2 hours ago, Arauna said:

I have tried to reach out to him.... but he does not respond to any form of kindness or even agreement. He puts himself above all of that.

You don't need to reach out to me, I'm not important. What you should do is, continue the great commission, regardless of what your personal feeling are. I cannot believe, you have a NONE JW defending the truth more so than real JWs. How can that be?

Am I saying, be harsh as me? No! @Space Merchant doesn't allow for attitudes, even though he might slip once in a while with me. But, he puts his best foot forward, which is something you should all have learned long ago.

(Proverbs 22:29) 29 Have you seen a man skillful at his work? He will stand before kings; He will not stand before common men.
 

4 hours ago, Pudgy said:

It appears here that you are claiming to be an Elder of Jehovah’s Witnesses. 

No! I don't have that type of mission. If it takes someone 22 years to develop another person's spirituality, that person needs to reconsider their own spirituality. God's Holy Spirit enriches the soul to develop good fruits.

There are dozens upon dozens of converts from the past that I know and are still around that were properly guided by the spirit, and they still produce fine fruits even in these trying times.

That's the blessing of obedience. 

(Leviticus 26:11, 12) . . .. 12 I will walk among you and be your God, and you for your part will be my people. . .

(2 Corinthians 6:16) 16 And what agreement does God’s temple have with idols? For we are a temple of a living God; just as God said: “I will reside among them and walk among them, and I will be their God, and they will be my people. . .
 

4 minutes ago, Pudgy said:

I have never claimed to be a “good” Christian, and if it were not for the training and education I received from OTHER highly flawed Jehovah’s Witnesses, I would have had a very short life, dying on a battlefield somewhere, or worse.

That's where we differ, I was taught by the best Bible educated person, Fred Franz. Even so, we all have a choice to make. You can either dedicate yourself to the service of God, or you can rely on your own interpretation of scripture and fool yourself into thinking you are doing the right thing.

8 minutes ago, Pudgy said:

A lot worse.

We should NEVER stop trying to be a Christian.

As the famous cartoon character Pogo once said “We have met the enemy, and he is us.”

I don't expect you to. I want to see, you dust yourself off and fight for your salvation. Ask God for mercy and forgiveness, even if you think you are talked out. Just like God, I refuse to see quitters in a race they started toward their personal salvation. I hate to think people coming here will be influenced in not accepting the righteous path of Christ. JWs are better than that.

Like I said, it's not about me, it's about getting you people here back in the correct road to salvation, no matter what it takes.

1 hour ago, JW Insider said:

I suspect that his personality has already made trouble for himself with the elders, and that this is one of the reasons he reaches out here. Like the guy who gets yelled at when he's at work, and must find a dog to kick when he gets home.

You need to know someone, to know that. I convene committee's not get dictated by them. I follow God's laws. You people don't. So, don't think for one minute, I would associate myself with you fake witnesses here, much less call you brothers. Baptism meant something to me. I have yet to see any committee not understand my position against apostates. Especially those from within my institution that none of you, should be part of.

But, it has never been about me. It's the falsehood and deception you people offer to the visitor. If you think there can't be someone as strong as Peter among the ranks, then you just meant one. Until you understand about "gifts" are, you will always be blind.

However, I don't need to explain myself to none of you. That you don't get to know.

15 minutes ago, Thinking said:

Well thank you..for I thought I must be going nuts or have thin skin …but I would have to say there is no excuse for cruelness…and at some stage someone needs to stop such..because it cannot come from a source or spirit as Jehovah …

You wouldn't be counseled in any KH, you'd be disfellowshipped no matter how you slice it, just like that obtuse mutt, @Pudgy. That institution has no need for more apostates. There are millions already. You should join them and stop trying to be something you're not, Christian.

@Srecko Sostar I believe @Arauna, was wrongfully motived to defend her fake sister when that person wrongfully stated angels have different laws in heaven from us on earth. Like I mentioned, how does misrepresenting scripture make any sense? Then @Arauna wanted to justify her argument with the phrase free will. After, she made several more mistakes.

These people definitely need to learn scripture, but they seem to think by trying to prove me wrong, they prove, they are unredacted when it comes to bible understanding. Now, I'm not saying ExJWs are any better, but they should know better. That's why I will never believe they are JWs in good standing.

(Jeremiah 33:25) 25 “This is what Jehovah says: ‘Just as surely as I have established my covenant regarding the day and the night, the laws of heaven and earth, 
 

1 hour ago, Arauna said:

Satan - the minute he lied to Eva. 

