I'm 24, I'm Gay, I'm a Virgin, I'm Your Brother, and I'm Very Scared & Alone

[Anna]

15 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

Singleness as a way of life was once a quite common and respectable lifestyle, with no connotations whatsoever of abnormality. Read the classics and that point is easily established. But today, largely through the media, everything is sex, and people have come to define themselves in terms of their sexuality. It’s a herculean time for a gay person to be “fighting the fine fight.”

A good observation that is sometimes forgotten

[James Thomas Rook Jr.]

As far as I know, San Francisco's Paladin never married ....

[ImStrugglingBad]

Thank you so much, Anna. 

The overwhelming nature of this weakness, coupled with chronic physical and mental illness makes it difficult to cope. I know Jehovah loves me and that he understands. Sometimes I ask Jehovah if he would be happier had I either not been born, or if I was never one of his dedicated servants in the first place. All I do is disappoint him. I feel like simply existing brings reproach on him, as well as the congregation. When I slipped up and looked at pornography, I felt that nothing was ever going to fix anything. I tried. I really did. But the longer time goes on, the more I feel I'm going to fail again. Every day since I was a teenager, I've wondered whether Jehovah would approve of me in the new world. I know he loves me, but I don't know that he approves of me. I feel perverted, diseased, and completely inadequate. That's why I wonder whether death is a better option. Because I feel that maybe, just maybe, the death will cover over the sin of my existence. And if not, Jehovah can forget me. My family and friends would forget me in the new world, and I wouldn't be here to bring reproach on Jehovah. 

[James Thomas Rook Jr.]

Every journey begins with a single step ... when you are going through Hell ... be resolved to GO THROUGH Hell, and not stay there.

Emotional healing begins with getting some real tactile unconditional love.

In the world they say "You can't get over someone, until you get UNDER someone", but since that option will get you killed, and worse ... again, I recommend puppies as a first giant step to good emotional health.

The point is TACTILE love ... hugs, kisses, wagging tails, ecstatic to see you, ALL THE TIME.

They don't care if you are ugly, crippled, brilliant, or stupid ... AND .. their love is unconditional if treated properly.

They love people MORE than they love other puppies!

It's impossible to be depressed, while laying on your back on the floor,  with a box full of happy puppies crawling all over you !

[Anna]

 

53 minutes ago, ImStrugglingBad said:

Every day since I was a teenager, I've wondered whether Jehovah would approve of me in the new world. I know he loves me, but I don't know that he approves of me.

Dear @ImStrugglingBad , actually, we ARE all perverted, diseased, and completely inadequate.  If Jehovah didn't approve of you, then he would not be able to approve of ANY of us. Jehovah looks at these thing differently to us, and although our hearts can condemn us, he does not. He knows our imperfections and weaknesses are not our fault and you must believe that too. I heard one brother reason once that Jehovah is the only one who can see our potential, how we will be when all our imperfections are removed from us. That makes sense because Jehovah has that ability to project into the future if he wants. So he can see you perfect in the new world, and that is why you can meet his approval already now. Does that make sense?

So please don't think that you existing brings reproach on him.  On the contrary, you existing gives him another opportunity to call Satan a liar. It's like True Tom said,  in today's society  " It’s a herculean time for a gay person to be “fighting the fine fight.” 

Please, don't give up. Stay with all of his Witnesses who are all trying their best to cope with Satan's world where good is made to be bad, and bad is made to look good.  And when I said seek expert help, I meant especially regarding your suicidal thoughts. Any time you need to talk you can send me a direct message.

[Ann O'Maly]

So glad you have posted again, @ImStrugglingBad.

6 hours ago, ImStrugglingBad said:

That's why I wonder whether death is a better option. Because I feel that maybe, just maybe, the death will cover over the sin of my existence. And if not, Jehovah can forget me.

Doesn't this make Jesus' sacrifice redundant? Your death isn't the answer. According to the Christian gospel, it is Jesus' sacrificial blood and one's faith in that that covers over your (and everybody else's) sins.

Romans 3:22-24

"... yes, God’s righteousness through the faith in Jesus Christ, for all those having faith. For there is no distinction. For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and it is as a free gift that they are being declared righteous by his undeserved kindness through the release by the ransom paid by Christ Jesus."

Ephesians 2:8

"By this undeserved kindness you have been saved through faith, and this is not of your own doing; rather, it is God’s gift."

Notice the tenses used here: "are being saved" and "have been saved." Jesus has done it for you already. Your death accomplishes nothing. And your existence isn't a sin. It has worth; you have as much entitlement to exist as the rest of us.

Have you explored those links? How do you feel about them? Respond privately if you prefer.

