Believing false information

[Guest]

Believing false information can have serious consequences. This is what happened in Moses' day, when 10 of the 12 spies who had explored the Promised Land made a negative and exaggerated report ( Numbers 13: 25-33 ). The Israelites believed him and were utterly discouraged ( Numbers 14: 1-4 ). They may have said that, since most spies said the same thing, it must be true. They did not want to listen to the positive report presented by Joshua and Caleb, trustworthy men ( Numbers 14: 6-10 ). Instead of looking for facts and having faith in Jehovah, they chose to believe the negative report. What a stupid reaction!

A soldier who is not loyal to his leader will not be a good soldier. That's why enemies use propaganda to destroy the trust that exists between soldiers and their commander. They will say for example: "You can not trust your leaders! Or: "Do not let them lead you to disaster! To add weight to their assertions, they may be skillfully exploiting the mistakes these leaders might make. That's what  Satan does. He never gives up trying to destroy your trust in those Jehovah uses to lead his people.La Tour de Garde (édition d'étude)  |  Juillet 2017
 

[Matthew9969]

On 9/28/2019 at 10:00 PM, salomon said:

Believing false information can have serious consequences. This is what happened in Moses' day, when 10 of the 12 spies who had explored the Promised Land made a negative and exaggerated report ( Numbers 13: 25-33 ). The Israelites believed him and were utterly discouraged ( Numbers 14: 1-4 ). They may have said that, since most spies said the same thing, it must be true. They did not want to listen to the positive report presented by Joshua and Caleb, trustworthy men ( Numbers 14: 6-10 ). Instead of looking for facts and having faith in Jehovah, they chose to believe the negative report. What a stupid reaction!

A soldier who is not loyal to his leader will not be a good soldier. That's why enemies use propaganda to destroy the trust that exists between soldiers and their commander. They will say for example: "You can not trust your leaders! Or: "Do not let them lead you to disaster! To add weight to their assertions, they may be skillfully exploiting the mistakes these leaders might make. That's what  Satan does. He never gives up trying to destroy your trust in those Jehovah uses to lead his people.La Tour de Garde (édition d'étude)  |  Juillet 2017
 

It's amazing you say this, this has been a tactic the watchtower has used since it's inception.

[Anna]

1 hour ago, Matthew9969 said:

It's amazing you say this, this has been a tactic the watchtower has used since it's inception.

What has been the tactic of WT, believing false information?

[Witness]

On 9/28/2019 at 9:00 PM, salomon said:

soldier who is not loyal to his leader will not be a good soldier.

 ^“Join with me in suffering, like a good soldier of Christ Jesus.”  2 Tim 2:3

Are we living in the time of Moses?  Moses was given the law to lead God’s people.  The law has been fulfilled in Christ. Luke 24:44  HE now leads God’s people; HE is our commander, who would never make a mistake.  

 “And beginning with Moses and all the Prophets, he explained to them what was said in all the Scriptures concerning himself.”  Luke 24:27

He said to them, “This is what I told you while I was still with you: Everything must be fulfilled that is written about me in the Law of Moses, the Prophets and the Psalms.”  Luke 24:44

“You study the Scriptures diligently because you think that in them you have eternal life. These are the very Scriptures that testify about me, ⁴⁰ yet you refuse to come to me to have life.”

 ^“If you believed Moses, you would believe me, for he wrote about me.”   John 5:39,46

How can you believe when you accept each other’s praise and don’t look for the praise that comes from the only God?   Joh 5:44

If God chooses an individual to trumpet truth, as a “leader” in truth, that one leads another to Christ by speaking the truth of Christ. John 14:6; Phil 2:9-11   He doesn’t expect loyalty to be given to him!  There is a difference, do you understand?

