TrueTomHarley

On 12/17/2017 at 10:14 AM, Matthew9969 said:

Talk about silly rules:

There are no rules of any sort.

Except for a family head who is authorized to set rules for his family. And since Bethel is a 'family' - many persons living in voluntary close quarters for a specific reason - there are quite a few rules there. But they do not carry over into the general congregation (though there are always some who would have it otherwise).

There is counsel and peer pressure. It will be (relevant to this thread) based on the concept many have noticed that men and women are attracted to each other, yet cannot enjoy the intimate closeness of sex relations unless married so it is best not to allow themselves to get all pumped up. The counsel varies from place to place and culture will have something to do with it.

If you enjoy privileges in the congregation - servant, pioneer - you will find that you are expected to be an example and you can lose privileges by flying in the face of such counsel as to what is locally acceptable or has been published. Otherwise, no.

Jehovah's people are not belligerent or headstrong and are not inclined to blow off counsel as nothing. Elders are not control freaks or micro-managers, though some are - in about the same proportion as the general population, I would guess. Efforts are made through training so as to get those ones to be less that way.

There is such a thing as 'brazen conduct' - it used to be translated 'loose conduct.' It has the air of contempt & outrageous disregard of customary standards & an in-your-face attitude. That can get a person in trouble. Since it is more vague than outright immorality, it will not always be applied consistently. But always it is associated with persistent defiance of accepted conduct - just look up the word 'brazen' to get a sense for it.

But it is never a matter of petty rules enforced by people who just like to meddle. Anyone like that jeopardizes his reputation as a reasonable person - one of the criteria for serving as an older man.

It's Bolivia.

13 hours ago, The Librarian said:

You may want to break this up into 7 individual questions 

Who are the world's seven greatest librarians? What qualities make them such? A thread for each one, if you please.

On Facebook, one of my countless friends said: "Hussein's rebuilt Babylon was smashed to bits in the first gulf war. A Syrian brother told me the local Iranian word on the street was basically "Why did they bomb Disneyland?"

Homeschooling the kids, we used to color in on a world map each year the various countries - with colors corresponding to penetration of the good news, as in 'publisher to general population' ratio. It was a fine way to teach both theocracy and geography

We used the rainbow. Red was the greatest concentration. Violet was stone cold. Alas, today it might all be misconstrued as the advancement of gay rights.

What do you do when you spy the woman of wickedness trying to climb out of the ephah jar? (Zech 5:7)

You grab the brazen hussy by the scruff the neck and boot her back down into the jar from where she came. (taking care in these volatile times that you do not get accused of harassment) Then you summon the two with wings to ship her back to Babylon.

Maybe it was a reminder to the Jews who had just come from there to check their own ephah jars - or even their shoes, lest they had tracked something in. 

Incidentally, present at our meeting was an Iraqi man who has responded to the Arabic group. The actual  Babylon means something to him, unlike to anyone else. He says it is the site of a festival each year, with music and food. Also that there is the slogan everyone knows: 'Babylon will rise again.'

?

5 hours ago, Matthew9969 said:

Is there a watchtower video that warns children to be weary of possible pedophile men in the congregation their parents force them to attend?

Why would you want them weary over something so serious as that?

I’m gettin’ up in the morning—I believe I’ll dust my broom
Keeping away from the women
I’m givin’ ’em lots of room - Bob Dylan

33 minutes ago, Israeli Bar Avaddhon said:

If it happens that the king of the north is able to "succeed" then maybe someone will ask himself some questions? will you question your absolute certainties?

Nobody even knew that it was still the king of the north after glasnost. I think there was a published comment once that the identities of those kings was then unclear. The terms have not been used for some time.

33 minutes ago, Israeli Bar Avaddhon said:

However, all this will not happen because it is unthinkable to call into question an understanding of the "faithful and discreet slave"!

No, I don't think it is. What is unthinkable (except by those who do it) is to rebel against them. Everyone knows they are people and can make mistakes. But Jehovah's people also exercise faith, which has been borne out from the oldest times, that God works through humans and does not take kindly to ones that trash them.

On 5/8/2017 at 7:14 PM, Jay Witness said:

purchased the plot of land between New Paltz and the mountains from Watchtower Society of New York, a Jehovah’s Witnesses group, for $2.1 million. The westernmost part of the trail will be inland owned by Mohonk Preserve.

Shortly after construction of the Henrietta Assembly Hall, Kodak purchased adjacent land. The brothers were delighted. It probably meant the land would be rural forever. There was already a high-tech Kodak facility nearby and there apparently just wanted bigger buffers. (there was a rumor that they also wanted to buy the Hall itself)

We all know what happened to the K. The land was resold long ago and there is now a housing tract abutting the Assembly Hall.

On 12/4/2017 at 10:30 AM, tromboneck said:

"Presiding Overseer" was dropped,

It translates into 'El Presidente' in some languages. Hence there is COBE.

It caused me trouble. I do nothing but raz our COBE, and he me,  and we are on good terms. When a new Bethel bigwig came to visit and was staying with our COBE, I said to him at our first meeting: "Are you the hotshot from Bethel who comes down to straighten out our no-good COBE?" Only I didn't say COBE. Inadvertently, I said CO. He got a shocked look on his face and wilted away.

When I realized my mistake I called the COBE by phone and said he had to bail me out. He did - but he said I owed him one or two (or three).

4 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

To put it the context of your nonsensical reply ... What specifically did Jesus do to try and deceive Pilate?

He specifically tried to sell him a  deed to a summer cottage he did not even own of the Sea of Galilee without telling him violent waves kicked up by frequent storms making seafront property worthless for that body of water - AND that it was polluted with the carcasses of 1000 pigs that had leapt off from the precipice above!!

