Arauna

You guys are getting too personal...... really .  It does not bring honour to jehovah  if we (myself included) get personal.  It serves no edifying purpose....

To see words as "how dare you"  etc indicates a spirit of arrogance.  God can speak for himself..... he does not need us to show indignation on his behalf...... just like muslims who think they have the right to kill for god./ or in his name.

On 10/17/2019 at 1:34 PM, Witness said:

was a wallflower in the organization.  I

Not prepared to only preach.... I understand completely.  

You and Pearl.... where do you go for meetings as instructed by Jehovah. Where is the nation you belong to as stipulated in Isaaih 2:2-4....... a nation which comprises people if all tribes on the earth. .....? And prays to Jehovah....... and accepts christ as only a man of flesh?....... and preaches world-wide in fulfillment of Matt 24:14

While I u understand the imperfections of humans (GB are humans as you are) I also understand that jehovah worked with Israel before Jesus was born...... and they did many terrible things.. 

You spend so much time on here breaking down those who serve jehovah..... no building up. Using the word of God as a misleading weapon. This is NOT the fruit of the spirit from God.  I am not deceivied by you no matter how sincere you may personally feel. 

On 10/17/2019 at 7:40 PM, Srecko Sostar said:

You connect old age of Belgian

No- I meant "old" in sense of ruling for a long time like despots and do not get voted out. They are all younger than I am - and I do not consider myself old.... 

On 10/18/2019 at 12:38 AM, Shiwiii said:

You do realize that lepers looked different, right? Sores, mostly dirty, etc. 

Lepers are not dirty - depending on circumstances.  I will study with any leper as I have had a study with a Rasta - dispite his pot smoking and his unhealthy looking hair...... because I saw the person behind the crazy hair and valued him as a person. 

BUT I did expect him to change his appearance as he grew in knowledge about Jehovah.   SPIRITUAL GROWTH BRINGS CHANGE -  did you change? 

On 10/17/2019 at 10:02 PM, Matthew9969 said:

When I see jw men all dressed up, I can't tell the difference between them and mobsters, lawyers, politicians, ands shady TV evangelist.

Well a person should not just judge by appearance - that is very immature.

But first impressions do count. So being neat and not have some outrageous fad in your dress is recommended.

14 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

When you punish a man's family

I think you have an issue with God and the bible -  not JWs.   Achan and his entire family died and an example made of them. Why? They condoned Achan's behaviour and went along with him - kept quiet about him stealing the gold and garment and hiding it in his tent - which was dedicated to Jehovah as firstfruits in the promised land.

There are numerous scriptures in new testament which talk about having nothing to do with "brothers" who practice fornication, lying, extortion, reviling  etc. Etc.  It also says that one condones it by greeting them or eating with them. So I think  you have an issue with the bible - because JWs do what it says.  Here is my own story:

I have 3 brothers, one went to prison for 3 years for the truth, another is not a witness and the other is an apostate..    I call him Ett for short..... He has the same OCD I often recognize here on this forum. 

I was 21 years old when the youngest brother (Ett) was born. He was like a child to me..... soft natured and brilliant.  My parents were quite old when he was born so he had less discipline but went to a school for gifted children.

He came into the truth for only a brief time.  He was a smartypants.  Too smart for his own shoes - like many apostates.  

To pretend that I do not mourn him every day is a lie....... so this is so false to infer that  JWs easily shun family members.... and many critics  imply that we are heartless.....so false.   I helped raise my brother....., He was the brother/child I loved the most and I could relate to him the most because he had a gentle heart.....and a sweet disposition albeit inclined to his own way. We had a close bond.  He went with me on holiday together with my children. Later my mother got cancer.... when he was still  quite young.  I still love him (the way he was) with all my heart.

BUT: He broke his loving bond with Jehovah and his loving bond with me by reading the books of Richard Dawkins and rejecting the notion of a creator. (Dawkins became a celebrity for a while with his silly notions).  My brother became hateful against jehovah and led a loose life - like the prodical son.  He rejected all help offered to him from JWs and the  non-JWs in the family to re-evaluate his position.   (Both of the other brothers are highly educated in science and engineering  (one is a analytical chemist and science programmer the other has engineering and economic degrees.. ..... they are both brilliant in math and can argue about thermodynamics etc etc).

So please, don't any one if you here on this forum pretend it is easy for a JW to cut association with someone who's association has become pure OCD poison. I realized it was spiritual suicide....to remain in contact with him because he had OCD.... could not help himself to return to some subject against God....... it is not easy for us.

