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Witness

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  1. Like
    Witness reacted to Alessandro Corona in Could Someone Be Disfellowshipped For Not Believing In The "Overlapping Generation" JW Doctrine AFTER Being Baptized?   
    No, as a Christian I have an obligation to warn everyone when they are being misled. Even if it means losing my friends, their blood isn't on my hands,  I warned them all as much as I could. 
    Paul said the same regarding a group of people he was preaching to. 
  2. Like
    Witness reacted to James Thomas Rook Jr. in Could Someone Be Disfellowshipped For Not Believing In The "Overlapping Generation" JW Doctrine AFTER Being Baptized?   
    Not one witness in 200 understands ( and I just made up that statistic ...) that the way "new truth" is determined is that it is proposed by someone, and VOTED ON ... and there has to be a 66.66% majority to apostasize from the "Old Truth", or come up with a "new" idea.
    In 1957, when Sputnik was circling the Earth ... it was proposed that this be viewed as one of the "signs in the heavens", but it did not get enough votes to become "new light".
    YOU CANNOT VOTE ON TRUTH!
    Something is either true ... or it's NOT!
    I remember pieces of a movie I saw on TV many years ago ... I think the movie's setting years were somewhere around the 1300's ... Omar Sherif playing somebody was being asked if there REALLY was such a thing as witches.
    He replied "I hope so ... because we burn at the stake about 16,000 a year, in Germany alone." (paraphrased 50 year old memory fragment).
    I understand the relationship between these two apparently disjointed ideas ... I hope you do also.
    When people start "making up" theology from NOTHING ... they also start collecting firewood for those who will not, and cannot believe it.
    .
     
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  3. Like
    Witness reacted to PeterR in Could Someone Be Disfellowshipped For Not Believing In The "Overlapping Generation" JW Doctrine AFTER Being Baptized?   
    I openly admit that I have no idea what you are now saying, nor why you are saying it.
    I'm not sure you do either.
    TrueTomHarley - do you value honesty at all? Is there a basis for a conversation here, or when confronted with reality is pulling a pin on a confusion grenade the only option for you? If so I have to say that it was pretty effective.
    In the meanwhile if anyone else has followed the exchange, and would like to make a reasoned comment on the matter, then I'd love to inhale a small whiff of sanity.
  4. Upvote
    Witness reacted to Shiwiii in Could Someone Be Disfellowshipped For Not Believing In The "Overlapping Generation" JW Doctrine AFTER Being Baptized?   
    I'm sorry but I just cannot accept this part of your post in all honesty. In an essence you're saying "just go along and be a good person, nevermind if the foundation of your beliefs are all outta whack, it'll work itself out." 
    The doctrines of a belief is the foundations of that said belief. You even eluded to this in a different post. 
  5. Upvote
    Witness reacted to PeterR in Could Someone Be Disfellowshipped For Not Believing In The "Overlapping Generation" JW Doctrine AFTER Being Baptized?   
    In my opinion and experience there is an element of this going on. I don't believe it's motivated by corporate greed though. There are different motivators at work. If you want to start to understand what they are you can look at a local level and work up from there.
    There are many good brothers and sisters who do good deeds for no personal advancement. This is true of many people outside of the organization also (it would be wrong/silly to suggest otherwise), but most of us are primarily focused on what happens inside. 
    At the same time there is a hierarchy. Technically nobody is "greater", but it's implicitly acknowledged that some "privileges" are greater than others. (All animals are equal, but some are more equal than others. - Animal Farm)
    In recent years the ones being promoted up that hierarchy tend to be younger than they were a decade or two ago. There's nothing intrinsically wrong with that, but most people who see what's going on from inside would say that loyalty is being valued over experience. If anyone cares to argue with that then please go ahead. Loyalty is a valuable quality when applied correctly and directed to the right party. Loyalty to Jehovah God and his Son is essential. But if the organization becomes interchangeably used with Jehovah, with no practical distinction then there is room for loyalty to become abused by those in authority.
    When organization becomes the thing that must be preserved at all costs, and individuals are expendable, bad things happen. The word "organization" never occurs in God's Word, and Jesus always stressed the value of individuals. That's not to say that being organized is a bad thing, but not if "unity" and "organization" trump "love".
    By all means I would prefer to support my point of view with specific examples. I could do that, but I won't in a public forum.
    It should not be necessary though. Those in the hierarchy know the facts even though they may not care to confront them. And for sure if things are going without problem in your corner of the world then I am happy for you. The question is whether the system itself is geared to serve the needs of an organization when it comes to the crunch, or to help individuals.
    Elders - what is the order of priority you have been given at school - 1) Jehovah's name, 2) the congregation, and 3) the individual.
    Anyone care to argue?
    In practice #1 & #2 actually becomes "the organization" and #3 remains as "the individual".
    And the scriptural support for this is .... ? See the problem?
    (I already know that certain people will not see a problem)
     
  6. Upvote
    Witness reacted to PeterR in Could Someone Be Disfellowshipped For Not Believing In The "Overlapping Generation" JW Doctrine AFTER Being Baptized?   
    You would be asking the wrong question Anna.
    You need to ask him whether someone could be disfellowshipped for NOT believing it after baptism.
    If he says no, he is either misinformed, forgetful, or lying.
    Now I grant you, not every elder will apply the letter of the law (although in a JC it's more likely because of the group dynamics). But that there are procedures in place to allow for DF'ing someone who refuses to believe in particular teachings is very real.
    Let me ask you Anna - if I could prove beyond doubt that this was true would you accept it, or would you continue to make light of it?
    If you are determined to see only what you want to see I have no agenda to change that. But I can assure you that I do not speak from a position of ignorance or partial information in this regard.
  7. Like
    Witness got a reaction from Shiwiii in Who can really explain *GOG from MAGOG* ?   
    "And He gave some as apostles, and some as prophets, and some as evangelists, and some as pastors and teachers, for the equipping of the saints for the work of service, to the building up of the body of Christ"  Eph 4:11,12
    If the anointed accepts and understand the spiritual role of each bodily member, the gifts are shared. The whole body is enhanced at “teaching”, “healing”, comforting, etc,  all under the same Head, Christ.  One who comforts can be equipped to teach, etc. 
    “A manifestation of the Spirit is given to each person for the common good” 1 Cor 12:7
    So, as James says, not all should  assume the role of primary teacher, as what is taught could be destructive to the entire anointed Body. 1 Cor 12:29,4,11; 12:17,18  This is how it is with the GB and their “teaching” – a “world of unrighteousness”, defiling the entire anointed body.  Also, any other “gift” of the anointed ones who must obey them, may as well be nonexistent.   1 Cor 1:10-13;25,28-30; Col 2:19
     
