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Patiently waiting for Truth

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    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Arauna in “Yahweh” or “Jehovah”?   
    *** New World Translation of the Christian Greek Scriptures, 1950, Foreword, p.25 ***
    While inclining to view the pronunciation "Yah-weh'"  as the more correct way,
    But Mr Carroll still advertises the company name. 
  2. Downvote
  3. Thanks
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Arauna in Searching for the earliest mention of the Israelite god, "Yahweh" (Tetragrammaton) aka "Jehovah" in Modern English   
    I saw a historical discrepancy and said what I thought.  Sorry to get you all in a tizzy about this..... I thought you would just find it interesting that there is a discrepancy - actually 2.
    I liked the link @Chioke Lin gave us: 
    "Among ancient Egyptian designations for types of foreign peoples in the New Kingdom Period (1550–1070 BC), the term Shasu occurs fairly frequently. It is generally accepted that the term Shasu means nomads or Bedouin people, referring primarily to the nomadic peoples of Syria-Palestine. There are two hieroglyphic references in New Kingdom Period texts to an area called "the land of the Shasu of Yahweh." Except for the Old Testament, these are the oldest references found in any ancient texts to the God Yahweh.It is very likely that the Egyptians of the New Kingdom Period classified all of the ancient Edomites, Ammonites, Moabites, Amalekites, Midianites, Kenites, Hapiru, and Israelites as Shasu.

    There is even a reference dating to ca. 1250 BC in Papyrus Anastasi I to a group of giant Shasu living in Canaan who may be identified with the giants encountered by the Israelites at the time of the Exodus. Clearly the Egyptians knew about Yahweh as can be seen in the Soleb and Amarah-West topographical lists, but they did not worship him, and they apparently did not want to worship him."
    This indicates as the librarian said : that the inscription could have been of a later date. Since Amenhotep did not rule in 1500BCE era. 
  4. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Arauna in Searching for the earliest mention of the Israelite god, "Yahweh" (Tetragrammaton) aka "Jehovah" in Modern English   
    Agreed, right after the flood  everyone were nomads but later as clans grew in groups they would later become nations with city-states - such as the Edomites (offspring from Esau), Amonites and Moabites (offspring of Lot) etc. Later on there were still nomads roaming about and they lived in areas which were not occupied by cities. In Canaan the different Canaanite nations occupied specific areas. Joseph was picked up and sold in Egypt by a group of Ishmaelites /Midianites who were offspring from Abraham.  By this time there were many caravans which were travelling merchants who sold goods and travelled around different trade routs. 
    About 800 years after the flood - Egypt was a massive country comprising different tribes (at least 20 Nomes - states with governors - maybe even different dialects) and even  Ethiopia was already a nation.  It was in this time that Jehovah led Israel out of Egypt in the exodus.  800 years after flood is a loooong time.  Nations had formed and wars were everywhere. 
    The archeologist mentioned the inscription which referred to NOMADS of Jahweh which the Pharoah had conquered.  He speculated that it was the Israelites AFTER  the exodus......as the exodus took place +- 1512 BCE.....  this  speculation is not based on the reality.  Israel Never went back to Egypt after the exodus (but a break away group before the exodus could have become nomads).  If there were a group of nomads who had Jehwah or jahweh as their god they could also have been another nomadic group which split off from other peoples after the flood and remained in pockets and travelled around.  He says this because the inscription is dated to the 15th century but then he uses the wrong Egyptian king! which sat on the throne much later! 
    Today there are pockets of Africans in North East Africa who have Jewish customs. Apart from Ethiopia there are other tribes. They must have become proselytes at one time or had contact with Israel and or split off from other tribes who had these customs. The traditions were carried over from generation to generation.
    This kind of thing makes for very interesting history.
     
