"Let Us Test And Examine Our Ways..." Lam 3:40

[Guest]

"Let us examine and scrutinize our ways, and let us return to Jehovah."

 

There is not a householder class. There is not a thief class. There is not a slave class. There is not a drunkard class. There is not a master class. There is not a hypocrite class.

 

There is an illustration about keeping on the watch:

 

"Keep on the watch, therefore, because you do not know on what day your Lord is coming. But know one thing: If the householder had known in what watch the thief was coming, he would have kept awake and not allowed his house to be broken into.  On this account, you too prove yourselves ready, because the Son of man is coming at an hour that you do not think to be it. Who really is the faithful and discreet slave whom his master appointed over his domestics, to give them their food at the proper time?  Happy is that slave if his master on coming finds him doing so!  Truly I say to you, he will appoint him over all his belongings. But if ever that evil slave says in his heart, ‘My master is delaying,’  and he starts to beat his fellow slaves and to eat and drink with the confirmed drunkards,  the master of that slave will come on a day that he does not expect and in an hour that he does not know,  and he will punish him with the greatest severity and will assign him his place with the hypocrites. There is where his weeping and the gnashing of his teeth will be."

 

Are you faithful? Great. Good job being obedient to the master. He's going to be happy with you when he gets here.

 

Are you discreet? Great. Good job being obedient to the master. He's going to be happy with you when he gets here.

 

Are you mean to others and not paying attention to Jesus' direction? Things won't go so well for you when he gets here.

 

Not too complicated. Not a clergy title "The Faithful And Discreet Slave". In fact, taking that title is in opposition to Jesus' clear command to not call any man "Good" or "Rabbi" because Jehovah is the Good one in the heavens.

 

"And one of the rulers questioned him, saying: “Good Teacher, what must I do to inherit everlasting life?”  Jesus said to him: “Why do you call me good? Nobody is good except one, God."

 

"But you, do not you be called Rabbi, for one is your Teacher, and all of you are brothers. Moreover, do not call anyone your father on earth, for one is your Father, the heavenly One.  Neither be called leaders, for your Leader is one, the Christ.  But the greatest one among you must be your minister.  Whoever exalts himself will be humbled, and whoever humbles himself will be exalted."

 

Those men who take such titles will be humbled when they get what's coming to them, their reward in full for misleading the flock and misrepresenting Jehovah.

 

"Then God spoke all these words:  

“I am Jehovah your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of slavery.  You must not have any other gods besides me. 

“You must not make for yourself a carved image or a form like anything that is in the heavens above or on the earth below or in the waters under the earth.  You must not bow down to them nor be enticed to serve them, for I, Jehovah your God, am a God who requires exclusive devotion, bringing punishment for the error of fathers upon sons, upon the third generation and upon the fourth generation of those who hate me,  but showing loyal love to the thousandth generation of those who love me and keep my commandments. 

“You must not take up the name of Jehovah your God in a worthless way, for Jehovah will not leave unpunished the one who takes up His name in a worthless way."

 

We are not under the Mosaic Law, but it's still wrong to idolize men, and then to say it is "worshipping Jehovah" to idolize men is a double no-no. Especially when those men make doctrines and traditions in opposition to what is clearly written in God's Word, like about abstaining from all blood, and about showing love.

 

Those who act like the wicked slave will be thrown out. Jesus said so.

 

Praise Jehovah.

[Witness]

3 hours ago, AnnaNana said:

Keep holding fast what you have until I come."

He meant hold fast to Truth! The truth given at the time of anointing.   He didn't mean hold fast to an organization!  

"I know your works. Look, I have placed before you an open door that no one can close because you have but little power; yet you have kept my word and have not denied my name. ⁹ Note this: I will make those from the synagogue of Satan, who claim to be Jews and are not, but are lying—I will make them come and bow down at your feet, and they will know that I have loved you. ¹⁰ Because you have kept my command to endure, I will also keep you from the hour of testing that is going to come on the whole world to test those who live on the earth. ¹¹ I am coming soon. Hold on to what you have, so that no one takes your crown."  Revelation 3:8-11

If there's an open door in front of you you have to go to the door to walk through it.

