TrueTomHarley

No. This simply shows that @Equivocation is well-read and that you, despite bolting from the Witnesses, have not compensated for that lack by becoming so. It is pretty common outside of the JW world to refer to the “Pauline writings” and find uniqueness in them. After all, he wrote about half of the New Testament. Since the overall world cannot comprehend unity, (because it doesn’t exist for them) they focus on points of uniqueness and figure that each one is grounds for division and dispute. They cannot conceive of people smoothing over things because it doesn’t happen for them. (Of course, I am speaking in generalities) Often it is said that Paul is essentially a “co-creator” of Christianity. It is he that put most of the Mosiac Law underpinnings to the Way, spelling them out in his letters. The Michael Hart book “The 100,” rating the most 100 influential persons who have ever lived, ranks Jesus (#3) after Mohammad (#1)largely for this reason—he reasons that Mohammad is fully responsible for founding his religion, but Jesus is only half-responsible for founding his. Paul is #6. Isaac Newton, @James Thomas Rook Jr. will be happy to know, is #2, since he is considered the father of science, which rivals religion in the eyes of many and is on the ascendency. Hart also ranks Mohammad before Jesus on the basis that Mohammad’s followers by and large follow him, but Jesus’ “followers” by and large do not. Of course, I view this co-creatorship between Jesus and Paul differently. To my mind, it is to be expected, given Paul’s background and education. He is “bringing his [scholarly] gift to the altar,” doing what the simple folks that comprised early Christian leadership, Peter, John, James, etc, could hardly have been expected to do. Jesus could have done it, of course, but his course was not to suck up to the “educated people,” as though he needed their validation. His course was to appeal to the uncomplicated heart. Let others fill in the scholarly and (for the typical person) boring details—not boring to everyone, of course, but it is well known that Paul’s writings are not the synch to read that Jesus’ sayings are.

This is because the clerk sees you “discreetly parting your suitcoat to reveal your holstered gun, and he doesn’t dare.

Yes. I have cancelled my subscription to the Watchtower. Also The Week. Also my trips to the library. Also any further visits to JW.org. How could I ever have wasted all those hours? Now I am a regular reader. I do nothing else. (No. I have yet to visit. That is not to say maybe it will be so someday. Try.to keep your enthusiasm in check)

No! Say it ain’t so. The only thing that is lacking is that your VW bus ownership does not stretch back to the original ones of the 60’s. You know, the more I think about it, the more I think that the JW website should be taken down and replaced with a Facebook page like yours. That way, Zuckerberg will steal information willy-nilly, the way he does, and we can count it all as placements.

