Deus magnus est

Thank you for revealing more of Watchtower’s lies. 
In the quote above, they are comparing the WT organization to the anointed Body of Christ in the first century, where it has been made plain through scripture that there were inspired prophets designated so, by God.  If the GB are not “inspired” by Holy Spirit they should not make the comparison.   
 
Since they have a 100 percent fail rate, how does this show respect for prophesy?    I have yet to find a genuine heartfelt apology by the governing body or any WT leaders for misleading millions of people with their failed prophesies.   They are more inclined to pass the buck onto their hearers.  1975 is a prime example.   
Here is another:
"Some anticipated that the work would end in 1925, but the Lord did not state so. The difficulty was that the friends inflated their imaginations beyond reason; and that when their imaginations burst asunder, they were inclined to throw away everything." (Watchtower 1926 p. 232.) 
Let’s go back to 1925 to identify the “some”:   
"We have no doubt whatever in regard to the chronology relating to the dates of 1874, 1914, 1918, and 1925. It was on this line of reckoning that the dates 1874, 1914, and 1918 were located; and the Lord has placed the stamp of his seal upon 1914 and 1918 beyond any possibility of erasure. What further evidence do we need? Using this same measuring line.... it is an easy matter to locate 1925, probably in the fall, for the beginning of the antitypical jubilee. There can be no more question about 1925 than there was about 1914." (Watchtower, p. 150, May 15, 1922)
 Check the 1914 chronology to see its changes.  Check all of the dates for changes.  “Any possibility of erasure”???  They are such liars.  
"True, there have been those in times past who predicted an "end" to the world, even announcing a specific date. Yet nothing happened. The 'end' did not come. They were guilty of false prophesying. Why? What was missing? Missing from such people were God's truths and the evidence that He was using and guiding them.'' (Awake, Oct. 8, 1968) 
 "God's faithful people on earth emphasized the importance of the dates 1914 and 1918 and 1925. They had much to say about these dates and what would come to pass, but all they predicted did not come to pass." (Vindication, vol. 1, 1931, p. 146) 
By their own definition, they are false prophets.   
Prophecy can not be understood until it has been fulfilled or is in the course of fulfillment. From 1874 to 1914 the prophecy concerning the Lord's coming was being fulfilled and could be understood, and was understood, by those who were faithful to the Lord and who were watching the development of events, but not by others. (Creation; 1927; p. 290) 
'If these prophesies have not been fulfilled, and if all possibility of fulfillment is past, then these prophets are proven false.' (Prophecy, 1929, p 22) 
As I said, they are “inspired” through demonic inspiration.  If they were still part of the vine of Christ, they would naturally be "inspired" with Holy Spirit.  John 15:5; 1 John 2:27 
THE ARE FALSE “INSPIRED” PROPHETS.   Matt 12:34  
They may not join the word “inspired” to prophet, but God does not need to.  The dictionary makes it clear that prophets are inspired, as does the Watchtower itself.   
God – But the prophet who presumes to speak a word in My name, which I have not commanded him to speak, or who speaks in the name of other gods, that prophet shall die.’ 21 And if you say in your heart, ‘How shall we know the word which the Lord has not spoken?’— 22 when a prophet speaks in the name of the Lord, if the thing does not happen or come to pass, that is the thing which the Lord has not spoken; the prophet has spoken it presumptuously; you shall not be afraid of him. 
This organization is supposedly GOD'S organization.  When every doctrine fails, then who is to blame?  The GB do not take the blame.  Is God to blame since His spirit supposedly guides it? 
Dictionary –  Prophesy - to utter by or as if by divine inspiration, to predict with assurance or on the basis of mystic knowledge 
Watchtower’s Reasoning Book –
Prophesy - An inspired message; a revelation of the divine will and purpose. Prophecy may be a prediction of something to come, inspired moral teaching, or an expression of a divine command or judgment. 
This definition just about covers all aspects of the Watchtower’s teachings within the "theocratic organization".   If the GB claim they are not inspired, then they should put down their pen, stop the printing presses and leave millions alone to find truth by turning fully to Christ and the Father.   
When a GB members says, “This is a theocracy ruled by God, not a collection of man-made decisions.  This is governed from heaven.”, how do you believe this is possible if not through an “inspired” anointed one?  If God “pours out his Spirit on His organization”, where does all that spirit go?  Does it magically appear in word form in a magazine?  
The nation of Israel was governed from heaven through an authentic prophet – Moses.  Did you know the GB at times compare themselves to Moses?  They expect JWs to swallow this lie and also to accept they are not inspired.   On top of this, they must obey without question any doctrine doomed to fail.    
Where is the truth in any of this?  The truth is that the GB is guilty of false prophesy. Since they are unable to receive “inspired messages” from God, even though they claim they are anointed; not only because they say they are not inspired, but because they are led by another spirit, 
THEY ARE FALSE PROPHETS TELLING LIES.  ACTUALLY, THEY ARE FALSE PROPHETS CLAIMING AN IDOL – THE ORGANIZATION – IS THE ONE INSPIRED (since they say they are not)  as  GOD’S “SPIRIT-DIRECTED ORGANIZATION”.  
The Reasoning Book continues:
False prophets - Individuals and organizations proclaiming messages that they attribute to a superhuman source but that do not originate with the true God and are not in harmony with his revealed will. 
Is the claim made on the front of the Wt. magazine below in harmony with the will of God?  Is it that hard to recognize a lie when you see it? Can you see how firm the statement is made on the cover that was circulated to thousands - millions of people in the world?  It is purely, false prophesy. 
Without a doubt, the Watchtower is guided by false “inspired” prophets, who have “breathed spirit” into the organization.  It is a spirit that has caused great harm, oppression, confusion, depression, division of families and loss of lives; pure darkness.   It is the farthest thing from a spiritual paradise that has ever existed.    Rev 13:1,11,15 
It is fruitless to further communicate with you on this, SM.    My hope is that JWs see through the organization’s lies and turn aside to Christ.
 
 
 
 

Do not add to my words Butler. You know exactly what I said. If you do not understand Strong's do the research otherwise you will show yourself to be ignorant of what it is, granted you do not know where the very bible you read derives from.
If you do not trust a translation, why bother to read it because you find it easier? Double-Speak much?