 

[TrueTomHarley]

10 hours ago, ImStrugglingBad said:

My family and friends would forget me in the new world, and I wouldn't be here to bring reproach on Jehovah. 

Unfortunately, he is stuck with you, the same way he is stuck with me.

Many times he has tried to get out of his contract with me, which he perhaps feels he made too hastily. However, I always show him the forgiveness clause and he has no recourse but to back down - even though he may grumble about it. I have him over a barrel.

I'm kidding, of course, but only partly. There is a forgiveness clause - though, to be sure, we are not to "accept the undeserved kindness of God and miss its purpose." But let God determine when that has happened, not you.

10 hours ago, ImStrugglingBad said:

I know he loves me, but I don't know that he approves of me.

Good. That means you also don't know that he doesn't approve of you. Assume that he does. Focus on the love. The forgiveness clause has him backed into a corner. You have him where you want him.

 

10 hours ago, ImStrugglingBad said:

That's why I wonder whether death is a better option.

Because you figure Jehovah would understand your feelings and forgive you? He probably would, but the fallacy is to think he will not regarding the current struggles you go through, even if you feel you are getting pasted. Your family will forgive you, too, but they will be crushed - perhaps for life.

 

10 hours ago, ImStrugglingBad said:

I feel perverted, diseased, and completely inadequate.

To the extent you can, lay off on this kind of thinking. We are all basket cases in one way or another - whether in the truth or not. Let God figure it out when and if you have disappointed him. All you really have to do for now is to avoid homosexual acts, which can't be super-hard because they always involve another party. In this respect you are no different from a straight person who is yet single. Viewing pornography is not good, but it is largely not good because it draws you into a funnel that doesn't end and the funnel skews your future ability to relate to a real person. Again, this is no less true of a straight person.

 

10 hours ago, ImStrugglingBad said:

All I do is disappoint him

No. Even if you are a complete scoundrel in your congregation - and your comments make it very clear that you are not - you are doing a tremendous service right now by bringing something taboo but potentially lethal out in the open and allowing others, many of whom are mature, to comment. It is a thread that may benefit not just you, but they, and also others who may have the same issue as they stumble across it later.

Lay off on the guilt, to the extent you can. Or put it in perspective. Count yourself like Paul who pummeled himself and declared himself a 'miserable man' because what he wanted to do he did not do, and what he did not want to do he did do. What was his issue, anyway? Who's to say he was not gay, facing exactly the same troubles you face? I've no reason to think it is true, but I have no reason to think it is not true. It doesn't matter. It could be true, and that is good enough for you. His exact demon is probably left vague for exactly that reason - to help many persons in many struggles who will see that he is saying "been there, done that" and say "maybe he is talking about my problem."

Maybe even self-abuse is what he is carrying on about. Who can say? Masturbation is not great, but it is in some respects like porn - its the end result of a long habit that will mess you up, not an instance of the habit itself. Recently I read in some city how the cops were busting men for masturbation in the park. These were businessmen in suits on their lunch hour who were married. There were not few of them. Yes, sexual appetite unrestrained leads to the most disturbing conduct, but that is not at all true of a lapse here and there, which can be shrugged off as an "oh, well - life goes on." Lay off on the guilt is what I'm saying. Big as that Bible is, and as many are the things that it condemns, it no where condemns self abuse specifically. You must read it in from other verses having to do with self-control and with wholesome outlook about proper sexual relations. You read it in properly, make no mistake, but you must read it in nonetheless. If it were really a big deal, it would be the 11th commandment. Sometimes I think it is as much a Victorian relic as a biblical one that we carry on about it as much we do.

What are the things that really get God going - from that proverb about the six things that he hates - no, wait - make that seven? He hates anyone spreading contentions among brothers. You doing that? I don't think so. He hates "feet that are in a hurry to run to badness." It seems you are doing all you can to glue yours to the floor. "A false tongue" he hates. You been doing any lying lately? It doesn't look like it here. Oh, and he hates "hands that are shedding innocent blood" How are you doing on that score? Killed anyone lately? I didn't think so. Cut out Proverbs 6:16-19 and mount it next to the yeartext on your bedroom wall. Mount it over the yeartext, if need be. 

10 hours ago, ImStrugglingBad said:

I tried. I really did.

Of course you did.

 

10 hours ago, ImStrugglingBad said:

But the longer time goes on, the more I feel I'm going to fail again

If you fail you fail. Find that scripture about the righteous man who falls seven times and yet gets up each time, and put it next to your other new yeartext. You know what 'seven' means in the Bible - it could be a thousand times he messed up. How come he doesn't lose his 'righteous' status at the 5th failing? Because that's how God is with us - none of us are 'clean.' He deals with it. He doesn't have to. We don't sit back and fleece him for it - that's why we carry on a struggle. But go easy on the guilt. "No temptation has taken you that is not common to men," Paul says, and you don't knock every ball out of the park.