 

3 hours ago, AnnaNana said:

The reapers are angels. When Jesus is enthroned, he will send his angels to take out all those things causing a stumbling and people doing wickedness.

Mat 13:30 - “Let both grow together until the harvest. At harvest time I’ll tell the reapers: Gather the weeds first and tie them in bundles to burn them, but collect the wheat in my barn.’"

Matt 3:12 – “His winnowing shovel is in his hand, and he will clear his threshing floor and gather his wheat into the barn. But the chaff he will burn with fire that never goes out.”

 

Matt 24:31 – “He will send out his angels with a loud trumpet, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of the sky to the other.”

 

Is 42:6-8 - “I am the Lord. I have called you

for a righteous purpose,

and I will hold you by your hand.

I will watch over you, and I will appoint you

to be a covenant for the people

and a light to the nations,

7 in order to open blind eyes,

to bring out prisoners from the dungeon,

and those sitting in darkness from the prison house.

8 I am the Lord. That is my name,

and I will not give my glory to another

or my praise to idols.”

“Once again, the kingdom of heaven is like a net that was let down into the lake and caught all kinds of fish. When it was full, the fishermen pulled it up on the shore. Then they sat down and collected the good fish in baskets, but threw the bad away. This is how it will be at the end of the age. The angels will come and separate the wicked from the righteous 50 and throw them into the blazing furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. Matt 13:47-50

 

Anyone who tells JWs to REMAIN in slavery to men and their lies, (Gal 1:10) have no sincere compassion for sheep tossed and skinned about by an abusive leadership, who disregards victims of their own faulty, corrupt leadership; who threatens them by saying they have blood on their hands if they don’t get out in service and share their lies about 1914, “this generation”, the thousand year reign of Christ, about Christ himself, and avoid the scriptures that teach exactly where the man of lawlessness is found…anyone who encourages JWs to sit in apathy, in a false sense of peace and security, (1 Thess 5:3) has only evil intentions to keep JWs captive in bondage and blindness, and away from the full light of Christ.   

Your words ring hollow. Babylon the Great is the promise of death. (Isa 28:14-19) It is where false teachers/false prophets have made their haven of lies. (Rev 16:13-16) We are to escape that haven, not sit obediently to lying men, waiting for your false prophecy to come true. What does Revelation 18:4-8 tell you? Do you really want JWs to remain where the leadership's sins have piled up to heaven? Do you want them to remain inside and share in those sins?

That is what you are telling them to do, which is the opposite of whatGod is telling them to do.  

Jer 6:13-19 - https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Jer+6%3A13-19&version=CSB

Rev 3: “Write to the angel of the church in Laodicea: Thus says the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the originator of God’s creation: 15 I know your works, that you are neither cold nor hot. I wish that you were cold or hot. 16 So, because you are lukewarm, and neither hot nor cold, I am going to vomit you out of my mouth. 17 For you say, ‘I’m rich; I have become wealthy and need nothing,’ and you don’t realize that you are wretched, pitiful, poor, blind, and naked. 18 I advise you to buy from me gold refined in the fire so that you may be rich, white clothes so that you may be dressed and your shameful nakedness not be exposed, and ointment to spread on your eyes so that you may see. 19 As many as I love, I rebuke and discipline.

So be zealous and repent. ²⁰ See! I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and eat with him, and he with me.”  Rev 3:14-20

“Come to me, all of you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest.” Matt 11:28

 

 

[Guest]

"John to the seven congregations..."

 

John wrote to the congregations.

 

"...saying: “What you see, write in a scroll and send it to the seven congregations..."

 

The message was from Jehovah to Jesus to John to the congregations.

 

"As for the sacred secret of the seven stars that you saw in my right hand and of the seven golden lampstands: The seven stars mean the angels of the seven congregations, and the seven lampstands mean the seven congregations."

 

Angels are angels. Congregations are congregations. It's not complicated.

 

There are angels who are looking out after the the congregations. The angels were not permitted to strike until after the anointed were all sealed and Jesus is enthroned. Once Jesus is enthroned, then the angels will get the command to remove the "weeds". Jesus wants us to know that the angels are involved in protecting those in the congregations during the great tribulation that is to come.