^“ I have come in My Father’s name, yet you don’t accept Me. If someone else comes in his own name, you will accept him.”  John 5:43

A “faithful slave” of the Master, would not assume the role of Master. Yet, an “evil slave” would “beat” his fellow slaves for choosing to follow their Master Christ, and for refusing to recognize a pseudo leadership of an evil slave.  Matt 24:45-51  An evil slave would fabricate that “human rule”, leading us to become “bondservants of men”. Gal 1:10; Col 2:20-22; 1 Cor 7:23 Can you see this?

We do not answer to a human, but only to the Father and Jesus. 1 Cor 3:5 

What happened to those who rose up against the prophet/messenger Moses? What do you think will happen to those who have usurped the role of Christ as our Head?

"They claim to know God, but by their actions they deny him. They are detestable, disobedient and unfit for doing anything good."  Titus 1:16

Then He said, “Watch out that you are not deceived. For many will come in My name, saying, ‘I am He,’ and, ‘The time is near.’ Don’t follow them.  Luke 21:8

If we rise up a human to rule over us, we have rejected the rule of Christ, who was a prophet/messenger to his people. We then begin to seek out “each other’s praise” instead of seeking praise from Jesus. His prophetic words remain as our message. John 4:41 If another speaks of Christ, yet expects to assume command over our souls, (as the organization practices through judgmental measures), that one is preaching “another Jesus”, through “another spirit”.   Rev 13:11,15; 16:13,14

 “The nations you will dispossess listen to those who practice sorcery or divination. But as for you, the Lord your God has not permitted you to do so. ¹⁵ The Lord your God will raise up for you a prophet like me from among you, from your fellow Israelites. You must listen to him.”   Deut 18:15

“I will raise up for them a prophet like you from among their fellow Israelites, and I will put my words in his mouth. He will tell them everything I command him. ¹⁹ I myself will call to account anyone who does not listen to my words that the prophet speaks in my name.”  Deut 18:18,19

On 9/28/2019 at 9:00 PM, salomon said:

"You can not trust your leaders! Or: "Do not let them lead you to disaster! To add weight to their assertions, they may be skillfully exploiting the mistakes these leaders might make. That's what  Satan does.

 Would you call it exploitation when you use your skills to expose the trinity doctrine at a householder's door?  God expects us to expose untruths (“not holding to the truth”)  spoken by our own people, just as Jesus did. John 8:44 If we don't, we are no better than those who feared the power of the Pharisees, and chose to obey their words and not those of Christ. Matt 23:13

 This, on the other hand, is what Satan does accomplish:

“But I am afraid that just as Eve was deceived by the serpent’s cunning, your minds may somehow be led astray from your sincere and pure devotion to Christ. (not to a human leader!) ⁴ For if someone comes to you and preaches a Jesus other than the Jesus we preached, or if you receive a different spirit from the Spirit you received, or a different gospel from the one you accepted, you put up with it easily enough.”

“For such people are false apostles, deceitful workers, masquerading as apostles of Christ. ¹⁴ And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light. ¹⁵ It is not surprising, then, if his servants also masquerade as servants of righteousness. Their end will be what their actions deserve.”  2 Cor 11:3,4,13-15 
 

 

 

 

 

[divergenceKO]

8 hours ago, Matthew9969 said:

It's amazing you say this, this has been a tactic the watchtower has used since it's inception.

When has the Org accepted the killing of another is justified under God’s law? When has the Org mentioned to your belief, Gay rights is acceptable to God, Etc.

Please provide such tactics of the Org?

The inception of the Zion Watchtower was to expose false teachings. Were the Bible Students the only ones seeking the truth? History will disagree with such speculation.

[TrueTomHarley]

On 9/29/2019 at 12:00 AM, salomon said:

They will say for example: "You can not trust your leaders! Or: "Do not let them lead you to disaster! 

Exactly.

In the first century, Nero executed Christians en masse. What would Agent JackRyan, Witness, Srecko,  Mathew457845, and Shwiiiiiii said about that had they been around back then?

You know that they would be screaming at how incompetent and wicked were the brothers taking the lead in Jerusalem.

