Srecko Sostar

Are yes but the sinners Christ chose were INSPIRED OF HOLY SPIRIT and Christ FULLY OPENED UP THE SCRIPTURES TO THEM. 
You cannot say that about your GB as they say they are not inspired of holy spirit and they admit making 'mistakes'. 

@Outta Here 1st quote How are we to understand the GB/Slave interpreting scripture, as the sole chanel, and at the same time accept that they can err? This is the question here.
As has been explained on many occasions, the GB/Slave is spirit-directed and not inspired. This means that guidance from Jehovah is provided whenever required. He keeps the the earthly part of His organisation on track....................when nececessary. In other words, if Jehovah has not intervened, then He is happy with the current progress. 
**** my green color
@Ou tta 2nd quote
??? I think I said that Jehovah is happy with the overall progress of His purpose and that will always govern in what He chooses to intervene. In other words, as He always has the successful outcome of His purpose in view, He is always happy with what He allows. Of course the negative aspects and consequences of human behaviour do not make Him happy (compare Ps.119:136). Surely you know that???
He will indeed intervene in the affairs of all mankind soon. The outcome of that intervention will make him happier still, although there are some who feel otherwise.
**** my green color
my response: 
Are you serious?
Do you want to apply this idea about JHVH only on JW religion in some special situations and periods of religious progress/changes aka new light dogma?
Or do you offer this Idea as General View (Happiness) that JHVH have on Humankind and World Condition (in specific religious issue: old Jew, 1st Church, 2nd Church, Reformed Churches, etc.) in past thousand years? By reading of Bible report we see that god was Unhappy only ones, when released Flood on Earth. In all other stages, periods by not intervened He showed Happiness? :))
your response on this part:
Do you want to apply this idea about JHVH only on JW religion in some special situations and periods of religious progress/changes aka new light dogma?
You are referring to the nature of Jehovah's happines here I think? If that is the case then I don't apply it in such a narrrow context.
 
 :))))) now is time for real time :)))))
Somehow You start to involve wording, Nature of JHVH happiness, in question i put. I don't now why. Because you started talking about God's Nature (Happiness). Even more, you go further and gave idea how there is gradation in this emotional state of God (happy - happier) :))) So, Who is that guy who talking about God's Nature? You or Me? :))
 You made it clear that you talking about 2 different progress that is going on, and about 2 reasons for God's happiness. And how god's happiness is also visible because, supposed progress, taking place . Perhaps His happiness about this two things is VISIBLE only TO You. :)))  and to WTJWORG.
God is Happy with current progress ( here you talking  about progress inside WTJWORG).
God is happy with the overall progress of His purpose (here you talking, i guess, from Adam and Eve to nowadays)   
Somehow you entered in God's Mind and Emotions (aka God's Nature) and made inspection, insight of His Will, and then came before all of us here with comment even statement how God is satisfied with this 2 particular things.  
- to laugh or to cry, question is now - 
First of all, you made connection between WTJWORG activity, you called that PROGRESS with one EMOTIONAL STATE of JHVH Nature, aka happiness. This connection you have produced, was been reason for my next response i made to you:    In regard to JW religion, and with your opinion, this would mean how JHVH is happy when JW members feeling, thinking, speaking and doing things that are factually wrong. Strange god you have :))  
I hope how this retrospective is helpful for our conversation :))))) stay well!
 

I have no custom to offer Bible verses as for reason to support my opinions, but for those who Respect Bible above WTJWORG:  
Psalm 119:160 The sum of your word is truth,
John 17:17 Sanctify them in the truth; your word is truth.

Ephesians 1:13-14 In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit, 

Job 34:12 Of a truth, God will not do wickedly, and the Almighty will not pervert justice.

Psalm 25:5 Lead me in your truth and teach me

Psalm 86:11 Teach me your way, O LORD, that I may walk in your truth;

John 8:31-32 … So Jesus said to the Jews who had believed in him, “If you abide in my word, you are truly my disciples, and you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”
John 17:8 For I have given them the words that you gave me, and they have received them and have come to know in truth that I came from you;

WT magazine: Of course, Jesus did not tell us that his faithful slave would produce perfect spiritual food". 
TRUTH = PERFECT 
First and Last thing what JW's need, must have in Mind, to reevaluate; JHVH/JESUS is Source and He Produced Truthful, Perfect and Healthy Spiritual Food .... NOT GB from WTJWORG.
If by any chance GB want to apply on themselves illustration from Matthew about servant who sharing food, (Sharing, NOT Grow, NOT Produce, Not Cooke)  than the best thing for them would be to continue with printing the Bible, and only Bible. :)))

