the Sower of Seed

As I read Daniel 11 & 12 describing events that that will occur in the final days I am reminded that ONLY Jehovah opens the mind to understand.

As a man I see the angel speaking to Daniel, then Jehovah sends 2 more angels, 1 has the task of asking "When"

The main speaker replies 3-1/2 times or 42 months from the Mark of Time "the removal Constant Feature"

Daniel states he does not understand

The angel rephrases and  We add the previous statement

42 months from "the removal Constant Feature" "bashing of Holy Ones"

1290 days from "the removal Constant Feature" the glorious days of the "Disgusting Thing"

1335 days from "the removal Constant Feature" God's people experience the Happiness 

Jesus could not know then because "the removal Constant Feature" had not occurred

It has occurred now

On 5/7/2021 at 3:52 AM, BroRando said:

 

Would you like to be a Survivor of the Last Days? 

 

"But know this, that in the last days critical times hard to deal with will be here." (2 Tim 3: 1) The Last Days (pangs of distress) do not last for an exhaustive period of time but do have an ending to them. It's an allotment period of time of 120 years, like the Days of Noah. This allotment is a Conclusion of a System of things .

As Christ Millennial approaches, we will soon bring an end to our Preaching Work to those associated with (2 Tim 3: 1-5) the end of an Age has come. It's not the end of the world but rather the End of an age of Wickedness.

Read more ...

Jesus knew this pronouncement of Jehovah, Jesus knew when the Gentile Times would end, these being true, Jesus would have known when the Great Day was to be.

Rather the pronouncement would apply to the average lifespan after the flood. 

11 hours ago, JW Insider said:

Then you appear to disagree with the Watchtower publications on this point, where the 1,335 days end in the "happy" year: 1926.

*** w51 7/15 pp. 437-438 par. 16 The 1,290 and 1,335 Days of Daniel’s Prophecy ***
blessed is the one who comes to the 1,335 days. So reckoning this period on from the termination of the 1,290 days would mean from September, 1922, to May, 1926,—three years, eight and one-half months—at which time a large international convention of Jehovah’s people was in session at London, England. It was a season most blessed,

And from 1977:

*** go chap. 8 pp. 146-147 par. 57 Marked Days During the “Time of the End” ***
Truly the year 1926 deserved to be marked as the happy climax of the close of the 1,335 days. Those of Daniel’s “people” who kept in expectation and reached the end of the 1,335 days were launched off into a happiness that has not diminished,

And even more recently:

*** w00 5/15 p. 14 par. 28 Pay Attention to God’s Prophetic Word for Our Day ***
The 2,300 days of Daniel chapter 8 as well as the 1,290 and the 1,335 days of chapter 12 are all past—behind us in the stream of time.

 

Of course, the "evidence on the ground" was quite different. The Yearbook (below) describes this period as one of the unhappiest times in WT history. The brothers and sisters were still reeling from the heartbreaking stumbling of so many brothers due to the failure of the 1925 prophecies from the "Millions" campaign and the failed predictions from the book The Harp of God, and the continuing departure of followers under Rutherford's direction. There were the additional failures of the expectations promoted in the book Comfort for the Jews, which had just come out in 1925 (rescinded in 1930/31), etc. 1926 also saw the beginning of heated arguments with Rutherford over why he still called for campaigns to sell Russell's "Studies in the Scriptures" to the public (from 1926-1931) even though Rutherford had begun to reject the majority of the content of those books.

*** yb75 p. 146 Part 2—United States of America ***
A. D. Schroeder states: “It was thought that then the remnant of Christ’s anointed followers would go to heaven to be part of the Kingdom and that the faithful men of old, such as Abraham, David and others, would be resurrected as princes to take over the government of the earth as part of God’s kingdom.”
The year 1925 came and went. Jesus’ anointed followers were still on earth as a class. The faithful men of old times—Abraham, David and others—had not been resurrected to become princes in the earth. (Ps. 45:16) So, as Anna MacDonald recalls: “1925 was a sad year for many brothers. Some of them were stumbled; their hopes were dashed.

Prophecy is best understood after it is fulfilled: Daniel 11:44-12:13

I can agree that it had a previous alignment with occurrences, yet I see Jehovah embracing Daniel at the end of his life of integrity. He shows him how Jesus will Stand Up as Earth's new King, then the resurrection that Daniel will experience. He may show him the lot he will be allotted and what it will become. Jehovah sends an angel to ask "When?", another angel answers 3-1/2 appointed times. Daniel states "I do not understand", then it is spelled out for Daniel how this system will end,and when. The King of the North will go forth in a rage, the Last King / UN rules for an "hour" after 1290 days and the first day of Happiness 45 days later or maybe I am misunderstanding what I see, the next 2 appointed times will tell.

2 hours ago, Patiently waiting for Truth said:

But unfortunately your Leaders do not act as slaves of God through Christ. You know this to be true.

The Child Sexual Abuse. The lies told in courtrooms by the GB's Lawyers. The false prophecies from your Leaders past and present.  You GB pretending to be the F&DS.  Your GB exalting themselves above the Anointed, and then telling the Anointed not to meet together, not to pray together and not to study God's word together. 

And your GB put in writing in the Watchtower magazine, that if the Anointed were to meet together to do those things, then your GB say the Anointed would be working against the Holy Spirit. 

And the Leaders of your organisation have brainwashed all JW into believing that 'only JWs will be saved' and that 'only JWs can be Christians'.  

Your Leaders and many of the Elders are causses for stumbling, that does not being praise to Almighty God.  

Look at the pictures they have put on the front of Watchtower magazines over the years, to frighten people into the Org. 

And JWs do not preach. JWs distribute the words of your GB. Standing at a cart / trolly handing out thingswritten by your GB, is NOT preaching God;s words, it is handing out the words of men. 

JWs have long been instructed NOT to give their own opinion on anything, but to always refer to 'the literature'. And when a 'Bible study' takes place, it is not from the Bible, it is from a GB written book. 

I was a JW for many years, I know the proceedure. I am no longer a JW because I left the Org, yes I left the Org, I was not d/fed. I left because of the way Victims of CSA are mistreated. They are treated as collateral damage. Your GB does not care about them and your Elders have no conscience. 

Most JWs have no idea what is going on behind the scenes of the Org. I keep refering to something Jesus said about 'first cleaning the inside of the bowl or dish, so that the whole thing would become clean'. But your Leaders only whitewash the outside of the JW Org to pretend it is clean. 

Yes, Jesus is coming with the Angels, to judge us all. But He will judge in righteousness, whereas the Watchtower / JW Org / GB / Elders, do not do so. 

Every faithful witness is sorry for the reproach any member brings on Jehovah's Name. That being said you should forgive and move on. 

Jehovah does not bring it up every time a member sins, then asks for forgiveness. No the individuals are the ones that must repent and ask for forgiveness. If a person puts the sins of 1 member on the organization they become fighters against God, for He has given all authority to Jesus to be head of the greater congregation and discipline individuals.