As to what human rules are you even speaking about?
You have the Church whereas its teachings are to be adhered to, as with what is commanded by God ans his Christ. Nothing in this sense screams human rule, if you can agree with an apostle who lead the church, it is understandable, but to agree with someone who is alienated from eh church or teach what is accursed, clearly you will run into some problems.
there is a line between what is of the church and what is considered accursed and not of the church.

Maybe the JW Org / GB / Watchtower have always been a hoax, and never been the truth. 

Bill Nye is more of a "promoter" than a scientist. He definitely does not belong in the same category as Richard Feynman. I've read two of Feynman's books and they are really good, and reflect true science. I loved "What do you care what other people think?" because it draws non-scientists into his world.
Echos of your doppelgangers here. They always have said the same thing about the 1975 fiasco. It's true that no Watchtower literature ever contained a prediction that Armageddon would arrive in 1975. The point was that at some time in the 1970's we should expect Armageddon to be no further than a matter of months, not years, away.
*** km 9/73 p. 1 par. 4 Intensive Tract Distribution ***
Why is the distribution being done in such an intensive manner? Because of the impact that this will have on the public. People talk to one another, and they will soon realize that nearly everyone they know was served with the same urgent message. This will make a far deeper impression than would a gradual distribution over many months. Furthermore, we realize that the time remaining for this wicked world is greatly reduced. Opportunity for people to learn the truth and take their stand on Jehovah’s side is fast running out. *** km 5/74 p. 3 How Are You Using Your Life? ***
Yes, since the summer of 1973 there have been new peaks in pioneers every month. Now there are 20,394 regular and special pioneers in the United States, an all-time peak. That is 5,190 more than there were in February 1973! A 34-percent increase! Does that not warm our hearts? Reports are heard of brothers selling their homes and property and planning to finish out the rest of their days in this old system in the pioneer service. Certainly this is a fine way to spend the short time remaining before the wicked world’s end. I started regular pioneering in the summer of 1973 and quit school even though I was technically still 15 years old, turning 16 before the next school year. I have to admit, it felt good being one of those statistics. My parents then, as a favor, sold our time-consuming farm worth about $50,000 (1974) at the time for only $10,000 to a brother and moved us all into the city. The brother we sold it to broke up the old farm acres into several subdivisions, got power and septic tanks to all the lots, and probably made a million dollars by now. He's no longer a Witness (and recently died too) but several Witness families still live on those acres.
And of course, quitting high school at age 15 was not just recommended by circuit overseers. It was the subtext of the following prophecy made in Watch Tower publications in 1969, preparing us for "What Will the 1970s Bring?":
**g69 5/22 p.15
"If you are a young person, you also need to face the fact that you will never grow old in this present system of things. Why not? Because all the evidence in fulfillment of Bible prophecy indicates that this corrupt system is due to end in a few years. . . . . Therefore, as a young person, you will never fulfill any career that this system offers. If you are in high school and thinking about a college education, it means at least four, perhaps even six or eight more years to graduate into a specialized career. But where will this system of things be by that time? It will be well on the way toward its finish, if not actually gone!" Awake!1969 May 22 p.15  And all of it was based on a totally unbiblical belief that each of the 7 creative days were 7,000 years in length, which supposedly made it significant that we were evidently coming up on then being 6,000 years into that seventh day. Why ever bring up the 6,000 years since Adam if we weren't pushing its supposed but unbiblical significance?
*** w68 8/15 p. 499 pars. 29-30 Why Are You Looking Forward to 1975? ***
That means, in the fall of the year 1975, a little over seven years from now (and not in 1997 as would be the case if Ussher’s figures were correct), it will be 6,000 years since the creation of Adam, the father of all mankind!   Are we to assume from this study that the battle of Armageddon will be all over by the autumn of 1975, and the long-looked-for thousand-year reign of Christ will begin by then? Possibly, but we wait to see how closely the seventh thousand-year period of man’s existence coincides with the sabbathlike thousand-year reign of Christ. If these two periods run parallel with each other as to the calendar year, it will not be by mere chance or accident but will be according to Jehovah’s loving and timely purposes. Our chronology, however, which is reasonably accurate (but admittedly not infallible), at the best only points to the autumn of 1975 as the end of 6,000 years of man’s existence on earth. It does not necessarily mean that 1975 marks the end of the first 6,000 years of Jehovah’s seventh creative “day.” Why not? Because after his creation Adam lived some time during the “sixth day,” which unknown amount of time would need to be subtracted from Adam’s 930 years, to determine when the sixth seven-thousand-year period or “day” ended, and how long Adam lived into the “seventh day.” And yet the end of that sixth creative “day” could end within the same Gregorian calendar year of Adam’s creation. It may involve only a difference of weeks or months, not years. Then of course, in 1972 and 1973 the Watchtower promoted the "Ezekiel" book and other publications with the statement that the faithful and discreet slave was a prophet. Not just a "prophet" with quotes around it, but literally, a prophet. This was not very different from statements like this one in 1924 referring to Rutherford and another like him:
*** g1924 p.149 ***
" . . . Judge Rutherford is permeated with the real Biblical and prophetic spirit, ceases not in his discourse to defy the devil and throw (morally) an inkwell into his face, as the deceased Luther did. . . . This year 1924 is worse than 1914."

Yes. I know exactly why but it would not (or should not) be of much interest to anyone here. Since I brought it up, it was not through anything conspiratorial, or finding out "where the bodies were buried" so to speak. [That's an inside joke about Rutherford, by the way.]  She merely had shown a bit too much ambition in trying to get higher profile assignments, which wasn't too much of a problem until she was caught interfering with the assignments that others got in the apparent hopes of accomplishing this end.