I cried a lot and I still mourn him...... but hope everyday he comes back to his senses as he sees prophecies being fulfilled. Nobody will be more pleased than I if he is prepared to clean up his hate speech against God and his moral  standards and return to my heart. 

After rejecting Jehovah he lost his girlfriend in death and many other things went wrong in his life because he no longer had Jehovah's protection. Did this make him humble? No.

I sent him money to support him for quite some time because he lost his sense to live....... a result of his choices...... I regularly ask my non-witness brother how he is because he lives in the same city.   My non-witness brother also broke off association with him for a while because he could not cope with  the OCD this apostate brother displayed against God.  He believes that God exists and as a non-witness did not view Ett as good association.

So hopefully this gives you some insight into how non-apostates feel.  Every time I study the weaknesses in the  evolution theory, philosophy or history....... I think how wonderful it could be to share this with Ett. ..... because he is a reader of eclectic subjects.... but then I remember that it is hard to have a reasonable conversation with him due to the OCD against God.   I have not spoken to him for years........ but the pain remains.

I however am determined  to not condone his behaviour or pollute myself. I am secure in my faith and bible knowledge but I had to be on guard when he was in a conversation.....  It is spiritually dangerous.    I have often spoken to elders about my struggle to keep separate......and have managed to do so for years.......  and I supported him financially when it was hard for me........ because I love him and  love and  obey Jehovah. So do not treat us as heartless...... apostacy often makes the perpetrator heartless.

Kabbalah? Mysticism and meanings in numbers and letters...... 

A watering down of the word of God by teachings of men.  Jesus himself rejected the "oral tradition" of men which was later written down as the Mishnah.

Rabbis practiced the kabbalah which is closely linked to mystic teachings of the East.

Need I say more? 

As I said before: when you join a golf club ... you know the rules. Go to the club and flagrantly break the rules by disorderly or brazen conduct and you may find yourself "outside" the club. So if this rule is OK for other clubs..... why is JW treated so bad for expecting people to follow the standards in the bible?

18 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

we all accepting, Bible is two edge sword

All those who are NOT members of the body of Christ (or do not treat them as brothers) are obsessed with position and authority....... similar to the world..... people with fleshly thinking.

True members of the "body" of christ accept that there are members who all have different tasks - like in a physical body..... all work together for one goal. It is not about position but working together towards the goal of glorifying Jehovahs name...... no other name.

Those who have been infiltrated by secular thinking or fleshly thinking all argue about position and authority...

Corrupted fruits identify false teachers and the "man of lawlessness".   The catholic church had statues of false gods at the Vatican a week ago - which caused outrage.  

Some churches in USA are "voting" for LGBTQ rights.........to be part of the doctrine of the church.....  So their fruits are clear ...... their false teachings prove they are the man of " lawlessness".  

Yes, let every person in the organization come with their own theories of how a scripture should be interpreted. Let any person say they are anointed and then take disciples for themselves and preach their own interpretations. Yes let each one become their own God. 

This is a truly a united way of thinking - it will be similar to the world which is now so irreconcilably "united".

I just love the way these so-called bible experts think - so illogical and impractical...... quick to accuse others of being "gods" but wanting to replace those gods with their own ludicrous ideas. And quite ready to replace those gods with their own godlike opinions and authority.

The world is sitting on a time-bomb waiting to explode.  There are so many issues that are covered up or not addressed. If one speaks the truth you will be prosecuted.  ....... this is why I believe that we will soon see major changes in the world......  Satan is being drawn out of his lair.

I don't reason with people who cannot follow the thread of an argument..... 

There are other religions who are getting away with child rape as part of their teachings and regular PRACTICE  ....but  only JWs singled out for the odd renegade members. 

There are top society members, members of government and CIA who are trafficking children and it is covered up.... such as the Epstein case has exposed the rampant rotten wickedness of these people.

How many cities in UK were exposed as having rape rings of perpetrators and police were too afraid to prosecute because they were members of the ' religion of peace.' .... this proves your bias and hate towards JWs because you only single them out.

17 hours ago, Matthew9969 said:

There is also a mental illness of claiming that you are God, like your governin

That is only your personal opinion not reality.  I have not read anywhere that they have said this. They claim to be the true servants of jehovah....... just like Jesus claimed to be the SON of jehovah.......... and they accused him too!

1 hour ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Page 30.... and we still opposing each other :))))

There is a time for everything.... a time to debate and a time to stop.   A time to bury the hatchet and get on with life....

There is nothing as sad as those who confident in their ignorance.....  Speak to Jews.... I have preached to many..... and you will find they know the JHWH (tetragrammaton) but do not pronounce it.  One accused me of  appropriating the Jewish god. ...... 