    I do not know if you deliberately misunderstand me.  No - I am not saying the hieroglyphs are not 1500 years BCE or that the Name is wrong.  
    Let me put it this way - I do not expect a gynecologists to know everything about heart of eye problems. I do not expect a bone doctor to know a gynies business. 
    Similarly and archeologist usually specializes in one field.... .  I do not know the field of this archeologist but I am thankful he cares about the bible and Jehovah's name.
    Unfortunately he did sloppy biblical history about the inscription.  We are supposed to be the bible students are we not? And therefore I say he was wrong to say it was inscribed by the Israelites AFTER the exodus.  It does not make sense.   
  5. Haha
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Chioke Lin in Searching for the earliest mention of the Israelite god, "Yahweh" (Tetragrammaton) aka "Jehovah" in Modern English   
    The video just shows another instance where God's name has been found. In Egypt, it's not the first time. This is just the latest. If archeologist continue to look, they will find plenty of evidence. Some will be open to the public, some will not, due to human intervention of not wanting God's name to be truly known.
    https://www.breakingchristiannews.com/articles/display_art.html?ID=7493#:~:text=The oldest historical mention of ancient Israel occurs,people called the Shasu. (Photo%3A the Merneptah stele)
    This "Stele of YHWH in Egypt" is, from referencing, The Prophecies of Isaiah 18–20 concerning Egypt and Kush. Another proof of the "oldest historical mention" of the "tetragrammaton" in Egypt.
    The Vatican has had in its position a reference of Yahwe from about 490CE that they just released about 2 years ago.
    What matters, God does have a personal name, and it should be used. That thing about God's name being forbidden is a man-made thing.
    Keep in mind that "Nehemia Gordon" found a specific instance of God's name with the (Y) Yahovah. 
  6. Haha
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to The Librarian in Searching for the earliest mention of the Israelite god, "Yahweh" (Tetragrammaton) aka "Jehovah" in Modern English   
    that tablet could potentially be seen as the earliest known artifact to mention God in the Land of Israel.  
    Interesting... but there is also the possibility it comes from much later. Whereas the Temple in Ancient Egypt is pretty rock solid... pun intended 😉
     
  7. Downvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Arauna in “Yahweh” or “Jehovah”?   
    CURRENCY and FAMILIARITY = MAN MADE TRADITION 
    CUSTOM = man made tradition.  
    And then JW org / GB / Watchtower, pretend to be 'no part of this world' SO WHY FOLLOW TRADITIONS OF MEN.
    we have retained the form "Jehovah" because of people's familiarity = MAN MADE TRADITION, or worse.
    Moreover, it preserves, equally with other forms, the four letters of the tetragrammaton JHVH.
    Now I was taught by JWs that YHWH was the four letters of the tetragrammaton.
    So one of them has to be a lie. 
    And all the time they admit that 
    While inclining to view the pronunciation "Yah-weh'"  as the more correct way,
     
  8. Haha
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to The Librarian in Searching for the earliest mention of the Israelite god, "Yahweh" (Tetragrammaton) aka "Jehovah" in Modern English   
    See also: Jehovah
    To potential commentators: Please note this topic thread is not to be about the pronunciation differences of opinion on Yahweh, YHWH, Jehovah, Jave, Jehova etc... for that please comment here
     
  9. Like
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Witness in “Yahweh” or “Jehovah”?   
    What does the "Aid to Bible Understanding" say about the name, "Jehovah"; which isn't found in the "Insight" volumes?
     
