Patiently waiting for Truth

This is interesting because my 26 year old son and i were having a conversation about the Law or Moses / Nation of Israel ( I will start a separate topic of the conversation above ) Let us get one thing clear. The NATION OF ISRAEL had LAW. If you were born into, or, if you became part of, the NATION OF ISRAEL, you were under that LAW. However, CHRISTIANS are NOT under LAW. Christians should live by BIBLE PRINCIPLES, which would be governed by a BIBLE trained CONSCIENCE. So xero's comment above smells badly of the Devil's work. Xero is trying, but failing, to prove the need of a dictatorship organisation. Once again xero links two completely separate things, (quote) " a faithful Christian or a faithful organization". Those things are miles apart. Quote " if these failed to either submit to organizational authority". = dictatorship. Quote "an earmark of what I'd expect of a true religion - that the religion would expect and enforce biblical standards and principles." The Watchtower and multiple JW orgs do not have "biblical standards and principles." but they do enforce man made rules. If you want to go back to the Nation of Israel then your GB / ranks / Elders bind up heavy loads and put those loads on the shoulders of congregants, but those in 'control' do not help to ease any load. Pharisees.

Do you seriously need to read that stuff to know about your own conscience ? Or is it just as a matter of something to read ? Are you trying to justify something ? Update : Having read the first 6 pages i can see where it is coming from and i can see that you will thoroughly enjoy it . You may even try to use it as an excuse for the dictatorship by your GB, down through the ranks and the Elders. The first 6 pages deliberately uses a bad example of a wicked man pretending that his church / elders are picking on him. This is the type of example that JWs use on this forum. The difference being that JWs blame innocent people for wrongdoing if those innocent people decide to leave the wicked JW Org.

You condemn my laughing emojis, BUT, you try to turn serious issues into laughable subjects, in which case you are much worse than I. But what you comment proved (although not intentionally) is that God has no interest in the Watchtower or JW Org. For if God through Christ were to control your wicked orgs, then things would be done properly and those orgs (plural) would be clean and trustworthy.

This is a new topic (because we are supposed to do this) based on information given by @JW Insider JWI gave information about someone being told NOT TO partake of the emblems at the Memorial. This evening is the Memorial of the last meal that Christ shared with His closest followers. Whilst we remember how Christ gave his life I would like to share a scripture at Revelation 5 9, And they sing a new song, saying: “You are worthy to take the scroll and open its seals, for you were slaughtered and with your blood you bought people for God out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation, 10 and you made them to be a kingdom and priests to our God, and they are to rule as kings over the earth.” This scripture shows that Christ 'was slaughtered' for the Anointed ones. So I have a question. Do JWs who feel they are of the Anointed have to ask the Elders for permission to partake of the Emblems ? Q2. Does any human on this earth have the right to judge if another person can partake of those emblems ?

You see what I'm talking about? Yes I agree with you, and i laugh about it. But it fitted so well, about Big Brother / GB and want to muzzle people / keep everything inside the Org, only tell the elders. The topic was about the world, but it shows how the GB / W/t / JW Org mimic the world closely.

Yes people can't even be an individual now. Being crazy doesn't mean being different if everyone is crazy.

Oh dear. I'm glad the UK left that lot behind.

Fault 1 mixing up 'the org' with the first century anointed. Fault 2. similar to fault 1 but even more insulting to the anointed apostles of Christ. Fault 3. Presuming that anyone wishes to 'trash' the WTS org, using excuses not facts. Fault 4. Creating a diversion by misplacing the blame, because you do not have truthful answers. Fault 5. Fantasising without basis. Um, well done. quite good overall You see I can laugh at myself and accept your insults, and not get bitter or angry. Have a great day.

That's a good one. Jesus was obviously testing them because it does sound off putting. So those that stayed with him. Did they stay because Holy Spirit guided their hearts and minds, or was it that they simply didn't have anywhere else to go ? It was a bit of a sheep and goats dividing moment maybe.

So then tell me, Who is the guilty party here ? the elders likely made a mistake, probably because they assumed that neither of these were truly anointed, because of traditional conditioning around previous teachings. because of traditional conditioning around previous teachings. Tell us about this bit please. Conditioning.......... Brain washing, indoctrination. Previous teachings............... False 'truth'. Fake information from a fake leadership. You and Tom write sentences so freely, without really thinking about what you are writing. But in truth you are admitting that the GB and the Elders are not fit for purpose.

