This is a quote from the original poster who subsequently asks for the opinion of others.. The opinion of others can only be Yes, No, or Maybe. As this is a UK issue, there is a moral, not legal, duty, for an informed third party to report such matters to a suitable authority. In view of the intimate knowledge this alleger claims to have, the option was suggested that they discuss the matter anonymously with Childline on a Freephone number 0800 1111.
What is particularly odious about the whole exchange is that the party in question is vociferously complaining and making allegations about others who, in their opinion, "cover up" such cases.
Consider:
An allegation has been made.The accuser has given their opinion as above.
Others have expressed their varied opinions.
An option that would report the matter to a suitable authority, anonymously, has been given.
Yet the alleger continues to dither, continues to accuse others of the same moral hypocrisy.
The alleged potential for further harm remains.
This person, regardless of status, is appearing to behave like an active part of the problem they are continually complaining about. Why is there even a discussion on the matter?
This is a ridiculous allegation.
There is no promoting of the UN in these articles any more than the apostle Paul promoted the Stoic poet Aratus in his speech on the Areopagus at Acts 17:28.
These WT articles merely reference the attempts of the UN to promote beneficial strategies for the human family, and highlight it's failure to accomplish what can only be achieved through the administration of Jehovah's kingdom, the only viable government for this earth.
These assertions, and others like them, are filling up the measure of the activities of Haman (Esther 3:8).
Thanks. I believe you. Should have known. I've heard rumors go wild before. Apostates who were dismissed in the Spring of 1980 were all suddenly supposed to have been homosexual swingers and wife-swappers. If there had been only 2 baby seals in an imaginary Bethel Zoo, I'm sure that eye-witnesses would seen them taking turns clubbing 50 of them.
Yes, probably they were some of the more creepy Bethelites, of whom there were a few I met in the 70s.
My recollection of Edgar, who I met just after I was baptised, was of a rather friendly, polite, little, old gentleman. He had quite a soft voice and a rather eccentric way of speaking, almost like a stammer, and a bit of a twitchy eye, like a kind of squint that would intermittently assert itself. I suppose that might have made him a bit "unfashionable" along with his early '50s dress sense. I knew nothing then of his background, that he was one of the anointed, started his Bible study in 1914, Bethel from 1926 etc.
In the ensuing years he visited us at home or we met up with him at Bethel when he keenly showed me round the various printing presses and how to operate the linotype press as in the photo. Jack Barr was working next to him at the time. He was anything but "creepy". In fact, he gave me a great deal of encouragement in my most formative years coming into Jehovah's organisation. I lost touch with him late '70s and actually do not know when he died. He was in his 80s when I last saw him.
I found out later that he was known by the brothers as one of the "three wise men" along with Pryce Hughes and Ewart Chitty because of the lead they took at Assemblies and Conventions during the 40s and 50s.
I knew him as an unassuming, kindly and encouraging gentleman, with one or two "minor" physical oddities that provided food for behind-the-back ridicule on the part of some Bethelite "creeps".
Like @@James Thomas Rook Jr., I cannot think that a politician as wiley and experienced as Mr Putin would use the word "persecute" in connection with his own government's activity. As suggested above, the word "prosecute" makes far more sense and indeed a statement as quoted:
is no less an indictment on the persecution (intended use) of Jehovah's Witnesses in Russis and is really more credible.
Sorry about that. Sometimes he inspires me!
Some more trivialities:
The "Frank and Ernest" comic strip actually has billed itself as the "Hot Dog Comic Strip" because of a long-running hot dog theme, and these, of course, have nothing to do with the Watchtower's old radio show on WBBR called "Frank and Ernest." But it is true that this radio show moved over from the Watchtower's Bible Students to "Dawn Publishing" in 1928 or so where it kept going, to become one of the longest running radio shows ever.
Some, including Anglican clergymen, believe that animals only die because of Adam and Eve's rebellion and that in the future animals will also live forever as they think they did in Eden. Some of these also believe that animals will be resurrected, regardless of the possibility of us being nose-deep in gerbils before long. They base it on Romans 8:21-22.
JTR: I agree with you here. If you look at the entire meeting, the word "prosecute" was used in the translation a few of the other times, even in similar contexts. Judicial prosecution was already the topic here in nearly every case discussed, but the overall topic is a wider context than the auto-translator AI looks at. The fact that the name of a minority was used in the sentence, "Jehovah's Witnesses," and that the word "Christians" was in the immediate context, this is what probably triggered the translation, "persecute" instead of "prosecute."
Of course, this is still a very important admission as @Outta Here has said, and it's in line with what you were thinking about Putin being the one to get it straightened out, if it reaches to a high enough priority. There were several interesting admissions in the meeting, and Putin comes across as very professional, careful, knowledgeable and "wiley." He is just defensive enough to protect himself from various questionable decisions by judges, admits problems with some laws, understands some of the PR issues with the rest of the world, etc. But he also doesn't commit to overturn questionable actions, and doesn't want to give in too much, to avoid the impression, for example, that future amnesty can be counted on, based on past or current amnesty.