When Anthony Morris, at the 2016 Regional in Atlanta, spoke of coming down south, and his sons had asked him ‘What is a redneck?’ he replied that they “would know them when they saw them.” He was having fun with his opening remarks. Everyone....well, almost everyone....took it in that spirit. In case there was someone who did not, in a subsequent talk he walked it back, referring the the gentle “folk wisdom” of the south. He speaks off the cuff sometimes. Rise, for he too is human. He probably regrets that remark about the tight pants, because @James Thomas Rook Jr. has made it is yeartext ever since. It is very difficult counseling a huge and diverse group of people One will say: “Thanks for the new RULE!!” and his companion will say: “Huh? Did you say something.” I think they just don’t want to find themselves in the shoes of Lot, whose sons-in-law thought he was joking. Even at the Watchtower study last Sunday, the conductor gave an aside about the tight pants, observing that they must have to be put on when wet, so as to allow the fabric to stretch over the feet. Strictly speaking, (even loosely speaking) it is not necessary. But an 80-year old can be forgiven for a few seconds (it was no more than that, and he is universally regarded as a man of integrity and good judgment) of scratching his head and expressing bewilderment at the world that is today. This is the same Watchtower conductor whose lifelong secular work was that of a Porsche dealer mechanic, and who quit in disgust when Porsche began manufacturing SUVs, as though an elite art museum commended displaying that painting of the dogs playing poker. It’s not true, he tells me. He was about to retire anyway, but he does nothing to counter the meme that others have spread around. This is the same Watchtower Study, on how the wisdom of Jehovah is superior to the wisdom of this world, in which I thought the artwork was wrong. The VW bus is one from the 70’s, whereas it should have been one with a funky grill that was from the 60’s. The impeccably dressed brother with the hat is from the 50s—hadn’t dress hats pretty well faded out by the mid-60s? And don’t get me going about the “hippy” conversing with him, who no doubt took off his wig and clothes thereafter and resumed his place analyzing a computer spreadsheet. And while I am on the topic of that Watchtower: My daughter is in town for a few weeks. At the study observation of how some say God-given sexual desire argues for promiscuity, she said: “Well, that’s stupid! God made me to have to pee, too. Does that mean I should pee my pants?” “That’s my daughter!” I told the family gathering, as she related her remark. Frankly, I wish I had thought of it. But back to the tight pants. They were tight in the early 60s, too, and I can remember battles with my [non-Witness] Dad because I wanted to wear them and he had a fit over it, though I gradually won out. Even the “spray-on” descriptions are from the past. I wore clamdiggers, too, cool pants that came in pastel colors, had a stripe down the side, and ended mid-shin. I wore them when visiting my uncle who lives way way out in the sticks, and he said: “What are you doing wearing peddle-pushers? Those are girls’ pants!!” They weren’t peddlepushers, you hillbilly. They were cool clamdiggers. It’s not just pants. Ties widened in the late 60’s as well, regaining the status they previously had given up. I remember Brother Park giving a talk about how the Bethel brothers were very concerned for Brother Knorr, who showed up for meals day after day with very wide ties, at a time when the styles were changing—I think he say they ultimately became as thin as a pencil. Those brothers were so worried about him, because he was “not in style.” “BUT DO YOU KNOW WHAT HAPPENED?!” he gasped. Ties began to reverse and became wider and wider—and now Brother Knorr is “in style!” And yes, I have rambled a bit, doing what John has accused me of. Sorry.

That’s because there is not. Jack is drinking too much of his own Kool-Aid. This is because I have tipped them off that you do not appear to, and they can save themselves the gas and time by doing other things with them.

Even the part about 2060 being the final year?

Most of the involved cartoonists have said something similar to Einstein: “If I had known, I would have been a locksmith.”

I locked mine long ago, and yes, it is a pain. I almost always forget that I have done it, and usually forget how to unlock it—though I am getting better. The greatest (though not only) reason that the scoundrels want to steal your info is so they can drain you dry, and a credit freeze makes that much less likely. I think what needs to happen is that AOC be appointed CEO of Equifax. By the way, the Green Deal that she floated before Congress that was largely shouted down, has been adopted independently, even enhanced, by Andrew Cuomo, the NYS governor. He is advertising that his new law will make New York, not only the greenest place in the country, but probably in the world. 70% of all power to be derived from windmills by 2030, up from the present 20% or so. All emissions of any sort are to be monitored. I hear that @James Thomas Rook Jr. has signed on as the Chief Engineer. There is a huge generational divide, not only on climate change, but on democracy. The young are far more likely to think climate change is the prime threat to life, while the older tend to be less concerned, often thinking it is a political plot of the left. To be sure, AOC wants to go left, and a very large—is the the majority?—of the young want to go there with her. It will always be the case when the gap between rich and poor grows too great. The poor are not going to be students of economics—they’re poor, and preoccupied with survival. All they know is that whatever the system may be, it is not working for them, and they lose patience as they see things getting, not less equitable, but more.

Many things are hard to find, until you find them. Which is it: “absolutely” or “the general consensus?”

I don’t really know who anyone here is, nor do I know exactly where he is coming from. I skim a lot. I missed that point of his. It is enough to know that he is not against Jehovah’s people. One does not have to weigh in on every little thing. Not having seen it, I don’t know whether I agree with it or not. I think that SM and I are not on the same page in everything, but for purposes of this forum, we share more ground than not. It is not at all like Witness and yourself—you, who have outgrown any need or desire for God—and she, who is far too pious even for me, quoting reams of verses every time she bats an eyelid, each of which you reject. And here she is lending you support as though a faithful wife. It is not that I am “displeased” with it. I just find it weird. That is what is “too much.” It is not like when, ages ago, someone said of my young son that he was “too much” as she listened to him, and he later asked: “Why did that lady say that there was too much of me?”

This is too much—absolutely too much. Witness and @Srecko Sostarmaking common cause, as though she was his anointed. Meanwhile.... Let us freely admit it. There are times when nobody says it better than the ol pork chop..