Anyone that continues to attack because of a sin years ago that Jesus has handled, has USURPED the authority of the Christ.

I have Faith in Christ!

1 hour ago, Patiently waiting for Truth said:

Maybe you should re-read my comment above, about the JWs actions against God and Christ. 

The Jews were once God's chosen people, but they sinned against God and killed His Son, Jesus Christ. 

If ever the JW Org was God's chosen Org, then it has since sinned against God and 'killed' Christ anew. 

The JW Org is immoral and it's Leaders have innocent blood on their hands. 

Do you really think God and Christ will allow this ? 

The Jews were God's People as you just stated. God stated they were a people for HIS NAME. God stated He allowed Pharaoh to disobey for the purpose of making HIS NAME know through out the Earth. His Eternal Chosen Name is important to Him. Jesus is named after Him. Jesus was falsely labelled  a blasphemer by the Jews, this distressed him very much, that his death would bring reproach on Jehovah's Name. Jesus taught those who really are his disciples to go door to door, giving the people hope that Jehovah would make Jesus, the seed of David, king of the Earth, the Messiah.

Jehovah's Witnesses proudly do this preaching as slaves of Jehovah God. We obey Jesus as he is the appointed head of the sole religion doing his will today. JW.ORG magnifies Jehovah's Name in a modern way. Millions search the site for literature that scripturally references topics that we run into. Anyone can go there and see that every belief we have is based on the Bible, not on the erroneous human philosophies like the Trinity or Hellfire. You can go there and see we are not Haters of God, but Lovers of Truth based on the Bible, Imitators of Jesus Christ. We believe the Bible should be the Touchstone for proving any religious principle. 

The Bible states what is "immoral", having a website that magnifies the Name of God, proves by the scriptures that Jesus is coming as God's appointed King of His Kingdom to remove every human government, every hater of his Father and the Divine Name. There is no time for complacency, 2034 is years longer than any date in the Bible where God by an angel, states the Righteous will Shine, due to their Happiness and being the Only Ones inhabiting the Earth.

You may need to explore Daniel 12:10 for days because unless you are humble and listen to the Word speak you will by no means understand the Truth.

Jehovah's Witnesses are named in the Bible by God. They have systematically preached the Good News from door to door and translated and placed the Bible in more languages and nations than any other religion at their own expense. He has written His Laws upon their hearts. The Truth is Simple, Visible ONLY by His Drawing, I cannot alter or usurp that authority! Just as the Jews could not see who Jesus was, when he was standing there 3 feet away healing hands, ears, legs, eyes and lives! You will know a prophet was in your midst and you did not allow yourself to see or listen to him/Him, to bad, to bad.............

On 9/22/2021 at 1:41 PM, Arauna said:

I can tell, you quote the bible but have not read your bible in quite some years!  When I read Revelation, I see doom and gloom for those not offering up pure worship to Jehovah and SURVIVAL for those who do worship in Spirit and truth,,,,,  So the good news amplifies for those who want to be obedient servants and brings joy, which is a fruit of the Spirit of god.

I use the verse John 4:23,24 to show there are 2 standings in Jehovah's eyes: True Worshipers and False Worshipers.

There are some 10,000 False Religious Organizations who worship in some false form and 1 Organization that Jehovah has written His Principles on the figurative hearts because of their humbly seeking to please Him. They went out door to door instead of fishing Saturday morning week after week preaching the Good News through the inhabited Earth the angel in mid Heaven directed.

Now that work has stopped, similar to the priestly actions that were halted in the past, a mark in time occurred that day and the days are counted from then to the fulfillment of the prophesy it pertains to.

As for Jesus stating that no one knows, do you believe that will always be true? No, it would only be true if this all imagined and there is no God or Inspired Bible. Time and increased knowledge changes ones view, especially if you are one in the One.

There is a lot of manure spread from person to person here, it and all history of it will soon be forgotten by those the angels don't destroy as at Matthew 13:43. All manure will have one definition there, for the truth will be increasingly what all speak until every lie is forgotten. Imagine the eons before Satan lied, the first lie in all eternity of the past.

19 hours ago, Arauna said:

We are NOT pushing for a date an time.  If you cannot recognize what is going on in the world right now as the fig that is flowering then: woe to you!

Daniel was shown the King of the North, Christ's actions as he stands up and the resurrection he would benefit from and shown/told of his lot that he would possess upon that resurrection.

Daniel 12:5,6: Why would God send an angel to ask another angel "WHEN?" He wants those worshipping in spirit and truth to know! For the days to the U.N. and the "Day of Happiness are recorded there.

According to Daniel 12 this statement is true! What happens there? Daniel is lead along through the ages including today, through Christ removing every enemy and the human resurrection which Daniel was to experience. Verse 13 Daniel is assured a "lot", in fact he may have been shown it and what it will become.

Proof the End is Near: While the angel speaking to Daniel moves above the waters, Jehovah sends 2 more to document the answer to the question the angel asks verse 7 “How long will it be to the end of these marvelous things?" the answer 3-1/2 appointed times. Daniel says 8 "Now as for me, I heard, but I could not understand." So it is spelled out to him 10 Many will cleanse themselves and whiten themselves and will be refined. And the wicked ones will act wickedly, and none of the wicked will understand; but those having insight will understand.( ONLY THOSE REFINED IN GOD'S EYES WILL BE ALLOWED TO UNDERSTAND, NO OTHER CHURCH OR RELIGION WILL UNDERSTAND)

Jesus could not know at the time he was asked because he did not know the date the constant feature would stop. Jesus would also have been knowledgeable about the first fulfillment, yet what is the context? Jesus standing up and the resurrection, yes this applies to the first fulfillment. However in 12:1b it states "And during that time your people will escape, everyone who is found written down in the book." Can that be said of the first fulfillment? NO, Is there any documentation that Jehovah's Witnesses escaped the effects of WW1 or the Spanish Flu by God's hand? No, this is after Armageddon

Plus verse 2 speaks of a resurrection of those who are later judged unfaithful to God verse 2 "And many of those asleep in the dust of the earth will wake up, some to everlasting life and others to reproach and to everlasting contempt". This is not the first resurrection of 1914, for all those were granted immortality upon their resurrection as spirits who join Jesus awaiting Jehovah's command to Go!

So the angel sent to ask "WHEN" at God's direction, with a third angel as a witness that this is fact, The answering angel raised 2 hands to Heaven as swearing to these facts. There are 2 answers given, 2 United Nations, 2 fulfillments.

verse 11 “And from the time that the constant feature has been removed and the disgusting thing that causes desolation has been put in place, there will be 1,290 days" The United Nation will rule the Earth on and after this.

Verse 12 “Happy is the one who keeps in expectation and who arrives at the 1,335 days!" 

Why are these Happy? Because this is the first day on Jesus full rule of the Earth with the 144,000! 

The Only Question Left is " Will You Be Happy Then?

I have not read the book/s. 