The more of this information the better!
What a colossal task to keep this whole logistical juggernaut moving and yet still keep the preaching work, and the shepherding of the flock, to the fore!
For the picture with the dog, my guess would be Little Rock, Arkansas, USA, since that's where Travelers Field was. Also, it says Little Rock, Ark., right under Travelers Field. (And one of the signs in the background says "Arkansas Carpet and Furniture" which existed in Little Rock, AK., at either 6th and Main, or 709-715 Main St. in Little Rock.)
So 404 of 489 - this is it. That’s how many terrorist organizations we have in the Russian Federation. Thus, I would like to express the hope that the anti-extremist legislation will, let's say, be moderated in accordance with the requirements of society and in accordance with the real level of crime.
Because everyone has more or less understood that these searches for pictures on social networks and the initiation of cases on this issue - this does not contribute to strengthening anything, it does not correspond to any state interests, it does not prevent any terrorist acts.
As we can see, when, unfortunately, this kind of thing happens, these are people who did not follow these lists, who did not come into the view of law enforcement agencies, because, of course, they do not post pictures on VKontakte, they do not communicate among themselves in open communities. They coordinate their actions completely differently.
Thank.
V.Putin: Thank you very much.
Ekaterina Mikhailovna, I am very pleased that the questions, rather sharp questions, were raised precisely by you - an employee of the Institute of Social Sciences under the President of the Russian Federation.
E.Shulman: Yes, I am now twice under the President of the Russian Federation, both at the place of work and in social activities.
V.Putin: See, everything is the same.
And they require careful consideration, all the questions you raised.
Regarding Jehovah's Witnesses. Probably, we can, and even should at some point, be much more liberal to representatives of various religious sects, but we should not forget that our society does not consist solely of religious sects. 90 percent of the citizens of the Russian Federation, or so, consider themselves Orthodox Christians. We have three more practically traditional our religions, which the state provides assistance. We should treat the representatives of all religions in the same way - this is true, but nevertheless it is also necessary to take into account the country and the society in which we live. True, this does not mean at all that we should include representatives of religious communities in some destructive ones, not even in terrorist organizations. Of course, this is complete nonsense, you need to carefully deal with it, here I agree with you.
You always return me to the case of Ponomarev, he is probably a truly respected person. But the judge, when he made the decision, do you think I knew that he was making the decision? Of course not. But when a judge makes such decisions, he does not proceed from merit or from something else. If it were a simple citizen who few people know, even the question would not be raised. The law is the same for everyone. To close relatives could be released at parting, at the funeral, there is no other case in the law. The judge is guided by these direct instructions of the text of the law itself, that's all. There is nothing like that, there is no ambush here, there is no political motive.
About unauthorized rallies. Let's still come back to this and see. You yourself mentioned, said about Paris. See, there are victims already affected. The fight is mainly in the center of the capital, and a state of emergency has been declared because of this. How many pogroms there are, burnt cars, shops, the losses are not only in the state, but also in people who have nothing to do with the state, they are enormous. And all this time - like a match, and everything started.
This does not mean at all that we should not analyze our own life and not look after the law that is in place in our country. But still, we must understand the world we live in. Liberal approach to an unauthorized rally. The hard answer from the state what? Water cannons, gas, batons, hundreds of delays - hundreds, can you imagine? Don't we know that? More recently, there have been heavy events in which the Constitution of the Russian Federation was adopted in force, in conditions of growing civil war, in fact, civil war! Crowds of people with weapons ran across Moscow, stormed the Ostankino, crawled along some kind of underground facilities, communications. Regular units of the Russian army were brought into Moscow, internal troops were involved, and they still fired at each other, not understanding what was happening. Chaos! Carefully need to treat this very. Although, of course, it is necessary to analyze the conditions in which we live and the rules that govern our life, including its side, which you mentioned.
Please, I beg you.
---------------- skipping to the area near the end where Putin brings up JWs on his own---------------
If the damage was mitigated, repaid, and the antisocial act is not so serious there.
A.Sokurov: It is the New Year and Christmas amnesty.
Vladimir Putin: Let's think, we have Christmas every year. We must carefully approach this.
It is necessary to finish already. I promised, otherwise I will work until three in the morning.
Here it is, that's all. Please, I beg you.
V. Ryakhovsky: Vladimir Vladimirovich, thank you very much.
To be honest, this is the first time in six years, the turn has reached me.
I have two questions, I will try to short, saving time.
In July 2016, a federal law was passed under the title “On the adoption of additional measures to counter terrorism”, the so-called “Spring Act” among the people.
This law amended the law on freedom of conscience. The Law on Freedom of Conscience was supplemented by a chapter on missionary activity. The definition of missionary activity is given, the procedure for its conduct is established, to the extent that, in order for a person to speak about his convictions, he must be delegated by a religious organization and have a standard document.
The Code of Administrative Offenses introduced Article 5.26 on establishing liability. A year and a half has passed, and I would very much like to ask the initiators of this law: has the goal, which was set by the authors, been achieved? According to this law, at least one extremist was held accountable?