 

"To the angel of the congregation in Ephʹe·sus write..."

 

"And to the angel of the congregation in Smyrʹna write..."

 

"Let the one who has an ear hear what the spirit says to the congregations..."

 

"To the angel of the congregation in Perʹga·mum write..."

 

"Let the one who has an ear hear what the spirit says to the congregations..."

 

I think you get the point. I could go on and quote more times the direction is clearly to the angels of the congregations, in the hearing of the congregations. The message to John was from God, to Jesus, through an angel, to John. It is the same pattern. The angels are involved. Jesus wants us to know that the angels are here and they know who really belongs to Jehovah. The angels are not "the elders". The angels are the angels. They were involved in the "marking" work described in Ezekiel, marking for survival those in the congregation who are sighing and groaning over what is going on in the organization. Whether or not someone is part of the congregation is not based on what a committee of men says or a label like "disfellowshipped" or even "baptized". It is based on Jesus' judgment.

 

The congregation is the arrangement described in the scriptures. Humans live on a physical earth. The congregation on earth is also physical. The "priesthood" congregation is not on earth. It is in heaven. The context helps us to know which one is being talked about. 

 

The congregation that becomes the priesthood is not in heaven yet. When they are in heaven, they will not need to be corrected regarding Jezebel/Balaam/SectOfNicholaus/etc because when they are in heaven they are perfect.

 

The message to the congregations in Revelation is for the earthly organization of Jehovah's Witnesses, those associated with them, witnesses of Jehovah.

 

The message to the congregation in Thyatira was to hold fast what you have, which includes the congregation arrangement. Jesus did not say to leave. Jesus said he would send his angels to remove the false teachings and wicked ones from the congregations. Jesus hasn't done that yet. But he will. He is faithful.

 

Jesus wants us to know we don't need to be afraid. He's got this. There was an angel who went ahead of them when they left Egypt. Jehovah has not changed. There are angels helping us today too. Jesus is their commander. He knows where everybody is, and he will not lose even one of His Father's Sheep. But we have to obey him when he says to stay with the current arrangement. Even if wicked men cast us out, we have to recognize the congregation is the arrangement and do the best we can to wait for it to be fixed. We hold fast what we have until he comes, whether we are currently in the congregation or outside of it. Some of us are in figurative "prison" as regards not being able to be reinstated until the kingdom is in place because wicked men would demand we do an act of worship to them in order to be reinstated. We will not do an act of worship to men. Jesus knows what we are dealing with. Hold fast to whatever we have. Keep our integrity. We obey God as ruler rather than man if men demand worship that only belongs to God. Jesus is coming soon, and all these manmade doctrines will be done away with. But the congregation will still be there. It will be cleansed and refined. Wait for it.

 

"The one who bears witness of these things says, ‘Yes, I am coming quickly.’” 

“Amen! Come, Lord Jesus.” 

May the undeserved kindness of the Lord Jesus be with the holy ones."

[Moise Racette]

38 minutes ago, Witness said:

He meant hold fast to Truth! The truth given at the time of anointing.   He didn't mean hold fast to an organization!  

You mean like the kind of organization you are a part of as an apostate?

I see you refuse to answer the question just like that spiritual infant. Don't have the courage to accept a challenge?

38 minutes ago, Witness said:

Anyone who tells JWs to REMAIN in slavery to men and their lies

Can the same thing be said about those that "remain" in slavery to Pearl Doxsey and their lies?

38 minutes ago, Witness said:

who disregards victims of their own faulty, corrupt leadership; who threatens them by saying they have blood on their hands if they don’t get out in service and share their lies about 1914, “this generation”, the thousand year reign of Christ, about Christ himself, and avoid the scriptures that teach exactly where the man of lawlessness is found…anyone who encourages JWs to sit in apathy, in a false sense of peace and security, (1 Thess 5:3) has only evil intentions to keep JWs captive in bondage and blindness, and away from the full light of Christ.   

You mean, people just like yourself? People that don't accept scripture and are leading God's creation astray with lies, and corrupt leadership like Pearl Doxsey?

