Patiently waiting for Truth

Yes I've noticed that some JW's  dig themselves into big holes with their words. 
They think they are defending the GB and it's Org but they make it quite clear of the faults in both. Don't they actually think about what they are writing  

Um, empty K H's when the Governing Body say we are so close to the 'end of this system'. I thought there was supposed to be a massive influx near the end, not empty K H's. 
Actually it is quite difficult for a private person to get insurance for a minibus here in the UK.  The government seem to think it has to be for business use. And congregations will not support the running of a minibus, and elders make that clear. 
As for 'true Christians' travelling as far as it takes. That is not a loving thought. I know of older brothers and sisters that cannot drive in the dark. I think that here in the UK half of every congregation is old people. So where is this love that should abound in the 'truth' ?  

If blood is soooo sacred in the eyes of the GB / Org, they why do the GB 'allow' JW's to accept fractions of HUMAN BLOOD ?
I would have thought the mere 'messing about' with / disecting of, human blood would be seen as wrong. That blood has been removed from someone's body. Shouldn't all blood removed be 'pored out on the ground' ? 
On this subject, can someone tell me exactly how many different types of blood fractions JW's are 'allowed' to use ? I have tried to research it but it get confusing to me. 
On a wider scale of things though,it definitely shows that the GB are the GOVERNING BODY, dictating rules of men,doesn't it ?
Didn't Jesus say how wrong that was ? Lording it over the congregation. 
God is going to judge us through Christ, so do we really need to be dictated to by men ? Are we not allowed to have a conscience ?  Guidelines, yes, but man made rules dictated to servants of God, no. Especially as failures of those in charge are easily seen. It seems like some here want to go back to the lie told about the 'Superior Authorities' just to gain more power over the earth wide congregation.. 
 

Point 1. I really do laugh at this term "Only game in town"   As I've said before the JEWISH RELIGIOUS LEADERS would have said that serving God by obeying THEM and the Mosaic Law, was the only game in town. Jesus however proved those Religious leaders to be wrong. Jesus and his disciples carried over the good points of the Mosaic Law and discarded the bits no longer needed. (Such as animal sacrifices, circumcision etc). 
Russell & Co came out of former religions. I presume they must have carried over some good points from those former religions, then made adjustments or changed doctrines.
So why would it not be possible for people that have left the JW Org to form a new religion ?  Carrying over the good and disposing of the bad, of which there seems to be plenty....
I'm not saying it will happen but it does dispose of this idea of 'the only game in town' brainwashing. JW's seem to be taught that there cannot be anything else ever. What if Russell had believed that, the Bible Students would have never been formed. 
Point 2.  The 'Truth' / JW Org.
As I read more and more on here I am finding out that the Governing Body / Writing Dept'  / Legal Dept' et al,  have deliberately told many lies.
The latest I'm reading (on a new topic on here) but the info stems back a while, seems to contain information whereby the 'Org' / those in charge at the time, implied, that children cannot get baptised, and that blood transfusions were acceptable to the Organisation. It seems that this was written in order to get favours from a certain government. 
Both of those things are lies but seem to be deliberately used for some form of dishonest gain.
Then of course we have lawyers telling lies in court about shunning. 
And C.S.A court cases have proved that elders and others have deliberately lied. And the American 'section' of the JW Org deliberately withholding information regarding such matters.
Link this to misuse of scriptures, such as, Superior Authorities, which deliberately took away people's conscience / freedom of choice, in WW2.
And I'm sure people here can come up with lots more examples of lies, deliberate wrongdoing, mistakes, misinterpretations, 'new light' corrections et al.
Why am i writing all this ?  Well I am proving two points. 
1. If it's your 'only game in town' then it's not a good one. 
2. That calling it 'The Truth' is totally deceptive.
I do not think you would like it if I gave you a meal that was three quarters yummy, but a quarter poison. The poison might well contaminate the good food !
So, saying that the Org / GB are three quarters right does not help. 
 