Ironic: And they (the scandinavians) bring in more and more muslim migrants  in which religion a woman really has no rights (half of a man in Sharia court) and they throw gays off of high buildings and LGBT, adultery, and changing your religion will get you killed - not shunned.  They marry nine years olds legally ( and cases are thrown out of high court because it is their "culture" to marry kids) and are allowed up to 4 wives which each get their own paid-for apartment for their 3 to 4 children. Each Muslim gets free medical, housing, money for food etc.

Swedes give ISIS fighters a new identity and give them housing. 

The injustice of this has not even dawned on them..... they are being "virtuous" by doing these wonderful deeds...for Muslims. because this new "cultural revolution" philosophy, which is part of communistic radical feminism, has no logic.

The 'mother instinct' to nurture minority groups (muslims and LGBTQ) is virtuous - they do no research and reasoning about it is taboo -  in this radical philosophy, which is now in all schools and universities in the West. If they looked at stats they would find out that Islam is soon the be the largest religion on earth - and most violent to non-believers or hypocrites (other muslims).

They are nurturing a viper in their bosom. Muslims are in favor  and Christian's are totally out of favour for these secular politicians  - especially the devoted christians. 100,000 Kurdish Christian's will soon be slaughtered by Turkey..... they will not get migrant status - as has happened before in Syria and IRAQ - most christians slaughtered. Christians are daily being slaughtered in north Africa by al Shabaab and Boko Haram and taken as sex slaves - nothing in the news about this. Why? Because Islam has now received the stamp of approval as a religion of peace (one can go to jail in Scandinavia and UK if one says anything negative about it....... even when they commit crimes, it is covered up!) 

Islamic culture is now taught in all schools and the high court in USA just threw out a case against parents who objected..... so kids are forced to learn Islam as being beautiful and they are forced to write and recite the shahada-  which makes you a Muslim when you say it in front of witnesses.  How ignorance prevails!  Some Christian's applications for refugee status have been rejected by Canada and UK.

Yes - good to see the animosity against JWs as singled out Christian's....... it means things are moving ahead as predicted in the Bible......the day is here, and will escalate in hate,  when each one acknowledging Christ will be persecuted.

When these stupid politicians wake up it will be too late...... but they are so secular in their thinking they do not see the real danger....... as some opposers with secular thinking are here on this forum.

The Pope is signing an agreement next year with the other abrahamic religions.... Judaism and Islam..... one united religion. Here is the rub:  jesus Christ has been totally removed from the agreement....... great!  ......The 'man of lawlessness'  is being exposed.

All supporters of 'amorality' (against the just morality of Jehovah) are now showing their true colours.

7 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

eloquence is confused with competence. There is very littl

I know of mathematical geniuses who have dyslexia..... so never measure other people at your own standard.

I speak several languages but I think I only write one competently and maybe eloquently..... and it is not English. We are not all writers.  Language is primarily for communication, so when it fulfils this purpose (conveys a thought) then it is sufficient.  

When one uses a language in an expert and innovative way, then only can it become art...... but not all people are artists. 

Most Africans I know speak 5 languages (even more), and I have found that many swedes speak at least 3 languages or more at a high level. Usually those who speak only one language will judge others on their language skills. My eyes are really bad now and my impatience grows with my arthritic fingers. I really dont care if my writing is pure, perfect, prestine or up to some other person's standards. Language can be misapplied to be a gauge of intelligence or prestige. In this regard I am a rebel..... I really don't care if I make a mistake or people think I am uneducated. I need no other person's approval to exist or give my opinion.

Look at yourselves - your squabbling is a give-away.

Reminds me of the period I was the senior publicity officer for the national orchestra.  Some classical singers really think themselves above the rest just because they can sing opera or oratorio..... and orchestra members vie with each other  egotistically.  BUT most of them are as immoral as the worst popstars....with scandals, deceit and competitiveness. 

On 10/21/2019 at 11:20 PM, Matthew9969 said:

ex-witnessIt's pretty easy to tell who are the die hard jw

Good!   You forgot to add that many make this choice by free will and after studying many religions, philosophies, history and darwinism....... some do this in their own time.  It is not a blind following or indoctrination as many opposers summarize...... our eyes are open when we make this choice! Some ex-witnesses did not do this.... use their time wisely.... that is why they are ex-wiwitnesses.

Bad association DOES spoil useful habits.  My confidence us not in myself but in christ and jehovah to assist me to remain faithful even in small things.

I see here in this forum a level of secularism that influences those affected by it to a level where wrong is no longer wrong.  Their perception of right and wrong is more secular than close to biblical compliance.

