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Evacuated

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  1. Upvote
    Evacuated reacted to Queen Esther in Graphic: Anointed Remnant Partakers at the memorial celebrations since 1938   
    Jehovah doesn't  make  any  mistake !!  ONLY  humans...
  2. Upvote
    Evacuated got a reaction from Teresa Morales in What if the Gentile times did not end in 1914?   
    With respect, judge for yourself and not for me on that one.
    Discussions and expectations about dates have presumably been going on one way or another ever since Jesus said he would return. (Matt. 24:3, Acts 1:7).  In fact, disputes over Christ's presence were foretold as a feature of the "last days" 2 Pet. 3:3-4. And this is not limited to religious entities either: Dan. 7:23-25. So there is nothing new or unexpected here.
    Despite it all, Jehovah's Witnesses continue to develop, grow, prosper, and seem to be successful in whatever they turn their hands to, even if it means surviving and outliving vicious attempts to slander and persecute them and prevent their activity. And this in the face of changes, refinements, adjustments, (and whatever else you want to call it), to their doctrine, organisational structure, and procedure. So there is no reason to expect this to change in the future.
    1Tim 2:1-6 is a big deal for me however. The supplications and prayers etc. requested by the apostle Paul appear to be having the desired effect.
  3. Upvote
    Evacuated got a reaction from Anna in God's Kingdom Rules   
    Here is the basic assumption upon which your lengthy dissertation appears to be based. (I say lengthy because you have expressed aspects of your view on this matter in a number of responses elsewhere on the forum). 
    Before even considering the many facets to your proposition, there remains the fact that Jesus likened his parousia or presence to the days of Noah. Obviously, there is not an exact parallel, as Noah did actually know the time that Jehovah's action would take place, althought there was a rather short notice period given. see Gen.7:4. (Maybe someone would argue that he still did not know the hour.)
    However, "apostrophes" aside, Jesus words at Matt.24:37-39 would need to be reconciled with the idea that the parousia is an event taking place at the end of a marked time period or generation. As we are indulging in a bit of a paraphrase, I take Jesus words to be something like this:
      [vs 36] . . . concerning the actual time of Jerusalem's destruction (and by extension the destruction of a complete system of things in the future) I just can't tell you the day or hour because none of us, neither the angels nor myself, actually know it yet. Only the Father has the complete timetable for His executing of judgement. And you know, knowing that day and hour wouldn't really benefit you anyway. [v. 37] However, as you are my friends (John 15:15), I will tell you something that really will benefit you. I will give you a clue about my presence or PAROUSIA which will lead up to that time of judgement. It will be just like the days of Noah.[v. 38] Remember that in those days before the Flood, people were going about their daily lives eating, drinking, getting married  [doing what they had been doing since the days of their forefathers, saying, in effect that there was peace and security] despite the fact that the earth at that time was filled with violence and immorality? Well, Jehovah got involved with Noah and told him what He was going to do. He told Noah to build an ark and also to preach to the people. This went on for years, right up until the very day that Noah entered into the ark. [v 39] Those people heard and saw him, but it meant nothing to them and it was as if they knew nothing until the Flood came by surprise and swept them all away. That's exactly how my PAROUSIA will be. I will get involved with people of faith like Noah, ensure they know what my Father's  requirements for salvation are, and help them to preach the warning message everywhere and to gather in to safety any that respond. Then, once these tasks are completed, judgment will take people by surprise, too. [v.40, 41] That's why you are going to see men and women going about their business in this generation, too, and you will see one person taken by surprise and the person who was right next to them just as surprised to see the other person gone. Their judgement will not be based on outward appearances. [v. 42] So keep on the watch, because you do not know on what day your Lord will come to execute JUDGEMENT. [v.43] Although it will be as unpredictable as a thief in the night who breaks into your house, (and no thief is going to announce his arrival), here's an illustration to help you keep awake. Although the householder doesn't know the exact time a thief will break in, if he knows during which watch (3 hour period) it will occur, he will be doubly alert and not get robbed.  [v. 44] So once I have alerted you during my PAROUSIA, prove yourself ready at all times, because the JUDGEMENT itself will arrive at a time that you just won't know in advance. 