 
 
 

If blood is soooo sacred in the eyes of the GB / Org, they why do the GB 'allow' JW's to accept fractions of HUMAN BLOOD ?
I would have thought the mere 'messing about' with / disecting of, human blood would be seen as wrong. That blood has been removed from someone's body. Shouldn't all blood removed be 'pored out on the ground' ? 
On this subject, can someone tell me exactly how many different types of blood fractions JW's are 'allowed' to use ? I have tried to research it but it get confusing to me. 
On a wider scale of things though,it definitely shows that the GB are the GOVERNING BODY, dictating rules of men,doesn't it ?
Didn't Jesus say how wrong that was ? Lording it over the congregation. 
God is going to judge us through Christ, so do we really need to be dictated to by men ? Are we not allowed to have a conscience ?  Guidelines, yes, but man made rules dictated to servants of God, no. Especially as failures of those in charge are easily seen. It seems like some here want to go back to the lie told about the 'Superior Authorities' just to gain more power over the earth wide congregation.. 
 

Wow...  Just wow. 

This will soon be so. Governments will clamp down on ANY organization which enforces biblical law... I see you do not get it.  ..the tide against ALL Christian' laws/principles  is turning.
It will be up to the individual to decide to vote, not take a blood transfusion, or not condone unchristian behaviour,  by cutting association with those who approve LGBT or any other prohibition imposed God.  You do not get it - this is the 'beginning ' of governments enforcing their new moral laws on all Christian's and especially those who stand out for their obedience to laws which other christians do not care about.  In England and Scandinavia people are going to prison or taken into custody for talking against Islam and LGBT - soon it will include voting, blood transfusions and shunning.... and much more........ the world will take away freedom of choice and impose their humanist/satanic laws on us under the guise of human rights.
 
 

You are asking the wrong question, Arauna, about people who have police power (bayonets) to enforce whatever their perspective is .... right or wrong.
The question SHOULD be... the question you should be concerned about is why does the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society LIE to the Bulgarian Government that we do not impose congregational sanctions on those who accept blood... SPECIFICALLY, disfellowshipping, and and extreme shunning.
ANY JW, ANYWHERE, knows this is NOT TRUE.
THIS is what you should be concerned with.
Oh, as an aside, I still do not have my answer about are there congregational sanctions currently against a person voting in a political election.
The answers we get are so weasel worded that they can mean ANYTHING.
If you know better ... please correct me.
What I am looking for is the latest information, in light of Norway's threat to withhold MONEY from the Society, for violating what Norway considers one of the most basic of all human rights... and labeling us us as "extremists".
I strongly suspect because there is MONEY involved, we are soon, if not already, going to be allowed to vote without being censured or disfellowshipped.
 

MONEY .mp4

Why should a  ignorant  office worker in some government department decide we are 'extreme' people and a 'threat to public health' when the God of the universe tells us to abstain from blood?
The true evidence is that transfusions are in reality a great threat to public health with all the fatal diseases which can be transmitted such as Hepatitis C, AIDS, syphilis.... just to mention three which come to mind.
They greatest threat of blood transfusion is anaphylactic shock - which is never put on death certificates as cause of death - and in reality is the greatest cause of death after surgery.... By third day after the surgery it starts manifesting and then the death certificate usually says "complications after surgery".  
So, in the final analyses it is about obedience to jehovah.  If one believes he really exists - will one deliberately ignore his laws ?  ......and risk losing his Holy Spirit? 
What you guys here do not get is that the risk is high when one deliberately disobeys God........ one risks getting an unapproved mental state.... and then it does not matter if you are shunned by others.  Your own mental state will shun you....... because you will become an opposer and be shunned for a brazen attitude by breaking some other laws of God as well. 
You may become like some people here on this forum who gives each other silly likes when they find material which condemns JHws while they (the JWs) are in the situation of trying to obey God.  I bet some of the opposers here will feel justified when our persecution starts and revel in our being designated "extreme" and even enjoy our persecution.   God predicted it would happen.
That is the mental state you get when you disobey jehovah and think you can make your own rules as you go along and condone hate against those trying to obey the laws of God.
Even if governments force their laws and morality on us and outlaw shunning.......(which I predict they will do in the near future) , obedience to the laws of God and his personal approval of the individual will still remain the factor in final approval  and  opportunity for life everlasting.

Each person will have to choose if they will vote. !
its fine to say that to the public but unfortunately that's not really true when you are a JW.
Actually what my wife and I have noticed for the last few years is that the society is happy to portrait a different kind of rules kinda show a different society to the public where we have a choice or is up to each individual to choose about blood, shunning, vote etc but that's not reality.

If you will refer to what I actually said, Arauna, I said "many" ..... not all.
I faced 5 years in Federal Prison during the Vietnam War, and there were as many reasons why different people became conscientious objectors, as there were who became soldiers.