Ah yes but they had PROOF of who their leaders should be, whereas the GB do not give any proof that anyone should follow them or obey them. They are in fact false leaders. Verse 7 here says CONTEMPLATE HOW THEIR CONDUCT TURNS OUT.  Done that already. And I can see very bad conduct, which shows false leaders.. 
. 7  Remember those who are taking the lead among you, who have spoken the word of God to you, and as you contemplate how their conduct turns out, imitate their faith.
As for verse 17.  I don't know what Bible you are using, thought you were a JW so here is the JW Org version..  Please notice in BOTH verses it DOES NOT say LEADERS it says THOSE TAKING THE LEAD. 
17  Be obedient to those who are taking the lead among you and be submissive, for they are keeping watch over you as those who will render an account, so that they may do this with joy and not with sighing, for this would be damaging to you.
So the GB have no proof that they have any authority and they deliberately do wrong. Yet you still want to follow them. OK so be it. 

There are. Some people think that Barbara Anderson was the only female in the Writing Department. She was not. There are some even now. They aren't the ones who write the study articles or the scripture-based articles in the Watchtower, but many of the Awake! articles are written by them from start to finish. When the "Insight" book was being prepared, over a hundred Bethelites were given assignments to take on various articles to update the "Aid" book. More than a dozen sisters were given these assignments too. Even while Barbara Anderson was in Writing there was another sister getting similar research assignments, after doing a good job on some "Insight" work. and research assignments often come with the assignment to write up a draft article about it that might get used with very few changes. This other sister got "fired" before Barbara Anderson left, and no sisters sat in the Writing Department, per se, for quite a while. (I don't know for sure how long, but it was a matter of years.) But this didn't last forever, and sisters have been back in the Writing Dept (officially as "Researchers") for years now.

I believe you should read further in Matt 24...to Matt 24:48-51
He said, “Listen to my words: When there are prophets of the Lord among you, I make myself known to them in visions or speak to them in dreams.”  Num 12:6
“‘In the last days, God says,
    I will pour out my Spirit on all people.
Your sons and daughters will prophesy,
    your young men will see visions,
    your old men will dream dreams.
18 Even on my servants, both men and women,
    I will pour out my Spirit in those days,
    and they will prophesy.”  Acts 2:17,18 
He said to me, “Son of man, stand up on your feet and I will speak with you.” 2 As he spoke to me, the Spirit entered me and set me on my feet, and I listened to the one who was speaking to me. 3 He said to me, “Son of man, I am sending you to the Israelites, to the rebellious pagans who have rebelled against me. The Israelites and their ancestors have transgressed against me to this day.  Ezek 2:1-3 
Instead, go to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. 7 As you go, proclaim: ‘The kingdom of heaven has come near.’  Matt 10:6,7 
“Then I was given a reed like a measuring rod. And the angel stood, saying, “Rise and measure the temple of God, the altar, and those who worship there. 2 But leave out the court which is outside the temple, and do not measure it, for it has been given to the Gentiles. And they will tread the holy city underfoot for forty-two months. 3 And I will give power to my two witnesses, and they will prophesy one thousand two hundred and sixty days, clothed in sackcloth.”  Rev 11:1-3
“The blessings of Jehovah God are upon you because of his loving-kindness to his beloved anointed remnant. Jehovah God dwells with you because his anointed are his visible temple. w56 11/15 pp. 696-702     
John 2:18-21;  1 Cor 3:16,17; 1 Pet 2:4-10; Eph 2:20-22  https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John+2%3A18-21%3B +1+Cor+3%3A16%2C17%3B+1+Pet+2%3A4-10%3B+Eph+2%3A20-22&version=CSB
Spiritual Israel are the anointed, the Temple.   Who are the spiritual “Gentiles” “treading” the temple? 
“Representing the royal priesthood (anointed)  are appointed elders, who serve in positions of responsibility in congregations of Jehovah’s people around the earth. These men deserve our respect and wholehearted support, whether they are of the anointed or not. Why? Because, through his holy spirit, Jehovah has appointed the older men to their positions.  
Rather than challenge their authority, we truly appreciate our hardworking elders! Their record of faithful service, often over many decades, inspires our trust. 
“Loyally Submit to Godly Authority” wt 02/8/1 pp. 9-14
 “My hand will oppose the prophets who see false visions and speak deceptive divinations. They won’t be included with the council of my people, nor will they be entered into the registry of Israel’s house or enter Israel’s land. Then you’ll know that I am the Lord God”  Eze 13:9
(Rev 7:4)
… And I will give power to my two witnesses, and they will prophesy one thousand two hundred and sixty days, clothed in sackcloth.”  Rev 11:3 
“The descendants are obstinate and hardhearted. I am sending you to them, and you must say to them, ‘This is what the Lord God says.’ 5 Whether they listen or refuse to listen—for they are a rebellious house—they will know that a prophet has been among them. Eze 2:1-5 
So when they persecute you in one city, flee to another. I can guarantee this truth: Before you have gone through every city in Israel, the Son of Man will come.   Matt 10:23 
Rev 21:8 - But the cowards, faithless, detestable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars—their share will be in the lake that burns with fire and sulfur, which is the second death.”
 Big letters for emphasis.  

@Anna Quote : I am sorry, there was no one announced at our hall for such a long time so I don't know how exactly the announcement is made anymore. I can assure you though it will be known that you are no longer one of Jehovah's Witnesses because you do not agree with the organization. I remember someone was announced years ago, and everyone knew it was because he had differing views, and not because he had committed immorality or something like that. (End quote.)
I was wise enough to tell a few brothers what i was about to do, so at least they would know the truth. I gave only one of them the reason, but told others i was 'resigning'. However here is the stupidity of things shunning causes :- 
A man, a JW that i had helped many times as he was over 80 years old, though he is quite physically active.  Whilst i was still a brother i sold him a motorised bicycle. We had an agreement that if he decide he didn't really want it, that i would buy it back from him. 
A long time had passed since this business agreement. Then suddenly my wife has a text message on her mobile phone (cell phone to you guys i think). This being after i left the Org. The message is from this man, asking her to talk to me about me buying back this motorised bicycle. 
Two points here : -
1. The man should never have been given my wife's personal phone number, so whoever gave him the number was doing wrong.
2. It was a business agreement between the man and myself, not involving my wife. And my wife knew nothing about it and was not interested in getting involved in it. 
My wife gave me the information after getting over the shock of receiving the message, and I could see she was genuinely upset by him having her number. 
I emailed him quite politely telling him how my wife and i felt about it. I also agreed that if he contact me personally I would buy the item back from him.
Now, the questions must be, Why was he too frightened to contact me directly first time ? And, why has he not replied to my email ?
I know the answers of course.   He is frightened of being told off by the Elders of the congregation, for contacting me. 
I know this man well enough to know he is not frightened of me personally. And i know that we once had a really good friendship. It proves my point, that people are frightened of the Elders. 
There is a second case proving the same thing, but i will make it brief.
One of the brothers i told that I was resigning, visited me the Wednesday evening before the Thursday announcement. He promised me he would call back in 6 months time to see how i was doing. He has not been near my house since that Wednesday evening. Why ? Well once again it just proves my point, but in his case he has also proved himself a liar. He has broken his word. All because of fear of men, the Elders.
 