    So, I haven't seen anything yet to dissuade me that Jesus Parousia CULMINATES in an execution of judgement....so far that is.
  4. Upvote
    Evacuated reacted to JW Insider in Muslim Man Slaps the Sh*t out of His Friend for Talking to Jehovah’s Witnesses   
    What was the point of the foul language in the title? A small warning about foul language in the video itself should have been sufficient, I'd think.
    That said, I was surprised the brother walked back into the fray to pick up something. Methinks he might have grown up on these same streets himself.
  5. Upvote
    Evacuated got a reaction from Anna in Will only Jehovah's Witnesses be saved?   
    Interesting question. I'm not sure about @HollyW, but the comment made regarding the choice of option #3 seem to indicate a former association with Jehovah's Witnesses.
    Anyway, Byan Wilson wrote a paper suggesting some secular reasons for this kind of activity. This makes for an interesting perspective, whether you agree with everything he suggests or not.
    http://www.scientologymyths.info/apostates/docs/bryan-wilson-apostate-study.pdf 
  6. Upvote
    Evacuated reacted to Melinda Mills in What value was there in changing the wording in Song 58, My Prayer of Dedication?   
    Those old songbooks are no longer around. Here is what I found on the Internet. When I was a small child lots of our songs had words in common with the best songs/the most truthful songs of Christendom. They evolved to being more truthful according the enlightened understanding of truth. So maybe one of the older versions of this song probably had those words, and I probably remembered it faintly.
    ======
    Take my life and let it be
    consecrated Lord to Thee
    Take my moments and my days,
    let them flow in ceaseless praise
    Take my hands and let them move at the impulse of Thy love
    Take my feet and let them be swift and beautiful for Thee
    Take my voice and let me sing always, only for my King
    Take my lips and let them be filled with messages from Thee
     
    Take my silver and my gold, not a mite would I withhold
     
    Take my intellect and use every power as You choose
    Here am I, all of me, take my life, it's all for Thee
    Take my will and make it Thine, it shall be no longer mine
    Take my heart, it is Thine own, it shall be Thy royal throne
    Take my love, my Lord I pour at Your feet, it's treasure store
    Take myself and I will be ever, only, all for Thee
    Songwriters Christopher Tomlin;Louie Giglio
  7. Upvote
    Evacuated got a reaction from Teresa Morales in What value was there in changing the wording in Song 58, My Prayer of Dedication?   
    I can understand how someone completely ignorant of the content Gods's Word might draw this erroneous conclusion on the strength of comparing these lines from one of the 151 songs in the book, “Sing Out Joyfully” to Jehovah.
    However, for the benefit of those genuinely making this error, Proverbs 3:9 shows the thought to be completely in harmony with the encouragement provided in God's word to contribute materially to the advancement of true worship. It reads there, (in context), 
    "Honor Jehovah with your valuable things, with the firstfruits of all your produce; 
    Then your storehouses will be completely filled, And your vats will overflow with new wine."
  8. Upvote
    Evacuated got a reaction from jo-mi in The slave is using this photo to make it clear what is not allowed in the dress of men for meetings and preaching.   
    Amazing how fashion dictates a person's thinking without them really being aware of the influence.
    The guys on the right look like they have been sleeping out in the rain a couple of days, or that they put on their little brother's suits (by mistake hopefully)!
    Presumabely, they would not see themselves that way?
  9. Upvote
    Evacuated got a reaction from Melinda Mills in Is it appropriate for minors to get baptized?   
    Actually, Watchtower no 3 for 2016 has two study articles which set out Jehovah's Witnesses view on this matter quite clearly.
    https://www.jw.org/en/publications/magazines/watchtower-study-march-2016/young-ones-ready-baptism/
  10. Upvote
    Evacuated got a reaction from John Lindsay Barltrop in The slave is using this photo to make it clear what is not allowed in the dress of men for meetings and preaching.   
    Amazing how fashion dictates a person's thinking without them really being aware of the influence.
    The guys on the right look like they have been sleeping out in the rain a couple of days, or that they put on their little brother's suits (by mistake hopefully)!
    Presumabely, they would not see themselves that way?