My thoughts on the Flood: The Seed had already been foretold, then the some angels made the Earth their playground to experience the flesh and sensations never available to them before. Rather than see His loyal angels violently evict those who had fallen away, a new timeline, an altered reality would come to be, a flood, Jehovah would destroy so many lives that those with faith might live.

Where did the water come from, a water canopy? Mars has some, did it have more at one time?

What about all the fresh water needed for the animals and humans for a year? The food? Did Jehovah cause a deep sleep on all?

We may not have all the answers, however we have His Word and physical evidence that it did occur in the deep ocean trenches and the mountains that were force upwards by the pressure. The fossil record of shellfish in areas far from any water today. It is enough, we can put faith in every word He has given us.

6 hours ago, Witness said:

As I’ve said here before, if I had hate for JWs, I wouldn’t be here.  I would walk away from the whole lot of you.  If we care about someone, and we know that person has made a grave error that will affect their life, we would speak up, right?  I have “brothers and sisters” in the organization that I care for.  I know they need to hear Christ’s truths.  Rev 11:1-3

While you reproach the Almighty God and doubt is ability to guide and instruct a people because some individuals within them sin.

Here is your greatest opportunity: Name the organization foretold in the Bible that :

2 Chronicles 7:14 if my people on whom my name has been called humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn away from their evil ways, then I will hear from the heavens and forgive their sin and heal their land. 

Daniel 9:19 O Jehovah, do hear. O Jehovah, do forgive. O Jehovah, do pay attention and act! Do not delay, for your own sake, O my God, for your own name has been called upon your city and upon your people.”

That has a central priest-like body foretold by prophetic parallels and scriptures.

They would be organized to do the will of God by: 

Faithful and Discreet Slave, Mtt 24:45

that is part of a greater body of anointed ones, Revelation 7:4, 

who are feeding themselves New spiritual light Daniel 12:4.

They are Preaching that there will be escapee's of a Great Tribulation Daniel 12:1

They are Preaching a resurrection of the dead on Earth of the wicked and good Daniel 12:2, Acts 24:15

the Faithful and Discreet Slave would be rooting out the lies and falsehoods,because of there seeing Jehovah and Christ hate the lies and liars John 17:17, Revelation 21:8

8 But as for the cowards and those without faith and those who are disgusting in their filth and murderers and the sexually immoral and those practicing spiritism and idolaters and all the liars, their portion will be in the lake that burns with fire and sulfur. This means the second death.” 

rooting out the lies and falsehoods like these:

 that God tortures the wicked eternally in a Fiery Hell,

or believe Jesus is the Almighty GOD YHWH,

or that Jesus was more than human while on Earth,

or that God will destroy the Earth,

or that God is a Trinity, a 3 head or dual godhead,

or that all good people go to heaven,

or that all religions lead to God,

or that God is supporting any of man's governments,

These would be transforming themselves individually as foretold at Isaiah 11:6-9. As seen at conventions of a vast mixed crowd of Jehovah's Witnesses. Revelation 7:9

This organization would be "obeying God as Ruler" rather than or above Men Acts 5:29

Isaiah 2:2 In the final part of the days, The mountain of the house of Jehovah Will become firmly established above the top of the mountains, And it will be raised up above the hills, And to it all the nations will stream.

These being called the Way and recognized worldwide as the True Worshipers of John 4:23,24

These are doing the expressed will of God ,Matthew 24:14 and Mark 13:10, preaching,teaching and announcing the Kingdom of God in the way that Jesus taught the Apostles, Matthew 28:19,20

during that time Jesus stated a generation would see people like yourselves EXPRESSING HATRED for Them because of the NAME they are called by. That Hatred would cause Persecution of those Doing God's Will.

this same generation would see world wars, great diseases and earthquakes and an increase in crime because the love for neighbor has faltered and people are visibly in disagreement among themselves and their government, especially the 7th world power of the US & Great Britain Daniel 2:43

They would see peace taken from the Earth and become faint out of fear,

They would see a days wage would only pay for the necessities of life

43 Just as you saw iron mixed with soft clay, they will be mixed with the people; but they will not stick together, one to the other, just as iron does not mix with clay.

This generation would see a pushing and a shoving between the King of the South and the King of the North Daniel 11:40 

 while keeping separate from war and the politics of this world John 17:14

Who are abstaining from blood and thing sacrificed to idols,

Acts 15:20 but to write them to abstain from things polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from what is strangled, and from blood. 

who need no cross, saint or crucifix or any other material object to express their faith or pray before:

Exodus 20:4“You must not make for yourself a carved image or a form like anything that is in the heavens above or on the earth below or in the waters under the earth.5 You must not bow down to them nor be enticed to serve them, for I, Jehovah your God, am a God who requires exclusive devotion, bringing punishment for the error of fathers upon sons, upon the third generation and upon the fourth generation of those who hate me.

The disgusting acts of pedophiles are hated by God, He is rooting out a people on Earth who will respect His moral Code, not like Adam, but like Christ.

Here is your greatest opportunity: Name the organization foretold in the Bible

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9 hours ago, Shiwiii said:

Hang on, so what you are saying is that you sin because Adam did?  This is essentially what you are saying. You are not accountable for your sins, just Adam is and you think that Jesus is paying for what Adam did and not for what YOU have done. 

We INHERITED sin from Adam. Adam's sin is the most important before God. Adam was perfect, his thinking was equal to Jesus. He spoke directly to God and God taught him during the years they spent together. Adam chose to turn his back on his designer and creator, like spitting in your fathers face for all the good he did to you!  Adam sold us into slavery to sin. 

Look at it this way. Adam was created in God's image and would live forever on the Earth fathering many children with his wife,Eve.Then one day Adam broke the law and was now sentenced to death, he was unplugged from the source of life, Jehovah, and sent to prison to await his death. While in prison waiting for this, Eve joins him and he fathers 8 billion people, we all share in the crime and all are still imprisoned. Who committed the crime? Adam. He is long dead, but we are still imprisoned for his crime, in order for us to be freed, compensation / restitution must be payed to God / the court for the crime. That compensation is "one perfect man". Since we are all criminals / sinful, where would we find a perfect man, then convince him to give up eternity for us! The court demands eye for eye, tooth for tooth, no less then Adam was prior to his crime.

God, out of His deep love for life, sent His Beloved Son, Jesus,he paid the compensation that justice demanded, why aren't we free? Because the court has set forth to find who of the prisoners will accept God's code of conduct and who will not. Then when the court resumes, like at Daniel 7:26. Two types of paroles will be granted, those who want to honor/obey God will be given probation for a thousand years then be re-examined before their parole is complete. The second parole is total freedom from life and all that includes immediately after the court recesses for the thousand years. You can't expect God to grant life in Eden to billions who will treat Him and Eden with the same contempt Adam did.

Unless we accept Jehovah's moral standards and worship Him in Spirit & Truth, with all the others He has called and who answered agreeably, our praying for the forgiveness of our personal sins is irrelevant, it may indicate some reverence toward God, but that means nothing unless we honor Him and His Will. He is searching for True Worshipers. We chose which we are!