Then Sin started with him and no one else. Adam and Eve came after. From that point, it's been his doing. There was no one before the devil to cause sin in heaven or earth.

1 hour ago, Arauna said:

No , but you referred to Nephilim  and the destruction of all. and you said a few things which are incorrect.

Perhaps by your lack of knowledge. As far as scripture states, the Nephilim and the rest of humanity was destroyed except 8 people and 2 of every animal. How is your @JW Insider style of argument, make it incorrect?

If you don't understand my post, it's simple, stay out of my conversation and stop being obtuse like @JW Insider  provoking a meaningless argument. 

If you people here use half the space of desperately trying to find fault with me, and direct yourselves in proving your worth a Christians, visitors might believe you are Christian. Loyalty is something else. Bible knowledge is something you people lack. That is sad since you come from an institution that prides itself with scriptural understanding.

1 hour ago, Srecko Sostar said:

It was just a moment of weakness. :)))

Then, you should have more weak moments. 😁

1 hour ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Yes, but a burning bush, a donkey, a voice from heaven do not support the claim/view as sort of rule.

Why are you challenging God in what he can or can't do?

1 hour ago, Srecko Sostar said:

JWs who say that they  are part of 144000 believe they will be sort of spiritual creatures similar to angels but much higher in position. Sort of transformation from human to angels?

How is the anointed receiving their heavenly reward, mean they can transfer to an angel then back to man? Do you understand the word transform?

If you believe those that are called to heaven to support Christ as kings will come back after their task is done, then you don't understand that process. Short answer, no they won't

42 minutes ago, Arauna said:

Jehovah would not destroy any who are righteous.  They knew that Noah was building the ark - even Noahs father, wife and brothers did not listen...... They were NOT punished because the angels were wicked. Noah through his obedience condemned them.

Are you going to squabble over a word that makes sense to others? Does the word "Destroyed" work better for you? How about, eliminated? Did I include Noah in the commentary, or did you need to see his name in my post?

32 minutes ago, Arauna said:

All moral creatures have free will to choose in every situation what they want to do.

Who do you believe was first to break that free will to disobedience, or do you believe there were others in the Garden?

1 hour ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Well, of course, Thinking's thesis about a special law for angels, and a special one for people, is not probable. Because both types of creatures have free will,  and they interact with each other according to Bible text. 

Glad to see you possess common sense.

1 hour ago, Srecko Sostar said:

It is this/those characteristic that connects them more than anything else (life form, place of life and abilities) separates them.

Will, no! Angels took human form when they needed to speak directly to someone, like Abraham, Lot, etc. Genesis 18:2

Also, man cannot transform to an angel.

3 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Maybe it makes sense. But then we wonder, if some action is a sin in one group?.... and the same action in another group is not a sin?

Does it make sense? All creation is under the same laws, since God made those commandments and laws. Satan was punished for his disobedience and free will. The legion of demons had their offspring punished by disobeying God. Those Nephilim had angelic spirit in them. That's why they were so strong. Humanity was punished for their disobedience and wickedness. A sentence that came directly from God.

What part of that misrepresentation of scripture makes sense to you? What part of Matthew 6:10 doesn't register?

1 hour ago, Witness said:

Now come on, Allen.  By the way, thank you for your condolences. 

Your most welcome.

1 hour ago, Witness said:

I think you are the one in conflict with your thoughts.  Jesus is the Son of man and the Son of God.  So, do you realize what you are saying, that not only should an anointed woman, or any woman, be submissive to the Son of Man, which is correct, but all fleshly men who claim to be “spiritual” – like the Preacher?    Do you realize that you have put Jesus Christ on par with fleshly men? 

Can you expand on this, since all of humanity was given the opportunity to be saved through Christ? Christ is the way for the anointed, other sheep and all mankind. Meaning, regardless of man or woman, Christians are to trust the word of God, not pick and chose what we like out of it, or do you think that should be allowed?

1 hour ago, Witness said:

What on earth have you been drinking?

While, it is a valid question, and adjusting for humor, I would say the same thing you are. 😏😅

4 hours ago, Space Merchant said:

hat is true, as well as the fact even the government cannot govern themselves. If they had to use God's Word, at times, they'll do so incorrectly. But granted of how man's law is, as is the recent situations mentioned, it is a double-edged sword which can prove to cause more problems for anyone, even concerning CSA.

