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Are JWs able to predict future events?


Guest Kurt

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43 minutes ago, JW Insider said:

I'm not considering these types of mundane predictions to be part of the Watch Tower's track record on Bible-based prediction

Well now, that's where we'll part company. I view the preaching work as the ALL important activity at this time and any plans, forecasts, developments, arrangements, in fact, the whole 9 yards, related to it as being inseparable from Bible prophecy. As the angel puts it at Revelation 19:10 :   "For the witness concerning Jesus is what inspires prophecy.”

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This topic recently started (again) over here: In that conversation @James Thomas Rook Jr. said: "The Society has NEVER been right about ANYTHING they predicted .. which is why "new light" is di

Threads like that have been started by others and I didn't want to be the one to start a new one. I don't think that the Watch Tower Society needs to be beat up any further on the topic, if the point 

As an example to affirm what I mean by the application of the term prediction according to the common definition as discussed above, there is a reference in the Feb 15 1943 Watchtower, p63-4. Quoting

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27 minutes ago, Eoin Joyce said:

I view the preaching work as the ALL important activity at this time and any plans, forecasts, developments, arrangements, in fact, the whole 9 yards, related to it as being inseparable from Bible prophecy.

So do I. But I don't think that's what the question about making predictions was about. For example: saying that we are sure we will see an increase of at least 3% in worldwide activity in a specific country due to a campaign to encourage more publishers to join the rank of pioneers in that country is not a Bible-based prediction.

Saying that the end of this system of things is expected within a few short years or even months after 1975 is a Bible-based prediction if we based it on Daniel 4 to get 1914 and we were adding a 70 year generation who were at least 10 years old in 1914, and who 'would not pass away' and found that all this coincided with a Bible-based belief that 6,000 years of human existence should coincide with a seventh day we believed to be 7,000 years long, where the 1,000 year reign should also fit within that 7,000 year period. We said that the 1970's would be the "appropriate time for God to act" based on Bible interpretations. 

If we had predicted that 50,000 anointed would be joined by 500,000 of the other sheep based on an interpretation of '10 men taking hold of the skirt of a Jew' then this might have been said to be Bible-based. 

I also remember a brother saying that Knorr had predicted that he could get a crowd bigger than a Billy Graham convention. Supposedly this was the reason that instead of having multiple assemblies across the nation in 1953 and 1958, Knorr decided to promote single US conventions in New York City in both these years.

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1 hour ago, JW Insider said:

increase of at least 3% in worldwide activity in a specific country due to a campaign to encourage more publishers to join the rank of pioneers in that country is not a Bible-based prediction.

That's where we disagree. The detail is immaterial to me. This is Jehovah's people doing their conscientous best to obey the command to preach the good news, and make (and keep) disciples. The fact that myriads would respond in a godless world is indeed a Bible-based prediction and in part forms the drive for engaging in that work with such vigour. 

1 hour ago, JW Insider said:

Saying that the end of this system of things is expected within a few short years or even months after 1975...and the rest..(my italics)

Now you are just banging a very old and tuneless drum. We have long established that predictions without inspiration are just guesswork. The detail will always be subject to correction and real prophecy is only apparent as or after it is fulfilled. The key element here is to recognise we are at the dawn of the new order and to "keep close in mind" (speed up) Jehovah's day.

For those were captivated by this '75 speculation (including some at the highest levels) some 45 years ago (not me I can say thanks to mature assistance at the time), let them bleat. Any maintaining a real focus on being 'the sort of people they ought to be' have suffered no real loss in missing out a bit on some of what the apostle Paul called "refuse".

I think we are still muddling prophecy and prediction.

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12 hours ago, JW Insider said:

They also claimed that the organization of Jehovah's Witnesses is indeed a prophet -- and not just a "prophet-like" organization. There has not yet been a direct retraction of this claim. However it has not been repeated since the 1980's as far as I remember. 

I think this has been discussed elsewhere but anyway, to repeat, the role of a prophet along with their prophesying served more in ancient times than to provide messages from Jehovah in the form of statements in advance of his intentions or requirements.

True prophets also stood as rallying points for Jehovah's worship as currently practiced and all that included, in the face of trends to dilute, pollute, or abandon true worship.

In that way the prophet-like comparison can still be made. With the Scripture complete and available for the present, there is no need for "prophets" serving in the manner of ancient times, or for that matter in the way of those in the 1st Century with the gift of prophecy. (1Cor 13:8). However, the Governing Body serves in a prophet-like role in upholding Jehovah's standards and in proclaimimg his revealed will and judgements in the midst of an ungodly world. How far that analogy can be extended to include those who support them in that God-assigned activity is a matter for future discussion.

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Yes, the benefits of the Kingdom will be wonderful.  So it is only natural to want it NOW.  Recently it was stated that there is no special divine knowledge in our time and that the faithful and discreet slave is not infallible but it is faithful and ever more discreet. 

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