@JOHN BUTLER
Idea is not just "stupid" but also impossible. Read again last sentence conclusion that @Anna made by quoting WT magazine.
In an effort to protect their intellectual and copyright law (ahahaha) and to blur the vision of the reader or the believer / follower, to justifies all past and future failure in any, any matter they reached for The Words that Jesus never said, according to Bible, OT or NT scriptures !!!!! 
Another funny idea can be filtered from the way they made explanation; Jesus did not tell us. From this we can make funny conclusion, but who knows, maybe editor of article truly believes in possibility that Jesus somehow told them with some Voice from Heaven, in a Dream, before this edition of WT magazine went to printing; I never told you and never promised you that i will supplied you with perfect spiritual food!  
Today's WT study (Nov 2016) p.15 par.9:  "Some may feel that they can interpret the Bible on their own. However, Jesus has appointed the ‘faithful slave’ to be the only channel for dispensing spiritual food. Since 1919, the glorified Jesus Christ has been using that slave to help his followers understand God’s own Book and heed its directives.’"
And
WT Feb.2017 p.26. par.12 " The Governing Body is neither inspired nor infallible. Therefore, it can err in doctrinal matters or in organizational direction. In fact, the Watch Tower Publications Index includes the heading “Beliefs Clarified,” which lists adjustments in our Scriptural understanding since 1870".
It seems that the key to making sense of these 2 seemingly opposing quotes is in the above paragraph if we continue reading: " Of course, Jesus did not tell us that his faithful slave would produce perfect spiritual food".
 

Wrong Billy! You changed thesis!
I am sure that you also  know, that it is not about issue of Transferring Perfection in question  but about Transferring Authority! 
After, later it came to the idea that such Authority means Infallibility.  

@Outta Here 1st quote How are we to understand the GB/Slave interpreting scripture, as the sole chanel, and at the same time accept that they can err? This is the question here.
As has been explained on many occasions, the GB/Slave is spirit-directed and not inspired. This means that guidance from Jehovah is provided whenever required. He keeps the the earthly part of His organisation on track....................when nececessary. In other words, if Jehovah has not intervened, then He is happy with the current progress. 
**** my green color
@Ou tta 2nd quote
??? I think I said that Jehovah is happy with the overall progress of His purpose and that will always govern in what He chooses to intervene. In other words, as He always has the successful outcome of His purpose in view, He is always happy with what He allows. Of course the negative aspects and consequences of human behaviour do not make Him happy (compare Ps.119:136). Surely you know that???
He will indeed intervene in the affairs of all mankind soon. The outcome of that intervention will make him happier still, although there are some who feel otherwise.
**** my green color
my response: 
Are you serious?
Do you want to apply this idea about JHVH only on JW religion in some special situations and periods of religious progress/changes aka new light dogma?
Or do you offer this Idea as General View (Happiness) that JHVH have on Humankind and World Condition (in specific religious issue: old Jew, 1st Church, 2nd Church, Reformed Churches, etc.) in past thousand years? By reading of Bible report we see that god was Unhappy only ones, when released Flood on Earth. In all other stages, periods by not intervened He showed Happiness? :))
your response on this part:
Do you want to apply this idea about JHVH only on JW religion in some special situations and periods of religious progress/changes aka new light dogma?
You are referring to the nature of Jehovah's happines here I think? If that is the case then I don't apply it in such a narrrow context.
 
 :))))) now is time for real time :)))))
Somehow You start to involve wording, Nature of JHVH happiness, in question i put. I don't now why. Because you started talking about God's Nature (Happiness). Even more, you go further and gave idea how there is gradation in this emotional state of God (happy - happier) :))) So, Who is that guy who talking about God's Nature? You or Me? :))
 You made it clear that you talking about 2 different progress that is going on, and about 2 reasons for God's happiness. And how god's happiness is also visible because, supposed progress, taking place . Perhaps His happiness about this two things is VISIBLE only TO You. :)))  and to WTJWORG.
God is Happy with current progress ( here you talking  about progress inside WTJWORG).
God is happy with the overall progress of His purpose (here you talking, i guess, from Adam and Eve to nowadays)   
Somehow you entered in God's Mind and Emotions (aka God's Nature) and made inspection, insight of His Will, and then came before all of us here with comment even statement how God is satisfied with this 2 particular things.  
- to laugh or to cry, question is now - 
First of all, you made connection between WTJWORG activity, you called that PROGRESS with one EMOTIONAL STATE of JHVH Nature, aka happiness. This connection you have produced, was been reason for my next response i made to you:    In regard to JW religion, and with your opinion, this would mean how JHVH is happy when JW members feeling, thinking, speaking and doing things that are factually wrong. Strange god you have :))  
I hope how this retrospective is helpful for our conversation :))))) stay well!
 