You seem to have a lot of mixed feelings about speculation; when its appropriate to speculate, and with whom. And that's okay.  One thing you seem sure of though, David Splane is not telling the truth about the "new light" concerning "this generation".  
Yes, "assumed" in the most wicked sense of the word.  
Assume - "seize and take control without authority and possibly with force; take as one's right or possession"
"But suppose that servant is wicked and says to himself, ‘My master is staying away a long time,’ 49 and he then begins to beat his fellow servants and to eat and drink with drunkards. 50 The master of that servant will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour he is not aware of. 51 He will cut him to pieces and assign him a place with the hypocrites, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth."  Matt 24:48-51
 

You're kidding, right?

@Anna Sorry but i think you are being naive on this point or deliberately not wanting to see the truth of it. 
I have to agree with @Witness (above post) on this issue, on two points.
1. If it is offered as spiritual food from 'Jehovah's table' then it should be fact not speculation. 
2. If a person makes mention of disagreeing with the GB / Org's 'teachings' they can be disfellowshipped for 'causing a division in the congregation'...  
A question though. If     "It's not as if "the Generation" is a fundamental teaching required for salvation is it? " 
Then, if they have no 'proof' of their claim, why can't they just say "We don't know" 
Why do the GB / Writing Dept' et al have to pretend that they know more than they actually do know ?
It only shows people that those at the top are 'running ahead' and not waiting on Jehovah / Jesus Christ for true guidance. 

Point 1. I really do laugh at this term "Only game in town"   As I've said before the JEWISH RELIGIOUS LEADERS would have said that serving God by obeying THEM and the Mosaic Law, was the only game in town. Jesus however proved those Religious leaders to be wrong. Jesus and his disciples carried over the good points of the Mosaic Law and discarded the bits no longer needed. (Such as animal sacrifices, circumcision etc). 
Russell & Co came out of former religions. I presume they must have carried over some good points from those former religions, then made adjustments or changed doctrines.
So why would it not be possible for people that have left the JW Org to form a new religion ?  Carrying over the good and disposing of the bad, of which there seems to be plenty....
I'm not saying it will happen but it does dispose of this idea of 'the only game in town' brainwashing. JW's seem to be taught that there cannot be anything else ever. What if Russell had believed that, the Bible Students would have never been formed. 
Point 2.  The 'Truth' / JW Org.
As I read more and more on here I am finding out that the Governing Body / Writing Dept'  / Legal Dept' et al,  have deliberately told many lies.
The latest I'm reading (on a new topic on here) but the info stems back a while, seems to contain information whereby the 'Org' / those in charge at the time, implied, that children cannot get baptised, and that blood transfusions were acceptable to the Organisation. It seems that this was written in order to get favours from a certain government. 
Both of those things are lies but seem to be deliberately used for some form of dishonest gain.
Then of course we have lawyers telling lies in court about shunning. 
And C.S.A court cases have proved that elders and others have deliberately lied. And the American 'section' of the JW Org deliberately withholding information regarding such matters.
Link this to misuse of scriptures, such as, Superior Authorities, which deliberately took away people's conscience / freedom of choice, in WW2.
And I'm sure people here can come up with lots more examples of lies, deliberate wrongdoing, mistakes, misinterpretations, 'new light' corrections et al.
Why am i writing all this ?  Well I am proving two points. 
1. If it's your 'only game in town' then it's not a good one. 
2. That calling it 'The Truth' is totally deceptive.
I do not think you would like it if I gave you a meal that was three quarters yummy, but a quarter poison. The poison might well contaminate the good food !
So, saying that the Org / GB are three quarters right does not help. 
 
 
 
 

@Anna Sorry but i think you are being naive on this point or deliberately not wanting to see the truth of it. 
I have to agree with @Witness (above post) on this issue, on two points.
1. If it is offered as spiritual food from 'Jehovah's table' then it should be fact not speculation. 
2. If a person makes mention of disagreeing with the GB / Org's 'teachings' they can be disfellowshipped for 'causing a division in the congregation'...  
A question though. If     "It's not as if "the Generation" is a fundamental teaching required for salvation is it? " 
Then, if they have no 'proof' of their claim, why can't they just say "We don't know" 
Why do the GB / Writing Dept' et al have to pretend that they know more than they actually do know ?
It only shows people that those at the top are 'running ahead' and not waiting on Jehovah / Jesus Christ for true guidance. 

Thank you @Anna I totally agree with this point. 