Just like Saul of Tarsus, we must accept what God ask for us. Or not.

10 hours ago, Witness said:

"I marvel that you are turning away so soon from Him who called you in the grace of Christ, to a different gospel, 7 which is not another; but there are some who trouble you and want to pervert the gospel of Christ. 8 But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed. 9 As we have said before, so now I say again, if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed.

10 For do I now persuade men, or God? Or do I seek to please men? For if I still pleased men, I would not be a bondservant of Christ.  Gal 1:6-10

The Truth is before you, however your Hatred for Jehovah's Witnesses keeps you from grasping it. The Apostle was warning the congregation of men like the clergy today, men who say their is nothing wrong with homosexual acts and the other works of the flesh that are listed at 5:19: are sexual immorality, uncleanness, brazen conduct, 20 idolatry, spiritism, hostility, strife, jealousy, fits of anger, dissensions, divisions, sects,21 envy, drunkenness, wild parties, and things like these. I am forewarning you about these things, the same way I already warned you, that those who practice such things will not inherit God’s Kingdom.To gain the approval of people in that congregation went out to please men rather than obey God, they were perverting the Gospel like you are perverting who the Apostle Paul is.

Saul was powerful as a Pharisee, hating the Way and stood there approving of the stoning of Stephen, he zealously arrested the Christians to have them imprisoned. Then he is blinded by Christ for 3 days. Now imagine he had to go with Ananias to become baptized as one of the first of the Christian Jehovah's Witnesses in the first century. Was humility needed?

Imagine yourself having to be baptized by one of those you persecuted and hated so much!!!  

Yet, Paul had to do that to gain God's approval. He HUMBLY accepted that he was wrong and turned his zeal toward preaching the Good News of God's Kingdom (just as all Jehovah's Witnesses do) and resisting apostates who pervert the truth and the Way.

2 hours ago, 4Jah2me said:

The GB have no idea

They don't speak of themselves as much as you do. The Witnesses out in the door to door ministry or the public display of literature ministry this day have seen the scriptures pertaining to morality and the proper understanding of those verses written in the magazines, books and public talks given at Kingdom Halls and convention halls and at jw.org. They have taken this information to billions of people who have witnessed the teachings and wisdom in obeying God. The articles promote the family and sanctity of marriage. Child abuse and adultery occur when a selfish individual seeks to satisfy ungodly desires. What is the solution? Separate the unrepentant selfish from your midst while showing support in helping the victims keep their spiritual relationship with God. This is the primary goal, while we await God's intervention.

Without question Jehovah's Witnesses are doing the Expressed Will of God as written at Matthew 24:14 and Mark 13:10. Jesus taught those who would OBEY him to go door to door, street after street,city by city,country by country preaching and declaring "the Good News of God's Kingdom".

That Kingdom rule will have One Standard toward everyone on the Earth below: Is the person acting in a loving way toward God and neighbor. Then there will be no complainers, where did they go? Jehovah sent the Christ with the entire 144,000 and many angels to tear them from the Earth. See Proverbs 2:22 and Matthew 13:36-43. What will make the time after Armageddon so great? Jehovah will have read the heart of everyone, those not knowing Him or those ignoring Him and His desire for mankind will be separated from their families forever!

The ultimate in disfellowshipping will be accomplished by God, millions will object for a second or two, but is God doing the right thing? Is it right to separate everyone not obeying God's Standards from the Earth so that Unity and Peace and Security can be enjoyed by those remaining? 

Moses sister Miriam, complained about Moses' wife, what did Jehovah do? He separated her from the congregation for a week,why? Because He disliked her attitude toward the one He chose to lead His Nation. That time gave Miriam time to meditate on what she had done and that faith in God's direction was lacking in her.

After that, the Law Given by God separated wrong doers from their families, it was an arrangement of God.

We live during a time of rebellion, Jehovah gave this time to show that neither Satan or Man can produce happiness for everyone as He had done for eons before a liar arose. The angels in Heaven needed to see the dreadful conditions that result when life that has consciousness of God and His principles, ignore those. In their wisdom, they permanently disfellowshipped the angels complaining about the Christ and his rule in heaven and earth. Next, the same will occur on Earth."Let Your Kingdom Come"

9 hours ago, Shiwiii said:

Then why did Jesus say that He died for the sins of MANY? Matt 20:26 specifically?

26 This must not be the way among you; but whoever wants to become great among you must be your minister, 

I felt I explained this already, Adam was sinless, A sinless man was needed to repurchase the human family that inherited sin from Adam. Jesus died for all who inherited sin from Adam. Jesus gave his life to God to repurchase us with the equal value of his sinless human life. If Adam was valued at $1,000,000 would God accept a sinner valued at $100.

No, a sinless man, equal to Adam, had to give his life and all his eternal hope as a human, to pay Adam's debt to God for his sin. Jesus body repurchased all who have died in Adam and gives us access in prayer to God to ask forgiveness for own sins.

10 hours ago, Shiwiii said:

Why if this is "Gods way" and He has to have an equal payment/ransom, then why did God allow for Israel to sacrifice a ram/goat/bird etc. for the atonement for the nation of Israel over and over and over again in the OT? 

Jehovah allowed animal sacrifice to teach mankind their hopeless condition.The blood of animals did not bring forgiveness of sin or access to Him in prayer. They did not equal the sinless man Adam's blood. Adam had to be replaced. Jesus became the father of all in place of Adam, giving access to God, through the flaming swords and the vast divide, and the basis to ask for release from Adam's sin and their own daily sins and a clean conscience before God on the basis of Jesus sin atoning blood.     

God is not going to rescue millions of people who see Him differently,that believe differently who is God. He has taught mankind what to believe through Christ's Brothers. Those brothers would be unitedly preaching the same message, the Good News of God's Kingdom systematically in all the inhabited Earth.

Humility is needed, Saul of Tarsus had to humble himself and join those he hated!

God is searching for True Worshipers, they must follow the One Truth that is preached in every Kingdom Hall every week anywhere in the world. Jehovah's Witnesses are United by Truth!

On 1/15/2020 at 10:57 AM, Srecko Sostar said:

Saul of Tarsus have some period about learning, but he didn't learned how to be apostle and member of Jerusalem GB

The 12 Apostles were trained by Jesus and spent time in the door to door ministry.It's not so much the training as it is the vetting, Judas lasted 3-1/2 years. The GB members may have individually spent 40,50,60 years in full time volunteer service while studying the Bible and supporting materials. 

Saul of Tarsus was well trained and excelled because he had a desire to serve and learn. As an example to every person outside of the Way, the Apostle Paul was shown he needed to subject himself to this Way. He needed to humble himself to the leadership of the Way then. Imagine that, the man that wrote 13 books of the Bible needed to humble himself to the older men of Jerusalem. Today there is not another organization on Earth closer to that Way than Jehovah's Witnesses.They are seen as the people who have preached the Good News of God's Kingdom in all the inhabited Earth and continue to let the world know a prophet is in their midst.Their Name Glorifies the Only True God Jehovah. See Exodus 3:15

They have God's view of war, of murder, of abortion, of headship, of voting, of trusting in men, of the use of blood, of immorality,etc......................................................