  8. Like
    Witness got a reaction from Shiwiii in Who can really explain *GOG from MAGOG* ?   
    Funny you should say that, since every “slave” of Christ should be teaching the people, not just a select few.  They “teach” through the avenue of the gift given them within the Body.   I guess it’s in the “blood”. Mal 2:7; 1 Pet 2:5,9; John 6:53; 5:1,2,4,5,16; John 13:20  
  9. Like
    Witness got a reaction from Hopper DeeDee in Who can really explain *GOG from MAGOG* ?   
    “Then, indeed, the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will do away with by the spirit of his mouth+ and bring to nothing by the manifestation of his presence.”
    And you feel this is through the “preaching work”?   Of God’s Kingdom based on 1914?
    “The spirit or breath of Christ’s mouth is given to his faithful anointed ones, whom he uses to expose the man of lawlessness.”  John 20:22; Rev 11:1-4; Matt 24:31
    But remember, the GB is not inspired by their own admission; which means they have no  Holy Spirit. 2 Pet 3:17  What is interesting though, is they attribute God’s spirit to be with the organization. Rev 13:15  Since God’s true witnesses of Isa 43:10 are the anointed ones (1 Pet 2:5,9; Rev 17:14), it must be other anointed ones he is using to expose the man of lawlessness – those who are fully aware of the power of Holy Spirit within them.
    You said, Could "Gog"-meaning have anything to do with -for instance- "the syna-GOGUE of Satan?"
    Excellent point; The false prophet/two-horned beast authorizes an “image” of the wild beast to be made and revered. Rev 13:4 This image is imbued with “life”, from Satan’s “breath”.  Rev 13:14,15  It is the synagogue of Satan, where both Beasts (Gog and Magog) have authority and power over…
     ….God’s dwelling… Col 1:19; 2:9; John 14:23; 1 Cor 3:16; 6:19
    … which is his Temple…1 Cor 3:16; 6:19
    … which is comprised of the anointed ones. Isa 43:10; 1 Pet 2:5,9; Eph 2:20-22
    In this synagogue, is the man of lawlessness; who is also the Wild Beast from the sea – a sea of “Gentiles” – nations, non Jews. 
    Both 2 Thess 2 and Rev 13 tell us about the man of lawlessness.   
    “who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.”  2 Thess 2:4
    “Then he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme His name, His tabernacle (God’s dwelling), and those who dwell in heaven.”  Rev 13:6
    ” Here is wisdom. Let him who has understanding calculate the number of the beast, for it is the number of a man: His number is 666.”  Rev 13:18
     God’s presence is within the Temple, the hearts of the anointed ones. Rom 8:9,11; 2 Cor 3:3;  These “living stones” have been cast aside in the organization and “hewn stones” have taken their place – a man made priesthood.  (Isa 9:10)
    An elder body “sits” as God, by replacing the Temple “stones”, and “stands” over the “royal priesthood” through the GB’s admonition that God’s appointed priesthood must obey the elders, who are not “spiritually” circumcised. Ezek 44:9
    This is the man of lawlessness, the disgusting thing/abomination standing in the holy place, and the last power of Daniel’s image, fourth beast, over the anointed ones. Dan 11:31; Matt 24:15  You won’t find God’s Temple anywhere else to fulfill this prophesy.    
    When the anointed spiritual “Jews”(Rom 2:29) awake to the state they are in and realize they serve men and not Christ, they voice truth and are disfellowshipped.  Rev 11:7; 16:2; 6:9  Through them, the man of lawlessness is revealed, through the spirit of the mouth of Christ. Rev 11:4 They “overcome” Satan’s great delusion of 2 Thess 2:9-11, that God allows his heritage people to be subjected, teaching them refinement and purification of all sin and idolatry – to become acceptable as the remnant and last “living stones” of the Temple to be sealed in the heavens. Mal 3:2; Rev 3:18; Zech 4:7
    “I know your works, tribulation, and poverty (but you are rich); and I know the blasphemy of those who say they are Jews and are not, but are a synagogue of Satan.”  Rev 2:9
     “I know your works. See, I have set before you an open door, and no one can shut it; for you have a little strength, have kept My word, and have not denied My name. 9 Indeed I will make those of the synagogue of Satan, who say they are Jews and are not, but lie—indeed I will make them come and worship before your feet, and to know that I have loved you. 10 Because you have kept My command to persevere, I also will keep you from the hour of trial which shall come upon the whole world, to test those who dwell on the earth. 11 Behold, I am coming quickly! Hold fast what you have, that no one may take your crown. 12 He who overcomes, I will make him a pillar in the temple of My God, and he shall go out no more. I will write on him the name of My God and the name of the city of My God, the New Jerusalem, which comes down out of heaven from My God. And I will write on him My new name.”  Rev 3:8-12
    @James Thomas Rook Jr. and @Otto , knowing who Gog and Magog are does matter to each and every one of us.  Otherwise, a few more scriptures become irrelevant in the minds of JWs.
    “All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness,  that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work.”  2 Tim 3:16,17
      “So when you see the ‘abomination of desolation,’ spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not” (let the reader understand), “then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains.”  Mark 13:14
     “But when you see Jerusalem (New Jerusalem/Temple) surrounded by armies,(“Gentiles”) then know that its desolation is near.  Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, let those who are in the midst of her depart, and let not those who are in the country enter her.  For these are the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.”  Luke 21:20-22
    What are the mountains that Jesus is commanding we flee to? 
    Matt.5:14,16; Zech.6:1; Zech.4:14; Rev.11:4,3; (Rev.12:6; John14:3; Heb.13:13; Matt.25:6); 
    Psalm72:3; 3:4; 2Chron.13:10,11,12; Joel3:18; Zech.14:8; Isa.65:9; Jer.50:19,20; Zech.3:9; Luke23:30; Eze.36:8
    Rev 18:4,5 – “And I heard another voice from heaven saying, “Come out of her, my people, (the anointed and their brethren are not in Christendom) lest you share in her sins, and lest you receive of her plagues.  For her sins have reached to heaven, and God has remembered her iniquities.”
    And one last scripture that JWs are well aware of, and what faithful anointed priests should be teaching the sheep (Mal 2:7)
     “teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age.” Amen.  Matt 18:20 
     
     
     