You call yourself a Bible student?

It makes as much sense at hiding an elephant under a bath towel for the Russians to discover the ruse.

OH NO! Allen shaved off his magnificent stache!   

the same way that the brothers owned a branch complex and the russians were not fooled.

18 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

REALITY is that they were trying to hide an elephant under a bath towel, and the Russians were not fooled.

Jesus tried to pull a fast one on Pilate and he was not fooled either.

14 hours ago, Noble Berean said:

The Hebrews had unquestionable, miraculous evidence that supported Moses' divine backing.

I will not blow off as nothing the theocratic accomplishments I see playing out today. Perhaps I should wait for oceans to part so GB members can walk to wherever they are going, but I will settle for what I see now.

It is not nothing that a people are gathered internationally who are entirely undivided by nationalism, by racism, by social or educational class. It happens nowhere else on any scale. I will not take it for granted and not give credit where it is due.

I will not blow off as nothing that there is one and only one organization that will put a modern Bible without charge into the hands of whoever desires it anywhere. They have to completely circumvent the world's profit-driven distribution channel to do it, inventing their own channel. And in 900 languages, no less. Given time, the Bible translation will approach that figure - you know it will. It is already massive. 

The smooth functioning and meshing of diverse peoples to attain a common and undiluted spiritual goal - there has been no greater worldwide example of 'you received free, so give free.' It doesn't just happen. Somehow God has enabled humans to accomplish it.

Human things are not perfect? Timing has been off? That should be a shocker? Jesus said: "Keep on the watch, but don't overdo it?" I don't think so.

There is fierce opposition today? As though, with a capable leadership, Jesus words would be wrong and the world would love Christians? As though the worse 'wicked thing they would lyingly say' about Jesus' followers is "They woke me up Saturday morning when I was sleeping?" No.

IF Srecko hehehe :))))))) headed up something with anything to show for itself, minus the missteps, I would investigate it closely. The same with our house annointed person. But there is nothing but crying, muttering and bellyaching from all of them - at least they have pointed to nothing of significance. All they can do is cry that the doers are doing it wrong. Until humans are perfect, who can't do that?

Regarding authorization by miracles, Paul said such gifts would pass away. What if he had said it on this forum? What responses would he get? "Well - okay, BE that way if you are going to be. But don't expect anything from us! We're not budging unless we see plenty of razzle-dazzle!"

What we do see ought to be enough.

On 12/6/2017 at 4:48 AM, Cos said:

Can I just say that Jesus, the Son, is not the Father! I looked up the beliefs of the United Church of Christ head office at http://www.ucc.org, and they nowhere claim to believe that “the son is the father”. I don’t know where you got this Oneness idea from.

Well, she might have gotten it from the signs one routinely sees everywhere: "Jesus is God!"

On 10/25/2017 at 12:36 AM, Nana Fofana said:

I don't know why they say that, unless you/they mean by "Christ's Deity", that "Jesus IZZ God!", which as far as I'm concerned, arose about 15 years ago, completely out of the blue, & makes no sense , and is bizarre.  My husband pays no attention to faith matters now, but like me, grew up attending 'nice' protestant churches,

I will not forget my first Bible student in the late 1970's - my grandmother who had always attended 'nice' baptist churches. She was much troubled that I was in a religion that didn't believe in the Trinity. I reviewed the doctrine and she said that she had never believed that - all she had meant was that there was a Father and a Son and a holy spirit. She had never imagined that they were the same.

6 hours ago, Noble Berean said:

I don't think we are in disagreement that the murmuring and revolting of the Hebrews was ridiculous

Many times during the 40 year period of wandering, the Jews then were called a stiff-necked and rebellious people. What were they stiff-necked and rebellious about in your opinion? Do you think there is anyone who corresponds to them today? If so, who? If not, why not? What lessons has everyone learned?

7 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

FOR YOU ... it's all a Play, and you are but actors following a script for their entertainment.

It is a play for everyone. Christians "are a theatrical spectacle to the world," of which "the scene of the world is changing." The sooner that is realized, the better off everyone is. It is not the present life that Paul describes as the real life.

2 hours ago, Noble Berean said:

I don't even think you really believe what you're saying.

Alright. YOU account for them wanting to return to Egypt, where they'd experienced nothing but misery,  just a month after crossing the Red sea - and being ready to stone whoever would stand in their way!

Give me an explanation for THAT! Let me see if I think you actually believe what you are saying.

I don't back down a word. If people want to bitch, they will bitch.

It is possible you are right. But there was a time not too distant ago that Russia wanted to take a respected place among the world community of nations.

16 hours ago, Anna said:

16 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

intrigues me is just so much mental cabbage

Now you've piqued my curiosity

It is never on anything doctrinal or about timing of the end. When it comes, it comes. The present explanation I am always ready to acknowledge as the present explanation. Sometimes it stands the test of time. Sometimes it doesn't. It all will come out in the wash. I don't care too much. It is enough that Christianity offers a rewarding way to live.

The things that strike me are my own scriptural  'gems' that I can put to good use in working on my personality. Or in reflecting upon how God has dealt with me. Or how he hopefully will. Or how Hebrews 4:12 is seen to divide soul and spirit in so many ways. Or - well, you get the idea. 

Many Witnesses do this. Though, there are many who simply give 'the answer' from the paragraph. That's fine and an important part of picking up 'the pattern' the truth. In time, people find depth in many verses, even if they have not been formally commented upon, and they zoom in there.

But it is never doctrine that gets me going. The essential doctrines of Jehovah's Witnesses have been in place for over 100 years and the things that come up today for at-times intense examination are essentially but footnotes.