• Every day, in the temple courts and from house to house, they did not stop teaching and proclaiming the good news that Jesus is the Christ. Acts 10:36 He has sent this message to the people of Israel, proclaiming the gospel of peace through Jesus Christ, who is Lord of all.

So, who is doing the "threatening" apostate? Your kind of substandard human beings that subvert scripture by misinterpretation.

[Moise Racette]

16 minutes ago, AnnaNana said:

Some of us are in figurative "prison" as regards not being able to be reinstated until the kingdom is in place because wicked men would demand we do an act of worship to them in order to be reinstated. We will not do an act of worship to men.

Seems, this person is advocating for @Pudgy lol! The only prison is in your head. You can leave anytime you want. apostate. No one is holding you, nor need your kind. Seek fellowship with @Witness since you share many of the same views.

Both of you are crucifying Christ every time you post and condemn God's words. Both blasphemous attributes from false prophets.

[Guest]

@Witness, I can tell you have been hurt by the organization. It is obvious. 

 

Do you remember all the witnesses who endured the concentration camps? I'm sure you've probably read some of their experiences, the old yearbooks have quite a few details. Were the brothers and sisters in the concentration camps able to have peace and rest while they were in the camps?

 

Physically, no. There was no peace and rest in a physical way. But they could have spiritual rest in a way that transcended their physical surroundings. Why? Because Jehovah gave them peace beyond what is normal. Jesus was right there with them, to strengthen them.

 

It is possible to have peace even while our "persecutors" are in authority over us. It is also possible to endure suffering without raising up a sword or a rebellion.

 

Those brothers and sisters did not plan an evacuation or escape from the camps. They waited on Jehovah. If they could get out legally, great, yes, they were gone from there. But some have to wait until the resurrection to get "free" from their situation.

 

In the congregations, Jesus said there would be oppression and injustice. He didn't say to get out. He said keep your integrity. For some of us, that means getting "disfellowshipped" and being treated as if we are dead by all those we love. Jesus didn't leave us. He is proud of us. He keeps giving us strength and rest.

 

He is coming, @Witness. He knows all of our tears. He cried along with us, just like he did alongside Martha and Mary. He will fix it, just like he raised up Lazarus. Our organization that we loved, it is half dead, rotted away. "Lord, by now he must smell..." Jesus can fix it.

 

Take courage. Have patience and faith. Our Lord can do great things. Jehovah is with him.

 

Praise Jehovah.

[Moise Racette]

9 minutes ago, AnnaNana said:

@Witness, I can tell you have been hurt by the organization. It is obvious. 

This sympathy scenario has been tried in the past. Didn't work. Get off your sympathy rollercoaster since you have none for the members of the Watchtower or Christian knowledge. This poster contradicts itself every time a post is made.

[Witness]

4 hours ago, AnnaNana said:

But the basic structure will stay. It is based on the solid foundation of the Christ

You're speaking about the spiritual Temple of God. That is not the organization, or the full congregations of JWs.  Eph 2:30-22.   "Israel", the priesthood.  1 Pet 2:5,9; 1 Cor 3:16

Where in the scriptures does Jesus say to wait inside an organization until he returns.  Where is the scripture?   

The Greek meaning for "angel" is Messenger.  It is used to describe John the Baptist.  Messengers are priests bringing the understanding of the word of God to the people.  Messengers/priests, are the "angels" Jesus sends in the last days to warn his people.    Mal 2:7

[Moise Racette]

16 minutes ago, Witness said:

Where in the scriptures does Jesus say to wait inside an organization until he returns.  Where is the scripture?   

Where in scripture does it say not to congregate and remain united until Christ Returns?

1Cor. 14:40 But all things should be done decently and in order.

What is "in order" if NOT organized. Start learning scripture.

John 15:4-5 Good News Translation (GNT) 4 Remain united to me, and I will remain united to you. A branch cannot bear fruit by itself; it can do so only if it remains in the vine.

[Guest]

The word for "angel" might be translated "a human messenger" in other contexts. But just because it means "a human messenger" in one verse, does that mean it's the same in every verse?

 

The name "Obed" means "Servant". Does that mean the scripture here should say: "You are my witnesses, declares Jehovah, Yes, my Obed whom I have chosen..."