  10. Like
    Witness got a reaction from Alzasior Lutor in Who can really explain *GOG from MAGOG* ?   
    I addressed this in my second post.  Hope it helps.  
  11. Like
    Witness got a reaction from Shiwiii in Who can really explain *GOG from MAGOG* ?   
    I will repeat again, in its twisted way, the Watchtower reveals the true timing of the thousand year reign of Christ, that it ends before Armageddon; but you have to desire to see it. 
    God’s Kingdom Rules!
    “God’s Kingdom Removes Its Enemies” pg 222-230
    Subheading:  “The Grand Finale of the Great Tribulation”
    Although it is full of biblical error, it is telling JWs that Gog and Magog attack God’s anointed ones BEFORE God’s Kingdom arrives. 
    “An all-out attack. Gog of Magog will attack the remaining anointed ones and their other sheep companions. (Read Ezekiel 38:2, 11.) This attack against established Kingdom rule will be Satan’s last battle in a war that he has been waging against the anointed remnant since his expulsion from heaven.” 
    Remember, it is saying that it is Satan's last battle, BUT of this event, it ends by saying:
    “Then, after Jesus has conquered and removed all human enemies of God’s Kingdom, he will hurl Satan and his demons into the abyss. There they will be kept in a deathlike, inactive state for a thousand years.—Read Revelation 6:2; 20:1-3.
    So...apparently it isn't Satan's last battle, because there is another battle to come.  
    The article sites Rev 20:1-3:
    “Then I saw an angel coming down from heaven holding the key to the abyss and a great chain in his hand.  He seized the dragon, that ancient serpent who is the devil and Satan, and bound him for a thousand years.  He threw him into the abyss, closed it, and put a seal on it so that he would no longer deceive the nations until the thousand years were completed. After that, he must be released for a short time. 
    DOES CHRIST HURL GOG AND MAGOG INTO THE ABYSS FOR A THOUSAND YEARS? NO. 
    NOTICE WHAT THE ORGANIZATION HAS HIDDEN FROM YOU! 
    READ FURTHER IN Rev 20: 
     “When the thousand years are completed, Satan will be released from his prison and will go out to deceive the nations at the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them for battle. Their number is like the sand of the sea.  They came up across the breadth of the earth and surrounded the encampment of the saints, the beloved city. Then fire came down from heaven and consumed them.  The devil who deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur where the beast and the false prophet are, and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.”  Rev 20:7,8
    The attack of Gog and Magog happens after the thousand year reign of Christ. IT IS SATAN'S LAST BATTLE, AND IT OCCURS DURING ARMAGEDDON AS GOD'S KINGDOM RULES BOOK STATES.
    So, who is the target of Satan’s deception?
     Every JW in the organization, where God’s anointed ones are “gathered” during Armageddon– which is happening now; and who believe a thousand years of peace is still to come!
    Rev 16:13-16 – “Then I saw three unclean spirits like frogs coming from the dragon’s mouth, from the beast’s mouth, (organization) and from the mouth of the false prophet. (GB)
     For they are demonic spirits performing signs, who travel to the kings (anointed ones) of the whole world to assemble them for the battle on the great day of God, the Almighty. 
     “Look, I am coming like a thief. Blessed is the one who is alert and remains clothed so that he may not go around naked and people see his shame.” 
    So they assembled the kings at the place called in Hebrew, Armageddon.”
    The valley of decision, where anointed one and brethren love either truth or lies/deceit/deception.  Joel 3:14; 2 Thess 2:9-12
    Your leaders will tell you that the faithful Kingdom heirs must be in heaven before this battle ensues.  Not true.  The remnant can be sealed while on earth, IF they have love for pure truth, and reject deceit.  Eph 1:13; Heb 12:22; Rev 5:9,10
    “But Isaiah cries out concerning Israel,
    Though the number of Israelites
    is like the sand of the sea,
    only the remnant will be saved;
     since the Lord will execute his sentence
    completely and decisively on the earth.”  Rom 9:27,28
    2 Thess 2:11: “For this reason God sends them a strong delusion so that they will believe the lie”
    “Delusion” - πλάνη plánē, plan'-ay; feminine of G4108 (as abstractly); objectively, fraudulence; subjectively, a straying from orthodoxy or piety:—deceit, to deceive, delusion, error.
    G4108 - πλάνος plános, plan'-os; of uncertain affinity; roving (as a tramp), i.e. (by implication) an impostor or misleader; --deceiver, seducing.
    The Governing Body/harlot/ and her Beast/organization have allowed JWs to be deceived about what is presently happening in the spirit realm, they do this by twisting the scriptures to their liking.  Rev 22:18
    How does Satan deceive?  With lies and delusions.  Would God allow another “delusion” to take place in his righteous Kingdom after a thousand years? People would sin again, taken in by deceit which is Satan’s common ploy.  How demeaning to both Christ and the Father it is to teach this, when we consider Christ’s sacrifice for the atonement of our sins, once and for all.
     “He takes away the first that He may establish the second.  By that will we have been sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.”  Heb 10:10
     “Anyone who has rejected Moses’ law dies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses.  Of how much worse punishment, do you suppose, will he be thought worthy who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified a common thing, and insulted the Spirit of grace?  For we know Him who said, “Vengeance is Mine, I will repay,” says the Lord.And again, “The Lord will judge His people.” It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.”  Heb 10:28-31 
    Such bold letters, do they make any impact on any of you?  Why are lies tolerated?  Why do you want to be deceived?  Why do you love the lie?  2 Thess 2:11,12; Jer 5:30,31
     
     
  12. Like
    Witness got a reaction from Shiwiii in Who can really explain *GOG from MAGOG* ?   
    Wt 15/7/15 pp. 1,2 - “Jehovah’s people enjoy a special environment of peace in the earthly part of his organization.”
    Wt -5/2/15 pp. 17-2 – “Our spiritual heritage can also infuse in us a deep sense of spiritual security that can be enjoyed only within Jehovah’s organization.” 
  13. Thanks
    Witness got a reaction from Queen Esther in Who can really explain *GOG from MAGOG* ?   
    I know you include yourself in your disguised humility ?  There are exceptions though; otherwise, we may as well discard more scriptures; beginning with Amos, here are just a few.  
    Amos 3:7
    Num 12:6
    Acts 2:17-21
    1 Cor 14:32
    Rev 1:1-3;2:29; 10:11
    Matt 17:9-12
    Ezek 43:10-12
    1 Cor 3:16,17
    2 Cor 6:16
    Eph 2:20-22
    1 Pet 2:5,9
    Dan 9:24,25; 8:13,14
    Matt 24:15,16
    Neh 2:17,18
    2 Thess 2:3,4
    Rev 13:5-7,15
    Rev 11:1-3,7-10
    Luke 21:24,25,17-19 
    Zech chapter 4
    Rev 3:9-12; 21:2
    Rev 10:7
    If the completion of the Temple brings God’s Kingdom to mankind onto the earth, as well as Satan’s demise, it would be foolish to think Satan won’t do everything in his power to stop it.  It would also be foolish to think that God won’t reveal Satan’s plan against God’s servants, and the way they are to cope with it. And it would be foolish to think Satan doesn’t know how to create a counterfeit plan to “soothe” the future Temple members into a false sense of “peace and security”. 
    We as people may have moved into the 21st century, believing we are beyond God’s power to work through individuals; however, God never changes.  Isa 48:17,18,3
     Can this Temple/New Jerusalem be completed via the organization?  No, it’s “restoration” occurs outside of the whitewashed walls, outside of the delusion.  Ezek 13:14-23; 2 Thess 2:1-4,11,12 
    A power was predicted to come against the “saints”; it is the organization/GB that disgraces God’s anointed servants inside by replacing them with false teachers, removing any "power"/Holy Spirit  they may have possessed (Mal 2:7; 1 Pet 2:5,9; Dan 12:7); and outside the organization, for those who turn to Christ.   Dan 7:23-25; Luke 21:24,25,17-19; John 16:2-4; Rev 13:15; 11:7-10; Heb 13:13; Matt 5:10,11;Ps 22:6;78:35; Jer 31:11;  Isa 41:13-15;44:22
    If JWs are Bible readers, as they propose to be, it is the scriptures that reveal God’s message to his people, as well as how it is delivered.  The scriptures shouldn’t scare us off from understanding there are more anointed ones than just the GB, and who actually bear "fruit that will last".  They're just not as "pretty".    Matt 7:15-20; John 15:16; 1 Cor 1:27-31
     
     
     