I'm glad you think so but that isn't the important thing, as you already know.
I guess your first point was that when I referenced the parable of the sheep being separated from the goats, I mentioned that I thought Jesus was separating two kinds of sheep from the goats.  You requoted a portion of what I said as follows:
I believe that when Jesus separates the sheep from the goats he is separating the anointed sheep as well as other sheep who don't identify themselves as anointed. (Matt 25:32)
You had asked for my opinion, and I told you this was part of my opinion. Absolutely nothing has changed. When Jesus separates the sheep from the goats, these sheep will include anointed sheep and other sheep who do not identify themselves as anointed. Let's assume for example, that you believe you are one of the anointed sheep, and I believe I am one of another class of sheep, as I do not identify myself as anointed. When Jesus comes to separate the sheep from the goats, I am hoping that he favors both of us with a place on his right hand, and that we are not going to be with the goats on his left.
You tried to explain that I meant something like this:
There is actually so much ambiguity in that first sentence that it is difficult to parse your meaning. Perhaps I worded it in a way that confused you, but I can't find the logic in the idea you apparently got out of it. I never said anything about who any of the goats were and where they might come from. I'm including sheep who claim to be anointed and sheep who claim not to be anointed in the sheep category who Jesus will place on his right. I didn't say anything about who the goats are.
I don't see a problem, and I don't see any reason to change, revise or edit anything.
Strange. I take this to be more of the kind of blame-shifting and projection that you have become infamous for. In the past, you have often copied pages from Christendom's commentaries, and pictures of scholarly looking book covers that have titles that appear to support your claims. Then someone points out that the contents of the book show just the opposite of your claim. Then you go twisting and scrambling to make it look like you never made a mistake after all.
I've even seen this type of twisting and scrambling for something as simple as a typo or mistaken definition, or misused vocabulary. When someone pointed it out to you, you doubled-down with some absolutely incredible pseudo-explanation to avoid admitting even a minor mistake. Sometimes, you apparently resort to meaningless word-salads or other types of word-play, and I can't tell if you think it worked to impress others, or to obfuscate. But whenever you get a piece of criticism like this you can be counted on to counter-claim that it is others who use word-play and word-salads, or you go on a temper-rant claiming that people are making fun of you.
I'd recommend that before you start claiming that I say things "in order to confuse" just ask others if they were also confused. Maybe they were, and this means I should rewrite it, but if it's mostly just you who's confused, just ask more questions, and I'll be happy to explain further the things that you might not have understood correctly -- just as I am happy to do now.
You also apparently had a problem with my statement that Zechariah 8 (in context) gives us some good ideas about helping others to become Christians, which should be a goal of our ministry. You requoted a portion here: “My own opinions here are somewhat separate. Although on the matter of Zechariah 8, I think that chapter really does provide an excellent and important image for us to remember about our own attempts to make converts to true Christianity”
Again, I don't see what kind of a problem you would have with this. We want people we meet in our ministry and persons whom we hope to have study the Bible with us become converted to true Christianity. Right? The context of Zechariah 8 had shown how this would be fulfilled in the midst of economic hardships and disappointments and even the incursion of enemies/opposers. I had already pointed this out and also wanted to show how the image of having people come to us can sometimes be more important that us coming to them. If we are true Christians, we will be known by reputation. As Jesus said (and as my very next sentence began after the portion you quoted):
I partially understand why you wish to disagree with me whenever you have a chance, but you very often seem to forget that when you are so anxious to be an opposer, when not careful, you can end up opposing Jesus' own words, too.