  11. Upvote
    Evacuated got a reaction from Queen Esther in The slave is using this photo to make it clear what is not allowed in the dress of men for meetings and preaching.   
    Amazing how fashion dictates a person's thinking without them really being aware of the influence.
    The guys on the right look like they have been sleeping out in the rain a couple of days, or that they put on their little brother's suits (by mistake hopefully)!
    Presumabely, they would not see themselves that way?
  12. Upvote
    Evacuated got a reaction from JaniceM in What value was there in changing the wording in Song 58, My Prayer of Dedication?   
    I can understand how someone completely ignorant of the content Gods's Word might draw this erroneous conclusion on the strength of comparing these lines from one of the 151 songs in the book, “Sing Out Joyfully” to Jehovah.
    However, for the benefit of those genuinely making this error, Proverbs 3:9 shows the thought to be completely in harmony with the encouragement provided in God's word to contribute materially to the advancement of true worship. It reads there, (in context), 
    "Honor Jehovah with your valuable things, with the firstfruits of all your produce; 
    Then your storehouses will be completely filled, And your vats will overflow with new wine."
  13. Upvote
    Evacuated got a reaction from Queen Esther in Placard Witnessing in Japan   
    Matt. 13:4  
  14. Upvote
    Evacuated reacted to James Robinson in Master List of Kingdom Music   
    Does anyone have any of the New World Records from the 1950 Songbook? I have a few I am willing to share, but I would love to fill in the ones I am missing. It would be great to have a library of kingdom music to listen to. I have music starting with the 1944 Songbook forward. Official music from 1966 forward, with Piano for 1944-1966 from Noteworthy Composer. There is someone on YouTube, music jwpiano that does piano covers of the new songs, with sheet music. He hasn't done any lately, but the ones he has done are beautiful. if there is enough interest, I would be happy to upload. If anyone needs help converting record to mp3s, I can offer assistance also. 
    James
  15. Upvote
    Evacuated reacted to Aaron Mathewson in “Sing Out Joyfully” to Jehovah   
    A brother compiled a spreadsheet of a comparison of the songs from the current and new songbooks to make it easier to find where a song is in the new book. I took this info and made a PDF so it is easier to print.
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/0udkagzgpd8vmy8/Song Book Comparison.pdf?dl=0
    Song Book Comparison.pdf
  16. Upvote
    Evacuated reacted to JW Insider in Matt 24:34. "by no means"   
    Because it's a double negative. In Greek, a double negative emphasizes the negation (in most cases), rather than the way it works in many modern languages where (formally, at least) it creates a positive.
  17. Upvote
    Evacuated got a reaction from JW Insider in Why no warning regarding Warwick?   
    Who knows what we all eat, drink, breathe, and whatever else in this rumor-ridden, pathetic excuse for a civilised society?
    Surely with your talent for digging you could find some information on this interesting topic? I know it would be a bit different from your usual area of expertise but your skills are presumably transferable?
    ...and I've ingested a fair bit from some of the posts on this site, but thanks still for the immunity from it's toxic effects that you have apparently granted me!"
    C'mon @JayWitness, this is not up to your usual standard. Let's have some real news!
     
     
  18. Upvote
    Evacuated got a reaction from Melinda Mills in Why no warning regarding Warwick?   
    Who knows what we all eat, drink, breathe, and whatever else in this rumor-ridden, pathetic excuse for a civilised society?
    Surely with your talent for digging you could find some information on this interesting topic? I know it would be a bit different from your usual area of expertise but your skills are presumably transferable?
    ...and I've ingested a fair bit from some of the posts on this site, but thanks still for the immunity from it's toxic effects that you have apparently granted me!"
    C'mon @JayWitness, this is not up to your usual standard. Let's have some real news!
     
     
  19. Upvote
    Evacuated got a reaction from io.porog in Why no warning regarding Warwick?   
    http://www.recordonline.com/article/20150608/NEWS/150609481
    http://www.recordonline.com/article/20151214/NEWS/151219671
    This seems to be fairly "old" news? Surely there has been an adequate clean up as mentioned in the second report which says:
    " Watchtower is seeking unspecified reimbursement for the cost it has incurred in the cleanup and remediation. "
    And wouldn't the planning authorities have had some input in verifying the site as fit for human occupation? 
