@JW Insider I can read your words but they make no sense to me. 

You seem to be trying to 'hide' that scripture inside a million other words, maybe to discredit the scripture or me. Either way it matters not to me, for my feelings are that anyone reading my words that is truly interested in what I'm saying, will understand exactly where I am coming from. 

That is why TTH and BtK cannot understand me, because they only see things from the JW Org viewpoint. Which in fact, it seems, is where you are seeing things from. 

So, maybe give your interpretation, of, what the Watchtower's interpretation is of that scripture. The reason i say it like that is, because even JW's seem to disagree on matters of scripture and W/t interpretations. 

Thus saith the LORD of hosts; In those days it shall come to pass, that ten men shall take hold out of all languages of the nations, even shall take hold of the skirt of him that is a Jew, saying, We will go with you: for we have heard that God is with you.

out of all languages of the nations,  would seem to signify people from all over the Earth. 

" By this he evidently means those who are truly led by the holy spirit, who are truly motivated by the holy spirit, and who therefore give proper guidance and to others. "

Well actually I think HE means those that are TRULY ANOINTED OF HOLY SPIRIT, just as the Apostles were. 

And I think HE means that it would be 'visible' in some way, but maybe only to those truly seeking God in a 'pure way'. 

Quote "They can also be looked at in terms of our willingness to be involved with organizational goals or congregational goals when economics, delays, mistakes, and the despondency of others can take a toll on our own courage."

This is very vague and general in it's meanings. " organizational goals or congregational goals " Which organisation and congregations ? 

" mistakes " By whom where and when ? 

Yep Bro Jackson totally messed up on the whole thing but those that worship the GB will never see it or never admit it. 

Back to this point :- 

February 2017 Watchtower. Who is leading  God's people today ?

 The Governing Body is neither inspired nor infallible. Therefore, it can err in doctrinal matters or in organizational direction. In fact, the Watch Tower Publications Index includes the heading “Beliefs Clarified,” which lists adjustments in our Scriptural understanding since 1870. Of course, Jesus did not tell us that his faithful slave would produce perfect spiritual food. 

But with this comment here then not much more is needed is it ? 

The GB are stating that they are the 'Faithful slave' but admitting that their 'food at the proper time' is not perfect spiritual food. Luke 12 v 42

And the Lord said: “Who really is the faithful steward, the discreet one, whom his master will appoint over his body of attendants to keep giving them their measure of food supplies at the proper time?

So the GB are saying that the food Jesus is supplying through Holy Spirit, is not good food. Now why would Jesus want to provide bad food for his followers ? 

Ah but the GB are not inspired of Holy spirit, so um where exactly do they get this spiritual food from then ?

Let's look at this in a practical way. The GB are the GOVERNING Body of JW Org and Watchtower. (it would seem that officially / legally they are not, but in practical terms they are ). Then there is a Writing Department. Are they inspired of Holy Spirit ? Well if the GB are not then I presume the WD are not. 

Then we have the point of being Anointed. Surely if a person is Anointed then they are anointed with Holy Spirit ?  Ah, but the GB say they are not inspired of Holy Spirit. 

So now we have the question, are Anointed ones actually anointed with holy spirit ? And if so are they inspired by holy spirit ? And if not, what is the point of having Anointed ones ? Yes we know they will die and go to heaven as part of the 144,000 but surely they have an important job to do now. They surely should be guiding God's earthly servants in the right direction ? 

To guide God's earthly servants in that right direction, the Anointed ones would need to be inspired of Holy Spirit and to receive the spiritual food from Jesus Christ. 

That brings us back to the scripture about the ten men clinging to the skirt of a Jew. 

TTH and possibly BTK seem to want to follow a body of men that :- is neither inspired nor infallible. Therefore, it can err in doctrinal matters or in organizational direction 

Why would anyone want to do this ?  Surely if a person wanted to serve God properly they would need proof positive that those men on earth that they follow were approved of by God and by Jesus Christ and that those men were actually being used to supply true spiritual food. 

Please don't use numbers to justify God's holy spirit. There are surely far more Catholics and Muslims in this wicked world than JW's.  There are millions of bibles written by hundreds of different translators. There must be priests and clerics that put in many hours to their service to their gods. So saying that JW's do this or that proves nothing. 