 

Brother Jackson said a lot of things, including basically admitting that the GB are not the only spokesman God is using. 
Governing Body Unwittingly Condemned
Mr. Stewart then asked pointedly if the Governing Body views itself as Jehovah’s spokespeople on earth.
Brother Jackson does not vacillate this time, but states, “That, I think, would seem to be quite presumptuous, to say that we are the only spokesperson that God is using.”
With those words, Brother Jackson is unwittingly labeling the Governing Body as presumptuous. Here is the official position of the Governing Body with regards to its role before God. [Italics added]
“Jehovah gives us sound counsel through his Word and through his organization, using the publications provided by “the faithful and discreet slave.” (Matthew 24:45; 2 Timothy 3:16) How foolish to reject good advice and insist on our own way! We “must be swift about hearing” when Jehovah, “the One teaching men knowledge,” counsels us through his channel of communication.” (w03 3/15 p. 27 ‘The Lips of Truth Will Endure Forever’)
“That faithful slave is the channel through which Jesus is feeding his true followers in this time of the end.” (w13 7/15 p. 20 par. 2 “Who Really Is the Faithful and Discreet Slave?”)
Theocratic appointments come from Jehovah through his Son and God’s visible earthly channel, “the faithful and discreet slave” and its Governing Body.” (w01 1/15 p. 16 par. 19 Overseers and Ministerial Servants Theocratically Appointed)
However that 'faithful slave' and the GB are one and the same now, as the rest of the Anointed are pushed to one side.
So there you have it. As I've said before the scripture at Luke 14 v 11 
For everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, and whoever humbles himself will be exalted.”

I no longer attend meetings due to the Child Abuse problem earthwide in the JW Org. I left the Org in January of this year. I could not be part of what I'd found about. I could not encourage other people in to such dangerous situations. 
If i had stayed I would have passed on information to other congregants, then I would have been disfellowshipped for 'Causing a division within the congregation'. It was better for me to leave of my own choice and be free to use my own voice to tell anyone that would listen.
I could have stayed and become completely inactive, a Jehovah's bystander. But that would have silenced me, and by doing so, make me part of the problem. In my opinion if a person knows of danger but keeps quiet then they are almost as bad as the ones causing the danger. 
Many here say I am giving false alarms, but we each have to weigh up the situation and deal with it as we think best. 
 

I think you have misunderstood my question brother...I just dont understand why Brother Jackson advised the Australian Government to make it mandatory in every state to report....why don’t we just do that ourselves..worldwide...
I also think we should be allowed to ask such honest question without being accused of engaging in conspiracy theories...
I totally back you as far as the great deceiver being at work on the internet..causing divisions and doubts amongs Jehovah’s people...there is no forum on the internet that is safe...

John here is the rest of my reply. I will try and be as concise as possible
The instance I gave you was from the 80’s when there was much more leeway in how some congregational matters were handled. The DOCUMENT we have now on the website  enables anyone to check if things are being handled the right way or not. I printed mine out.
 
For practicalities sake it makes sense that only a handful of people make up the FDS. Anointed ones are scattered all over the world and it would be hard for them to contribute in any meaningful way unless they were all present together, which is impossible. None of the anointed are above another anointed and nor is anyone anointed above someone who isn’t. Anyone who asks, can receive holy spirit as helper. The difference between one who is anointed and one who isn’t is only in their final destination. Faithful and discreet slave is not a title, merely a function that someone has to perform. The qualifications are no different to the qualifications of an Elder, except perhaps these men have a longer period of service before they are elected to be on the governing body.
I am not quite sure what you mean by that. I wouldn’t know what the GB thought and whether they pretended something.  I cannot read their thoughts....
Every human that has ever lived has been fallible. Every human that has been God’s true servant has been fallible. Countless Bible accounts testify to this fact. The only time a human has been able to say something that has been infallible was when under the influence of holy spirit, but ONLY in Bible times. This kind of privilege served its purpose for writing the Bible and for establishing the Christian congregation. Since then the holy spirit does not act in the same way. There is no miraculous interception, nor any inspiration. One simple reason is that everything we need is already in the pages of the Bible. The right food at the right time really is the presentation of the right scriptures at the right time. Not someone’s ideas. Yes, the information comes from God because the Bible is from God. But interpretation or the understanding of it is subject to the fallibility of man. Especially when it comes to prophecies.  Br. Jackson was asked about the operation of the holy spirit during the ARC hearing. Here is a short excerpt from the transcript:     
Q.   By what mechanism would you understand God's spirit to direct your decisions?
Br. Jackson:   Well, what I mean by that is, by prayer and using our constitution, God's word, we would go through the scriptures and see if there was any biblical principle at all that would influence our decision - and it could be that in our initial discussions there was something that maybe we were missing and then in another discussion that would come to light.  So we would view that as God's spirit   motivating us because we believe the Bible is God's word and came by means of holy spirit.
However, there are fundamental doctrines or truths which are clear and simple. It is these fundamental truths that have been the backbone of our faith and these have never changed. As long as we are clear on those fundamental truths, the other stuff is just frills that we may or may not change, or that we may or may not understand, or even personally consider important for the time being.
This is the paragraph you must be quoting from: Gods Kingdom Rules page 101: “The Bible Students long acknowledged that Christmas has pagan roots and that Jesus was not born on December 25. Zion’s Watch Tower of December 1881 stated: “Millions were brought into the church from Paganism. But the change was mostly in name, for the pagan priests became christian priests and the pagan holidays came to be called by christian names—Christmas being one of these holidays.” In 1883, under the title “When Was Jesus Born?” the Watch Tower reasoned that Jesus was born about the beginning of October.* Yet, the Bible Students did not at the time clearly see the need to stop celebrating Christmas. It continued to be celebrated even by members of the Brooklyn Bethel family. After 1926, however, things began to change. Why?
 As a result of careful, closer scrutiny of the subject, the Bible Students came to realize that the origin of Christmas and the practices associated with it actually dishonor God. 
It seems that they did make the necessary changes as soon as they realized. Prior to that they couldn’t have been convinced enough to take the decisive action necessary. I would hope I was given some leeway and patience if I took a little longer to making adjustments in my lifestyle. Life is progressive, experiences are progressive, knowledge is progressive. Rarely do things happen right from the get go.
What is one person’s positive action is another person’s holding back. There is no one size that fits all cases. Yes, I agree, some cases were woefully mishandled, and these are the cases that are reported on in the media. Other cases were handled well. I am sure you are aware that “successful” cases do not get reported in the media. Yes, most active JWs were unaware of a problem unless they were directly involved and/or unless they had children. Many JWs were under the impression that this cannot happen in our org. despite publications which said that indeed these things CAN happen in the org.  I explained the gist of the reasoning “we are better than anyone else” in my previous post.
 