    On another note, regarding the dubious suggestions in the original post regarding spirit-direction on the project.:
    Isn't Jehovah providing at least a part "ruined" earth (Rev.11:18) as an inheritance for the "meek" survivors of Armageddon? (Ps.37:10-11). And what about the billions of resurrected ones?(Acts 24:15) Surely an adequate clean-up of the environment will take place in order to safely accomdate the inhabitants of what will eventually be a paradise earth?(Ez.39:14; Is.35:1) And on that basis, is there any doubt that this future project will be spirit-directed?(Is.55:11).
  20. Upvote
    Evacuated got a reaction from JaniceM in Why no warning regarding Warwick?   
    Who knows what we all eat, drink, breathe, and whatever else in this rumor-ridden, pathetic excuse for a civilised society?
    Surely with your talent for digging you could find some information on this interesting topic? I know it would be a bit different from your usual area of expertise but your skills are presumably transferable?
    ...and I've ingested a fair bit from some of the posts on this site, but thanks still for the immunity from it's toxic effects that you have apparently granted me!"
    C'mon @JayWitness, this is not up to your usual standard. Let's have some real news!
     
     
  21. Upvote
    Evacuated got a reaction from JW Insider in God's Kingdom Rules   
    WHITE MAN'S HEAD (STILL) ON FIRE

  22. Upvote
    Evacuated reacted to JW Insider in God's Kingdom Rules   
    If you boil your argument down to its essence, then, you seem satisfied then that the key part of the phrase "In 1914" might just refer to the time that the beginning events of Christ's presence began, which they could discern later, but which it would at least have been possible to discern in that particular year. (No particular evidence of the "discernment" in 1914 would be required.) Perhaps, as they kept looking back on events that they recalled or considered, it would have become increasingly clearer in time that 1914 itself was that new starting point for "Christ's presence." Whether or not they discerned much, or anything, about it in that very year is not so important, because it was still going to be the events that they had seen that year which would finally be put into place in the updated doctrine.
    If we were to focus on the meaning of "discernment," in this case, it need be no more than seeing it, at the time, but what they saw is the foundation they will build on as true discernment becomes clearer. Perhaps you are also crediting them (or some of them) with at least a small measure of actual discernment that 1914 might have been so different than their original expectations, that perhaps some were already thinking "in the back of their mind" that it might end up having a different significance than what they had thought previously. Perhaps someone might have even thought that it could end up becoming be a better year in which to claim that the "invisible presence" had started. 
    I think that's fair enough. You are being a bit more flexible than I am. But it's that faint, vague possibility of that flexible interpretation that makes me think that this isn't really a "lie."
    I am sensitive to the ease with which this phrase can still be misleading, however. It does give the impression that there must have been Bible Students, in 1914, who had already discerned that Christ's presence had begun in 1914. And if this is true, we know of no evidence that any of them left for us. (And as I said before, they actually left evidence to the contrary, which I'll expand on below or in another post.) I should add that you might also be thinking perhaps that the writer knows something that hasn't been put into evidence, or even that this particular phrase was prayerfully pored over by the Governing Body and will turn out to be right even if there was no evidence for it at the time.
    You probably won't be too surprised, but in my opinion, it's more than likely that the writer has purposely worded it this way, knowing it was a "stretch," out of a strong desire to put the Bible Students beliefs in the best light possible, before admitting that the doctrine they were teaching in 1914 about Christ's presence was wrong. This is almost always the formula for presenting this particular portion of the WTS history. It's my opinion that this was intended to lead the reader to think the following:
    that the events of 1914 had been predicted by the Bible Students that the primary event they had predicted was a great time of trouble that would begin that very year that they not only predicted the events of 1914, but these predictions turned out to be even more correct than they expected, when it was an actual World War that only the Bible Students had the privilege and ability to "discern" these events in advance that the Bible students, while still in the year 1914, were able to "discern" that these events provided the evidence that they had been right about expecting that Christ's presence would start in that year that this special privilege and ability to "discern" --before 1914-- is intended to "impress" the reader into accepting that the Bible Students were special recipients of Jehovah's holy spirit and guidance that this special privilege and ability to "discern" --during and after 1914-- is intended to "impress" the reader into accepting that the Governing Body of the Watch Tower Society were therefore about to be chosen as the special representatives of "the faithful and discreet slave" who were entrusted with providing spiritual food at the proper time. It's also my opinion that the writer knew very well that what he is implying that they had discerned is not true, but that he has worded it very carefully to get some of these same ideas across without pushing the ideas so far that they would be considered "lies" by those who know the evidence behind it. Once those ideas about "discernment" are out there, only then is it OK to admit that they didn't have a complete understanding, or even a very good understanding about Christ's presence at the time.