  14. Like
    Witness got a reaction from Queen Esther in Who can really explain *GOG from MAGOG* ?   
    @Shiwiii - Another thought, if jw's do not engage in war, then again....who is fighting here? Either it will be jw's against jw's or someone has the story wrong. 
    The thousand year teaching is another false story of the Watchtower.
    The false prophet and Wild Beast and Gog and Magog both have the same purpose, to destroy the anointed ones.  So, both groups mirror each other.  To see who is fighting who, it’s good to compare each group’s identities. 
    Wild Beast - The beast was given a mouth to utter boasts and blasphemies. It was allowed to exercise authority for forty-two months.  It began to speak blasphemies against God: to blaspheme his name and his dwelling (Temple 1 Cor 3:16,17; 1 Pet 2:5,9) —those who dwell in heaven. Rev 13:5,6  Heb 12:22; Rev 5:9,10; Jer 7:30; 25:29 
    - “And it was permitted to wage war against the saints and to conquer them. It was also given authority over every tribe, people, language, and nation. Rev 13:7
    False prophet – “It also performs great signs, even causing fire to come down from heaven to earth in front of people.  It deceives those who live on the earth because of the signs that it is permitted to perform in the presence of the beast, telling those who live on the earth to make an image of the beast who was wounded by the sword and yet lived.” Rev 13:13,14
     Gog and Magog: “Now when the thousand years have expired, Satan will be released from his prison (guarded) and will go out to deceive the nations which are in the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle,  whose number is as the sand of the sea.  They went up on the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city. And fire came down from God out of heaven and devoured them.  The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are. And they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.  Rev 20:7     Ezek 7:1-4
    In both cases, “fire” is used to “consume” and “conquer”; the saints with deceit – uttering blasphemies against God; and ultimately, fire from God. The word of truth is like “fire”/spirit which faithful ones use to fight off Satan’s counterfeit fire  - a counterfeit “truth”; lies spoken through false prophets by another spirit/fire, than that of God’s.  Jer 23:29; Ps 29:7; Jer 5:14; Matt 10:20; Hos 6:5; Rev 11:5; Job 1:16; 2 Cor 11:4; 2 Thess  2:3,9,10;  2 Pet 2:7; Rev 16:13,14 
    Watchtower teaches that the Beast/false prophet is the political governments today represented by the UN. The UN does not “wage war with the saints” or blaspheme God’s Temple (1 Cor 3:16,17); in fact, representatives affiliated with the UN, came to the defense of JWs in Russia.
    Side point:  Revelation’s “kings of the earth” are the anointed ones (as well as “horns”); as is the two horned false prophet/harlot/beast from the earth. Rev 1:5; 5:10;13:11;17:2; 21:22-27; Isa 66:1 The two sides of Armageddon’s battle involves these kings. 
     Only the Watchtower both “wages war” with the anointed by silencing them into submission, and blasphemes God’s Temple by enforcing a false priesthood to rule with authority over the anointed ones. Matt 24:15 When an anointed one rejects such claims, they are disfellowshipped or “killed” by the Beast/organization.  Nowhere does the UN “kill” the anointed ones, or are even aware of what God’s heavenly Temple/Zion consists of. 
    (it-2 pp. 1076-1083)
    An early “anointed/saint”, the apostle Paul said,
    “For although we live in the flesh, we do not wage war according to the flesh,  since the weapons of our warfare are not of the flesh, but are powerful through God for the demolition of strongholds. We demolish arguments  and every proud thing that is raised up against the knowledge of God, and we take every thought captive to obey Christ.  And we are ready to punish any disobedience, once your obedience is complete.”  2 Cor 10:3-6
    There it is, the war against falsehood strongholds (the organization) and the true knowledge of God through our obedience to Christ and truth.
    Armageddon is this war.  2 Thess 2:7,8 – “For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work, but the one now restraining will do so until he is out of the way, and then the lawless one will be revealed. The Lord Jesus will destroy him with the breath of his mouth (Holy Spirit/”fire”) and will bring him to nothing at the appearance of his coming.
    Jesus’ army equipped with “fire” comes up against Satan’s false prophet/Beast.  Jer 20:9; Rev 12:7-9  By its own admission, the Beast and false prophet are present, therefore, so is Gog and Magog. 
    I should get back to the point.  The “thousand years” began when Christ sat down on his throne (1 Cor 15:24-27; Matt 10:34; Ps 110:1,2) and ended when Satan was no longer “restrained”.  Rev 13:14,15
    2 Thess 2:11 – “For this reason God sends them a strong delusion so that they will believe the lie”
    God allows Satan to carry out his end time deception on the “remaining ones of the woman’s seed”. 2 Thess 2:9-12; Rev 12:17   How else will Satan do this if not with the help of humans, particularly those whom are “among” the anointed ones? 
    2 Pet 2:1-3: “Just as false prophets rose up in the past AMONG GOD’S PEOPLE, false teachers will rise up in the future AMONG YOU. They will slip in with their destructive opinions, denying the very Master who bought their freedom and dooming themselves to destruction swiftly, but not before they attract others by their unbridled and IMMORAL BEHAVIOR, Because of them and their ways, others will criticize and condemn the path of truth we walk as seedy and disreputable.  These FALSE TEACHERS will follow their greed and exploit you with their fabrications, but be assured that their judgment was pronounced long ago and their destruction does not sleep.” 
    Satan is the catalyst, “Wormwood”, a fallen (composite) anointed “star”, carries it out – the “beast from the earth”/false prophet/harlot.  Rev 8:11; Heb 12:15; Prov 5:4
    God’s Kingdom arrives when everything evil is gone, fully gone. “The last enemy to be abolished is death”.  1 Cor 15:26,24; Dan 7:21-27 After Gog/ Magog, Wild Beast/false prophet/harlot is thrown into the fire, the source of death, Satan ,follows. 
    There are not two judgment periods, otherwise Dan 2:44 would be a lie. 
     “In the time of those kings, the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that will never be destroyed, nor will it be left to another people. It will crush all those kingdoms and bring them to an end, but it will itself endure forever. 
    Dan 2:35 would be a lie,
    “Then the iron, the clay, the bronze, the silver and the gold were all broken to pieces and became like chaff on a threshing floor in the summer. The wind swept them away without leaving a trace. But the rock that struck the statue became a huge mountain and filled the whole earth. (Mount Zion)”
    Rev 21:3,4 would be a lie.
    “And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Look! God’s dwelling place is now among the people, and he will dwell with them. They will be his people, and God himself will be with them and be their God. He will wipe every tear from their eyes. There will be no more death or mourning or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away.”
    Even the promise of eternal salvation through Christ’s sacrifice would be a lie, only to last a literal thousand years; after which, temptation and sin would return to earth again. Does this thought even make sense? 
    Matt 19:16; Rom 6:22; 1 John 2:25; John 17:3
    2 Pet 3:8 - “Dear friends, don't overlook this one fact: With the Lord one day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years like one day.”
    This “day” is the light of Christ that he offers those who submit themselves to him. 2 Pet 1:19
    During Satan’s end time deception once he is let loose from his “restraint”, (2 Thess 2:1-12) the light of Christ is obliterated until he “stands up” and calls his people out of darkness (the “valley of decision”), and into his light. Joel 3:14; Isa 63:2-6; Rev 11:3-5;Dan 12:1; Rev 18:4-8
    For just one example, look at Watchtower’s study edition of 9/2017  “Imitate Jehovah’s Compassion”  The picture shows Jesus healing a man, but only one small paragraph, as if as an afterthought, gives credence to the compassion God sent us through Christ.  The light of Christ does not shine through in Watchtower’s teachings, something that has taken over 100 years for the organization to develop.  Rev 16:13,14
    “For he says: At an acceptable time I listened to you, and in the day of salvation I helped you. See, now is the acceptable time; now is the day of salvation!”  2 Cor 6:2
    The thousand year reign of Christ cannot be taken literal as each individual during their life time will either receive salvation or condemnation, depending on their stand for light or darkness.   Faithful anointed ones throughout the ages are “sons” of that “day”, when walking in Christ’s light, even though Satan’s darkness still exists.  1 Thess 5:5; Matt 5:5: John 1:4  There is so much to be said about its symbolic meaning. Revelation is full of symbolism, including this time period of a thousand years, as well as other time factors.  1000 - 10x10X10 – a perfect complete testimony of truth found in the heart of the faithful anointed ones and all who overcame Satan’s darkness when Christ began ruling from heaven.   Ps 110:1-3
    So, there is no waiting for man to become perfect physically or mentally to be then judged.  Clearly, scriptures say our “judgment” began when Jesus appeared on the earth. John 3:19 I could never understand Wt’s thousand year teaching, especially knowing so many before Jesus who walked the earth were faithful as imperfect humans.  At that time, Satan was not “restrained” from causing evil, until authority to do so was given to Jesus. Matt 28:18; Rev 20:3 Yet, each person was judged according to their love of truth.  I remember fretting over what would happen after a thousand years of supposed peace – would I stand up to Satan’s last deception?  Well, it is here, right in front of each JW residing with the captive anointed ones in the organization.
    God is “not the God of the dead, but of the living.” Only those who have received salvation and “life” now in Christ through our obedience to him – not to men – during this lifetime, is the basis of our judgment.  There is no second chance in a fabricated thousand years to come.  Matt 22:29-33
    I checked the defining mark of true prophets vs false prophets in the Insight Book.  True to word, the GB’s teaching fits the description of false prophets…perfectly.  How I wish JWs would wake up.
    I apologize for such a lengthy comment. 
     