Jehovah has blessed them and continues to support and lead them through Christ's direction.

Anyone who has faith in an Almighty God, who inspired the compilation of 66 books and foretold 100's of future events that we recognize all came true. He explains why we are here, why conditions are as they are and what we have to look forward to, to hope in. If we trust Him with our lives and of those we lost in death, we surely must trust He can lead men who know Him, pray to Him, individually and in groups,men who have forsaken this world and it's desires.

They must have faith He can make the changes HE desires. It really doesn't matter how the 1st GB members were appointed. I have faith that they were vetted over decades.Jehovah's Witnesses are excelling where others are failing, the GB are doing a fine job before Jehovah, Christ and the congregations. No one else are their peers.

Everyone Trusting in Jehovah, does Just That! 

5 hours ago, Shiwiii said:

I would argue "just a man in flesh", not quite. "just a man in flesh" does not do the things Jesus did. When was the last time YOU walked on water? Healed the Blind? Cast out demons....who know you by name....? Fed thousands with some small fish and some bread? Etc.

What were the Apostles, were they more than imperfect men, more than just men of flesh? No, they were even SINNERS who God's Holy Spirit empowered to raise the dead, heal the sick, expel demons, walk on the water, speak in tongues. The Holy Spirit from the ONLY ALMIGHTY GOD DID ALL THE MIRACLES. GOD is the Source of HOLY SPIRIT, not Jesus, Not Paul, Not Peter, Only Jehovah is why it is called “God’s Holy Spirit”

2 Corinthians 4:7 Now there are different gifts, but there is the same spirit;5and there are different ministries, and yet there is the same Lord;6 and there are different activities, and yet it is the same God who performs them all in everyone.7 But the manifestation of the spirit is given to each one for a beneficial purpose.

ἀντί λυτρον is a dual word, search for ἀντί  then search for λυτρον. ἀντί  will yield results of "instead of" meaning Jesus life instead of Adams, or corresponding Jesus to Adam. λυτρον will yield ransom

5 hours ago, Shiwiii said:

Then why does scripture say Jesus paid the ransom for ALL? If it was just man for man, then why does it say for all? Because it is not equal for equal, it is Jesus for ALL. You, me and those down the street. 

5 hours ago, Shiwiii said:

I have not seen one scripture which backs your (and the rest of jws) claims Adam and Jesus were equal, not for a ransom, not for anything.

Every person born from Adam needed a sinless man to redeem them from their father Adam's sin. God applies Jesus sacrifice to Adam, freeing every son and daughter from the debt incurred from Adam the father. Adam was the only sinless man that needed a redeemer to release his family.

You have been shown several scriptures, you are not accepting the evidence before you that Jesus was miraculously born a sinless man, Adam was created a sinless man, when Adam sinned, a sinless man had to give his life to pay the price in order to free the children of the man that sinned. Adam sold his children into slavery to sin.

Here is the legal basis to repurchase a slave, which all of us are. This is the legal touchstone from the Grand Judge and Lawgiver Jehovah

Leviticus 25:

47“‘But if a foreign resident or a settler among you becomes wealthy and your brother has become poor alongside him and must sell himself to the foreign resident or the settler who lives among you, or to a member of the family of the foreign resident,48 he will continue to have the right of repurchase after he has sold himself. One of his brothers may buy him back,49 or his uncle or the son of his uncle may buy him back, or any close relative, one of his family, may buy him back. “‘Or if he himself has become wealthy, he may also buy himself back.

Jehovah became the Repurchaser of every one who has inherited slavery to sin, why Jehovah and not Jesus? Jehovah gave His Son, Jesus. Jesus was born in the flesh and by extension became like his brothers of the human “family” his blood would free from slavery. Paul states this at Hebrews 2:   

11For both the one who is sanctifying and those who are being sanctified all stem from one, and for this reason he is not ashamed to call them brothers,12 as he says: “I will declare your name to my brothers; in the midst of the congregation I will praise you with song.”13 And again: “I will put my trust in him.” And again: “Look! I and the young children, whom Jehovah gave me.”14 Therefore, since the “young children” are sharers of blood and flesh, he also similarly shared in the same things, so that through his death he might bring to nothing the one having the means to cause death, that is, the Devil,15 and that he might set free all those who were held in slavery all their lives by their fear of death.16 For it is not really angels he is assisting, but he is assisting Abraham’s offspring.17 Consequently, he had to become like his “brothers” in all respects, so that he could become a merciful and faithful high priest in things relating to God, in order to offer a propitiatory sacrifice for the sins of the people.

Ephesians1:7 By means of him we have the release by ransom through the blood of that one, yes, the forgiveness of our trespasses, according to the riches of his undeserved kindness.

Revelation 5:9 And they sing a new song, saying: “You are worthy to take the scroll and open its seals, for you were slaughtered and with your blood you bought people for God out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation.

14:3 And they are singing what seems to be a new song before the throne and before the four living creatures and the elders, and no one was able to master that song except the 144,000, who have been bought from the earth.4 These are the ones who did not defile themselves with women; in fact, they are virgins. These are the ones who keep following the Lamb no matter where he goes. These were bought from among mankind as firstfruits to God and to the Lamb,

 This point is not nominally argued, what organization does your beliefs represent? 

20 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

This formulation say how they had no "qualifications", but JUST had been GIVING opportunity to direct

This formulation is the same as most businesses on Earth. You start at the bottom and work your way up, with the difference being they are volunteers. The GB members all gained spiritual and mental experience in the many years they were full time publishers alone with no other responsibilities. They were trained by older men, the older men suggest to a body of older men that they be considered to help a congregation or branch office while the continue their volunteer service as door to door ministers.

You don't start in the mail office one week then become president the next. The structure of Jehovah's Witnesses leadership weeds out those who have no desire to serve God. Many pioneers have spent 120 hours a month going door to door with the magazines,this is the expressed will of God preaching the Good News of God's Kingdom in all the Earth. They keep records before God who and where they spoke with someone, that they may reach every door, every person.

Have you ever spent 120 hours a month as a volunteer, spending your own money for all expenses? Previously they paid for the literature they lovingly gave to those who would read them. The GB are lowly servants of Jehovah. They respect that Jesus is the true head of the congregation. Having a body lead the organization spiritually is much better than having one man with unpredictability.

If the Apostles Paul and Peter were members, there would be complainers inside and out of the organization.The world is full of nonconstructive complainers.What will be their outcome? We leave that to the one who peers into such conversations from the heavens!

The GB are lowly men who are humble before God, searching the Bible for truth and direction, no different than a father who tries to care for his families spiritual needs.  

8 hours ago, Arauna said:

Interesting thought: like the tree of good and bad , I was sure it was symbolic...... because there is no way jehovah would make our everlasting lives depend on a literal tree as we need obedience to him for e everlasting life..... 