What is needed is proof positive of who the true Anointed really are and that they are inspired of God's holy spirit through Jesus Christ.

And it is my true feeling that before Judgement Day arrives, God will show willing humble people exactly who those 'spiritual Jews' really are. 

The Kid seems to think that man's laws are higher than God's laws it seems. So what happens when a government tells the JW's not to preach the good news, or not to talk about God ? Romans 13 v1 again Billy. 

What would your W/t do Billy, obey man's laws ?

No, it only hides behind man's laws when it is convenient to the GB and it's Org. 

If 'data protection' hides criminals and sinners in the JW Org, then surely God's laws would override it for true servants of God. 

I laugh at Billy's use of those last two scriptures. 1 Peter 2 v 16.

¹⁶ Live as free people, but do not use your freedom as a cover-up for evil; live as God’s slaves.

The GB / W/t / JW Org are using their freedom as a cover up for evil. That is what the Child Sexual Abuse investigations Earthwide are all about. The known facts and more facts being revealed about this Child Sexual Abuse being committed by Elders and others within the JW Org.   

But Billy will keep his head in the sand, and as I've said before, he cannot really be a true JW by his thoughts and words. 

 "Either your trust in God or you don't", Billy says.... Yes Billy trust in God, but not in the Watchtower or the GB of JW org. Or in the Elders of JW congregations. 

'Now you want the Watchtower to be an organization that breaks man’s law to benefit opposers,' Billy says.

So, are victims of CSA now viewed as opposers in Billy's eyes ? Look after widows and orphans Billy, remember scripture. 

@James Thomas Rook Jr. I totally agree with your first comment above and I believe the first paragraph of this second comment. As for the full proceedings, I didn't watch it all but have seen 'bits' via youtube or somewhere. 

I do know that the Org tried to withhold information from the Charity Commision here in the UK. 

I find it so funny when you call JW Org 'OUR' system or org. I cannot fully understand why anyone with your knowledge of the GB / W/t / JW Org would want to be any part of it, but maybe you are still getting info to pass on to us. 

I would think that half of the time the criminal or sinner is an Elder, and that he is liked and protected by other Elders, so justice is seldom done. And all is hidden behind closed doors. 

Whereas in that 'wicked old world' outside the Org, justice is more often done, and is seen to be done. 

1 minute ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

If God CONTROLS all governments, as you have just stated, BTK, then the Nazis are blameless for their atrocities.

You cannot have it BOTH ways!

Well the Kid is unwell isn't he ? It's obvious that God does not control all governments. Not would God want to it seems.

The Devil offered all those 'kingdoms' of the earth to Jesus, so I think it's obvious that the Devil controls them. 

7 minutes ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

What irritates me the most ... really burns my overweight butt ... is that the Secular Authorities HAVE THE MORAL HIGH GROUND.

Explain please ?

2 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

The apostles did not “compare themselves to God’s high standards,” for they knew that to do so would be smug. They tried to keep them. They knew very well that they fell short. 

Instead, they said things such as with Paul: 

“I find, then, this law in my case: that when I wish to do what is right, what is bad is present with me.  I really delight in the law of God according to the man I am within,  but I behold in my members another law warring against the law of my mind and leading me captive to sin’s law that is in my members.  Miserable man that I am! Who will rescue me from the body undergoing this death?”  Romans 7:22

You really did manage to miss a lot during your time as a Witness. In your own way, you are no less judgmental than Billy—perhaps even more so.

 

Yes I am judgemental. And in my own opinion I have good reason to be, as do many other ex JW's.

The JW Org, it's GB, the Watchtower, they all need to be judged. Just as they judge the Catholic church and others. 

However, for JW's to use the badness of this wicked world as an excuse for badness in the Org, that is a poor show.

I bring back another of my old saying "Well we didn't offer as many children in the fire to Molech as the other nations did".  When they knew perfectly well what God standards were. 

And i don't see in that scripture you've quoted, that Paul is saying " But I'm better than most people in the world".

Which is the excuse you seem to use.

Comparing things does not mean that you say they are equal. Comparing the JW Org to God's standards shows how wicked the JW Org really is when compared to the standards God expects. Matthew 5 v 48

Matthew 5:48 English Standard Version (ESV)

^{48 "}You therefore must be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect."

We know perfection is not attainable for us, but to use the imperfection as an excuse is so weak. 