     
  15. Upvote
    Witness got a reaction from James Thomas Rook Jr. in Governing Body: Does it show loyalty or disloyalty to question the GB?   
    "Governing Body: Does it show loyalty or disloyalty to question the GB?"
    Firstly, I ask, loyalty to what?  The organization or to God?
    I think the better question is, do we show loyalty to God and Christ when tolerating wayward teachings by the GB?  If these men were faithful servants, they would welcome questions and suggestions from fellow anointed servants and adjust their own thinking by reasoning on the scriptures. This is the role of a steward; to gather from all sources. 
      Although they truly would love to called so, and hint at it frequently, they are not Moses. Instead of pointing to themselves as the source of the final word, they should be pointing to God. Acts 14:15; Luke 4:8; Rev 19:10 There is not just one rotten and discarded teaching from the mouths of the GB, there is a bushel of them.  Matt 12:33; Col 2:8
    Are they above law of loving one’s neighbor as one’s self?  They certainly show it in the same way as the Pharisees. Matt 5:20; Mark 10:42-45; Phil 2:3; Rom 12:10; Eph 5:21
    Even Jesus did not expect glory for himself. John 7:16,18; 17:4
    We are judged on our love for purity in truth, not for following men.
     
  16. Thanks
    Witness got a reaction from Queen Esther in Who can really explain *GOG from MAGOG* ?   
    Queen Esther,  I get the feeling this post will be moved to controversial.  Nonetheless, I do hope you read it.
    From “God’ Kingdom Rules” Book -  Attack on religion. Recall that Paul wrote: “Whenever it is that they are saying, ‘Peace and security!’ then sudden destruction is to be instantly on them.” Just as a flash of lightning is closely followed by the crash of thunder, so the time of saying “Peace and security!” will be instantly followed by “sudden destruction.” What will be destroyed? First, “BABYLON THE GREAT,” the world empire of false religion, also known as “the prostitute.” (Rev. 17:5, 6, 15)
    What religion declares “peace and security” within its borders?
    Wt 15/7/15 pp. 1,2 - “Jehovah’s people enjoy a special environment of peace in the earthly part of his organization.”
    Wt -5/2/15 pp. 17-2 – “Our spiritual heritage can also infuse in us a deep sense of spiritual security that can be enjoyed only within Jehovah’s organization.” 
    Babylon the Great is a covenant -  a promise of death. Isa 28:15,18
    Covenants are represented as “mothers” in scripture; (Gal 4:24,26)  This promise or covenant is the “mother” of her “harlot/daughters”, and there have been many of these daughters over history. The last of ‘Babylon’s’ daughters are unfaithful anointed ones who are no longer spiritual ‘virgins’ belonging to Christ, but have entered another “marriage” with their new King, Satan. 2 Cor 11:2  They are harlots, who love the authority and power Satan bestows on them in order to “wage war” with the “remaining ones of her seed”.   Rev 12:15; 12:7,11,17; 16:13-16; 17:14; 19:11,14; 20:8
    Captive to lies and the threat of disfellowshipping, a spiritual “killing” results if one does choose to follow the Lamb and not an organization. Luke 21:24,20; Rev 13:5-9, 11, 14-18.  We clearly see this fulfillment now.  With the false prophet/harlot’s deceitful tongue, spiritual “Israel” is offered a false sense of “peace and security”, which is only a piece of the puzzle constituting the entire ‘refuge’ of falsehood.  
    “False messiahs (false christs/anointed) and false prophets will arise and perform great signs and wonders to lead astray, if possible, even the elect.”  Matt 24:24
     “Now when the thousand years have expired, Satan will be released from his prison and will go out to deceive the nations which are in the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle, whose number is as the sand of the sea.  They went up on the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city.  Rev 20:7-9
    When attending the kingdom hall, can this attack by Satan, the Master of Delusion, be easily perceived?  As the Watchtower below says, the cry of peace and security is a clever facade that hides well what Satan and his harlots, disguised as “ministers” of the “angel of light” are operating against the anointed ones. 2 Cor 11:14,15; Ezek 38:10,11
     “Who will make this significant future declaration of “Peace and security”? The Scriptures do not tell us. What we do know is that no matter what form the proclamation takes or how convincing it might sound, IT WILL ONLY BE A VENEER. “w13 11/15 pp. 10-14
    Not all “battles” are fought with physical weapons.
    “Finally, be strengthened by the Lord and by His vast strength.  Put on the full armor of God so that you can stand against the tactics (schemes, tricks)  of the Devil.  For our battle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the world powers of this darkness, against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavens.  This is why you must take up the full armor of God, so that you may be able to resist in the evil day, and having prepared everything, to take your stand.”  Eph 6:10-13
    There are two teachings by the Watchtower on this attack by Gog and Magog against the anointed ones.
    One:
    As the “ GREAT TRIBULATION” moves toward its climax, God’s people will be the target of an all-out attack by “Gog of the land of Magog.” During this attack, “a numerous military force” will come against God’s people “like clouds to cover the land.” (Ezek. 38:2, 14-16) No human agency will come to the defense of Jehovah’s people. Their survival will depend on God alone. (ws12 4/15 pp. 21-26
    And also:
    “We are told that AT THE END OF THE 1,000 YEARS, Satan will be released from the abyss, and “he will go out to mislead those nations in the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together for the war.” (Rev. 20:8) ws15 5/15 pp. 27-28
    Ezek 38 and Rev 20, have seldom been referred together in Wt. magazines to describe this attack.  Why?  The Wt. teaches that the thousand year reign of Christ is initiated after Armageddon.  Yet, Ezekiel is used to point out that this attack happens during the great tribulation.  Is Gog and Magog defeated by Christ twice?  
    Ezek 38:18-23 describe God’s judgment is executed.  Rev 20:10 states:
    “The Devil who deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur where the beast and the false prophet are, and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.”  In both cases, judgment is final as Armageddon reaches its peak.
    Ezek 38:2,14-23   
     Should you believe this attack comes before or after Armageddon?  Interestingly, in one rare occurrence of using both Ezekiel and Revelation,  the Wt. asks, “Are these different attacks? That is not likely.” (Wt 15/5/15)
    Satan’s deceptive arrows of deceit are targeted in all directions leading JWs down a confusing, windy path of lies.  Babylon, in fact, means “confusion”.  
    Ezek 13:6,7 
    The original “Gog” was an Israelite from the tribe of Reuben; a chief who ruled over his nation of Magog by employing a skilled army from the “north”.  1 Chron 5:4 
    Take a moment and read the etymology of the name, “Gog”.
    Jones' Dictionary of Old Testament Proper Names:
    “The masculine noun גג (gag) means ROOF OR TOP, or (as HAW Theological Wordbook of the Old Testament puts it) THE HIGHEST POINT OF AN EDIFICE. Its root is unknown and it has no sibling derivations.
    The noun גג (gag) denotes most commonly the flat roof of a building on which things can take place; USUALLY TO DO WITH IDOLATROUS WORSHIP (Judges 16:27, Joshua 2:6, 2 Samuel 11:2, 2 Kings 23:12, Jeremiah 19:13 and 32:29, Zephaniah 1:5; but also Acts 10:9). Roofs were also used to PUBLISH MESSAGES, news or expressions of grief into the neighborhood (Isaiah 15:3, Matthew 10:27, Luke 12:3), and possibly as a PLACE OF REFUGE (Joshua 2:6, Isaiah 22:1, Matthew 24:17) or lodging (1 Samuel 9:25-26, 2 Samuel 16:22).
    The housetop seems to indicate a CERTAIN SPIRITUAL EXPOSURE. Someone on the housetop opens himself for something, preferable something SOOTHING, or higher. Note that the ominous names Gog and Magog are derived from this root.”
     “Possibly, the rooftop is semi-synonymous to a place of worship, ESPECIALLY PAGAN WORSHIP, and Magog denotes that same inclination.”
    JWs, what is your roof, your covering, your perceived spiritual high place? Is it not what your adulterous GB leaders and organization call, EARTHLY MOUNT ZION – a title deceitfully given to an earthly organization that applies only to God’s anointed TEMPLE priesthood, “the beloved city”? Ps 132:7-9,13,14;Eph 2:20-22; 1 Pet 2:5,9; 1 Cor 3:16; Rev 14:1; 21:2,3
    “Gog” and “Magog” apply to both the false prophet/harlot GB, -  fallen anointed ones of spiritual “Israel” -  and to Satan and his “sea”, the organization, who spearheaded this deception.  Rev 13:1; 20:8; 16:13-16  The “northern army” that Ezekiel describes as coming against “Israel” is already upon them; it is the elder body and the pulsing heart of the organization.  God’s Temple priesthood has been replaced by a “Gentile” false priesthood that demands obedience from all. It is the abomination standing in the sanctuary/holy place/Temple, “trampling” God’s Temple by “setting itself up” over God’s priesthood.    Joel 2:2,20,25; Rev 9:3-11; 2 Thess 2:3,4; Matt 24:15; Rev 11:2 
  17. Haha
    Witness reacted to James Thomas Rook Jr. in ALL aspects of 1914 doctrine are now problematic from a Scriptural point of view   
    Meanwhile all this discussion is going on, poor Caleb is being held
    Prisoner in the confiscated Russian Bethel Branch Office by Russkies !!