The mantra "born gay" is self-defeating. There is little evidence that it is that way. Gayness may be firmly entrenched for as long as one can remember, but that is not the same thing. Who knows what triggers it? In my youth it was accepted wisdom that it came as a result of parental dynamics, a domineering mother and a retreating father - which is far less depressing for someone determined to abide by God's standards because it implies change is possible. That accepted wisdom was never disproved, just as it was never proved in the first place. It was merely drowned out by another model which has also never been proved, but it is the favored model because it validates a lifestyle that some want validated. If there is one thing that has proven crystal clear in recent decades - to the astonishment of most - it is how amazingly fluid sexuality is. It does not respect 'one man-one woman.' It does not respect gender lines. It does not even respect age limits. It jumps the rails at every turn and is only nudged back on track with only great difficulty. 

How to nudge it? Have 'plenty to do in the work of the Lord,' Paul says. Accept that you have homosexual leanings for now and be done with it. You cannot act upon them, you certainly  work against your own interests should you deliberately cultivate them, but the leanings themselves do not disqualify you. They will fade so subtly you will not notice it, probably over much time, in this system or the next, as you routinely rub shoulders with persons who in this regard have their act together. In other regards, you do and they don't, and when you see someone whose feet are "in a hurry to run to badness," you can stick out one of yours and trip them up. They'll thank you for it later. In this way also you can be like one of the genuine members of the Christian body, which works smoothly with the other members. I don't know that is what Paul had in mind but it works,

No, ISB, you are not a washout. You are doing your brothers a tremendous service and the best is yet to come. "Strengthen your brothers when once you return," Jesus said to Peter. He could strengthen them only because he had gone somewhere. Had he never gone on a difficult journey, he could do no more than say "I know just how you feel." "Yeah, sure you do," his intended recipient would say, rolling his eyes. 

[TrueTomHarley]

'The tribulation is momentary and light,' Paul says. They all are, though they sure don't seem that way at the time.

Oh. And my blog tomsheepandgoats.com has a category of 'Gays and Lesbians'  Some of the material I have dressed up and supplemented and weeded out the inelegancies to form that book chapter.

By the way, don't think I am passing off porn or masturbation as matters of no concern. Many smokers report they were hooked from the first cigarette. It is the same with a drink for an alcoholic. All I hope to posit is that these things are not on the A-list of things that will sink you spiritually in a heartbeat on first relapse. They are not category 5 sins.

[Guest]

You have a nice approach Tom

[Anna]

Nice article in next week's workbook to be given as a talk Theme: "Does Jehovah Assess in Advance How Much Pressure We Can Bear and Then Choose the Trials We Will Face?". I thought it could apply to this topic quite well too.

https://www.jw.org/en/publications/magazines/watchtower-study-february-2017/does-god-determine-trials-we-will-face/

[Noble Berean]

@ImStrugglingBad I am so, so sorry you are struggling with this. 

My heart breaks for our young JW brothers and sisters that are struggling with their sexual orientation. There is little sympathy in the organization towards gay people, and it doesn't feel like the "Christian love" we always here about in the mags. 

But I want you to know that you ARE loved. Don't forget that. You are loved by God, and by me, and by so many other Christians! You are loved for trying so hard to do the right thing when giving in would be so much easier! That's something to be proud of! 

Throw your burden on Jehovah God. Don't worry about what others say. Lean on him alone. He can give you a power greater than human strength.

[Guest Nicole]

On 9/10/2017 at 10:37 PM, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

It's impossible to be depressed, while laying on your back on the floor,  with a box full of happy puppies crawling all over you !

I just reminded of your comment @James Thomas Rook Jr.  I just finished working out and was cooling down on my back on the floor and sweating, my dogs think I am playing with them  and one of them wants  to remove my sweat with his tongue ... they forget I'm tickled 

By the way exercise and healthy meal help to struggle depression  

I have a gay friend, a JW in another congregation, he studied the Bible when he was young, and became a JW then he got back to homosexual practices and was disfellowship after many years he came back and now is serving in his congregation,  different ways assiting the elders, most of all have showed him love, he is very kind, and appreciated also by his non believers fellow workers at the hospital where he works as a nurse. So far I see he is enjoying life, of course he must have a terrible  internal war as many of us who want to serve God not matter our sexual orientation .... my point is that he is trying to enjoy life and be happy within his difficult circumstances.