“And the 70 returned and they were bummed. The Lord said, “Why are you bummed.” They answered, “We sat at home from morning through the burning heat of the day, straight into evening, and nobody knocked on our door.” I don’t think that this is true. The nuttiness is no more than it has always been, and is in many respects less. To some extent, it is exactly what one would expect. Jesus said he did not come to call on those who do not need a physician—he came to call on those who do. When our people go nuts, they still would not hurt a fly. When those outside go nuts, for many of them you’d better call the SWAT team. The conventions invariably make a good impression. Both the website and the literature carts add a measure of dignity not always conveyed by any given publisher. Events transpiring in Russia paint us as downright champions of human rights. Yes, the charges of CSA are bad, but they are largely offset by the fact that there is no sizable group of persons not also enmeshed in them, as well as a general weariness of lawyers. You well remember when premiere television or billboard sponsors were manufacturers or vendors. Today they are lawyers, and people weary over the massive transfers of cash that they enable, whilst skimming off at least the top third. They think of all the things they used to be able to do that they no longer can do on account of lawyers making things cost-prohibitive, and it qualifies any zeal for whatever cause they might represent. Even as people as individuals hope that their turn winning the lawyer-lottery may come next, people as a group share a general sense that the barristers have destroyed the fabric of life. Insurance premiums of all sorts skyrocket at a time that overall inflation is quite low. Everyone knows why. Nonstop lawsuits on everything under the sun amounts to a tax on everyone else. I think it is too much you pumping life into anti-Witness memes—living and breathing that life. You are consumed with them, and thus you come to think they far more occupy people’s attention than they really do. It is like that with every cause. It is like that even with us. We start to imagine that everyone on earth is turning over in their minds and hearts the kingdom cause, siding for or against. But when I met an author in the dog park, he said: “Watchtower—that’s the Mormons, isn’t it?” https://www.tomsheepandgoats.com/2019/07/the-author-in-the-dog-park.html

Oh, come now. He does it by showing up here. I, however, have not. I really really really want to, but I am too scared.

Uh oh. There does not seem to be that option anymore. I’m sunk. Something seems a little flakey with this software lately. Has the Librarian (that old hen) fallen off the wagon again?

Yes, yes, another diatribe on why how are spreading out the Fine Feast on Facebook, whereas the JW anointed are no good. Still, you didn’t address the question. Why doesn’t he go there? Actually, @James Thomas Rook Jr. had said it, and I missed it. Something about being the only game in town. It is hard to keep up. I think he means that with Jehovah’s Witnesses there is a combination of pure teachings that are found no where else. Some of them are individually, but the combination is not. They involve such things as the Name, the kingdom, no immortality of the soul, no Trinity, the reason for suffering, the preaching work, the need to keep watchful, transformed personalities, and so forth. The Christian ministry is a treasure, however it is a treasure carried in “earthen vessels”—that is, people, who are not unflawed. Although he fights so much and so bitterly with the bus driver that I can’t imagine why he doesn’t just leave—it would make the driver happier, the bus company happier, the passengers happier, and one would think, him happier—yet he does not do it, probably for the above reasons. (except for the ministry, and the nearness of the end, which he doesn’t seem to think is so) People are a collection of their experiences, both those that have happened to them, and those they have manufactured. I have called John a loon. Maybe he is not, but he so closely resembles one that I cannot tell the difference. My bad. As much as he carries on about worshipping the GB (with key support from JTR at critical times), he cannot seem able to understand that it is factors in the second paragraph that form a Witness’s faith, and following the direction of the GB is no more than not fighting with the traffic cop or the coach or the mentor. Let us humor him for a moment. Let us grant his dream come true, that malfeasance will someday be uncovered ....gasp!’....high up in the ranks. So? It would hardly affect one’s faith. They are men—everyone knows that. There have been many times in the past when the earthly organization is shaken practically into rubble—in America during WWI, in Axis countries during WWII, in Russia now—and as soon as the heat is off, God’s people rebuild like ants, because their faith was never in human arrangements—those just exist to facilitate and enhance spiritual things—their faith was in the spiritual things themselves. Many times in the past brothers in responsible positions have proven unfaithful, sometimes even deceitful, and have been removed and replaced. It happens. Even GB members have been removed—sometimes with fanfare and sometimes not. Faith itself continues. It was never in human arrangements. It was in spiritual things. Enemies of the faith make the same mistake here that they do in Russia. Failing to grasp spiritual things, they imagine that if the shut down the earthly coordinating organization, the faith will collapse. Instead, it is like stomping on the anthill. The ants run for cover, but almost immediately they commence rebuilding. Their faith was never in the anthill—that was just their to magnify their ant-life. The Bible reading last week in 1 Timothy 1:18 encourages ones (Timothy) to hold “faith and a good conscience, which some have thrust aside, resulting in the shipwreck of their faith. Hy·me·naeʹus and Alexander are among these, and I have handed them over to Satan so that they may be taught by discipline not to blaspheme.” As long as you hold faith and a good conscience, you are fine—and the faith is with regard to God and his Son, as accurately represented by the factors of paragraph 2. If Hymenaeus and Alexander go bad on you, to be sure, it is a downer, but it does not destroy faith and a good conscience. And so that John does not once again attach his maniacal laughing emoji to whatever he disagrees with—which is anything from a faithful Witness—I will do it myself and beat him at his own game.