    That probably sounds like I am saying that the writer was dishonest. Not exactly. The writer likely believes very strongly in the last point (#7) above, and believes that the ideas behind all the other points are either true or mostly true. He must maximize how impressive it is at this point, so that he can add the caveat later, and it won't change the overall impression. 
    Why would I say such a thing, then? Because I've seen this process up close and personal. Also, it is exactly the pattern that explains the use of similar phrases for many years. There is a very real need to "impress." We can see it in the historical video, Faith in Action, Part 1: Out of Darkness, where (at 44m53s) Brother Anthony Morris III, says "...it's still significant that they could pinpoint that year. That's phenomenal!"
    The full idea behind the points in the paragraph of "kr" are also embedded in the following quotes
    *** w04 2/1 p. 19 par. 6 “The Scene of This World Is Changing” ***
    As that “time” approached, Jehovah took steps to reveal the answer to a group of humble Bible students. With the help of God’s spirit, they discerned that “the appointed times of the nations” began with the destruction of Jerusalem in 607 B.C.E. and that those “times” were 2,520 years in length. From this, they deduced that 1914 marked the end of “the appointed times of the nations.” They also came to realize that 1914 was the beginning of the end for this system of things.
    *** w13 2/15 p. 18 par. 4 Stay in Jehovah’s Valley of Protection ***
    Decades before 1914, Jehovah’s worshippers declared to the nations that the end of “the appointed times of the nations” would come in that year and that the world would enter into an unequaled period of trouble.
    *** w86 11/1 p. 6 A Dream Reveals How Late It Is ***
    For over three decades before 1914, Jehovah’s Witnesses called attention to the significance of this date.
    *** w81 2/15 p. 10 Insight on the News ***
    Hence, another respected authority adds his voice to those of numerous statesmen and historians who, in looking back, recognized the significance of the year 1914. Yet, decades before that year arrived, dedicated students of Bible prophecy were able to identify 1914 as a climactic turning point
    *** w69 4/15 p. 243 par. 12 Making Men and Nations a Laughingstock ***
    Decades before 1914 C.E., careful Bible students had calculated this date by means of the Bible timetable and Bible prophecy. From world events and conditions since that momentous year, it is unmistakable that something ended, an era ended, for the Gentile nations in 1914.
    *** w69 12/1 p. 719 par. 27 Final Woes to Enemies of Peace with God ***
    They did not like to be notified that the “times of the Gentiles” had run out in the year 1914 and that these witnesses had been vindicated by world events in pointing forward for decades to that year as the time for God’s kingdom by Christ to come into full control in the heavens, with authority to oust the Gentile nations from the earth.
    *** w67 12/15 p. 752 par. 31 “In All the Nations the Good News Has to Be Preached First” ***
    Why, for decades before 1914, Bible students associated with the magazine The Watch Tower and with the Watch Tower Bible & Tract Society looked for God’s Messianic kingdom to come into full power in 1914.
    *** w53 8/15 pp. 492-493 par. 3 Living Now as a New World Society ***
    For decades before World War I God had been preparing a people to become this altogether different society of our day. To them he uncovered the teachings of his Word . . . He roused them to the realization that the time for the oft-prayed-for Kingdom to be fully established was getting close. Long in advance he even disclosed to them by his Word that the time for the Kingdom to assume power in heaven and in earth was A.D. 1914, for then the time he had allotted for the uninterrupted domination of the earth by the Gentile nations since Jerusalem’s first destruction in 607 B.C. would run out.