I think you would have the pedophiles in the JW Org using that scripture from Paul as an excuse :

 when I wish to do what is right, what is bad is present with me ...   but I behold in my members another law warring against the law of my mind and leading me captive to sin’s law that is in my members.  

Any excuse for JW 's. 

4 minutes ago, TrueTomHarley said:

Now, now. “If it is not perfect, it is filthy,” does not fly with me.

Go argue it with Billy.

You have deliberately missed the point. You are comparing the JW Org with the world. But we know the world is filthy and horrible, so yes the Org is a bit better than the world at large.

However you should be comparing the JW Org to God's high standards, then see how smug you can be.  

Wow what a lovely avatar for a spiritual person to have  Billy seems to like the idea that the Kid killed many more people. 

Just a point here, is a genuine photo and avatar ? 

@TrueTomHarley 'In your dreams is right, for the whole first comment you wrote.

What twaddle. Didn't Peter and the Apostles say at Acts 5 v 29

But Peter and the apostles answered and said, We must obey God rather than men. 

And now the JW's are admitting they have a clergy class ? clergy-penitent privilege 

Quote "Unity among Jehovah’s Witnesses is a commonplace and unremarkable fact." 

What utter rubbish. JW's take each other to worldly courts. They bicker and gossip about each other. It has been proved that some congregants have been 'threatened' by Elders to keep their mouths shut or be disfellowshipped, and that includes me. There is adultery, divorce,  family disputes, all sorts of problems, dishonest dealings too. 

You rabbit on about the world and the UN, but why ?  The W/t, JW Org, GB, are supposed to be NO PART OF THE WORLD, so why doe you people even try to compare yourselves to that world ? 

I've said before, living in my house is much better than living in a sewer. Does that mean my house is perfect ? No of course not. It just means it's better than a sewer. 

So comparing W/t and JW Org to the world means nothing.  As people tell me the 'world' is a big place and is varied in many ways. But even I have met people 'in the world' that are much 'nicer' in a humane way than people in the JW Org. 

Then of course you find the need to off into the realms of fantasy, to obscure the truth about your wicked Org. So be it.

2 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

Are you suggesting that Billy is out to destroy the GB? I never thought of that.

If you have made that assumption, I'll leave that with you  

But it would be possible for a person to pretend to love, admire, follow, believe in, other people, so that they would not be suspected of any foul play if said people came to harm. 

8 hours ago, BillyTheKid46 said:

Nice Try. You get burned just like James, and you can't own how dense your remark was. But, since it seems you still don't understand, the idiocy continues.  However, How much more sick are you in comparison to me. I believe your actions speak louder than my words. That, in essence, is Tom's assessment of thinking you can still be saved. 😂

I think it was you that got burned Kid, when I pointed out that the scripture you used from John 8 wasn't recognised as being authentic scripture. 

But now you go on to use another reference that isn't authentic scripture. 

My only thought here is that you are trying to guide people away from God's word. Why would a 'Christian' want to do that ? 

And why would someone who pretends to love the 'Watchtower' / JW Org not use the NWT ? 

But then why would a 'Christian' have a house full of guns and want to use a murdering outlaw as his avatar ? Do you know I've just found a strange coincidence Billy. Let me show you :- 

Billy the Kid (born Henry McCarty September 17 or November 23, 1859 – July 14, 1881, also known as William H. Bonney) was an American Old West outlaw and gunfighter who killed eight men before he was shot and killed at age 21.

Now how many men in that GB ?  How strange that is. 

Billy is strange, pretending to be a JW, using writings that are not for true Christians, just to try to back up his useless comments. I think the person is unwell. I was going to say man, but one never knows with stupid avatars, if a person is male or female. 

I think your own comment applies to you Kid 

 If you were a JW at one point, whoever taught you scripture did a poor job of it. 

Why would a JW use the Gospel of Thomas which is possibly fake and not inspired of holy spirit ? 

Remember 'all scripture is inspired ...... ' but the gospel of Thomas is not scripture. 

My feeling is this Kid is defo' not a JW but is trying hard to destroy the reputation of the JW Org in an indirect way.

Unlike me that uses direct means and am not frightened to speak my mind. I think the Kid has a grudge against the GB / JW Org / Watchtower and is being sneaky about how he is getting back at them. 