The intentions are in Acts 3:19
If I understand correctly, your main concern is that people are aware that you left of your own volition because you no longer agree with some of the ways things are done in the organization. You are right, reasons for disfellowshipping are not given, out of regard for the dissfelliwshipped person and their family. But if you have disassociated yourself, and the announcement is made that "John Buttler has disassociated himself and therefore is no longer one of Jehovah's Witnesses" then people will know it was because of something you did not agree with, and not because you necessarily committed some moral wrong. If people ignore you, then it is because you are no longer of "their sort" (1John 2:19) and will view you as a man of the nations, because you are no longer a part of the Christian congregation.
I am sure this magazine is intended for those who have “drifted” and become inactive as Jehovah's Witnesses. They are still considered JW to a certain extend.
Not sure what you mean by that. Do you mean organized?

This statement, and indeed the thread itself, seems to depend on the rather narrow view that prophecy is solely limited to fortelling future events, in other words, history written in advance.
This is an unecessary limitation, as the word in a biblical context refers to an inspired message as a revelation of divine will and purpose or the proclamation thereof. Prophecy may be an inspired moral teaching, an expression of a divine command or judgment, or a declaration of something to come.
Paul's words on prophecy make clear that "the one who prophesies builds up and encourages and consoles men by his speech." 1Cor.14:3. He does not say "foretells future events".
Adam served as God's initial "prophet" in that he would have made known Jehovah's requirements to Eve   He did not remain faithful to Jehovah. Others "prophesied" later, such as Lamech, and Noah. Abraham, the first one referred to as a "prophet" is not noted for foretelling the future specifically, although the promise of the "seed" is recorded as having been spoken to him.
Whilst it is clear then, that the term "prophet" refers to a specific role for a human, the specific fortelling of events is not intrinsic. Neither is it so that every utterance from a prophet, whether written, spoken, or mimed, (as in the case of Ezekiel), would be moved by God's spirit or "inspired", or, indeed, could not be subject to error.
"All Scripture is inspired of God and beneficial for teaching, for reproving, for setting things straight, for disciplining in righteousness" 2Tim.3:16. This message alone is a prophecy in itself. The commission of Jesus at Matt.28:18-20 in itself is an appointment of all true Christians to a prophet-like role with regard to all nations , and Jehovah will hold all truly dedicated servants accountable on that.
Anointed Christians serve in a "prophet-like" role in their commission outlined by Peter at 1Peter 2:9. Their governing body serves similarly, Matt.24:45-47. But in that role, it is not incumbent that any utter what could be described as "inspired utterences", or that ANY of their "forecasts" or predictions on world events should specifically come true in all detail. Even those that do would not evidence divine "inspiration".
All that is necessary is for them to proclaim Jehovah's inspired moral teaching, an expression of a divine command or judgment, or a declaration of something to come, as found in "All Scripture", and to hold faithfully to it as far as humanly possible, admitting mistakes, adjusting and correcting error when found. And as in the past, they answer to Jehovah and not to men in the faithful discharge of their responsibilities.
One thing for sure is that "the Sovereign Lord Jehovah will not do a thing unless he has revealed his confidential matter to his servants the prophets" Amos 3:7. So it is in our interests to listen to those who serve as Jehovah's prophets, (in the correct understanding of the term).
I like the observation of Richard Feynman on this: " We never are definitely right, we can only be sure we are wrong." But I think this statement needs a little modification in the words of Jesus at Matt.11:19: "All the same, wisdom is proved righteous by its works." ?

Hi!
This sound like new way of expression, some kind of introducing new, different way of talking about same issue by GB.
Instead "we are inspirited" he say "we are motivated".
 
Tomorrow, perhaps we will hear not only this "we are not inspired", but also
" we are not motivated"  (we are currently indisposed)
:))))

To be fair .... this is the Achilles Heel of ALL shamans, witch doctors, snake oil salesmen,  priests, clergy and other assorted religious leaders.  
Yes, the WTB&TS has always been wrong about everything they have ever tried to prophesy .... but then again .... so has everybody else.
... nothing to see here, folks ... move along ... these are not the droids you want.
In the history of civilization ... there have NEVER been any exceptions ... and there aren't any now !
This sort of thing ALWAYS, without exception, occurs when the Leadership starts dressing well, sleep warm every night, start accumulating real estate, managing huge piles of free money, and self-appoint themselves as the Laodicean Messengers of God.
If prophesy was easy ... In the early 1970's, I might have bought stock in Apple Computer or the Bubba Gump Shrimp Company.
..... Or I would have won the recent 1.68 billion dollar Lottery.
 