     
  10. Like
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Witness in Patiently Waiting For Truth wants to discuss his take on my post: Searching for the earliest mention of the Israelite god, "Yahweh" (Tetragrammaton) aka "Jehovah" in Modern English   
    Dear, @The Librarian it appears that @Arauna is telling you that this video is twaddle. 
    I do keep saying that it is difficult to know what is truth and what isn't. 
    Oh well, I'll keep using YHWH and you lot can use that false name you love so much. 
    YHWH seems genuine but some here might not even agree with that. 
  11. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Witness in Patiently Waiting For Truth wants to discuss his take on my post: Searching for the earliest mention of the Israelite god, "Yahweh" (Tetragrammaton) aka "Jehovah" in Modern English   
    Seriously, I can't make out if you are agreeing, being sarcastic, or calling Egyptians liars. 
    I haven't researched the video to find out how old this video is but I trust @The Librarian to have researched the authenticity of it. 
    @The Librarian mentions in the title "Yahweh" (Tetragrammaton) aka "Jehovah" in Modern English.
    Why do you need a modern name for Almighty God. God who has always existed. God who will always exist. God who's name has such important meaning. 
    Why would you need to change God's original name. In fact WHO would want to change God's original name. The only one that would want to wipe out God's original name is Satan the devil. 
  12. Haha
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to BroRando in The truth about Armageddon...   
    The truth about Armageddon is that there is a parellal account that we can learn from.  We read, "They did not see his signs and his deeds that he did in Egypt to Pharʹaoh king of Egypt and to all his land; or what he did to the armies of Egypt, to Pharʹaoh’s horses and war chariots, which were overwhelmed by the waters of the Red Sea when they were chasing after you, and Jehovah destroyed them once and for all." (Deuteronomy 11:3-4)
    The generation after Pharaoh did not witness Jehovah's signs and deeds but Pharaoh and his armies did. Remember the ten plagues?  Even before the ten plagues began Pharaoh was personally witnessed too by Moses and Aaron.
    Pharaoh and his armies can be compared to Gog of Magog.  Just as Pharaoh and his army were destroyed, soon, Gog of Magog to be destoyed as the Great Crowd makes its way into the land of milk and honey. While Gog of Magog grows jealous of the health and prosperity of Jehovah's Witnesses. It will prove to be too much for them. And they will be motivated to plunder. “Are you invading to get much spoil and plunder? Have you assembled your armies to carry off silver and gold, to take wealth and property, to seize a very great spoil?”’ (Exekiel 38:13)
     “This is what the Sovereign Lord Jehovah says: ‘In that day thoughts will come into your heart, and you will devise an evil plan.  You will say: “I will invade the land of unprotected settlements. I will come against those living in security, without disturbance, all of them living in settlements unprotected by walls, bars, or gates.”   It will be to take much spoil and plunder, to attack the devastated places that are now inhabited and a people regathered from the nations, who are accumulating wealth and property, those who are living in the center of the earth.  “‘Sheʹban and Deʹdan,o the merchants of Tarʹshishp and all its warriors will say to you: “Are you invading to get much spoil and plunder? Have you assembled your armies to carry off silver and gold, to take wealth and property, to seize a very great spoil?”’ (Exekiel 38:10-13)
  13. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Witness in The truth about Armageddon...   
    Rev 13:4 - They worshiped the dragon because he gave authority to the beast. And they worshiped the beast, saying,
    “Who is like the beast? Who is able to wage war against it?” 
     So the beast opened his mouth to blaspheme against God—to blaspheme both His name and his dwelling place, that is, those who dwell in heaven. (dwelling place - 1 Pet 2:5,9; 1 Cor 3:16,17; Eph 2:20-22)
    7 The beast was permitted to go to war against the saints and conquer them.
    W 02/8/1 - “Representing the royal priesthood are appointed elders, who serve in positions of responsibility in congregations of Jehovah’s people around the earth. These men deserve our respect and wholehearted support, whether they are of the anointed or not.
    Rather than challenge their authority, we truly appreciate our hardworking elders!”
    Revelation continued:   He was given ruling authority over every tribe, people, language, and nation
    W 12/2/1 pp. 8,9 - “With God’s backing, millions from all nations, tribes, and tongues are gathering together to form a harmonious, loving brotherhood.
     8 and all those who live on the earth will worship the beast, everyone whose name has not been written since the foundation of the world in the book of life belonging to the Lamb who was killed.
     9 If anyone has an ear, he had better listen!  Rev 13:6-9
     