Well, the proof of that, are in the proven facts about the Australian government and the ARC court. However, when it comes to CSA, you had an entire city in the U.K. try to hide facts about child abuse to those that were investigating certain allegations. That means, the entire city government was involved, and it was proven. I can't begin to explain the child abuse in Canada with their government run orphanages. Yet, these countries, Australia, Canada, and the United Kingdom, are the most critical against the Watchtower. That just means those countries are hypocrites when it comes to not allowing investigators to look into their enteral problems.

5 hours ago, Space Merchant said:

xactly, a level of bystander syndrome. This also goes for those of domestic abuse.

Moreover, the culture concerning Police has changed in which people deem them the enemy because of a few bad Individuals, for instance, the case of Daniel Holtzclaw, and his actions in the black community and how it concluded.

Glad you see the truth correctly. Unfortunately, you can't force people, especially here, to see that truth.

5 hours ago, Space Merchant said:

I have many times and those who speak of CSA don't take action, but I guess the next time CSA is brought up, I might just update my thread concerning CSA and teaching children. Granted it benefited the visitors before, it is would be a good thing to bring it up again. But as of recent, I am looking for the video and information of what I told @Equivocation, even @Patiently waiting for Truth. If I can find it, or whatever is left of it, I can add that to my update.

Glad to see you are welling.

2 hours ago, Witness said:

If you believe this organization is "spirit-directed", then the Spirit of God would gather the anointed together under Jesus Christ.  

Since the anointed know "truth", it seems that every effort would be made to look to them as a collective body for spiritual understanding of scriptures, instead of to those who "represent the royal priesthood".   

Does this mean Pearl Doxsey has direct conversations with Christ, just like the Pope thinks he does with God in that little darkroom above the Vatican? Can you post proof of this? I thought ExJWs don't believe the anointed have a direct channel to heaven by inspiration. So, what you are saying, Your anointed sees Christ materialize to Pearl like he did with the apostles and Paul. Are you now saying Pearl Doxey is the 14th Apostle, like the Mormons believe Joseph Smith was?

2 hours ago, Witness said:

Allen sir,  I cannot be submissive to an earthly husband I no longer have.   Christ only, is my spiritual head, even when my husband was alive.

Then you followed scripture to a certain point. You say, you have Christ as your spiritual head, even though he is the Son of Man.  Can you explain this conflict?

2 hours ago, Witness said:

He never was my spiritual head, only my fleshly head.  But we worked together equally, with equal respect for one another.  "Headship" should be based on love, just as the scriptures in

He might not have been a JW, but you acted upon scripture, that's good. It's established in scripture that a husband should honor his wife as an equal, since she is weaker than the husband. 1 Peter 3:7

Therefore, your husband did not have to be your spirit head in order to follow God's commands. Therefore, your refusal to respect those men that are in a responsible position that are led by God's Holy Spirit is contrary to what is written by God's inspired words. Thus making your stance wrong as a Christian.

By the way, my belated condolences on your lose.

8 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

I thought it (this verse) was about if you wanted to jump from 100 meters and tell God, now save me if you're powerful.

You have just said, what Satan told Jesus.

NIV Matt 4:5-7

5 Then the devil took him to the holy city and had him stand on the highest point of the temple. 6 "If you are the Son of God," he said, "throw yourself down. For it is written:

"'He will command his angels concerning you, and they will lift you up in their hands, so that you will not strike your foot against a stone.'"

7 Jesus answered him, "It is also written: 'Do not put the Lord your God to the test.'

How, can testing God which is what you are doing, testing the spirit of those calling themselves Christians? Those pretending to be Christians are also testing God by interpreting scripture their way.

8 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

“Saints” have come to this status in the past through anointing with/by the Spirit. Today’s “anointed” come to their status as they take symbols of bread and wine.

And by extension the Elders are given that responsibility while the saints concentrate on the matters of that spirit. Therefore, Elders are led by the Holy Spirit. 

Something everyone here confuses.

9 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

It seems to me that this could be related to the idea that "God allows evil". If he allows it to happen everywhere and towards everyone and from everyone then it might be clear to you why caution is in place. 

This can only come from a blind person. How does allowing evil the same as dispensing evil? Are you suggesting, God compelled @Pudgy to do evil?

1 hour ago, Arauna said:

ok - please tell me in which congregation of Jehovah's witnesses you will find 2 - 3 anointed people today. 

I understand this comment is meant for @Witness. However, can you clarify your position?