Water as symbol of God's Spirit.
By this, what Jesus told, this "inspirational water" has The Source in Jesus (and God). Well, it would be normal, and not mental issue, if somebody  come with claim how he/she is "inspired". :)) 

Not if you take what they say as speculation on their part. Which is what I think it is. Anyone has the right to speculate. I have no qualms telling Br.Splane that I think his chart is based on speculation. And I'm sure he'd reply that that's my opinion. In which case he is right too. No harm done, we both have our opinion. It's not as if "the Generation" is a fundamental teaching required for salvation is it?

Isn’t this teaching served on “Jehovah’s rich spiritual table”?  Isn’t it based on a principle that is part of the foundation of the organization?  1914?  Every teaching on generation revolves around this date, and if anyone verbally rejects this date, they can be disfellowshipped.  
Partake appreciatively of the spiritual food available only at Jehovah’s table, and you will not be misled by false teachers or wicked spirit forces. w06 11/15 pp. 21-25 “When I go to Christian meetings, conventions, and assemblies and I am able to feast at Jehovah’s spiritual table, this really refreshes me spiritually,” she observes. w02 9/15 pp. 8-9 Can a typical JW distinguish between what is served on “Jehovah’s spiritual table” and what is concocted from the minds of men?  Yes, anyone has the right to speculate, but does the GB encourage it?  Are you even suppose to “go there” and "speculate" otherwise?
Why should we be on guard if someone begins to speculate or to speak critically?
9 We are nearing the outbreak of the great tribulation and the end of this wicked system, so those inspired warnings given in the first century take on greater significance. We definitely do not want to ‘miss the purpose’ of Jehovah’s undeserved kindness and lose out on the promise of everlasting life, be that in heaven or on earth. (2 Cor. 6:1) If ever someone attending our congregation meetings would try to entice us into discussions of personal speculations or critical conversations, we should definitely be on guard." w13 12/15 p. 9

Point 1. I really do laugh at this term "Only game in town"   As I've said before the JEWISH RELIGIOUS LEADERS would have said that serving God by obeying THEM and the Mosaic Law, was the only game in town. Jesus however proved those Religious leaders to be wrong. Jesus and his disciples carried over the good points of the Mosaic Law and discarded the bits no longer needed. (Such as animal sacrifices, circumcision etc). 
Russell & Co came out of former religions. I presume they must have carried over some good points from those former religions, then made adjustments or changed doctrines.
So why would it not be possible for people that have left the JW Org to form a new religion ?  Carrying over the good and disposing of the bad, of which there seems to be plenty....
I'm not saying it will happen but it does dispose of this idea of 'the only game in town' brainwashing. JW's seem to be taught that there cannot be anything else ever. What if Russell had believed that, the Bible Students would have never been formed. 
Point 2.  The 'Truth' / JW Org.
As I read more and more on here I am finding out that the Governing Body / Writing Dept'  / Legal Dept' et al,  have deliberately told many lies.
The latest I'm reading (on a new topic on here) but the info stems back a while, seems to contain information whereby the 'Org' / those in charge at the time, implied, that children cannot get baptised, and that blood transfusions were acceptable to the Organisation. It seems that this was written in order to get favours from a certain government. 
Both of those things are lies but seem to be deliberately used for some form of dishonest gain.
Then of course we have lawyers telling lies in court about shunning. 
And C.S.A court cases have proved that elders and others have deliberately lied. And the American 'section' of the JW Org deliberately withholding information regarding such matters.
Link this to misuse of scriptures, such as, Superior Authorities, which deliberately took away people's conscience / freedom of choice, in WW2.
And I'm sure people here can come up with lots more examples of lies, deliberate wrongdoing, mistakes, misinterpretations, 'new light' corrections et al.
Why am i writing all this ?  Well I am proving two points. 
1. If it's your 'only game in town' then it's not a good one. 
2. That calling it 'The Truth' is totally deceptive.
I do not think you would like it if I gave you a meal that was three quarters yummy, but a quarter poison. The poison might well contaminate the good food !
So, saying that the Org / GB are three quarters right does not help. 
 