How can you say that the Watchtower society / JW Org / GB dispense truth when they keep changing the meaning of scriptures ? It is not a lie to say they they have changed the meaning of the scripture concerning 'This generation will not pass away' .. It is not a lie that they changed the meaning of the scripture concerning the 'Superior Authorities'. it gets boring repeating this but you obviously don't believe they change the meaning of scriptures. 
They also misuse scripture and misuse their 'authority' but that is another matter. 
The GB have no way of proving that they have been chosen by God to do His will. They admit not to be inspired. They even admit that they make mistakes. If they have the responsibility of 8.5 million lives already, and if they have yet another 9 million bible studies going on, and if they have the job of gathering all those with the right heart condition, then surely they would need to be inspired by God, and surely Jesus Christ would not let them give false information or make mistakes which would stumble thousands of people earthwide and stop some people even being interested in the JW Org.
As for understanding, you only seem to understand the GB's / Watchtower's meaning of scripture, so you prove yourself to be following MEN. 
Sorry Billy but you do make yourself open to criticism by your blindly believing all that the Watchtower / GB tells you. 
 

The implication that God's happiness depends on men? No, sorry, not my view anywhere as far as I can see. Not intentionally anyway.  
Shame. It seems I don't understand you....and..... you don't understand me.
I will state my view on this matter clearly so there is no mistaken implication.  Jehovah's happiness DOES NOT depend upon men. There. Is that clear enough? So what was the point you were making on this?

Agree!

I have no custom to offer Bible verses as for reason to support my opinions, but for those who Respect Bible above WTJWORG:  
Psalm 119:160 The sum of your word is truth,
John 17:17 Sanctify them in the truth; your word is truth.

Ephesians 1:13-14 In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit, 

Job 34:12 Of a truth, God will not do wickedly, and the Almighty will not pervert justice.

Psalm 25:5 Lead me in your truth and teach me

Psalm 86:11 Teach me your way, O LORD, that I may walk in your truth;

John 8:31-32 … So Jesus said to the Jews who had believed in him, “If you abide in my word, you are truly my disciples, and you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”
John 17:8 For I have given them the words that you gave me, and they have received them and have come to know in truth that I came from you;

WT magazine: Of course, Jesus did not tell us that his faithful slave would produce perfect spiritual food". 
TRUTH = PERFECT 
First and Last thing what JW's need, must have in Mind, to reevaluate; JHVH/JESUS is Source and He Produced Truthful, Perfect and Healthy Spiritual Food .... NOT GB from WTJWORG.
If by any chance GB want to apply on themselves illustration from Matthew about servant who sharing food, (Sharing, NOT Grow, NOT Produce, Not Cooke)  than the best thing for them would be to continue with printing the Bible, and only Bible. :)))

Billy the Kid puffed up with pride again i see. And back to woshing the GB. 
Either your faith is centered on the interpretation given or it isn’t.  But interpretation given by whom ? 
Ah I see,  If it isn’t, it is due to not having faith in God that he can transmit spiritual understanding on the proper time to those he has chosen on earth.  But i wonder who Billy thinks has been chosen ? 
And then Billy puts it down to : That’s a failure of those that don’t understand, dispense spiritual food at the proper time. 
Poor poor Billy, all he has is his faith in those 8 men. He hangs on their every word. 
I wonder if billy ever gives thought to the point that, if those 8 men don't actually have good spiritual food to give, then why do they give anything at all ?  Giving poison (lies, deceit, misuse of scriptures, dishonesty ) to your brothers just because you do not have good spiritual food to give, is not God's way of doing things. 

JW's only god is their GB. That is whom they serve, believe and rely on. So yes a very strange god indeed. 
 

@JOHN BUTLER
Idea is not just "stupid" but also impossible. Read again last sentence conclusion that @Anna made by quoting WT magazine.
In an effort to protect their intellectual and copyright law (ahahaha) and to blur the vision of the reader or the believer / follower, to justifies all past and future failure in any, any matter they reached for The Words that Jesus never said, according to Bible, OT or NT scriptures !!!!! 
Another funny idea can be filtered from the way they made explanation; Jesus did not tell us. From this we can make funny conclusion, but who knows, maybe editor of article truly believes in possibility that Jesus somehow told them with some Voice from Heaven, in a Dream, before this edition of WT magazine went to printing; I never told you and never promised you that i will supplied you with perfect spiritual food!  
Today's WT study (Nov 2016) p.15 par.9:  "Some may feel that they can interpret the Bible on their own. However, Jesus has appointed the ‘faithful slave’ to be the only channel for dispensing spiritual food. Since 1919, the glorified Jesus Christ has been using that slave to help his followers understand God’s own Book and heed its directives.’"
And
WT Feb.2017 p.26. par.12 " The Governing Body is neither inspired nor infallible. Therefore, it can err in doctrinal matters or in organizational direction. In fact, the Watch Tower Publications Index includes the heading “Beliefs Clarified,” which lists adjustments in our Scriptural understanding since 1870".
It seems that the key to making sense of these 2 seemingly opposing quotes is in the above paragraph if we continue reading: " Of course, Jesus did not tell us that his faithful slave would produce perfect spiritual food".
 