*** w12 10/15 p. 14 par. 8 What Kind of Spirit Do You Show? ***
8 To avoid that kind of spirit, we can remember that Jesus is pictured in the Bible as having “in his right hand seven stars.” The “stars” represent the anointed overseers and, by extension, all the overseers in the congregations. Jesus can direct the “stars” in his hand in any way he feels appropriate. (Rev. 1:16, 20) Thus, as Head of the Christian congregation, Jesus has full control of the bodies of elders. If someone on a body truly needs correction, the One who has “eyes as a fiery flame” will see to it that this is done in His own time and way. (Rev. 1:14) In the meantime, we maintain proper respect for those appointed by holy spirit, for Paul wrote: “Be obedient to those who are taking the lead among you and be submissive, for they are keeping watch over your souls as those who will render an account; that they may do this with joy and not with sighing, for this would be damaging to you.”—Heb. 13:17.
 

3 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to determine if they are from God,... - 1 John 4:1

Unfortunately, that does not apply to God. 

NIV Luke 4:12

12 Jesus answered, "It says: 'Do not put the Lord your God to the test.
 

So, if a lightening bolt strikes you, you only have yourself to blame. 😉

3 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

God is spirit, demons are spirits, WTJWorg are spirit guided organization, Bible is inspired by spirit, human also have spirit. All of this numbered are connected to "spirit".

Glad you can distinguish, between good and evil. However, at what point do you believe God applied his spirit to evil? 

3 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

What is wrong to put all sorts of this spirits to challenge, to test?

With man, knock yourself out. With God and Christ, never!

Be careful, you might be smitten by God where you stand. 😬

4 hours ago, Witness said:

A couple people here have been speaking about "church".  SM has the opinion (well, he calls it "fact"),  that within that church, women must be under the headship of men.  I am now a widow, am I under the spiritual headship of a Christian man?  

This depends, do you consider Christ a man?

4 hours ago, Witness said:

This spiritual church is the Bride of Christ. 

Who comprises the Body of Christ alongside the saints?

4 hours ago, Witness said:

JWs have decided that women are under a spiritual head, not only that of their husband, but also of elders.  That’s not what the scriptures say.  

Which bible are you relying on? Why do you find it a need to go against Christ as a widow? You do realize Christ instructed the apostles, don't you.

NIV 1 Peter 3:1-3

3 Wives, in the same way be submissive to your husbands so that, if any of them do not believe the word, they may be won over without words by the behavior of their wives, 2 when they see the purity and reverence of your lives.

4 minutes ago, Space Merchant said:

Well not of the legal system, the solutions, even the ones based on biblical means. The problem is not everyone seems to follow or apply it, hence the influence gained in regard to CSA, which reaps reaction. But knowing the functions of a legal system also helps too, however, it is a double-edged sword.

When  it comes to the legal system, governments don't recognize scripture. Therefore, it's more complex for the Watchtower, that has to deal with man's law and God's law, together.

8 minutes ago, Space Merchant said:

As for the last remark, also true, people tend to not know how the law works, as for calling the police, among the solutions parents, guardians and or relatives can do this also, for CSA prevention is aware that some people do not want to get involved in such things and will encourage, not all of them, but some, mainly if they are not equipped to handle the situation.

Before, the victim was advised they had every right to call the police themselves, or by any family member. That can be easily proven by the letters to the Elders. When governments started cracking down on those issues in 2013, it was a slow rollout. It wasn't until the U.N. made recommendations because of child trafficking in 2016, it took off. What people here don't seem to understand, back then, some wives or a child didn't pursue secular justice out of FEAR! The Watchtower could not force someone, but at times, they did intervene for the safety of the victims.

However, there are still nations that afford the Clergy Privilege. Therefore, those institutions need to adhere to those privileges since, certain things would not be admissible in a court of law.

The Watchtower, still recommends any victim to pursue legal enforcement.

22 minutes ago, Space Merchant said:

For in the end no group is immune to CSA, even the paradigm, but one paradigm is already making it difficult as of 2022 whereas children risk is higher and frequent.

Explain that, not just to ExJWs but also, those that claim to be JWs.

1 hour ago, Space Merchant said:

The thing is the CSA thing is an issue that plagues both JWs and former JWs, often times manipulated by a fringe group among EXJW who's warpath isn't making anything better. In @Patiently waiting for Truth's case, the primary issue of his is CSA, even interjects it at random and unnecessary times.

