible
And Jesus coming, spoke to them, saying: All power is given to me in heaven and in earth.
What other hath he appointed over the earth? or whom hath he set over the world which he made?
Darby Bible Translation
And Jesus coming up spoke to them, saying, All power has been given me in heaven and upon earth.
Who hath entrusted to him the earth? and who hath disposed the whole world?
English Revised Version
And Jesus came to them and spake unto them, saying, All authority hath been given unto me in heaven and on earth.
Who gave him a charge over the earth? or who hath disposed the whole world?
Webster's Bible Translation
And Jesus came, and spoke to them, saying, All power is given to me in heaven and upon earth.
Who hath given him a charge over the earth? or who hath disposed the whole world?
World English Bible
Jesus came to them and spoke to them, saying, "All authority has been given to me in heaven and on earth.
Who put him in charge of the earth? or who has appointed him over the whole world?
Young's Literal Translation
And having come near, Jesus spake to them, saying, 'Given to me was all authority in heaven and on earth;
Who hath inspected for Himself the earth? And who hath placed all the habitable world?
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14 minutes ago, Shiwiii said:45 minutes ago, Jesus.defender said:
There are multiple writers that were involved with Genesis
Moses is credited with the writing of Genesis by both the Jews as well as Christians. What information do you have that I can review that credits others with this writing.
This seems to be following the pattern of Acts 23:7. So, in the famous words of Peter Jones, "for that reason, I'm out!"
You know full well the answer to that question.
I see my point hit home.
Disfellowshipped Children at the Memorial
in Topics
Posted
@Ann O'Maly. In view of the Librarian's comments elsewhere regarding creating new threads, this discussion seems to be heading away from the original question. So I will cease here unless the topic is raised elsewhere.