Nevertheless, law enforcement agencies initiated and brought to court more than 600 administrative cases involving representatives of various religious denominations, with the possible exception of one - the most widespread. These things are as unbelievable as imagination can probably be.
Here is just one vivid example: Nizhny Novgorod, a student, a citizen of an African country, a sixth-year student at a medical university, is a little more than a month from state examinations. She gives an interview to one of the Internet channels, talks about herself, about her family, about her childhood, about how she has been a believer since childhood, a Christian, and in Russia she also comes to church, and all this helps her in her studies .
Two administrative cases are brought against her. The first is for violating the rules of missionary activity, she is fined, the second is for violating the goals of staying in the Russian Federation. She arrived on a missionary visa, and here she says something about her convictions. And she is appointed in the second case a fine and expulsion from the Russian Federation. Fortunately, the appellate station probably had enough intelligence: they didn’t cancel these decrees, but they postponed her expulsion until they received the diploma, in just a few months.
Interestingly, the basis of these cases was the expert opinion, which saw in this video hidden appeals, hidden missionary activity.
That is, you understand what's the matter? Hidden. There are no obvious signs of missionary activity. And why are they not? Yes, because it is hidden, and because of this, she was brought to justice.
I can bring a lot of such things, because this is part of my professional interests. The Constitution has a stable notion: when the freedom of conscience is revealed, it is said about the right to impart one’s beliefs. This measure, this rule of law appears, to put it mildly, simply manifestly excessive, it does not contribute to the harmonization of interfaith relations, but, on the contrary, leads to imbalance and violation of the constitutional rights of citizens.
Therefore, Vladimir Vladimirovich, we kindly ask you to instruct the Supreme Court to simply summarize the practice. And then there are so many accumulated of these cases that you can just draw caricatures. It just comes to ridiculous! I just brought one thing, but in fact there are a lot of them. And to raise the question of generalizing this practice on 5.26 with respect to religious organizations, and in general, probably, raise the question of the expediency, to what extent is such regulation justified. There is the concept of "spreading religious beliefs." Why else to introduce the concept of "missionary activity"?
The second question is completely irrelevant to this. Literally the day before, I had a meeting with several businessmen who responded to your May invitation to return to the Russian Federation after the years of emigration on the so-called Titov list.
And indeed, it was precisely by believing your word and not doubting your innocence, because those behind whom there was something, I think, would not even come at your invitation. And the fact that several people have already returned to their homeland in the hope that, while at home, they will be able to recover and protect their good name. And one of the first defendants in the so-called Titov list, who returned to Russia after 13 years of forced emigration in London, became a businessman from Yekaterinburg Sergey Kapchuk. I met him. You should have seen his eyes after he arrived. Just burning, shining - he came home, he came, believing your call and believing that here is true today, unlike those years when he left, justice.
But, alas, he encountered today the same methods of investigation from which he had once escaped. He was automatically charged since 2005. After reading the materials of the case, as he explained to me, the corruption scheme in the government of the Sverdlovsk region, in which it was used, simply became clear.
They filed applications for the interrogation of specific people, heads of individual industries, confrontations - all of this consequence closes his eyes today, and, as we understood, is ready to bring the case to court, to hang up some conditional or slightly lax sentence, order to forget this thing.
But he did not come for this. He did not come to be given a conditional sentence, not to be released under an amnesty, but to prove that he was innocent.
Therefore, Vladimir Vladimirovich, kindly requested. The first is to give the General Prosecutor's Office to take over the cases of Sergei Kapchuk, and similar cases for the people who came, returned to Russia, to take control. And to you, of course, such a request, to still follow the fate of these people not until they returned, but in general, before the completion of their work.
This case has a public outcry today. Why? Because others, those who still remain abroad today, they are closely watching the result of this business. This will be an example for them, as an urge to return to Russia too. And, fulfilling the request of Kapchuk, I just wanted to give you a short appeal from him.
Thank you very much.
V.Putin: Thank you.
As for your first story about this African student, you need to look, of course, some sort of nonsense. From what you tell, it's just some kind of nonsense.
And you need, of course, to do what you propose - to conduct an analysis of law enforcement practice. And if necessary, make some adjustments.
V.Ryakhovsky: According to this girl, they now appealed to me, so that I would continue to the European Court ...
V.Putin: I don’t know to which confession she belongs, she is Christian, but there are also many directions. Jehovah's Witnesses are also Christians, for which I do not really understand how to persecute them. Therefore, you just need to analyze, you need to do it. I will talk with Vyacheslav Mikhailovich, and try to do it.
K. Kabanov: Thank you, Vladimir Vladimirovich.
Dear Colleagues!
You know, I actually, probably, in my 14 years of work, every time I hear that we have two problems: law enforcement agencies and bad laws.
In fact, in the framework of the instructions you gave last time, Vladimir Vladimirovich, we dealt with the history of the criminalization of the teenage environment. But, as we were taught at previous duty stations, we must look deep into, look, study . . . .
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