  14. Haha
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Peter Carroll in The truth about Armageddon...   
    And still these pretend Christians sing the same old song, lies. 
    Mr Caroll still spouting the same old lies about God's name, and still serving the Org. 
    Arauna saying that is it Yehovah but still using Jehovah.
    Mr Rando coming up with many different names on his comments, but still thinks it's Jehovah.
    BUT it's still YHWH, and His son Yeshua. 
    And look at that book stand in above comment. Do you see one Bible on offer ? NO. What you see on that stand is the words of men. JWs are just puppets offering the words of their GB. 
    And the orgs logo, JW org. They have reduced the name of their god to just one letter, 'J'. 
    Isn't that an insult ?
    Who do your serve ? JW Org. Who do you serve ? JW Org. Who do you serve ? JW Org. 
    Who should you serve ? YHWH through Yeshua. 
  15. Haha
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from BroRando in The truth about Armageddon...   
    And still these pretend Christians sing the same old song, lies. 
    Mr Caroll still spouting the same old lies about God's name, and still serving the Org. 
    Arauna saying that is it Yehovah but still using Jehovah.
    Mr Rando coming up with many different names on his comments, but still thinks it's Jehovah.
    BUT it's still YHWH, and His son Yeshua. 
    And look at that book stand in above comment. Do you see one Bible on offer ? NO. What you see on that stand is the words of men. JWs are just puppets offering the words of their GB. 
    And the orgs logo, JW org. They have reduced the name of their god to just one letter, 'J'. 
    Isn't that an insult ?
    Who do your serve ? JW Org. Who do you serve ? JW Org. Who do you serve ? JW Org. 
    Who should you serve ? YHWH through Yeshua. 
  16. Haha
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Arauna in The truth about Armageddon...   
    And still these pretend Christians sing the same old song, lies. 
    Mr Caroll still spouting the same old lies about God's name, and still serving the Org. 
    Arauna saying that is it Yehovah but still using Jehovah.
    Mr Rando coming up with many different names on his comments, but still thinks it's Jehovah.
    BUT it's still YHWH, and His son Yeshua. 
    And look at that book stand in above comment. Do you see one Bible on offer ? NO. What you see on that stand is the words of men. JWs are just puppets offering the words of their GB. 
    And the orgs logo, JW org. They have reduced the name of their god to just one letter, 'J'. 
    Isn't that an insult ?
    Who do your serve ? JW Org. Who do you serve ? JW Org. Who do you serve ? JW Org. 
    Who should you serve ? YHWH through Yeshua. 
  17. Downvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Peter Carroll in The truth about Armageddon...   
    I've never seen so many pathetic JWs as there are on here.
    All acting like children in the playground. All singing the same song.
    "You are apostates, you serve satan" The JWs sing it over and over again. 
    No real answers so they sing this silly song. 
    Then, instead of giving praise to GOD through Christ,
    They give praise to the JW org.  So who really are the apostates ? 
    Who really have turned their attention away from YHWH and Yeshua, and are now serving an organisation ?  
    It is you that need to be careful. 
     
  18. Haha
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Arauna in The truth about Armageddon...   
    So you are saying that a person that goes to investigate the original manuscripts, this person has to be anointed to be able to distinguish the spelling of the Name of god?  Only the true anointed can understand this?  
    I will not ask any further questions because then I will just expose you.  I think you have humiliated yourself enough!
  19. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Witness in The truth about Armageddon...   
    I'm sorry, but you don't get it. 
    If Jesus ever pronounced the tetragrammaton out loud, he would never have said "Jehovah", or
    "Yahovah" or "Yehovah".  Do you really think he would connect the Hebrew word, "hovah" (Strong's 1943) to identify the Father?
    Je/Ye/Ya - God of 
    hovah - disaster/ruin
    All of you do, every time you say it out loud or utter it in your mind. 
    It is easy to speak to the Father, pray to the Father, and address God as Father, as Jesus did.  Obviously it isn't easy for JWs who believe that the literal word "Jehovah" is a talisman of some sort, like an amulet worn around the neck.   "Jehovah" IS NOT the tetragrammaton.  
    This is not how one gets to understand and know God.   Jer 4:22; John 14:8-10
     