3 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

JTR never responded to this. After he had made the charge that: “I was the subject of a Congregational Committee Trial once, and the three judging me REFUSED TO TELL ME THEIR NAMES.“

He never responded. JTR always responds. His responses are as dependable (and often as smelly) as a bear pooping in the woods. 

He has responded to many other things in the interim.

It makes me think that I hit the nail on the head. If not directly on the head, then close enough. I strongly suspect his seemingly outrageous “mistreatment” that I have never heard of as happening anywhere before was somehow triggered by something outrageous on his part.

And here he is trying to portray himself as a victim.

TTH is here trying to put the blame on JTR. TTH has learnt well from the GB and it's Org. 

Victims in the JW Org very often get told they are to blame. Especially in cases where a victim of mistreatment blames an Elder. Once again we see worship of the Org. 

Quote TTH "To the extent people accept you as a genuine member of the faith". TTH do you really think Billy the Kid is a JW ?

Even when he quotes a scripture from Matthew that the Org says is fake. 

And when he uses a bandito as his avatar and has a house full of guns that he seems to love. 

Strangest type of JW I've ever heard of. 

1 hour ago, BillyTheKid46 said:

Tell what I'll do, since you are re-posting. I'll re-post all your comments here, especially the threating ones, on my FACEBOOK PAGE to see what kind of reaction it will get.

Oh, I thought you were sending all my comment to a higher authority, the one that the bible mentions 'Superior Authorities' 

26 minutes ago, BillyTheKid46 said:

I think you are missing the point here. These are disgusting things men to each other in the name of God and Patronage, that I for one do not accept. If you're trying to justify your personal conduct and threats as though it can be seen the same way, You're funnier than I thought. But as I said, don't worry if an "inspector" knocks on your door. Don't worry about someone else's door. Don't worry about men at war. No one knocks on their door. It's all justified under the rules of war. If you see the news, Trump Pardoned a couple of war criminals. Where's your human justice system.

However, you should also have read, when I stated, EX_RELATIVE

I copied the whole comment to my FB page so that people can make their own mind up about it all. 

Unlike some on here that pick out just a few words out of context.  

But I still find people having a love of guns strange. There are people here in the UK that collect German war memorabilia, i find that disturbing too. Perhaps, in my opinion, it should all be forgotten. War in my opinion is racist. The idea that one race has the right to live above another. 

I tend to collect old household items and farming items, things used for constructive purposes not destructive ones. 

@TrueTomHarley "If it were my defense before the Sanhedrin, that would be a different matter. There I might polish up every word beforehand."

According to God's word you wouldn't need to. The words would be given you by holy spirit.  Doesn't the Bible say not to worry about making a defence for yourself as the words will be given to you? 

10 minutes ago, BillyTheKid46 said:

It's all in the wording. There are times when the heart runs a standard of truth that appears in writing. You can change the narrative once it has been exposed, but it still remains the same. The fact the "librarian" deleted the comment should be the proof. I would have gone further as the librarian has done in the past to "delete" a person but when it comes to opposers, they get better treatment and sympathy in order for Tom to get feedback. Once again, it depends on which alter-ego you are dealing with.

Have a good day John. Don't threat if a Bobby knocks on your door. I'm sure, JWinsider and the Librarian have already instructed you on how to defend your accusation, contempt, hate, and wholehearted threats on the Watchtower GB.

Well it's quite funny to read this comment right now as I've just posted, on my FB / Ex JW page, about JW's that have a stockpile of weapons in their own homes. And how they love to talk about war and about men being run over by vehicles and having their heads blown off. Very Christian attitude, not. 

And how it seems fine with the GB for 'brothers' in the USA to stockpile guns, and how those 'brothers' seem to have a love for weapons of war..

I'm sure my readers will find it interesting. 

I got the idea of copy and paste from the Kid, so I copied and pasted from this blog to my FB. 

31 minutes ago, Outta Here said:

Some may feel this to be the case. Of course there is no mandate to invest in Stocks as there is also no prohibition. It is just one of those matters for a personal decision, such a problem for those who prefer rules. Investopedia has a summary on this "myth".

Investing in Stocks Equates to Gambling

This reasoning causes many people to shy away from the stock market. To understand why investing in stocks is inherently different from gambling, we need to review what it means to buy stocks. A share of common stock represents ownership in a company. It entitles the holder to a claim on assets as well as a fraction of the profits that the company generates. Too often, investors think of shares as simply a trading vehicle, and they forget that stock represents ownership.