    *** w53 9/15 p. 561 par. 18 Flight to Safety with the New World Society ***
    For decades before A.D. 1914 Jehovah’s witnesses had been preaching the full establishment of God’s kingdom by Christ at the end of the “appointed times of the nations” in that year. To confirm their preaching as correct, World War I for global domination by the nations of this earth broke out suddenly in 1914,
    *** g75 4/22 p. 29 Watching the World ***
    For decades before World War I, Bible students had warned that 1914 would be a critical point in history. “The trauma of World War I . . . is widely regarded as a benchmark in the evolution of modern America,” confirms a recent issue of U.S. News & World Report. And such changes were felt world wide. In more recent decades Jehovah’s witnesses have again noted what Bible chronology indicates, this time warning that the mid-1970’s would be critical for mankind. What does the record so far indicate? According to this article, “Historians compare . . . today’s upsets” with the “time of social and moral change” during World War I.
    *** g73 1/22 p. 8 Who Can Accurately Predict Man’s Future? ***
    Based on what he said, along with the words of Daniel and John, Jehovah’s witnesses pointed to the year 1914, decades in advance, as marking the start of “the conclusion of the system of things.”
    *** yb75 p. 37 Part 1—United States of America ***
    Very noteworthy was the striking accuracy with which that book pointed to the end of the Gentile Times, “the appointed times of the nations.” (Luke 21:24) It showed (on pages 83 and 189) that this 2,520-year period, during which Gentile or non-Jewish nations would rule the earth without interference by any kingdom of God, began with the Babylonian overthrow of the kingdom of Judah in the late seventh century B.C.E. and would end in 1914 C.E. Even earlier, however, C. T. Russell wrote an article entitled “Gentile Times: When Do They End?” It was published in the Bible Examiner of October 1876, and therein Russell said: “The seven times will end in A.D. 1914.” He had correctly linked the Gentile Times with the “seven times” mentioned in the book of Daniel. (Dan. 4:16, 23, 25, 32) True to such calculations, 1914 did mark the end of those times and the birth of God’s kingdom in heaven with Christ Jesus as king. Just think of it! Jehovah granted his people that knowledge nearly four decades before those times expired.
    *** ce chap. 18 pp. 227-229 The Bible—Is It Really Inspired by God? ***
    Decades before that date, there was an organization of people who were making known the significance of 1914. The New York World of August 30, 1914, explains: “The terrific war outbreak in Europe has fulfilled an extraordinary prophecy. For a quarter of a century past, through preachers and through press, the ‘International Bible Students’ [Jehovah’s Witnesses] . . . have been proclaiming to the world that the Day of Wrath prophesied in the Bible would dawn in 1914. ‘Look out for 1914!’ has been the cry of the . . . evangelists.”29
    A People Who Fulfill Prophecy
    *** kr chap. 2 p. 16 par. 12 The Kingdom Is Born in Heaven ***
    12 The work those faithful men did in championing doctrinal truth in the decades before 1914 was simply amazing!
    *** pm chap. 19 p. 332 par. 8 The Kingdom Withstands International Assault ***
    For decades prior to 1914 C.E., even since the year 1876 C.E., the nations and peoples of the world had been notified that the Gentile Times would close in that year. Dedicated, baptized Christians, like Charles Taze Russell who became president of the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society, were used to serve this notice, especially upon the nations of Christendom.
    *** su chap. 3 p. 25 par. 11 How Long Will the Present System Last? ***
    Decades in advance it was known that this would come in 1914 at the end of the major fulfillment of the “seven times” of Daniel 4:10-17. But full realization of its significance came gradually during the years that followed. Progressively Bible students saw unfolding before their eyes details of the composite sign that Jesus said would indicate his heavenly presence in Kingdom power.
    *** tp chap. 7 p. 73 par. 11 When Will the Foretold World Destruction Come? ***
    After going on record that the Bible pointed to 1914, Jehovah’s Witnesses had to wait for several decades before they saw the outcome.