  20. Haha
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Arauna in The truth about Armageddon...   
    Jesus read from the Hebrew scriptures and taught Jehovah's name (we all know the last prayer he said before being taken into custody - wherein he mentions several times that he taught people his father's name), due to the tradition that started before his time to eliminate the enunciation of the Name, Jehovah.  To deny this fact is deliberate obtuseness.
  21. Downvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to BroRando in The truth about Armageddon...   
    Claiming JESUS never use God's Name JEHOVAH is a false and hyprocitical statement. Just  calling the Messiah JESUS, gives WITNESS to his God and Father JEHOVAH.
    Also, when you quote scripture from Bible Books from writers with Names to bear WITNESS to JEHOVAH, you are only calling JUDGEMENT to YOURSELF.  And that is a good thing due to the timing of things that the Last Days are coming to thier end .
     
    יהוה הוא האל ואביו של אדוננו ישוע.  

  22. Confused
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to JW Insider in The truth about Armageddon...   
    Our “English” letters have come to us through a variety of sources. Most people who learn to speak multiple languages have more acceptance about this variety. For example, you probably know that in German, a man named Johann Walters would spell his name with the J and the W and would therefore pronounce his name Yohan Valters. (But if a German word starts with a V then it is usually pronounced more like the English sound “F”.)
    Many copies of the Greek Septuagint translation of the Hebrew Bible (LXX) were made about the time that some of the Maccabees had already campaigned against pronouncing God’s name in Hebrew or Aramaic. Curiously, the OT book of Joshua in the LXX is called the book of Jesus, because Joshua was already being spelled "Iesous." The initial letter “I” was pronounced as a “Y”. The German word for Jesus is Jesu, pronounced Yay’zoo. (As in the two English words yay! + zoo. )
    Jewish persons who wrote Greek in other countries and who were outside the influence of the Maccabees campaign or other campaigns to avoid pronouncing God’s name would write it in Greek in a way that indicated it was being pronounced Ya’ho.  Even non-Hebrew writers wrote about this pronunciation as the common pronunciation among Jewish persons when Jews referred to their Hebrew God. (As in the two English words yaw + hoe.)
    In English most of us don’t mind the fact that we speak of the book of “James” even though the NT Greek actually says “Iakobos” (Jacobos). But Spanish speakers will often replace this this word “Jacobos” with “Santiago” and hardly anyone is offended. Even the NWT uses “Santiago” instead of "James" or "Jaime" or "Jacobo": https://www.jw.org/es/biblioteca/biblia/biblia-estudio/libros/santiago-informacion/
  23. Downvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Chioke Lin in The truth about Armageddon...   
    ( The above comment wasn't aimed at me, but has been before. )
    You see, this is what makes the above commenter seem so much like previous partakers of this forum. 
    He speaks rubbish and actually makes dishonest accusations. 
    Rejecting an English form of a name is not rejecting the one whom that name is, so say, attached to. 
    I much prefer the name Yeshua as it is closer to the original Hebrew, whereas the name Jesus is from the Latin which in turn is from the Greek. 
    Jesus' real name, Yeshua, evolved over millennia in many cases of transliteration that took it from Yehōshu'a to Iēsous to Jesus.
    What Was Jesus’ Real Name?
  24. Downvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to BroRando in The truth about Armageddon...   
    Now the Fourm members can also state that you are a denier of Christ since you reject JESUS.  
     
     
     
     
  25. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Witness in The truth about Armageddon...   
    "Jehovah" does not represent the tetragrammaton. It is a fallacy - a MADE UP NAME for your god.  I've already put the same information up about what Jesus' name means in the past.  It doesn't mean the hybrid name "Jehovah".  "Yah", is not the same as "Jehovah".  
     I refuse to acknowledge the name "Jehovah" as the name of the Almighty God and Father.  
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