Once again, how does  his mockery of the legal system help others? It's one thing to have sympathy for the victims, but another thing when he, stirrup a hornet nest with lies. Therefore, it's not possible to praise his intent.

1 hour ago, Space Merchant said:

This is why I told him and @Srecko Sostar to actually be grounded in this regard on different platforms to speak to both sides rather than attack. Granted @Srecko Sostar is from the Cedar crowd, him and that group are not fond of seeking grounded solutions with anyone, even JWs, laughed and bashed it in the past, when coined again, he tried to deviate from something that could be beneficial to reduce the problem in any way possible.

When it comes to emotions, people need to have the right attitude when it's made toward such sensitive issues. You actually had JWs praising him without personal proof, here. He left the institution on hearsay. Yet, fools got upset when I called out @Pudgy with information the police and his State Government uses. They figured such a person is dangerous. That is just down right obtuse.  One fool even praised him when he emailed the UK IICSA. These are all so-called Witnesses. Therefore, here it doesn't matter. This platform is full of deception.

1 hour ago, Space Merchant said:

In @Patiently waiting for Truth's case he uses a platform, even attested to it now. Although I do not like Big Tech granted their view on CSA and what they do, Butler actually can speak on the issue, however he is not grounded, this is parallel to someone such as @Equivocation  (as is some aware EXJWs who are outcast in their community) who is - granted he is able to see that not all in his community is equipped to deal with the issue whereas Butler assumes otherwise, for the CSA situation, Bystander Syndrome, is a global thing in all issues. As for Facebook, it has a CSA problem granted over the internet it is a complex issue.

What good does it do the public when this platform allows for lies and deception? Once again, what benefit does this person possess?

1 hour ago, Space Merchant said:

For if there not too many people who are grounded concerning the issue, CSA will be a problem for the unaware, and when abuse happens, a domino effect of problems and a headache for those involved as is indirectly.

I'd say, no one here is. They allow their emotions and sympathy do the talking for them,  instead of closely looking at an individual issue under a microscope. The ARC report is one of them. Those cases were in a span of 20 years. Some of those cases were women. There was limited information given to the government due to the Australian Privacy laws. Meaning, the Elders could only use information that they could use. So, if a person admitted to "Child Porn", that person would end up in that list. Why? In part, by the limitations made by that government to classify., Institutions could only categorize it one way, pedophilia. Now, what other information can make the list under the Watchtower? Depending on government regulations, some churches also included substantive information about spousal abuse, fornication, adultery, Child Neglect. Why does the government need to see that information about adultery, fornication, and masturbation? Yet, you have fools demanding the release of such information. 

Governments combine a wide range of issues into pedophilia. 

Therefore, it doesn't matter how you want to justify certain peoples, action, if no one here understands how to apply, government's laws correctly; the LAWS of the land, STAY out of those issues.

If you personally see something, and you wish to get involved, call the police and do your best to keep your recollection honest. However, until that happens,

1 Thessalonians 4:11

English Standard Version

1 hour ago, Srecko Sostar said:

It is reminiscent of Russell's time, when assemblies elected their own elders. I have nothing against it.

Well, to Russell's credit, he wanted the churches to choose their Elders like stated in scripture. However, as you can see it was meant for a body of men, not just one.  Then, just like @Space Merchant mentioned, there were churches that went rogue on him. So, contrary to popular belief, Russell didn't approve of such division. 

SM121
misconceptions of the Divine Word and Plan, and that the causes which originally led to Church divisions have considerably disappeared. If we can now recognize one true Gospel we may all reunite, in harmony with our Master's prayer, that "All may be one, as Thou, Father, and I are one."--John 17:21.

And no! The SM is not Space Merchant, lol!😁

It's from, Pastor Russell's sermons.

5 minutes ago, Srecko Sostar said:

That's fine with me. We disagree on many things, but I appreciate your intention.

Then you are the only one that does. Too many haters here to be called Christian. 😉

7 minutes ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Yes I saw the comments. Prohibition is nonsense. If I see you driving drunk then you should definitely be banned from driving.

You just made my day, thanks! 🤭

8 minutes ago, Srecko Sostar said:

SM? Ahhh. I was here. Do you/what you expected from me to do about that?

That's why I ask for clarification to everyone that needs to. Unfortunately, people like @JW Insider,  @TrueTomHarley and @Thinking have a great disdain for that. They prefer to see the visitor accept their nonsense, because certain people here do have the power to ban, even though they make false claims that they can't.