Leaders of a Jehovah's Witnesses church 'made a 15-year-old girl listen to an audio tape of her own rape for four hours for her to say it was "consensual"', Utah Supreme Court hears It would seem that JWs use the same tactics. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8942521/Jehovah-Witnesses-leaders-girl-15-listen-recording-rape-four-hours.html

Another joke from CC but he actually hangs himself with his own rope here. God will punish me as an individual BECAUSE I have an individual conscience. God will not punish the congregation for my sins because God will not be using collective conscience.

This whole comment above is so funny that it's hard to know where to start to answer it. I presume Tom is on the wine or vodka or something. Of course Tom will now provide proof of God's true guidance and give names of the organisations that God used from the year 100 through to 1800. Tom will now show how God was using specific organisations when, ops, That Russell guy, he said there was no need of an Organisation, and he had plenty of people agreeing with him it seems. Tom also deliberately tries to hide the FACT that I am NOT Anti- organisation. Even governments are organised to a degree. Families are organised. Businesses are organied. So too, religion will be organised. Let's quote Tom here " If God is worth his salt, he will provide adequate human leadership." Yes Tom, God will provide a True Anointed remnant to replace ALL false religions in good time, before the Judgement comes. Quote "Jehovah’s people will cut their shepherds some slack, just as was necessary in the first century," Yes well. the blind leading the blind. Catholics will probably cut the Pope and the priests some slack too. But please give me 5 examples of this 'first century' slackness, where the 'followers' cut their leaders some slack. Quote "But they also recognize that these ones will be relentlessly attacked simply for the Christian shepherding work that they do." No, JWs are so blind that they believe the things they are told. Most JWs do not do research into things such as CSA. They do not research scripture from an outside viewpoint. They believe that their leaders are the ones to follow without question. And most JWs easily give up their conscience to follow orders. Sorry to be so blunt, but when you talk rubbish then you have to be open to a reply.

Who thought they had the GOD GIVEN or CHRIST GIVEN right to tell her not to partake of the emblems ? In my opinion, if you were there at the time and you said nothing then you are just as guilty as that one whom gave the ORDER not to partake. Remember clearly what Jesus said. Matthew 25 :40 In reply the King will say to them, ‘Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did it to one of the least of these my brothers, you did it to me.’ 45 Then he will answer them, saying: ‘Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did not do it to one of these least ones, you did not do it to me.’ 46 These will depart into everlasting cutting-off, but the righteous ones into everlasting life.” JWI 'Just wrote up a related experience' as if it was just writing about today's weather. Do you people not see the importance of such things concerning the Anointed ? The other thought is, that if the other sister was distressed then maybe she needed to examine her own heart condition as to why she would be distressed.

The problem is not the act of disfellowshipping. The problems are, the reasons for disfellowshipping, and that scripture say to take it before the Congregation, before disfellowshipping. BUT the Elders act in secret, behind closed doors and do not give the congregation true reasons for disfellowshipping someone.

So this destroys the idea of 'collective conscience'. And it proves the idea of individual conscience.

Rubbish. but now I get a glimpse of how ex Elders think. Are you suggesting that a person would have to be a Pedophile to know that it is wrong ? Do you then have to experience everything to have a conscience about it ? NO.

Yes and it seems the Watchtower are even supplying the paper with a special logo in the bottom corner. One that can be read by 'posh' cell phones.

This is a strange expression. Who hate THE FAITH. Faith is a personal strong belief in something or someone unseen but yet 'known'. Are you replacing the Watchtowers words 'the Truth' with your words 'The Faith' ? It would appear that 'the faith' of JWs is in the things seen, not unseen. Those things seen being the GB and the massive amount of real estate that the W/t own.

Read this as, dictatorship of the Elders.

And you xero lick it up as if it's strawberry jam.

But what you are doing here is, putting your trust in 'men'. It is so funny how JWs will deny somethings 'men' say, but happily follow other things that 'men' say when it serves their purpose.

I'll give you a clue. I am alive, so my mother must have fed me some reasonable food when I was young. However my mother was a whore and she was the cause of my father's death, so I hated her. Now apply that thinking to JW Org. Within a life time a person (or an Org) may do a couple of good things, but it does not excuse all the wickedness.

Yes scripture sank in and stayed in. It was Watchtower teachings that i threw away because they are lies

What rubbish. Paul was directly commissioned by Christ. Jesus Christ appeared to Paul when Paul was Saul. Acts 9 :4 4and he fell to the ground and heard a voice saying to him, “Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting Me?” 5And he said, “Who are You, Lord?” And He said, “I am Jesus whom you are persecuting, 6but get up and enter the city, and it will be told you what you must do.” 7The men who traveled with him stood speechless, hearing the voice but seeing no one. 8Saul got up from the ground, and though his eyes were open, he could see nothing; and leading him by the hand, they brought him into Damascus. 9And he was three days without sight, and neither ate nor drank.