Wt. 1964/10/1 - "Those who do not read can hear, for God has on earth today a PROPHETLIKE ORGANIZATION, just as he did in the days of the early Christian congregation."
Wt. 972/4/1 -  "Of course, it is easy to say that this group acts as a 'prophet' of God. It is another thing to prove it. The only way that this can be done is to review the record. What does it show?" 
How do you think the prophetic claims are made?  Who voices them?  Someone other than the GB?  Their "prophesy" is not inspired by Holy Spirit, but through demonic "inspiration".  
Review the record.  It shows nothing but failed prophesy.  

You could help by staying....and just being there for ones who are hurting...I’ve heard good solid brothers tell it like it is.....it’s refreshing and up building .....perhaps organization isnt the best word to use ..I dont know when that was introduced....Russell didn’t introduce it ....I think of us as a big worldwide congregation...just like a huge family with all its troubles and problems ..tears and joys and smiles...
i remember a brother once drew a line on the board...it started high and as the line travelled across the board it went into a downward spiral ....he said...that was the world.."he then asked us...how do you think Jehovah’s people are travelling.....he then drew a line..above the worlds declining line ....but it to went into a spiral downward...it remained above the worlds spiraling...but we still went down..just at a slower pace to that of the world.
it was a sobering thought for all of us.....don’t expect too much from any of us....it really boils down to just you and Jehovah....
 
 

So according to you if you speak of someone, make him known and give information of something that is to reveal and or profess support what does make it to you, Butler?
I posted an image a few response back, you were the one who posted about Mr. Gardener a few months ago the same Mr. Gardner who took part in disrupting the JW Church that Evo goes to.
Apparently so, but aside from that I strongly encourage you to take up what I said and adhere to Child Abuse Prevention sources, of which I posted to you before. For if I have to be honest, abuse and neglect of children is far greater in the UK, than it is to us here.
If your Father can teach you to do good, do the same to another who is lower than you, younger than you so he will be wise just as your Father has made you wise.
For if we do not take this stance, the next thing you know such ones will succumb to violence, they will succumb to other vile things and will become a potential victim to an abuser. Play your part the best way you can or only remain to be the very obstacle that is preventing those who do take such things seriously.
Srecko Sostar continued to dodge the very fact that I had used primarily Child Abuse and Neglect Services own information against him, as with Bible Principles - that he himself asked for, so I encourage do what he cannot do, read and understand what is being conveyed about better solutions.
After all that information that I linked is the real deal, I am just a centimeter away from posting actual PSAs that would pretty much defeat the deception Srecko poses in regards to child abuse prevention and his sly misinterpretation of my words.
If the Bible says we are to teach ourselves to be wisdom we do it, in turn we teach our children to be wise, just as both Mary and Joseph taught Jesus the very Law and practices of the Jews he was born under.

Okay Billy  the kid...let me make one thing clear to you...I have not overlooked the massive amount of work the society has done in educating all about this problem...in fact I use it.......you are very self righteous and judgmental...and I can only assume still a bit of a kid...where you and I are different is I listen to these so called disgruntled women....and men.....who have been raped ......I cannot even beleive you made such a clearly chauvinistic comment...but that does show your immaturity..so I’m giving you some leeway to leave your short pants you are wearing and will offer you patience to grow Into long pants ..thus show a bit of emotional maturity...
Many are confused and have doubts....we need to speak consolingly to those who have doubts....I can see on this thread there are a lot of troublemakers who will not listen to reason...they are here to cause division and trouble....but you do not help a lot as you come over rather pious...and self righteous......and that’s only gives them fuel brother...
I advocate for trying to understand both sides of the coin..but always with Jehovah’s love and  compassion...but there does come  time where one has To draw a line in the sand With out right trouble  makers.
you have stated some good points in your comment brother...but you don’t have it all correct either..and nor do I....but at least I know that...
Those disgruntled women were once little girls who were raped...and angry men were little boys who were once raped...some over long periods of time...
They are in EVERY religion and organization world wide...most don’t even come to the attention of our elders...
I Thess 4,,,is good advice,,,for both of us ..so let us both stop continting with this activism.
 

You found a different Harvinder Singh.
Harvinder Singh  University of Birmingham, Philosophy, Theology and Religion, Postgraduate Student    Theology and Religion Studied English Literature and Language at The University of Leicester. I am currently studying the MA in Religion, Politics and Society at The University of Birmingham. I am particularly Interested in researching New World Religions (NRMs), particularly Jehovah's Witnesses, the Latter Day Saint movement of Restorationist Christianity, and Scientology. Supervisors: Prof. Nicholas Adams It's one of many papers he has written. This latest supports what you said earlier:
Here is the full list of his current contributions to academia.com
How have the Jehovah's Witnesses adapted child safeguarding practices and guidance to local circumstances in the United States of America, England and Australia The WatchTower Bible and Tract Society of Pennsylvania, or as they are more commonly known as Jeh... more     Bookmark
Download 178 ViewsTop 3% How should a responsible journalist approach reporting on the subject of religion? This is an assignment that I had produced for the postgraduate taught module Religion in Contempo... more     Bookmark
Download 49 Views Are governments obliged to intervene if Human Rights are violated in other countries? When and on what grounds? This is an assignment that I had written for the postgraduate taught module, Human Rights (14515)... more     Bookmark
Download 40 Views1.3 PaperRank What is the most convincing explanation for the emergence of the Islamic State of Iraq and Syria? This is an assignment that I have completed for the 'Understanding and Countering Radical Islamic... more     Bookmark
Download 115 Views How has the United States of America countered ISIS? (Poster) This is a poster that I had produced for the module: Understanding and Countering Radical Islamic... more     Bookmark
Download 26 Views Critical review of two empirical studies This is a critical review of two empirical studies which are relevant towards my dissertation inv... more     Bookmark
Download 20 Views Identify and evaluate the main challenges ISIS (the so-called Islamic State) poses to the secular international system? This is an assignment that I have written for the post graduate taught module: Religion in Contem... more     Bookmark
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there is no nullification anywhere, John 1:3 states clearly that Jesus created everything that has been created. This does not make any scripture mistaken, only the interpretation made by some. 
The confusion is there because those who are so opposed to the idea that God can do anything and be everywhere. There is a common mistake that people have in regards to the trinity, they only have heard a slight idea of it but profess to know it has to be wrong. 
Michael? hardly. Michael is and was and will for ever be Michael, not Jesus nor the Son of God. This notion of Michael being Jesus is not found within scripture, it is made up by men. If you'd like, start another thread on this topic and I'll discuss it. 
I have no problem with Jesus sharing in the creation work, or having been used and an instrument. John 1:3 makes it clear that He did create everything that has ever been created. So it fits. 