5 hours ago, Matthew9969 said:

seeing the hate and disunity

You forget some are apostates and are no longer JWs..... so equate all as JWs is incorrect.  

Why bother to answer - this person is not interested in reason. 

Most opposers of JW who have insurmountable hate for the organization have OCD - not the real kind but similar because they repeat the same hate over and over and twist scripture to suit their ends). It seems they are consumed by one thought only - like Cain.  Most of those kind here have this same attitude and mindset. God himself warned Cain about the bad condition in his heart but did he stop hating his brother?  He had no self-control and went ahead to premedidated murder of his brother.

They do not give reasonable replys but meander on and on - or point to silly things which only end in a point of hate...... not worth wasting time on illogical and emotional  postings.

If she were of the anointed  she would be out there preaching about the only solution  jehovah has for mankind - his kingdom in the hands of his son Christ Jesus.... not be angry about the fact that she was not offered the opportunity to have a  following.

6 hours ago, Witness said:

Have you thought of writing the GB about this?

No, but I bet you have- because you have a HUGE ego that cannot be quenched and therefore manifests in OCD hate and bitterness ....... over and over. 

I speak a form of Dutch as my first language.... I understand the culture well...... and I also understand communism....which they are proponents of.  ........ and I am older than they are.   So what is your point?

4 hours ago, Shiwiii said:

what you are saying

This phrase is a way of rephrasing what the other person has said to give it a personal and nasty twist....

Race does not matter... period.... but the way you present yourself - this does matter.   I always present myself in a neat way.  RASTA does not look neat...... it always looks asif your hair has not been washed for 6 months and it "may " have some fleas lurking somewhere.

4 hours ago, Shiwiii said:

hardly think that Jesus would do the same

That is YOUR opinion. Jesus did not own a house or have a prestigious worldly job...... but the soldiers threw lots for his garment. Why?  Because it was of good quality.   Jesus must have looked decent and properly dressed for the preaching work.

Again: not racist clothing but fit for the job at hand.....

23 hours ago, Shiwiii said:

h...blah...blah, but the fact of the matter is you know you treat people different based on appearances.  

Most people notice appearance. Ever looked for a job as a truck driver?  No job if you look like a pot smoker..... Get real.   

When on field service we want to look  decent and clean cut so as to not bring reproach on Jehovah.  No Rasta T-shirts, dreadlocks to create impression that you smoke pot for religious experiences.   Nothing to do with race - but appearance does matter. 

1 minute ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Old leaders 

Sounds like a presumptuous youth speaking....

Reminds me of the African elders in the African tribes..... they have acquired a mildness and wisdom with age - not so judgmental.

When young Africans overthrow the elders and run the elder courts themselves  - gross injustices occur.  Elders do make mistakes too..... but the presumptiousness of youth have far worse results.

A lesson can be learnt from this.... of course these traditions are fast disappearing.

Two scriptures:  1 Sam 15:  "for rebelliousness is the same as the sin of divination, and pushing ahead presumptuously the same as using magical power and idolatry. Because you have rejected the word of Jehovah, he has rejected you from being king.”

The words "pushing ahead " indicates that we should show caution.....

2john :"Everyone who pushes ahead and does not remain in the teaching of the Christ does not have God. 

This indicates that self regulation is important. We should be aware so that we do not become presumptuous when it comes to the things pertaining to God. 

Srecko:  true freedom comes with serving Jehovah because it frees one from being a slave to yourself , money, government power, or any other human philosophy.

One is always a slave - either of God or satan. You are deceived if you think you are free when you reject Jehovah.  

One is free of law if you show royal love.  When one breaks or rejects law then you come to be under law and judged by it.

The children under Jerusalem above are truly free - Can you direct me to any other world-wide organization which promotes worship of Jehovah, teaches about his future kingdom, are politically neutral and  stick to the morality of the bible?

19 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

she easily could be accused of “running ahead,” and “going beyond the things written”

True,  but I do not go beyond what is written in the bible.  NEVER!  If we are to meditate on things in the bible, we definitely will come up with insights that are not broadly accepted but this does not mean it is wrong to speculate.  .... or wrong to see a new insight.  Even Angel's wish to peer into these things.  

I see what is in the bible and what is in the world and make a connection.   I see what is in the bible about scientific subjects and  make a connection with what I know or have read.... it has enriched my thinking and love for the truth.

I have prayed about this..... that jehovah chastize me if I am moving in a wrong way...... I am ready to be corrected. ...... running ahead can be like spiritism.... so it is something to be careful of...... show caution..... on the other hand I do think things are moving in certain directions in the world and I think think things are moving fast. 

I do not "bend" scriptures as I have seen some do here.