  18. Upvote
    Witness reacted to JW Insider in Governing Body: Does it show loyalty or disloyalty to question the GB?   
    Then why did the Watchtower ever change anything if everything was directly from scripture? Obviously you are saying that this might not have been true last year, because some things have already changed since then, but it must be true this year. But if it's true this year, then you are claiming that any changes made for next year are no longer directly from Scripture, unless of course you are arguing that the Scriptures contradict themselves. You are using cult-speak even though the Watchtower is not a cult.
    Obviously we need to question ourselves first, but to answer your first question, it's our Christian obligation to question the anointed ones. You've seen a dozen scriptures to this effect, and you evidently do not believe in them. By whose power and authority do you decide it's OK to go against the Bible, and not to question the anointed ones?
    (1 John 4:1) . . .Beloved ones, do not believe every inspired statement, but test the inspired statements to see whether they originate with God, . . .
    (Philippians 1:8-10) . . .. 9 And this is what I continue praying, that your love may abound still more and more with accurate knowledge and full discernment; 10 that you may make sure of the more important things,. . .
    (1 Thessalonians 5:21) 21 Make sure of all things; hold fast to what is fine.
    (2 Corinthians 13:5) 5 Keep testing whether you are in the faith; keep proving what you yourselves are.. . .
    (1 Corinthians 11:19) 19 For there will certainly also be sects among you, so that those of you who are approved may also become evident.
    (Romans 12:2) . . .be transformed by making your mind over, so that you may prove to yourselves the good and acceptable and perfect will of God.
    (2 Corinthians 10:4, 5) 4 For the weapons of our warfare are not fleshly, but powerful by God for overturning strongly entrenched things. 5 For we are overturning reasonings . . .
    (Philippians 4:5) 5 Let your reasonableness become known to all men.. . .
    (James 1:6) 6 But let him keep asking in faith, not doubting at all, for the one who doubts is like a wave of the sea driven by the wind and blown about.
     
  19. Confused
    Witness got a reaction from Gnosis Pithos in ALL aspects of 1914 doctrine are now problematic from a Scriptural point of view   
    I don’t think you realize what Phil 4:8 is telling you.  What is of serious concern, righteous, chaste, lovable, well-spoken of, virtuous and praise-worthy  to God, appears to be off the table; that being,  God’s justice and righteousness.  ? 
     
    That this is a rebellious people,
    Lying children,
    Children who will not hear the law of the Lord;
     Who say to the seers, “Do not see,”
    And to the prophets, “Do not prophesy to us right things;
    Speak to us smooth things, prophesy deceits.
    1 Get out of the way,
    Turn aside from the path,
    Cause the Holy One of Israel
    To cease from before us.”  Isa 30:9,10
     
  20. Thanks
    Witness got a reaction from Queen Esther in Theocratic Pins   
    Dare we wear a pin that says, Jesus is the Way, the Truth, and the Life?  It's pretty simple, isn't it?   The apostles were in a "congregation" (not an organization), and clearly, their pledge - their dedication -  was to Christ and the Father.  
    Peter said,  "Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to mankind (by YHWH) by which we must be saved.”  Acts 4:12
     
     
  21. Like
    Witness got a reaction from The Librarian in The 'Anointed'   
    "Modestly, anointed ones acknowledge that they do not necessarily have more holy spirit than those with an earthly hope."

    No one is superior as all become children of God in God’s Kingdom.  Yet, those chosen as priests and kings to serve in God’s Temple have a specific job to do. True faithful anointed ones are blessed with the outpouring of Holy Spirit to teach truth; if and only if, they remain part of the vine, one with Christ and one in the Body of Christ.  Their sole purpose is to serve God and Christ in righteousness and administer to the people the true fruit of the vine, true knowledge that Holy Spirit gives them.