What makes no sense to me is that you have evaded my question. If you have peered into the deeper things of God and have decided that those running the show are frauds, why do you come to the meetings that they sponsor, as you must have for them to give you any grief. Witness runs a fine shop that she operates out of Facebook. Why don’t you go there?

Did you drive him there in his chariot? That being the case, why would he even show up afterwards at any meeting directed by his spiritual enemies, so that they could “take you and he to the back room” or however you phrased it? If their baptism is no good, why assume that their meetings are? It makes no sense.

“What I mean is this, that each one of you says: “I belong to Paul,” “But I to A·polʹlos,” “But I to Ceʹphas,” “But I to Rook.” Is there a reason that he cannot be baptized at an assembly or convention like every other Witness on the planet? Did you tell him to wear tight pants, too?

From “TrueTom vs the Apostates:” Drive this matter of child sexual abuse to the Supreme Court, if need be. If they decide to hear it, it will be case number 50-something that Witnesses have tried before that body. Let it be resolved once and for all when the time is right. Many groups are driven to the edge these days over child sexual abuse, as it becomes almost the only issue that matters to some. Over such matters, the Boy Scouts are exploring bankruptcy proceedings. The Boy Scouts! who have long fought the evil but did not succeed in eliminating it. The Boy Scouts! who taught generations of boys to be responsible. The Boy Scouts! who I can’t walk the area trails without coming across historical kiosks or other amenities constructed as someone’s Eagle Scout project. The Boy Scouts! who when they were successfully sued on behalf of a single plaintiff in 2010 for $18.5 million, one of that person’s legal team stated his belief that they “have undertaken a truly noble and important task in mentoring young boys, for which they are to be commended,” and it was his sincere hope that the $18 million judgment “will impress upon them the need to do it better.” Now that he has driven them clear to insolvency, it will be a little hard for his dream to come true. Though groups as the Boy Scouts manifestly benefit children in ways not readily duplicated, their deep pockets permit a pummeling such as cannot be visited on unorganized segments of society, though it be every bit as accommodating to child sexual abuse—and without providing any benefit. It will be so with groups that instill religious values into youth as well. Some elders wanted to meet with him afterwords, and he published their names, photos, and addresses. I wrote of it here: https://www.tomsheepandgoats.com/2019/04/he-has-blocked-me-i-think-that-says-it-all.html Given how vested you are in this, it is surprising that you do not know

Language, for one. “We’re going to impeach this motherf****r!” is practically the first thing her squad-mate said upon entering Congress. The whole idea of a “squad” is ridiculous, though granted, that is a media concoction, not hers. The taxpayers in NY are not thrilled that she scuttled the Amazon deal. Amazon is that big company that employs a lot of people who thereafter pay taxes.

Aren’t you in Britain? Don’t you have some exotic cars there that I could buy? What was the last auto that James Bond tooled around in? My current project is to go through Dear Mr. Putin - Jehovah’s Witnesses Write Russia paragraph by paragraph to re-examine wording. I have already done so to (mostly) fix a self-devised system of punctuation. That book has caused me more trouble than my other three put together, mostly because of the manner in which it was written. Once I have completed the task, I will look into releasing it on audio, as an author-read narrator. There are many many things that I am not good at, in fact, almost everything. However, public reading is something that I am good at.