I hear you, I'm just trying to answer the statement that was made that something created perfect doesn't become imperfect.

 As we think about that day some 6000 years ago, Jehovah throws them out, physically they are still perfect, how did they physically become imperfect? Did Jehovah alter Adam's DNA? Did physical perfection depend on something in Eden?

Jehovah seems to indicate they could sustain physical perfection by re-entering the Garden, but how could something ingested alter your DNA toward perfection? 

Spiritual Perfection depends on obedience and a active relationship with Jehovah, that perfection will allow us to communicate with Jehovah individually.Can we even imagine that?

After Armageddon, Jehovah will teach us how to achieve all we can be through the "leaves of the trees that grow close to the waters from the throne". Today, we search the deeper things of the Bible, stringing verses together as we go deeper into a well that cannot be exhausted. 

On 1/13/2020 at 11:39 AM, Shiwiii said:

On 1/10/2020 at 8:32 PM, the Sower of Seed said:

Jesus had to be corresponding to Adam in order for justice to occur.

unsubstantiated 

ὁ (From a Greek Interlinear:

the (one) δοὺς (having given) ἑαυτὸν (himself) ἀντίλυτρον (corresponding ransom) ὑπὲρ (over)

(all (ones) τὸ (the) μαρτύριον (witness) καιροῖς (to appointed times)

The Flavor of ἀντί  λυτρον is corresponding to (Christ had to COVER Adam’s Life as the Best of Human Creation) without defect, without sin, very good, perfect without blemish.His Disobedience caused his change from perfect to un-perfect.

The only Absolute perfection is Jehovah God. He created angels and humans with Free Will rather than force them to obey,  He offers benefits for obedience and punishment for disobedience.

The Entire theme of the Bible is God explaining what has happened and what steps are being taken to return man to spiritual and fleshly perfection.

There would be no need for a Bible if Adam did not sin, for God spoke to Adam and Eve and would speak with us if we were not sinful.

Genesis 1:26 Then God said: “Let us make man in our image, according to our likeness, and let them have in subjection the fish of the sea and the flying creatures of the heavens and the domestic animals and all the earth and every creeping animal that is moving on the earth.”   

How was Adam like God? Adam had a consciousness of life, he could reason, adding one thought to another, he had a conscience, discerning what is wrong and right, he had the potential to live forever like God.

Genesis 1:28 Further, God blessed them, and God said to them: “Be fruitful and become many, fill the earth and subdue it, and have in subjection the fish of the sea and the flying creatures of the heavens and every living creature that is moving on the earth.”

God commissioned them to do something that would take thousands/millions of years. Would God order them to do this if they were to die long before they finished?

Genesis 2:15 Jehovah God took the man and settled him in the garden of Eden to cultivate it and to take care of it.16 Jehovah God also gave this command to the man: “From every tree of the garden you may eat to satisfaction.17 But as for the tree of the knowledge of good and bad, you must not eat from it, for in the day you eat from it you will certainly die.”

Death is the penalty for disobedience, had there not been disobedience, there would not be human death. Genesis 3:4 Satan calls God a liar: 4 At this the serpent said to the woman: “You certainly will not die. Eve ate and gave some to Adam.

After Adam sinned, God sat in judgment of them and foretold the future of man and Satan. God foretells a “seed” that would come from God’s creation and Satan would give it a “Heel” wound, afterwards the seed would give Satan a head wound.

Why is man the dominate sex? To the woman he said: “I will greatly increase the pain of your pregnancy; in pain you will give birth to children, and your longing will be for your husband, and he will dominate you.”

Genesis 3:17 And to Adam he said: “Because you listened to your wife’s voice and ate from the tree concerning which I gave you this command, ‘You must not eat from it,’ cursed is the ground on your account. In pain you will eat its produce all the days of your life. (The foods we desire must be cultivated)

Is it possible for humans to live forever? Jehovah God then said: “Here the man has become like one of us in knowing good and bad. Genesis 3:22 Now in order that he may not put his hand out and take fruit also from the tree of life and eat and live forever.

Mankind could eat this fruit and live forever, Adam and Eve were free to eat it while they lived in the Garden, in fact they may have eaten it regularly. Even after Adam sinned it could have this affect, but it would not repair the relationship with God or change the way the Earth and it’s people suffer today.

God cast Adam and Eve from the Garden of Eden and never spoke with them again. They were now criminals, having transgressed the law of God. We all live within a prison of sin and death. In order to be freed, someone equivalent to Adam would have to sacrifice that possible eternal future as a human to God to replace the life Adam, our father, threw away.

How GOOD was the life Adam and Eve would have lived?

We only need to look at what God promises to those who accept the value of Christ’ blood and enter a relationship with Him, hoping to never forsake appreciation for all He has done.

No Wars, Feeling of Security on their own place:

Psalm 46:9  He is bringing an end to wars throughout the earth….

Micah 4:4 They will sit, each one under his vine and under his fig tree, And no one will make them afraid, For the mouth of Jehovah of armies has spoken.

God will cause the Earth to produce:

Isaiah 35  The wilderness and the parched land will exult, And the desert plain will be joyful and blossom as the saffron.

Their own place and they will build their own homes:

Isaiah 65:21-23  They will build houses and live in them,

And they will plant vineyards and eat their fruitage.

22  They will not build for someone else to inhabit,

Nor will they plant for others to eat.

For the days of my people will be like the days of a tree,

And the work of their hands my chosen ones will enjoy to the full.

23  They will not toil for nothing,

Nor will they bear children for distress,

Because they are the offspring made up of those blessed by Jehovah,

And their descendants with them.

Never Sick:

Isaiah 33:24  And no resident will say: “I am sick.”

The people dwelling in the land will be pardoned for their error.

Youthful Flesh and Energy Forever:….

Job 33:25  Let his flesh become fresher than in youth;

Let him return to the days of his youthful vigor.

Interactivity with God:

Isaiah 65:24 Even before they call out, I will answer; While they are yet speaking, I will hear.

Peace with the animals:

Isaiah 65:25 The wolf and the lamb will feed together, The lion will eat straw just like the bull, And the serpent’s food will be dust. They will do no harm nor cause any ruin in all my holy mountain,” says Jehovah.

Isaiah 11:6 The wolf will reside for a while with the lamb, And with the young goat the leopard will lie down, And the calf and the lion and the fattened animal will all be together; And a little boy will lead them. 7 The cow and the bear will feed together, And their young will lie down together. The lion will eat straw like the bull. 8 The nursing child will play over the lair of a cobra, And a weaned child will put his hand over the den of a poisonous snake. 9 They will not cause any harm Or any ruin in all my holy mountain, Because the earth will certainly be filled with the knowledge of Jehovah.

Adam was the Best of God’s creations, the “crowning point of creation” God looked at Adam and Eve and concluded they were “ very good”. Adam and Eve would have had all that God promises us by means of His Kingdom. Jesus human life had to “cover” all that Adam was and could become prior to his disobedience.