    You shall anoint them, as you anointed their father, that they may minister to Me as priests; for their anointing shall surely be an everlasting priesthood throughout their generations.”  Exod 40:15

    But let no one come into the house of the Lord except the priests and those of the Levites who serve. They may go in, for they are holy; but all the people shall keep the watch of the Lord. 2 Chron 23:6

    “For the lips of a priest should keep knowledge, And people should seek the law from his mouth; For he is the messenger of the Lord of hosts.  Mal 2:7

    If proven faithful, Chosen ones are blessed with knowledge to impart to the people; again, if they remain in union with their Head, Jesus Christ.

    They do not claim to have special knowledge or revelations; neither do they try to prove that they are in some way superior.

     Any honor shown is according to the justice of God, given to those who were without honor in man’s eyes, in order that there should be no superiority, imbalance, or division within the Body. 1 Cor 12:24-26; Matt 20:26,27; 1 Cor 4:7; Rom 12:3,6; 1 Pet 4:10; Matt 20:16; 23:12 
    If God chooses the most despised to be shown an equalizing amount of mercy, of what concern is that to anyone? 1 Cor 1:26-30; Matt 20:13-15  All anointed are undeserving worthless slaves, who perform their assigned place within the Body of Christ, and not out of superiority. Rom 4:4; Luke 17:10; 1 Cor 4:7; Luke 12:48
    There are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit. There are differences of ministries, but the same Lord.  And there are diversities of activities, but it is the same God who works all in all. But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to each one for the profit of all:  for to one is given the word of wisdom through the Spirit, to another the word of knowledge through the same Spirit,  to another faith by the same Spirit, to another gifts of healings by the same Spirit, to another the working of miracles, to another prophecy, to another discerning of spirits, to another different kinds of tongues, to another the interpretation of tongues.  But one and the same Spirit works all these things, distributing to each one individually as He wills. 1 Cor 12:4-11

    But you are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, His own special people, that you may proclaim the praises of Him who called you out of darkness into His marvelous light 1 Pet 2:9

    These things we also speak, not in words which man’s wisdom teaches but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual. 1 Cor 2:13

    But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and you know all things.  1 John 2:20

    But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you.  John 14:26

     For the administration of this service not only supplies the needs of the saints, but also is abounding through many thanksgivings to God,  while, through the proof of this ministry, they glorify God for the obedience of your confession to the gospel of Christ, and for your liberal sharing with them and all men, and by their prayer for you, who long for you because of the exceeding grace of God in you. Thanks be to God for His indescribable gift!  2 Cor 9:12-15

    “For the lips of a priest should keep knowledge, And people should seek the law from his mouth; For he is the messenger of the Lord of hosts.”  Mal 2:7

    It is a requirement that all anointed minister to the people in the knowledge they receive from the outpouring of their anointing.  If they remain anonymous, ambiguous, concealed, mysterious, unknown; their true calling to serve God and Christ goes unheeded.

    "In no way, then, would they use their anointing as a “calling card” to introduce themselves to others. For the most part, they would not even mention this personal experience to others, so as to avoid drawing attention to themselves; neither would they want to boast about their future reward."

    Of course not.  Anyone with humility would not boast in such a way. And yet, these Chosen ones are not only Temple priests, but ARE symbolically, the spiritual Temple:

    Or do you not know that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and you are not your own?  For you were bought at a price; therefore glorify God in your body and in your spirit, which are God’s. 1 Cor 6:19,20

     Now, therefore, you are no longer strangers and foreigners, but fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God, having been built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ Himself being the chief cornerstone,  in whom the whole building, being fitted together, grows into a holy temple in the Lord,  in whom you also are being built together for a dwelling place of God in the Spirit.  Eph 2:19,22

     “He who receives you receives Me, and he who receives Me receives Him who sent Me.  Matt 10:40

     How can one receive such anointed ones if they are to remain silent?  As Mal 2:7 brings out, the people must seek knowledge from the lips of such faithful ones.  

     And whoever gives one of these little ones only a cup of cold water in the name of a disciple, assuredly, I say to you, he shall by no means lose his reward.”  Matt 10:42

     “Then they also will answer Him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and did not minister to You?’ Then He will answer them, saying, ‘Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to Me.’  And these will go away into everlasting punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”  Matt 25:44-46
     
    Jesus’ anointing:

    “The Spirit of the Lord is upon Me, Because He has anointed Me To preach the gospel to the poor; He has sent Me to heal the brokenhearted, To proclaim liberty to the captives And recovery of sight to the blind, To set at liberty those who are oppressed  Luke 4:18

    Faithful anointed ones follow in Christ’s footsteps as one in Christ:

    Now He who establishes us with you in Christ and has anointed us is God, who also has sealed us and given us the Spirit in our hearts as a guarantee. 2 Cor 1:21,22
    Chosen ones also must proclaim liberty to the captives and the oppressed as ambassadors of Christ.
     "Now then, we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God were pleading through us: we implore you on Christ's behalf, be reconciled to God"  2 Cor 5:20
    This can only be accomplished when the Body is one in Christ.
    “I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, bears much fruit; for without Me you can do nothing.  John 15:5

     And all Mine are Yours, and Yours are Mine, and I am glorified in them. John 17:10

    Can Jesus be glorified through his faithful anointed ones if they remain undisclosed?

    Because of the suggested state of the anointed ones to remain camouflaged among all the people; God’s Temple lies in ruins.  It appears it was not the case when the early apostles began building this Temple in Christ.  They were well known among all believers:

    To the church of God which is at Corinth, to those who are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all who in every place call on the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both theirs and ours 1 Cor 1:2

    We should ask, why is it different today?  Could this be considered a defilement of God’s Temple?

     Do you not know that you are the temple of God and that the Spirit of God dwells in you?  If anyone defiles the temple of God, God will destroy him. For the temple of God is holy, which temple you are.  1 Cor 3:16,17

    We realize that in the end times this Temple MUST be restored.  What are God’s people waiting for?

     “Thus speaks the Lord of hosts, saying: ‘This people says, “The time has not come, the time that the Lord’s house should be built.”’”

    3 Then the word of the Lord came by Haggai the prophet, saying, 4 “Is it time for you yourselves to dwell in your paneled houses, and this temple to lie in ruins?” 5 Now therefore, thus says the Lord of hosts: “Consider your ways!

    6 “You have sown much, and bring in little;
    You eat, but do not have enough;
    You drink, but you are not filled with drink;
    You clothe yourselves, but no one is warm;
    And he who earns wages,
    Earns wages to put into a bag with holes.”  Haggai 1:2-6

    Is it man’s call to decide when the anointed ones come together under their Master, Christ? Is it man’s decision to keep Christ’s brothers silent when it is their duty to glorify their Master and God through teaching truth, that each individual anointed one should know?   It appears to me that the Chosen ones should prayerfully consider their circumstances and listen to Christ’s teachings to come together as a complete Body for the benefit of all.