Witness would have quoted half the Hebrew Scriptures in an effort to show how it was their presumptuousness that was to blame.

[Witness]

@TrueTomHarley said:  "You know that they would be screaming at how incompetent and wicked were the brothers taking the lead in Jerusalem."

Can you provide a scripture that verifies brothers "taking the lead in Jerusalem"? 

"Witness would have quoted half the Hebrew Scriptures in an effort to show how it was their presumptuousness that was to blame."

Presumptuous is a good word for those who believe they can rightly "take the lead" today.  

From the Greek scriptures, and something to consider:

"Nor should you be called ‘Leader,’ because your one and only leader is the Messiah."  Matt 23:10

STRONGS NT 2519: καθηγητής

καθηγητής, καθηγητου, ὁ (καθηγέομαι to go before, lead);
a. properly, a guide: Numen. quoted in Ath. 7, p. 313 d.
b. a master, teacher: Matthew 23:8 R G, 10. 

Luke 22:25,26:

But He said to them, “The kings of the Gentiles...(today, that would be elders not the "Israel of God", acting as "kings" over the congregation of JWs.  Since they "represent the royal priesthood" of "kings", the elders have usurped the role of  not only priests, but kings.  Rev 5:9,10)

dominate them, and those who have authority over them are called ‘Benefactors.' ("friends of the people", the GB)

Well, we know the GB has authority over the entire elder body of "Gentiles".

Is this a good thing?  

It is not to be like that among you. On the contrary, whoever is greatest among you should become like the youngest, and whoever leads, like the one serving.

There is to be no one exercising headship over another.  If one "leads" in truth, he is serving that individual with truth.  He expects no honor to be given to himself.  Do a little research, look up "honor" and how it relates to "elders" in the organization.  Look up "humility/humble" and how it relates to the anointed in the organization.  No honor is bestowed on God's kings/priests, but certainly  on man's choice of who are the "priests and kings" of your organization.  

 

[TrueTomHarley]

22 minutes ago, Witness said:

Can you provide a scripture that verifies brothers "taking the lead in Jerusalem"? 

Is even THAT not allowed in your book? What a very strange world you occupy.

[Witness]

12 minutes ago, TrueTomHarley said:

Is even THAT not allowed in your book? What a very strange world you occupy.

We both know you are establishing a belief that an "organization" of leaders is vital to salvation.  

Scripture please?  

[TrueTomHarley]

You would demand a scripture to prove that there were ones who took the lead back then? It is too stupid a request to countenance.

I do not have a scripture to specifically say that first-century Christians used the privy, either. In the absence of one, I am going to assume that they did not.

Prove I am wrong, lady. Where is the scripture?

[Matthew9969]

21 hours ago, divergenceKO said:

When has the Org accepted the killing of another is justified under God’s law? When has the Org mentioned to your belief, Gay rights is acceptable to God, Etc.

 

Please provide such tactics of the Org?

 

The inception of the Zion Watchtower was to expose false teachings. Were the Bible Students the only ones seeking the truth? History will disagree with such speculation.

See there you go, perfect example of spreading false witness against the leaders of my church. We do not believe in gay rights being acceptable to God, myself nor any Christian I have ever known thinks killing is acceptable, (we can find plenty of stories of Jehovahs witnesses killing others though). Now I request you apologize for lying about me and my church, and millions of other Christians.

 

[divergenceKO]

31 minutes ago, Matthew9969 said:

See there you go, perfect example of spreading false witness against the leaders of my church. We do not believe in gay rights being acceptable to God, myself nor any Christian I have ever known thinks killing is acceptable

Can you say that about all Christians? If you read correctly, that is what I meant. It's good your church doesn't believe in Gay Rights? How about those Christian Churches that do? How about those Christian Churches that have Gay Priest?

If you find plenty of stories about Jehovah Witnesses killing others in the name of God, just like the majority of Christians that defend their lands through patronage, possibly including your own church, please provide the evidence. I request you apologize for being a false prophet and naive.