And John has no sense of hyperbole, rather unfortunate, because Jesus uses them frequently.

The Witness organization cannot possibly be as bad as you charge, for the Devil is not that bad. You are a loon, John, wildly overstating all of your points, substantial or trivial, implacable to any persuasion to back down even a little on any of them. Nothing shows more clearly. More later.

What surprises me as I go through the sequential schedule of Bible reading, now focused on the letters of Paul, is how well they anticipate current “anti-cultist” complaints of being brainwashed, misled, duped, and so forth. What would appear to be a brand new scenario is just history recycled—put on steroids by modern viral methods of communication. Given that the following was said then, when the only communication was word-of-mouth, it is not at all surprising that it would be so prolific today: “We have wronged no one, we have corrupted no one, we have taken advantage of no one,” says the apostle at 2 Corinthians 7:2, as though the accusation of those things was commonplace. “Nevertheless, you say, I was “crafty” and I caught you “by trickery,” he says again at 2 Corinthians 12:16. For sure, Solomon had a point: “There is nothing new under the sun.” (Eccles 1:9) Do “apostates” proliferate today, as though something new? It’s the oldest game in town. “For there are many—I used to mention them often but now I mention them also with weeping—who are walking as enemies of the torture stake of the Christ. Their end is destruction, and their god is their belly, and their glory is really their shame, and they have their minds on earthly things.” (Philippians 3:18-19) ”Having their mind on earthly things” is where its at today, and there are endless people who obsess over petty freedoms at the expense of totally missing the real ones. Their “critical thinking” has sold them down the river; they have shipwrecked whatever faith they once had—just like Paul says about two actual malcontents in the first century, when he advised Timothy to “go on waging the fine warfare, holding faith and a good conscience, which some have thrust aside, resulting in the shipwreck of their faith. Hymenaeus and Alexander are among these, and I have handed them over to Satan so that they may be taught by discipline not to blaspheme.” (1 Timothy 3:18-19) What exactly is it to be “handed over to Satan?” The only other use of the expression (1 Corinthians 5:5) makes clear that it is expulsion from the congregation. Today their counterparts on social media protest loudly that discipline. They protest another sort of discipline as well. “Just as I encouraged you to stay in Ephesus when I was about to go to Macedonia, so I do now, in order for you to command certain ones not to teach different doctrine, nor to pay attention to false stories and to genealogies. Such things end up in nothing useful but merely give rise to speculations rather than providing anything from God in connection with faith.” Today the ones so “commanded” would hop on social media to rail that you can’t even breathe a word different from the tyrannical men on top to be muzzled at first transgression, and ejected at second. Jehovah’s Witnesses are a cult if and only if the Bible is a cult manual. Nobody has apostates like Jehovah’s Witnesses. Nobody has apostates more prolific, more determined, and in some cases they seem almost deranged—I mean, if someone so much as farts at Bethel, there is one of these yo-yos to start a thread on it, which is not ignored, but is joined in by countless persons in sympathy, some of whom are coherent and some of whom are pure loons. It is as it should be. We should be proud of our apostates. Nobody else has anyone like them. What if they did not exist? Would you not have to wonder why? No writer of the New Testament fails to deal with them. What if there were no mention of them today? Would it not indicate that the faith had so strayed from its roots to embrace contemporary thinking that there was little to apostatize from? I will admit that the only apostates that interest me are the ones that go atheist, which partly accounts for my take on the 2 Thessalonians “Man of Lawlessness.” Having learned the man-made origins of Trinity and the immortal soul, and having come to appreciate the damage these teachings do to to a close relationship with God, can one really go back to them? Often the “believing” apostates do not—they simply become ambiguous on such doctrines, thinking that they hardly matter—to each his own. Essentially, they want to retain God, but they acquiesce to the greater world molding their thinking as to outlook, goals, and morals. They want to “throw off all restraint” and in no time at all, they have lost whatever unity they once had. When they can be distracted from attacking their former roots on social media, they are to found lambasting each other over differences in matters scientific, medical, climate, politics, etc.