Nowhere does in the bible does it state Jesus is God because the verse tells you of what he met by the Temple, which is the Temple of his Body. For if Jesus was indeed God, it would discredited the very fact that in other verses it is made known that God also dwells in True Christians as he dwells in Jesus, the fullness of deity that dwells in him and them, according to the verses.
The additional verses listed above, several of them, if not most, cross-references with each other regarding that passage, not only does it show that it I.D.s both the Father and Son, it shows you clearly that God had a role in Jesus' resurrection, for the Bible speaks of God as being the life-giver, and in giving life he does to the Son, and giving the authority and power to the Son so that he too can resurrect a great multitude of people and I agree with what was said to Jesus in the same gospel, that whatever he asks from God, God will give to him.
That is understandable, but the Bible does not show anywhere that the Son is El Shaddai, the Son was sent [Shaliach] by El Shaddai. It is wiser to take in what the Bible says and what the followers of the Christ taught, in turn, taught to the people, the church.
That being said, in Trinity doctrine, the Father is not Jesus and Jesus is not the Father. For one to say Jesus raised himself is also to say the Father did not raise Jesus because Jesus is not the Father, or perhaps to say the Father raised Jesus is also to say that Jesus did not raise himself.

To profess that Jesus raised himself from the dead is also to say it was not the Triune God who raised Jesus since Jesus is not the Triune being and the Triune being is not Jesus, for what it lands in another factor of confusion when a claim is made that Jesus raised himself and then insist that two other persons raised that same "himself". 

Which makes the problem an even bigger fire is that it puts one in a position to believe in 4 that different identities raised this particular himself:
 
(1) the Father (2) the Son (3) the Holy Spirit (4) the Triune God Resulting in such ones who believe somehow Jesus is El Shaddai, YHWH, they are put in a situation that renders them unable to see or acknowledge their own contradictory confusion.
Another factor is that YHWH himself, is incorruptible, not like a man or a son of man, and only YHWH, all of which the Bible makes it clear of several times, furthermore, is identified as the Father, as well as God, and by the Law, this is stated as well, something of which I believe I stated before.
Anytime, for the Bible and the context that comes from Scripture is always key- nothing cannot be left out and everything must be taken to understand the apostolic church's position - which lines up with that age.
I never dismiss Scriptures, if I had, it would defeat the utmost respect and practice of Biblical Hermeneutics in my case, after all, I respect the verse and passage by making use of the cross-references and as with anyone who practices Biblical Hermeneutics, all things must be taken into account and anything pertaining to how the passage connects harmonious with anything pertaining to an event read in the Bible, that includes all verses that line up with that time-frame of Christ Jesus and the meaning of what he said, furthermore, there is no contradiction, granted that among the source gospel accounts, John's gospel was the unique one, if I may add. The specific account in John 2 (the passage in question being 13-22).
Now, the claim here regarding John 2:19 to some means Jesus raised himself. For after reading this without further study and or ignoring the cross-references that brings forth the context, one would read into it as is and look no further after that. This brings the reason of such ones who don't see the problem with their claim; [God the Father raised Jesus from the dead], [the Holy Spirit raised Jesus from the dead], and [Jesus raised himself from the dead]. 

When context is taken seriously and the references, it is clear of who raised Jesus from the Dead to fulfill what was said, as well as what was in use by means of it, and as we can see when Jesus actually died, he was actually dead for that time when he was later resurrected.

To believe that all 3 persons of Trinity doctrine raised Jesus from the dead, therefore, it is concluded to such ones that the Triune God raised Jesus from the dead and here is where the confusion manifests in of itself.

Outside of the realm of confusion, as the Bible itself professes when context is put forth in application.

Unfortunately, people who take this claim seriously without application of context don't always understand that they aren't making any sense at times. In the doctrine of the Trinity, the Father is not the Triune being, the Son is not the Triune being, and the Holy Spirit is not the Triune being, and conversely, the Triune being is not the Father, the Triune being is not the Son, and the Triune being is not the Holy Spirit; to say Jesus raised himself is therefore to say the Triune being did not raise Jesus because Jesus is not the Triune being in Trinity doctrine or to say the Triune being raised Jesus is to say that Jesus did not raise himself since the Triune being is not the Jesus, for the Father raised Jesus from the dead in addition with Jesus raised Jesus from the dead and the Holy Spirit raised Jesus from the dead - that amounts to the Triune God raising Jesus from the dead, granted that Jesus himself actually did perish, in this case actually died, or as the Bible says - expired.
What some fail to see is that if they make such a claim, they can't say the Father raised Jesus from the dead nor can they say Jesus raised Jesus from the dead nor can they say the Holy Spirit raised Jesus from the dead because any one of these 3 is not the Triune God in their own doctrine of the Trinity.
Simply put, to claim the Triune God raised Jesus contradicts the claim that Jesus raised himself. In the Doctrine of the Trinity, you simply cannot say that the Triune God raised Jesus from the dead and also insist Jesus raised himself from the dead, and hope to make any kind of sense whatsoever because Jesus is not the Triune God, and the Triune God is not Jesus. The Triune God raised Jesus from the dead or Jesus raised himself from the dead. Therefore, in the doctrine of the Trinity, you can't claim both without contradicting yourself in the process.
And yet when God speaks, he wants us to understand His Word, and but forth the application, and his own Son speaks God's Word, hence Shalich Principle in play on Jesus' part.

All things should be taken into consideration.
John 2:19 does not amount to any evidence that Jesus is God at all (especially if you take in the meaning of his words along with the references), he speaks of the Temple of His Body, and the very fact Jesus, while on earth was corruptible, capable of dying and has died, thus showing you that he was like us of mankind, who was indeed born a Jew into the Law (Galatians 4:4).
The next factor is the fact that Jesus profess Shema, God cannot profess Shema because he is the one who gave this Law to Moses in which he and the people followed well into Paul and Jesus' day and into present day - us. And the other regarding Jesus being a mediator between 2 parties [God and the disciples he spoke regarding the Covenant with in regards to Spiritual Israel].