In the stock market, investors are constantly trying to assess the profit that will be left over for shareholders. This is why stock prices fluctuate. The outlook for business conditions is always changing, and so are the future earnings of a company.

Assessing the value of a company is complex. There are so many variables involved that short-term price movements appear to be random (academics call this the random walk theory); however, over the long term, a company is supposed to be worth the present value of the profits it will make. In the short term, a company can survive without profits because of the expectations of future earnings, but no company can fool investors forever—eventually, a company's stock price will show the true value of the firm.

Gambling, in contrast, is a zero-sum game. Gambling merely takes money from a loser and gives it to a winner. No value is ever created whereas the overall wealth of an economy increases through investing. As companies compete, they increase productivity and often develop products that improve lives. Investing and creating wealth should not be confused with gambling's zero-sum game.

Of course, some approach investment with a gambler's mentality and often end up with a gambler's reward.....nothing.

As far as gambling is concerned, elders have better things to do than be concerned about those who wish to throw their money into the air. However, there are other connected issues that have more serious repercussions, These may invite attention.

I couldn't resist exploding the Stock Exchange myth as it has surfaced here and may mislead others, but I'm bowing out of this thread now as it is off topic and discused thoroughly elsewhere 

Like I've said before people can make excuses for almost any action. The GB and it's Org are very good at it. 

Um, I thought the JW Org was 'no part of the world', so why would it interest itself in the economy of the world. 

I had a nephew that was really good at poker and won quite a fortune, so to him it wasn't gambling.  

10 hours ago, Melinda Mills said:

Re making interest by way of bank or stock market:

(Matthew 25:24-27) 24 “Finally the slave who had received the one talent came forward and said: ‘Master, I knew you to be a demanding man, reaping where you did not sow and gathering where you did not winnow. 25 So I grew afraid and went and hid your talent in the ground. Here, you have what is yours.’ 26 In reply his master said to him: ‘Wicked and sluggish slave, you knew, did you, that I reaped where I did not sow and gathered where I did not winnow? 27 Well, then, you should have deposited my money with the bankers, and on my coming I would have received it back with interest.
 

Jesus acknowledge the bankers work (and the methods they use to get interest). If the bankers gamble with your money (in the stock market  - every single bank [international development bank and commercial bank) has a department that invests in stocks) and make interest you don't usually complain and ask how the interest was made and wherein they invested your money.  You put out your hand and take the interest.  It is like what Paul said:

(1 Corinthians 10:25, 26)" 25 Eat whatever is sold in a meat market, making no inquiry because of your conscience, 26 for “to Jehovah belong the earth and everything in it.” 

 

Twisting scripture to suit your own means. Typical JW. There is a big difference between putting your money in the bank and Gambling on the stock market.

Gambling is gambling whatever way you do it. It's not me that is against gambling it's your GB / JW Org / W/t writers.

It's the love of money that is a sin not just having money. But my point is , as with the Smoking thing, not made 'law' in the Org until 1970, and the Christmas thing not made 'law' in the Org until around 25 years after they knew it was wrong.  So it is with the Stock Market, they know it's wrong but they still do it and allow others to do it. 

But if a congregant should do the Lottery or other forms of gambling they would get 'reproved' from the platform. 

@BillyTheKid46  Without twisting exactly what I have said, can you truly find a THREAT that i made against the GB ? 

To say I would not be surprised if the GB were removed / killed / assaulted etc, is not a threat it is just saying that i would not be in the least surprised. 

You yourself know that people kill school children for no good reason. They kill people in churches and mosques. They kill people at social gatherings. What exactly is the murder rate per day in the USA these days ? 

American people have to live with the threat of being shot every day, in the UK it's the threat of being stabbed.  It's reality Billy, you and I know it, but it seems strange that people try to hide those facts. 

As for screen shots, I don't think they will hold up in court. Well I haven't had the Police knocking on my door yet, but I have warned my wife of your silly threats of reporting me etc. So if they come knocking she will at least know why  .

Have a good day Kid, this is all so funny, have a laugh.

I think many comments on here are edited after a reply is given and the original commenter sees how bad the first comment was. 

Suppose that is why the Kid and maybe others take screen shots / print screen.