The Books of Exodus, Leviticus & Deuteronomy explain God’s principles and that sacrifices to Him all had to be without blemish, perfect, the best you had.

Exodus 21:23 But if a fatality does occur, then you must give life for life,24 eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot,25 burn for burn, wound for wound, blow for blow.

Jesus human attributes and behavior had to be correspond to what Adam was prior to his disobedience.

On 1/13/2020 at 5:40 AM, 4Jah2me said:

Well then maybe you can both explain how two past members of the Governing Body were Homosexuals.

If people in the 1st century were homosexuals before learning the truth of God's Kingdom and Christ' sin atoning blood became anointed, what is the difference today.

The GB members are no different than any other witnesses, they just have been giving opportunity to direct the organization.They have not been blessed with an Apostleship and Outward Displays of Holy Spirit as some of them were.

Like us, and those in the 1st century, they repented and left ungodly practices behind and are reaching forward.They may have preached the message full time and been given responsibility one step at a time after many years. WHO IS THEIR JUDGE?

20 hours ago, Shiwiii said:

unsubstantiated 

ALMOST EVERY EXPRESSION IS MINE. Scripture are copied.

1 Timothy 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, a man, Christ Jesus,6 who gave himself a corresponding ransom for all—this is what is to be witnessed to in its own due time.

WHO DID JESUS SACRIFICE CORRESPOND TO?

20 hours ago, Shiwiii said:

Adam was Perfect

@Shiwiii said disagree, something perfect does not have a flaw nor does it gain a flaw, for then it is not perfect.

You believe God created us to suffer a few years and die? 

Or

When God Cursed the land he changed Adam and Eve from perfect to imperfect?

On 1/11/2020 at 4:55 PM, Anna said:

Hopefully more brothers and sisters will gain a better conscience and report any wrongdoings to Police and Authorities as it still seems that Elders are exempt from doing so

When a person is a alcoholic or drug addict, what is the common goal of rehab?

To help the person gain a relationship with God! With Hope that a higher responsibility toward God will help the person refrain from wrong doing.

2 Corinthians 10:5 For we are overturning reasonings and every lofty thing raised up against the knowledge of God, and we are bringing every thought into captivity to make it obedient to the Christ; 

A person may imagine sexual scenarios, is this the Christian thing to do? NO. A person seeking to be pleasing before God must try to control thought and actions. Why? See Galatians 5:19-21. 

Jehovah's Witnesses teach what fornication is and how such imagination is the first step of sin. What is sexual sin in God's eyes. To arouse sexual desire in someone who is not your wife or husband. This can be done many different ways.The Watchtower magazine often teaches it's readers to abstain from thoughts or actions that will cause emotional and spiritual pain. The congregation will always try to help individuals to "have the mind of Christ"

The Bible teaches of one of David's sons who imagined his half sister would react differently. In his mind he had left any desire to please God, and was full throttle toward satisfying the sexual passion that  imagination had built within him. 

2 Samuel 13 Now David’s son Absalom had a beautiful sister named Taʹmar, and David’s son Amʹnon fell in love with her. 

Amnon played sick and arranged for her to come cook him a meal. 

9 Then she took the pan and served him. But Amʹnon refused to eat and said: “Have everybody leave me!” So everybody left him.10 Amʹnon now said to Taʹmar: “Bring the food into the bedroom, so that I may eat it from your hand.” So Taʹmar took the heart-shaped cakes that she had made and brought them to her brother Amʹnon in the bedroom.11 When she brought them for him to eat, he grabbed her and said: “Come, lie down with me, my sister.”12 But she said to him: “No, my brother! Do not humiliate me, for such a thing is not done in Israel. Do not do this disgraceful thing.13 How could I live down my shame? And you will be regarded as one of the disgraceful men in Israel. Now speak, please, to the king, for he will not withhold me from you.”14 But he refused to listen to her, and he overpowered her and humiliated her by raping her.

With What Result?

15 Then Amʹnon began hating her with a very intense hatred, so that his hatred for her became greater than the love he had felt for her. Amʹnon said to her: “Get up; go away!” 

After his sexual passion was satisfied his chemicals returned him to reality and He Now hated her for not matching his imagination. In moments his thinking was changed, however, I'm sure desire soon returned. 

Sexual transgressions are nothing new in the world, however the wickedness is reaching higher levels than ever before. 2 Timothy 3:13 states that in our time "But wicked men and impostors will advance from bad to worse, misleading and being misled."

The cause: Every type of sexual desire can be fed on TV, Videos,The Web, magazines and any kind of product commercials.There is no conduct kept in the closet as unspeakable or shameful conduct. 

Though there may be individuals that have left any sense of responsibility to Jehovah behind, there is no reason to color the entire organization of people with the same brush.Jehovah's Witnesses are the only organization on Earth performing the expressed will of God as we read at Matthew 24:14 and Mark 13:10. They try to live their lives with a consciousness toward the Holy God they represent and teach others about. 

Most of Jehovah's Witnesses hate seeing the name of their God mentioned in a way that brings reproach and shame upon it. They hate that someone in their midst would act as a pedophile or betray the relationship between elder and those seeking spiritual help. When such a person is found in the congregation they are subjected to scrutiny by the elder body. It may be very difficult to tell whether a person is truly repentant. The world knows that if a person is found to be a non-repentant person, as someone who may cause harm to the congregation,or that they will continue to practice something that God hates, they are expelled from the congregation, this is what God Himself had instructed towards Moses sister who complained about Moses wife. Later in the 1st century, congregations were instructed to do this that the wrongdoer may repent and reapply themselves to reach out for God's approval. This is much like Jews previously practiced by removing people from the Sanhedrin, who actual had to move away from God's people in order to be able to work and live.  

Jehovah's Witnesses have great desire that the day will soon appear when Jehovah reads the inner person of every adult on Earth and each one will be marked as a sheep or a goat.The goats: everyone who has no personal relationship with the true God Jehovah, will no longer do any harmful acts or acts of any kind on Earth. While the sheep, those who have tried to act in a way that pleases God, both in their imagination and visible acts, will be allowed to continue living on Earth and growing towards the perfection Jesus enjoyed as a human being.These are ones who make a practice of bringing every thought into captivity to make it obedient to the Christ; this is the only solution to the excelling of wickedness being imagined and practiced on Earth. 

The Goal of Satan:As God's adversary, is to distort how you view any of Jehovah's Witnesses. He wants you see something unholy, transgressors of what is good. He propels this thought so that you will be less likely to listen to them while they do the will of God, just as Jesus did, preach the Good News of God's Kingdom. Just as Satan used many different means to stop Jesus from loyally acting as God's appointed Messiah, Satan will use many different ways to stop people from learning how God's Kingdom will set all matters straight. Satan does not want anyone to gain eternal life as Jehovah's friend since he will not be allowed life after his judgment is executed. That Good News of God's Kingdom includes the knowledge that God will give what is deserving to everyone bringing reproach on His Holy Name. You should also know that the majority of Jehovah's Witnesses hate what is bad and try to act as an exemplary neighbor!