 
 
 

@TrueTomHarley  I think it would be very difficult, impossible in fact, to be an honest whistle blower and stay inside JW Org.  If a person wishes to be totally honest in giving warning / making others aware of serious problems in the Org, then they would need to use their real name. Once the elders of his/her congregation became aware of what he/she was doing, then disfellowshippping would closely follow. Once a person becomes disfellowshipped their input is discredited by many. The only way to truly whistle blow about JW Org would be to leave the Org first, giving valid reasons for doing so. 
It is remarkable however that you @TrueTomHarley turn whistle blowers into apostates with just a flick of your fingers on your keyboard. I care not that you've put it in inverted commas, the accusation is still there. 
Who knows, if enough of these whistle blowers got together, they could form another 'religion'. After all didn't Rutherford  & Co come from former religions and then build a new one ? These whistle blowers could simply carry over the good and discard the bad points of JW Org.   Come to think of it, Jesus' disciples did much the same. Carry over the good points from the Mosaic Law and discard the bits no longer needed, thereby forming the new way of serving God properly.  And they would have been seen as 'mentally ill' by the Jews. 

Wow, Having missed only two hours on here, I am now 3 pages behind. Makes it rather difficult to keep up and even more so when the subject changes so much on each topic. 
I do think there is a vast difference in what the 'early Christians' said and did as opposed to what the J W Org / GB say and do now.  Someone mentioned about  'those not with us now that were formerly with us', as part of a scripture (you see i do find it difficult to relate to it all ) . But the scripture was concerning those 'early Christians' which were inspired of God and of the Anointed. They would have known 'pure' truth from the Hebrew scriptures, and also have been guided directly by God through Christ and through Holy Spirit. 
How can anyone relate that to a Governing Body that admit that they are not inspired of God ? How can you relate that to an Organisation that is so big, that the Governing Body is totally out of touch with it ?  A Governing Body that admit that they do wrong (err), as well as make mistakes.  
Having followed this 'blog' for a long time, I've seen / read, many here that have given proof of 'mistakes' / wrong doing by the Governing Body, the Writing Department, Elders et al.  So how can a person compare a scripture which relates to the pure worship of God through Christ, of those first century Christians. It makes no sense. In the time of the disciples/ apostles, true worship was direct, because the 'group of people' involved was small. The Greek scriptures were written directly by those actually hands on, doing daily work, and having direct guidance. What can we say now ? No one is inspired by God. No one is pure. The Governing Body give themselves the tittle of F & D S, but it proves nothing, because they get so much wrong.  We've also seen by written examples here on this blog , that the elders do not show the love and care for the 'flock'. 
I do however like the idea of the 'Apostasy spectrum' because the word apostate is banded about by those in the J W org just as an excuse not to talk to or mix with someone, even if said J W knows nothing about the reason someone is no longer attending meetings or has left the Org. 
I would talk personally with Arauna when she says, a person can only be an apostate to the truth. My answer is, But truth changes week by week in J W Org. 
Mr Rook, I thought the Charity Commission here in the UK were thinking of stopping the 'allowances' too, but it hasn't happened yet. 
 

You talking about WT Society and "higher education" ? Because i spoke about "higher education" as something that GB see as not good for members. GB consider such plase as "brood" of fornication and demonic influence. But people where ever they  go will be faced with bad things ….even in JW congregations.
“The educational system varies from country to country. In the United States, for example, public schools offer 12 years of basic education. Thereafter, students may choose to attend university or college for four or more years, leading to a bachelor’s degree or to postgraduate studies for careers in medicine, law, engineering, and so forth. Such university education is what is meant when the term “higher education” is used in this article. On the other hand, there are technical and vocational schools, offering short-term courses that result in a certificate or diploma in some trade or service.” Watchtower 2005 Oct 1 p.27
The educational system in many countries teaches students not only practical skills but also human philosophy. Students are encouraged to question the existence of God and to disregard the Bible. …. Some Christians who have pursued university education have had their minds molded by human thinking rather than by God’s thinking. .... A sister who has been in full-time service for over 15 years says: “As a baptized Witness, I had read and heard about the dangers of pursuing university education ............ What effect did higher education have on this sister’s thinking? She answers: “I am ashamed to admit that the education I pursued taught me to be critical of others, especially my brothers and sisters, to expect too much of them, and to isolate myself from them -   Watchtower 2019 Jun pp.6-7
….and so forth
 

Last week i experienced, in interval of few minutes, how two elders from another congregation respond on my look at them, accros the street, and giving greting with smile. Younger, son of older brother, returned with a smile. Few minutes later, two sisters standing with box and looked at woman with dog. I was walking beside them, again with happy face with looking on sister from my ex congregation, She returned with a smile on her face. …..Or maybe that was because of playing with dog :))))