The strangeness for me seems to be in your implication that God's happiness depends on what humans are "feeling, thinking, speaking and doing", whether right or wrong.
"Strange god you have" Yes, I can accept that you find my God strange.
Now you seem to be talking more sensibly.

I don't know nothing about nature of JHVH (and his happiness). What i think i know maybe is wrong or insufficient. I am not sure how your view about God's nature is correct. Because you said, He is always happy with what He allows. 
B1 [ T ] to give permission for someone to do something, or to not prevent something from happening:
[ + that ] formal to admit or agree that something is true:
to let someone do something or let something happen; permit:
to make it possible for something to be done or to happen:
https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/allow
In regard to JW religion, and with your opinion, this would mean how JHVH is happy when JW members feeling, thinking, speaking and doing things that are factually wrong. Strange god you have :)) 

Ahh, i see clearly now, i figured out .... difference between "be inspired" and "spirit guided" :)))))
Another prophetic words for less publications in recent years.
But again have to ask, what Bible verse said; "not ALL the time"? :))) 
....... similar with WTJWORG statement: "Jesus not promised perfect food" ?? :))
Looking for Literal interpretations about illustration.
 

If people follow such teachings and kill themselves, it is loss of their own lives and wasted effort.
But when people, as in example you gave with Uriah, successfully implement to kill somebody (spiritual or literal dead) because of teaching aka instruction from some men ...... than is not enough to make just intellectual disagreement and do a job.... but refuse to do so. 

I think this is strange feeling.
........In your heart....or in god's.

In my amateur opinion: two expressions with the same meaning :))))
Are you serious?
Do you want to apply this idea about JHVH only on JW religion in some special situations and periods of religious progress/changes aka new light dogma?
Or do you offer this Idea as General View (Happiness) that JHVH have on Humankind and World Condition (in specific religious issue: old Jew, 1st Church, 2nd Church, Reformed Churches, etc.) in past thousand years? By reading of Bible report we see that god was Unhappy only ones, when released Flood on Earth. In all other stages, periods by not intervened He showed Happiness? :))
 

This is one general claim that can be/need to be  used  in the system, of all kind.
 
 
 
If i may say, it seems that JW religion is one Socio-Religious International Experiment. 
And as such, with promises made by imperfect and erroneous leaders, promises in the name of God/Jesus, they offer leadership with warning (warning clearly made from 2017 - not before and not on a day of your baptismal promises, after long decades of "perfect meals" they were bringing to table) how "Jesus not promised perfect food". /WHAT VERSES in Bible CARRYING THIS JESUS PROMISE ABOUT NOT PROMISE?
Again we see, they changed rhetoric. And again, this was done in Jesus name.

THE PHILOSOPHER KINGS WILL DO ANYTHING TO PROTECT THE PHILOSOPHER KINGS.
... JUST REMEMBER THIS ... PLAYING WITH WORDS WILL NOT CHANGE REALITY.
.... AND PLAYING WITH A MILLION WORDS WILL NOT CHANGE REALITY, EITHER.
TO UNDERSTAND WHAT JESUS OR THE APOSTLES REALLY MEANT, YOU HAVE TO "GET INTO THE MIND" OF THOSE THAT WERE BEING SPOKEN TO AT THE TIME.
HOW DID THEY UNDERSTAND IT ?
ALL ELSE IS ARROGANCE.
ALL ELSE IS VANITY.
ONCE A RELIGION ACCUMULATES MONEY AND REAL ESTATE, IT'S ALWAYS ABOUT MONEY AND REAL ESTATE THEREAFTER, AND  WHATEVER IT TAKES TO KEEP IT.
-------
THERE HAVE NEVER BEEN ANY EXCEPTIONS IN THE PAST.
-------
THERE ARE NO EXCEPTIONS, NOW.
-------

 
 
 

I think there is a policy rule that all Governing Body Members have to be of the Annointed, have many, many years of faithful service to the Organization, be beyond reproach, well spoken of, and be able to pee, standing up.

???????????????????? Not that many around???????????????
 
Man's job???????????????

According to that article, the slave is one who is anointed. So why are there not 144k governing body members, and why aren't any women on this governing body?