In the Bible we only see the Father identified as God, many times, and we see people who know, even demons and the fallen one himself, that Jesus is God's Son, and Jesus himself is well aware of the one who sent him and the Will of whom he is doing as well as the one who raised him from the Dead, thus making him the Firstborn out of the Dead and the First of the Firstfruits.
 
There is only one God, not three.
Well I suggest you make more research regarding the Bible and not wait around for Judgement. Just as when Jesus was a child who observe, recite and read the Old Testament, learned of who the God of Israel is and what he had done, for us today we must do the same, and read the word daily and take everything into consideration as with the cross-references and context that comes from the Bible.
for John 1:3, it is also best to carefully consider John 1:5, the Light shines in the darkness, it is obviously apparent that these words are referring to the ministry of Jesus  as seen in John 3:19-21, 8:12, 9:5 and 12:35-36, granted the very first chapter of John is John's Introductory. Moving into verse 4, we also read that life was in the Word and that life was the Light of men. It should be taken into consideration here that John is not referring to the Genesis act of creation at this point. The true Light which enlightens every man was presently coming into the world (John 1:9). The last part of verse 3, in connection with verse 4 indicates that life and light came into existence by means of the Word. (Colossians 1:15, 16).

With this information in view, it is obviously apparent that John 1:3 is not referring to the Genesis act of creation but to all the things that came to be through the proclamation of the Word, through the ministry of Jesus. For this reason, Jesus cried, It is finished (it has been accomplished) later down the road when he was killed by means of Crucifixion; just as we find God was finished all His works in the Genesis act of creation, the same regarding the one sent by means of Shaliach Principle. Jesus' ministry was the beginning of the new creation of God, whereas our risen Lord, Christ Jesus, is the first of the firstfruits of that new creation (as well as the one Firstborn out of death), the beginning of the creation of God, mainly when it can be understood what the new earth and new heavens entails regarding said new creation.
Indeed, but the Temple in question is His Body, the Body of our Lord, Christ Jesus, in turn the Father's Temple due to the very fact God does his Purpose and Will through his Son. That temple of which they were thinking about was The Temple of Herod.
Yes, the Holy Spirit is mention in both verses, but you have one instance regarding the Christ regarding him being risen on the 3rd day and the other regarding those who are ministers. Because the Holy Spirit is mention in both instances, does not equate the two into being the same event, despite Holy Spirit being one of 90 or so occurrences in various instances in the Greek New Testament.
If so why state Jesus raised himself when the Bible itself has made it clear he had expired?
You sure? Can you show me Acts 13:2 references regarding John 2:19? Regarding my response to you is as followed: [Acts 13:2 focuses on such ones ministering for God. The references for this verse points to Ac 9:15 and 1 Timothy 2:7, even while outlined nothing points back in references to Jesus being risen from the tomb....], I do not see Acts 13:2 pointing back to John 2:19 - anywhere, even while outlined.
https://www.blueletterbible.org/esv/jhn/2/1/t_corr_999019 https://www.openbible.info/labs/cross-references/search?q=John+2%3A19 https://biblehub.com/john/2-19.htm The only verses Acts 13:2 cross-references to and points back to even in outline form is
Deuteronomy 10:8, 1 Samuel 2:11, Daniel 9:3, Matthew 9:38, Luke 2:37, 1 Timothy 2:7 (as mentioned), 2 Timothy 1:11, Acts 8:29, 9:15 (as mentioned), 22:21, 14:26, Romans 1:1, 1 Corinthians 12:11, Galatians 1:15, 2:8-9, Ephesians 3:7, Hebrews 5:4, etc and dozens more, including the ones above amounting to a total of 41 verses (with 1 Chronicles 16:37-43 bringing the count up by 47 verses).

That being said, even regarding Acts 13:2, both John 2:19 and Romans 18:11, is nowhere to be found, even in cross-references without outline in the Bible itself does not say and it only points back to the 2 verses already mentioned, granted that both instances were and are entirely different, despite the Spirit of God being mentioned in both instances.
And the bible informs us the Christ had expired and God had a hand in his resurrection.

You tend to use the scripture written by John, who learn by the time he penned this gospel the true nature of Christ. And he truthfully states that Jesus was WITH God, not that he WAS God, right? At the very beginning verse 1, in the beginning the Word was WITH God. Verse 2 then says again WITH God. John calls the Word ' an only-begotten son'. And how could this person do what verse 18 says? " who is at the Father's side"? At verse 29, right before being baptized how did John the Baptizer identify him? As God? No! The Lamb of God! And he was sent by One above him, his Father. And at verse 34, the apostle John writes and calls Jesus, 'this one is the Son of God.' It was only after Jesus died and returned to heaven there was confusion about who,he was. His apostles knew he was the Son of God. The demons knew he was the Son of God. Gabriel the angel who announced his birth knew he was the Son of God. The angels who sang praises at his birth also knew. Yet, we now are confused following a teaching that he never supported. A lie that smears his Father's name that which he said he came to make known. Yes, this is a discussion that will only be made if one has a humble heart to listen to the truth of scripture. Not the treacherous things of ones own heart.
Rockafeller was a well financed man and many structures are attributed to him, but how many did he actually build? But by his will of money they were erected through construction companies, architects and the rest. It happens daily around the world, yet we can not agree that the Almighty God could delegate such to,his Son, which is how the scriptures read. Having Christ sitting at his right side until the time is right for him to rule in the kingdom over the earth. It is there, many will not see. And as you said you have made your choice. Being told that it was a mistake.... it is! One other thing, none of Christ's parables spoke of him as God, but as the Son in all of them, not the Father. He was to be subjective again as he was in the beginning as Paul wrote in Corinthians. Jehovah God would be the One over all even Jesus, not being him, or vice versa. Yes, it is true the Bible does not contradict itself, all scripture are inspired for setting things straight. But many still abuse them for their own agenda. Please keep reading it, you just may find what it really teaches.