    *** wj chap. 9 p. 23 par. 15 Identifying God-Inspired Truth ***
    Decades before World War I began in 1914, Jehovah’s worshipers were making known the significance of that year. The New York World of August 30, 1914, explains: “The terrific war outbreak in Europe has fulfilled an extraordinary prophecy. For a quarter of a century past, through preachers and through press, the ‘International Bible Students’ [as Jehovah’s Witnesses were then known] . . . have been proclaiming to the world that the Day of Wrath prophesied in the Bible would dawn in 1914.”8
     
  23. Upvote
    Evacuated got a reaction from JW Insider in God's Kingdom Rules   
    Thats the best quote I have seen on this subject and I would be surprised to see something in Society publications that captures the situation more succinctly.
    I am happy with that statement as well. I suppose it is the "conspiracy theory " slant that so many try to sustain when discussing this type of subject that makes me want to lean as far as possible the other way.
    Well, I will have to take your word for that, but I have no reason to doubt your first hand experience of the "sleight of hand" employed by writers, especially when trying to maintain interest in a subject that might appear repetitive in nature. I have noted the "massaging" techniques applied to life experiences in this regard, both in written and oral form, where they are used to support a particular theme. Selective quoting is another technique (appearing quite frequently on this forum). These methods have their place, but one needs to be aware of their limitations when submitted as "proof".
    I know people are often impressionable and easily lead, so this places a great responsibility on those writing, particularly in this field of all places, to ensure integrity is never sacrificed for the making of an impression.
    However, I was introduced to a principle almost at the outset of my association with Jehovah's Witnesses and this has stood me in good stead in evaluating all information I have come across since. It is a piece of advice available to everyone studying the Bible and it is currrently rendered:
    Proverbs 14:15: "The naive person believes every word, But the shrewd one ponders each step."
     
  24. Upvote
    Evacuated reacted to JW Insider in God's Kingdom Rules   
    As I started to point out in my last post, several versions of this same comment have been made dozens of times before, sometimes with careful wording that indicates the writer knew there were limits to what he could claim, and sometimes with not-so-careful wording. Some of these come across as technically true, but misleading. There are even a couple of cases where the wording created not just a false impression but a true falsehood.
    The most interesting versions of this pattern go back to the time when Rutherford was still in the midst of re-working doctrines that had been considered true in Russell's time. Here's one that gets right to the point about what was or was not "discerned" in 1914:
    *** Watchtower, October 1, 1930, p.291 ***
    Understanding that the ''day of Christ'' began when Jesus came to the temple of God, in 1918, it appears that the rebellion must precede that day. The beginning of the falling away or rebellion against God's organization would also mark the beginning of the disclosure of the ''man of sin'', even though none of God's children then on earth understood the matter. The Revelation which God gave to Jesus Christ to show to his "servant" began to be disclosed particularly from 1914 forward, but none of God's children on earth had an understanding thereof for fifteen years or more thereafter. They did see the evidence of things coming to pass which mark a fulfilment of Revelation, but they did not discern the meaning thereof. Likewise the faithful have for some years seen the manifestation of lawlessness and now begin to discern the meaning of the term the "man of sin".
    *** end of quote ***
     
    There are also many published statements from this time period that give a clearer picture about what really was being discerned with reference to the date of Christ's presence between 1914 and 1931. It's difficult to get a clear view with just a couple of snippets, so if I get a chance, I'll look up some of the quotes again and post something either here or in the "Millions" thread.
  25. Upvote
    Evacuated reacted to Anna in God's Kingdom Rules   
    Can I put an end to this argument (discussion)? On page 50, paragraph 5 and 6 of the book says:
    "As we saw in Chapter 2 of this book, the Bible Students spent decades pointing out that the year 1914 would be significant in fulfilling Bible prophecy. However, at that time they believed that Christ’s presence had begun in 1874, that he had begun to rule in heaven in 1878, and that the Kingdom would not be fully set up until October 1914. The harvest would extend from 1874 to 1914 and would culminate in the gathering of the anointed to heaven. Do mistaken ideas such as these cast doubt on whether Jesus was guiding those faithful ones by means of holy spirit?
    6 Not at all! Think again of our opening illustration. Would the premature ideas and eager questions of the tourists cast doubt on the reliability of their guide? Hardly! Similarly, although God’s people sometimes try to work out details of Jehovah’s purpose before it is time for the holy spirit to guide them to such truths, it is clear that Jesus is leading them. Thus, faithful ones prove willing to be corrected and humbly adjust their views.—Jas. 4:6."
     
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