    Thus says the Lord of hosts: “Consider your ways! Go up to the mountains and bring wood and build the temple, that I may take pleasure in it and be glorified,” says the Lord. “You looked for much, but indeed it came to little; and when you brought it home, I blew it away. Why?” says the Lord of hosts. “Because of My house that is in ruins, while every one of you runs to his own house.  Haggai 1:7-9

     ‘Who is left among you who saw this temple in its former glory? And how do you see it now? In comparison with it, is this not in your eyes as nothing?   Haggai 2:3



     

     

     

     
  22. Upvote
    Witness got a reaction from OtherSheep in 7/17 Wt. “Seeking Riches That Are True”   
    Not unrighteous in the least?  The organization mingles with other secular commercial mega corporations but tells the sheep to guard themselves in commercial endeavors? 
    From JWfacts.com –
    “Though condemning the world's commercial system as part of Satan's system, the Watchtower Society has not held back from utilising it to the fullest, in the process becoming a multi-billion dollar organization. In 2010, the valuation of Watchtower real-estate in Brooklyn alone exceeded a billion dollars. By claiming religious or charity status, the billions earned over the last century have been largely tax free.
    The Watchtower Society has used stocks, bonds and trusts as investment vehicles. One such trust was the H M Riley Trust, from the deceased estate of Henrietta Riley.
    This trust trades in a wide spread of bonds and shares in companies such as Exxon Mobil, Coca Cola, Proctor & Gamble, Phillip Morris (one of the world's largest cigarette manufacturers) and Cardinal Health (who supply medical equipment including for blood transfusions.)
    In 2007, Watchtower had an SEC filing for a $40 million dollar hedge fund through K2 STB Fund Ltd, located in the Cayman Islands. For a full description see watchtowerlies.org.
    Shares have also been held in Rand, a supplier to the U.S. Department of Defence, as shown at this SEC filing as of 20th Feb 2015.”
    Does the title “Jehovah’s organization” confirm it is “no part of the world”, when indeed it is thick in the middle of it, participating in the same activity as any large commercial entity?
    And He said to those who sold doves, “Take these things away! Do not make My Father’s house a house of merchandise!”  John 2:16  (Greek meaning for merchandise - a place were trade is carried on, esp. a seaport, a mart, an emporium)
    Did the early apostles build a “market” that relies on money?
    “For we are not like the many who market God’s message for profit. On the contrary, we speak with sincerity in Christ, as from God and before God.”  2 Cor 2:17
    That was their only focus, taught to them by Jesus.  It was the doctrine “which accords to godliness”, not “useless wranglings of men of corrupt minds and destitute of the truth, who suppose that godliness is a means of gain. (investments) From such withdraw yourself.”  1 Tim 6:5
    The organization has created not only a literal commerce of trade, but a spiritual one, where any “buying and selling” must be done through the GB’s final words enforced by the elder body.  Luke 6:24-26; James 5:1
    In Matt 25:24-27, the slave of Christ (anointed ones) is too afraid to speak up against the “banker” (GB), to use the talent received from Christ (which is truth), in the banker’s “marketplace”.  1 John 2:20,27; 1 Cor 4:1; Matt 25:14,15; Rev 3:18.  Upon his return, Jesus tells the fearful slave, “you should have put my money on deposit with the bankers, so that when I returned I would have received it back with interest." Acts 1:2,8,9; Matt 28:19,20  The slave could have put aside his fear and given his “talent” (knowledge of truth) to the bankers in control of the spiritual commerce – the GB.  Zech 8:16; Eph 4:25   Instead, the slave kept the talent/truth buried “in the ground” – in his own heart.  Fear, accomplished by the threat of disfellowshiping.
    “Stop making my house a house of merchandise”.  God’s “house” is the heart of each anointed one – his Temple. John 14:23; Eph 2:21; John 2:19-21; 2 Cor 3:3    The GB, the other anointed and all in the org have filled their heart with earthly treasures that must be nourished, pursued, attended to, leaving the deposit of spiritual truth to wither. Matt 6:19-21
    2 Cor 6:16 - And what agreement has the temple of God with idols? For youare the temple of the living God. As God has said:
    “I will dwell in them
    And walk among them.
    I will be their God,
    And they shall be My people.”
    “agreement” – “a putting together or joint deposit”  The Watchtower “idol” is the earthly, even spiritual treasure that takes precedence over the Holy Spirit and truth in an anointed one’s heart.  All JWs have done the same.
      “Therefore speak to them, and say to them, ‘Thus says the Lord God: “Everyone of the house of Israel who sets up his idols in his heart, and puts before him what causes him to stumble into iniquity, and then comes to the prophet, I the Lord will answer him who comes, according to the multitude of his idols, that I may seize the house of Israel by their heart, because they are all estranged from Me by their idols.”’   Ezek 14:4,5
     
     
     

  23. Upvote
    Witness got a reaction from OtherSheep in Why don't Jehovah's Witnesses celebrate Easter?   
    I appreciate not being guided by any other method than that of scriptural reasoning:
    "I have realized, that the geographical location of Jerusalem, no longer holds any significance to God. The previous Temple in Jerusalem did reap the very consequences foretold by Christ (Mark 13:1-2; Matt.23:37-38). God's dwelling is no longer there.
    He now abides within the hearts of His Temple stones (1Cor.6:19; 3:16; 1Pet.2:5,9; Eph.2:21-22). God's Temple is now located, in the members of NEW Jerusalem (Rev.21:9,2; Eph.5:23; Rev.21:22). 

    God knew from the beginning, that his Chosen Ones would come to reside all around the globe (Acts 1:8; Mark 13:27; Rev.5:9-10; 7:9). 
    Why then, I asked in prayer, would the city responsible for the death of God's Son (Acts 7:52; John 8:40; Mark 10:33) whom Jesus declared as "abandoned" by God (Matt.23:38), be the basis for any worship which the faithful perform, today? (Eph.5:10-11; 2Cor.6:17; Job 14:4)

    My resulting decision then, is that each person should partake on the equivalent of Nisan 13, in their own locale. I expect that this will be during the same 24 hour period around the globe, after each person's sunset.

    The way in which Nisan is calculated, is to find out when the Spring Equinox occurs. 
    Then go to the schedule of the new moon for each month in your area, 
    and find the new moon that occurred BEFORE the Spring Equinox.
    That new moon, is the start of the last month of the Jewish calendar that Jesus followed. 
    Then find the next new moon. That is the first day of the first month of the new year (Nisan). If the new moon occurs at an hour, after the partakers sun has already set, then that 24 hour period (sunset to sunset) is still the last day of the last month. The fresh day, would start the following sunset.
    Next, is to count 13 days from the starting evening of Nisan 1.
    For my location, that brings the start of Nisan 13, to after sunset, on April 9th.
    This is when I intend to partake. It is up to each individual, to decide what they will choose to do.

    For those who may be wondering why I plan to observe the Memorial on Nisan 13 instead of 14;
    it is because Jesus did not institute the Memorial of his death, nor die, on Nisan 14.
    He did so, the day before, on the "Day of Preparation", the first day of unfermented cakes. Pearl Doxsey
    From this point we can calculate when Christ was resurrected and "celebrate" it purely through scripture. 
     
  24. Upvote
    Witness got a reaction from Queen Esther in Jehovah’s Witnesses former members tell court they were subjected to ‘total control’   
    I am respecting admin's wishes.
  25. Upvote
    Witness reacted to Micah Ong in "Let Your NAME Be Sanctified"   
    @Witness wow beautiful scripture, what "good news of peace" that is!
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