On 1/10/2020 at 8:32 PM, the Sower of Seed said:

Up until Satan spoke with Eve there were 2 things Jesus did not create: himself and Jehovah.

2 Corinthians 10.5 For we are overturning reasonings and every lofty thing raised up against the knowledge of God, and we are bringing every thought into captivity to make it obedient to the Christ; 

We MUST actively be bringing every thought into captivity, refuting falsehoods so that our sacrifice is to Him, GOD Almighty YHWH Jehovah and not demons. This is the mandatory action of everyone who would find pleasure in Jehovah and His Son. For if we worship a falsehood, or in falsehood, we worship demons who are in association with Satan the Devil, the father of the lie. Try to imagine that fact, that for eons, there were no lies spoken between all the spirits of Heaven. Not one lie in Heaven!  

Christ was a fleshly mirror of God, his thoughts were in union with God's. He spent eons with his Creator. He spoke of reverence toward his Father and taught mankind to pray to Him as God. Jesus affirmed he was the son of God, not God in the flesh.The Family representation from the Bible means a lot and we should always remember that YHWH is the Unsurpassed Almighty GOD and Father of every living thing, Jesus is a son among many. He was firstborn and knows his Father the best. They have a united bond of love from the ages they have shared.

We MUST examine every belief as to "why do I believe this"? What is the touchstone? The Entire Bible.

All Scripture is inspired by ONE GOD, His thought should match everywhere in the Bible, from beginning to end, from Genesis to Revelation, we should hear the same voice and thought of God Almighty YHWH.

We must harmonize every scripture speaking of God to know "Who is God?"and "What does He Hope for us and from us?"

The True Worshipers will be eager to know GOD. What does He say toward every belief we have. He has Exposed to us how He feels about what is the best way of life, not only for OURSELVES, but for the OTHER PERSON and the Entire Body of Life.

2 Timothy 3:16 All Scripture is inspired of God and beneficial for teaching, for reproving, for setting things straight, for disciplining in righteousness,17 so that the man of God may be fully competent, completely equipped for every good work.

Romans 15:4 For all the things that were written beforehand were written for our instruction, so that through our endurance and through the comfort from the Scriptures we might have hope. 

The Bible many time speaks about giving Jehovah the best Sacrifice. He gave guidelines as to what was approved and the joy that we should have in giving it. He spoke through Noah, Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Joseph, Saul, David, Solomon, Hezekiah, Jesus and the Apostles, of to who and what that sacrifice is. When He gave Jesus, He gave the Best He had of His angelic creation.

Jesus had to be a perfect man just as the pre-sin Adam was, that excludes Jesus from having any godly or angelic powers. The miracles Jesus performed were the same as the Apostles performed, all accomplished by GOD's Holy Spirit. The painful suffering and godly restraint were human, an example of what the man of God can and should do. 

I John 2:2 And he is a propitiatory sacrifice for our sins, yet not for ours only but also for the whole world’s. 

1 John 4:10 The love is in this respect, not that we have loved God, but that he loved us and sent his Son as a propitiatory sacrifice for our sins.

Hebrews 4:12 But this man offered one sacrifice for sins for all time and sat down at the right hand of God, 

1 Corinthians 10:20 No; but I say that what the nations sacrifice, they sacrifice to demons and not to God; and I do not want you to become sharers with the demons. 

How are they Sacrificing to demons? They Worship in FALSEHOOD, NOT TO THE TRUTH OF GOD.

The Bible Exalts Jehovah as the Almighty, the Creator, the Eternal of the past and future, Without Beginning and End, He is the Lawgiver, He is the Giver of Christ Jesus, He is the Hearer of Prayer, He is the embodiment of Love, Justice, Wisdom and Power. All the angels praise Him in acknowledgment of this:

Revelation 4:11 “You are worthy, Jehovah our God, to receive the glory and the honor and the power, because you created all things, and because of your will they came into existence and were created.”

We then ask who is speaking at Genesis 1:26 Then God said: “Let us make man in our image, according to our likeness,and let them have in subjection the fish of the sea and the flying creatures of the heavens and the domestic animals and all the earth and every creeping animal that is moving on the earth. Who was God speaking to? 

GOD ALMIGHTY YHWH is speaking to Michael / Jesus. Jehovah loved him so much, He created many others like him using Michael / Jesus as His helper. This statement is in unity with Revelation 4:11 as truth.

Jehovah is the Almighty God, who loves his creation so much HE GAVE IS BELOVED SON, JESUS, IN OUR BEHALF.

Hebrews 10:5 So when he (Jesus) comes into the world, he (Jesus) says: “‘Sacrifice and offering you (GOD YHWH) did not want, but you (GOD YHWH) prepared a body for me. 

Many may find reverence to Jesus, prayer to Jesus, worship of Jesus as a lofty thing. The True Worshipers will Worship Jehovah God while loving Jesus for all he accomplished in teaching us who God is. We Honor Jesus as our teacher and instructor, knowing his commands are from Jehovah. We are eternally grateful all he has suffered in our behalf. We acknowledge that Jesus is the firstborn son of the Creator Jehovah and is loved by Him as an obedient son. We Recognize, like the angels of Revelation 4:11, All Prayer and Praise should be directed to You the Father Jehovah, the Giver of Life and every good thing. 

6 hours ago, Shiwiii said:

So you agree that all things came into existence through Jesus, but you do not agree with the rest of John 1:3 where it states that not one thing that was made (created) was made (created) without Jesus.  Do I get this right?

Up until Satan spoke with Eve there were 2 things Jesus did not create: himself and Jehovah.

 GOD was speaking to Jesus at Genesis 1:26 Then God said: “Let us make man in our image, according to our likeness, and let them have in subjection the fish of the sea and the flying creatures of the heavens and the domestic animals and all the earth and every creeping animal that is moving on the earth.” 

You agree?

1 Timothy 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, a man, Christ Jesus,6 who gave himself a corresponding ransom for all—this is what is to be witnessed to in its own due time.

The standard of God, eye for eye, found in the Law is a Principle of GOD. The Law is a tutor, teaching us today the views of GOD, the ROCK, unchanging.

We learn how He feels about murder, abortion, sexual relations, stealing, etc.....The Law is not binding today, but the principles are.

Jesus had to be corresponding to Adam in order for justice to occur.

After all, why did Jesus have to come to earth? Why did God not just forgive them? The 4 cardinal attributes of Jehovah are Love, Power, Wisdom and JUSTICE. 

Jehovah could not forgive Adam because Adam was Perfect. He had a relationship with Jehovah and understood the one law of Eden.

Even though Jehovah loved his first human son, Divine Law required Adam be held responsible for his thoughts and actions.

The Greek word for corresponding ransom has the flavor of "complete purchase price" Jesus had to match Adam, to pay the complete price, not one penny less.

What is the value of perfection, of a perfect man who could live forever?

How much would a court value him? 

The entire population today could not equal it!