 

The name "Isaac" means "Laughter". Does that mean the verse should read: "Better is distress than Isaac, for the sadness of the face makes the heart better..."

 

The name "Solomon" is from a root word meaning "Peace". Does that mean "Whenever they are saying 'Solomon and Security!' then sudden destruction..."

 

The name "Esau" means "Hairy". Does that mean "The Esau male goat stands for the king of Greece."

 

The name "Tabitha" means "Gazelle". Does the verse mean "The unclean person and the clean person may eat it, as you would eat Tabitha or a deer."

 

The name "Jonah" means "Dove". Does that mean "The holy spirit in bodily form like Jonah came down upon him..."

 

The name "Rachel" means "Ewe" or "Female Sheep". Does that mean "Then he took some of his possessions as a gift for Esau his brother: 200 female goats, 20 male goats, 200 Rachels, 20 rams..."

 

The name "Shaphan" means "Rock Badger". The scripture, does it mean, "You must not eat these animals...also Shaphan, because he chews the cud but does not have a split hoof."

 

The name "Tamar" means "Palm Tree". Does this verse actually mean "It had carved cherubs and palm-tree figures, with each Tamar between two cherubs..."

 

@Witness, that would be ridiculous.

 

Words mean things, and the context helps us figure it out. Jehovah's word is clear that in context in Revelation the word angels means angels, as in spirit creatures, spirit sons of God. 

 

"As for the sacred secret of the seven stars that you saw in my right hand and of the seven golden lampstands: The seven stars mean the angels of the seven congregations, and the seven lampstands mean the seven congregations."

 

@Witness, the organization says "the angels mean elders". You are saying "the angels mean people messengers". You are both falling for the same trap of the wicked one. What did Jesus say?

 

"The seven stars mean the angels."

 

It's not complicated.

 

The angels of the congregations are actually real, spirit-creature, faithful angels. We don't have to be afraid. When they get the word from Jesus, they will clean up things. They can clean up quick. Look at what happened to Sennacherib. And that was just one angel.

 

Jehovah's got this.

 

Praise Jah.

[Guest]

The entire first three chapters of Revelation make clear that Jesus commands we stay in the congregation. Jesus is talking about how there is trouble in the congregation. He gives admonition to everyone in the congregation. He says he's going to get rid of the troublemakers very soon, those who "serve" with bad motives like Balaam, those who put out a hit on others like Jezebel who bore false witness to get faithful ones taken out, and those who promote sects. 

 

A sect is following a person rather than following Christ. Jesus is standing in the middle of the congregations. Jehovah stood with Jesus when Jesus was on the torture stake. Jehovah was right there every single minute of it. He was right by Jesus' side. Jesus is just like his Father. Jesus and Jehovah know every single minute when we are treated unjustly in the congregation. He is with us every single minute of it. He did not abandon us, because we did not abandon Him.

 

We will not abandon Jesus' clear command to stay with him. He is Our Head. We will follow the Lamb wherever he goes.

 

He is standing among the lampstands, the congregations.

 

"These are the things that he says who holds the seven stars in his right hand and walks among the seven golden lampstands:  ‘I know your deeds, and your labor and endurance, and that you cannot tolerate bad men, and that you put to the test those who say they are apostles, but they are not, and you found them to be liars.  You are also showing endurance, and you have persevered for the sake of my name and have not grown weary.  Nevertheless, I hold this against you, that you have left the love you had at first. Therefore remember from where you have fallen, and repent and do the deeds you did at first. If you do not, I will come to you, and I will remove your lampstand from its place, unless you repent."

 

Jesus is coming to judge the congregations, all the individuals in them. The organization will be cleaned. Faithful ones who have been persecuted (by those in the congregation who are like "the synagogue of Satan") will be restored. "They will have to know that I have loved you."

 

Praise Jah.

[Moise Racette]

1 hour ago, AnnaNana said:

We will not abandon Jesus' clear command to stay with him. He is Our Head. We will follow the Lamb wherever he goes.

Seriously! WOW! This poster abandoned Christ since it became a scoffer, building strife, and division among the true brotherhood, and the poster has the guile to post this! 😂

Then the poster indicated the poster follows Christ. How, when the poster disobeys scripture just like @Witness